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0:32

Campside Media.

0:35

So Chris Birch loves China. That

0:37

much we've established. His brother

0:40

chip once told me about a time he and Chris

0:42

went to Chris's favorite massage

0:44

place in

0:45

Shanghai. They line you up in lazy

0:47

boys. Somebody's working on your hands.

0:50

Somebody else is working on your feet. You're

0:52

getting your ears done. You're getting

0:54

your nose cleaned out. You're watching

0:56

a video. Chris is holding a meeting

0:58

on his phone and he's just never

1:00

coming up once for air. Chris,

1:03

for his part, says that he's been flying

1:05

over a million miles a year, mostly

1:08

to Asia for years. An

1:10

associate of his told me that when he

1:12

was in Asia, he'd meet with factories

1:14

that worked for major brands. And

1:17

Chris would typically ask them, who'd

1:19

he make for? What are you making for them?

1:22

Show me what you make for them. And

1:24

everything they show

1:25

him, he says, you can make that for

1:27

two dollars.

1:29

This is what I was told. He says he can

1:31

make anything for two dollars. Anything

1:33

he sees, whether it's a tote or

1:35

a necklace. From

1:41

campsite media and Sony Music

1:42

Entertainment, this is infamous, and I'm

1:44

Vanessa Gregorianis. I'm

1:47

Gabe Sherman, and this is the third part of

1:49

our three part series on Chris and Tory

1:51

Burch. It's called Retail

1:53

Revenge. So

2:01

where did we leave off last time, Vanessa? Well,

2:03

we met Tory Burch and her glamorous

2:06

mom, Riva, who those shoes were named after.

2:08

We also met her husband, Chris Burch, who

2:10

started Tory Burch, the business with her,

2:12

and it grew into this really big brand

2:14

really

2:14

quickly. They had a huge hit with the

2:16

ballet flats, the rivo flats. What

2:19

are those again? So those are the flat

2:21

little shoes like ballet slippers. Justin

2:23

Harmon describes them as like almost

2:25

looking like condoms. Right? But

2:28

they have this big gold medallion

2:30

on the toe and it has these two

2:32

teas that are carved into

2:33

it, which is t for tory. You know, they're iconic

2:36

shoes. And

2:36

those are the ones that Chris wanted to make knock

2:38

offs for cheap. That's right.

2:41

So

2:41

at this point, what's going on in Tory and

2:43

Chris' marriage?

2:44

Well, they're not divorced, but they are separated.

2:47

The

2:47

marriage is pretty much over, and Chris

2:49

has a new girlfriend. In fact,

2:52

he's backing a new fashion line from his

2:54

girlfriend, Monica Chang. She's

2:56

a bit of a fashion hero fight. This is your

2:58

second time showing at New York Fashion

3:00

Week. What do you think you've won this time

3:02

around?

3:03

Oh, my gosh. Well, at least I know

3:05

how the venue looks. She

3:07

used to work as a manager at a nightclub.

3:10

Of course, you did.

3:14

Bottles and

3:14

models, man. I love fall because

3:17

you can do the high boots, you can do

3:19

the long coats. You can do many

3:21

more

3:22

things and layering. So I don't

3:24

know. I'll also come spraying. I'll probably say the

3:26

same. Chris likes anointing women as

3:28

the new Tori, perhaps. He's also

3:30

invested in a line from Kelly Cottron

3:33

who burst international consciousness as

3:36

a judge on Tyria Banks's show. America's

3:39

next top

3:39

model. Your

3:40

walk is not happening. Okay. I'm done talking

3:42

to you. I feel like you're from, like, an

3:44

elf tribe and you lost your plant.

3:46

So Kelly is the bitchiest

3:49

of all bitchy fashion publicists. And

3:51

by that, I mean, she is the funniest. She

3:54

starts the line with Chris that specializes in

3:56

sportswear for empowered women.

3:58

I mean, talk about pressing it. This

4:00

was back over a decade go. And now

4:03

you can't go to a five star event without

4:05

seeing people in athleisure. But

4:07

to do all of these different ventures, Kelly's

4:10

venture, Monica Chang's venture, and

4:12

of course his own store.

4:14

See wonder. Chris needed

4:16

money. So he started looking into

4:19

selling his stake in Tory Burch to private

4:21

investors. He even

4:23

allegedly began agitating for

4:25

it to go public. Which Tory was

4:27

not pleased about. Let me

4:29

just remind you, Tory and Chris did

4:32

not comment for this story. In

4:34

any case, we know

4:37

that Chris really wanted to make

4:39

his own store work, the

4:41

line that he was the star of.

4:44

The flower in Bloom.

4:48

See wonder though, it wasn't chic

4:50

in the way that Tory Burch was.

4:53

It was greeting cards, blackard

4:55

boxes, some clothing, bright

4:58

colors. I remember blue and green.

5:01

Kind of saccharine. The fitting

5:03

room have cushions, like a

5:05

kind of preppy stripe navy

5:07

and white thick stripes. Hampton's

5:09

meets

5:10

Target. That's Amy Hodel,

5:12

a longtime fashion journalist and the

5:14

author of Anna, The Biography.

5:17

It's about Tory's friend and Wentor.

5:20

It was one of those stores that, like, you would casually

5:22

kind of walk into on a Saturday if you were out

5:24

shopping with your friends.

5:26

When Sea Wonder launched, Chris Birch leaned

5:28

on his fashion contacts to get people like

5:30

Aimio Delve writing about the

5:31

store. I feel like I did write about the store,

5:34

but It wasn't

5:36

ever going to compete with Tory

5:38

Burch in terms

5:39

of, like, being ready to wear a

5:41

brand that you see a fashion week. In fact,

5:43

when Chris told Tory about she wonder initially,

5:46

he gave her a pitch book. That's

5:48

a document with a bunch of pictures in

5:50

it. And information about what you're gonna make in

5:52

your fashion line. So in

5:54

that pitch book, it didn't even seem

5:57

like Sea Wonder was one of fashion

5:59

line. The pitch book said fifty

6:01

percent of sea wonder's product was devoted

6:03

to home goods, washers and dryers,

6:06

motor scooters, refrigerators, other

6:09

unusual items. The kind of

6:11

stuff that Chris finds were cheap at

6:13

Chinese trade fair. But

6:15

when Amy went to see wonder. There

6:17

weren't a lot of washers or dryers

6:20

or refrigerators for

6:21

sale.

6:22

I really saw it more of like kind

6:24

of a hodgepodge of souvenirs, greeting

6:26

cards, and clothing. And Chris

6:28

selling clothing wasn't okay

6:30

with Tory. Actually, nothing

6:33

about Sea Wonder was okay

6:35

with

6:35

Tory. What's purchase secret to

6:37

see a copycat? Everybody interprets

6:40

things from fashion from the past in the beginning.

6:43

But I wouldn't say copycat. There's

6:45

nothing actually in fashion that hasn't happened

6:47

before is just the way you twist

6:49

it. You know, superficially, it

6:51

one hundred percent looked like

6:54

Okay. Chris Birch

6:55

has, you know, made like a diffusion

6:58

line of his ex wife's brand. It looked

7:00

very much kind of like a

7:02

screw you to his ex wave. And

7:04

not only that, Chris opened Sea

7:06

Wonder stores in retail spaces,

7:09

near Tory

7:09

Burch. Even this YouTuber noticed

7:12

that. I think the owner

7:14

of Sea Wonder is actually Tory Burch's ex

7:16

husband. So it's funny because

7:18

Tory Burch is right across from this

7:20

store. Like, a couple stores down and right

7:22

across. It's hard not to see that as

7:24

a big screw you. And that

7:26

is allegedly how Tory Burch

7:28

saw it. More

7:31

after the break.

7:40

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8:16

See you. I'm off to Miami. No.

8:19

Actually, wow. Look at that. No. I I'm going to Hawaii

8:21

now. Oh. Cancun looks nice.

8:23

You know what? Belize looks pretty

8:26

nice this time of the

8:26

year. Or Mhmm Palm Springs.

8:28

Don't do all happy,

8:31

please.

8:32

Happy, prize. Go

8:35

to your happy prize, prize line.

8:39

As if the McCrispy couldn't get any better,

8:42

Bacon and ranch just entered

8:44

the chat. The bacon ranch,

8:46

Macrispy, available at participating

8:48

McDonald's for limited time. But

8:55

You're listening to Inkmis from campsite

8:57

media. So

8:59

Tory Burch and her company were probably

9:02

not happy about Chris' company Sea

9:04

Wonder, selling what they saw

9:06

as cheap knock offs.

9:08

They were livid about

9:10

Sea Wonder. And it was unequivocal.

9:12

It wasn't like maybe he did this by

9:14

accident, it was like, no. He's

9:17

a monster and this is like a

9:19

screaming fuck you to

9:21

Tory into our brand. There was no like

9:23

question from the side of the

9:26

Tory Burch camp that he

9:28

was anything but a

9:29

monster. Behind the similarities

9:31

between Sea Wonder and Tory

9:33

Burch the products and

9:35

designs that sort of look the same,

9:38

there was another truth and that

9:40

may have been more complicated. Did

9:43

he do that subconsciously?

9:46

Did he do that on purpose? He's

9:48

been, you know, deep in the

9:51

kind of waspy aesthetics like bringing

9:53

that to the masses for pretty much

9:55

his entire career. So

9:57

maybe this is like who he is. And

9:59

it it has nothing to do with Tory Burch at

10:01

all. Tory Burch isn't actually

10:03

selling heart shaped waffle makers or

10:05

pigdocking stations. For Tory

10:07

Burch, none of that may have mattered. Her

10:10

brand was her, or at least

10:12

her image. It was macchiato

10:15

with foam. It was understated,

10:18

and it needed to be reliable.

10:21

Amy Odell again. Anne Wintour

10:23

during the pandemic, appeared

10:26

in the vogue Instagram feed jogging

10:30

at a Tory Burch track suit And

10:33

she looked great, and she was at her domestic

10:36

home on Long Island, which is her

10:38

sprawling luxurious estate.

10:41

So I feel like that's kind of what she's

10:43

going for is this reliable customer

10:46

that's not looking to reinvent their look

10:48

that you

10:50

know, buys just

10:52

kind of the same basic stuff

10:56

season season year to year. So

10:59

it's understandable that Tory may

11:01

not have wanted anybody to confuse

11:03

that customer. Now

11:05

amid all this back biting, There

11:07

was, of course, a lawsuit. Chris

11:10

said he was allowed to make a competing

11:12

brand according to Tory Burchbylaws.

11:16

But Tory seemed to be positing that

11:18

she'd been tricked by Chris.

11:21

In her legal document, she writes Chris

11:24

is allowed to compete fairly.

11:27

What he is not free to do is

11:29

compete unfairly. In

11:32

fact, it says in the two plus years

11:34

leading up to Sea Wonder and this is

11:36

sort of unbelievable, Chris

11:38

repeatedly asked for and

11:40

was given full and complete

11:42

access to competitively sensitive

11:45

information. While

11:47

being paid eleven million

11:50

dollars as a consultant for

11:53

Tory Burch. Also

11:55

in this document, there's like page after page

11:57

of photographs of stuff from Tory store

11:59

that is sort of similar to the stuff

12:02

in Chris' store. Even the clogs with

12:04

the logos on them, This whole document

12:06

is really like a very meticulous burn book.

12:09

Tory says in it that even at one

12:11

point, she got a text from a friend that said

12:13

quote, I love your new store.

12:15

I just saw it en route to lunch. X

12:18

x. Close quote. And

12:20

of course, that was Chris' store.

12:23

But her friend thought it was

12:25

hers. So

12:27

what does Chris have to say about all this?

12:29

Well, he has his

12:31

own legal documents. And they say

12:33

that Tory is engaged in a

12:35

vicious campaign against him. The

12:38

green carpeting he has the

12:40

brass buttons, all that stuff. That

12:42

is not owned by Tory. He

12:45

also calls the board mindless loyal

12:47

to her. And he is saying

12:50

he's not gonna back down. But

12:52

there's still a big issue. To

12:55

fund sea wonder's emporium of sweaters

12:57

and pigdocking stations to

12:59

say nothing of Monica Chang's line

13:02

and bitchy, Kelly Cotron's

13:04

line. Chris needs

13:07

cash. Tory versus

13:09

Chris, spy says

13:11

spy. New York's nasty two

13:14

billion dollar war of the x's just

13:16

got nastier. Okay. It's November

13:18

first. Two thousand and twelve, and we're in Delaware

13:21

where a lot of corporate fights get settled.

13:23

Representatives for Tory Burch and

13:26

Chris Burch line up on opposite

13:28

sides of the aisle. They're

13:30

present for a hearing in a lawsuit.

13:33

Chris is alleging that Tory is holding

13:35

his shares of Tory Burch hostage,

13:38

and that's hurting Sea Wonder.

13:40

Now, this seems like a pretty serious

13:43

issue. Right? But the judge in

13:45

the case, Leo Stragg junior, he

13:47

wants to have some fun. So

13:50

after he calls the court to order, and

13:52

attorneys launch into their opening

13:54

arguments. He interrupts. I

13:56

don't wanna spoil the drama of

13:58

the trial. I'll sit down. How

14:00

many stores are there for what

14:02

is this wonder bread sea

14:04

wonder? Sea wonder, your honor.

14:07

Sea wonder.

14:08

It's becoming clear that the judge

14:10

thinks this is just a very silly

14:13

fashion

14:13

dispute, which maybe

14:16

it is I didn't see any

14:18

reason to burden anyone's Hanukkah,

14:21

New Years,

14:22

Christmas, Quons of Festival

14:25

with this preppy clothing dispute.

14:27

He then issues some tips about

14:29

how they can all prepare for trial. I

14:31

think if you read sheaver, go

14:34

see the new Virginia Wolf revival

14:36

and watch mad men will all

14:38

be geared up and in the mood for this

14:41

sort of drunken wasp vest.

14:43

Are are they wasps? Are the burch's

14:45

wasps? Do we know? Perhaps

14:48

Tory Burch's lawyer horses before

14:50

responding. Tory Burch is Jewish,

14:52

and Chris is not Jewish. But

14:55

not Jewish doesn't make you a

14:57

wash. Because it could make you an equally

14:59

excluded faith like Catholic. Right?

15:02

I mean, that's not a wasp beauty.

15:04

You know a wasp is a wasp. Wasp

15:07

or not, Tory was going to protect

15:09

her throne. And a few days after

15:11

the hearing, she files a counterclaim.

15:14

But then everything goes quiet.

15:17

Hanukkah, Christmas, Kwanza, they all

15:19

come and go, crickets. And

15:21

then suddenly, on January first

15:23

two thousand thirteen, Troy and Chris

15:25

announced they have finally done the WASP

15:28

thing. They have settled the case

15:30

privately. If the discovery

15:32

came out, it would have been the board meetings were

15:34

were present, emails,

15:37

text messages, like any snappy

15:40

thing that they would have said behind each other's

15:42

backs would have been made

15:44

public, which Tory

15:46

Burch would not have enjoyed. Chris

15:48

Burch sells off his stake in Tory

15:50

Burch for sixty five million

15:52

dollars. Like good wasps

15:54

or not, they handle the details

15:57

behind. Closed doors. And

16:00

what about Tory

16:01

Burch? Tory Burch is

16:02

not a billionaire, but she's also worth nine hundred

16:04

million dollars. That's been his term. A

16:06

former financial journalist who wrote a

16:08

Forbes cover story on Tory Burch

16:10

in two thousand and twelve.

16:13

We wrote at the time that the company's revenues

16:16

were about one point five

16:18

billion

16:19

dollars. And we also estimated

16:21

a profit margin at eleven percent

16:24

So everything is pretty okay for

16:26

Tory, but there is

16:28

gonna be a casualty. Chris'

16:30

dream. Tory Burch

16:33

will move on, but will C

16:35

wonder. More after

16:37

the break.

16:43

The legend of doctor Ronald Dante

16:45

spends decades, movie stars,

16:48

fugitive

16:48

yachts, continents, if

16:50

you believe his version of events.

16:52

He is Ronald Pella, a legendary

16:55

god man.

16:56

No one but wrong to pull that

16:58

off. From campsite media and

17:00

Sony Music Entertainment, chameleon

17:02

season five, Doctor Dante

17:04

is available now. Subscribe on

17:06

Apple podcasts to binge all episodes

17:09

or listen weekly wherever you

17:11

get your podcasts.

17:14

You may have heard of the podcast juicy scoop

17:17

wondered what it is? Why aren't you listening?

17:20

Well, I'm its host. Created it, been

17:22

doing it for seven years. I'm

17:24

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17:26

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17:28

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18:13

This is infamous from campsite

18:15

media.

18:19

So it's January two thousand fifteen,

18:21

cold Monday morning, first of the New

18:23

Year. But inside sea wonders, flat

18:25

are in office, the mood may be darker

18:28

than New York's gray clouds. Cardboard

18:31

boxes litter the room all around

18:33

the office about a hundred shell

18:35

shocked employees are packing

18:37

up their desks. Today

18:40

is their last day. C

18:43

wonder stores across the US have been shuttering.

18:45

And now, at an eleven AM

18:47

town hall, C wonder's corporate office

18:50

just found out they're being laid off.

18:53

A barebone staff will stay on for a few

18:55

more weeks to handle the wind down, but

18:57

sea wonders remaining shops will close

18:59

in a few weeks. And after

19:02

that, the brand is toast.

19:05

Chris is nowhere to be seen. He

19:07

recently relocated his as to Miami,

19:09

but the business has been far from sunny.

19:12

Chris' baby is hemorrhaging money.

19:15

In fact, it's estimated that Chris lost

19:17

seventy billion dollars of his own cash

19:20

on Sea Wonder. So

19:22

how does a loss that big happen?

19:25

The answer is lots of little

19:27

mistakes. They expanded

19:29

their footprint too quickly, opening

19:31

in cities without the customers to support

19:33

it. They were

19:35

forced to sell a lot of items at steep discounts.

19:38

That happened at an outlet mall that

19:40

this YouTuber visited in North

19:43

Carolina. I went to

19:46

Tanger outlets a couple of

19:48

actually, over a week ago. And

19:51

Sea Wonder just opened up there. They

19:53

are a final sale

19:56

only outlet. Basically, it

19:58

was buy to get one free.

20:00

And then it was like forty percent off

20:03

the jewelry.

20:04

But like a Phoenix, sea

20:06

wonder rose again or

20:09

at least It kinda limped

20:11

onto QVC. We

20:14

love our sea wonder t shirts and what do you wear

20:16

over? Your slubmit t shirt

20:18

you wear your Sea Wonder denim jacket.

20:20

In two thousand and fifteen, Chris

20:23

Burch sold Sea Wonder for just

20:25

twelve point five million dollars. And

20:27

its new owners struck a new deal to hawk,

20:29

close on air. Now QVC is

20:31

hardly a high fashion, but

20:34

The funny thing is that in some ways,

20:36

Chris Burch and his whole

20:38

idea, it was actually

20:40

ahead of his time. That's what Aimio

20:42

Dell thinks. If you think now

20:44

about Instagram and TikTok and

20:47

Home Depot and all of that, sure.

20:49

I think there's probably a huge market for little

20:51

magnetic. But now people probably buy them

20:54

from Urban Outfitters and Amazon and

20:56

other stores that have influence our affiliate

20:58

programs. Would have been too early.

21:01

Today, the former Sea Wonder store in SoHo,

21:04

the one I described at the beginning of these

21:06

episodes, is an Amazon

21:08

store. The brand Sea Wonder

21:10

now, it does still exist and you

21:12

can buy it at Walmart.

21:14

But Chris seems like he realizes how

21:16

badly this whole episode ended up.

21:19

You've started two businesses with family.

21:22

Right.

21:23

A lot of people say you shouldn't start a business

21:25

with family or it's difficult looking

21:27

back

21:29

It was the right choice. The only way It's

21:31

kinda like that analogy is,

21:34

for me, the business I started with family

21:36

turned out to be extremely successful businesses,

21:38

but it causes lot

21:41

of pain and consternation. I

21:43

would suggest not starting a business

21:45

with a family member I

21:47

think the best business

21:49

can be with friends. These days,

21:51

over a decade later, friends of

21:53

Tory and Chris actually say

21:55

they're on pretty good terms. When

21:58

I asked them for a comment for this story,

22:00

they sent me a joint statement. It

22:03

says, we have a close and positive

22:06

relationship especially around

22:08

our children. We strongly

22:10

believe the past is the past and

22:12

we feel fortunate to have each other's

22:15

support and friendship. As

22:18

for Tory Burch LLC, not

22:20

long ago, Tory stepped down as CEO

22:23

of her company to focus on designing.

22:25

But she's close with the new

22:28

CEO because he is.

22:30

Actually, her new husband.

22:33

Back in two thousand and fourteen, Pierre

22:35

Yves Roussel was the CEO of

22:38

LVMH. Louis Vuitton,

22:40

Mowei, Tennessee. It's the

22:42

world's largest luxury company.

22:45

And that is pretty much the biggest

22:48

job in fashion. Tory

22:50

was fresh from the Sea Wonder fight. Here's

22:53

Denise Tom, the former Forbes reporter.

22:56

They met and they started

22:58

doing long distance. Obviously,

23:00

he was in Paris and she was

23:02

in New York. And after

23:04

a certain point, they were

23:06

like, hey, how are we gonna

23:08

make this work? Like, let's get married

23:10

and be in the same place. As

23:13

the relationship was beginning to get more

23:15

serious, perhaps, Tory was also

23:17

tiring of running her own business. She

23:19

wanted to focus on the bit she loved.

23:22

And she loved designing clothes.

23:25

In other words, she was in the market

23:27

for a successor. So they got

23:29

they got married and shortly

23:32

after, Tory Burch,

23:34

the brand, announced that

23:36

Tory's new husband, Pierre Yves,

23:38

will be running the business. Alongside

23:41

Tory. The Anna Winter told me

23:43

was that Pierre Yves himself was

23:46

very hesitant. So my

23:48

understanding is that Tory completely

23:52

trusted him, and she thought that it was

23:54

gonna be okay. And I, you know, I asked

23:56

her that was like, you had a business

23:58

with your previous husband and

24:01

there were lawsuits involved like weren't you

24:03

weren't you scared. And I

24:06

think according to Anna Winter,

24:08

you know, Tory

24:11

did not really think that that would be an issue.

24:13

She just really trust's pure

24:15

eve. And

24:18

he was convinced.

24:19

To Tory, it was also simple.

24:21

That was what she said. Pierre Yves was the

24:24

best person for the job and

24:26

the best person for the job ended up being her

24:29

husband. She said a bunch of stuff that

24:31

actually makes you think, but

24:33

weren't you once married to someone

24:35

who ran the business with

24:36

you?

24:37

I've been a CEO and doing the creative

24:39

for fifteen years. Mhmm.

24:41

And it is such a relief to

24:43

be able to have someone you trust and

24:45

know that he has all good intentions

24:48

and will be taking the business to the

24:50

next

24:50

level. And we fundamentally see

24:52

business in the same way. PREs

24:54

was basically mister fashion. But

24:57

it also does seem that being married

24:59

to Tory Burch is the same as

25:01

being married. To Tory Burch, LLC.

25:04

He's the new mister Burch.

25:11

Next week, we're taking you to Dubai,

25:13

where a princess's golden cage is

25:16

still a cage.

25:18

I'm a hostage, and this

25:20

villa has been converted into a gym.

25:22

Every day, I am worried about my safety in my

25:24

life. Don't care enough. I've been

25:26

to similar situation. He's

25:29

the most evil person I've ever met

25:31

in my life. He's pure evil.

25:36

Inpromise is executive produced, created,

25:39

and hosted by Gabriel Sherman and me,

25:41

Vanessa Gregorianis. Natalie

25:43

Rovamed wrote and reported this episode.

25:46

Our managing producer and editor is

25:48

Shoshi Smolovits, Heather Schruhring,

25:50

I edited the episode, and

25:52

Natalia Winkleman, Grace Hurman,

25:55

Garigram, and Lily Houston Smith

25:57

produced. David Devereaux is our sound

25:59

designer. Voices by David

26:01

Eigler and Mark McGatham, Ewen

26:04

Lai Tramouen, is our recordist. Some

26:06

of this reporting appeared in Vanity

26:09

Fair

26:09

magazine. Thanks so