0:09

Hey readers, I'm an Bogle and this

0:11

is what should I read next? Welcome

0:13

to the show that dedicated to answering

0:15

the question that plagues every reader. What

0:18

should I read next? We don't get

0:20

past the on the show. What we

0:22

will do here is give you the

0:24

information you need to choose your next

0:26

three. Every week will talk all things

0:29

books and reading and do a little

0:31

literary matchmaking with one guest. If.

0:40

You Her! Last week's episode, I mentioned

0:42

that we recently sense a very short

0:44

notice invitation to our patron community to

0:46

fill a handful of last minute recording

0:48

slots because. Of personal demands

0:50

on my time this winter. Today's

0:52

guest is another member of our patron

0:55

community and we are still glad to

0:57

have him join us. Thank you so

0:59

much to all who answered are call

1:01

We so appreciate you and thank you

1:03

to everyone who has sent is sending

1:05

and will send some to that form

1:07

on a daily basis. My team and

1:09

I love reading every single one that

1:11

form is that what should I read

1:14

next? podcast.com/guests We are so honored and

1:16

privilege to get to read about your

1:18

reading lives. Thank you for sharing. Them

1:20

with us. Thank you for listening here! We're

1:22

so glad to be reading with you. I'm.

1:25

Jane Perlez long time Foreign

1:28

correspondent and former Beijing Bureau

1:30

Chief for the New York

1:32

Times. I've been a correspondent

1:34

in lots of places Somalia,

1:36

Indonesia, Pakistan, but nowhere as

1:39

important to the world as

1:41

China. I in China is

1:43

not dropping anti democratic paratroopers into

1:45

Montana. But of course we did

1:48

see things like the weather balloon/spy

1:50

balloon riveting the whole country for

1:52

a week. This his face

1:54

off and eight part series in which

1:56

will take you behind the scenes to

1:59

key moments in. The tumultuous Us.

2:01

China relationship will speak with

2:03

a diplomat, a spy attack

2:05

reporter, a Us admiral, even

2:07

yo yo ma. Plus

2:09

my pal and noted China historian

2:12

run emitter join the conversation, will

2:14

look at what's driving the two

2:16

nations a pass and explore with

2:18

anything can help bring them back

2:21

together. Say. Sauce launches

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April ninth. Families.

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Get ready for thoroughly. Not

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then with coach a kid.

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Podcasts. Join us

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the world, embarking on a journey

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through cultural traditions and languages all

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and best culture kids

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podcast Lazio video podcast

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he there. Now.

3:27

Leaders adjusting your beating life to

3:29

a new routines. It's hard, changes

3:31

hard even if it's detains and

3:33

today's guess would love my suggestions

3:35

as to too big and exciting

3:37

changes. The railed his previous strategy

3:39

of. Choosing his neck stream. Caleb.

3:42

Wilson Johnson used to love planning

3:44

his entire reading year in advance.

3:46

As a oriented person, he took

3:48

great joy and discovering the perfect

3:50

books for each season. Sometimes right

3:53

down to identifying the perfect book

3:55

is fit for the specific month

3:57

or even day as a Panzer

3:59

disclosed. Nine. But. He

4:01

would recently got married and moved across the

4:04

state to live with his new husband. Both

4:06

of these joyful offense and really impacted his

4:08

previous reading routine and instead of trying to

4:10

get back to the way things were before

4:13

his curious about exploring the a new path

4:15

forward could look like today came up and

4:17

I are going to think through how he

4:20

can bring a fresh outlook, the planning his

4:22

upcoming mates while keeping in mind his desire

4:24

for engaging and Pleiade books that will

4:26

hold his attention and keep him reading simply

4:28

because he cannot wait to pick the. Book

4:31

back up and find out what happens next.

4:33

Today's episode is all about reading for the

4:35

season you're in. I'm excited to share with

4:38

you. Let's get to it. Caleb.

4:41

Welcome to the So. Thanks. For having

4:43

me I'm so excited to be or. Oh

4:45

it's my father. It's so good to talk

4:47

to you and catch up. We're so excited

4:49

to see that you answered are called to

4:51

our patrons. I thought behind on recording was

4:53

just a lot of personal stuff this winter

4:55

and we ask our patron community as we

4:58

do sometimes to help us record on short

5:00

notice and thank you for answering the call.

5:02

Oh. I couldn't have responded. That's enough

5:04

successor. I appreciate that. See So game

5:07

of I want to introduce you to our

5:09

readers. Tell us a little bit about your

5:11

life, your life in in Detroit these days.

5:14

Yeah. So I live in Detroit,

5:16

Michigan and it just recently moved

5:18

here of this past december of

5:20

two thousand and twenty three after

5:22

living in Lansing for several years.

5:25

So. I got married or.

5:27

Not. To the plot but I got married

5:30

and. Possibly foil

5:32

anything by talking about getting married.

5:34

Yeah, that's what prompted the movie.

5:36

I've lived in Michigan for combined

5:38

total of about ten years now,

5:40

and had been primarily based in

5:43

Lansing. Our which is where

5:45

my job as and then met wonderful

5:47

guy Miles from my goal and. We

5:50

were married this past February

5:52

so we after going you

5:54

know back and forth trying

5:56

to decide where we wanted

5:58

to. Live. He

6:00

owns a home here so we decided it

6:02

would make the most sense for me to

6:05

move to Detroit. Not something that was them

6:07

the the books for me but I am

6:09

enjoying learning about. This.

6:12

Place with so much history and culture

6:14

and it says something that wasn't expected

6:16

a my life but it's been wonderful.

6:19

Or a tough to traits hit

6:21

find. Spot. When. She got.

6:24

Oh. My goodness I'm saying this is someone has only

6:26

been to the airport. Came. In. This.

6:29

Is it? So. Far me too Actually

6:31

before now I'd been in to

6:33

the suburbs of Detroit bite as

6:35

far as the actual city. I

6:38

just didn't know that much about

6:40

it and I will say it's

6:42

probably the best saying it is

6:44

a festival called Dally and the

6:46

Alley and it was where we

6:48

went for i think our second

6:51

like official date actually. So I

6:53

think it's a one day festival

6:55

and they closed down several different.

6:57

Blocks. And a neighborhood

7:00

and. There's. Art

7:02

and music, and all

7:05

sorts of performances happening.

7:08

In. The streets and in the alleyways

7:10

and between the streets. And of

7:12

course you know all of the

7:14

historic homes in Detroit. and everywhere

7:16

you turn. It's really a

7:19

spectacle. I I never been there anything

7:21

quite like it. And for instance, we

7:23

were walking through one little alley going

7:25

from. One. Area to another

7:27

and a marching band just popped up

7:29

and started plane and I don't remember

7:32

the song but I think it was

7:34

like a Britney Spears song played by

7:36

marching band and it was. The.

7:39

Most bizarre but delightful thing that I've

7:41

ever experienced. And so not to mention

7:43

the back that I was there. Be

7:46

no on a day with, you know,

7:48

the person who would eventually had become

7:50

my husband Butts. But yeah, I'd never

7:52

heard of this festival at all and

7:55

it was such a unique experience. There's

7:57

house music, there's rock, there's. Or

7:59

in. The their pop like all

8:01

over. These. Neighborhoods. So many

8:04

one things. And as is

8:06

Amazing. okay coming the soil. Everybody has

8:08

time to plan. Congratulations.

8:11

On your marriage. Thank. You so much.

8:13

And. Also, you mentioned your submission that

8:15

the same. Routine. Well.

8:17

You know what? Caleb, Unless it was it worth in your mouth, tell me

8:20

about it. I will

8:22

say that I'm very introverted, I'm

8:24

a homebody and so yeah was

8:26

pretty settled I would say and

8:29

into my life which was made

8:31

meeting my husband such a. Like.

8:33

Surprising and wonderful thing. but yeah,

8:36

I stay humble. I'm a reader.

8:38

I liked Cut Out, you know,

8:40

just kind of like had my

8:42

routine very much established. I liked

8:44

my neighborhood, I liked my commute

8:46

and all of it. And. You.

8:48

Know never imagine moving to a new

8:50

city. I work remotely so it wasn't

8:52

a huge deal and that regard by

8:54

I do commute to the office one

8:56

day a week so I have about

8:58

an hour and a half drive one

9:00

way. So. All the sudden

9:02

you know there's less time that

9:04

I have for reading. But but

9:07

not only bad, just kind of.

9:09

You know when your life merges

9:11

with another person's as you know

9:13

I'm you know, having been married

9:15

for quite awhile yourself, everything just

9:17

sort of changes. and it's It's

9:19

such a wonderful time of discovery

9:21

about yourself and who you are

9:23

as a person, but also the

9:25

person that you're marrying and and

9:27

combining your life with. And so

9:29

for me, just for instance, I

9:31

would read. Nonfiction. And

9:33

morning for about half an hour to

9:35

get my day started and the quiet.

9:38

and then in the evening I would

9:40

spend several hours. often times staying up

9:42

way too late. I would make a

9:44

cocktail I read for like you know,

9:47

two hours, maybe three and that says

9:49

that was my everyday routine. And so

9:51

now you know we have dogs in

9:54

the house of the mornings are quiet,

9:56

as silent as I'm used to. but

9:58

again all good thing. All very.

10:01

Joyful! Things and then in the

10:03

evening. It. We spend time together. We

10:05

watch Tv, And I do

10:07

have times where I husband is

10:09

working on it, his degree and

10:11

interior design. So there are times

10:13

when he's working on assassin project

10:16

or school project. And so I

10:18

do have those extended hours of

10:20

readings. but again, it's just a

10:22

big change and routine. And then

10:24

you know, the commute on Wednesday

10:26

that that definitely adds another. Element.

10:29

Of change to the make.

10:31

So it's just all been

10:33

delightful and crazy and wonderful

10:36

and different. And. You. Know

10:38

I've been in a bit of a tailspin, but I'm

10:40

I'm settling in. By

10:42

my reading, life has definitely taken a turn

10:44

for sure. Now I think a

10:47

lot of. Readers. Will be in see

10:49

by and maybe to are increasing some

10:51

the. Incident: Systems. Are

10:53

planning the you had your Tbr prior

10:56

to getting married. Like he said, he

10:58

has the missing that sometimes you plan your

11:00

reading right down to the months and it's.

11:03

Getting. Very specific but definitely like being a seasonal

11:05

reader and wanting to read around the season and

11:07

with. The bucks take place

11:09

and. We. Need to hear more about

11:11

that human. Is. It's very

11:13

and circuit add a little bit

11:16

mad depending on who you ask.

11:18

probably bites. I am a very

11:20

seasonal reader. A strong sense of

11:22

place is something bad is really

11:24

important to me and any book

11:26

that I read. so my system.

11:29

Up until now and this is just

11:31

my tendency. altogether. I just want the

11:33

experience to be totally immersive and so

11:36

I live here in Michigan. We do

11:38

have four Seasons decide most people thinking

11:40

it's just went all the time, but

11:42

we do get a nice sampling of

11:45

all four seasons and so I kind

11:47

of want to experience and my actual

11:49

life, what's going on and the book

11:51

that I'm reading so. I. Will

11:54

often. When. I am choosing a book

11:56

or when I saw you know out of bugs

11:58

my tbr. Usually. Are. Either

12:00

purchase the book or sometimes I'll

12:02

go to the little preview on

12:04

Google and I'll just read the

12:06

first few pages. And interesting

12:08

thing as most of the time like the

12:11

beginning of a paragraph or the beginning of

12:13

a chapter will say something that is an

12:15

allusion to. The. Season.

12:18

Or. The minds are the days, especially

12:20

with like epistolary novels or something where

12:22

it they give you the actual day

12:24

I live for those moments because he

12:26

makes it so easy for me to

12:28

the slot it right exactly where I

12:30

won it. But I think more than

12:32

that it's just. you know if I'm

12:35

reading a book that is about the

12:37

holidays and it says Christmas is approaching

12:39

I like that feeling been mirrored in

12:41

my reading. lies. The. I

12:43

will plan. Often times

12:46

my entire Tbr based

12:48

on the minds. The. Year,

12:50

the date. Sometimes I'll even pay

12:52

attention to details like you know

12:54

it. It was a very rainy

12:56

spring and so I know. Kind

12:58

of like where that would fit

13:00

in my Tbr schedule. so it's

13:02

very intricate. It's it's. a little

13:04

bit obsessive, but. It. Really

13:06

enhances the reading experience for me and

13:09

I remember reading the book st acts

13:11

of as like a thriller. And

13:14

even though. That.

13:16

Book took place in a tropical setting.

13:18

It was January and I remember that

13:20

because I was thinking okay, even though

13:22

it's cold here, but they're at a

13:25

tropical. Okay, so like they're escaping to

13:27

a vacation destinations I could still read

13:29

and January because I can feel like

13:31

I was escaping out of the cold

13:33

of Michigan. And some

13:35

interesting you know. I really like the strong

13:37

sense of place my work since I could not

13:40

have passed the puck. Where's the much to

13:42

ask me what month Cynics takes place? It

13:44

was during the school year i think so

13:47

and from school the idea night another. And

13:49

I guess to I can look back on books

13:51

that way and remember kind of the setting. And

13:54

you know the time that I read it and the

13:56

time that it took place based on that approach. And.

13:58

His, It's interesting and that's when the hopper

14:01

Now as we think about what you want

14:03

and you're reading life right now. Okay so

14:05

Caleb, you are finding yourself at a time

14:07

of. Great. Chains and upheaval in your

14:10

reading life. I don't know distress you have to

14:12

say it like that is something that I think

14:14

about all the time as that change the stressful

14:16

it can be good change it can be and

14:18

welcome change. but no matter what, like adapting. To

14:20

change is tough and. Lots of ways.

14:22

And for readers, of course, it's tough

14:24

in the specific way when that happens.

14:27

I. Would have said that before or guy

14:30

I've always been sort of. Not.

14:32

Resistant to change, but because

14:34

I'm such a routine. Oriented.

14:37

Person that probably would have described

14:39

the way that I fell. But.

14:42

This time and and this

14:44

particular situation. The. Way

14:46

that by now has a night. Mad

14:49

like it was a such a.

14:51

Unexpected and wonderful thing that happened to

14:54

my life. It just cause me to

14:56

really lean and to her and it's

14:58

it's felt more like an adventurer. In.

15:01

This situation. But I would have said that

15:03

for sure before because I've. Always

15:05

been such a routine oriented person. Like

15:08

added censor. I love that some Caleb

15:10

I'm gathering the you're not looking to

15:13

replicate we've had in Lansing. In Detroit

15:15

when it comes to your reading life, the goal is

15:17

not to carve out three hours a night for a

15:19

cocktail and many, many chapters of the That Bucks. right?

15:22

I think it's more of an

15:24

invitation for something new and a

15:26

different approach, which I do think

15:28

is refreshing and will kind of

15:30

reinvigorate my reading life. I

15:33

love believe that and also we're

15:35

definitely going to keep in mind

15:37

have you described reading has been

15:39

both enjoyment and centering practice Or

15:41

you. Just. It's both of those things.

15:44

Can we? Were you enjoy eating. He. Said he had

15:46

a pretty good idea of the textbooks. And work for you. Yes,

15:49

Like I mentioned before or something

15:51

with a strong sense of place

15:53

especially books were the place almost

15:55

becomes a character in itself. I

15:58

love books that are. Centered

16:00

around like a house or

16:03

a city or. Something.

16:05

Of that nature. Something. That

16:07

is driven by. An. Exciting

16:10

plot that kind of moves forward.

16:12

I know there are folks out

16:14

there who really enjoyed character driven

16:16

books that are very like interior

16:19

and lots of character development. But.

16:21

I find those books drive me

16:23

crazy a little bit, be heard

16:26

and I need something to happen.

16:28

And I think I remember. Maybe.

16:30

It was you on and podcast episode referencing

16:32

a book in Japan. If you're expecting something

16:34

to happen in this book, this is not

16:37

the book for you. But it was a

16:39

lot of internal monologue with with characters That

16:41

is not a book for me. I really

16:43

need to have a guy just not going

16:45

to me and. This. Which

16:48

was great because I knew that that was

16:50

not for me. but yeah I would say

16:52

strong sense of place and. Saw.

16:54

It would be the top to. Distinguish.

16:57

Months for me and what I'm looking for? A book.

17:00

And yet you like to be surprised. I

17:02

do. Yes, I love a twist even

17:05

if it's not like us thriller kind

17:07

of twist but just something unexpected. I

17:09

do enjoy that I do. I'm surprised.

17:13

I'm excited! To. Hear more. Kill

17:16

a prima disaster Megabucks. Yeah.

17:18

Let's do it. You.

17:20

Know how this works. You're going to tell me three

17:22

books you last one but you don't and what you've

17:25

been reading lately and will talk about what books may

17:27

be right for you in this next test as he

17:29

reading lists and he sees these her today. I.

17:33

Debated. How was going to approach this?

17:36

Whether I was going to choose my like

17:38

all time favorites to like? I keep a

17:40

running list of those because you know sometimes

17:43

that will change throughout. Throughout. Your

17:45

life. You might have said you had

17:47

a book that was like your favorite

17:49

of all time but. With. This

17:51

one I I went back and a couple

17:53

of these are all time favorites for me

17:55

by I tried to think recently I went

17:58

back through my good Reads to see. What?

18:00

I had enjoyed most. Recently.

18:02

And I think I would say like in the past. Two.

18:05

Years probably so this is a more recent

18:07

list. And he lime excited

18:09

to hear about what you can't Caleb, What

18:11

is the first? The que les. The.

18:14

First book I chose was my government means

18:16

to kill me by recede Newson. This.

18:18

Is a book that takes

18:21

place in the eighties and

18:23

it primarily centers around the.

18:26

Aids. Crisis, The Act Up

18:28

Movement, and the story is

18:30

told from the perspective of

18:33

a teenager or young adults

18:35

and he's. Sort. Of

18:37

coming into his own. And

18:40

you see the journey that he's

18:42

on the it's told and from

18:44

the perspective of of this person.

18:47

so it almost reads like a

18:49

memoir. And I would call the

18:51

speculative fiction because while it's based

18:53

on true events. You

18:55

know, this person obviously did not exist

18:57

in our allies, but there are footnotes

19:00

throughout the book that tell you you

19:02

know this might have been the way

19:04

it happened. Or. This

19:06

is the true part of you. know

19:08

this statement and this is. The. Historical.

19:11

Facts about it. but then there are other

19:14

parts of said well this is said to

19:16

have happened or this might have been how

19:18

this took place or this person might have

19:20

been here at this time. So I really

19:22

liked the fact that was based in fact

19:25

and it was told from the perspective of

19:27

this boy. but it was also. Kind

19:29

of. His own experience of how

19:31

he was navigating the world during that time

19:34

and how he became involved an. Act

19:36

Up and also discovering his own

19:38

sexuality. And so there's so many

19:40

components that spoke to me from

19:43

the setting been in New York

19:45

City with very vivid and it.

19:47

I. Also, just I found my own

19:49

self in that story a little bit too.

19:51

And so I'd really love this book and

19:54

I read it so fast because I just

19:56

was so rebutted by what was happening in

19:58

the story. That's a lovely

20:00

to stepson and it has me wondering about a couple

20:02

bucks. You may enjoy it later. Caleb.

20:05

Lists the second book He Loves. My.

20:07

Second book is congratulations The best

20:09

is over by our Eric Thomas.

20:11

I really love Eric's writing so

20:14

my it's his first book is

20:16

still one of my favorites of

20:18

all time and I was curious

20:20

to how the follow up would

20:23

be. since this was the second

20:25

memoir and essays he's written a

20:27

couple of or war One young

20:29

adult section and another book about

20:31

the life of Maxine Waters Bites

20:34

this Berg sort of. I don't

20:36

want to say. It picked up where

20:38

here for at his first book left

20:40

off. But. It it have is

20:42

distinctly different tone. And.

20:45

I had the privilege of getting to

20:47

know Eric through. A work

20:49

event that we hosted him for

20:51

a book club events and it

20:53

was interesting. Hearing him

20:56

talk about the writing process, You.

20:58

Know while bespoke was being written and kind of

21:00

what he was going through in his own

21:02

mice bite. I will say overall. Eric

21:05

has this way of calf

21:07

strain. Real. Life.

21:10

And. Motion and experience, but

21:12

also. Being. So really the

21:14

bull and humorous. And. Not

21:17

being afraid to say the things

21:19

that are hard are difficult but

21:21

also approaching it with. A.

21:23

Sense of Humor And you know that

21:25

both. Joy. And sadness

21:27

can coexist in your life at

21:30

the same time. And I honestly

21:32

really loves his voice. When he

21:34

writes, it's almost identical to his

21:36

actual real life personality. if it's

21:39

a very delightful. I

21:41

related to the book so much because of

21:43

some things I was going through a my

21:45

own life, but it just gave me permission

21:48

to see all those feelings to say them

21:50

out loud. But. Also to allow

21:52

joy to exists in my life at

21:54

the same time. So. This. Book

21:56

Is. I think he describes it as

21:58

sort of a midlife crisis. This kind

22:00

of moments by his writing is just

22:02

got about finding you where you are

22:04

an it's so relate of all. It's.

22:07

So funny and so enjoyable. And that's

22:09

what I love the most about bespoke.

22:12

And then we have let everybody know

22:14

that are Eric. Thomas appeared unless I

22:16

read next back in August. Twenty Twenty

22:18

Three That's episode Three Ninety Two. It's

22:20

called insightful and entertaining memoirs and you

22:22

can hear Eric talk about his own

22:24

work while we sarah hosting recommendations for

22:26

memoirs. The also had a lot the

22:29

same notes that you describe kill Them

22:31

like when the me where you are

22:33

that say the hard things but are

22:35

still really double and sunny. and yeah

22:37

we talked a lot about life and

22:39

as you mentioned Iraqs why a work

22:41

is that a. Like section of the bookstore

22:43

that you've explored are interested in exploring. I.

22:47

Have and I've read a couple of

22:49

Why a book that I will say

22:51

I really loved Kings of Be More

22:54

His why a six and book. For.

22:57

All the reasons I just described earlier about what

22:59

I look for in about strong sense of place.

23:01

A fast moving plight. I

23:04

I I don't wanna be rude or

23:06

insensitive saying that's what I do not

23:08

enjoy. Books about teenagers are children and

23:10

I don't know why that is my

23:12

government needs to kill. We may have

23:14

been an exception, but he was approaching

23:16

adulthood. I was also a children's faster

23:18

for a long time, so perhaps I

23:21

just. I just served my

23:23

time with. all things kids and youth

23:25

are teenagers? I don't know, but if

23:27

kids are children are are like the

23:29

main characters and a book. I don't

23:31

tend to enjoy it. I did really

23:33

love Kings of Be More so maybe

23:35

I'm open to that. Maybe it's something

23:37

I should explore more because that definitely

23:39

took me by surprise, but I have

23:41

not explored a ton of way. I

23:44

like your theory that perhaps he may

23:46

take years to restore some equilibrium the

23:49

your lives in that way. I.

23:51

Think you're Isis A. System Scale

23:53

of what is the third Vacuum of. The.

23:56

Third book I love and I will

23:58

say this one has been. My.

24:01

Favorites: Of all time

24:03

For many, many years I don't remember

24:05

the exact your was published, but it's

24:07

bread and wine. My Santa Nyquist. This.

24:10

Book. Check. So many

24:12

boxes for me. Ivory Reddit. I.

24:14

Don't know. Countless times, probably five or

24:16

six times at this point by the

24:19

combines a lot of things. I love

24:21

our food. I love food riding. Sign.

24:24

Up for a long time lived in Chicago

24:26

so she has a Midwestern sensibility and her

24:28

life and in her writing and that sort

24:30

of defined her. which is a lot of

24:33

what a book is about. And if you've

24:35

read any of her books at all, you

24:37

know that the Midwest and Chicago was just

24:39

a big part of her life and her

24:41

story and something she identified with by the

24:44

she writes with a very strong sense of

24:46

place and all of her books I feel

24:48

and. When. I read this book.

24:50

I just moved to Michigan. She lived

24:52

in Grand Rapids for a time as

24:55

well. so lot of the things that

24:57

she was writing about I was able

24:59

to experience restaurants, but also it's sort

25:01

of tommy how to approach cooking. I

25:04

was living on my own for the

25:06

first time and so it was a

25:08

companion to me. It was. An.

25:11

Interesting. I don't

25:13

say lot because it's a it's a

25:15

memoirs it's true story. Told. In

25:17

essays by there's a so many things

25:19

about Pittsburgh Bad: Just checked all the

25:21

right boxes for me. I love the

25:24

way this on a talks about food,

25:26

I love the way she talks about

25:28

books and reading and I just liked

25:30

the way this he describes. A.

25:32

Setting or a place or a time in

25:34

her life and I don't know for me

25:36

it just it. It hit all the right

25:39

marks. Know. I love status of since

25:41

I can. Tell. Me my has his

25:43

writing. And says notice that nets come

25:45

up and suddenly a couple a times. Yes,

25:47

Food. I am very very passionate about

25:50

food. I don't know that the term

25:52

food he is still a culturally relevant

25:54

bites. I love cooking. I love food

25:57

experiences. I love trying out new restaurants.

25:59

It's system. The in that. It's

26:01

a big part of my lies and.

26:04

On a personal know I will say that. It's

26:07

good. To be in that place

26:09

because I struggled for a long time with

26:11

disordered eating and so for a long time,

26:13

food for me was nigh. A.

26:15

Pleasure. or it wasn't something that I found

26:18

Joy Enema something I found a lot of.

26:20

Same man. And that's another reason why this

26:22

book, bread and wine spoke to me. Because

26:24

seats you sort of talks about that. Journey.

26:26

For herself to and you know

26:29

now that I think about it

26:31

may be. That was a moment

26:33

where I stopped apologizing for loving

26:35

food and eating and the way

26:37

that it gathers people in the

26:39

way that food connects people and

26:41

cultures and and all these different

26:44

things that I just love reading

26:46

about food at. Roof Rifles

26:48

or my favorite Authors who writes almost exclusively

26:50

about food. So yeah, it's a big it's

26:53

a big part of my life and I

26:55

just live experience as damn ball food like

26:57

it's something that I'm very passionate about and

26:59

that I enjoy on. I.

27:01

Hit the skids now and definitely something that we will

27:03

keep in mind. Candid. With

27:06

heard about Lila is now tell us about about

27:08

that was not. At. It since the yes. Yes,

27:11

And I was so disappointed by the Us

27:13

because I saw it was going to be

27:15

hit the mark. so much for me that's

27:17

the book. Devil House by John Darn Yell

27:20

and I first heard about this book from

27:22

Samantha Herb. He says here's the most humorous

27:24

reviews of things that sees, read em and

27:26

the way she describes than I just I

27:29

think it's so funny. bite. Many.

27:31

Of the looks is recommended have really worked

27:33

for me this one though. When

27:36

I'm choosing a book, I. Again

27:38

with my systems I will. I will always

27:40

say like of I'm reading a description and

27:42

if it checks three boxes for me but

27:44

I know I will read it and I'll

27:46

give it my time. So. I

27:49

have very i think nice

27:51

and dress one of those

27:53

his eighties and early nineties

27:56

nostalgia. Another thing is. Like.

27:59

A haunted house Or a manor house

28:01

or something like that. And so this

28:03

book. Is. About a. House

28:06

that had been all of these different

28:08

things. Can be Neat

28:10

store at one point and there was

28:12

a gruesome murder that took place at

28:15

his house. And. So the cover of

28:17

the both very much looks like of. Kind.

28:19

Of Pulp Fiction book from the

28:21

eighties that she would see like

28:23

an old Stephen King paperback of

28:25

So so many Things About is

28:27

what drew me and the main

28:29

character and the story. Moves into

28:31

the home to have a house

28:33

for this gruesome murder took place

28:35

to investigate it and I just

28:37

kept waiting for something to happen.

28:39

something that was going to like

28:42

move the plot forward. There were

28:44

three sections of the book and

28:46

not a giveaway any spoilers here,

28:48

but it just never. Really went anywhere

28:50

and instead so I stopped reading and about

28:52

i don't know seventy five percent the way

28:54

through and then Ice and I went back

28:56

to finish it because it is bugging me

28:58

and when I realized was the whole thing

29:01

was just. An. Exploration of.

29:04

Truth and how a story is told.

29:06

and the perception and ice. I suppose

29:08

it's interesting to think about that, but

29:11

it was not what I was looking

29:13

for. In terms of I

29:15

felt like the description was very off. Okay,

29:18

so you love the book he thought it was going

29:20

to be. In you didn't love to book

29:22

it was. Yes, And

29:24

instill when I look back on it like when

29:26

I see the cover, him and I read the

29:28

plot summary. I still. I'm like

29:31

oh I I really want to loved as

29:33

to what I wanted to be something different.

29:35

but it's it's was it. And and I

29:37

do love books that kind of. You.

29:39

Know take a broader look like they're

29:41

saying something bigger and and using the

29:44

story as more of a vehicle you

29:46

know for a larger narrative to come

29:48

through. Or. A deeper narratives to come

29:50

through. But yeah, didn't take any box for me

29:52

and I'm still sad about it. He

29:55

would. I was really interesting is how unhappy

29:57

has there's a lot of Jon Daniels nuisance

29:59

and. Really like before he was a

30:01

novelist, he was and is a lyricist

30:03

for The Mountain Goats By it is

30:06

you know there's some reading experiences. Where

30:08

because of a relationship you have with the person

30:10

or persons work. The feel like I have

30:12

to love this. There is no her absence

30:14

and. The I've been afraid to pick it

30:16

up. Okay, but I will at least

30:18

know what I'm getting into his past when I

30:21

do. Yes, All right,

30:23

I'm just gonna leave. Sat there for the time

30:25

being. Caleb: When have you been reading lately? The.

30:28

Most recent book that I've read I just

30:30

finished as a couple days ago as I

30:32

have some questions for you by Rebecca Mci.

30:35

I. Will say her previous book, The

30:37

Great Believers is still probably my

30:40

very favorite fiction books of all

30:42

time. Favorite novel. So many things

30:44

about that. Book. Just

30:46

spoke to me because I was really excited

30:48

about this. Book. By her I know

30:50

it was really anticipated and I've heard. Varying.

30:54

Opinions on the approach. I really

30:56

loved it for all the reasons

30:58

I just talked about earlier. Strong

31:00

sense of place, the plot move

31:02

forward. It was very surprising. it

31:04

had a few twists that I

31:06

was not expecting. I enjoyed it

31:08

so much and would highly recommend

31:10

it. It really reinvigorated my

31:12

reading life for sure. I'm.

31:14

Really glad to hear that was a winner for you. Another

31:17

bug that I've really enjoyed recently,

31:19

and this was something I was

31:21

I read in the morning during

31:23

my non fiction reading time was

31:25

one hundred Things We've Lost To

31:27

the Internet by Pamela Paul. I

31:30

heard an interview with her on

31:32

Npr and. Again, going

31:34

back to the nostalgia factor see

31:36

list or hundred different things that.

31:38

We. Do not have any more because

31:40

of the internet and I think this

31:43

and even say it sometimes half joking,

31:45

half serious but of I wish we

31:47

didn't have cell phones anymore. or sometimes

31:49

I wish there was no internet because

31:51

I feel that. There. Is a

31:54

connection that's been lost between people.

31:57

Maybe I'm just an assault a person, but I

31:59

I do have. Vivid memories of you

32:01

know, using a phone without long

32:03

cord or. I do

32:06

find joy and doing a

32:08

lot of things in an

32:10

analog manner and. I just

32:12

found this book to be interesting,

32:14

a kind of the delved into

32:16

like what we've lost but also

32:18

what we gained by the internet.

32:21

It was a quick read. the chapters are

32:23

very sore indigestible which made it perfect for

32:25

morning reading. but I thought it was very

32:27

insightful and it just kind of check that

32:30

nostalgia box for me as well. That's.

32:33

Really? Interesting. I'm glad you enjoyed it. I remember

32:35

to connect with him a library when it came

32:37

out and. And was just talking

32:39

with my fourteen your the Bennett morning. Because we

32:42

were wondering about the weather. And.

32:44

We both agree Sir I phones and one thing

32:46

that Pamela passes loss. To the internet is

32:48

wondering about the weather along with well

32:50

as a window and boredom and will

32:52

toss us and about really missing the

32:54

land line like the kitchen sewn in

32:57

a house. Yeah. I think about that

32:59

when all the time. A nursery isn't finished

33:01

it when I saturday. But. I think about

33:03

it all the time and even the weather channel of

33:05

the see talk about the. She.

33:07

Does Yeah and I I guess the

33:09

Weather channel may be came along a

33:11

little bit later but there are videos

33:14

on Instagram of the music from the

33:16

Weather Channel and it just evoke such

33:18

strong emotions. Front of a day waiting

33:20

you know for the scream slides on

33:22

the screen to scroll. Third, see what

33:24

the weather was going to be? An

33:26

even better when the little announcement ticker

33:28

with sprawled across the bottom saying of

33:30

schools are closed or open on snow

33:32

days. Or when you had to

33:35

call the school number and wait for the voicemail.

33:37

Okay, that's supposed to Sicily thinking of I. Imagine

33:39

my brother's baseball games getting cancelled and you

33:42

had to be. One of like

33:44

three hundred families to call and hear

33:46

the recording. That with say. Games are

33:48

on her games or us and getting free

33:50

with nightmare my mom but set a timer

33:52

goes every minutes to seek across that they

33:55

don't miss. Been. A lot of

33:57

it. Yeah. Unless there really isn't the

33:59

starts descent. For. Sure, Visit

34:01

them with your eighties nineties nostalgia. Absolutely.

34:04

Okay Caleb, we thoughts about and around this

34:06

for much of our time together. but what

34:08

would you say you are looking for and

34:11

you're reading life right now. My

34:13

routine is just completely changed and

34:16

I've looked at it as an

34:18

invitation for my my reading life

34:20

to change, but I think what

34:22

I'm looking for most is just

34:25

some strategy both in terms of

34:27

getting some reading momentum back at

34:29

some in a very busy season,

34:31

are planning a wedding, getting married,

34:33

moving to a new city, all

34:36

of these things but just firstly

34:38

getting my really moments and back.

34:41

I think this might be an opportunity to

34:43

may be step out of the hustle of

34:45

like being disappointed if I don't worry four

34:47

bucks a month which is what I averaged

34:49

before by. Just. Been okay with

34:51

the pace and I'm going in terms

34:53

of reading and also choosing books that

34:56

will help me accomplish that goal. So

34:58

I'm very open. I'm excited to try

35:00

something new as as new fresh outlook.

35:03

As I think to go of

35:05

of further just managing my own

35:08

expectations. And. Prioritizing books

35:10

that will. Keep.

35:12

The momentum going and instead of

35:14

feeling disappointed that I am not

35:16

finishing a certain amount of bugs,

35:18

just enjoying what I am reading

35:20

but also choosing bugs that will

35:23

help me feel like com plus.

35:26

Muggy. Accomplished as the wrong word. Because

35:28

it's not a competition. I'm

35:30

really glad you had the opportunity here

35:33

yourself because there's nothing then when instill

35:35

accomplished. Unless. You

35:37

hear yourself and think, actually, that's not what

35:39

I want. It. Might be what you

35:41

wanted for a really long time. Kill.

35:44

Do something about a fresh outlook for

35:46

right now and. I'm interested

35:48

in how it feels to channel like

35:50

your past self. The

35:52

one he was very. Diligence

35:56

and tactical and

35:58

specific about. Planning

36:00

your to be reading lists. Around

36:02

the season you are an and

36:04

the seasons and which the books

36:07

take. Place. And so.

36:10

Not. He gets him at on you but like

36:12

Caleb you are in a season. And.

36:14

I wonder if instead of thinking

36:16

like oh well, it's April? oh,

36:18

it's still Iowa's January Like I

36:20

wonder if you think like okay,

36:23

Here's a man. In this

36:25

season. And what book

36:27

might said This readers. This reader,

36:29

who is you? right? Now. Like

36:32

what would be right? For for a brief

36:34

moment. That you are

36:36

in. If anything, they're. Yeah.

36:39

That's so unfair for and I feel like I'm in therapy

36:41

right now. Ethic

36:44

Therapy Yes, that's exactly what I

36:46

am trying to say. realizing.

36:49

That says the season of my life. And

36:51

one of the things I've been

36:54

thinking a lot about just personally,

36:56

is being present for today. Being

36:58

grateful for today, being grateful for

37:00

the moment that I man and

37:02

I think so many times. Not.

37:05

To get too deep here bite, you know

37:07

in terms of reading or anything else we

37:09

can be so focused on. Getting.

37:11

Something accomplish that we just don't enjoy

37:13

the moment that were libyan. Or

37:15

the book there were reading as it were. Yes, I

37:17

like that Call back to the pump list. Also

37:20

I feel like I was asked me to diagnose

37:22

just and like okay here is a man that

37:24

man is in a place. where does that mean

37:26

nice But also maybe you don't have those answers

37:28

right now or maybe just have the glimmers and

37:30

I think that like one of the seasons are

37:33

in is really a season of discovery and like

37:35

that's a wonderful thing. This can be a season

37:37

of discovery in your reading life as well. He.

37:40

Has of I love that. Yeah.

37:42

Yeah, okay so. I

37:44

can hear the you already have giving

37:46

yourself a great deal of permission to

37:48

dislike. Kinda like get the lay of

37:50

the land. For. Where you are now. New.

37:53

Place practically metaphorically and I would just

37:55

like to affirm like yes, that that

37:58

is it that place for you right

38:00

now. And. Some

38:02

readers who really like to see oh grounded

38:04

in who want to know what's happening next

38:07

might even want to get themselves from us

38:09

in the like. Okay, for like, we don't

38:11

need a thing about the site Year for

38:13

a year, just kinda see where the tide

38:15

takes you. You might be really

38:17

uncomfortable with that. He. Seems to see where

38:19

this I'd say see you might feel a he won a little

38:21

more stocks or. But Caleb, He's also a

38:23

you really wanted to manage. Your own

38:26

expectations to. I

38:28

would really like to encourage you just to

38:30

be cognizant of the timing. I. Don't

38:32

want to tell you what you said are

38:34

shouldn't do, but I'm playing with the concept

38:37

of like rushing things. Are encouraging yourself

38:39

to hurry. Like whether or not even

38:41

realize you're doing it of thinking like there's a

38:43

ticking clock of thinking you ought to have it

38:45

figured out by x dates. I don't know how

38:48

you feel about sign. And getting on

38:50

with things. Were. You thinking now.

38:53

That. Sounds Just write a I

38:55

think it all goes back to

38:58

just enjoying the moment, enjoying the

39:00

place that I man and being

39:02

open to. What? The future

39:04

holds. I love what you just

39:06

said about being and a season

39:08

but just like taking the whole

39:11

time component out of the equation,

39:13

I'm here and the summer I'm

39:15

enjoying bespoke. I'm enjoying this experience

39:17

and I'm not gonna discounted by

39:20

being. Upset that I am

39:22

not further along on my Tbr or whatever

39:24

the case may be. The

39:26

here reader you'll be a leader and you

39:28

can figure out what kinda readers you're going

39:30

to be now and in the near future.

39:33

On. Your own timeline. I

39:35

think there's a lot to be sad about. Enjoying

39:38

the place that were am but also being

39:40

excited and curious about the person that we

39:42

will become. Very. Excited and curious

39:44

where you entered the same time. You're talking

39:46

about how you want to prioritize certain kinds

39:49

of books that would keep the momentum going.

39:51

And like, I don't want to seem too

39:53

much, but I'm I'm thinking that books that

39:55

help you keep the momentum going. And.

39:58

The ones that your side it's read that the. That

40:00

you want to pick up. The

40:02

ones that make you think like ah, you

40:04

know, like this with time well spent with

40:07

that book. Does. That ring

40:09

true. Yes, Absolutely.

40:11

I think. The. Best

40:13

reading experiences that I've had have

40:15

always been those were. I'm

40:17

thinking about it throughout the day. You know I'm

40:19

I'm looking forward to when I can dive back

40:21

and and see what. Waits. For

40:24

me with them both pages and I've

40:26

I think I have some questions for

40:28

you. Really did that for me most

40:30

recently. So that is definitely what I'm

40:32

looking for. I'm. Really

40:34

excited about what you can be reading. You

40:36

have a good idea of what you love in some ways

40:38

and also I just want to see late for you that

40:40

you sad and your. Submission and out

40:43

loud The you really enjoy

40:45

being surprised and perhaps. And

40:48

we used to stick with us but

40:50

I'm wondering what it might be like

40:52

for you to really embrace idea that

40:54

this is a season of discovery and

40:56

that may mean like this, giving yourself

40:58

like an extra grace like our a

41:00

preferential option for the. The weird

41:02

stuff. The Stuff: Maybe a little further

41:05

off your beaten path, but by all means, if

41:07

you're really excited about something that sounds right up

41:09

your alley and what you've left in the bath

41:11

like, do that. That sounds great as the kind

41:13

of thing we can get excited about as readers,

41:15

but also like them. maybe. Oh Sarah title issue.

41:17

This is like kind of like ah, I

41:20

don't know if you're intrigued, you could try it.

41:22

Without. Feeling like he would be

41:25

a loss to discover that you

41:27

didn't have it? Oh

41:29

yeah, that's such a great way of framing of

41:31

and I will love this approach of surprise. Ready

41:34

for it. I haven't yet. And.

41:36

I am. I'm just really excited about where

41:38

you are in your life and you realize

41:41

guessing great questions. I'm excited for you.

41:43

Can I keep them excited for you and really excited for

41:45

the. I can feel

41:47

the excitement and I appreciate it. Let's talk

41:49

about what are we next, What he thinks. Let's do it. You.

41:53

Loved! My government means to kill me

41:56

by receiving isn't. Congratulations.

41:58

The best is over by our. Eric com Esse

42:00

and Bread and Wine by Sun and Equal As

42:02

although I did notice that you said perhaps the

42:05

great, The Leavers by Rebecca Mci is your favorite

42:07

six in of all time. Yes,

42:09

And that's that still stands. In Also,

42:11

I'm seeing least not in there. I got it

42:13

noted that's going into the pot. Not

42:16

for you. With Devil House by Giant are now you

42:18

thought you would love the book you thought it was

42:20

in. It was not that book. right?

42:23

And then lately Rebecca Mci they have some

42:25

questions for you was really works Also you

42:27

pick up a good amount of oxygen like

42:29

past your books we talked about had been

42:31

nonfiction so you mentioned Pamela. Paul's one hundred things

42:33

with loss to the innocent. Yes, And

42:36

now we're going to think about what you

42:38

might read next. Okay, off the beaten path

42:40

to surprising, but I'm definitely critically. Acclaimed

42:43

so far. As you yet encountered.

42:45

Martyr by copper Akhbar. I.

42:48

Haven't haven't even heard of that. I.

42:50

Think this could be a surprising book

42:52

for you, but also it has. So

42:54

much in common with books that you have

42:56

read. His you pull

42:58

up. The. Cover you will

43:01

see right off the bat by

43:03

the little speech bubble. That

43:05

it's presence on a series. Cover That

43:07

this book has a sense of

43:10

humor. Which is something the

43:12

like the for. As and

43:14

elements in books that are really talking

43:16

about serious like, sometimes hard in heavy.

43:18

Things. That are

43:20

shared. A in a voice that and I

43:22

would really encourage you to just like pick

43:25

this up in the bookstore, the library, or

43:27

just like read a sample on the internet.

43:29

The voice is something. The grabs lot of

43:31

readers like right from the be getting like oh this

43:33

is a character I could settle in and spend some

43:36

time with. spends. Three hundred pages with think

43:38

it's a little bit on the server. Side

43:40

but this is.

43:42

A story by a man who

43:45

is a poet's. He's. In

43:47

A because of his over dependence

43:49

on alcohol and he's an addict

43:51

to a whole lotta stuff that

43:53

he says isn't especially like scary

43:55

on it's own. he just does

43:57

the drugs and combinations that always.

44:00

Wonder think that living in the

44:02

real world but arbor Dragon is

44:04

is an Iranian American poet. His

44:06

name is Cyrus. he's in Indiana

44:08

see got some mid western ground.

44:10

In essence, sensibility, there are like

44:12

that I thought you might. So

44:14

both his parents have already died.

44:16

his father died of a stroke

44:18

and his mother died because she

44:20

was on an Iranian passenger airline

44:22

that the Us Navy. Sat down in

44:24

Nineteen Eighty Eight and he does circle back

44:26

in recess. at that time late eighties

44:29

reference but it is there. He

44:31

is not entirely sure it's not

44:33

because the drugs but he has

44:35

enough or they would he interprets

44:37

to be a sign from God

44:39

that it sets him off on

44:41

a. Quest. So.

44:44

At the very beginning of the book he

44:46

has a sign from God and. It's.

44:48

Like like a label flickers. It's a

44:50

real little thing, but it's enough for

44:52

him to like. Conceive of this like

44:54

big. Poetry. Project. He's

44:57

going to create this thing called the

44:59

book of Martyrs because his mother his

45:01

of really interested in the concept of

45:03

martyrdom and you can decide. How you

45:05

think he sees himself? In. That

45:07

context that just like he happens to discover

45:09

that there is a terminally ill Iranian American

45:11

artists who is living out the end of

45:14

her life in the Brooklyn Museum. As he

45:16

said talking the visitors who were like coming

45:18

i'm pilgrimages to see her and Cyrus is

45:20

like you know what I'm going to do

45:23

I gotta go talk to the terminally ill

45:25

artists and so it becomes a quest story.

45:27

They're going to go to Brooklyn, Gonna journey,

45:29

They're gonna learn some things Along the way

45:32

it feels like there's a dark. Tone to

45:34

the story and you wonder what he really

45:36

intense as he hints. At what his

45:38

life will be like during and then

45:40

after he completes this project. So

45:43

serious that is happening here,

45:45

but also the tone throughout. Like

45:48

it's funny and there are some books that deal

45:50

in dark and have a things. But.

45:53

Have like such a strong

45:55

sense of humor alongside it's.

45:57

Just. You consider that Million said.

45:59

You. That would I react how mr

46:01

This is the six know version of

46:04

that. This book does that dark humor

46:06

really well and I also think that

46:08

you may enjoy like the philosophical exploration

46:10

in hand them with. This.

46:12

Guy it's like thunder hangouts and timeless. I think

46:14

easy get home and be like what do we

46:17

do and next Iris son does that sound the

46:19

use. Of Gray. I pulled

46:21

up the cover and I'm very intrigued and I

46:23

love the little illustration of on the cover. the

46:25

skills Like something that I would enjoy. I'm.

46:28

Glad to hear that going in a different

46:30

direction. I'm in a plot a book at

46:32

some Germ. Good Reads was we asked readers

46:34

for on on their submissions if they would

46:36

like to share and maybe you've already read

46:39

this season? Tell me what you think but

46:41

the ones that I want to recommend is

46:43

The Supper of the Lamb A Colin Their

46:45

It Reflects and by Robert Sarah Capon. Have

46:48

you picked this up yet? You put on your list A looks

46:50

like and twenty twenty two. I

46:52

have not picked us up and I funny

46:54

enough, I first heard about this book from

46:57

Santa Nyquist and then I think gender mentioned

46:59

at a little more recently on an episode

47:01

of the podcast and so it sounds like

47:03

it would be just right for me and

47:05

I sort of like put it on and

47:07

then taken it off my Tbr list based

47:09

on the new that I man. but I

47:11

think this might be the time. I

47:14

really relate to what you're saying about this

47:17

book because I follow Sauna forever. But Caleb

47:19

Ginger on our team as the ones who

47:21

like I remember being the one who put

47:23

it on my radar and the way she

47:25

described it made me think elastic a reader

47:28

immediately and look, I don't want to be

47:30

heavy handed with you, but before we hit

47:32

record on our conversation that we're having right

47:34

now, we're talking about recycle and so much

47:36

You love her, right? And how I

47:38

didn't realize this is such that I should

47:40

be subscribed to because I feel like I

47:42

read everything she writes. but now I've been

47:45

missing out. But you can pick up the

47:47

addition of the Supper of the Lamb, which

47:49

was written decades ago, but there's a new

47:51

were addition is in the Modern Library Said

47:53

series. The has an introduction by Deborah Madison

47:55

to I imagine you've encountered as someone who

47:57

lost his writing. Of course that.

48:00

Of the theories editor it is Ruth

48:02

myself and she writes the first introduction

48:04

in this back and talks about her

48:06

experience growing up and how is she

48:08

became a cooker of vegetables for reasons

48:10

even though she didn't feel at home

48:12

and that role and how seeking to

48:15

cooking and how she felt misunderstood with

48:17

her left for food we both know

48:19

that he can really write descriptions of

48:21

your her reminisce about. Meal Seasons White

48:23

or write about what she's eating now or

48:25

what she wants to eat Split. See

48:27

things: the praises of the suppress,

48:29

the lamb beer and those pages.

48:31

Before you even have the opportunity to

48:33

get started with the book, Itself.

48:36

But then. The.

48:38

Author: Takes the stage

48:40

and he like get you started

48:43

by laying out a recipe for

48:45

a dinner party and kind of

48:47

like rise. Gently. Snarky.

48:50

Tone: He tells you how to do it right.

48:52

What's gonna happen if you do it wrong? Make

48:54

sure that the butcher doesn't cut the lamb into

48:57

the poor sense and selves. Or you'll lose half

48:59

the fun and also half the portions. He

49:02

like has is as it's whale comments about the

49:04

recipe for the lamb and he's like well okay

49:06

so I told you how to do that Now

49:08

let's get started and. This is

49:10

another one where I think you could pick

49:12

it up. Read the sample. Reversed

49:14

myself whereas if you want. But also see

49:16

a little bit about this man whose

49:19

first person narrative you'll be spending some

49:21

time with in these pages and I

49:23

think you'll find that really want to

49:25

like he's on like wins a cool

49:27

and Funny and rye as such a

49:30

good sense of humor but as also

49:32

deeply related li talking about food. And.

49:35

How we can enjoy it but also by

49:37

it means. So whether he's talking about the

49:39

gift as gathering or what it means says

49:41

it's really like live in the moment and

49:43

cut. Your. Onion I think he tells you

49:45

the been to set aside in our you don't have any

49:47

with thing us to do you like this is important stuff

49:50

let's just do it right. That sounds delightful.

49:52

It is. Okay so there's one review

49:54

from Returning Dominica on Good Reads. I

49:56

just had to share this. Is the review

49:58

in it's entirety. An explosion of

50:00

joy over the goodness of being like this.

50:02

Talking about this book address, you can hear

50:05

me smiling as a Sig smile on my

50:07

days. You could sit down and read this

50:09

in one sitting because you wouldn't wanna get

50:11

up, but you can also. Read it

50:13

and smaller parts and just find yourself looking

50:15

forward to seeing what Mr. Capon is gonna

50:17

tell you about next. How

50:19

that sounds exactly like what I needed

50:22

that combines so many elements from the

50:24

food and then you mentioned for a

50:26

by reprisal Santa Nyquist one point talked

50:28

about this I think. Yeah, I

50:30

think this is right up my alley. Attempt

50:33

adherents look while we were in Indiana. Maybe

50:35

I should have mentioned Ross Gay. But.

50:38

I. Think you could really like has bite size on

50:40

six in his to most recent the book enjoy the

50:42

book of more joy. If those are

50:45

not yet on your radar on yourself, please. To

50:47

think, Think about those. I think you can enjoy those.

50:50

Have not read them, but I did gift

50:52

them to a friend recently. They. Make

50:55

excellent if bucks I mean you know there

50:57

is beautiful and by his size and I

50:59

don't know what makes him such good. Gift

51:01

box I know they are but can they

51:03

are situated. She. Was going through a difficult

51:05

time. I felt like she needed some joy so

51:07

I. Just felt like the book

51:10

of Delights or something that she might

51:12

find useful. I can appreciate

51:14

that. So he also I'm the one from lieu

51:16

of will not you but a local coffee shop

51:18

does a cameo. Something important happens to the local

51:21

coffee shop. I thought I lost a son. Caleb.

51:25

When. You were talking about my government needs

51:27

to kill me. It really put me

51:29

in mind of a lie. A novel

51:31

which is why I asked you hey.

51:33

How do you feel about why a novel

51:36

as he answers Snow Grape? Or maybe so

51:38

because you did really loved Kings of the

51:40

More. I do. We're

51:42

both aware that this may or may not

51:44

be a great set, but I do want

51:46

you to know about it. This is a

51:48

favorite. as team member least she's the one

51:50

who put it on my radar and I

51:52

ya thought bucks she said this looks utterly

51:54

wrecked her. And. Also, of course, for

51:56

those reasons, it might be her all time

51:58

favorite way. Novel. Now that. The came to

52:00

Reddit and Twenty twenty but you did

52:03

speak highly of it and with Iran

52:05

for myself, I could topple the get

52:07

it. So this is about an Iranian

52:09

seen his name is rather and he

52:12

is gay, deeply closeted, newly arrived in

52:14

New York City where he makes a

52:16

friend who's in the spring fashion designer

52:18

and then he meets another friend who's

52:21

a photographer and he's out at school

52:23

and actually president which. Is

52:25

not the place where Reza is when

52:27

the story begins. So this is one

52:29

of those stories that we've I mean

52:31

we've been talking about a lot of

52:34

books that are both like about important

52:36

in hard things. And

52:38

also like abs elements of grace

52:41

and is a little bit a

52:43

humor that lightens the heavy. So

52:45

this is a story that explores.

52:47

The ups and downs of friendship. And for

52:50

slugs, there's a love triangle here. It's

52:52

all set against the backdrop of Aids

52:54

and activism in nineteen eighties New York,

52:56

and it's one that doesn't shy away

52:58

from Greece a lot of that era,

53:00

but also really, Celebrates the community that

53:02

read the signs in New York. And.

53:04

Nineteen. Think mostly. Nineteen Eighty Nine.

53:06

So. I think this has some of

53:09

the same elements of stories you enjoy. Yes,

53:11

it definitely has that eighties nostalgia. I ones

53:13

either know about it. I'm afraid to ask. I

53:15

feel like of this is a maybe than

53:17

like we're winning But if it's not that

53:19

I at least learn something. We can move on. Yes,

53:22

I think diver definitely give it

53:24

a try. I think similar to my

53:26

governments to Kill Me on the

53:28

Great Believers that period of time and

53:31

Aids activism or something that's really interesting

53:33

to me and so I think

53:35

kind of hearing stories about the same

53:38

period of time through the lens of

53:40

other people's experiences because everyone's viewpoint

53:42

is so different. perspective are so different.

53:44

I think this is my really work

53:47

for me. I'm definitely going to

53:49

try. I'm glad to hear that.

53:52

I. Want to throw on a mystery the morning? Go back

53:54

to New York City. I know if you've read Simone same

53:56

chains, I love some on St. James.

53:58

Have you read this and them As. Yeah.

54:01

It checked all the boxes for me and it was

54:03

a five star free. Okay, perfect so

54:05

I'm glad to hear that was the

54:07

winner. Readers: If you did not understand

54:09

the subtext, this fix it was. Zinaida

54:11

succeeds. This takes place in Upstate New

54:13

York at a run down motel nineteen

54:15

eighty. Who with those eighty sides and

54:17

it's got a one hundred motel. This

54:19

as much a character is the women

54:21

at the front of the story and

54:23

like I thought this is one with

54:26

the pages practically turn themselves like why

54:28

is there always the lingering sent a

54:30

cigarette smoke when nobody's been smoking. I

54:32

guess why do these mysterious things keep happening for

54:34

reasons that you do get to find out by

54:37

the and that the book. Yes,

54:39

It's so a moody, an evocative like

54:41

you really can picture yourself. fair like.

54:44

I found myself cold multiple times when

54:46

I was reading here and really have

54:48

it checked out like that for me.

54:51

I'm glad to hear. How. Has this

54:53

one is a stretch but I want you

54:55

to know about it and especially We've been

54:57

talking about how you are really enjoying like

54:59

watching some adaptations on screen. The says this

55:02

is Garth Risk, Hallberg City on Fire and

55:04

Caleb that is a big all bucks the

55:06

thing like nine hundred pages and. I think

55:08

this was first introduced to me. By.

55:12

Or guess that hands on like episodes for

55:14

that We talked. About it is for

55:16

wealthy just like very. Very.

55:18

Early in our history. Of.

55:21

Wasn't one of the zebra. But.

55:24

This is another book of that era,

55:26

although I believe the action. Actually, it's

55:28

said around the very real New York

55:30

City Blackout. Oh gosh, Caleb, you updates

55:32

the Blackout. The takes place on my

55:34

birthday. In New York City they had me

55:36

googling. Likely, I know. this book is awesome and

55:39

a historical blackout. But. Like is is

55:41

for real. Does it will happen

55:43

Then And the Ss? Yes. And

55:45

absolutely so. This is nine hundred

55:47

and forty four pages. Long.

55:49

But really, it's New York City of that

55:52

era. Is. Very much a

55:54

character in this book that

55:56

revolves around a punk rock

55:58

band, a wealthy. And different.

56:00

like super wealthy and dysfunctional York City

56:03

family unit. bunch of different family members.

56:05

There's a pyrotechnics expert and his daughter.

56:07

and then they are invisible threads that

56:10

become apparent to the reader. Way. Before

56:12

the characters themselves understand that

56:14

all. Connect them together. Oh I

56:16

love when that happens. I. Know it's like

56:18

you get to like looked down from

56:21

above an idea. I see what's happening

56:23

but they are all connected like it

56:25

comes to get into big way around

56:27

this historical blackouts. This be investments. I'm

56:29

trying to think where the. Salts. And

56:32

the Pleiade scale. Slow.

56:34

Careful book real is far as

56:36

that of swatting is concerned ah

56:38

intricately pot it would be oh

56:40

a book review it as gifts

56:42

note this. Does that sound like something you

56:45

might. Investigate. Further, It

56:47

does. And and fact, I believe I

56:49

had added that to my Tbr at

56:51

one point just because of the time

56:54

period, the setting being a New York,

56:56

I really love books that a New

56:58

York period so I'll definitely others to

57:00

my list. Okay, we've

57:02

been places today. Caleb.

57:04

Of the books we talked about today

57:06

and a Worm Martyr by Kappa Akhbar.

57:09

The. Supper of the Lamb by

57:11

Robert, Sarah, Caitlin Although we. Can't

57:13

forget the introductions. I differ Madison and Ruth

57:15

pricing. Like a love

57:17

story by a D, not a mean.

57:20

We. Hit on the Sunday my tell by some

57:22

on St. James Woods you love. And then

57:24

we ended with City On Fire by Garth

57:26

Risk Hallberg of those lox. What do you

57:28

think? He may be taxed? I'm.

57:30

Thinking supper of the lamb, I might

57:33

run down to the local bookstore to

57:35

see if a have today. I'm. Very.

57:38

Excited about that one! I. Hope

57:40

it's the book the you want it to be.

57:42

Well, I've heard good things from new

57:45

from Refresh. Your friends are never ever

57:47

had to enter act like it sounds

57:49

like everything's. Pointing to this book for

57:52

me sign say as all and limit.

57:54

Caleb This is been a pleasure! Thank you so much for

57:56

attacking books with. Me today. Oh thanks for

57:58

having mates and a pleasure. Hey

58:05

readers, I hope you enjoy my discuss

58:07

them with Caleb and I'd love to

58:09

hear what you think He sipri Max

58:11

son Caleb on Instagram at Caleb Johnson

58:13

lives We've got that link and the

58:15

fullest the title without About Today at

58:17

Arsenal Eight at what said I read

58:20

next podcast Doc Make sure you're following

58:22

up I guess so each new episode

58:24

is ready for you whenever you're ready

58:26

to listen. Follow along in adults I

58:28

guess modify Overcast wherever you get your

58:30

package. Worth a lot.

58:32

Connecting with listeners on Instagram find are

58:34

so out. what should I be? That

58:37

and subscribing to our email list means

58:39

you'll receive updates from our team. Set

58:41

your inbox know algorithm weirdness to interfere

58:43

with that? Sign Up! At what should

58:45

I mean it would guess of com/new

58:47

for her. Been. Here for the

58:49

people who make the So happen what should

58:52

I read next is created each week I

58:54

will vogel Hollywood protest he and studio the

58:56

podcast production readers. That's it for this episode.

58:58

Thanks so much for with thing and is

59:01

my memory of Roka said ah how good

59:03

it is to be among people. Who

59:05

are beating Happy reading of him.