"Everyone loses. Even if the Israelis lose, the Palestinians have lost so much, maybe the seed isn't there anymore. And in Israel, the great abundance of goodwill Israel has built up around the world with the holocaust centres and so forth is being dismantled."

As long threatened, Israel has invaded the last refuge of Palestinian citizens along the Gaza Strip, the city of Rafah, leading to more escalating casualties. Meanwhile, the judge in Donald Trump's hush money trial has rejected calls for a mistrial after Stormy Daniels shared sordid details of her encounter with Trump on the witness stand, but other judges have been far more accommodating to the former president. Also discussing House Speaker Mike Johnson, Australia and China relations, and local election results in the UK.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.