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linkedin.com/Spoken. That's linkedin.com/Spoken. Terms and

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conditions apply. This

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is an apostrophe podcast production.

3:29

He was born in the backwoods of Kentucky

3:31

in the early 1800s. His family was

3:35

dirt poor. His mother died

3:37

when he was nine and he

3:40

had a difficult relationship with his father. He

3:43

went to school now and then and it said

3:45

his entire schooling amounted

3:48

to less than one year's attendance.

3:51

As a result, he was mostly

3:53

self-educated and loved to read. Neighbors

3:56

said he would walk for miles just

3:58

to borrow a book. Reading

4:03

became a great pastime for him.

4:07

He wasn't able to find many books,

4:09

but fully absorbed every one he could

4:11

get his hands on. By

4:13

the time he turned 21, he

4:15

stood six foot four. He

4:18

was lanky, but muscular and

4:20

powerful. He was noted

4:22

for the skill and strength with which he

4:24

could wield an axe. He

4:28

was a rough and tumble frontier man. He

4:31

moved to Illinois and became a

4:33

rail splitter, allowing him to earn

4:35

some money clearing land and building

4:37

farm fences. About

4:40

that time, he settled in a town

4:42

called New Salem. There he

4:44

got a job as a storekeeper. On

4:47

the side, this strapping young man

4:49

liked to wrestle, and

4:52

he was good at it. He would

4:54

wrestle in county fairs and look for

4:56

matches wherever the opportunity arose. By

4:59

some accounts, he wrestled for a dozen years

5:01

from his early 20s to

5:03

his early 30s and only lost

5:05

one single match. But

5:08

maybe his most famous match happened

5:10

as the result of a

5:12

bet. His

5:16

boss boasted that his young employee was

5:18

not only the smartest guy in town,

5:20

but also the toughest. That

5:23

comment riled a gang of

5:25

toughs called the Claries Grove

5:27

Boys. His boss

5:29

bet another man that his employee

5:31

could beat the toughest member of

5:33

that gang, a man named Jack

5:35

Armstrong. Armstrong was

5:37

the roughest and most feared member

5:40

of the Claries Grove Boys. So

5:43

a date was set, and on the

5:46

day, the entire town gathered to watch

5:48

the wrestling match. The

5:53

two men stripped to the waist and

5:56

the wrestling began. The two

5:59

were well matched. and the fight

6:01

went on and on and got rougher

6:03

and rougher. Then,

6:06

well into the fight, Armstrong

6:08

used a painful illegal move.

6:11

That infuriated his young opponent, who

6:13

then picked Armstrong up and threw

6:15

him to the ground, knocking

6:18

him out. That

6:22

wrestler, the powerful fighter who

6:24

beat Jack Armstrong that day, was

6:27

Abraham Lincoln. That's

6:30

why Abraham Lincoln is in the

6:32

Wrestling Hall of Fame. Question,

6:37

is that story true or

6:39

is it a lie? That

6:49

story is true. A

6:52

huge mural of that fight hangs on the

6:54

wall inside the Wrestling Hall of Fame. These

6:57

days, it's getting more and more

6:59

difficult to tell the truth from a lie. Over

7:02

the decades, advertisers have often been

7:04

accused of lying. But there

7:07

is another side to that particular coin. In

7:10

focus groups, in surveys, and

7:12

in polls, customers lie

7:14

to marketers. Advertisers

7:17

use that research to make

7:19

important marketing decisions. So

7:21

what happens if the information

7:23

advertisers use to produce products

7:25

and create advertising campaigns is

7:28

false? One

7:45

of the trickiest surveys researchers undertake

7:47

is when they try to determine

7:49

how often people lie. The

7:52

problem, of course, is that people

7:54

lie about how much they lie, even

7:57

on anonymous surveys. A

8:00

recent study on this very subject,

8:02

done by the University of Wisconsin,

8:04

followed 632 people

8:07

around for 91 days. Those

8:10

632 people told 116,366 lies during that period. The

8:20

study concluded that most people lie a

8:22

maximum of twice a day, which

8:24

doesn't seem like much, until you

8:27

realize it adds up to nearly 60 lies

8:29

a month. 90%

8:32

of those are what we call little white

8:34

lies, more like fibs,

8:36

like telling someone a meal was

8:38

delicious when it wasn't. But

8:41

another 11% were categorized

8:43

as big lies. The

8:46

top 1% of the participants were

8:49

prolific liars, telling over 17 lies

8:51

per day. The

8:54

demographic that lies the most? Millennials.

9:01

Everybody fibs now and then. We

9:03

often tell tiny lies to avoid hurting

9:06

people's feelings. But

9:08

this preponderance to lie has

9:10

other ramifications, especially to

9:12

marketers. The advertising

9:15

industry is constantly researching people to

9:17

try and understand their behavior, to

9:20

get a sense of how they make their

9:22

purchasing decisions, to try and figure

9:24

out how a brand makes them feel, or

9:27

whether they like a potential advertising

9:29

campaign the company is about to

9:31

spend millions on. The

9:34

marketing industry relies on

9:36

this feedback. According

9:41

to research, there are many reasons why people

9:43

don't tell the truth. They

9:45

lie on surveys 33% of the time, on social media

9:48

75% of the time, on resumes 70% of the time,

9:55

to their doctors 47% of

9:57

the time, and to their

9:59

therapists 93% of the time. One

10:04

of the most basic reasons for lying

10:06

is the desire to be socially acceptable.

10:09

When people are asked if they donate

10:11

to charities, for example, most would say

10:14

yes, although most do not.

10:17

Answering yes to that question is the

10:19

most socially acceptable answer. Sensitive

10:22

questions about sex, religion, or

10:25

politics rarely elicit truthful answers.

10:28

People will often inflate self-worth

10:30

in surveys, especially in

10:32

anonymous surveys where no one is pressing

10:35

them. So questions

10:37

about how much money you make, how

10:39

often you exercise, or how much you

10:41

weigh usually result in a

10:43

lot of fibbing. Either

10:45

people lie to inflate their salaries for

10:47

vanity reasons, or they lie

10:50

to minimize their revenue for fear of

10:52

tax reasons. Politeness

10:54

often gets in the way. When

10:57

people are asked about a new product

10:59

or a potential advertising campaign, they will

11:02

often give an answer they believe will

11:04

please the interviewer. Then

11:07

there is intentional sabotage. Some

11:10

people will purposely lie and mislead

11:12

for a variety of reasons. Maybe

11:15

they don't like the company. Maybe

11:18

they relish the role of contrarian. Or

11:20

maybe they just want to shock

11:23

the interviewer. Marketers

11:27

rely heavily on focus groups. This

11:31

is where a group of six to

11:33

eight regular people are invited into a

11:35

room, and a moderator asks them questions

11:37

about a product or an ad campaign.

11:40

And the advertising agency observes the

11:42

group behind a one-way mirror. In

11:45

my experience, a mini social

11:47

hierarchy often forms in those

11:49

rooms. An outspoken leader

11:51

will emerge and will often sway others

11:53

in the group to agree with him

11:56

or her. There will

11:58

be a few who will answer honestly. a few

12:01

who won't, and others who

12:03

feel being negative makes them appear

12:05

intelligent. Advertisers

12:07

have to rely on very good

12:09

moderators to pry truthful answers from

12:12

focus groups. It

12:14

often means trying to read

12:16

between the lines. I

12:26

read a fascinating book recently titled

12:29

Everybody Lies by Seth

12:31

Stevens Davidowitz. The

12:33

core theme of the book is that

12:35

people rarely tell the truth, even in

12:38

anonymous surveys. For example, the

12:40

book quotes heterosexual women in the

12:42

US saying they have sex 55

12:44

times a year, using

12:46

a condom 16% of the time. That

12:51

adds up to 1.1 billion condoms

12:53

a year. Heterosexual

12:56

men say they use 1.6 billion

12:58

condoms a year. Now,

13:00

by definition, those two numbers should

13:02

be the same. But according

13:05

to Nielsen, fewer than 600 million

13:07

condoms are sold every year. Therefore,

13:11

everyone is lying. The only

13:14

difference is by how much. But

13:17

Davidowitz says there is one place

13:19

everybody tells the truth, one

13:22

place where lies don't occur. And

13:25

that place is Google. The

13:28

author maintains that the Google

13:30

search box is a kind

13:32

of confessional. When

13:38

the author looked at Google searches for

13:40

jokes, for example, he found

13:42

that those searches are lowest on Mondays

13:44

when people report they are most unhappy.

13:48

Joke searches are lowest on cloudy

13:50

and rainy days, and they plummet

13:52

after a major tragedy. The

13:55

takeaway? People are more

13:57

likely to seek jokes when things are going well in

13:59

life. not when they're feeling

14:01

sad. People lie

14:04

to friends, lovers, doctors, and even

14:06

to themselves, but on

14:08

Google, they reveal their most intimate,

14:10

honest feelings. They share

14:13

their most embarrassing information in that Google

14:15

search box about their

14:17

sexless marriages, their mental

14:19

health issues, their insecurities,

14:22

and their animosity toward other

14:24

races. People who

14:26

regret having children admit this to no

14:29

one, except Google.

14:32

The number one Google search for the

14:34

question, is my husband dot dot dot,

14:37

the word gay is 10 times

14:39

more likely than, is my

14:41

husband cheating, and eight

14:44

times more likely than, is my

14:46

husband alcoholic, or 10 times

14:48

more likely than, is my husband

14:50

depressed. Searches

14:53

questioning a husband's sexuality are more

14:55

prevalent in the least tolerant regions

14:57

of the country, which

15:00

suggests many men are still

15:02

in the closet. Men

15:12

Google about their penises more than any

15:14

other body part. They conduct more

15:16

searches on how to make it bigger than

15:19

how to tune a guitar, make an omelet,

15:21

or change a tire. Women

15:24

search about vaginal odor. Here's

15:27

the interesting thing about that. Men

15:30

make roughly the same number of

15:32

searches about a partner's vagina as

15:34

women do about their partner's genital

15:36

size, which is to say, almost

15:39

never. There's clearly

15:41

a lot of worrying for no

15:43

reason. And when

15:46

it comes to body image, the

15:48

subject definitely skews female, but

15:50

it's not as lopsided as you may think.

15:53

According to an analysis of Google

15:56

AdWords, interest in beauty and

15:58

fitness is 42% male. My

16:01

boss is 33% male and

16:04

cosmetic surgery searches are 39% male.

16:09

Parents are twice as likely to search,

16:11

is my two-year-old son gifted, than to

16:13

ask the same question about their daughters.

16:15

Yet there are far more girls in

16:18

gifted classes than boys. Parents

16:21

more often search, is my daughter

16:23

overweight, than they would about their

16:25

sons. Yet more boys

16:27

are overweight than girls. Netflix

16:36

once offered an option to let people list

16:38

the movies they most wanted to see and

16:41

would remind them when those movies became

16:43

available. But Netflix discovered

16:45

that when it reminded people about those

16:48

movies, they didn't watch them. It

16:51

turns out people listed highbrow movies they

16:53

had no intention of watching. The

16:56

list just made them look good. So

16:59

Netflix instead made recommendations based on

17:01

what people were actually watching. Activity

17:05

on Netflix jumped. Because

17:09

algorithms know the real you.

17:15

Data also reveals that the words

17:18

you use on a loan application

17:20

determine whether you'll default or not.

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19:32

Polling data

19:34

can be very challenging. In

19:37

the book, A Field Guide to

19:39

Lies, by Daniel J. Levitin, the

19:41

author shows an election graphic from

19:43

Fox News. It was

19:45

a pie chart that showed the GOP candidates

19:47

and the support they were getting for the

19:49

upcoming 2012 election. That

19:52

said, 70% back Sarah Palin, 60% back Mitt

19:54

Romney, and 63% back... Mike

20:00

Huckabee. Can't

20:02

be, as author Leviton points out.

20:05

The first rule of pie charts is

20:07

that the percentages have to add up

20:09

to 100. Researchers

20:11

also found when it comes to

20:13

voting search boxes reveal a lot.

20:16

Seemingly neutral searches contained

20:19

information voting polls missed.

20:24

When people searched Clinton-Trump

20:27

debate or Obama-Rome election,

20:30

the order of the candidates names

20:32

was significant. The

20:34

candidate's name that appeared first in

20:37

the most searches was predictive of

20:39

which way a particular state would

20:41

go. The results

20:43

were accurate but it defied the

20:46

pollsters. Clearly the

20:48

voters were lying in exit polls,

20:50

possibly too uncomfortable to reveal how

20:52

they really voted. That

20:55

may also explain why pollsters were so

20:57

wrong about the Trump election in 2016.

20:59

Looking back, Seth

21:03

Stevens-Dvidewitz found there were more

21:05

searches for Trump-Clinton than Clinton-Trump

21:07

in key Midwest states that

21:10

Clinton was expected to win.

21:13

Trump owed his election to the

21:15

fact that he sharply outperformed his

21:17

polls there. During

21:23

his first election, Barack Obama's

21:25

team did extensive testing to

21:28

determine marketing strategies. For

21:31

example, they tested Obama's home

21:33

page by posting three different

21:35

designs in three different cities.

21:38

One had a photo of a

21:40

serious Obama face and the words

21:42

sign up. Another

21:44

showed his family with the words

21:46

learn more. And a

21:49

third showed a smiling Obama with the

21:51

words join us now. Which

21:54

one do you think generated the most

21:56

response? Answer? designed

22:00

one by a landslide. It

22:02

was estimated it attracted 40% more people to

22:04

sign up, netting

22:07

the campaign about $60 million

22:09

in additional funding. Would

22:12

a survey have picked a family design?

22:15

Probably not. All

22:25

people who borrow money from banks and

22:27

other financial institutions promise to pay

22:30

it back. Yet, 13%

22:32

default. Here's

22:35

a list of eight words and phrases

22:37

researchers found that are commonly used when

22:40

applying for a loan. God,

22:43

promise, debt free, minimum

22:46

payment, lower interest rate,

22:49

will pay, thank you, after

22:52

tax. Of

22:54

those phrases, here are the ones used by

22:56

people most likely to pay the debt back.

23:00

Lower interest rate, debt free,

23:02

after tax, minimum payment.

23:06

And here are the words most used

23:08

by people most likely to default. God,

23:12

promise, will pay, thank

23:15

you. Phrases like

23:17

lower interest rate and after

23:19

tax indicated a certain

23:22

level of financial sophistication. Phrases

23:25

used on a loan application like

23:27

promise and will pay and thank you

23:30

are the least likely to pay back. People

23:33

mentioning God were 2.2 times

23:36

more likely to default. The

23:39

word God was among the highest

23:41

indicators of a likely default. The

23:51

Centers for Disease Control and Prevention

23:54

releases flu data one week after

23:56

it has received it. Even

23:58

though doctors and hospitals would. benefit from

24:00

having it much sooner. But

24:03

Google searches for flu symptoms show up

24:05

right away, which could

24:07

give hospitals much earlier indications of

24:09

how fast the flu is spreading.

24:13

Walmart learned something very interesting

24:15

using online searches. When

24:18

a hurricane is approaching, Walmart noticed

24:20

that people search and stock up

24:22

on strawberry Pop-Tarts.

24:26

Who knew? It

24:28

might be because Pop-Tarts don't need

24:30

refrigeration. Why strawberry? Nobody

24:33

knows. But when

24:35

a hurricane is coming, Walmart

24:37

sends truckloads of strawberry Pop-Tarts

24:40

to those locations. So

24:50

if people lie in surveys, they fib

24:52

in focus groups, they lie about what

24:55

they really like and dislike, and

24:57

they're afraid to reveal their true feelings

24:59

in polls. What is a

25:01

marketer to do? Well,

25:04

some resort to hypnotism.

25:07

But not the type of hypnotism you're probably

25:09

thinking about right now. Marketers

25:12

don't hypnotize people to buy their

25:14

products. They hypnotize them to

25:16

understand how they truly feel about their

25:18

products. In most

25:21

focus groups, the answers tend to

25:23

be rational. But under

25:25

hypnosis, the answers are almost

25:27

always emotional. Research

25:30

firms that specialize in hypnosis

25:32

can do one-on-one sessions with

25:34

customers or can actually

25:36

hypnotize a group of six to eight

25:39

people together. The

25:41

goal is to access the subconscious,

25:43

remove the filter from people's thoughts,

25:46

and free them from taboos. Once

25:52

hypnotized, the moderator will begin asking

25:54

questions to uncover things hidden in

25:56

memory banks or to tease out

25:58

information that are... person wouldn't reveal

26:01

in a wake state for

26:03

fear of looking uneducated or for

26:05

fear of peer pressure from others

26:07

in the focus group. In

26:10

one hypnotized group, for example, people

26:12

were asked to remember the very

26:14

first time they ever watched television.

26:18

Respondents not only remembered what show it

26:20

was, howdy-doody, but what clothes

26:22

they were wearing, what they smelled

26:24

in the room, and precisely which

26:26

episode they were watching. Suffice

26:29

it to say, most people could

26:31

not recall that much detail from

26:34

their childhood under normal circumstances. So

26:37

in that deep relaxed state, a

26:40

moderator might ask when you first

26:42

experienced the brand, what

26:44

impression it made on you, how

26:46

it made you feel, or what

26:48

features you look at in a car

26:51

dealership, or what was

26:53

your most powerful experience with the

26:55

brand. Because

26:59

people lie or exaggerate in focus

27:01

groups, research firms believe

27:04

hypnosis can reveal the truth.

27:07

For example, a Scotch brand

27:09

looking to attract younger customers asked

27:11

them why they drink Scotch. They

27:14

answered because they liked the taste. But

27:17

under hypnosis, they said drinking Scotch

27:19

made them feel cool. So

27:22

the Scotch brand created an advertising

27:24

campaign around looking cool. Starbucks

27:28

used hypnotism to figure out why people

27:30

in their 20s were so

27:33

negative towards the brand, calling it

27:35

corporate coffee and destroying mom and

27:37

pop shops. But

27:39

under hypnosis, respondents were asked to

27:41

imagine walking into a Starbucks and

27:44

to describe the other customers in

27:46

there. They described

27:48

guys in suits in their 40s. The

27:52

moderator asked if there was anybody that looked

27:54

like them in the Starbucks. Respondents

27:57

said no, only the guy behind the

27:59

box. the counter. That

28:02

was a big insight for Starbucks. It

28:04

clearly had to change the tone in

28:06

its advertising and stop playing

28:08

Kenny G music in the shops. Hypnosis

28:12

revealed the problem which was,

28:15

I don't belong here. When

28:18

Procter & Gamble did hypnosis

28:20

focus groups, they asked the

28:22

respondents to describe Tide without

28:25

using the words laundry detergent.

28:28

The respondents said, mom.

28:31

That told Tide nostalgia was

28:33

important. Shell discovered

28:35

through hypnosis that people are loyal

28:37

to the gasoline brand they saw

28:40

their parents use when they were

28:42

children. Research

28:51

firms maintain nobody is harmed

28:53

through hypnosis. Nobody can be

28:55

made to do or say something that goes

28:57

against their true wishes. And

28:59

nobody is transformed into a clucking chicken.

29:02

But not all advertisers like the

29:05

idea. Plumbing the

29:07

minds of customers in a hypnotized

29:09

state just doesn't sit well with

29:11

many brands. They say

29:13

it feels unethical and intrusive. In

29:16

spite of the fact, respondents agree

29:18

to be hypnotized. So

29:21

those brands choose not to use

29:23

it, even if it

29:25

might uncover some treasures and

29:28

some truth. Famous

29:38

Adman David Ogilvy once said,

29:41

customers don't know what they feel, don't say

29:43

what they know, and don't

29:45

do what they say. It's

29:47

an interesting conundrum. Marketers

29:50

rely on research to predict

29:52

behavior, but so much of

29:55

that customer feedback may be untrue.

29:57

It could be

30:00

reasons why so much advertising

30:02

doesn't resonate with people. That's

30:05

why the Google search window is so

30:08

powerful. People type in

30:10

their most honest, personal feelings in the

30:12

quiet of their own homes. They're

30:14

not trying to impress anyone. They're

30:17

revealing their innermost truth without fear

30:19

or filter or shame. Google

30:23

then sells that information to

30:25

political entities, governments, and advertisers

30:28

because data collection is

30:30

Google's greatest product. And

30:33

if we're to believe Seth

30:36

Stevens Davidowitz's extensive research, that

30:39

search box is a truth serum

30:42

because it reveals the

30:44

intimate subjects we're all wrestling

30:46

with when

30:49

you're under the influence. I'm

30:52

Terry O'Reilly. This

30:59

episode was recorded in the TerreStream AirStream

31:02

mobile recording studio. Producer Debbie

31:04

O'Reilly. Sound engineer Jeff Devine.

31:07

Under the influence theme by

31:09

Ari Posner and Ian LeFever.

31:11

Tunes provided by APM Music.

31:14

Follow me on social at

31:16

terreoinfluence. This podcast is

31:18

powered by Acast. And if

31:20

you'd like to read next week's

31:23

Fun Fact, just go to apostrophepodcast.ca

31:25

and follow the prompts. See

31:28

you next week. Hi, this

31:30

is Jesse O'Donaghy from St. John's,

31:32

Newfoundland and Labrador. Fun Fact! Believe it

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or not, the sales of Pop Tarts

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have been on the rise for 32

31:38

straight years. Hmm.

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