0:01

The true

0:21

Jordy podcast that is guest

0:23

is the UFC heavyweight champion

0:26

of the world, Tom Aspinall. Thanks for coming on me.

0:28

Thank you. I mean, the interim people

0:30

get very upset about that, you know, say that. So yeah,

0:32

I'm here, mate. Finally, we know

0:35

that we've been texting McAfee for quite a while.

0:37

So it's the logistics haven't worked out. But we're

0:39

finally here now. I appreciate it. I've been texting

0:41

them, got some questions. What

0:43

would it take for a UFC fighter to finger you? Not

0:46

much, apparently. I

0:49

love that, you know, actually, because it was the most human

0:51

moment where you're trying to bend that back and forth with

0:53

someone who's doing this all the time. It

0:56

gets taken out of context and immediately everyone's

0:58

like, oh, he's a misogynist or whatever. The

1:01

Daily Mail are right. What was that like?

1:03

Just to go? Because you're not long on

1:05

the belt. Well, you've got to watch what

1:07

you say, mate, when you're when you're going

1:09

up in levels and you know,

1:11

I'm a normal guy. I've not had

1:13

no media training, nothing like that. So

1:16

it's different, like with a bit of context behind it,

1:18

meaning me and Nina know each other. Of course. We

1:21

were talking off camera about she

1:23

gets like loads of mad questions on Instagram and stuff

1:25

and people are asking has she

1:27

been having sex with Dana White? People have been

1:29

asking has she been fingered by UFC fighters and

1:32

and all that. And then she asked me something

1:34

about it. She made she asked me loads of

1:36

weird questions. That's her. No one cares about. Yeah,

1:38

that's her thing. She can ask me 20 minutes,

1:40

literally 20 minutes of weird questions. I

1:43

throw one back at her just for a laugh, mate, just because I

1:45

know Nina and I knew she won't take it in a bad way.

1:48

But you got to watch what you're saying, I guess. Sometimes

1:50

you fucking swing and miss, don't you? That was such a

1:52

lesson for you. It was. It was. I

1:55

mean, it a lot since as well, like even

1:57

with the situation, like I'm sure we're going to go into

1:59

this throughout the podcast. But I'm in a bit

2:01

of a sticky situation now with the politics of the

2:03

UFC kind of thing whom are gonna fight next and

2:06

Should I defend an interim? Should I fight steep

2:08

a fight John Jones? What should I wait it

2:10

out? I mean, it doesn't matter what you say

2:13

people are always gonna fucking jump on you You know more

2:15

than me you're famous than I am people are gonna jump

2:17

on you and be like You said

2:19

their own thing. Yeah, like found us at fight steep a

2:21

notion fight steep a and it's the same with anything mate,

2:23

you just gotta You

2:26

can never like idiot proof everything that

2:28

you say so I'm learning mate. I'm

2:30

learning on the job I think that

2:32

part of the problem is when you

2:34

come into it looking like a Sort

2:37

of a squiggly clean guy you had a very wholesome

2:39

image. Yeah, and you're very down to earth that

2:43

You're just there to make any little mistake

2:45

wrong Whereas someone like the Shawn Strickland is

2:47

almost uncancellable because they know he doesn't give

2:50

a fuck But they think you

2:52

know you do. Yeah, definitely mate. Well, like when

2:54

you see like I had to explain

2:58

to like some fat some female family members

3:00

who are not into MMA and they just

3:02

see a headline of like MMA

3:05

champion sexually abuses female Fucking

3:10

watch the full industry when you see a 10-second clip

3:12

mate and it goes like and I

3:14

asked her the question Are you been figured out? Yeah,

3:16

it looks pretty bad granted like I hold my hands

3:18

up that doesn't look good But

3:20

if you watch the full interview mate when she does

3:22

she asked me all kinds of stuff And I think

3:24

it's hilarious like her stuff I absolutely love Who

3:27

Nina is what she's all about what she brings to like the

3:29

UFC because a lot of the time mate as a fighter myself

3:32

Especially fight week especially big fight weeks you and

3:34

you ask the same questions mate boring So I

3:36

appreciate Nina for what she is and I appreciate

3:38

her channel, but like when I asked one back

3:41

It's like fucking all this guy's

3:43

some kind of fucking sex addict So I don't

3:45

know some kind of weirdo, but it wasn't like

3:47

that mate wasn't like that at all She put

3:49

she played it perfectly as well. She very much

3:51

like a Ricky Gervais character Yeah,

3:53

she's great. You watch you with she's great. She's great

3:55

Nina's great. I've got my word save hour So

3:58

going back early on to you UFC

4:00

career, it was very apparent very

4:02

quickly, you're a different beast to

4:04

a lot of these other heavyweight.

4:07

This combination of like, if you look in

4:09

other UFC fighters, you'd be like, he's kind

4:12

of got the power of Francis, but the

4:14

speed of gone. It's a freaky combination. At

4:16

what point did you sort of start the

4:18

twig in your life even, different

4:21

to these other cats? Errr,

4:25

it's a great

4:28

question. I'm still

4:30

not sure. And I think

4:32

that unshallness gives me an edge.

4:35

If that makes any kind of sense. I

4:37

think that I'm like, even now,

4:39

I've just won, in my

4:41

opinion, I've just beat the scariest guy in the UFC in

4:43

a minute. But

4:46

I'm still nowhere near satisfied. And I'm

4:48

still aware that my sport is fucking

4:50

absolutely crazy, especially at the heavyweight division.

4:52

Like, in my opinion, MMA is

4:54

like the most unpredictable sport in the world. And

4:56

at heavyweight, it's even more

4:58

so. And I just don't

5:01

rest on me being better than everybody. Like I know

5:03

that the skill goes a long way. I don't know.

5:05

I think, I think I know I'm jumping

5:07

around a little bit here, but I

5:09

think that my dad installed young to me, like, because

5:11

I've been training with my dad since I was six

5:13

years old, that this

5:16

is like a sport. Do you know what I mean?

5:18

You have to treat it for

5:20

what it is. And what it is to me is just a

5:22

sport. I don't look at it like a fighter. I've got beef

5:24

with anyone or anything like that. Like I literally try

5:27

and hit them and don't let them hit me. And

5:29

that's kind of the route. Like it's almost like a

5:31

bit of, it's almost like a game of tag for

5:33

me. That's how I treat it. I don't treat it

5:35

anything more. I try not to look at it too

5:37

deeply and try and get in like a beast mode

5:39

or a warrior spirit. Like it should. I'm just doing

5:41

a sport and that's the way I treat it. You're

5:43

a thinking man's fight on me. I

5:46

don't know about that, but I just try and see if

5:48

what it is. Like even to my low

5:50

level of sparring that I've done, I felt

5:52

the same way. Like I never felt like I wanted to take

5:55

this guy's head off. And I think that that's the cleverest way

5:57

to play it because In a

5:59

heavyweight competition. Then you know the more

6:01

you think and with aggression and and

6:03

and I'm going to believe. That

6:06

the your saw a playing into the at the

6:08

gambling site of him and especially in the happy

6:10

with for you just really shouldn't be goblin swell

6:12

think is a big guy. And.

6:15

So. Big guys like our size because the gym

6:17

the twenty years old or whatever and they don't

6:19

they're not use again hit a when the do

6:22

get hayes like fuckin our just been health This

6:24

guy on twice as big as anita get a

6:26

bite or and they don't also deal with it

6:28

was may have been a martial arts as I

6:30

was six years old aside as a smallish like

6:32

a stuttering adults classes. While he was a lot

6:34

of those classes when I first I'd ever made

6:36

the wasn't his glasses it didn't exist at the

6:39

time he wasn't near. The sport wasn't develops in

6:41

north south like say kids on them outright lie

6:43

when I was ten years old. I wish I

6:45

knew twenty. Adults who are in the fall is

6:47

you know the main so I'm have been used

6:49

to light be in the nail so to speak

6:52

like I took a lot shelves and and been

6:54

a lot about sports from be and really I'm

6:56

sorry to see it seat lot our big guys

6:58

come the gym and they don't need as much

7:00

seven acres as other guys because it the because

7:02

the footed must apply the just wish you and

7:05

because I started off really on local a massive

7:07

advantage on people as the musa taken the shelves

7:09

want to do a dozen are not forced to

7:11

buy it did automated am on a minimum plus

7:13

I'm not forced to buy under slot right. On

7:16

just wait my turn, I'll get my

7:18

get myself together and and away my

7:20

moments. That's probably why he moves so

7:22

well because with big I do this

7:24

movement is the hardest thing right? A

7:26

You know this footwork and stuff like

7:28

by comes a lot harder to. The

7:30

big idea is which is why people

7:32

like yourself. Theory a matter of it,

7:34

they the anomalies but because you been

7:36

getting your body used to doing the

7:38

same thing as you grown into this.

7:40

A dude you know can carry those

7:42

techniques from being a smaller guy. Oakland.

7:45

You don't have the like weightlifting and speed training

7:47

and stuff like that. Are you talking all the

7:49

on a muzzle are you saw of Not really

7:51

bothered about that. The

7:54

To. a degree like a know where i'm up to a

7:56

degree but i'm not like a lifted this last week i

7:58

got a list this this what you do know domain like

8:01

yeah but just

8:03

to touch on that a little bit I've had some really good

8:05

coaches as well like over the years I've trained a lot of

8:07

different places and the

8:10

speed thing has always been encouraged by

8:12

everybody I've always been fast and I

8:14

think I'm not I'm genetically fast anyway

8:16

I don't think you can definitely improve

8:18

that to a degree but

8:21

I think I'm genetically fast anyway

8:23

but that's something I

8:25

always wanted to keep up with the smaller guys

8:27

I never wanted to like let my size hold me back because

8:29

you see a lot of big guys who

8:31

just they're just lazy bastards mate and I don't want to

8:34

be that guy but yeah I always try to do it

8:36

even like lifting weights I'm not lifting weights like bodybuilder I'm

8:38

not doing all time under tension and stuff like I'm lifting

8:40

the weights as fast as I can for short amount of

8:42

reps and putting it down yeah yeah

8:44

it's fucking shows doesn't it in

8:47

terms of for me the fight that made

8:49

me go all right this guy is this

8:51

is something serious we've got a real pallet

8:54

in the UK here was the Arlosky fight

8:56

I think you showed so many different aspects

8:58

of your game and that fight and

9:01

not only were you you know and Arlosky legend

9:03

really I mean what a guy they're still that

9:05

long to have Korea and you put it on

9:07

him didn't quite get him out there immediately having

9:10

kabya composure yeah and then the takedown

9:12

and the submission I was like okay

9:14

you've just you played with him and

9:17

you were like you were enjoying it

9:19

yeah I mean Arlosky for me he

9:22

is literally one of the reasons I got into MMA the

9:24

UFC came to Manchester which is where I'm from Andrea Arlosky

9:26

fought on the card and we went to the weigh-ins at

9:28

Manchester I remember it like clear his day I must have

9:30

been like 12 13 years old at the time I

9:33

lost you got on the scales mate with these like preem

9:36

joggers on he had the fangs you know he

9:38

had like a long hair and he put his arm

9:41

up when he was rich and the crowd just went

9:43

like he's big dude and the crowd just went wild

9:45

so when I fought Arlosky even though

9:47

like now he's definitely on the back end of his career he's

9:49

on the back end of his career when I fought him still

9:51

but he was on a six fight win streak when I fought

9:53

him so he was like he was coming back a little bit

9:55

but mate in that fight he punched me in the eyeball

9:59

and it wasn't a poor or anything but I couldn't see him for

10:01

most of the fight. So I

10:03

hurt him early on. When he had him on the

10:05

fence, I just unloaded because I

10:07

couldn't really see. I couldn't really see where I was punching

10:09

so that wasn't my best performance but definitely

10:12

to get people like that on your resume is like, I

10:14

don't know, I believe in like the rub. That's what we

10:16

call it in every, it's like the rub. And like when

10:18

you fought good guys like that, you get a bit of

10:20

a, I don't know if it's, it's

10:22

obviously like a mental thing but I felt like

10:25

I belonged after I fought him. Yeah, confidence

10:27

for you has been a really interesting thing

10:29

to watch that grow because like I've seen

10:32

a lot more of it recently. But

10:35

the Volkov one must have been one that you got a

10:37

lot of confidence from because the way

10:40

you implemented takedowns with stand

10:42

up was one of the

10:44

best we've ever seen from heavyweight. It

10:46

was like there was one point

10:48

where he commits you rolling down,

10:50

that was beautifully made. Thank you.

10:54

I think my confidence has gone up a few

10:56

notches since then. I think that was

10:59

definitely a good performance but since I injured my knee, that

11:02

was like, it sounds fucking weird. Every time I see

11:04

it, I could see people looking at me like, what

11:06

are you talking about? But honestly, that was the best

11:09

thing probably that ever happened to me is me injuring

11:11

my knee. Did it enable you to see the bigger

11:13

picture? Massively, massively mate. So like I got signed to

11:15

the USA in the pandemic. Sorry,

11:17

before the pandemic but then the pandemic hit. So it was

11:19

like, I was just taking mate any

11:21

fight that I could anywhere and obviously when you

11:24

first start with a promotion, you don't get any

11:26

say in anything basically you don't say where you

11:28

fight, who you fight even now I don't

11:30

really say who I fight but I

11:32

was just made just jumping on any fight that

11:34

I could against anyone. And I

11:36

didn't really get a time to like think do

11:38

you know what I mean? I was just stuck

11:40

at home stuck in the gym, going for fights

11:42

winning, coming back and then onto the next one

11:44

basically. And I

11:47

knew there was some stuff that wasn't right in my

11:50

life which I won't go into too much. Is

11:53

there anything you can't show? Just

11:55

I was just a bit easily distracted, you know,

11:58

like I was just trying to I

12:00

always had in my mind that like

12:03

I definitely suffered with my confidence because this

12:06

is why I've had so long to

12:08

think about it like I had a year off so I got a

12:10

lot of time to think about it is I always wanted like a

12:12

built-in excuse of not

12:14

taking my diet seriously, not taking my

12:17

recovery seriously, not getting the best

12:19

training that I could get, all

12:21

kinds of different like not doing I didn't do any

12:23

strength and condition at all, all this like different stuff

12:25

it was always like ah

12:28

well if I lost I can just blame it on x y and

12:30

z do you know what I mean and that's not the

12:32

way that a champion holds himself do you know what I

12:34

mean if and then I thought you know when I was

12:36

injured I thought like right I've got two choices here I

12:39

can either fuck this thing off and go and just be

12:41

a normal regular person living a normal regular job or

12:43

I've got to go like all in and I've got

12:45

to leave behind

12:48

me going to the pub, me

12:51

going to someone's granddad's 70th because they

12:53

asked me I want to be

12:55

polite like I do I think I just got better

12:57

at like saying no and putting myself first and that's

13:00

something that I really struggle with like I've always

13:02

been like a quiet yeah a people please are

13:04

like a quiet kid growing up and I think

13:06

I just wanted everyone to like

13:09

like like me yeah exactly and I'd be scared

13:12

to be like actually no I'm not doing that

13:14

because I've got to fucking put myself first here

13:16

and when I got the injury mate I decided

13:19

they said I'm gonna go both feet I'm

13:21

gonna go balls to the wall with this thing and if it

13:23

doesn't work out at least I can look back mate in 20

13:25

years and go this fucking didn't work out but I tried my

13:27

best so I'm proud of myself and

13:29

since then mate it's been working out pretty good so I'm

13:31

really happy and it is a difficult thing to do for

13:33

someone like me like I said I was a shy kid

13:36

I spent a lot of

13:38

the time in the gym I didn't have too many

13:40

friends or anything like that I mean I've got friends

13:42

obviously but I wasn't like the popular kid at school

13:44

or anything and I just wanted to be liked by

13:46

everybody to be honest and that's the way it was

13:48

that started getting a bit of success and I felt

13:51

like everyone started liking me more and I was like I

13:53

need to go this place with this person need to do

13:55

this with this person this person telling me I should do

13:57

this I'll listen to him but when I got injured I

13:59

was like No, actually fuck that I know exactly

14:01

what I need I need to execute that and

14:03

since I did it It's been so powerful mate.

14:06

I feel amazing You know I don't know if

14:08

you know how lucky you are in a way

14:10

because as someone who didn't sort of get that

14:12

message earlier I'm in my own success like

14:15

I was being generous to me is a great

14:17

quality to have yeah But

14:19

you can be generous to a fault right and that's

14:21

what I was I was an idiot about it I

14:23

literally just was helping people who didn't deserve it Just

14:25

like allowing anyone who wanted to be on the gravy

14:27

train come on. I'll help you out me, too And

14:31

you think you're doing the right thing But like there

14:33

is a line and to realize that

14:35

and go actually no I'm fucking myself here on the long run

14:38

And then you've got this thing about sabotage in

14:40

yourself so that you've got an excuse John

14:42

Jones used to do that ironically before every fight of

14:44

a blowout. It's a confidence issue mate It's a cut and

14:47

that's a it's something before my injury before I'd hear

14:49

off I never had time to think about this kind of

14:51

stuff, and it was always like I was going well so

14:53

far So I don't want to change anything. Do you know

14:55

what I mean? It was a bits of superstitious like

14:57

that I was like right this is going really good It's

15:00

about time to change something now. I can't be changing this

15:02

this and this because well mate there was so many stuff

15:04

wrong Like

15:07

inside the gym outside the gym and and

15:10

stuff like that like I needed to just Hey,

15:12

do you know what change me is when you lay on the floor

15:15

mate holding your leg in front of 22,000 a wrong fans Who

15:18

start leaving because you're least? That's

15:21

a fucking ego death on the well

15:24

like that that changed me for the better like it was

15:26

absolutely awful at the time like It's one of the worst

15:28

things that happened in my life. It was terrible But

15:31

ultimately yeah, I came back so much

15:33

stronger And now like my career

15:36

so good, but not only that is my life so

15:38

good as well like saying no to people and sometimes

15:40

people I know you want to come down this it

15:42

no I'm not doing it. Do you want to come

15:44

for this session? No, I'm

15:46

just how do you just do

15:48

your thing and I'll just do my thing and

15:50

I watch some something online I'm not trying to

15:53

be like it's no motivational speaker nothing like that,

15:55

but it was like sort of something and It's

15:58

just like let them And it was

16:00

anything, I just let them do that. Let

16:03

them say this, let them say that. It

16:05

doesn't matter, like I'm doing my thing and

16:08

I'm gonna be the fucking best in the world. And

16:11

if I'm not the best in the world, at least I fucking tried my

16:13

best to be the best in the world. So that

16:15

was the injury and the whole recovery process

16:17

was super powerful for me. Time's the greatest

16:20

storyteller mate and I'm sure that those decisions

16:22

will prove that. And one of the things

16:24

that, cause I watch almost all your interviews,

16:27

proper farm boy and I've been watching the

16:29

Bisping stuff and there was a moment on that

16:31

channel where you were in a chat with Bisping,

16:33

you were talking like, I am gonna apply myself

16:36

100% and I'm not gonna leave

16:38

no stone unturned and I am gonna be champion.

16:40

And you'd never, it'd all been very slow and

16:42

I wanna take my time and then all of a

16:44

sudden it was a 180, switch

16:47

flick. And then you also mentioned that you

16:49

changed your training so that now it was

16:52

all heavyweights inspired by the

16:54

Fury gym. And you definitely

16:56

got an advantage from that, right? And

17:00

also I go to Holland as well as training

17:02

with a guy called Rico Verhoeven, are you familiar

17:04

with him? He's like literally statistically the best kickboxer

17:06

in the world. He's been the glory

17:08

heavyweight champion for 10 years. He's unbelievable. And

17:11

him and their team and

17:14

Peter Fury and their team and like

17:16

I trained with Peter Fury for a long time that it's all

17:19

based around the fighter and that's what

17:21

I kinda wanted is I wanted that.

17:23

And as a big guy mate,

17:25

you need big guys. Simple as that, like there's

17:27

no hiding from that. That's why I was in

17:30

a position to take the Pavlovich fight because I

17:32

didn't have a fight booked and I

17:34

wasn't fit like I would be for a fight.

17:36

But I knew where I was at. Whereas before

17:38

I wasn't training with heavyweights regular and I

17:40

just, yeah mate, sit like my training. What's

17:42

the difference when you compare the two? In

17:46

what sense? As in beforehand you were

17:48

training with middleweights, like heavyweight, then just

17:50

heavyweights. How does that change you?

17:52

Oh mate, heavyweight MMA's almost got its own rules

17:54

in my opinion. Like it's so

17:56

much more exhausting training with big guys as

17:58

opposed to. Um, like

18:01

small it like, mate, if you're trying to fucking

18:04

grapple with a guy who's 110 kilo, 120

18:07

kilo, excuse me, it's

18:09

massively different than grappling with a

18:11

guy 80 kilo. It's just,

18:14

you have to be a heavyweight to realize, I think,

18:16

I think, um, the smaller guys think, oh, it's not

18:18

a big issue, but it may, it is, it is

18:21

simple as that. Like I'm a heavyweight. I know exactly

18:23

what it feels like to have a fucking guy my

18:26

size or bigger on top of the,

18:28

and a, and a middleweight or a wealth weight or a

18:30

lightweight on top of it is massively different. Then

18:32

you got the call for Pavlovitch, who

18:34

is a scary motherfucker. Like, and, and,

18:37

and, you know, you must've been like,

18:39

when you got the call, was there a moment where you're like, fuck me? Oh,

18:41

but you just completely. Yes. Um,

18:44

I was just completely. Yes. You

18:46

know, I just think that there's not many chances like

18:48

this come around. And

18:51

I think, well, I knew 100% factor

18:54

that the matter is like, if I'm

18:56

watching it on TV at home in the UK, I'm

18:58

definitely not going to win that. I can guarantee that

19:00

I can put all the money I've got on that.

19:03

So I just thought, why not? You

19:06

know, I want in the shape that I'm

19:08

normally in. Um, as

19:10

you said, Pavlovitch is a fucking scary guy,

19:12

man. And MMA

19:14

fans are so fickle. Like I

19:17

see people now being like Pavlovitch is not that

19:19

good. Hey, come

19:21

on now. The amount of

19:23

messages that I got of people being like,

19:26

RIP Tom, Tom's going to get,

19:28

he's going to get steamrolled in

19:30

30 seconds. Cause mate, Steve Pavlovitch just didn't

19:33

want to fight Pavlovitch. Sir Organ didn't

19:35

want to fight, like all these guys are turning him down.

19:37

And I took it on two weeks, less than two weeks

19:39

notice. So I think

19:41

that just, again, that's a testament to my training though.

19:43

I think like I knew exactly where I was at

19:46

because I'm training with the big boys day in, day

19:48

out. So I know that I had

19:50

a smile last week with so and so he's, he's pretty

19:52

good. And I managed to do the rounds with him

19:54

and I managed to get him off in this position. Oh,

19:56

my cardio was all right in there. My conditioning is good.

19:58

I'm pretty strong. in this spot. So

20:01

that's why it's so important I think to train with heavyweights

20:03

because you know where you're at at all times. And

20:06

like having that knowledge of the power and

20:08

devastation that a guy like that can cause,

20:11

you said afterwards I was probably more scared

20:13

for this one. How do you walk into

20:15

the cage? How are you dealing with the

20:17

nerves for someone like that? Oh, it's scary.

20:19

I would like it myself. It's so scary.

20:21

It is so scary. I'm not even going

20:24

to like beat around the bush. It's so

20:26

scary. As

20:28

soon as it gets going though, I'm all right.

20:30

To be honest, I'm more nervous like the week,

20:32

the week of the fight. Like you get to

20:34

the, especially because like I was in New York

20:37

time change, all that stuff.

20:39

It's just scary. When you're about to go to sleep, is

20:41

there a time of day when it sort of creeps in

20:43

your head of fuck me, this guy could really kill me

20:45

here. Just all the time. It's

20:47

just really scary. I'm not going

20:49

to say it's not. It is like

20:52

I'm scared each and every time I fight. And I used

20:54

to think when I was like an amateur and even

20:57

before I did MMA, when I used to like box

20:59

and I'd be having kickboxing fights, I'd be in jujitsu.

21:01

Like I've done the full spectrum of martial arts. I'm

21:03

competing them all. I used to be really nervous for

21:05

all them as well. And I used to

21:07

think, watch the UFC and think, look at them guys. They're

21:09

not even nervous. Look at them. It must

21:11

be so easy when you get to that level. Mate, it

21:13

doesn't get any easier. It doesn't get any easier at all.

21:15

But what I do is something

21:17

that I've learned a lot from

21:19

the internet from watching GSP. GSP

21:22

has actually told me personally, we've had a few lengthy

21:24

chats about it as well. He's like, you

21:27

have to accept fear because it's not going

21:29

away. Like fear makes you super sharp. And

21:33

once they accepted fear that it's going to be there and

21:35

that I can't because I always, I always say I used

21:37

to have two fights. I used to be fighting my opponent,

21:40

I used to fight and be fighting myself. And

21:42

I used to be like, listen, just

21:44

trying to push my, I used to be fighting the fear more

21:46

so than my opponent. He'd be like, I need to stop thinking

21:48

like this. This is not, I was supposed to think now

21:51

I just accept this is how you're supposed to

21:53

feel. And this is actually going to help me be

21:55

sharper in my fighting. That's something that

21:57

accepted a few fights ago. probably

22:00

maybe around the time I just got in the

22:02

UFC actually so seven or eight fights we all

22:05

and once they accepted that it's just given me

22:07

a whole new confidence. I think there might have

22:09

been Brendan Schaub who said that the worst he

22:11

ever thought was when he wasn't scared and I've

22:13

heard a few fights like that's when you actually

22:16

should be fucking worried because your reflexes everything

22:18

ain't going to be on point and when you were

22:20

in there you're obviously moving around him you're on your

22:22

bike and Pavlovitch catch Oh he whacked me

22:25

yeah he did whack me. What did that feel like?

22:27

When I'm in there and I'm just emotionless

22:30

I'm not thinking about anything apart from

22:32

what I'm doing and by

22:34

the way that's an absolutely fantastic spot to be in

22:36

in life in general where you don't have anything else

22:38

to think about apart from what you're doing right now

22:40

it's really rare I've got really active mind so it's

22:43

really rare that I can be in that

22:46

that's why I love this sport so

22:48

much is because I'm constantly questioned

22:50

like I love it I absolutely

22:52

love that aspect is I can

22:55

find out who I am every time I fight

22:57

and that's pretty rare mate that's pretty rare like

22:59

people run away from that and

23:01

I try and embrace it as much as I can because the

23:04

sport is a it really

23:06

fucking puts into perspective

23:08

this is like focusing in the

23:11

moment if you're not focusing the moment

23:13

mate you're gonna get knocked out and it's a great sport

23:15

for that so I absolutely love it for that but when

23:18

he whacked me he actually thought it's

23:20

not as bad as I thought to be honest he clipped

23:22

me with he missed the right hand I slipped a little

23:24

bit he got me the left go he started knocking he

23:26

knocked my gum shield out a little bit and

23:30

I started retreating back and like readjusted

23:32

my gum shield and I think that

23:34

he thought he I think that

23:36

he saw I've got he hurt me yeah

23:39

but he didn't I was just readjusting my gum shield so he came forward with

23:41

a couple more and I slipped him I got out of the way and

23:44

I think he was a bit demoralized after that to be

23:46

honest because usually he whacks someone and that's the beginning of

23:48

the end so it's a bad habit to

23:50

get into I guess what getting whacked well no

23:52

for him to to be expecting you'd be here

23:54

because then if the one thing all of a

23:57

sudden and we've seen this before the

23:59

one guy who can take that shot and you

24:01

shit yourself like Deontay Wilder had it with Tyson

24:03

Peery but you know. Mate he's

24:05

so heavy handed though and like seven

24:08

first round knockouts in the UFC

24:10

against top 15 guys is fucking

24:12

unbelievable. The guy's an absolute truck

24:14

and I guarantee moving forward

24:16

he's going to knock a lot more people out. The guy's an

24:18

absolute cheat. You'll probably meet him again. I'm sure I will. Like

24:20

I've only just turned 30. I think he's like 31, 32. We've

24:23

got at least another five years

24:25

left so. Young heavyweights. You're very young heavyweights

24:27

yeah. So you catch him, you put him

24:29

down, smash him,

24:31

emotion's pouring down. Can

24:34

you sort of describe what that felt like

24:36

for me mate? I

24:39

was just really overwhelmed. I thought I was going

24:41

to. To be honest I definitely thought

24:43

I had a good chance of winning the fight. I thought

24:45

the fuck that it would be later on but I have

24:47

serious power as well like I know that I do and

24:50

something else that I have over the other heavyweights is they

24:52

don't see the punches. I'm not going to give away what

24:55

I do too much but they don't see them. I don't

24:58

just stand in front of you and unload the punches. I

25:00

do a lot of subtle stuff that's hard to see from

25:02

the outside. I was really overwhelmed and

25:04

I think obviously winning the title is great and

25:07

like that's my lifelong dream. But

25:09

also the circumstances that I was in. There

25:11

was a lot happened behind the scene

25:14

so to speak. I fight,

25:17

taken a fight on two weeks notice. I

25:19

not being in the best shape ever. Fucking

25:21

truth. So I fucking injured my back. Also

25:24

I didn't realise I was going to New York until two

25:26

days before because I couldn't get a visa and I had

25:29

to be in London like dicking around a couple of times

25:31

trying to get a visa. When you've

25:33

got all that resting on your shoulders mate

25:35

it's a lot. I'm very regimented

25:37

with my training. I'm very regimented with my

25:39

life, my routine is everything to me. I

25:42

do the same things every day and

25:44

I didn't have any of that in this training camp. I

25:46

call it a training camp. It wasn't a training camp. You

25:48

can't train for a fight in a week. Simple as that.

25:50

So it was none of that. I was way out of

25:52

my comfort zone so I think it was just pure

25:55

relief more than anything. It was so great

25:57

that you did a bisping and that bisping

25:59

was there. And he

26:01

said he went into the locker room beforehand

26:03

and then you see in a master word

26:06

for English MMA fans for you know, you

26:08

like me. We watched Bispin take the belt

26:10

off a rock hold to see you guys

26:12

have that moment was like, fuck

26:14

me. I could cry just watching this. You know what

26:16

I mean? What was that like? Just going to the

26:18

father Bispin. He's

26:20

just, he's, he's my guy. Do you know what I mean?

26:23

Like we're good friends. Um, I

26:25

was watching Bispin mate, start off in the nosebleeds in

26:27

the M E N arena at the time I came,

26:29

I came down to, uh, I watched

26:31

him in Birmingham against Chris Leibman. Fucking

26:33

years ago. Like I was just the

26:35

ultimate Bispin fan. And then when

26:38

I'm sometimes, you know, it's like you meet people and

26:40

you're like, nah, he's not what I thought he would

26:42

be. Uh, but Bispin's like,

26:44

no, Bispin's that guy

26:46

and more like he's, so he's such a nice

26:48

person and we have such a good relationship personally

26:51

as well. Um, Michael

26:53

Bispin, USC champion aside, it was just nice to

26:55

have Michael Bispin, my friend there supporting me. It

26:57

was great. There was a bit of criticism about

27:00

the performance he did. Obviously you got caught and

27:02

then this thing that people keep like, uh, laying

27:04

out, you saying your chin's in the air. Um,

27:07

I wondered what your response is to people who say

27:09

that, uh, I agree. My chin is in the

27:11

air. It's something I'm working on. Um, I

27:14

have bad habits, same as anybody else. I'm training every

27:16

day to make them better. Um,

27:18

I wasn't expecting that response.

27:21

No, no, I think that you can

27:23

learn from anybody. Um, I

27:26

can, I can see my bad habits just as much as

27:28

anybody else. I'm not going to sit here and be like,

27:31

I am the ultimate complete finished product right now. Like

27:33

I feel like I'm going to, even when I'm retired

27:35

from fighting, I'm still going to be trying to improve

27:37

on martial arts skills forever. I'm a lifelong martial artist.

27:39

Um, this thing never ends. I'm

27:42

never going to be the complete fighter. I'm never going

27:44

to be the complete martial artist. Um, so

27:46

those people who say, yeah, my chin's in the air. Yeah. I

27:48

shouldn't have took this shot. That shot. I do this wrong. That

27:50

wrong. Uh, mate, I can see it more than anybody else. I'm

27:52

an own biggest critic. You don't have to tell me the bad

27:54

habits I'm making. I love the sport

27:56

of MMA. I love martial arts. I study

27:58

martial arts. I study. myself more than I

28:01

study anybody else and I know

28:03

what I need to work on and I'm working on it every day. Has

28:06

people been changing how they treat you since then?

28:08

Because it's one thing to be Tom

28:10

Aspen or the F.C. F.A.I. I don't think

28:12

they have the belt. Visually it hits people,

28:14

you know, like you're the king now. Yeah. People

28:17

asking a favour, people talking to you a certain way. What are

28:19

you saying? Do you know what? I just try

28:21

and keep my life exactly the same. You know, I'm really like, it took me a

28:23

long time to get to the point where I'm at. So I want to keep it

28:25

that way. I'm not into like these bougie parties

28:27

and celebrity living and popping bottles and wearing

28:29

all nice jewelry and going on this and

28:32

that and this yacht and doing all that

28:34

shit. Obviously, I've got offers for that, but

28:36

it's just not really my thing. I want

28:38

to stay who I

28:40

am because I'm happy with myself and it's took

28:42

me a long time to get happy with myself

28:44

and I'm there. So I just want to keep

28:46

it like that. That's amazing to me because so

28:48

many fighters get to where they are buying

28:51

security. Like I look at Conor McGregor,

28:53

for example, and I think

28:55

the fact that he has this like small man syndrome

28:57

thing going on, like he wants to be the biggest

29:00

shining star in the room. And

29:02

that's actually sparked a lot of his success.

29:04

Same with Floyd Mayweather. That's why they're jewelry,

29:06

money. That is their problem. Whereas I think

29:08

you being a big guy, it probably helps

29:10

you. You don't have this thing of I've

29:12

got a chip on my shoulder because I need to act like

29:14

the biggest, hardest man in the room. I am the biggest, hardest

29:16

man in the room. I don't really have to prove that. You

29:19

know what I mean? Yeah, no, I know exactly what you mean.

29:21

I just don't. It's

29:23

just not really my personality, to be honest with

29:26

you. And I'm not going

29:28

to fake that. Like, as I

29:30

said, I'm very happy with the person

29:32

I am now. I'm very, I

29:35

try and have like good morals. I believe in

29:37

like karma really strongly and stuff like that. So

29:39

I try and be honest and upfront with people

29:41

and just just leave it like that. I'm not

29:43

really into like the flashy lifestyle. It doesn't really

29:45

suit me like it. Obviously

29:48

I like nice things just as much as the next side,

29:50

but I'm not going to go flashing them in everyone's face

29:52

like I'm from a small working town. So if

29:55

someone did that in my town, I'd be like, what a knob. Look

29:57

at this. I don't want to.

29:59

I don't want everyone to look at me like that.

30:01

Well, I see when I got that like money, cause

30:04

I'm a kid from working class background big time, I

30:06

had this moment where I went out and bought a

30:08

load of cars and stuff and I'm driving them around

30:10

now. I was like, yeah, I'm the man. And then

30:13

like a few months I find, I was like, God,

30:15

I look like such a fucking prick. I'm the same,

30:17

mate. I've got a Range Rover, right? And it's

30:19

not some big fancy one. It's beautiful. I

30:21

love it. And people are like,

30:24

Oh, why didn't you get like a Lamborghini Urus and all

30:26

that? I was like, I can't be driving around my town

30:28

in that, like a knob, like a Range Rover. It's big,

30:30

it suits me. It's great. And I'm

30:32

just happy with that. Yeah, I don't like to

30:34

say there's some stuff that people do and I

30:37

just don't want to be one of them. Well, Bisping

30:39

mentioned on my podcast, he was like,

30:41

you rang you up going, tell the

30:43

wife, get the handbags out, get

30:45

the house picked. It's all happening. And you

30:48

were like, but I don't want to do

30:50

that. Yeah. So like

30:52

you're not daydreaming about possessions. It is

30:54

about the martial arts. It's about competitions,

30:56

about legacy. But

30:58

ironically, I was talking about McGregor before, you have had

31:00

a little bit of a back and forth, haven't we

31:02

all? He said you

31:04

were three after you said you weren't really first on

31:07

his comeback fight, which I don't think was a bad

31:09

thing to say by any means. I

31:12

basically said that he would

31:14

starve you of your Jim

31:16

King deal and kill you,

31:18

you fucking disrespectful, yada, yada, yada.

31:20

What was it like to have, and

31:23

let me be clear, a man who you could

31:25

absolutely annihilate within a minute. I

31:27

do what you want with him, giving you

31:30

death threats. Little bit weird because

31:32

I don't really know Connor at all. I've never even

31:34

met the guy. Never

31:36

had any beef with him or anything. And the whole situation

31:38

came on a little bit weird. So my friend started a

31:40

YouTube channel, right? Cause he's my friend, he came down

31:42

the gym and interviewed me and I did it because he's

31:45

my friend. He doesn't have a lot of numbers on his,

31:47

doesn't have loads of followers or loads of subscribers or

31:50

anything like that. So it's a pretty

31:52

small interview with a couple of hundred views. That's it.

31:54

It's not like a big channel. And he asked me

31:56

about McGregor. You looking forward to McGregor's next fight, blah,

31:58

blah. And I said, oh, to be honest. I'm not

32:00

really I'm not really that interested in

32:02

Conor McGregor not because I'm mate I

32:04

only really watch the heavyweights and bigger guys. I'm not

32:06

as interested in the smog I just meant it like

32:08

that next one. He's fucking sending me death threats.

32:10

Well the tree I'm like me How first

32:13

of all, how did you even see that? It's got like 300

32:15

views on it How

32:17

are you offended? I just didn't I just didn't know I

32:21

just didn't I was just a bit baffled by it's like what

32:23

the fuck like this is a Like

32:26

I said, this is my friend's YouTube channel. It's

32:28

not like I'm not on MMA hour or

32:30

ESPN or a calling them out Yeah, I'm not doing

32:32

anything like that. He literally asked me I just said,

32:34

you know I'm not really that interested in what my

32:36

great is doing and he just got really offended by

32:38

it and started getting all violent and shit But it

32:41

didn't mean it like that. We've had Dana White come out

32:43

in the last couple of days. Yeah, I'm TNT Yes,

32:46

we're gonna talk about how he said Tom

32:48

Aspinall will not get the fight with a

32:50

that steepier or Jones They will fight each

32:53

other next. Yep as Someone

32:56

who is the the young hungry

32:58

lion John Jones and steepier are on

33:01

the older side of their career Yeah, to me

33:03

the UFC was built on the best fight and

33:05

the best for the heavyweight title of the world

33:07

And it's clear that you are the best. How

33:10

does that make you feel? well

33:13

Let me start by saying I Absolutely.

33:15

Love my sport. Absolutely. Love

33:18

the sport of MMA UFC in particular

33:20

like I'm so proud to

33:23

be fighting for the best MMA

33:25

organization in the world and What

33:29

that represents for me is? The

33:31

best fight in the best and I'm

33:33

a massive boxing fan, right? I absolutely love the

33:36

sport of boxing. I Fucking

33:38

can't stand the boxing model like this

33:40

should not be five six different world

33:42

champions at one weight And that's a

33:44

minimum some ways talk about eight nine

33:46

champions at one weight Let's find

33:49

out who the fucking guy is. That's what I that's

33:51

what I want to find out like this is There's

33:54

two champions now in the UFC

33:56

heavyweight division. That's not right, mate. It's not

33:58

right simple as that you sugarcoated all

34:00

you want, these legacy fights and whatever, like

34:03

my next fight has to be for the undisputed

34:05

title. Why would I, like, why

34:08

would I ever do otherwise? Like, it's,

34:11

let's fucking find out who the guy is. Simple

34:13

as that. All this legacy fights,

34:15

I don't understand how

34:17

that can happen. Yeah, like, I'm having a legacy

34:19

fight, but why for the undisputed title?

34:21

Why are you making the rest of us wait? And

34:24

I understand it's Jon Jones, mate. He's a legend. The

34:27

person walking this earth is a bigger Jon

34:29

Jones fan than me. But this isn't

34:31

boxing. This isn't guys avoiding

34:33

each other. This isn't the

34:35

number one guy fighting the number 10 guy. Let's find

34:37

out who the fucking guy is, because I believe it's

34:39

me. So let's see. This would

34:42

be the first time in history, to my

34:44

knowledge, that an undisputed

34:46

champion would basically

34:49

not be fighting the interim champion.

34:51

You always collaborate those two belts

34:54

and bring them together and unify.

34:56

And instead, you'll have the option as you

34:58

defend it, because Dana White has said it's

35:01

what they deserve. Yeah. And

35:03

I find that amazing, because Dana White,

35:05

for the longest time, has criticized boxing.

35:08

And yet, we have now finally got to a point

35:10

where Alexander, Youssouk, and Tyson

35:12

Fury are unifying. But mate,

35:14

two, three years too late. We don't

35:16

like, that's the way boxing works. You

35:18

look at people like Pacquiao and Mayweather.

35:21

Fucking five years on. Who's asked anymore?

35:23

That's how I feel about steep-baiting Jones. Exactly.

35:26

I don't care about that, because we've got the champion

35:28

right here. It's very odd. And obviously, I don't want

35:31

to sit here slagging off

35:33

my bosses. But it's

35:36

not right. It's not right. Like, they

35:38

can't be fucking two heavyweight champions. They can't be. This

35:40

isn't boxing. There's one guy. There's one

35:43

face, one name. And let's find out who

35:45

that is. I'm surprised that Dana,

35:47

especially because of the smiting of boxing,

35:49

and now we're kind of now doing

35:51

worse than boxing, because boxing's actually getting

35:53

attacked together a little bit in that

35:55

regard. And You're seeing the

35:57

court from Dana's, It's what they deserve. The

36:00

Us He has never been about block and

36:02

stuff people like Chuck Liddell the I never got

36:04

law passed out like you know it was

36:06

to kill us you want to be in

36:08

the Us A your fight and kill us says

36:10

no exceptions even for the analyze best friend

36:12

there was no exceptions. So to now sit there

36:15

and protects the be fussy beta would deny a

36:17

fight with Pablo that the Steep a to

36:19

deny fight with you and still get the title

36:21

shot. I understand steep is the north east

36:23

don't well them for the of say but

36:25

like you don't get brownie points as India for

36:27

like we're here if I know the best

36:29

is. Not to see to the Cw

36:31

easier. Ah eight it's It's frustrating for

36:34

the fans are and I personally think

36:36

like Barbara I'll get on. The Jon

36:38

Jones is must cool about this because

36:40

he said I faced the absolute toughest

36:42

competition the world has to offer for

36:44

fifteen years during com for title defense

36:46

and are major injury yada yada yada

36:49

know about newcomers of it's costing the

36:51

my championship gets that strip I'm assuming

36:53

is referred the was new com Us

36:55

Zero wins over Legends mean it's hot

36:57

it's a win over there were none

36:59

of them associates. Zero title

37:01

defenses and already sick and you call the

37:03

shots. The Dana Hilarious. My sister in Korea

37:06

seen so many guys supposed to be. The

37:08

next big thing is only been one Jon

37:10

Jones. Never forget that's no is at no

37:12

point does he say. When.

37:14

I come back. I'll fight Thomas. Been

37:16

on? Yep, Yep. six. So. Like.

37:18

Is great as you all the plot

37:20

seeing any confidence. To take you on. What

37:22

does that make you think. I'd be

37:24

surprised if we got to fight to be I'd

37:27

I would love it and. I

37:29

think he's aware of the it's just too good from at this

37:31

point. I. don't think he's smart i think

37:33

it's and eight the she was only the

37:35

full i would have fight me either and

37:37

thus not me begin myself up a slight

37:39

why would you know fi a guy the

37:41

forty two forty three a million miles on

37:43

the clock and then backdoor it as a

37:45

falsify in my this guy's a steamroller nadia

37:48

and i think it's models ugly scary is

37:50

jon jones' weight not scared of anybody most

37:52

i think he's just really small and i'm

37:54

scared though scared this is a word those

37:56

know of a bid to it's it's about

37:58

i see our what your mom do to

38:00

me and I don't think whether

38:02

or not it's fear but he understands that the

38:04

risk that you bring is significantly

38:06

greater than Miotis. Miotis has a look,

38:09

Miotis has his best never look like

38:11

you look like now. That alone is

38:14

very strange so if we're talking like

38:17

statistics or whatever like

38:19

John Jones has had one fight at heavyweight against Cyril

38:21

Gany, let's be honest, didn't fucking want to be there.

38:23

One dimensional as well. And that

38:26

was his one fight in three years so

38:28

he's had one fight at heavyweight. Stipe has

38:31

had one fight in four years

38:33

and he got knocked out. It's

38:35

fucking weird mate. This is actually worse than

38:39

anything boxing has ever done in

38:41

terms of protecting fighters because at

38:44

least in the heavyweight division at

38:46

some point you will fight a live dog within

38:48

three years. And by the time these

38:51

guys do fight it'll be one fight in four

38:53

years, one fight in five years. Like how can

38:55

that possibly represent

38:57

the best fighting the best? The

38:59

sport moves so quickly. I couldn't

39:01

agree more mate. It slows my

39:03

mind yeah. And even look at

39:06

the Cyril Gany fight with John

39:08

Jones before the takedown. John Jones

39:10

looked so low. That body

39:12

shot he threw away, missed him completely. I'm like you

39:14

know if you do that to Tom Aspinall your head's

39:16

coming clean off mate. I agree. I

39:19

do agree. It's frustrating.

39:21

So frustrating. You've

39:24

covered basically every point there is to cover and

39:26

I just don't understand it mate. And it's difficult

39:28

for me to speak in interviews and

39:30

stuff about it because everyone's like you fucking disrespecting

39:33

one of the best. No I'm not at all.

39:36

I want a shot. Like I want my

39:38

shot. Simple as that. I think I'm the

39:40

fucking number one heavyweight in the world right

39:42

now. I truly truly believe it. Let me

39:44

prove it. That's all I'm asking. I'm not.

39:46

I'm not. I forgot though. Top there John

39:48

Jones's last few fights like heavyweight. Yeah. He

39:50

did not look good man. I know. He

39:53

looked poor. Like going to a decision against

39:55

Anthony Smith with all due respect. Yeah. That

39:57

credible competitor. He didn't look good. And you.

40:00

And also my caveat on every John Jones

40:02

fight up until heavyweight was you were a

40:04

heavyweight who trained yourself down to light heavyweight.

40:06

And if you look at his actual resume,

40:08

most of the guys you fought were middleweight.

40:10

Michida went to middleweight, Shogun went to middleweight,

40:12

Chael Sonnen middleweight and like Chael Sonnen wanted

40:15

you on 24 hours notice and he wouldn't

40:17

show up for that. So

40:19

I just think that like, I think

40:21

John Jones as great as his legacy

40:23

is, it's incomplete without fighting a live

40:25

dog at heavyweight. And you all that.

40:28

I'd hold my hands up. If he

40:30

fights you, then you're legitimately the heavyweight

40:32

champion of the world because it's the best fight

40:34

in the best. But a winner of a Cyril

40:36

Gawne who was never the champion, does not make

40:38

you... You know, I

40:41

genuinely all hype

40:43

and talk aside, I genuinely want to find out who's

40:45

the best me or him because I think he's one

40:47

of the best fighters ever. I

40:49

literally believe that 100%. I'm

40:52

a massive, massive John Jones fan. I

40:54

want to find out is what I'm

40:57

doing in the gym and what I'm doing in my... Is

40:59

that right to fucking beat the

41:01

best guy ever? It will be. And

41:03

I think it is. I believe it is. And I

41:05

want to test it, but obviously right now it doesn't seem like I can

41:07

get any opportunity for it. Well, when

41:09

you look at the way he fought against

41:11

OSP, big guy, Alexander, a big guy. Same

41:15

with Dominik Reyes. Yeah, Dominik Reyes. All of

41:17

these six foot four guys who he hasn't

41:19

got a major size advantage over and strength

41:21

advantage over, he struggled big time. He did

41:23

not have the speed and power you do.

41:25

And with the look,

41:27

he defends well, but with your ability

41:30

to connect and hurt people, I just don't see

41:32

away from the win that fight. I completely agree. I'm

41:34

shocked. I don't know what

41:38

to do to get that fight. Do you know what I mean?

41:40

I don't know what else I can do. I fucking fuck

41:43

the fight and shot is no, it's possible. Any

41:46

lesson that's undoable. You can't take it. You can't

41:48

fly across the world, mate. I didn't have a

41:50

visa, so I couldn't have got there any sooner

41:52

than that. I

41:55

don't know what else I can do apart from go over,

41:57

knock out the scariest guy. By the way. Pavlovic

42:00

was, he was a backup fighter, he was training for three

42:02

months for that fight. I didn't even get a fucking week.

42:05

So I went over there, knocked him out, nobody

42:07

thought he could lose you, he was steamrolling everyone. If

42:10

that doesn't get me the fight, what else can I

42:12

do? I don't know what the fuck is going on.

42:14

I'm just, I'm just so, and then they're talking about

42:16

like defending interim and stuff and it's like, well,

42:19

first of all, who else is defending interim? I

42:22

don't know of any, I don't, I don't know either.

42:24

I don't know. And if

42:26

I've got to defend an interim

42:28

against a genuine contender, then

42:31

I should be the one with the fucking undisputed belt. Like

42:33

if you steep a fort, you should be undisputed. Yeah.

42:36

Yeah. Yeah. No,

42:38

he's fighting steep eight who's 42 or 43, whatever it is, million miles on

42:40

the clock. If I had to fight someone like Almeida, Cyril Gan, Volkov

42:43

again, all them kind of people who are

42:45

actually like in the prime and good, like

42:48

that's a bit of a shit end of the stick for me. Do

42:51

you know what I'm saying? He's fighting for the

42:53

undisputed and I'm defending interim. The other thing I

42:55

really can't understand is the fact that the

42:58

UFC and all, all, all boxing fighting,

43:00

even wrestling do this, right? You

43:02

get the guys with the miles on the

43:04

clock. They're at the end, they're almost ready. And what

43:06

you do is you have a change in of the

43:08

guard, right? You go, now we're going to line you

43:11

up against the hungry lion. We're going to hope that

43:13

you lose to the hungry lion, push him to the

43:15

moon. We've got a UK guy who's very likable

43:17

and every man who has the UK

43:20

audience behind him. I can't think of

43:22

a better way to, you know,

43:24

attach the star power to you and build you up more

43:26

than by having you fight either state by your choice. I

43:29

also don't know. I don't have an answer for it. I

43:31

don't know what else. I just feel like it's Jones's legacy

43:33

is entwined with the UFC's legacy. And

43:36

what they're thinking is like, he's the

43:38

Michael Jordan for us. And if he

43:40

does lose, it affects the

43:42

UFC's overall brand because then,

43:44

you know, a silver lost GSP lost.

43:47

Like we don't really have a guy to

43:49

hang on and go, he was the goat.

43:52

I don't know. I don't, you might be, I have not

43:54

a fucking clue, mate. I don't know. I'm

43:56

just over here. Like, how many fights a year

43:58

do you get offered? You're

44:00

supposed to get three or in

44:02

my previous contract it was through I've got a new contract now as

44:06

a champion Hey, then

44:08

sure no, he's fight so you better pay. Yeah, you know the

44:10

way to write. I Think

44:13

probably two now or something like that I

44:15

don't know but the reason I'm asking is

44:17

when I looked through because I've got a

44:19

bit of a conspiracy theory about the UFC

44:21

Heavyweight title. Yeah in that for whatever reason

44:23

in I hadn't really connected the dots I

44:25

was like, okay, I mean Daniel Cormier Keep

44:27

me me old church now John George is

44:30

staggering how rarely that belt gets defended.

44:32

Is it come? Oh, yeah compared to

44:34

Israel out of Sania at middleweight who's

44:36

yet to defend it weekly The

44:40

welterweight belt was average at probably like once a

44:42

year once a year. Yeah, which for

44:45

a promotion that Kind of you

44:48

know with certain fighters you've been grafting your balls

44:50

off some of these lads in terms of defending

44:52

their belt Twice three times a year minimum Israel

44:54

out of Sania three times a year Kamara Usman

44:56

was two or three times a year So to

44:59

have it so different heavyweight across three different champions.

45:01

For example, I was like, is there a Monetary

45:04

reason but they seem to

45:06

operate so much slower at heavyweight and

45:09

for you to be twice a year is Surprising

45:11

to me because I'm thinking let's

45:14

throw you as many fights as we I actually don't

45:16

know I don't have a decent answer for you. Unfortunately,

45:18

but I have been very active for heavyweight about Eight

45:22

nine fights in three years, which is quite a lot and

45:25

an injury. Yeah on an injury and I think that Yeah,

45:28

the injury kept me off for a year So probably I've been

45:30

averaging a little bit more but um, I think

45:33

definitely a big guys See the training takes out

45:35

of us a lot more just going back to what we spoke

45:37

about with the heavy weights and stuff Like

45:39

heavy weights are banged up a lot more than

45:41

smaller guys. It just takes more out your body

45:44

like If

45:46

you look at big guys, they're generally going

45:48

to like rugby or basketball or

45:50

if they're American They're going to like American football

45:52

and stuff like that. It's not often the

45:55

training for like 25 minutes scraps with someone

45:57

In an arena, do you know the means

45:59

so there's more small guys sport in general, I

46:01

think there's less guys to fight at heavyweight and I think

46:03

that heavyweight shifts aren't as

46:06

readily available as much as some of the smaller guys.

46:08

Do you think you're just going to sit there and

46:10

wait for them to offer another solution? Because

46:13

for you, your progress right now, to sit

46:16

out for what could be another nine months,

46:18

then they fight, if they

46:20

both make a three-one injured, at

46:22

the rate they're going, seems unlikely, you

46:24

then have another six months. It's just

46:26

not viable, is it, to sit out. It's

46:29

not ideal, definitely not, but right

46:31

now I guess we've just got to wait. There's no, I

46:34

don't really have a choice right now, I don't know what else I can

46:37

do. My next fight

46:40

has to be for the undisputed, has to be.

46:42

There's no, I'm the interim champion right now.

46:45

The interim means, if you actually translate the

46:47

word interim, it means like in waiting. So

46:50

it means like, the

46:53

champ, while the champ's unavailable.

46:56

So when he's available, exactly.

46:59

It's not rocket science mate, it's not

47:01

rocket science. I

47:03

don't, I'm just as baffled as everybody else with it. So

47:05

if they come to you and go, we're going

47:08

to offer you a Cyril God

47:11

to defend the interim title, are

47:13

you thinking you might say, no, it should

47:16

be for undisputed? I don't know.

47:18

I'm in a difficult spot to say that right

47:20

now, but I think my

47:22

next fight should be undisputed. I've never ever,

47:24

you can ask any of the USC staff,

47:26

any of my team, anyone, I've never ever

47:28

turned down a fight in my life and

47:30

I'll continue to not turn down a fight,

47:32

but I deserve to fight for the undisputed

47:34

title next, a hundred percent. In terms of

47:36

your heavyweight goal, who is that? Oh,

47:40

it's a tough one. I

47:42

loved Paul Velasquez and

47:44

his prime, loved him. But if you're

47:46

talking about the heavyweight goal, I think

47:48

statistically you got to go steep a

47:50

statistically, but I think

47:52

came Velasquez was better than him. If that, if

47:54

that makes any sense. So the performance, he was

47:56

unreal, like if you compare the great performance of

47:59

Stevie Potter and the to Kane. Kane

48:01

was the complete fighter. The

48:03

way he moved, he was so good at

48:06

everything. For

48:08

me, he was better than Phaedo. Yeah, definitely.

48:10

I completely agree. See,

48:12

I don't like talking like, oh, if Kane

48:14

in his prime

48:16

fought or Steve Kane in his prime, because that's just

48:18

bullshit talk. It's like I

48:21

hate the pam for pam conversation. I think

48:23

it's absolute bollocks. We might as well talk

48:26

about fucking Superman against Iron Man.

48:28

Do you know what I mean? It's impossible.

48:30

It's all make believe. But for

48:32

me, Kane in his prime was

48:35

fucking... He was like no one else.

48:37

He was incredible. He had this sort of steely

48:40

demeanor. For

48:42

me, the way he perfectly threw the leg

48:45

kicks and all of his

48:47

technique was so... Wasn't that flat on it?

48:49

The Iron Man that he was in terms

48:51

of his cardio. I mean, you could

48:53

argue he didn't have the power of someone like you, but

48:56

he had everything else. He was unreal. He was absolutely

48:58

unbelievable. I absolutely love. Never actually met Kane. I'd love

49:00

to meet him. And he just seems like such a

49:02

nice guy as well. Like he seems dead chilled and...

49:05

What he's gone through lately. For those

49:07

who don't know, I'll just explain. He got into a

49:10

situation where he found

49:12

out, I believe his daughter was being abused

49:14

by a teacher of some sort. Obviously,

49:17

as a man would, especially a man

49:19

like Kane, went after the guy chasing

49:21

him down the motorway, shooting at his

49:23

car. And I think they've

49:25

arrested him for attempted murder. So yeah. I

49:29

think as a

49:31

father myself, and

49:33

I think a lot of other fathers out there and a

49:35

lot of other men, even without children would say, that's

49:38

what I do. Is that I put some A blah, blah,

49:41

blah. Kane fucking did it. And I

49:43

think fucking fair play to

49:45

him. And I think he

49:47

shot the wrong guy or something, didn't he? Is that right? The

49:49

guy who was driving away had his dad in the car. Right.

49:52

Okay. It's a shame that

49:54

he got shot because he was obviously innocent. So

49:56

that's not ideal. But

49:58

it's fucking absolutely disgusting. him what went on

50:00

I think that free cane is

50:02

what I say I know he's a free man now

50:05

I don't know if he I heard he's got another

50:07

trial coming around I hope he gets minimal for what

50:09

for what he's done you'd think so I mean I've

50:11

only ever heard of one other case like this I

50:13

don't know if you've ever seen the footage of the

50:15

skis it was a karate teacher molested some

50:18

boy and the father of the boy

50:20

might have been a former cop or whatever and they're

50:22

bringing him through the airport and there's a guy on

50:24

a telephone and he just pulls a

50:26

gun out and shoots this karate it's the dad right

50:28

okay he's literally been hiding there for however long yeah

50:30

waiting for this guy and they got it gave

50:32

him minimal time because they were like the

50:34

grounds of insanity yes so you'd think that

50:36

there'd be an acceptance of that I do

50:38

wonder I worry about the fact that the

50:40

way Cain looks like Brown pride that's the

50:42

issue in it he's like see

50:45

I say all the time I

50:47

feel way safer in a bar

50:49

full of UFC players than I do

50:52

a bar full of regular people regular

50:54

people honestly I'd hand on heart like

50:56

that's how I feel like there's some

50:58

of them everyone's ego not everyone 95%

51:00

of people's ego in check

51:02

when you're when you're in MMA fight because you

51:05

get beat up on a regular basis and

51:08

yeah it goes against you though for someone who

51:10

doesn't know that he's like some lawyer who doesn't

51:13

know really whatever they think cage fighters either skinhead

51:15

the cauliflower ears and like you say the brown

51:17

pride tattoo and all that it doesn't look good

51:19

in that regard they see these a cage fight

51:21

for me I see champion it doesn't look good

51:23

but and I

51:25

know a few people who know Cain and

51:27

they say he's a great guy so I

51:29

can only go off that what do you

51:31

make of Alex Pereira yeah talking about becoming

51:34

a three division champion but because that would

51:36

be a very interesting welcoming you know if

51:38

you were gonna do yeah the

51:40

title fight a way

51:42

to make that spiced up a bit with would be

51:44

a double champ situation when he's

51:46

trying to take that belt from you would

51:49

you want to turn that but listen to this right we're

51:52

in New York heat we

51:54

obviously fall on the same carb in him never

51:56

met him before never know

51:59

a few of these and teammates

52:01

and stuff. I know a couple of these coaches and

52:03

a club to share and stuff like we've met before.

52:05

So pretty friendly. He

52:07

was quite frosty when I met him. And

52:09

I don't know him personally. I didn't know if he was just

52:11

like that. If he was just definitely not

52:15

happy chappy. Do you know what I mean? So

52:17

I spent a bit of time together. Obviously there's a language

52:20

barrier and stuff. He doesn't really speak English that I'm aware

52:22

of at least.

52:25

And we went to did the press conference. We sat next

52:27

to each other. He was literally I was I was here.

52:29

He was there. Got off

52:31

the press conference. And I said, Oh, like, how

52:33

was it? I said,

52:35

you know, Alex Pereira. He said, yeah, I

52:38

said, he thinks he can beat me, you know.

52:40

And the midhab was like, what

52:42

do you mean? I don't know. I can

52:44

just tell. I can. I literally could

52:46

feel often that. Did

52:49

he want you to feel it? I don't know. I know. He

52:51

wasn't part of me. He wasn't posturing. He wasn't like trying to

52:54

intimidate me or I just

52:56

felt like he

52:58

had in his mind. Maybe I'm just making it up.

53:00

I have no idea, but I've never

53:02

done it with anyone before. And I'm not like

53:04

that insecure guy being like, he's trying to fight

53:06

me. I'm not like that at all. I

53:09

just felt like when

53:11

I heard that he wants to move up to everybody, I

53:13

wasn't surprised. I felt like he was like sizing me up

53:16

a little bit. Maybe that's just the way he is. Maybe

53:18

I read it completely wrong. But I

53:20

remember coming off the press conference. I said to my

53:22

dad, I'm sure he was loud. I

53:26

almost got the feeling from him. Like I would get from

53:28

an opponent before I would fight him. Do you know what

53:30

I mean? Because he had it in his mind. I think

53:32

so. But saying that mate, we were two, three

53:34

days away from a fight. Maybe that's just the way he acts

53:37

in general. I don't know. I might've been reading

53:39

the situation completely wrong. He's called it. But when

53:41

I see, when I, when I saw that headline

53:43

that he's moving up to heavy, he's going to

53:45

move up to heavy. I was like, that

53:47

does make a bit of sense. But maybe I was

53:50

completely. What do you make of that fight between you

53:52

and him? I mean, what a, what a striking match

53:54

it could make. Yeah, I think he's great. I

53:56

think he's amazing. I'm massive fan of his. I

53:58

actually, as I said, I train. I trained with

54:00

Rico Verhoeven who is the glory heavyweight champion. He was

54:02

the glory light heavyweight champion on mid-way, so I was

54:04

aware of who he was before he even got to

54:06

the USA. I was a fan of him then. I

54:09

think it makes for an amazing fight to be honest.

54:11

Like if that's something that we can

54:13

explore later down the line, as I said,

54:16

I've never turned a fight down in my life, so can't

54:18

be. The talk of the town right now, one of the

54:20

guys I wanted to ask you about was Ian Gary. Oh

54:22

yeah. What a character. Divisive.

54:26

Divisive. Very disliked actually by a lot of people

54:28

in fact. What do you make

54:30

of his skill set and also just his personality?

54:32

The fact that he's been kicked out of all

54:34

these gyms and he's making buzz. Yeah. Well,

54:36

I wouldn't

54:39

like to say I'm friends with Ian Gary because I'm

54:41

not, but I've known of him and who he is

54:44

for a long time. We were on cage warriors together.

54:46

So he's always been like a brash, mousy,

54:49

out there character even on cage

54:51

warriors. I think his skill

54:53

set is really good. I think he's potentially a

54:55

future champion even though that weight division is fucking

54:57

stacked. And

55:02

he's getting a brunt of it at the minute.

55:04

I know his wife as well. I've

55:06

known her for quite a while as well. As I said, I don't, I'm

55:09

not sitting here saying that we're friends because we're not. I just

55:11

know one from the scene, the pair of them.

55:13

Has any of this surprised you knowing them from back in the day?

55:15

No. No, I

55:18

know it's common knowledge. Yeah,

55:22

I get you. I mean you seem like a

55:24

guy who can kind of read situations well and

55:26

see things coming as you say with this Pereira

55:28

sort of. I don't, I might

55:30

have read that. Fuck it. I might be way off. I

55:32

might be way off. Coming to the heavyweight division. He says

55:35

he is. He says he is. Maybe one day we'll meet,

55:37

but his coach was actually saying,

55:39

oh, we should train together after the fights. He

55:41

was like, oh, maybe we can start some training.

55:43

I'm like, sure. Absolutely. Maybe that's just

55:45

the way he is. Francis and Gurney. Yep. For

55:48

Tyson Fury, your old mate. Not

55:51

my mate, but I've seen that interview. Yeah,

55:54

I've seen it. I have an interview. Actually one of my favorites I've

55:56

ever done to be fair. But

55:58

in terms of in Ghana.

56:00

performance, I think he's shocked a lot of

56:02

people. You shared the ring with Tyson. You've

56:04

obviously fought at the level in Gornu House

56:06

and you know you would have been fighting

56:08

him if he hadn't gone to

56:10

the PFL. What did you make of the fight? Still

56:13

two months on him. I'm shocked by it.

56:16

Can't believe it. I cannot believe that that

56:18

happened and I've seen a lot of people say, oh Tyson didn't train

56:20

for it. Tyson's

56:22

people and my people are

56:25

pretty close. We

56:28

have mutual friends and one

56:30

of my coaches knows one of his coaches. He took that

56:32

fight deadly seriously. He trained hard for it. He trains hard

56:35

for all his fights. Very,

56:37

very shocked. I did not know that Francis

56:39

could do that. You've got to

56:41

respect him. You've got to absolutely respect what Francis

56:43

in Gornu has done. He stuck to his guns.

56:45

He stuck it out with the UFC, rolled it

56:47

out, left. Went

56:50

and got this massive PFL contract. Now

56:53

he's turned to boxing. He's making shit loads of

56:55

money out of it and he goes in there

56:57

mate and fucking holds his own. If not beats,

57:00

like I'm not a boxing judge. I can't score boxing.

57:02

I don't understand it properly. I'm not even though I'm

57:04

a- He dropped him. He dropped

57:06

him. Even though I'm a massive boxing fan, I don't claim

57:08

to be able to score a 10 round fight because I don't

57:11

know it that well. I can score at the five round

57:13

MMA fight. No problem but boxing. I'm not sure. He

57:15

definitely held his own and dropped him, which

57:18

to me was out

57:20

of this world. I think he's done absolutely,

57:22

absolutely unbelievable both in the fight and his

57:24

career and he should be extremely proud of

57:26

himself. The thing that I was thinking, which

57:28

you've alluded to earlier about heavyweight MMA is

57:30

almost a sport on its own. Heavyweight boxing

57:32

is the same for me and that, you

57:34

know, this, these light away guys who can

57:36

throw a million punches and take a million.

57:38

It ain't the same. One wrong move and

57:40

you're fucked in. I think as someone who's

57:42

met Francis, I was trying

57:44

to tell all my boxing mates, like

57:47

this guy is an athlete. He's right

57:49

up there with Deontay Wilder and all of

57:51

these heavy handed guys. But if anything, he can

57:54

take a punch and he isn't going to just be

57:56

manhandled. You can't just lean on him. Like the classic

57:58

fury things that he does. And I

58:00

just wondered, like, you know, you're watching

58:02

Francis, you're faster than

58:04

Francis, you can do things Francis

58:06

can't even, you know, and I

58:08

wondered what you were thinking about your own chances

58:11

in a boxing ring, if the time ever comes.

58:14

I've actually had a professional boxing

58:16

fight myself. That

58:18

was something I was actually thinking of doing at one point

58:20

is boxing. It's something that

58:22

I definitely do before my

58:24

career's over. But right now, I feel

58:26

like I'm nowhere near satisfied mate with

58:28

what I've done. Yeah,

58:30

I'm a heavyweight champion right now,

58:32

but I've got so much more

58:35

work to do, mate. I've not like won the

58:37

title and I'm like, yes, I've achieved it. What's

58:39

next? I'm like, yeah, I've got where

58:41

I wanted to go. But fuck

58:43

me, there's some absolute beast behind me and they've

58:45

absolutely like the next five years, mate, of my

58:47

life are going to be fucking a grind. They're

58:49

going to be tough. They're going to be in

58:52

the gym working. I'm going to be in fights

58:54

all over the world, getting dropped, getting back up

58:56

and being exhausted constantly and going through the fucking

58:58

pain to get where I want to go to

59:01

be satisfied. And you don't want the distraction to

59:03

think about. I'm not like I was asked in

59:05

an interview. What

59:08

like about it? And I didn't answer that way. I answered

59:10

by saying, oh, yeah, like you say, oh, would you ever

59:12

try boxing? I was like, oh, yeah, I guess. Yeah, I

59:14

thought I'd be interested in it. And

59:16

the next one is headlines out. Tom Aspinall, I

59:18

boxing career next. I'm like, no, it's not like

59:20

that. It's something that I definitely explore, especially if

59:23

like the money and stuff is unbelievable in boxing.

59:25

I think that's great. So it's something I potentially

59:27

do before I've retired. But right now I've got

59:29

so many massive challenges in front of me in

59:31

the USA that I've just got to focus on

59:33

that. Yeah, I think you're spot on with that

59:35

attitude because like you are just almost I look

59:37

at you like a weirdly

59:40

a young kid in the heavyweight division, even though

59:42

you're on top of it. And I think that

59:44

what you can achieve is unbelievable. Like what what

59:46

the legacy you can make, as Bismuth said as

59:48

well. The reason I just find this interesting is

59:51

I think the reason in

59:53

Ghana was such a problem for these heavyweight is the level

59:55

of athlete years. And I look at you and I see

59:57

when I look at the other top guys, you

59:59

to me. or like the Anthony Joshua of the

1:00:02

UFC in terms of a freak athlete. And

1:00:04

that means if you did jump in the

1:00:07

ring and you did fine tune the skills,

1:00:09

you'd be a fucking problem for them lot.

1:00:11

I think I've done a lot of boxing

1:00:13

sparring. How was it? It's different to MMA.

1:00:15

And I think that a

1:00:18

lot of MMA fighters who go, yeah, I'm just going to go into

1:00:20

boxing and it doesn't work like that,

1:00:22

mate. Punching is definitely a part of our

1:00:24

sport. Punching is a small percentage of what

1:00:26

you need to be good at. Like it's

1:00:28

probably barely 10% of

1:00:32

what you need to be good at is punching. And punching

1:00:35

for boxers is what they've done every day since

1:00:37

they were 8, 10, 12 years old up

1:00:40

until they're in the 30s. So there's a lot

1:00:42

of differences there. And I

1:00:45

stopped doing MMA for like two, three years because I

1:00:47

thought I was going to box. And

1:00:49

by the end of the three years or two years,

1:00:52

whatever it was, I was sparring regular with high level

1:00:54

boxers. I was doing all right. But

1:00:56

at first, mate, I was getting twatted

1:00:58

all the time. And that's something

1:01:00

that takes time. What was sparring

1:01:02

Tyson Fury like? So the first time

1:01:05

I sparred him was I was

1:01:07

a young man. I was probably like 22. It

1:01:09

was before he fought the klick

1:01:12

shot. Yeah. Yeah. He don't think he had

1:01:14

the fight then. It was like after he

1:01:16

fought whoever the number one contender was or

1:01:18

whatever before then it was after that. So

1:01:20

it was like prime Fury. Like the movie

1:01:22

that he was a Fury coach to make

1:01:24

unbelievable. Peter Fury, just to drop in that

1:01:26

he's fucking some coach mate. His style is

1:01:28

great. Like if I ever switch

1:01:30

over to boxing, he's still coaching me now. Like

1:01:32

we still go down there for sessions. We're in touch

1:01:34

all the time. He's a great family friend of like

1:01:36

mine and my dad's and stuff. The whole Fury family

1:01:38

are actually. But yeah, if I ever want

1:01:40

to switch over to boxing, he'll be

1:01:42

my coach. Definitely. I agree with

1:01:44

you in terms of like a lot of MMA fighters

1:01:46

are probably getting carried away looking at in Gurnu. Like

1:01:48

I feel like in Gurnu and maybe yourself and one

1:01:50

or two others are the anomalies. You

1:01:53

have to be a freak athlete to be able to have like,

1:01:56

you know, Connor. Yeah, he actually looked pretty good

1:01:58

against me or other, but still. wasn't

1:02:00

good enough. Tyrone Woodleaf and against Jake

1:02:02

Paul got flattened

1:02:04

eventually. What do you

1:02:06

make of influencer boxing? See

1:02:09

a lot of MMA fighters hate on it and

1:02:12

I just think, you know what? If you make your

1:02:14

money at it and you enjoy it, fucking go

1:02:16

for it man. Like the world's

1:02:18

yours, do whatever you want. Like if these

1:02:21

guys enjoy boxing and obviously they are influencers,

1:02:23

whatever, the YouTubers, Instagrammers, whatever the fucking hell

1:02:25

they do, I'm not familiar with a lot

1:02:27

of them. But I just

1:02:29

think if you like boxing and

1:02:31

you wanna test yourself and you can make money out of it, go and

1:02:34

box. Like why is everyone so hung up on the

1:02:36

fact that, oh these guys don't deserve,

1:02:38

well listen, if the shoe is on the other foot and

1:02:40

you could get millions of pounds for going and fighting someone

1:02:42

and you weren't very good at it, will you do it

1:02:44

or not? Of course you'd do it. So I don't see,

1:02:46

a lot of it comes from jealousy, don't it? Like I

1:02:49

think that your average five and old guy is probably

1:02:51

getting paid a couple of grand for a fight. And

1:02:54

these guys are getting, you know, millions

1:02:57

and they can't box. And

1:02:59

the guys who are five and old getting a couple of grand

1:03:01

are looking at them being like, I wanna be where you are

1:03:03

so I'm just gonna hate on you. And mate,

1:03:06

I just think fair play because it takes bollocks

1:03:08

mates to step in there under any circumstances. One

1:03:10

of your own mates is actually getting into influencer

1:03:13

boxing I think. Who's this, Darren Till? We're still,

1:03:15

oh we love Till, we love Till around here.

1:03:17

I'm excited to see how he gets on. I

1:03:20

think it might be in the company, I

1:03:22

do commentary for Misfits. So that's influencer, is

1:03:24

he definitely doing that? I'm unsure whether he's

1:03:26

doing like normal boxing or influencer boxing. Well,

1:03:29

I don't think he's gonna fight YouTube as. I

1:03:31

think they're gonna put him in there with maybe

1:03:33

a Mike Perry or a level like, a

1:03:35

Tofke, who's a real fighter. I don't think

1:03:38

they're gonna have an easy fight by any

1:03:40

means, but how do you think he

1:03:42

will do in the boxing ring? How do you see that

1:03:44

going? Till's got great hands, man. And Till has got a

1:03:46

bit of a, I

1:03:49

don't know if he's like, a lot of fans have kind

1:03:51

of turned against him a little bit, but I guess that's

1:03:53

the game that you play when you're big and mouthy and

1:03:55

stuff like that. Like that's just kind of stick if you

1:03:57

like, is to do that and sometimes you get on the

1:03:59

wrong. end of it but he's had a bit of

1:04:01

a bad run in the UFC, his body was in

1:04:03

awful shape like his knees were smashed and everything. And

1:04:07

he's got great, Till's got some good hands man,

1:04:09

some good hands and I'm sure that when he, I've not

1:04:11

seen him train for a while, I know he's been out

1:04:13

of the boxing for a couple of years now so I

1:04:15

don't know but even before any of that like he's been

1:04:18

a lifelong Thai boxer, he's been a Thai boxer since he

1:04:20

was like eight, nine years old or something, he's now in

1:04:22

his 30s so the guy can

1:04:24

definitely throw a punch, he can punch hard and I

1:04:26

think he'll do well definitely. And look at his last

1:04:28

fight in the UFC against Dreykus

1:04:31

yeah and he got, oh Till loses

1:04:33

again, he got you a lot of shit for it

1:04:35

and now looking back at it you're like you nearly

1:04:38

had him gone, what was it?

1:04:40

He's good mate, Till's gorgeous. That aged like a

1:04:42

fine wine that fight. I

1:04:44

think a lot of people were harsh on him for

1:04:46

that and now Dreykus is fighting for the title

1:04:49

so like how far away from the top is

1:04:51

Till? I kind of wish he'd stuck at the

1:04:53

UFC and not gone boxing but I guess we'll

1:04:56

find out once he makes the cash if he

1:04:58

wants to come. I look forward to it mate,

1:05:00

I'll tune in and if possible I'll be there

1:05:02

live watching it, I support Till and yeah I

1:05:05

think he'll do just fine mate, I'm sure he'll do

1:05:07

just fine. I want to talk about your dad

1:05:09

a bit because he obviously you've mentioned him a

1:05:12

couple of times and we see in this moment

1:05:14

where you put the belt on him in the

1:05:16

kids, proper heart warming moment but your dad like

1:05:18

yourself is kind of, he's not trying to hog

1:05:21

the limelight, he's very much like okay thanks very

1:05:23

much. What has it been like on

1:05:25

this journey between you and him? Yeah well fucking good

1:05:27

luck getting my dad on an interview or in a

1:05:29

picture because he doesn't like any of that stuff, he

1:05:31

likes it. I mean I don't mind it, he's growing

1:05:33

on me now I guess, I guess I go and

1:05:35

embrace it a bit but he don't want his face

1:05:37

on the camera, he doesn't want to be mentioned, he's not bothered about

1:05:39

any of that kind of stuff mate. My

1:05:42

dad got me into the sport of martial arts, I say

1:05:44

all the time mate, if my dad rung me, if I

1:05:46

come out of this podcast right now my dad rung me

1:05:48

and went Tom, I think you should sack this MMA off

1:05:50

and do something else, I'd go, no worries and I'd retire

1:05:52

right there, that's that, that's that. Well

1:05:54

you trust him so. That's how much my dad

1:05:56

means to me in the sport and in general

1:05:58

as well. Like he

1:06:00

got me into the sport, he's been at

1:06:02

every training session since, all around

1:06:04

the world. He's trained with me.

1:06:06

We've been to loads of top,

1:06:09

top level gyms mate. I always

1:06:11

train with him, you know, I train MMA in

1:06:13

the morning and me and

1:06:15

my dad do technique in the afternoon every day,

1:06:17

every day for 22 years. That

1:06:22

must have been hard for him though because I know he

1:06:24

was a jiu-jitsu expert. But then

1:06:26

he's also having to learn things to then relay

1:06:28

them to you, I'm assuming. Well mate, he's had

1:06:30

boxing fights as a kid, he's done Thai boxing,

1:06:32

he's done the full spectrum of martial arts himself.

1:06:35

So yeah, he's definitely a UK BJJ pioneer. He's

1:06:37

one of the first black belts to come out

1:06:39

of the UK ever, but he's done all martial

1:06:41

arts as well and mate the guy studies like,

1:06:44

studies the game unbelievably. He's got such a good

1:06:46

mind and I'm so blessed to have that guy

1:06:48

because if it wasn't for him I wouldn't have

1:06:51

even made it to the USA. As I

1:06:53

say, every day mate, every single day from

1:06:55

me being 80 years old, we have practiced

1:06:57

technique in my dad's garage up until now

1:06:59

that I'm 30. We still do it, we

1:07:01

still, mate, I'll go and spar in the

1:07:03

morning and then we'll go and break it

1:07:06

down in the afternoon, right? You need to do a bit

1:07:08

more of this, you need to, right, I've seen this video,

1:07:10

this guy's doing this, you need to practice this, put your

1:07:12

foot there, little tweak, mate, little tiny tweaks and mate they'll

1:07:14

be the most boring mundane sessions

1:07:16

anybody's ever seen. Like you can't

1:07:18

do them sessions with 10 guys

1:07:20

and it doesn't work, no one's going to do it, just for me

1:07:22

doing it. He'll have me, stepping

1:07:24

my foot there, stepping across

1:07:26

and turning it like that for 40 minutes,

1:07:30

literally just that and if I turn

1:07:32

it there and I'm a bit off, he'll

1:07:34

make me go back and do it again until I get

1:07:36

it right and that has been mate and a lot of

1:07:38

people don't see this is why I want to mention it

1:07:41

and every

1:07:43

fucking day since I

1:07:45

was 8 years old, we have been

1:07:47

practicing stuff like, right, this hand goes there,

1:07:49

boom, when you punch, you've got to bring

1:07:51

it back, slip off, mate, stuff

1:07:54

like that has been practiced for hours upon

1:07:56

hours upon hours and if I've not got

1:07:58

it right, he'll be the They weren't telling me

1:08:00

to do it again. And if he didn't tell me to do it

1:08:02

again, I wouldn't be doing it again. So, because he doesn't want to

1:08:04

stick his face in the camera. He doesn't want a load of credit

1:08:06

for it or nothing like that, but a lot

1:08:09

of strong part of

1:08:12

why I do martial arts is because of him. It's

1:08:15

just a complete formula for success when you are

1:08:17

willing to go over the Monday and the boring

1:08:19

details every day. But mate, it's only my dad

1:08:21

who could tell me to do it because I

1:08:24

won't be listening to anybody else like that. He

1:08:26

knows you. He knows me. And then he knows when I've

1:08:29

had enough. And we check in all the time. And

1:08:32

yeah, he knows when to push and when not to push.

1:08:34

And that's something that I just can't have with

1:08:36

somebody else really. Have you ever had like, I

1:08:38

don't know, heated moments?

1:08:40

Oh, plenty. Thank you, loads, loads. Absolutely. Anyone

1:08:43

that springs to mind where you were like,

1:08:45

fuck me, that was a born burnout. Because

1:08:47

to get to this level of success, you

1:08:49

have to challenge each other. You have to

1:08:51

be pushing. And like teammates do when football

1:08:53

matches. Yeah, yeah. They scream at each other,

1:08:55

don't they? Like, well, we've had a lot.

1:08:57

I'm up, mate, long fucking long. The

1:09:01

main ones is being like, again, going

1:09:04

back to what we spoke about before, like me being a people

1:09:06

pleaser and stuff. It's mainly like people drag it

1:09:08

right. Come over here and train with me. We'll do a bit of this,

1:09:10

this, and this. And he's like, that's

1:09:12

fucking wrong. What are you doing? Like, before I

1:09:14

was training with Heavyweights, he was on me like,

1:09:17

he'd come to a training session, like an MMA session

1:09:20

that I'd be doing in the morning. There'd be no

1:09:22

Heavyweights there. And he'd be like, Tom, we're

1:09:24

getting the car after. He'd be like, what are you doing

1:09:26

there? He's fucking shite. Why are

1:09:28

you doing it like this? I'd be like, I don't know, that's how

1:09:30

I do it. And then he'd

1:09:32

be like, you need someone to test

1:09:34

you in the gym. Like, you need to, like

1:09:36

he just hit me with a reality check like that,

1:09:38

which is something that a stranger or someone you don't

1:09:40

know as well can't really do. Like,

1:09:42

he'd be like, what are you doing there? He's fucking terrible.

1:09:45

Like, you can't be doing that. You need to be training

1:09:47

with Heavyweights who are gonna put you in your place when

1:09:49

you do stuff like that, which is why we now train

1:09:51

with Heavyweights. Is he the main guy in the corner? Or

1:09:53

do you have, cause he's a man. He's a man. Get

1:09:55

to the corner. Yeah, I don't wanna fucking get to the

1:09:57

corner if I don't have to. Cause we never see you.

1:09:59

You get a pep talk after her first round because it

1:10:02

just doesn't get there. But

1:10:04

yeah, in terms of you just being a family man

1:10:06

as well, you're married. How many kids you got? Three.

1:10:09

Yeah, you got three kids. What are you like with a

1:10:11

husband? What's your relationship like? Great. Great.

1:10:14

She's great. I'm

1:10:16

talking about my dad not liking a limelight. She hates

1:10:19

it even more. Well, I heard stories because it was

1:10:21

very funny because she wasn't there for the fights. Yeah,

1:10:23

she wasn't there. So we have three children. I won't

1:10:26

go into it too much because she gets uncomfortable. So

1:10:29

one of my children has autism. So

1:10:32

to pull that off and get childcare on

1:10:34

like a week's notice and her flycrafts the

1:10:36

world for multiple days is unfeasible.

1:10:40

So yeah, she was asleep. She

1:10:42

was asleep. So I was trying to call her

1:10:44

and stuff, but she was answering. She was asleep because of

1:10:46

the time difference. And I got through to her

1:10:48

and she was happy, of course. And you've

1:10:50

mentioned your child has autism. I've

1:10:53

got family members with autism. I think it

1:10:55

was great that you brought that up because

1:10:57

there isn't enough awareness. You see people bonding

1:10:59

this word about in a negative way, the

1:11:01

lack of understanding. And look, no

1:11:03

one teaches you about autism at school. We just sort

1:11:05

of hear the word and we don't really know what

1:11:07

it means until you actually interact with someone. What

1:11:10

has it been like for you as a dad, educating

1:11:12

yourself, finding out more about it and how have you

1:11:14

cope with it? First

1:11:18

of all, thanks for asking because I

1:11:21

always like to try and take the opportunity

1:11:23

to speak about it publicly when I'm gone.

1:11:25

And it's not something that's very easy for

1:11:27

me to speak about because still my child's

1:11:29

only just turned four. So I'm in the

1:11:31

emphasis of understanding autism. And I don't

1:11:33

want to come out and claim that

1:11:35

I know everything about autism because I don't. I'm

1:11:38

happy to say that I definitely don't. There's

1:11:41

people, there's adults who have grown up with

1:11:44

autism, obviously. There's people now, 60,

1:11:46

70 year old people who are still

1:11:48

caring for the children who are in

1:11:50

the 40s and 50s now who've got autism. So I

1:11:52

can't preach on it too

1:11:54

much. It varies a lot. It varies.

1:11:56

It's massive. The spectrum is massive. The spectrum

1:11:59

is absolutely enormous. But what I

1:12:01

want to try and do with my platform that

1:12:03

I've got is just try and get awareness about

1:12:06

kind of just because a

1:12:08

kid might be messing around and crying in

1:12:10

public and stuff like that. A

1:12:13

lot of the time the parents are just

1:12:15

as uncomfortable as anybody else like me as

1:12:17

a parent, especially before we got the diagnosis.

1:12:20

My kid was acting up in

1:12:22

public and crying and being in uncomfortable situations

1:12:25

that me or you wouldn't be uncomfortable with

1:12:27

but it made him uncomfortable and

1:12:29

we weren't aware of it at the time. It's

1:12:32

not always because the child's naughty or they've got shit

1:12:34

parents the reason why the kid's acting up. Do you

1:12:36

know what I mean? So I just want people to

1:12:38

know about that a little bit more. From

1:12:41

my understanding a lot of the time with kids

1:12:43

it's the frustration that they're not able to express

1:12:45

themselves in a way that other children can. It

1:12:48

comes out in this way. And

1:12:50

other parents may be looking at their child like,

1:12:52

oh, he's misbehaving and looking in a way of,

1:12:54

oh, do you not keep your kid looking at

1:12:56

all? Exactly. That's the lack of awareness that

1:12:58

you're mentioning there. Well, a few times I'd be

1:13:01

taking my kid in public and it's just

1:13:03

small stuff like they can't explain to you,

1:13:05

especially a three year old kid, that

1:13:07

they want a specific toy in a

1:13:10

supermarket and they can't understand that they can't pick that toy

1:13:12

up and take it home with them. And

1:13:14

you can't explain it to you. You try. You

1:13:16

try. And there's been a lot

1:13:18

of heartbreaks, screaming, crying, partying, all

1:13:20

the rest of it. And

1:13:23

there's been a few times I've had that situation in

1:13:25

the supermarket and some woman, some

1:13:27

women have walked past me and, you know, give me

1:13:29

a dirty look and a couple of comments here and there like,

1:13:33

it'd be easier if his mum was here and

1:13:35

it's like, no, it's fucking not about that. It's

1:13:37

about the fact that, you know, it's just, it's

1:13:39

just hard mate. And I just want to raise

1:13:41

as much autism awareness as I can. And there's

1:13:43

a couple of posts about Instagram and

1:13:45

I'm not trying to drop anyone in here, I've

1:13:48

got so many messages of

1:13:50

people in the public eye who have

1:13:52

got autistic children who I had no

1:13:55

idea that they had autistic children. And

1:13:57

I just wish people in the public eye would talk about it a lot.

1:14:00

bit more because I actually, the whole

1:14:02

reason I got my son diagnosed was because of

1:14:04

Pani McGuinness actually. So I watched his documentary

1:14:06

on autism, he has three autistic children and

1:14:09

it was, I looked at some

1:14:12

of them, I was like, that sounds quite familiar.

1:14:14

A lot of the stuff that, a lot of the symptoms

1:14:16

that he's going through and coincidentally

1:14:18

I met him and

1:14:20

he was on a question of sport, he was

1:14:22

the host on it and I asked him about it and

1:14:24

he said, mate, get a diagnosis

1:14:27

as quick as you can. That's the main

1:14:29

thing to do and I said, we're trying

1:14:31

to get a diagnosis, but we're on the

1:14:33

NHS. Luckily, I'm in a financial position where

1:14:35

I could pay privately, but mate, the waiting

1:14:37

list now to get a diagnosis is fucking

1:14:39

massive, like two, three years to even get

1:14:41

your kid looked at. It's horrendous because my

1:14:43

mum works in a school mate and there's

1:14:45

more and more autistic people and more and

1:14:47

more ADHD kids and all that kind of

1:14:49

stuff coming through each year and it's just

1:14:51

massive now. It's so big to get a

1:14:53

diagnosis and the thing is, mate, when you

1:14:56

get a diagnosis, when you can get help.

1:14:59

So, because as you said, the spectrum

1:15:01

is massive, mate. It can be something

1:15:03

that's, it can go from someone not

1:15:06

being able to explain the feelings properly to

1:15:08

somebody not being able to walk and

1:15:10

talk ever. So it's massive. It's absolutely

1:15:12

massive and I just

1:15:15

want to get as much help

1:15:17

and the word out there as

1:15:19

possible on autism. Yeah. The heartbreaking

1:15:21

thing from my understanding as well

1:15:23

is what you've just perfectly said

1:15:25

is the lack of the lack

1:15:27

of ability right now in public health

1:15:29

council and all of that to actually

1:15:31

take care of these kids. Meanwhile, we're

1:15:33

sending trillions to other countries who are

1:15:35

in war and all these problems and

1:15:38

yet we've got waiting lists like this

1:15:40

for our own children. It's a disgrace

1:15:42

and it's nowhere near good

1:15:44

enough really for what they deserve,

1:15:47

but like well done mate. I

1:15:49

really love what you're doing and I think

1:15:52

they've obviously got their symbol. There's like this

1:15:54

jigsaw piece that is the symbol of autism

1:15:56

and it's just great that more people are posting about

1:15:58

this and more people are talking about and the heavyweight

1:16:00

champion of the world is a big thank you

1:16:02

mate thank you and I'm not I'm I don't

1:16:04

I'm always pretty sensitive of kind

1:16:06

of what I put out on what I say and I don't

1:16:09

want to say the wrong thing because I'm really new to it

1:16:11

I'm super new to it like we've had the diagnosis just over

1:16:13

a year my kid is obviously

1:16:15

really really young at this point and I don't know

1:16:17

a lot of the questions that are getting thrown my

1:16:19

way and I don't feel educated enough on the subject

1:16:21

to speak about it a lot of the time

1:16:23

but all I want to get out there is that there's

1:16:26

all cystic people out there and just please don't

1:16:28

be so quick to judge when a child is

1:16:30

misbehaving that's it that's all I can offer right

1:16:32

now but hopefully as the years go on I'll

1:16:35

get more more stuff out there that brings

1:16:37

us on to the final question I ask

1:16:40

you bro how would you like to be

1:16:42

remembered oh that's

1:16:44

a great question you know I'm not the kind of guy

1:16:46

the guy kind of guy who

1:16:48

likes to think too much in the future I try

1:16:50

not to I try and live in the moment as

1:16:53

much as I can that

1:16:55

being said I want

1:16:58

to be the guy who was

1:17:01

one known

1:17:03

as a fan favorite I think that's really

1:17:06

important someone that put an exciting fights because

1:17:08

ultimately that's what this sports about

1:17:10

that's why I watch it because it's exciting and I

1:17:12

want I want people to look

1:17:14

at it and not be like I'm gonna watch him

1:17:16

because I want to watch him lose oh he's been

1:17:18

he's been saying this in the press conference and he's

1:17:20

been saying don't interest in me I want people to

1:17:22

watch and go fucking hell there's gonna

1:17:24

be some masterclass on here like someone's gonna get

1:17:27

knocked out and I want to tune in for

1:17:29

it that's why I want people to watch for

1:17:31

a martial arts perspective so that first of

1:17:33

all and I want to go down as

1:17:35

the best heavyweight ever well

1:17:38

mate as long as you don't run from challenges

1:17:40

like some champions that we know yeah I'm pretty

1:17:42

sure that will happen yep that

1:17:44

was Tom Aspinall on the true Jordy podcast

1:17:47

big love big thanks and I'll

1:17:49

see you on the next one Cheers Thank

1:18:00

you.