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your first purchase of a website or domain. Since

0:38

the beginning of the war in Gaza, Yousuf Hamash

0:40

has been a master of good timing and good

0:42

luck. We did a story about him

0:44

a few months ago, and we remind you for a minute

0:47

who he is, and how capably he got his

0:49

family from place to place. Hamash

0:51

attacked Israel on October 7th. Yousuf

0:53

let his home on October 8th because

0:56

he was afraid that Jabalya where he was from was going to

0:58

be bombed. And the

1:00

next day, October 9th, Jabalya

1:02

was bombed. As

1:05

the war moved, he moved a second time down

1:07

south to a city called Khan Yunis. Then

1:09

Israel dropped leaflets from the sky telling

1:11

everybody to evacuate Khan Yunis immediately, get

1:13

safety for their self in Rafa. Yousuf

1:16

packed up the car that day, his wife

1:19

Manal, his kids, his mom, and

1:21

made his third move. And this

1:23

is around the time that he started having conversations with one

1:25

of our producers here, Khan Jaffee Walt. He

1:27

told Khan that he knew his sisters who were

1:30

in Khan Yunis needed also to go to Rafa.

1:33

And he kept wheeling, arguing, pleading,

1:35

making promises, wearing them down. And

1:37

they still did not move until

1:40

an airstrike hit the building next to

1:42

them. Terrifying, right? Yousuf

1:45

raced to where they were. And as soon as

1:47

they saw each other, Yousuf and his sisters shared

1:50

their relief by being exactly how they always are

1:52

with each other. The first thing I

1:54

said today when I met them, there is no

1:56

discussion. We are leaving. So you didn't

1:58

like hug them and cry? and

2:00

say I'm so glad you survived

2:03

you said. No, we have

2:05

a different type of

2:07

relation. It's not about tagging.

2:09

I was laughing. You should have died. I said

2:12

me and the morgue now. This

2:16

is how I'm with my sisters. And

2:19

did they laugh? What did they say? And

2:21

Hadid was like, you know, actually

2:23

they would start to give me orders quickly.

2:26

You need to talk to our cousin because

2:28

he was supposed to invite him. Also

2:31

go to our uncle Iman because they wanted

2:33

to. Finally took his sisters to safety in

2:35

Rafa in a tent camp

2:37

that he built for them. This is back

2:39

in December. Every time Yousa's tent camp of

2:41

extended family in Rafa grew to 60 people

2:44

with the use of managing

2:46

it as mayor, repairman, caterer,

2:48

driver, healthcare provider. And then

2:50

on the same day Yousa's sister, Neil had

2:52

a baby bringing the population of the

2:54

tent camp to 61. The

2:57

prime minister of Israel announced he was

2:59

planning to evacuate Rafa and

3:01

invade the city where Yousa's family

3:03

and over a million other Palestinians

3:05

were living. Yousa was facing moving everybody

3:07

for a fourth time. And

3:10

he's always been the one who's made this call for

3:12

his family. Yousa's the one who decides it's

3:14

too dangerous to stay where we are. And this is

3:16

when we have to go. It has to be now.

3:18

And this is where we're going next. But

3:21

this time Yousa didn't know where to go

3:23

next. Keep everybody safe and

3:25

together. They're going as far south as you can go

3:28

in Gaza. There really might not be another place

3:30

to run to. He told Rana

3:32

back then. It's I, I, I should

3:34

be honest. I don't want to think about that because I

3:36

know there's no solution. And unfortunately

3:38

this time I'm completely useless because

3:40

I ran out of options. So

3:44

what I'm going to do. I

3:46

have never heard you talk like that

3:48

Yousa. I've never heard you

3:50

say that. You're always the guy that's like, yeah,

3:52

I'll figure it out. I'll call so and so

3:55

tomorrow. Or no, we don't have it right now,

3:57

but I don't have the option.

4:00

land of me when I have options and

4:02

start to think deeply about it, but up

4:04

to now I'm completely useless. But

4:07

there was one other option. There's just

4:09

one that Yousif had never seriously considered. They

4:12

could try to leave Gaza. Which

4:14

might seem like an obvious choice to anybody who would

4:16

want to do. If we leave the place where bombs

4:19

are falling and it's getting harder and harder to find

4:21

food and drinkable water. But it's

4:23

not an obvious choice. For Yousif and

4:25

for lots of people. As you're here.

4:29

Today what happens when Yousif gets

4:31

pressed into a fourth move. One that he has

4:33

deeply mixed feelings about. And is not

4:36

even sure he can pull off. And that's

4:38

to try to get his family out. As quickly

4:40

as possible. Before Israel invades the city

4:42

where they're living. Time

4:45

he knew was not on his side. And

4:48

if you think you can imagine what that entails. Let me tell you. You

4:50

really do not know the half of it. You're

4:53

about to witness feats of ingenuity, strokes of

4:55

luck, and big piles of cash. On

4:58

a deadline against enormous odds.

5:00

And also you'll

5:02

see how hard it is on this family to make

5:04

this decision. How even trying

5:07

to go pares them up. Tares

5:09

Yousif up. From

5:11

WBEZ Chicago to American Life I'm out

5:13

of glass. And

5:15

with that I'll turn things over to Khanna. Yousif

5:19

did not want to leave Gaza. Where

5:21

he's from. A place where

5:23

he knows everyone. Knows every system.

5:25

Has connections everywhere. His

5:27

job is doing humanitarian work in Gaza.

5:30

For Gazans. And his entire family is

5:32

in Gaza. A core

5:34

part of Yousif's identity is that he takes

5:36

care of the family. So

5:38

Yousif had no plan to leave. Did not even

5:41

want to think about leaving Gaza. And

5:44

then one day in February he found

5:46

out he might leave Gaza. He

5:49

was in the car with his wife Manal and their

5:51

kids. I was going

5:53

with Manal to her parents. We were

5:55

visiting her parents. My

6:00

daughter, Ilya, five

6:02

years old, Ilya, telling me that we

6:04

are going to travel to Egypt. That

6:07

meant to you they're talking about it during

6:10

the day and she's overhearing it? Yes.

6:13

So I understood that when my daughter came to ask me,

6:15

it means that they reach the limits on how much they

6:17

want to do it. Yousif

6:19

did not realize that a conversation

6:21

had started among the women in

6:23

his family. There wasn't so

6:26

much happening behind his back as just

6:28

away from him in the

6:30

places he wasn't. Hi,

6:34

Manal. Hi. Manal,

6:36

I've heard so much about you. Me

6:40

too, my dear. I've heard a lot about you. Manal

6:44

says Yousif had told her and his

6:46

mother he didn't want to leave,

6:48

but if they ever wanted to leave Gaza, he

6:51

would make it happen. And

6:53

Manal and his mom said no, they're

6:55

whole families in Gaza. We

6:57

felt it was wrong to travel and leave them behind. And

7:04

Manal knew, like everyone thinking about leaving

7:06

Gaza knows, if she

7:08

left, there was a good possibility she'd

7:10

never come back. So

7:13

no, she said she didn't want to leave and she meant

7:16

it. But

7:18

then Manal thought, maybe? The

7:22

idea stuck to her. She

7:24

thought of it when her children screamed through bombing. Or

7:28

when they begged for chicken instead of more

7:30

canned food. When she noticed

7:32

Ilya had forgotten all of her alphabet. And

7:36

she thought of it when she spent the entire day looking

7:39

for wood to boil water so her kids could

7:41

drink. She

7:43

worried. What if they ran

7:45

out of time? What if the Israelis showed up

7:47

before Yousif had another plan? Then

7:51

Manal mentioned all of this to

7:54

one of Yousif's sisters, Asil. Asil

7:57

is the sister who is most like Yousif. Decisive.

8:01

A problem solver. A planners

8:03

on them as often as of it

8:05

and I see and I went to

8:07

his views as she was the first

8:09

thing close me she said lead the

8:11

children live a good life go least

8:13

he encouraged me. Honestly a seal is

8:15

the closest to me because has been

8:17

my sense since childhood. I consider her

8:19

like a sister my favorite. Send in

8:21

the bus and they have that has

8:24

encouraged me to do it. That was

8:26

very good sir me because she knew

8:28

what my insists were and told me

8:30

my best insists was in live in

8:32

Gaza. A thought we

8:34

should hard in our hearts are best and

8:36

nice for the sake of our children. Hello

8:38

Less Than A says i love of a

8:41

this eagles less way that will have lost

8:43

on the upon. The.

8:45

Process of considering leaving Gaza

8:47

in this war is not

8:49

as one of weighing options.

8:51

One a them after another

8:53

is also getting people's blessings.

8:55

It's a series of permission.

8:59

To see on, give her blessing.

9:01

Eventually the other sisters did pew

9:03

knowing that they were not and

9:06

ago couldn't though they had their

9:08

own extended families and lives in

9:10

Gaza. Use of

9:12

Mom After some persuading, agreed to go

9:14

with minimal and use up and the

9:17

kids. So it

9:19

was decided. Manal pulled her

9:21

kids. They were going. And

9:23

for hurt, that was the happiest moment. The

9:25

release of being able to say to her kids.

9:28

This. Will end for you. They.

9:30

Were excited. So. Excited that

9:32

you! Yeah! the five year old ended up breaking

9:35

the news to her dad in the car or

9:37

form and now even had a chance to tell

9:39

him. So. You're

9:41

thinking about leaving when

9:44

soon? And

9:46

that sounds. First.

9:49

Of all, it's very, very

9:51

expensive their expenses. It's

9:53

very long process. Unclear

9:56

processor city middle of it as a lot

9:58

of playing he had and. I try

10:01

not to ignore it,

10:03

postpone it. Unfortunately,

10:06

when I think about the decision itself, I

10:10

get lost quickly because there is

10:12

loads of details behind that decision.

10:17

It's really difficult. But making

10:20

that decision is not getting

10:22

alone with my personality. It's

10:26

not getting along with your personality? Yes,

10:28

160 days of war. And

10:31

that wasn't enough to

10:33

raise the idea in my head that

10:35

I should leave Gaza, leaving

10:38

now. It's

10:42

kind of I'm

10:45

escaping my responsibility towards my

10:47

sisters, my responsibility towards my

10:49

job, my responsibility towards my

10:52

friends who I'm supporting. But

10:55

I'm standing ahead my

10:57

responsibility towards my children.

11:00

It's very, very, I

11:02

don't know, it's a

11:05

very difficult decision if you put these

11:07

two responsibilities in

11:10

front of you and you have to choose. This

11:13

was March. Israel continued

11:16

to say, our plan is to

11:18

invade Rafah. Yousif

11:20

knew if they did invade, they might close

11:22

the border. There was limited time to

11:24

act. He agreed it was the

11:27

right choice for his children. And

11:29

yet, everything about

11:31

how this move was happening was

11:33

different, slower than I'd seen

11:36

Yousif act through the entire war. Not

11:39

that he was stalling. He'd made

11:41

some calls. He was going through the steps. But

11:44

old Yousif would have made 1,000 calls, checking

11:47

all the angles, calling in favors,

11:49

urgently reading everything available about what

11:51

Israel might do next and when.

11:55

And now, this Yousif Did

11:57

not sound like a person who knows. It

12:00

may only be a small window. To make

12:02

your next move. And it's easy to

12:04

be too late. But.

12:06

For me to be honest. I.

12:08

Am lusts thinking about

12:10

it deeply. And

12:13

I'm very sorry and I know it's

12:15

a wrong way. but for me, the

12:17

only thing that I can do is

12:20

to keep avoiding thinking about it until

12:22

it became more closer to him. I

12:26

would do it I starting the process and

12:28

all of their that I add it's it's

12:30

very long process. But. A

12:32

complicated process. He.

12:34

Says couldn't talk about the process, how

12:36

they get out on the record. He.

12:39

Worried justifiably that any public statement

12:42

could jeopardize their chances of getting

12:44

yeah, When. He could

12:46

say was that he had paid to

12:48

register his family to leave. And.

12:51

That at some point to families names would

12:53

appear on a list of people allowed to

12:55

cross the wrath of Border. That

12:57

when that would happen. Unclear.

13:01

Another week past. Than another.

13:04

Those. Blow things Manal had collected from

13:07

everyone in the family. They. Meant

13:09

it but the longer this we went

13:11

on the blessings got. A little worn,

13:14

He. Says started seeing it when he

13:16

checked in on his sister's one of

13:18

the incidents happen we had an issue

13:21

with when my sister that one of

13:23

my sister and her husband than what

13:25

I went there I have to any

13:28

sort the issue there as. I

13:31

found out that my sisters were complaining

13:33

know so easily thing is leaving us

13:35

he was in this is crystal census

13:37

data plan they were a bit annoyed

13:39

so i like okay met you were

13:42

pushing for that a know you are

13:44

objecting that then I found as it's

13:46

a moment that they would anglia of

13:48

their then it's fine to ah I

13:51

know how this is about it and

13:53

they nor the as kids and then

13:55

i've been with of the right to

13:57

be scared it's does seem may guilty.

14:00

Makes me feel guilty but I am

14:02

already guilty from an African and fire

14:04

in the area even though the Lcs

14:06

or maybe feel guilty. He.

14:08

Was not doing his job keeping them

14:11

safe and together. But.

14:13

While he waited. Use. Of really

14:15

did try on the safety frank. He

14:18

threw himself and to making sir his sisters

14:20

would be okay without him there. You.

14:22

Mind up a million backups. A

14:25

guy with a car in case they needed to leave

14:27

quickly. A guy to help with broken

14:29

songs. With internet problems he told friends

14:31

I'm gonna. Be calling on you. You need to

14:33

look out for my sister. He. Set

14:35

up a contact and a currency sap so he

14:37

could send money from Egypt. And

14:40

he stashed emergency cash with several

14:42

different people he trusted. Does.

14:44

It have a lot of things have to

14:46

be put in place and to be designated

14:49

for someone because I found out that I

14:51

was going of upsets. You

14:53

You have definitely been doing a lot of

14:56

things. I would think you would need at

14:58

least a dozen people to do all the

15:00

jobs you've been doing. A. Leaves.

15:03

Or hundred people would never do the

15:05

job. Would. Love. And

15:07

person as I was doing it

15:09

it's was always. Have to

15:12

give me energy always when I

15:14

am manages things for them. That's.

15:17

The difference between need doing that

15:19

job and hundred people doing the

15:21

job. President

15:25

Biden was warning as route not

15:27

to invade Rafa. Twenty

15:30

Six you country is issued a

15:32

statement saying an invasion of Russia.

15:34

Would. Be catastrophic. Yousef.

15:36

Continued to. we continue to

15:39

be bombings, drones, gunfire all

15:41

the time. But

15:43

also something new. That

15:45

use of noticed happening around him and

15:47

rafat at the families. Tent camp. A.

15:50

Slow motion collapse.

15:54

Everyday use of would notice a

15:56

new deterioration of just. Daily

15:58

Life. There was

16:00

no trash pickup, no police

16:02

or services, nobody regulating traffic

16:04

or businesses. There was no

16:07

governance. One day he'd

16:09

get a call that someone's mother-in-law used the

16:11

shower when it wasn't her family's day, and

16:13

by the time Yusef arrived, the conflict

16:16

had exploded. Or another day.

16:22

So my brother-in-law had a

16:24

fight with a neighborhood,

16:27

one of the neighbors, and

16:29

my two brothers-in-law beating that

16:31

guy and insulting

16:34

him in a bad way. And

16:36

it happens that he's a friend of mine, and that

16:41

was difficult. They had to interfere in

16:43

between both of them, apologizing here and

16:45

there, trying to find a way to

16:47

be mediated with them. What did they

16:49

fight about? Small

16:53

children had a fight, they went to speak

16:55

with him, they didn't like the way he

16:57

responded. It

16:59

resulted in any

17:02

clashes by hand. Today

17:04

I have another one with one of

17:06

the other brother-in-law Ahmad, who would be

17:09

another neighbor for

17:11

another stupid reason. The

17:14

circumstances and what we are going

17:16

through is pushing us to become

17:19

unstable mentally. So everyone's

17:22

under huge pressure from the amount of

17:25

responsibilities that you have to do

17:27

or just to move from

17:29

a place to the other, just trying to

17:32

keep cash from

17:35

a bad incarnation. Everything

17:39

is very dramatic. The

17:42

more of this Yousafzai, the more

17:44

he settled into the decision to go. Now

17:47

it's really common we see people with

17:49

guns, a lot of

17:51

disputes between families, a lot of killing

17:54

crimes, looting. And

17:59

that's a big thing. affecting the entire society

18:01

itself. People are fighting for no

18:03

reasons now. A

18:06

few days ago, we had water trucking. They

18:13

had a lot of humanitarian organization

18:15

have provide water trucking. They send

18:18

drinkable water by trucks to these

18:20

areas. We

18:22

had a small dispute on the

18:24

line where people put

18:26

their jerry cans in line. Small

18:29

dispute have resulted

18:32

seven people killed the

18:34

enemy's ass as simple as that.

18:37

What happened? I

18:40

wasn't there, but I was hearing the shooting. It's

18:42

next to us now, actually. It's

18:46

like 100 meter away and, you

18:48

know, lots of ambulances and what

18:52

turned that fight is just

18:54

a small line in front of drinking water.

18:57

So that's one

18:59

of the things that pushing me to, you

19:03

know, I have to rescue my children from

19:05

that. But Yousif,

19:07

you've seen Israeli

19:09

bombs destroy homes. You've

19:12

seen much more

19:14

dramatic than that. Why did that

19:16

get to you? That's

19:22

a good question. It

19:24

feels different when you look to it

19:26

as your own people. Then, you

19:29

know, I don't justify for the Israelis what

19:32

they are doing and what they are committing

19:36

in Gaza. But when all the aggression that

19:38

they are doing gets a bit different with

19:40

the way you see it, when you see

19:42

it among your own people. But

19:46

societies can easily be rejoined

19:49

and destroyed like ours.

19:51

The fight is destroyed now. Seven

20:02

weeks after Israel announced plans to

20:04

invade Rafa, Yousaf and Manal were

20:06

still waiting. Every

20:08

night they would check a telegram channel

20:11

called the Landport Rafa Crossing. Around

20:14

10pm it would post screenshots of

20:16

a printed list of names. You'd

20:19

have to zoom in on the photo, and if

20:21

your name was on that list, you knew to

20:23

show up at the Rafa Crossing the next day.

20:27

You'd been granted permission to cross. 300,

20:29

sometimes 400 people a day. Yousaf

20:33

and Manal's names were never listed. But

20:37

Yousaf started seeing the names of

20:39

people he knew had registered not long

20:41

before him, showing up on the list. By

20:44

the end of March, he told me, it must

20:47

be close. How

20:49

are you feeling? It's

20:52

happening and so I

20:56

feel excited for that. You feel

20:58

excited? Yeah, kind of. I'm

21:00

afraid and excited at the same time,

21:02

so I'm going for nowhere. I

21:05

am abandoning a lot

21:07

of things here in Gaza.

21:09

My social status, my value,

21:12

my job, my career. So,

21:17

it's a new journey and unfortunately until

21:19

now I don't have any horizon

21:22

where I'm going, what's the plan?

21:26

I'm surprised to hear you say you're

21:29

excited. And excited in a weird

21:31

way, okay. I want it to happen and

21:33

it's like when you are going to get

21:35

a needle or you are, but

21:38

there is a pain that you go through it

21:41

and I just want to do it with Halas. Like

21:43

when you're getting a shot and you just

21:46

want it to be over. Yeah, exactly.

21:50

So that's not really excited. That's

21:52

like dread. I don't know. That

21:55

sounds more like... I'm

21:58

making up my language. It

22:00

sounds more like dread to

22:02

me than excitement. Nervous,

22:06

nervous maybe. It's

22:09

kind of, I just want to do it with

22:11

halosene. Before I did

22:13

the registration, I was like, okay with it,

22:15

I didn't think about it a lot. But

22:19

since I registered, it

22:21

became like a pain, that's like I just want to finish

22:23

it. I

22:25

just want to be on the other side already

22:27

of whatever is going to happen. Exactly.

22:39

What is this? This weight to be

22:41

placed on a list? What is this?

22:44

And you have to pay to get on the list? Why?

22:48

There were at the time over a million people

22:50

living in a city that was about to be

22:52

invaded. There was one way

22:55

out of Gaza. I

22:57

wanted to understand what was this full

22:59

peak process that Yousif was waiting on

23:02

and could barely talk about. How

23:11

to do if you want. Coming up,

23:13

the actual price to get somebody out of

23:16

Gaza. And yes, they're going to

23:18

want that in cash. No wire

23:20

transfer, no credit card, no bubble payment.

23:22

Good old-fashioned cash only. That's

23:24

in a minute. I'm just going to go up a radio when

23:26

our program continues. Define

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24:38

Julie turquoise I'm a reporter at the New York

24:40

Times to understand changes

24:42

in migration. I traveled to the

24:45

Darien Gap Thousands have been risking their

24:47

lives to pass through the border of

24:49

Columbia and Panama in the hopes of

24:51

making it to the United States We interviewed

24:53

hundreds of people to try and grasp what's

24:56

making them go to these lengths New

24:58

York Times journalists spend the time in

25:00

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25:02

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kind of journalism by subscribing to the

25:06

New York Times This

25:10

American life from Iraq last today's show We're

25:12

returning to use a famosh and his family

25:14

and Maffa who've been caught up in this war

25:16

that began October 7th when Hamas crossed

25:18

into Israel killed nearly 1200 Israelis

25:20

and took over 240 hostages and

25:23

has dragged on for nearly nine months now over

25:25

37,000 Palestinians and over 1,500

25:28

Israelis dead and people like

25:30

Yousif and his sisters trapped in the

25:32

middle of the fighting And back

25:34

in February when you've decided to try

25:36

to leave Gaza leave others behind There's

25:39

not getting everybody on board handing

25:41

off responsibilities But also

25:43

it was just literally hard to leave. It

25:46

was hard to get out Yousif

25:48

was cautious when it came to talking about this part

25:50

of the process. So Hannah started asking

25:52

around How exactly does

25:54

it work? How did a person

25:56

get out of Gaza with a clock ticking?

25:59

Everybody wondering when and if Israel was really going

26:01

to do what it announced it was going to do

26:04

and actually invade Rafa. What

26:06

procedure do you go through? Who do you call?

26:08

What form do you fill out to leave Gaza?

26:11

Here's Hannah. You know

26:13

it's not a clean, defensible operation when

26:16

nobody who touches it will talk about

26:18

it. I spoke

26:20

with Palestinians who went through the Rafa

26:22

crossing or were trying to. People who've

26:24

reported on the system. People who

26:26

work inside it. Almost

26:28

everybody didn't want to talk publicly.

26:31

They all worried about pissing off the

26:34

wrong people in the Egyptian military and

26:36

intelligence. The

26:38

first detailed document I read about how

26:40

the Rafa crossing works was

26:42

an investigation by a group of reporters at

26:44

a site called the Organized Crime

26:46

Corruption and Reporting Project. And

26:49

even they, the people who authored

26:51

the report, did not want to be

26:54

named. You can just say

26:56

that I'm one of the OCCRP reporters

26:58

who worked on this investigation. There

27:02

were several reporters working inside and

27:04

outside Gaza. I'm going to

27:06

call this one Naya. Naya

27:09

explained, after October

27:11

7th when Hamas attacked Israel, officially

27:13

Palestinians in Gaza with no other

27:16

passport were not allowed to leave

27:18

through the Rafa border. Israel

27:20

closed every other exit point. But

27:23

pretty soon these ads started popping up

27:25

online, offering to get people out. They

27:28

were for brokers, people calling themselves

27:31

travel agents or travel coordinators. Naya

27:34

pulled up a couple of the ads while we were talking.

27:37

Travel in luxury. Your

27:39

dignity and pride intact. And

27:41

really I mean it's like they're so

27:43

creepy and tacky at the same time. I mean,

27:47

wait, let me see if I can find it. It

27:52

was very funny. Okay,

27:54

there's one called the

27:57

King's Coordinations. It

27:59

says the strongest coordination

28:02

on the level of

28:04

Gaza. And then it says

28:07

easy and guaranteed. And

28:10

it has a photo of the Sphinx and

28:12

then a plane over

28:14

that Sphinx and then a guy

28:16

looking very modern, wearing a

28:18

rucksack on his back and orange

28:20

jeans. It looks so funny.

28:24

Why is that so funny to you? Because

28:27

I mean, the country is, Gaza

28:31

is a place of death and destruction and

28:34

the Sphinx is next to him and the plane flies

28:37

over the Sphinx. Like he's going

28:39

to see the pyramids with his camera around

28:41

his neck. It's nothing to do with the

28:43

reality. Every

28:51

war has its own manic economy.

28:54

These travel coordinators were sometimes charging

28:56

$2,500 per

28:59

person, sometimes 5,000, depended

29:02

who you asked and when. You

29:05

could send the money from your phone or

29:07

hand it to a coordinator in Gaza. As

29:10

Beth Nia and the other OCCRP reporters

29:12

could find out, a lot of the

29:14

money seemed to go to Egyptian intelligence,

29:18

although Egypt has publicly denied this.

29:21

And the price rose over time. A

29:23

few months after the war started, we called

29:25

one of the brokers ourselves and asked what

29:28

exactly is the price now? And

29:30

he said, sometimes it's 7,000, 10 or 12, $12,000

29:35

per person, an astounding number. Before

29:41

the war started, the average person in Gaza made $3,700

29:43

a year. It

29:46

was very difficult for Palestinians trying to leave

29:48

to tell who was legit or at a

29:50

price shop. People gave their

29:52

money to brokers who disappeared. It

29:54

was the wild west. And

29:57

then the entire system changed.

30:01

Egypt controls the Rafa crossing. Here

30:04

are some things Egypt did not want. Egypt

30:07

did not want Israel pushing Palestinians

30:10

from Gaza into Egypt. It

30:12

didn't want a refugee crisis. It didn't

30:14

want Hamas getting a foothold in Egypt. Egypt

30:17

also didn't want to look like it

30:19

was supporting the displacement of Palestinians by

30:21

facilitating their exit out of Gaza. And

30:24

last, Egypt definitely did not want to

30:26

look like it was collaborating in a

30:28

black market to charge Palestinians tens of

30:30

thousands of dollars to save their lives.

30:34

By the beginning of this year, it did

30:36

look like that. By

30:38

February and March, there were reports that

30:40

the main company offering travel coordination at

30:43

the Rafa border was making a million

30:45

dollars a day off Palestinians. The

30:48

manic economy was reined in.

30:51

New rules. No more

30:53

hiring brokers in Gaza to help you register

30:55

to leave. No more paying by phone. No more

30:57

free for all bribes at the border. There

31:00

would only be one company allowed to

31:02

register people to leave Gaza. An

31:05

Egyptian company called Hala with close

31:07

ties to the Egyptian military and

31:09

security services. And

31:11

now, if you wanted to register, you

31:13

needed to send someone to the Hala

31:16

offices in Cairo, in person,

31:18

and not just anyone, a first degree

31:21

relative. And you need

31:23

to pay in cash. $5,000 for an adult,

31:25

$2,500 for a kid. American dollars only. It's

31:31

like a dare. How could anyone in

31:34

Gaza pull this off? This

31:36

new system for getting out of Gaza

31:38

kicked in just as Israel announced its

31:41

plans for an offensive in Rafa. Just

31:44

as Manal told Yousuf, she was ready

31:46

to leave. A

31:48

new, much more rigid system that made

31:50

it much, much harder to get out.

31:54

Yousuf couldn't talk about how he raised that

31:56

much money in dollars and got it to

31:58

the Hala office in Cairo. and how

32:00

he did it fast enough to register to get on

32:02

the list in order to maybe make

32:04

it out in time. Most

32:07

Palestinians in Gaza didn't want to talk about any

32:09

of that either. So I reached

32:11

a Palestinian outside of Gaza on the West

32:13

Bank. Okay, so

32:16

first we set up the GoFundMe page and that

32:18

was a whole thing,

32:20

an ordeal of itself. I

32:23

knew the system was outrageous, but

32:25

I didn't know no until

32:27

I talked to Boushara. Boushara

32:29

Khaledi lives in the West Bank

32:32

in Ramallah. She's Palestinian. Her

32:34

husband's family is from Gaza and

32:36

Boushara wanted to help them get out. Seven

32:38

people, $30,000, which

32:41

she didn't have and had to fundraise. So

32:44

I couldn't say in my GoFundMe

32:46

page that I lived in Palestine

32:48

because Palestinians are not allowed to

32:50

receive any funds from GoFundMe.

32:54

And they actually emailed me and said, because

32:56

you're in a risky area, blah, blah, blah, you

32:58

cannot, you know. And then I

33:00

had a co-sponsor with me from the

33:02

US. Eventually I found somebody. It's

33:06

a long story. Short version,

33:08

she needed someone else to help her set up

33:10

the GoFundMe page. And the way

33:12

she found that person, her brother-in-law is

33:14

in a band that tours and knew someone in

33:17

the US who could help them set up the

33:19

page. Pretty quickly, talking

33:21

to Boushara, I got a picture that this is

33:23

the kind of person you need on your team

33:25

if your family has any chance of getting out.

33:28

Boushara is a lawyer. She speaks

33:31

perfect English. She works for a

33:33

global NGO, Oxfam. She's used to

33:35

navigating bureaucracies in multiple languages. She

33:38

has connections in countries all over the world.

33:41

To navigate this complex process,

33:43

you need someone who can make things

33:45

happen. You need a Boushara or

33:48

a Yousif. Apparently you also

33:50

need to know someone who's in a band. That

33:53

was the first hurdle. And then it

33:55

was a hurdle to write the story.

33:58

Every time you wrote the story, it has to be very... by

34:00

GoFundMe and then they would allow it or not. So

34:02

they weren't allowing it me mentioning that I lived in

34:04

Palestine, so we had to change the story, but we

34:07

didn't want to lie, you know what I mean? Like,

34:09

so we had to then change the story, say that

34:11

I kind of lived between Europe and Palestine

34:13

and kind of traveled for worth. I do

34:15

travel a lot. It had to be,

34:18

we had to write the story in terms of she

34:20

was fundraising on behalf of me that

34:23

lived in Europe, who was going

34:25

to help my family in Gaza. The

34:27

GoFundMe worked, but it wasn't enough. They

34:30

raised $20,000. They needed

34:33

30 for the Halafis. Bushra

34:35

and her husband were already sending

34:37

money constantly into Gaza, money

34:40

to pay for $200 bags of

34:42

flour for transportation every time the

34:44

family had to move five

34:46

times. Bushra knew if

34:48

the family made it to Cairo, they wouldn't be

34:50

allowed to work. So they'd need help paying for

34:52

housing and food there too. So actually

34:55

Bushra realized they needed $50,000. So

34:59

we took a loan out of 20K and

35:01

then put, our savings 20K. Okay.

35:04

Yeah. All our

35:06

life savings. How did you guys

35:08

make that decision? Or was that an obvious choice?

35:11

That also was what delayed the process

35:13

is like, we're currently like, we bought

35:15

a house a year ago, we're

35:18

like finishing it. So I mean, it's just

35:20

been, it's been a huge

35:23

financial strain. I talked

35:25

to people in Gaza who sold the cars they

35:27

were living in to pay for these fees. I

35:29

heard about families that sold their furniture,

35:31

took out loans, families who

35:34

hit up aunts and cousins and

35:36

extended family across multiple countries until

35:38

every family member savings was drained.

35:42

And once you did that, had the money in

35:44

hand, it wasn't over. The

35:46

move for us that was really complicated with

35:48

finding, with figuring out a way how to

35:51

get the money because you have

35:53

to pay cash in dollars

35:55

in Egypt and in order

35:57

for you to, you can't send the money by.

36:00

Bank transfer it to an Egyptian account A It

36:02

has to be like. Somebody.

36:04

In Egypt that has a us the

36:06

accountant whether we let's say you have

36:08

to have you have to have you

36:10

can't transfer money to and accounts know

36:12

like forty thousand dollars. Egypt and you

36:14

couldn't figure out. Literally how to get

36:16

the cast their how do we get

36:18

forty thousand Forty km. Well. The

36:20

thing is is that I. I. Could

36:23

ask phone out and taken it but

36:25

then we found out that I'm at

36:27

It has to be a first degree.

36:30

Relatives that registered. To

36:33

suit. I mean that has to read the

36:35

family and has to the and I'm not

36:37

First the Vm just like the in law

36:39

them like this that that the the dollar

36:42

loss so I could I couldn't And then

36:44

my husband tells the need men under forty

36:46

years old cat at to entry Egypt's unless

36:48

you have a specific. He

36:52

has to have like a permit from the

36:54

Egyptian authorities and secret services in these your

36:56

the security checks us that with also not

36:59

an option for. My my my husband

37:01

to go only go ahead. As.

37:03

To be his sister in

37:05

Sweden and. I'm

37:08

that it went through our editor them. Yeah

37:11

so we flew her out and her

37:13

and her daughters and her husband to

37:15

because you like to small very small

37:17

kids So we flew them all out

37:19

and they're like has the situation is

37:21

not. Amazing and sweet! And

37:23

they couldn't afford like two thousand five hundred

37:25

dollars for the plane tickets are we sit

37:28

with. Us to. God

37:30

now of number one of my counting

37:33

all that comes with tag have to

37:35

leave. Once the sister arrived in Cairo,

37:37

Boucher then had to figure out how

37:39

do I get her. The cash says

37:41

you can go in person to register

37:43

the family at the house office. bush

37:46

or had a friend in egypt he could

37:48

receive about twenty thousand and his account ah

37:50

thousand okay all tracks or twenty thousand to

37:52

him and then we spent in there was

37:55

a person i'm not exactly sure and again

37:57

i'm not a lesson for a he was

37:59

like I don't want to say

38:01

an agent, but he was like a person that was

38:03

going to Egypt, a businessman going to Egypt that

38:06

was taking money for people dollars to

38:08

Egypt for people. So he carried

38:10

15,000 for us. No

38:12

way. Yeah. Basically we paid

38:14

him $1,500 to take $16,000 with him. And

38:18

just to be like the mule just to carry

38:20

it basically. Yep. Yep. Yep.

38:24

Yeah, it was risky. That was a risky

38:26

move. Did you get the sense that that person is doing that

38:28

like all the time? Yeah.

38:31

But I don't think it was for

38:33

necessarily evacuating people from Gaza. It's just

38:35

he's a businessman. He has like businesses in

38:37

Cairo. So he was able to carry. I

38:40

don't know. I don't know what he does, but

38:42

he's like an entrepreneur. I have no

38:44

details. That I didn't part.

38:47

I didn't ask. I was like, cool. We got somebody to

38:49

ask. My husband didn't really ask. He knew the guy. He

38:51

knew the guy from a guy. So like he was like,

38:53

okay, cool. He didn't ask questions. Okay. So

38:56

your sister-in-law arrives in Cairo.

39:01

She goes to meet your friend who's holding

39:03

$20,000 for you and the businessman who has personally

39:08

delivered for quite a high fee, another

39:11

$15,000. And

39:13

all of that. Then she collects that like driving

39:15

around Cairo, this, those are like piles

39:18

of cash. Literally. Well,

39:21

yeah, I guess. I mean, is it piles of cash? It's

39:23

like $350,000. A hundred and $1,500 note.

39:25

So it's not. That's a lot of cash. I

39:27

mean, it's not a pretty quiet, but you can't put it

39:29

in a wallet. No,

39:32

you can't put it in a wallet. That's a

39:34

good question. I should have how she carried it. But

39:38

they know. So they got an apartment right

39:40

next to the, to the

39:42

company, the Hala company,

39:45

the sister-in-law that in line paid the

39:47

money. And then they waited for

39:49

the names of Bush's in-laws to show up on

39:51

the list. The sister

39:53

and her family were stuck checking the

39:55

same strange telegram channel Yousaf was the

39:58

one with the screenshots of this life

40:00

or death. The wheat was excruciating.

40:03

Bushra didn't want to think or

40:05

talk about it. Her sister-in-law

40:07

wanted to talk about it all the time. They

40:09

were all watching the news and the list.

40:13

On April 14th, their names appeared

40:15

on the list. The family left

40:17

the next day. I mean, definitely when

40:20

their names came out on the

40:22

list, it was like a physical... There

40:24

was something physical that changed in me.

40:27

What did it feel like? What changed? It

40:30

feels like... It's like, okay,

40:33

they're gonna survive. You know, they're gonna live.

40:36

Yeah. And there's no word

40:38

for it in English, but maybe

40:40

you can look it up. In Arabic,

40:42

it's called, ahar. Mm-hmm. It's

40:44

like... It's

40:46

like a mix of anger and

40:48

disgust. The word, that's what

40:50

it means. Like a mix of anger, disgust. And...

40:57

despair. And

40:59

you felt that toward what

41:02

made you feel, like which part? How...

41:05

I mean, listen. I have never...

41:07

I had never met my in-laws. Never

41:10

met her in-laws because Israeli restrictions make

41:13

it very hard to travel between the West

41:15

Bank and Gaza. Like, how

41:17

is it that this has to happen for us

41:19

to meet and for my son, to meet

41:21

his grandparents for the first time, you know?

41:24

Like... Why?

41:27

Why do we have to go through this? What

41:31

is it gonna mean to your family

41:33

to have spent this money on this?

41:36

Like, long-term or... Shame.

41:41

Shame. Shame? Why?

41:46

Because they're shamed. Because

41:48

that's not who we are, you know? Like, we've been

41:50

rendered destitute, you know? Like, they're

41:53

not destitute people, you know? Like, they had

41:55

a beautiful home and beautiful lives and... to

42:01

put that on your son. I

42:03

mean, I don't know.

42:05

I don't know if it's shame, but it's like

42:09

guilt, maybe. It's

42:12

like they're so grateful that they're ashamed to say

42:14

it. You know what I mean? It's

42:16

embarrassing that they put that on

42:18

us. Mm-hmm. And so it's that we don't

42:20

talk about it. It's not like there's a

42:22

thank you. Because even a thank you is like

42:24

not enough for them and so it's

42:27

better not to say it. Do you want to

42:29

talk about it? No.

42:34

Because I would do

42:36

it a million times over again and they

42:38

know that. I

42:41

just need to know that they're alive and that they're good and

42:43

now you know I mean the thing is is that they're

42:46

in Egypt now and I'm in Egypt now and

42:49

but the road ahead is so hard and like

42:51

coming here and like just seeing them like they're

42:53

not the same people. They never will be the

42:55

same people, you know. This

42:58

brings us back to Yousif. Yousif

43:01

who knew this, he knew leaving

43:04

Gaza meant he would not be the

43:06

same person and still

43:08

Yousif was going through all these steps through

43:11

a system designed to frustrate,

43:13

deter, and bankrupt him. Yousif's

43:15

version of this process raising

43:17

an astounding amount of money

43:19

getting the cash in dollars

43:21

physically to the hala office.

43:23

Yousif's maneuvers were not the exact same

43:26

as Bouchra's but they were just as

43:28

involved and absurd right up

43:30

until he was registered and

43:32

waiting for permission to do something

43:34

he did not want to do. When

43:45

he was growing up Yousif's uncle used to

43:47

tell him he reminded him of his grandfather. He grew

43:50

up hearing this a lot, the similarities to his

43:52

grandfather and Yousif got it. His

43:55

grandfather hustled, made things happen, he

43:57

was resourceful. Joseph

44:00

has been thinking about this lately, what it

44:02

meant to be like his grandfather, what

44:05

else it meant. His

44:07

grandfather is the one who got everyone

44:09

to Jabalia, to the refugee camp in

44:11

the north of Gaza when they were all pushed out

44:13

of their homes in what is now Israel in

44:15

1948. His

44:18

grandfather is the one who made sure everyone got

44:20

set up in the same place next to each

44:22

other, made sure they survived,

44:24

had housing, had their needs met.

44:27

He made sure they were safe and they

44:29

were together. And they were. Jabalia

44:33

camp became a small city. People

44:36

moved to bigger apartments nearby, had kids,

44:39

but the family stayed safe and

44:41

right next to each other. Seventy-five

44:44

years later, Yousif was

44:46

the one who moved to sisters and their

44:48

families to a tent camp in Rafa so

44:50

they could all be nearby, safe and

44:53

together. They were there

44:55

for three months when Yousif heard

44:57

from a contact in Egypt, a friend

44:59

with connections at the Hala company, who

45:02

told them that his family's names were likely to be

45:04

listed in the next week. He

45:07

wasn't just failing at keeping the family

45:09

together. He was the one

45:11

who was going to split them up. Yousif,

45:14

are you packing? I

45:18

don't have anything to pack. That's

45:23

the easiest thing. That's the easiest

45:25

part. I

45:28

have two jeans, pants, two

45:32

t-shirts, two jackets. Actually,

45:35

most of it I will leave it

45:38

for my brothers-in-law. I'm

45:41

just going to take just

45:44

what I could wear during the first

45:46

day, just a big drama for the

45:48

next day. That's it. That's

45:50

the easiest part is packing. What's

45:53

the hardest part? It's

45:58

also packing. And

46:00

I believe there is nothing to be

46:02

backed during the journey, but we are

46:04

backing our relations with our families now.

46:08

I don't know how it's going to be that day

46:10

when we are just going out. And

46:13

I don't want to really think about that moment because

46:16

I don't know how it's going to be. Yeah,

46:21

yeah, it's going to be difficult. I don't want

46:23

to think about it. Let's wait and see. Hi,

46:33

Yousuf. Hello, Hannah. Hi. Hi,

46:36

how's your day been? I

46:41

don't know. It was a bit long and... Yeah,

46:46

I need to end up with

46:48

our name listed, why the Egyptians

46:50

took us tomorrow to leave to Egypt. Wow.

46:56

And I wasn't expecting that soon.

46:58

Yeah, I knew about looking

47:01

to my sisters. Today I received the news when

47:03

I was with my sisters. And it

47:06

was really difficult how to be with it. You

47:10

were with your sisters when you found out? The

47:12

names were listed. They list the names usually

47:15

after 10pm, the night. So

47:17

we were there having a gift to our friends. I

47:19

see the rest of my sisters, Hib and Hadid. I

47:24

have a friend who lives in Egypt and he

47:26

had some access with the Hello Company, which

47:29

is a company that we just threw it to

47:31

cross to Egypt. And

47:34

he told me that my name is

47:36

not going to be listed today, so I don't

47:38

need to wait for the

47:41

list. It's going to be listed for tomorrow. So

47:44

I decided we were having a start with my

47:46

sisters. I told him that we are leaving the

47:48

day after. I

47:50

wanted to do that day. With them we agreed

47:52

to have a start together, all of us. We

47:56

were planning for tomorrow that I don't want

47:58

to go to work. I've been

48:00

there with my sisters, my family

48:02

there, we spent the entire day there. Then

48:05

we go back to prepare ourselves to

48:07

travel. And suddenly when we were there,

48:11

one of the wife of one of

48:13

our colleagues who lives with us, she

48:16

called and she said, your names are

48:18

listed. And it was very shocking. And

48:20

it became suddenly everything became a chaos.

48:22

Everyone started crying and it was very

48:24

emotional moment that I didn't want to

48:27

see. My

48:29

daughter, Elia was crying because her hands are crying. My wife is

48:31

crying. My mother is crying.

48:37

And then I

48:40

found myself in this chaotic situation trying to

48:42

understand this is the right option or not.

48:46

You were having doubts. You know, yeah, of course. I'm

48:52

going for nowhere, leaving behind me

48:54

everything. And this is the second time

48:57

I'm leaving things behind. I

49:01

lift my house in the north, I lift

49:04

my house, my memories, the thing in the

49:06

north. Now

49:11

I can, I'm trying

49:14

to understand or to imagine how

49:16

my sisters are feeling when they are

49:18

losing their backup, their support whenever they

49:20

want anything. Whenever

49:22

they are facing anything, they

49:24

know that Yousuf is there. What did they say,

49:26

Yousuf? What did they say to you? Everyone

49:32

was in a shock, including

49:34

me. Everyone was crying. And when

49:36

I was looking to my sisters, I felt how weak I

49:38

am to make that decision. I

49:40

don't have enough courage to leave

49:42

everything behind. This

49:46

is one of the hardest

49:48

moments in my life. When

50:10

I was looking for my sisters, when they

50:12

are thinking about

50:15

losing their entire family, it's

50:17

not only me, it's my

50:19

wife, my children, their mother.

50:23

I couldn't find the right word. What should I

50:25

say? The

50:28

issue is that I was

50:30

very overwhelmed emotionally. And if

50:35

I say, and it happened, when I started to talk

50:37

to them, I was trying to show how strong I

50:39

am. And I was like,

50:41

it's fine. Since a month, I informed you

50:43

to be prepared for this moment. And

50:47

here where I lost

50:50

control of my emotions. I

50:58

usually am

51:00

that tough man who always cannot

51:06

be seen as a

51:09

weak person. But I understood how

51:12

weak I am. I

51:15

don't want to be shown weak in front of

51:17

them, but it's

51:20

out of my head. My

51:23

sisters, I believe they

51:25

know that I will do anything for them. And

51:28

whenever they need anything, I already

51:31

prepared everything. Yousuf,

51:34

you told me over the last month

51:36

that every time I asked how

51:38

you feel about leaving, you were sort

51:41

of like, I can't, I don't know. I'll know

51:43

when it happens. I don't know. I can't think about it. Do

51:46

you feel like you're suddenly thinking about it now? I

51:54

was postponing, thinking about

51:56

it because I understood how

51:59

hard it is. And

52:01

I was doing right. I was doing right today

52:03

when I received the news and I'm knowing that

52:06

I'm leaving tomorrow. I

52:11

never felt a pain

52:13

inside me back today.

52:15

And I

52:18

was right. I was right.

52:20

And now it's real. It's

52:22

happening. And leaving Gaza towards,

52:24

like, losing

52:27

my identity. When

52:30

are you leaving? I'm leaving 7 a.m. in the

52:32

morning. Oh, wow. You're

52:35

leaving in six hours. Yeah,

52:39

I am leaving. Are

52:43

you going to sleep? I

52:48

don't know if I could manage to sleep. That's

52:51

tomorrow morning at 7 a.m. I have

52:53

to go to meet my sisters again

52:55

before we leave. I

52:58

want to make sure, even if I have one more

53:00

minute to spend the two of them, I do it.

53:03

I don't know, Hannah, I'm

53:05

going through one

53:09

of the most difficult. It's not one of

53:11

the most. It's the most difficult decision I

53:13

made in my entire life. I

53:16

know. Now

53:20

I'm just leaving everything. Now

53:22

I am leaving. And

53:24

I will be a refugee once again, born

53:26

as a refugee, raised as a

53:28

refugee, and

53:31

now starting a new life as a refugee.

53:37

Yousuf, I want to

53:39

let you go have time with your family

53:41

and also hopefully sleep some before you have

53:43

to make that trip tomorrow. Thank

53:47

you, Hannah. Thank you so much. Thank

53:51

you. And I think our

53:53

next call will be from

53:55

a different place. Hopefully it

53:58

will go okay. Yousuf

54:15

left through the rough-a-crossing the next day.

54:18

That day, his family saw the world

54:21

outside Gaza for the first time. The

54:24

kids were amazed by the electricity

54:26

in Cairo and the trees. The

54:29

trees in Gaza have been cut down now to use for

54:31

fire. When Ilia and

54:33

Asma started to tell their cousins in Gaza

54:35

about the watermelon they were eating and the

54:37

playground they played on, Yousuf had to tell

54:39

them to keep that kind of thing to themselves from

54:42

now on. Manal

54:44

took the children to the market and bought chocolate.

54:47

Yousuf sat at the computer, continuing

54:49

to try to make plans for his

54:51

sisters, trying to figure out where

54:54

were the Israeli tanks now? What

54:56

might their approach into Rafa be? What

54:58

was the intensity of the bombing that day and what

55:00

did it mean? Were the NGOs

55:02

leaving Rafa yet? Were other people leaving? Was

55:05

it time for his sisters to move somewhere else

55:08

in Gaza? Then,

55:10

on May 6, the

55:12

Israeli military sent tanks into Rafa.

55:15

The invasion had finally started. That

55:18

same day, there was news that Hamas

55:21

had agreed to a ceasefire. It

55:23

was very confusing, but for a couple hours,

55:25

it seemed like maybe there was going to

55:27

be a ceasefire. I was very, very excited. I

55:29

was like hyped and I was like, what to do? I

55:31

should go back to Gaza. And it's too

55:34

late. Really? It might take one, two

55:36

weeks. Yeah. I'm usually here. Why

55:38

is what I'm doing here? Watching the news, writing reports? I want

55:40

to be there. The only option for me is to go back to Gaza.

55:42

I'm not going to be there. I'm not going to be there. I'm not going

55:44

to be there. I'm not going to be there. I'm not going to

55:46

be there. I'm not going to be there. I

55:49

want to be there. throw

56:00

them in the car and we keep running in Gaza from a

56:02

place to the other. I don't mind it. Yousif

56:05

was suddenly back to the person I

56:07

remembered talking to for every other move

56:10

before this last one. Energized.

56:12

Frantic. I

56:14

start to think rationally about what's

56:17

going to happen, what I'm going to do,

56:19

and I will, the plan that I'm having

56:22

now is to get it out of the way,

56:24

how to come back. But

56:27

that day, there was no ceasefire. And

56:30

the next day, the Israeli military seized

56:32

the Rafah crossing into Egypt and

56:35

closed the border. There

56:37

was no way back. Yousif

56:39

would be in one world. His

56:41

sisters would be back home in

56:43

another. Hanatafi

56:46

Walt is one of the

56:48

producers of our show.

56:53

Han a story about Yousif was edited by Laura

56:55

Starcheski and

56:59

Nancy Updike. Her

57:02

episode today was produced by Aviva de

57:04

Kornfeld. People that together today's

57:07

episode include Jindai Banzo, Chase Michael,

57:09

Kamete Emmanuel, Joshi, Catherine Maymondo, Nadia

57:11

Raymond, Safiya Riddle, Ryan Rummory, Francis

57:13

Swanson, Christopher Sertala, Matt Tierney, Julie

57:15

Whitaker, and Diane Wu. Our managing

57:18

editor, Sara Abdurrahman, our senior editor,

57:20

David Kestenbaum, our executive editor, Zamanio

57:22

Barrie. Reporting research in

57:24

Arabic translation from Haniha Wasli. Arabic

57:27

interpreting from Emma Zraou and Salsin

57:29

Abdel-Atif. Arabic voiceover by

57:31

Liam Lubani. Additional reporting by

57:34

Fatma and by Dana Boulut. Special

57:36

thanks to all the reporters at Madam Masar

57:38

and the Organized Crime Corruption and Reporting Project.

57:41

Thanks also to Shana Lowe, Mona

57:43

Jalabi, Miriam Marmer, Tara Abboud, Adam

57:45

Bakri, and Rania Mustafa casting out

57:48

from Sabrina Hyman. Our

57:50

website, if you're going on a long

57:52

drive, going on a vacation, looking for

57:54

something to listen to, over 800 episodes

57:57

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this America. americanlife.org. This American Life

58:01

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always to our program's co-founder, Mr. Torrey

58:08

Malatia. You know, he keeps getting pulled

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with this one guy. Torrey couldn't remember

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his name. Elon something. I

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don't know what he does, but he's like an entrepreneur. I'm

58:20

Eric Glass. Back next week with more stories

58:22

of this American Life. The

58:34

delicious ice cold taste of Dr. Pepper has

58:36

a lasting effect on people. Lindsay from Sacramento

58:38

said, Pro tip, 40 degrees is the perfect

58:40

temperature for an ice cold Dr. Pepper. Why

58:42

is 40 degrees the perfect temperature for Dr. Pepper?

58:45

We brought in Sue from Duluth, Minnesota to tell

58:47

us. Oh yeah, I know a thing or two about

58:49

cold. Oh, that right there is the perfect

58:51

kind of ice cold for Dr. Pepper. I'd

58:54

share that with my friend Nancy. She likes Dr.

58:56

Pepper too, you know. My cold... Alright, that'll

58:58

be all Sue. Having a perfect temperature for

59:00

your Dr. Pepper? It's a pepper thing. Inspired

59:02

by real fan posts.