0:00

Pod, pod, pod, pod. Rugby pod. Right,

0:02

we're back. Hello

0:07

and welcome. It's the Rugby Pod. But there's

0:09

no Andrew Goode. He is on his son,

0:12

Laudia, in doobbs. But we've got a

0:14

hell of a replacement. He's in the studio. The

0:16

great Dan Bigger from the south of France. Is that

0:18

a real town or a fake town? They didn't ask

0:21

you when you first came in. It is a real

0:23

town. I got asked that quite a lot yesterday when

0:25

I did Northampton Munster for TNT last. It's the history

0:27

of people gone by. Welsh lads gone by. Admittedly,

0:30

I'm fighting a losing battle. But yeah, it's a

0:32

real town. It's a real town. The weather's a

0:34

lot better in the south of France than it

0:36

is in London. So it's a real

0:38

town. Jim, thanks for asking. Well, you're looking great. That's what

0:40

I'm saying. So that's why I was piggyback. And also who's

0:42

looking great. But definitely not us, Dan. Producer

0:44

Rob, you're in. I'm here. You are? Yeah. Yeah,

0:47

we are pale. You're paler than me. Pasty. But

0:49

we are happy. Reseding. Yes. So Rob, better than

0:51

all three of us in the studio. We've got

0:53

Ella the guest today. Biggs, you

0:55

sorted out. I'll let you intro. Who have we got coming on

0:57

later on? We have got the one

0:59

and only Louis Risamet, who has recently signed

1:01

for the Super Bowl champions, Kansas City Chiefs.

1:04

So that is going to be very, very

1:06

exciting. Yeah, it's going to be class. And

1:08

we're going to run through a bit of

1:10

the round of 16 from the champions. Come

1:12

and look forward to the quarterfinals. So saddleback,

1:14

Rob. Enjoy. And make sure

1:17

you subscribe, Don. Spotify. Boom. Biggs has

1:19

listed the show before. Enjoy. Have a

1:21

tea. This episode

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the banner or visit this episode's page to

2:28

learn more. Biggs, great to

2:30

have you in London. Great to see you on TV

2:32

at the weekend. You referenced that with the tan that

2:34

was spoken about. I didn't watch the beginning bit, I

2:36

watched the mid bit and the aftermath of

2:38

the Northampton Munster game, but you're in the studio. Brilliant

2:41

to be here, what a studio, what a place. It

2:43

beats the shabby internet that's going on in

2:45

the south of France. So I think we're gonna have to

2:48

make this a bit more of a regular thing. What a

2:50

place though to come in to work. Makes life a lot

2:52

easier. In Northampton yesterday afternoon

2:55

for the round of 16 game between Saints

2:57

and Munster, cracking game of rugby. Brilliant, brilliant

2:59

game of rugby. And my whole team are

3:01

flying at the minute. Yeah. Absolutely

3:04

flying. Fair play, they look like a team full of

3:06

confidence. And yeah, it was great to be back there.

3:08

The weather not quite as good in the East Midlands

3:10

as it is in the south of France, but you

3:13

can't get it all. No, but it was great to

3:15

see you, pitch hard as well. And I was rushing

3:17

because apparently there was gonna be a train strike from

3:19

Centre Park. So I've never been happier getting in my

3:21

car at nine o'clock at night in Nottingham.

3:23

And I feel bad because me and the missus have had

3:25

a few cross words about

3:27

my facials and my

3:30

demeanor. That's the quote unquote her over the last

3:32

few days. So I feel harsh. I'm not gonna

3:34

go and say that it wasn't a successful three

3:36

days in Centre Parks, but there was

3:38

a lot of stress. Yeah, talk to us

3:40

about that stress, Jim, in terms of a slightly

3:43

more traumatic event that went on in your life

3:45

over the last few days. Yeah, well, settle back.

3:47

I spoke to Rob about it. I didn't know

3:49

whether I was gonna share it on the pod,

3:51

but I thought I may

3:53

as well because there's no dash cam

3:55

footage. There's no footage out there of

3:57

a hero running down. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

3:59

It might look a bit disheveled today. I am.

4:02

I feel a bit stressed because I've not slept. I've

4:04

been at center parks, but I

4:06

basically saved a life. What

4:09

day was it, Robert? Did I call you?

4:11

Thursday. Thursday. Thursday.

4:13

Don't know the date. I should get the date because that's the

4:16

day that my life changed. Saved the life from

4:18

a burning car. No shit. From

4:20

a burning car? From a burning car. So here's

4:22

a story, right, Biggs? So in Coventry, off to

4:24

see my mate and the old

4:26

horn of Stonewall driving on the A429, a

4:30

road that I know very well. Been up and down

4:32

there loads. And I don't know if you've ever seen

4:34

a car crash before. Maybe the aftermath

4:36

of one. Well, I was about three

4:38

cars back, come around the bend, and the

4:41

traffic had just stopped. And I was

4:43

like, fucking hell, I'm not looking at my watch. There's a

4:45

bit of a crash up there. I probably need to turn around.

4:47

I've got my meeting to go to. And

4:49

then, I don't know, like I was literally about to

4:51

turn around. So my car was kind of half ready

4:53

to turn around. I got out of the car, and

4:55

I just kind of walked towards like

4:57

this kind of head-on crash. From

5:00

then, it was just like being

5:02

in a dreamland. There was a

5:04

guy on the phone, obviously ringing

5:06

the police, whatever. And I'm

5:08

just walking towards him. I'm like, what is it? And they're

5:10

like, don't go near it. Don't go near it. And

5:13

I was like, what? And he's like, oh, there's gas canisters in

5:15

there, because it was a camper van that was part of the

5:17

crash. And there was a van, and the

5:19

camper van that had collided. And I could see like a little

5:21

bit of smoke and stuff like that. And

5:23

I'm just like, no one else has walked towards a guy

5:25

to profile him. We

5:27

can have a joke about it a little bit after, but he looked like

5:29

Bob Marley. He looked like he was a Rastafarian. He was like, don't go.

5:31

Don't go. So I'm like, and

5:33

I was like, fucking hell, there's a bloke in the car.

5:36

In the van. In the van. The

5:38

bloke in the van. So I've walked towards it,

5:40

and they're like, don't go in. It's going to

5:42

explode, because there's a caravan that's fucking got gas

5:45

canisters in. And then that was

5:47

it, mate. Just walked towards it, man on fire

5:49

style. And there's a guy. Denzel.

5:51

Denzel. And there's a guy in the

5:54

driver's seat, and he's like, I look

5:56

like he might have been dead. Smash

5:59

the window. bare hands, tried to open

6:01

the door, couldn't open the door, and then there was like

6:03

a bit of smoke at the front of the, in between

6:05

the two cars, and then like,

6:07

tried, ripped open the top of the car door,

6:11

and yeah, I'm trying to get this guy out, and

6:13

like, he's passed down. I don't, I didn't know whether

6:15

he was dead. See, he's been surreal

6:17

just talking about it out loud. And

6:19

then he's coming round, and then I'm trying

6:21

to pull him out the car, but the

6:23

fucking dashboard is back, and the steering wheel's

6:25

on top of him, fucking hands hanging off.

6:28

What the fuck? And then I walk away and

6:30

I'm screaming, and the guy's like, starts coming round, I'm like,

6:32

mate, you need to get out the car, you need to

6:34

get out the car, like you're gonna die. And people are

6:36

starting to shout, get away, get away. And

6:39

then, Thinking the van's gonna blow. It's gonna

6:41

explode, but like, having looked, I'm no expert

6:43

on fucking how petrol and fire and like,

6:45

how long these things take, but didn't feel

6:47

like it was about to explode, but it's

6:49

more and more smoke's coming up. So I'm

6:51

walking away, and he's like, don't leave, don't

6:53

leave me. So I go back over, and

6:55

then I'm trying to pull him out the car, I couldn't get

6:57

him, so I've got my leg in the car, I'm like, I'm

6:59

trying to break his leg to try and get him

7:01

from under the steering wheel and stuff like that.

7:04

And he's not moving, so I'm like, mate, I'm really

7:06

sorry. I'm really sorry, walk away, and he's starting to

7:08

wiggle out of the car. So I go back in,

7:10

get underneath him, and fucking, like, trying

7:13

to move him, couldn't be, and he's starting to come out

7:15

even further, he's like, in and out of consciousness, his fucking

7:17

hand's hanging off, like, and I managed to get my leg

7:19

in, leg in, I don't know if it snapped his leg,

7:21

or, I mean, it takes a lot

7:23

of force, doesn't it? But in the moment, and

7:25

next thing's just seeing out a platoon, mate, we

7:28

had it similar with Undie Rowan Ibiza, when he

7:30

passed out, but I'm dragging this bloke, like,

7:32

and someone else has come over, carrying him, away

7:34

from the van, his leg's hanging, like, his leg's,

7:36

like, broken, you can, obviously, it's fucking in pieces,

7:39

he's in and out of consciousness, drag

7:41

him about eight meters away,

7:44

and then the car, like, doesn't blow

7:46

up, but it sets up in flames,

7:49

and then this other guy out of nowhere comes, he's got

7:51

a knife in his hand, he's like, I'm in the TA,

7:53

stand back! And he starts ripping his

7:55

trousers right open, and like, I'm like, what the fuck? But I've

7:58

got no idea, because I'm in a bit of shock. I'm

8:00

still in the moment, but I'm not like I'm just

8:02

like what the fuck and then I think

8:05

I can feel the heat coming off I'm like we need

8:07

to go. Don't move him. He might have broke his neck

8:09

like it starts. I'm not fuck you Start

8:11

dragging him down like the fucking guys in and

8:14

out of concert. You saved my life brother I

8:16

get in the car about to

8:18

drive off and the woman this woman comes in. She's like, who are you?

8:21

Call me picture And

8:24

like I drive off and Carry

8:27

on as in well, I didn't know what to do like

8:29

if the police turned up. It could have been half I

8:31

don't even know cuz I was in this weird like I

8:33

was in state of mind But

8:35

the thing is before I had my tooth out, right? And

8:39

there's blood everywhere. So I've got blood on my top a

8:41

little bit from him like patches from his hand But

8:44

like my mouth is dripping and like as in this

8:46

woman's like, you know, you're injured you're injured I look

8:48

in the mirror and I've got blood pissing out cuz

8:50

she's had my tooth out The adrenaline pumping

8:52

around the body and Yeah,

8:56

and it is so funny. I couldn't sleep the night after

8:58

I'd imagine and then I'm in the vet I'm like was

9:01

it me or was it fucking Bob Marley saved

9:03

this? And I'm watching it. I'm

9:05

just watching it from I think you should take the credit

9:08

It's so it sounds as if you should take the

9:10

credit. Have you been in touch with it? Or do

9:12

you know how the guy is? Well, I'd good one

9:15

on Google and it was like a mountain hospital without

9:17

life-threatening injuries and stuff like that But yeah, I don't

9:19

really know I didn't know you should you should find

9:21

out where he is and go. Yeah But

9:24

I've definitely had like I didn't think I was affected by

9:26

it, but I couldn't sleep for a couple of nights I

9:29

don't know whether that's because I was told him your mates and I've

9:31

made up the story so that you know for dust Can

9:34

footage comes out but no it happened. It was a

9:37

moment. Like I've never experienced anything like it So I even

9:39

like now I feel a bit like jaded.

9:41

Yeah, what the word is, but

9:43

I sent Rob the picture He what I'm mad was the

9:45

picture I said the picture after just like as if the

9:48

missus comes home. She thinks I've been scrapping I

9:51

got blood all over me and I'm like no

9:53

actually so I didn't take a picture of anything

9:55

gory Yeah, just the scene just the scene. It

9:57

was fucking I feel a bit bad cuz I

9:59

thought you were taking the piss I didn't believe

10:01

you for a day afterwards. Yeah, it looks photoshopped

10:03

before but yeah unreal well done mate Yeah, yeah,

10:05

I've been turning around. I just turned around well

10:07

I thought I would have but it was like

10:09

no one else is going towards it You know

10:11

like human yeah, but I hope someone's gotten dashing

10:14

because the man on fire like as in dance

10:16

I was just talking no. I'm just glad he's

10:18

alright. The rugby pod by day Superhero

10:20

by night. Oh, yeah, but well

10:22

done mate. Yeah So

10:25

I saved the life I saved Andy Rose life Yeah,

10:28

there's my been chemical induced. We don't know in

10:30

Ibiza, but and then celebrated

10:32

with a weekend in Center parks Yeah, and

10:35

then Center parks. Yeah normality you didn't quite

10:37

get to relax and enjoy your your hard

10:39

work You know you were straight back to

10:41

work on in the pool Was

10:44

it was it two or three days on the spin

10:46

you couldn't manage? Why did two days or so I'm

10:48

not going in the pool for third day in a

10:51

row? I just can't it just absolute bad lump and

10:53

I feel bad But turn the past expensive place to

10:55

go like and you know hiring bikes is like hiring

10:57

a car Well, that's what you're paying to go there,

10:59

so if it was cheap It was like chance

11:02

my mate we went to butlins when we were younger

11:04

mongrel. Yeah, but you pay in for you know We're

11:06

you know you're getting a sausage you get in a

11:08

hash brown you get in a piece of toast and

11:10

some beans Look at Rob licking his lips Cheaper

11:13

shit you getting a scrap you get tribal

11:15

tats and you're getting like

11:17

Tom Jones Who looks like

11:19

a woman, but it's tend to be Tom Jones singing

11:21

don't mind for 40 quid then it's a little bit

11:23

Well, I've booked up I've actually got a fight back

11:25

to the UK in a few weeks, and I've booked

11:27

it well in advance Ryan air Marseille to Bristol and

11:29

I paid 17 quid for it now

11:32

exactly like you you can't have any complaints

11:34

about legroom No pocket in the seat in

11:36

front whatever long delays getting on the plane

11:38

if you think if you're thinking 17 quid

11:41

It's cheap and cheerful, but like you

11:43

said Center parks is an expensive place And I've

11:45

got two young boys as well, and I feel

11:47

like when you go on holiday now It's basically

11:49

you're just paying a load of money to look

11:51

after your kids in a different venue No,

11:54

it's not I want to talk a little

11:56

bit about this because this will bring us

11:59

on to talk about you loving life

12:01

to a guest that is absolutely loving life

12:03

and we did it when we first had you on but

12:06

we were just talking in the green room, sounds so

12:08

rock and roll about there but you

12:10

are loving too long aren't you like as in

12:12

with your family, doing a little bit of the

12:14

media stuff. From a quality of life Jim it

12:16

is we've never been happier as a family, the

12:19

weather is brilliant, the lifestyle the boys absolutely love

12:21

it, the weather's just starting to turn a bit

12:23

now so it's going to be 23,

12:26

24 degrees over the weekend. Yeah just

12:28

really really happy and I think everybody's

12:30

well aware that the rugby

12:32

in France is the first thing to say is

12:35

how passionate they are, the stadiums are full to

12:37

the brim every single week, the atmosphere, it's like

12:39

an international match every weekend but it

12:41

is very much like a roller coaster in France, you

12:43

kind of win and you're the best team in the

12:45

world and you lose and you're the

12:47

worst team in the world so you have to accept that there's

12:50

going to be bumps on the road there from

12:52

a rugby point of view but from a quality

12:54

of life and family point of view we absolutely

12:56

love it and who knows what's going to happen

12:58

after I'm contracted till next year but we spoke

13:01

about maybe staying on even if rugby doesn't continue

13:03

we may look to stay on and live there

13:05

for a couple of years and just give the

13:07

boys the best opportunity to enjoy

13:09

some more weather, to learn more French

13:11

and just give them good experiences.

13:14

So at the minute Jim I'm really happy, I'm

13:16

loving doing bits and pieces like this as well

13:18

which is which is great. Did you think you'd

13:20

enjoy it as much as you have and I'm

13:22

going to just kind of carry on that because

13:25

without pumping up your tyres and

13:27

we were chatting about it it's clear to say

13:29

make you very good at it, just come out

13:31

the game, you know the players and even the

13:33

evolution that TNT whether or not that is kind

13:35

of just happened but the walk around the pitch

13:37

you see in your relationship with Finn Smith, that

13:40

was me a few years ago, but that is what

13:42

people want to see you're in that so did you

13:44

think you'd enjoy it as much as you are? I

13:47

didn't think I'd feel as comfortable doing it, you know

13:49

it's like when you see you doing this for argument's

13:51

sake it's natural to you, you make it look easy,

13:53

you and Goudy, you make it look easy mainly

13:55

because you've done it a lot of times you know

13:57

what I mean whereas I didn't think I'd feel

14:00

as comfortable as early on in, I

14:02

suppose, your media career, feeling as comfortable as

14:05

I am. And I think what

14:07

I've tried to do and everything I've tried to do in life

14:09

is kind of jump into it with two

14:11

feet rather than sort of just dipping the toe

14:13

in and afraid to make mistakes

14:15

or afraid to give an opinion or whatever. I've

14:17

tried to just really go into it and buy

14:19

into what everything is about, but not really good,

14:21

really enjoying it. Yeah, great. Although I did have

14:23

a very different experience this morning coming into the

14:25

studio. I stayed with some friends in London last

14:27

night out in Nunhead and I was

14:30

jam-packed up against the closing door of the

14:32

train this morning for about half an hour

14:34

on the train in this morning. So, slightly

14:37

different commute to my drive along the coast to

14:40

work in Toulon, but happy

14:42

to be here. And it's been a good couple of days. Well,

14:45

I'm talking about commutes to work. Our

14:47

next guest has got a slightly different commute

14:50

to all of us for the next, hopefully,

14:52

the next five, six, seven years. Should

14:54

we bring them in, Dan? Let's do it.

14:56

Let's bring them in. So, I guess this

14:58

week is the wonderful Welsh flight.

15:00

It's Louis Riesammet. There's no thing else. Look,

15:03

I don't need to say anything else. Louis

15:05

Riesammet. How are you, mate? Very good. How

15:07

are you? Not as good as you. Yeah,

15:09

we're all saying, oh shit, our lives are compared to

15:11

yours, basically. Your

15:14

life's the best, then Biggs, then mine,

15:16

then producer Rob. I don't know. I

15:18

think Biggs is up there, mate. Nah, you and

15:20

Taylor Swift next year, that will be a

15:23

bit different. Yeah, you'll be all right. Gosh.

15:25

I tell you what, the rugby community is not happy, Zam. You're

15:28

at the football. I'm there watching it with Mrs. and Mrs. isn't

15:30

that the lad who plays away or was I like, watch

15:33

this? Cha-ching, Kansas City Chiefs.

15:36

Zam, I tell you, who generally really isn't happy that you've moved away.

15:38

Who do you think, oh, do you think I'm going to say? James.

15:42

James. My six-year-old son is

15:44

absolutely in awe of Zam.

15:47

You all good, though? Yeah, yeah, all

15:49

good, mate. Yeah, all good. I'm flying Wednesday,

15:52

so kind of a one-way ticket. I'm going to go over

15:54

there and see how it goes. So, you know, I'm excited.

15:56

I can't wait to get there and rip into it, kind

15:58

of. Talk us through the last few. weeks, sort of

16:00

how it's been for you, what's sort of gone on

16:02

and give everybody a little bit more of that idea

16:05

of what's been going on. Yeah,

16:07

so obviously I've been in Florida, two and a half

16:09

month training camp, you know, it's very intense, six days

16:12

a week, kind of 12, 13 nowadays.

16:14

So it was a bit of a slog, but

16:16

you know, we had a pro day, so like a trial

16:19

day in front of scouts on the 20th of March.

16:22

And basically all the scouts from all the NFL

16:24

teams went there and had a look at all

16:26

of us. There was probably about 20 of us

16:28

in total, so not that many people to be

16:31

honest. So it was, it was good to get

16:33

a lot of reps and show what you can

16:35

do in front of scouts. And

16:37

then basically from that day, you basically get

16:39

called whether a team wants you into that

16:41

facility or they want to work you out.

16:44

So I ended up going to four teams.

16:46

I was meant to go to a load more, but I kind

16:49

of had my mindset on where I wanted to go based on

16:52

the plan they had for me. So the day

16:54

after pro day, I went to Cleveland Browns, seen

16:56

their facility, met all the coaches and everything. And

16:58

they were, they were absolutely amazing to me. And

17:00

then flew to New York. So

17:02

I went to the Japs, went to that facility,

17:05

had a workout. I went really well, met the

17:07

coaches. So they were great with me and then

17:09

went to the Broncos on the Monday.

17:11

So within like three or four days, I

17:13

already went to three or four franchises, went

17:15

to that facility, met the coaches, you know,

17:17

some worked me out, some didn't, but it was,

17:19

it was an amazing experience. And then the

17:22

final one was become city chiefs and they've

17:24

been absolutely amazing to me, met all the

17:27

coaches, you know, we've got a very good

17:29

plan together all on the same page

17:31

and, and basically see how it goes from

17:33

now because, you know, it's going

17:35

to be a busy few months me with preseason

17:37

coming up now in a week's time. You

17:40

know, I'm so excited. I fly Wednesday and

17:42

I get straight into it and

17:44

get to work basically. So I've kind of

17:46

been my last three months, I was meant to visit

17:48

a load of more teams, but I've always said to

17:50

myself, you know, I'm going to sit down with my family

17:53

and basically go to a team that has a good

17:55

plan for me. And we're all on the same page

17:57

and then the Kansas City Chiefs were the team for

17:59

me. So, you know, excited to rip right

18:01

into it and get to work. Sam, it's

18:03

fucking rock and roll, isn't it? It really

18:05

is. I am genuinely absolutely buzzing for you.

18:07

I had James Cook actually here in the

18:10

studio last week who's head of the IPP

18:12

program who's been part of your journey as

18:14

well. And it couldn't have

18:16

gone any better for you. You

18:18

think, I imagine if you mapped it out, Sam, and said,

18:20

right, this is what I'm doing, headline

18:22

news, I'm leaving rugby, I'm leaving

18:24

the Six Nations, I'm leaving

18:26

the wooden spoon behind, I'm leaving Gloucester, as lovely

18:29

as Gloucester and Choutenamah, and three

18:31

months down the line, four months

18:33

down the line, I'm going to be signing for the

18:35

Super Bowl champions. Like, have you had

18:37

time to pinch yourself or not? You

18:40

are smiling from ear to ear, you look a million dollars,

18:42

but I know you want to get to work, but just

18:44

give us the kind of feeling of when you walk through

18:46

the door of the Super Bowl champions and you were like,

18:48

this is it. When you

18:50

step into the facility, you just feel

18:52

like you're going to win. They have

18:55

obviously all that Super Bowl trophies straight

18:57

ahead of you and just everyone in

18:59

the building is so confident, they're so

19:01

chatty. You just feel like a belief

19:03

within the facility itself. So when

19:05

I went in there, I was just like blown away. I

19:07

was like, wow, this is the best I want to be

19:10

at. I really believe in myself. I really

19:12

believe that I can come into here and

19:14

make a difference to a team. And yeah,

19:16

I've met all the coaches and they were so lovely

19:18

to me as well. I've met a couple of players,

19:20

I haven't met everyone, but even just

19:22

the the the staff around the building, you

19:24

just know that they have belief

19:27

in everything they do. And they're such a professional

19:29

organisation. So that was kind of the feeling I

19:31

went in there with. And yeah, they absolutely blew

19:33

me away. Yeah. Well, James said they rolled out

19:35

the red carpet for you, like you met Andy

19:38

Reid, you met the coaches, which doesn't always happen

19:40

when they're looking to sign young players. Did Travis

19:42

Kelsey, did he open the door, did he to

19:44

heaven? Did he open the gates and say, no,

19:46

to be fair, Pat and Travis have messaged me.

19:49

Hang on. We're

19:51

not letting him get away. We've just called him Pat. Right.

19:54

Hang on. Just say them words

19:56

again. My best mate. messaged

20:00

me, you know, just saying, welcome to KC,

20:02

if I ever need anything, then let me

20:04

know. My Mrs.

20:06

Zam wants a couple of tickets to Taylor

20:08

Swift in the summer. So that could be

20:10

the first request. I'll make that work. Cheers.

20:12

That's crazy. I know you're an NFL fan,

20:14

right? So I've actually

20:17

to say that out loud. It's mad.

20:19

It's mad. Basically, when I

20:22

left the facility and I was coming home on the

20:24

plane, like, I was in the airport

20:26

in Kansas, and I went through security, and

20:28

some guy was like, he was like, looking at me weird.

20:30

And I was, I was just looking at him, and he

20:32

was like, you were a sports

20:34

person. I was like, yeah. And he was

20:36

like, who'd you play for? And honestly, when

20:39

I said it, I felt so weird

20:41

saying. And when I said I

20:44

was like, Oh, I

20:46

feel weird. Yeah, it still hasn't sunk

20:49

in yet. And I think it's gonna sink in, you

20:51

know, when I get to meet all the boys, I

20:53

get to train in the first day. But

20:55

yeah, it's been an absolute whirlwind for three

20:58

months. And I think, I don't

21:00

know, it's something that's been and I'm just so

21:02

excited to meet everyone and just start training. You

21:04

look excited for it, Zam. Anyway, I was going

21:06

to ask you about how different the training has

21:08

been in terms of say this sort

21:10

of two month camp you've been on compared to say

21:12

what a World Cup training camp was like in Switzerland

21:14

and Turkey, which we went on last summer, just give

21:17

us a bit of an insight how different it is,

21:19

how tough it was, or

21:21

if it's got any similarities. I'd say the

21:23

main difference is I've never

21:25

done anything as hard as I did in Turkey. And

21:28

I don't like I don't know what preseason is

21:30

like for the NFL. But that is probably going

21:32

to be one of the hardest things I ever

21:34

do at a World Cup preseason camp. So I

21:36

think that the training the difference is it's more

21:39

like, it's more explosive. It's not

21:41

so endurance based. Yeah, you're not doing

21:43

a long endurance testing and training. It's

21:45

all about explosive power, speed, short, sharp

21:47

kind of stuff. So I was gonna

21:49

say that since you dove to the

21:51

ground, I was gonna say you couldn't

21:53

have handpicked any better. But with that

21:55

is it easier then Sam, so you

21:57

know, we're watching it unfold on social

21:59

media. meeting, you watch the combine. So is

22:01

the training more suited to you? Did you

22:04

find it easier? I mean, I found it

22:06

easier than, than the World Cup training camp,

22:08

but. Because it suited you. Yeah. Yeah. Cause

22:10

it suits me. Like I'm more explosive. I'm

22:12

all about speeds, short, sharp

22:14

intervals, as opposed to doing

22:17

M.A.S. on the pitch, just constantly running up and

22:19

down the pitch. Um, there is a massive difference

22:21

and you know, it very much suits me. And

22:23

I kind of knew that going into it, but

22:25

it was a big grind for the two and

22:27

a half months and there was a lot of

22:29

classroom stuff. Cause obviously you're trying to catch up

22:31

the sport where boys have been playing since they

22:33

were eight years old. So it was more of

22:35

the mental side of the game, as opposed to

22:38

the physical side of the game that I was

22:40

trying to adapt to more, but yeah, it's been

22:42

an amazing three and a half months and you

22:44

know, I can't wait to see what the future holds. Yeah. James was

22:46

saying that, you know, the times that came out

22:48

that were made public on the day, you'd actually

22:51

run quicker, you'd done better. And they actually have

22:53

access to, of course, to do to all the

22:55

data. So how nervous were you when

22:57

you did your 40 yard dash, but you'd done a

22:59

quicker time that before was right in saying that. Yeah,

23:01

I was, I don't think I've ever been so nervous

23:04

in my life in that program. Because

23:06

I mean, this is my dream. And that

23:09

day was pretty much going to determine what I do

23:11

in my life. So I was very nervous at the

23:13

same time. I was trying to stay as composed as

23:15

possible because I've got to try and catch a ball

23:17

as well. So I can't be shaky and I can't

23:20

be nervous, but yeah, the 40

23:22

yard dash didn't go as I like, I know I've

23:24

ran way quicker in the leading up to it. But

23:26

what's your quickest you did on that? So I was

23:28

running like high four twos, low four threes, but I

23:31

ran like four, four, three, but yeah,

23:34

it is always like, I know like I'm

23:36

more of like a game speed kind of

23:38

guy, like I'm, I'm not a sprinter. So

23:40

I've never done track and field. I've never

23:42

done athletics. So I'm not used to

23:44

just running in a straight line. I'm more about game

23:47

speed, being able to run in a match, being

23:49

able to we, and I think that's basically what

23:51

the NFL is going to allow me to do.

23:54

So I'm never really going to be running just

23:56

in a straight line. It's all about what you're going to be

23:58

able to do in a game. So I. the

24:00

cake because obviously he picked up on that

24:02

because my 40 wasn't, it was

24:04

good but it wasn't amazing. It's

24:07

funny because that's kind of like a little bit

24:09

what we say, you know it like playing with

24:11

you for the last few years when people ask

24:13

how quick is he, what's his time, I said

24:15

well we don't really know but what's incredible with

24:17

you is how you transfer your speed into gameplay

24:19

and into a game scenario. So I

24:21

suppose I was gonna, you mentioned there was

24:23

a lot of classroom work and lots of

24:25

sort of stuff how you feel in the

24:27

pitch and things, how difficult is that classroom,

24:29

how big is the playbook, how complicated are

24:31

things or is it gonna take a fair

24:33

bit of revision over the next couple of weeks, couple of

24:35

months. Yeah it's gonna

24:38

take a lot of revision. You've got

24:40

to learn like over a season

24:42

probably a thousand plays and you're going

24:45

into a game with 80 plays, I

24:47

mean in rugby what we got

24:49

five scrum attacks. You normally ask

24:51

me what the plays are, I'm

24:53

like why am I running here?

24:55

So yeah it's a lot

24:58

of revision time but the way I'm seeing

25:00

it is like I'm actually loving this so

25:02

like I'm really enjoying learning the game

25:04

and I'm really enjoying just you know

25:06

diving deep into the game itself and

25:09

into football so you know here

25:11

I've got my iPad with the playbook

25:13

on it. Well that's an improvement over the last five

25:15

years we said you've been in rugby is that one

25:17

anyway. Yes I know so it's

25:19

just going to show like I'm actually loving it.

25:21

I'm really loving like just learning the game in

25:23

general so I've kind of been glued to that

25:26

iPad for the past two weeks since I've signed

25:28

so I want to try and pick up as

25:30

much as I can before going into camp but

25:32

yeah I fly Wednesday and I'm gonna go train

25:35

with heart and the receivers and yeah it's

25:37

gonna be amazing it's gonna be amazing experience

25:39

and there's no one to learn from and

25:42

then the likes of Patrick Mahoney, Travis Kelsey and

25:44

Andy Reid so yeah I'm very excited and

25:46

I can't wait to get going. I get

25:49

goosebumps when he says that's incredible isn't it?

25:51

Just because and again I'm getting a

25:53

bit of hate on Linezamp that I'm all over it at the minute

25:55

and James talked about as athletes I can't

25:58

even believe I'm putting myself in the

26:00

same kind of sentences as

26:02

athletes when I'm sat here with Biggs

26:04

and obviously Chantillyusam. I talk about

26:06

money right as in like you based athletes and

26:08

sport and entertainment and the money's aligned with that.

26:10

Can you give us a bit of insight around

26:13

what that is because I know in American sports

26:15

they talk about it don't they? So there's talk

26:17

of your contract. I think it's just

26:19

interesting for the listeners to hear what the incentive is.

26:21

Yes it's the NFL but there's also a financial incentive

26:23

like can you are you allowed to tell us Sam

26:25

are you happy? I mean James Cook was going to

26:27

mention it but he said it wasn't for him to

26:29

say but he said it is spoken about

26:31

like you speak about money in American sports. So

26:34

there's actually a website online that you can

26:36

find out everyone's

26:38

contracts because they're polar so everyone knows how

26:41

much you earn no matter who you are

26:43

like you can go find I mean you

26:45

can go find Patrick Mahomes' contract if you

26:47

wanted to like I think it's like a

26:49

deal in American sport that you can find

26:51

out people's contracts but basically what you do

26:53

is a rookie you you kind of sign

26:55

a three-year deal and you get guaranteed money

26:57

so if you get injured or you get

27:00

cut you still guaranteed that money but you've yet

27:02

cut at any point so it's a bit of

27:04

a cutthroat sport like I do go to preseason

27:06

now not do well and I would just get

27:09

cut straight away. So you're not like guaranteed those

27:11

that three years. You're not guaranteed for

27:13

three years at all and no one

27:16

is unless you're guaranteed the whole contract

27:18

so basically how it works is you

27:20

sign a contract if you get put

27:22

in the practice squad they terminate this

27:24

contract that you've just signed you're

27:26

a free agent for 24 hours so anything

27:28

can pick you up and then which is

27:31

called waivers if you ever heard that term so you've

27:33

got clear waivers so if no one picks you up

27:35

they can then put you on the practice squad if

27:37

not then they put you on

27:40

the 53-man squad and you stick to that

27:42

original contract you signed so they have minimum

27:44

money for certain so if you make the

27:46

53-man squad your minimum is

27:49

I think this year is 790

27:51

grand dollars yeah if you

27:53

make the practice squad is 250

27:56

grand minimum so. The

28:01

i'm having only forty six a voice

28:03

and when syrup from a stationary still

28:06

like. Six or seven people that

28:08

don't actually played that are still getting

28:10

paid the same amount as some Rockies

28:12

or someplace the the are in the

28:14

fifty three months rods the I signed

28:16

a three year on the side of

28:18

the made for three months from now

28:20

and my have Is Police prototype into

28:22

this into the Spartans in I'm Ready

28:24

To Show show I've reminder. Some.

28:26

We know you be of be really pissed at times

28:28

are just finish up on a mom. Maybe one more

28:31

question the or is the goal for you to really

28:33

make it? As a wide receivers you think it's. Maybe.

28:36

A place on special teams or is that

28:38

is. It still may be a little bit

28:40

too early to to tell what's what's your

28:42

saw a plan or was your ideas on

28:44

up. Yeah so the family size of a

28:46

sudden you take up rules. The sheriff's as

28:48

a massive loss was my main position is

28:50

gonna be so I thought to be a

28:52

sign opposition this year and Manis within the

28:54

ah thanks this is about how political in

28:57

the playbook which is he now we've got

28:59

planted said put me in various positions. Plan.

29:01

About feel that running back the assault receiver to

29:03

see how to use me as much as possible

29:06

and be treated with myself. It's all about may

29:08

lead in the paper thin and and the chemistry

29:10

with. With. All the players on offense

29:12

set. To be able to use me

29:14

so I mean the sun about to me said

29:16

to learn all the plays and. And

29:19

been able to integrate myself insert into a

29:21

soft in rolls. Fine I was gonna say

29:23

the law and besides I debates on for

29:25

me to do.on all the countries know that

29:27

so said no prussia. I'm gonna try learn

29:29

as much as possible to. To. Put

29:31

me in the past musicians or it's young feel. More

29:34

some is gonna be awesome to watch has been

29:36

awesome of to the spa I noticed a bag

29:38

and answer to business. Now for your so to

29:40

have you on it has been epic A know

29:42

your family you funny going to move over your

29:45

taught uber the are in business with the brothers

29:47

just talk about that less just yeah because of

29:49

Kelsey boys have got accelerate about spattering was Louis

29:51

three some and his brothers drink lesser so we

29:54

got sabotage which he says is mans you drink

29:56

may My brother sat up listening to a half

29:58

years in the Make system. really. a couple

30:00

months ago. So yeah, my brother's going to

30:02

move over in July. We're going to get

30:04

out in America and see how it goes.

30:07

But I know what I've got to focus

30:09

on. But at the same time, my brother's

30:11

dealing with Sabotage and all the other directors

30:13

within the company. So yeah, my brother's moving

30:15

over July and my family hopefully move over

30:17

to the season. I know

30:19

what I got to do. I got to try and make the 53-man

30:21

squad and then we can go from there. Amazing, Zam.

30:23

We're very, very grateful for you giving up some

30:25

time. We know how busy you are. And it'd

30:27

be awesome if we could check back in with

30:29

you maybe at some point during the season and

30:32

let us know what you're getting on. For sure,

30:34

for sure. Thanks guys. I'll break the news to

30:36

James again, mate. Don't worry. Don't do it. Thanks

30:38

mate. Appreciate it. Tom

30:40

Travers, I was asking for him as well.

30:43

He liked or the new heights like one

30:45

of my comments. So they know me. Cheers,

30:47

Zams. Right, cheers guys. Legend. It's

30:51

your weekend in Centre Park, sir. Jim, I think, doesn't it?

30:55

It beats my weekend every weekend, even the

30:57

best of the best. I am

30:59

so happy for him. You can see how excited

31:01

he is, kind of. He generally, generally feels excited

31:03

about the, I suppose, the hard work that's ahead

31:05

of him as well. And I think that's one

31:08

thing that maybe a lot of people in the

31:10

rugby community think Zams just this natural talent. But

31:12

probably at the start, he was a little bit

31:14

like that in terms of relied on his ability

31:16

and was able to just get away

31:19

with that. But the last two or three years, the

31:21

amount of application he's put to learning plays. I

31:23

know we had a bit of a joke about

31:25

asking me what the players are and where I'm

31:27

supposed to be. But that's what wingers do though.

31:29

Yeah, exactly. No winger, no winger knows any place,

31:31

basically, but he's applied himself. He's worked hard on

31:33

his repeatability. And I think that is going to

31:35

put him in really good shape for, for obviously

31:37

what he's got, what he's got to come ahead.

31:40

So I'm thrilled for him because it was a

31:42

big, it was a big decision for him, wasn't

31:44

it? To take the, because there was, there would

31:46

be no doubt he'd have had offers in Japan,

31:48

in France, in England. So I think

31:50

for him to take himself out with that and take

31:52

a chance, he's, you know, I'm really thrilled that it's

31:54

come through for him. It couldn't have gone any better.

31:56

Imagine getting a message from Patrick Mahomes.

31:58

I had a message off Prune. to Rob this morning

32:00

so I'm not sure. I have to say the same thing.

32:04

Rob, it is cool though. Are you looking at that thing? What

32:06

are you thinking as a Stockton resident?

32:09

It's so far away from our lives, isn't it? Yeah,

32:12

he's just living the dream, isn't

32:14

he? That's like the next level

32:16

of athleticism, fame, celebrity. Because

32:19

that's part of him as well, isn't it? As in building

32:21

the brand, having another brand on the side, and the old

32:23

guard of rugby would be like, what the

32:25

f... this is the new breed? I

32:27

was just about to say, I don't think rugby was

32:29

ever enough for Zam. I

32:32

think he always wanted that stardom.

32:34

Which is fine. Which is fine. And

32:36

I think, like you said, Jim, I remember we did that...

32:39

Remember we did that walk along the beach and we were

32:41

talking about Zam a few... Was it a year or two

32:43

ago now? Yeah. And the big

32:45

thing is everyone wants people to have opinions and characters

32:47

and things. And then as soon as someone has an

32:49

opinion or is a character, they get

32:51

shot down in flames. What I think has been really good for

32:53

him is he's put himself out there, he said, look, this is

32:56

what I want. I want to

32:58

grow the energy drink. I want to make myself

33:00

a star, a superstar. Not just

33:02

in rugby, in Wales, in the UK, whatever it is.

33:05

He wants to be globally known and good

33:08

on him. Good on him for

33:10

that. He's not ashamed to say that's what he wants.

33:12

And I think the more people that get behind him,

33:15

instead of maybe criticising or saying, oh,

33:17

you left your country, or whatever it

33:19

was, I think the more people

33:21

that get behind him, the better. Yeah,

33:23

I was just thrilled to see how happy he looked.

33:25

He did. He generally looked happy, didn't he? Of course.

33:28

And excited. It was hard not to be. But as in, it

33:30

is genuine. And

33:32

that's humility. That's

33:34

how someone like a youngster like that, who's got

33:36

it all going on and who wants it, you

33:39

can see the smile and that's humility, right? Because

33:41

he must be thinking, what the

33:43

fuck? He's thinking his world's probably going to blow up here, isn't it?

33:46

Do you know what I mean? So it's probably

33:48

for him, he's got to have good people around him.

33:50

And I know that he's really close to his family,

33:52

and his family will take care of, like he said,

33:55

his brother's going to run the energy drinks side of

33:57

things and the off-field stuff. And I think for him

33:59

now, it... really is about just knuckling

34:01

down and focusing on the playbook,

34:03

the iPad, all those bits and pieces

34:06

because if he doesn't, like I said, you could

34:08

see that the 53 man squad is what he wants.

34:10

So he's got to work his absolute socks off to

34:13

get there, leave everybody else worry about the media

34:16

stuff, the drink stuff, etc. And I'm sure

34:18

that in time that'll blow up for him

34:20

as well. But it's, yeah, it's

34:22

incredible. We'll have to take a trip out there to do the

34:24

pod out there and maybe catch up with him

34:26

in person. Yeah, I might do that. I

34:28

think I am mad. We'll see if Pat and Travis

34:30

keep the doors open for us. I'm

34:34

buzzing. No, class to having wicked. Cheers sorting

34:36

that bigs. No problem. Right

34:38

lads, enough of the big time. Let's talk

34:40

bigger time. Let's talk Champions Cup Round of 16. All

34:43

right, nice. I'm a big fan of the concept

34:45

though. Me and Biggs were having a chat before

34:47

and about how the Round of 16 sort of

34:49

fits and you're a big fan. Historically, you've liked

34:51

it. Not so much historically, just because the

34:54

Falcons have never done anything in it. So who's

34:56

your team then? In my mind, I have like

34:58

a few teams. So I'll think Stadt-Français, I'll think

35:00

Munster, I'll think Toulouse, Leicester

35:02

a little bit back in the day. Who do

35:04

you think Rob? I obviously, because

35:06

my team never do anything. I just

35:08

kind of support the players as opposed to teams. He

35:13

doesn't normally pop out. I say, come on, keep going.

35:15

So I'm a big fan of Saints at the minute.

35:17

I like the way they play. I like Finn Smith.

35:20

All right, Rob. Yeah, I'm done. But

35:23

do you not have like an old school like Trevor

35:25

Brennan in your mind or anything? Like your two, well,

35:27

there you go. Sun came out at the weekend. One

35:30

of my, I played against some of these boys,

35:32

but I used to love Biarritz back in the

35:34

day where they had Yashvee Lee, Imanoha Nordikey, Ari

35:37

Nordikey, Betts and those boys. And we actually lost

35:39

a quarterfinal to those boys in in San Sebastian,

35:41

actually. So I played in that

35:43

stadium 14 years ago against in that

35:45

quarterfinal and then played obviously last weekend there.

35:47

But that was kind of like, I always

35:50

used to love the, remember their little ground that they used

35:52

to play at? It used to be you see the red

35:54

roof, the terraced houses, the little pitch. And I always used

35:56

to think like whenever they were playing, it was always used

35:58

to be one that used to. tuned into and

36:00

watch rather than just your team as well. So, Beauret

36:02

would have been a bit of a team for me.

36:05

I love the Champions Cup. Having played in

36:07

it, won it a couple of times. Was

36:10

it Leicester in the squad then? So, I

36:12

kind of naturally and personally have like

36:15

a deep rooted love for the tournament.

36:17

It's gone through a few chops and

36:19

changes. I can't get

36:21

my head round the South African teams just yet

36:23

being in it. Like the travel, the fact that

36:25

the balls now need to come up against... Saints.

36:28

They're coming to Saints. They're not knowing until

36:30

three o'clock on a Sunday afternoon. So, all

36:32

of a sudden now they've got to book

36:34

flights and everything to get to Northampton for

36:36

a Saturday night kick off. So,

36:38

forget the logistics. Like, yes, I'm big on

36:41

the logistics, but even seeing the stadium, right?

36:43

So, you can look at, I don't know,

36:45

Toulouse-Rassen, Soledow, Northampton, Munster. Soledow, yeah. Soledow. We've

36:47

brought in, I know the South African teams,

36:50

there's a lot going on there and

36:52

it's all a little bit different, but what

36:54

are your thoughts on the make up of

36:56

like the Rounder 16, the tournament as a

36:58

whole? I think that the amount of quality

37:00

games this weekend was right

37:02

up there and I think that's a big

37:04

thing you see like Exeter and Bath being

37:06

sold out. And I just think that in

37:09

the old format when you had the six groups

37:11

of four, I felt like every team in that

37:13

quarterfinal could win the competition. Whereas I feel a

37:15

little bit at the minute in this Rounder 16

37:18

format, is there sort of four or

37:20

five teams that can probably win it out of those

37:22

16 teams? You know,

37:25

for argument's sake, like I think Exeter and

37:27

Bath, the two brilliant teams, were going really

37:29

well in the premiership. Do I think that

37:31

either of them could probably win the tournament

37:33

by having to play Toulouse in the next

37:35

round, then potentially Bordeaux, then potentially

37:37

Leinster in a final for argument's sake? And

37:39

I'm not quite sure that's possible for them

37:42

right now, but I look at teams like

37:44

Leinster, LaRochelle, possibly Northampton at the minute with

37:46

the form they're showing and the belief they've

37:48

got Bordeaux. And I think those

37:51

sort of three or four teams are going to really,

37:53

probably a step above the rest of

37:55

the teams in that Rounder 16. I mean, Munster

37:57

last, yesterday, they qualified for the Rounder. round

38:00

of 16s with one victory in the group stages.

38:02

So for me, that's where you kind of think,

38:04

well, you know, are you getting the top, top

38:07

teams or the creme, the creme in the group

38:09

stages coming through into the knockout stages? So

38:12

that's the only thing I'd say. I think teams

38:14

have been able to get into the last 16

38:16

and knockout matches without having actually

38:18

done a huge amount from somebody who's won it a

38:20

couple of times. Jim, is that, do

38:22

you like the format or do you think that

38:24

the old way was, was better? Or do you

38:26

think that there's any changes that you would make

38:28

to it? I'd have it

38:30

all condensed. So it's an easier

38:33

format to follow. So you go around the

38:35

16 quarter semi final.

38:37

So there's more jeopardy in

38:39

that space. I like Rob's idea that

38:41

we've had spoken about before, where you pick them out

38:43

of a hat. Is that right? Yeah,

38:46

I think I just stole off Nick Mullins. Yeah.

38:50

But yeah, I quite like that. So that maybe

38:52

opens up from the very start type of thing.

38:55

No, I think once you get into like the

38:57

round of 16s in the quarters, so it takes

38:59

out all the kind of planning that you'd have

39:01

around it as in, so we knew quite early

39:04

on where it was going to go and that

39:06

we got the repeat of the last round into

39:08

the course. Yeah, Munster, Sainz, LaRochelle, Stemmer. You know,

39:10

the fact that Leinster have all their games in

39:13

Dublin because they're generally top seeds. I

39:15

have a few issues around it and there is

39:17

a romance around it. Like you mentioned the prem

39:19

teams there, then that's a perfect example. You probably

39:21

did that, probably not intentionally, but

39:23

how can the prem teams compete with the

39:26

French teams and you Leinster's,

39:28

I know Lester put in a good account.

39:30

Yeah, very good. So it is really difficult.

39:32

Do you want, are you looking for that

39:35

kind of romantic story, which very rarely happens

39:37

in repeat? Do you know what I mean?

39:40

You've only got to look at the last sort

39:42

of two or three years really, in terms of

39:44

LaRochelle winning it, Leinster runners up. Yeah. Generally,

39:47

you look at the budget, you look at the

39:49

player, those teams are generally going to be there,

39:52

thereabouts every year. And it's

39:54

probably teams in the premiership and certainly

39:56

the Welsh regions and other teams are

39:58

probably a little bit below the level. those levels at

40:00

the minute, aren't they? You know, Glenn Stelarashell next

40:02

weekend is going to be pretty

40:05

special, I think, for it being a quarterfinal

40:08

is going to be really special. But you know, I

40:10

think Toulouse look brilliant with Intermark and

40:12

DuPont in tandem again. Bordeaux look incredibly strong

40:14

because Bordeaux's route is obviously, they're going to

40:16

stay in France for the whole, for the

40:18

whole run if they get there. Because even

40:20

if I think Toulouse will beat Dexter in

40:22

the next round. So Bordeaux look

40:24

good. Well, let's start with Bordeaux. Let's start with

40:27

Bordeaux. Let's start with Bordeaux because again, me and

40:29

Goude were chatting, I never before said, oh, Bordeaux

40:31

have got a chance until they

40:33

smoke Saris in the group stages.

40:36

And Saris come out of the six

40:39

nations, smoked Quinn's at the

40:41

Tottenham Stadium, not very good against

40:43

Northampton, but kind of in it. And

40:46

then get the pence pulled down in Bordeaux. I

40:48

watched the game last weekend first against Saints on

40:51

the Friday night. And I thought the one against

40:53

Quinn's, they were emotionally there at it when they,

40:55

you know, I know it was Farrell's 250th game.

40:57

There was a big occasion at the Tottenham Hotspur

40:59

Stadium, big rivalry. So I think that emotionally they

41:01

were there. And then I watched them the week

41:03

afterwards and they looked not that they didn't want

41:05

to be there, but you know what it's like

41:08

to play. They

41:10

were way off it and probably only about

41:12

15, 20, you know, 15%, but you know how much of

41:16

a difference that makes, especially when you're playing a team

41:18

who on the other side of the coin in terms

41:20

of Saints were fully charged and ready to go back

41:22

after losing to Bristol. So I didn't think

41:24

it was probably the best preparation for Sarri's going

41:26

into an away game knockout rugby against

41:28

Bordeaux. And I think they were probably still reeling

41:30

a little bit from that heavy defeat in the

41:32

group stages. Probably mentally they were thinking it's

41:35

a tough place to come and win you're the crowd are on top of you.

41:37

33,000 people in

41:39

the stadium and they were never

41:41

really in it, were they? But it

41:43

was actually only, I think it was only 10 nil at halftime or

41:45

10, three. So even at 10 nil, you still felt,

41:49

you know, I think Bordeaux had three or

41:51

four tries disallowed. So you sort of felt

41:53

like 10 nil was a result for Sarri's

41:55

at halftime. And then obviously the 20 minutes

41:58

after halftime, they just got blown away. are

42:00

normally good. But they, Bordeaux's attack, I

42:02

mean Penno was incredible, I know he

42:04

didn't get on the score sheet, but

42:06

just the mounted defenders he beats every

42:09

single week is incredible. I

42:11

mean, Luku looks a different player when he plays

42:13

with Bordeaux compared to the Six Nations he's had

42:15

and they just look a really, really

42:17

strong team. And I'm going to take some B.

42:19

But Sarri's just looked, again, they looked off it.

42:21

Once they went down, he just never felt like

42:23

they were coming back, did you? It felt like

42:25

it was one way traffic and I

42:27

think that will be a concern for Sarri. I think a

42:30

week off would be good for those boys. A lot of

42:32

boys who have obviously played a lot of minutes during the

42:34

Six Nations have had to back up two

42:36

or three weeks. They looked a little bit tired against

42:38

Saints the week before and they looked

42:40

very tired in that second half against Bordeaux. So

42:42

I think a week off will do them really

42:44

good. Sarri's just looking at some of the stats,

42:46

missed 42 tackles, conceded 16 turnovers.

42:49

About 40 of them are on Penno, I think,

42:51

were they? Do you know what I mean? And

42:53

maybe it's the Bogey team for them. But when

42:56

you look at it and you said that if

42:58

they're running will be all in France up to

43:00

the final at the Tottenham Stadium and the kind

43:02

of players that we've just profiled there and

43:05

the fact that you've got Damian Penno, who I think

43:07

is the form winger in the world

43:09

at the minute, 14 carries, 13 defenders

43:11

beating three offloads and a try assist, no try.

43:14

It's quite funny because when we used to play against

43:16

Penno for Wales, you just couldn't

43:19

analyse him because he pops up in so

43:21

many different positions. He's not really a winger.

43:23

He's almost just like a utility player on the, he's

43:25

like a hybrid on the field. Yeah, look, if he

43:28

stays in the kind of form he's in at the

43:30

minute with Jallibard to come back, they're going to take

43:32

some serious beating, especially in the south west of France,

43:34

no doubt. This episode is brought

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44:07

baseball there's something else. Do the Quins have a

44:09

chance? We're gonna review and preview preview and review

44:11

the whole way through. Do the Quins have a

44:13

chance? Yes because if

44:15

Quins have one of their days they can

44:18

rip up any defense in world rugby but

44:21

I think they've been a little bit too up

44:23

and down over the last few weeks. Yeah and

44:25

Glasgow gave them a proper game.

44:27

Glasgow a good team. Glasgow a good team. They're not

44:29

a great team they're a good team and this is

44:31

the levels right as in we know having played at

44:33

the Champions Cup and if it wasn't for a few

44:35

decisions Glasgow could

44:38

have won that game and they didn't get the rubber the

44:40

green they didn't get the decisions a number I don't want

44:42

to go through them all but they were hard done by

44:44

but Glasgow should have beat Quins. Yeah and Quins sort of

44:46

switched off a little bit didn't they after going what was

44:48

it 21-7 up all

44:51

of a sudden then Glasgow come back 24-21 up and just played

44:53

some brilliant

44:55

rugby played in the right areas of the pitch thought

44:57

George Holden was actually really good on the weekend great

44:59

to have Tua Piloto back for them as well makes

45:01

a huge difference he's gonna make a difference to any

45:04

team he plays in clearly. Quins got over in the

45:06

last couple of minutes with a driving Maltry and yeah

45:09

I don't know I just I just feel like

45:12

like I said Quins have been too inconsistent

45:14

and against a team in banging form like

45:16

Bordeaux going to the southwest of France I

45:18

just think that you can't be as

45:21

loose as what Quins are otherwise the game's gonna be

45:23

too far behind and but I think

45:25

I think it's gonna be a cracker of a game

45:28

both teams are gonna want to play. Marcus Smith to

45:30

be fair has been brilliant hasn't he the last few

45:32

weeks since coming back from from international duty so. What

45:34

level is he in Marcus Smith now

45:36

is he at the international level because he

45:38

hasn't really had a run and these games

45:40

bigs are the ones aren't they as in

45:43

to be really like you're owing farrells like

45:45

even yeah. I think Jim in answer to

45:47

that nobody can question how talented Marcus is

45:49

he's one of the most talented rugby players

45:52

on the planet but probably what England will

45:54

want a little bit more from him is

45:56

in terms of that control of the game

45:58

so when you go 21 up

46:00

at home against Glasgow, you

46:02

don't really want to have to win that again. But

46:04

he's coming under a bit of pressure from Finn Smith

46:07

as well, because Finn is actually showing

46:10

some real maturity in his game. Not just,

46:12

you know, he's got some lovely plays and

46:14

he's got some lovely moments, but

46:16

he's showing some real maturity beyond his age.

46:19

And that's sort of probably what the England

46:21

coaches will want to see a little bit

46:23

more, maybe from from Marcus in terms of

46:25

that, you know, but Finn Smith, speaking of

46:27

Northampton and Munster was excellent again yesterday. And

46:29

we'll come straight on to that, because we

46:32

both are saying Bordeaux against Queens at

46:34

the weekend. I would be very surprised if

46:36

Bordeaux didn't go through yet. Yeah, but the

46:38

Northampton thing that you were talking about and

46:40

mentioning Finn Smith there, the way

46:43

that Northampton beat Munster, and Munster, like you heard, there

46:45

was loads of illness in the camp, I didn't realise

46:47

that, I wondered why R.G. Sniman wasn't playing again. Yeah,

46:49

but he was a big miss as well. He was

46:51

a big miss, but they played really well, like regardless

46:53

of the sickness or whatever, they brought

46:55

a real dogged game plan

46:58

where Northampton had to have, and you

47:00

used this analogy with Scotland before around

47:02

a plan B. And that's

47:04

where the game management and having to

47:07

show that, actually shows that Northampton, like

47:09

they've got a chance in this tournament because they can play

47:12

two different ways. Yeah, I agree. And I think I actually

47:14

spoke, I was on the field, I spoke to a few

47:16

of the, I spoke to Sam Vesti, the attack coach, spoke

47:18

to obviously Phil Dowsen, the director of rugby and a couple

47:20

of players, and they actually said how

47:22

poor they attacked by Saints' standard yesterday

47:24

in terms of their game and how

47:26

they actually attacked. And I asked Phil

47:28

Dowsen in the aftermath, they said, was

47:30

it more pleasing that you're finding a

47:33

different way to win games, a very untraditional

47:36

way of winning games for a Saints point of view?

47:38

And he sort of said it's the maturity and

47:41

people like Finn Smith, like Alex Mitchell, who

47:43

are figuring out ways to win games. I mean,

47:45

they scored a brilliant try to get them ahead,

47:47

brilliant, brilliant try, something that they've worked, that play

47:50

has been in the locker book since. The George

47:52

Hendy one. The George Hendy first one. Scotsman. Yeah.

47:55

I was going to say, there must be

47:57

some Scottish in it. But

48:00

that plays been in the playbook for 10 to

48:02

the first day I joined So it's

48:04

exactly the same play they've run and it's no

48:07

coincidence that they've run it so well because Sam

48:09

vesti just gets them Run

48:11

in the same place attacking in different

48:13

channels all the time I

48:15

think he deserves huge huge credit because

48:18

he is for me the best attack

48:20

coaches out there The best

48:22

attack coaches out there and the way that he

48:24

has brought on all these players And and

48:27

there's no coincidence that Finn Smith's been at the club for just

48:29

over a year now 18 months Maybe and

48:31

you can see his game has gone up

48:34

huge amounts I believe that obviously he's playing in a good

48:36

team But he's he's being coached by

48:38

one of the best coaches that's out there as

48:40

well And you think he could overtake Marcus Smith

48:42

because we've got that all-round game. Absolutely I got

48:44

I don't see any reason why he couldn't be

48:46

ahead of Marcus in the pecking order But I

48:48

think Marcus is always going to be in the

48:50

conversation because of how talented he is Northampton

48:52

are interested in though because it

48:55

feels like it's now or never for them because

48:57

of Courtney. I was just yeah Waller Ludlam's

49:02

Paul Hill He's

49:04

gonna be Scottish. He's complaining yesterday. I spoke

49:06

to him as he's complaining about the house

49:09

prices in Edinburgh as well So yeah, he

49:11

said he's having an absolute nightmare trying to

49:13

find a place. Really? I've got a mate

49:15

Craig from Revere Yeah, I agree with that

49:17

Jim I

49:21

think that's a really good point because You

49:23

take those even those four or five players we've

49:25

mentioned on top of a lot of other squad

49:27

players that again I do know how important squad

49:29

players are and you think can that team do

49:32

the same? Next year is what they're

49:34

doing at the minute without those players and you have

49:36

to probably argue you have to think it would be

49:38

it Would be challenging wouldn't it because defense was an

49:40

Achilles heel for Northampton and you look at Lewis Ludlam

49:42

and Courtney Courtney massive massive

49:45

defenders for them and I think Lee Radford

49:47

deserves a huge credit again I spoke to

49:49

a few of the players before and after

49:51

the game and asked them What's

49:53

he been like has he been you know over

49:55

complicating things or has he been flooding it with

49:57

information? He said just he's worked on the end

50:00

the mentality and keeping things

50:02

really simple. I said it's

50:04

exactly the same as what Sean Edwards does. Sean Edwards,

50:06

everyone thinks Sean Edwards is this mastermind

50:08

and comes up with all these brilliant schemes

50:10

and plans and he is the simplest coach.

50:13

Oh, good enough, though. Yeah. Literally,

50:15

he is the simplest defense coach, but he is

50:18

absolutely nothing short of

50:20

spectacular. The best defense coach has ever been out there for

50:22

me because he gets people

50:24

to want to defend and that sometimes

50:26

is a challenge. You played, I'm sure you played with

50:29

players, Jim, who thought defense

50:31

is sort of the last thing they want to

50:33

be practicing after training. Everyone wants to be kicking

50:35

or passing or line up for him, whatever. So

50:37

I think he deserves a huge amount of credit

50:39

for bringing that mentality into the club. But I

50:41

think Northampton have got a huge chance to make

50:43

a semi-final. And maybe it is

50:45

better because we're like, now I'm thinking,

50:47

right, okay, Northampton on a six-day turnaround.

50:50

The ball's absolutely smotely on, yes, it

50:52

were an amazing game. The

50:54

ball's got some quality players, Kirtley

50:56

Arrins, Willie LaRue, Enric Lowe in

50:58

the background. The 12 is

51:00

just absolutely carbon. Do you know what I mean?

51:02

They've got some quality players, but with the travel,

51:04

and maybe that does add to it. I don't

51:06

know. There may be an element of the balls

51:08

who may just think, they may try and just

51:10

simplify that game next week against Northampton. They may

51:12

just come and say, right, we're gonna scrum and

51:14

maul you and kick the leather off the

51:17

ball and squeeze you. Because I think, and

51:19

then when they get their opportunity to bring guys

51:21

like Kader Moody and Willie LaRue and these guys

51:23

in the game. They need Kader Moody as well.

51:25

I was looking for the list of names that

51:27

they've got. So this is a proper team that

51:29

come into Frankmans Gardens next weekend, but I

51:32

think home advantage will just be enough for the

51:34

Saints. Yeah, because then that brings us on to

51:36

who they play or could play

51:38

in the semifinal. And we're

51:40

gonna call it the Grudge match. Five

51:42

meetings in the last four years. He

51:44

knows it all. Ronogara, head coach of

51:46

LaRue Schell, Munsterman, Lenster, Johnny Sexton's not

51:48

there, but the history of the games

51:51

in the knockout stage is LaRue Schell. I've

51:53

got their number. There's a lot going into

51:55

this. There's early doors in the championship with

51:57

it being a quarterfinal. Well, that's a me.

52:00

It's kind of like this, this picture has been

52:02

a final the last two years. So all of

52:04

a sudden you feel, you feel

52:06

like it's a little bit early in the tournament for,

52:08

for these two teams to be meeting, but Lara shell

52:10

seemed to have got lens as number a

52:12

little bit. And I said this yesterday, I think with

52:15

Lenser and Island a little bit, I

52:17

think you look at what England did to Island.

52:20

They basically match their power and stop their power

52:22

game. If you, if you allow Island or Lenser

52:24

to win collisions and dictate

52:26

play, then you're in a whole lot of

52:28

trouble. Whereas that's why I think Lara shell

52:30

have been so successful against Lenser because they've

52:32

got the ability to stop that

52:34

power with Antonio, with skeleton, with Donti

52:36

guys like this, who are just brute

52:38

athletes and I've got the ability to

52:40

stop that momentum in games. Whereas perhaps

52:43

other teams haven't quite got the ability

52:45

to hold that the momentum and

52:47

lose collision after collision after collision. So I think

52:49

that that's why Lara shell are so successful against

52:51

Lenser is cause they've got the ability to match

52:53

the power for power. But I

52:55

do think Lenser will fancy their chances this year. I

52:58

think Lara shell aren't quite the same team. I know

53:00

they had a brilliant win in

53:02

Cape Town over the weekend against the storm. I was

53:04

a little bit fortunate with obviously the conversion not being

53:06

slotted at the end, but I do, I do think

53:08

Lara shell are not quite the same. You know, they've

53:10

picked up a little bit of form the last month,

53:13

but you look at the top 14 this

53:15

year, they've been sort of around about seven or eight for

53:17

most of the season, now they start to climb a little

53:19

bit, but I mean, Ogara would have

53:21

would have been pretty happy with that draw, I think.

53:23

And you know, he's clearly a very, very good coach

53:25

and we'll, we'll, we'll have worked out another plan to

53:27

get the better of Lenser. Well, if Lara shell do

53:30

do it, it will be bigger

53:32

than anyone that they've had before. I think

53:34

because it will be third on the spin,

53:36

the dynasty that they speak about, but also

53:38

the way they've done it, cause they nearly

53:40

didn't make it. They nearly didn't make it.

53:42

They would have had to go away to

53:44

Cape Town, a way to Dublin, a way

53:46

to potentially Pretoria and then obviously the final

53:48

in London. So it's, um, it's

53:50

going to take some doing from them. Sometimes you just

53:53

know how to win big games. And because they've got

53:55

Lenser's number as well. So you're making the pressure. I

53:57

don't know. I don't know how the Irish team has.

54:00

I don't know how the Irish lads and the

54:02

coaches will deal with that maybe Jacques Nienauber having

54:04

him in and this is what I wanted to

54:06

ask you. I'm trying to see and again I'm

54:08

removed from the game so I'm watching it on

54:10

my iPhone with the kids screaming at me back

54:12

and then if I'm at home I'll record it

54:14

and go back and watch it but I have

54:16

a different view of the game to someone like

54:18

you, one of the greatest to have done it.

54:20

Have you seen any evolution, any more innovation and

54:22

I'll give you what I think I might have

54:24

seen as superficial as it is. I

54:28

don't remember Jameson Gibson-Parp being involved

54:30

as much almost like an Anton de Pont

54:33

feel to him now. Free roll. Free

54:35

roll, even an attack. So it feels like

54:37

now they're using the short side more which

54:39

will when you play against bigger teams and

54:42

like good defenses like La Ruchon at the

54:44

highest level, how you play down that

54:46

short side is really really important,

54:48

the manipulation around that. But I feel as

54:50

if he's maybe added more

54:52

to his game or he's been allowed to add

54:54

more because Johnny's not there and that's where in

54:56

my mind I'm thinking how do they beat La

54:59

Ruchon like because if they've been physically outdone that

55:02

physical dominance will still be there. So it's

55:04

going to be the small manipulations that they

55:06

have evolved in maybe under the Jacques Nienauber

55:08

that gives them. Yeah, 100%. I think a

55:10

little bit on that is that obviously with

55:12

Johnny retiring clearly he was the focal point

55:14

of everything that Leinzer and Ireland did. But

55:17

now you've got Jack Crowley in Ireland and

55:19

you've got Ross Byrne in at Leinzer who

55:21

clearly very experienced, Ross Byrne in particular is

55:23

a very experienced player. But

55:25

they probably look to the Jameson Gibson-Parp a little

55:27

bit more for direction on the field. They probably

55:30

look to him for saying right well what's the

55:32

option here rather than having a

55:34

Johnny type figure running the whole ship. For

55:36

me I think what's more impressive about him is

55:39

because Leinzer plays so much, so many attacking

55:41

phases and they move the ball and they're always

55:43

an option. But for me it's his

55:45

error count. His error count is so low. And

55:48

normally when you've got lots of balls and you've got lots of

55:50

play you are going to make errors. But

55:53

for me it just takes the right decision taking the short side for

55:55

a second round the weekend. Just

55:57

the ability when to go back to James Loade to

55:59

use it for action. length. Just I just think he's

56:02

if Anthony de Pomp probably wasn't on this planet then we'd

56:04

be saying this guy's the best nine in the world by

56:06

a mile. I thought Jameson

56:08

Gibson actually box kicked the ball quite a lot

56:10

on the weekend in terms especially in that first

56:12

half there was a couple of times around that

56:15

halfway line where the ball had gone slow and

56:17

they just thought well we're not interested in playing

56:19

here which is perhaps

56:21

a little bit that springbok influence if they're not

56:23

getting anywhere look to look to try something different

56:25

and but again I just thought he took control

56:27

of those situations really well against a Leicester team

56:30

who obviously came you know missing

56:32

a few players, Reffel, Martin, these guys who

56:34

obviously would have made a big difference but

56:37

that's such a well-drilled machine aren't they

56:39

Leinster that even when they're 69% possession

56:41

against them and territory they just still

56:43

find a way to win and probably

56:46

in third gear really weren't there on the weekend so

56:48

full credit to Leicester but again did any of

56:51

us really think that Leicester could go there and

56:53

win on Saturday night? No. Probably

56:55

not. They overachieved when I looked at it. Yeah

56:57

100% in the actual game but I just think

57:00

there was too many of those games on the

57:02

weekend where you just thought there's not really a

57:04

chance of this team winning against against that team

57:06

but Leinster just critical workman like

57:08

performance never really got out of third gear

57:10

and they're gonna have to step up they're gonna

57:12

have to get out of third gear this weekend. I

57:15

think Leinster win. I

57:17

think Leinster win as well. Yeah it feels like

57:19

the momentas gathering with them that game against Leicester

57:21

the fact that it was a bit stuffy you

57:24

know they weren't at a third gear I had

57:26

an anonymous tip-off as well that came through on

57:28

Instagram that said the reason Jameson Gibson-Patt hasn't shaved

57:30

his hair or had his lid done is because

57:32

they've not won the Champions Cup so when they

57:34

do that's when he'll get it done. That's when

57:36

it's coming off. Because you know like he's running

57:39

around he's so good I'm just like I'm drawn.

57:41

Do you genuinely think do you look at like that

57:43

do you ever think about his lid or not? Never.

57:46

I will this Saturday when I'm watching the game.

57:48

But you haven't. Not massively. I know what you're

57:50

pointing to. I probably have had a glance of

57:52

it. Yeah and I think I think he's I

57:54

mean he's probably not short of a quid or

57:56

two either so he could probably get himself

57:59

out to Turkey or whatever. and get

58:01

the job done. Even Andre Astahason, he's had it

58:03

done in that mid-season break. He's

58:06

gone through the shedding phase and is

58:08

now coming back before our eyes as we play. But

58:11

that's it. Once he gets that done, he's complete. He needs to shave the

58:13

beard off as well and just go and moustache. I think he needs it.

58:15

Look, he needs regrooming. The way he's playing at the minute,

58:18

he may just keep going with it. Maybe

58:20

you can sort him out with a few products, Jim. A

58:22

moorland brawl. Yeah, we'll get him some moorland brawl. I don't

58:24

know if your hair grows back with that, Jimson, but we

58:26

can try and send you some over. You need to start,

58:28

you know, that powder that people have where you can fill

58:30

in the gaps. You know the powder, because you use

58:32

the powder, Rob. I know, I've heard other people talk

58:34

about that. Nanogen, it's cool. It's like fibres.

58:36

Bigs, you don't need it. You got a few greys for

58:38

out, then? That's the sun. Or

58:41

two kids. Yeah, very true. I'm not quite sure which one

58:43

it is. I normally go for the high and tight because

58:45

then you don't see the greys as much. Yeah, that's what

58:47

I do as well. Yeah, how old are you now, Rob?

58:51

33, I told you. Yeah, I

58:53

told you the other day. I was 34 when I was actually

58:55

33. You forgot, dear. Yeah. We

58:59

had a message on Instagram here, lads. So, fan

59:01

question. Oh, name? Name? Oh,

59:04

I didn't write the name down. Right.

59:07

So, you've got to pick one, you've got to bench

59:09

one, and you've got to drop one. Oh, the one

59:11

for game? Yeah, but it's got to be based on

59:13

current form or athletic potential,

59:15

because otherwise it might be

59:17

a quite easy question to answer. Kirtli

59:19

Avonser, Damian Panno, and

59:21

Fay Woboso, you've got to pick

59:23

one, you've got to bench one, and you've got to drop one. I

59:26

think I know which way I'm going, but... I'll

59:28

be honest, I'm not going to just agree with

59:30

you, because I've got history doing that. I'm easily

59:32

manipulated. Why don't you go first, then? Which

59:35

one do you want me to go? Who would you pick? Damian Panno.

59:37

I would agree with that. I'm going

59:39

the same wavelength, yeah. We've gone through

59:42

the reasons why. I think

59:44

he's the best winger. I know you use profiles

59:46

with him as just an athlete. Been there, done

59:49

it. Proven. Proven. No

59:52

complaints, yep. Who's on the bench, then? I'd

59:54

go Fay Woboso. If you hadn't said current

59:56

form, I think I would have flipped

59:58

the two of you. them round. But

1:00:01

I think in Caronville I thought he

1:00:03

was absolutely brilliant on the weekend. His

1:00:05

explosivity in contact, his pace, his power,

1:00:08

I don't think anybody tackled him front

1:00:10

up on the weekend. We've called on

1:00:12

airbags and again I'm not talented at

1:00:14

many things. I was a lover

1:00:16

and also identifying talent.

1:00:19

I saw this kid and

1:00:21

I was like they've got

1:00:23

it, that's it. Yeah, now he's got it. Usually

1:00:25

now when you get the ball you

1:00:27

need players, you need athletes

1:00:29

across the board that can, like Theo

1:00:32

Dan for example, a lesser

1:00:34

example, he's a hooker, but I watched him

1:00:36

early on. He's got something, yeah.

1:00:38

He's got something when he carries the ball.

1:00:41

Yeah. Right, he's got something. I watched very well so and I

1:00:43

was like I'm telling you now this kid

1:00:45

is going to be, if he stays fit, has

1:00:47

made it. Yeah, I agree. Because his point of

1:00:50

difference is forget the tries that he will score,

1:00:53

the power, just that you would

1:00:55

play players. His ability to beat

1:00:57

people, his ability to get his

1:00:59

team going forward and again a

1:01:01

little bit similar to Penno actually.

1:01:03

He pops up quite

1:01:05

often around those sort of working off

1:01:07

nine inside ten around those fringes and

1:01:10

I think on current form I would say he

1:01:12

just sneaks on the bench for me. And currently Aaron

1:01:14

said they're going to hate us on here because we've

1:01:16

built the South African beast and Rob, I don't know

1:01:18

whether this comes through off Instagram or... Rob just

1:01:20

stitched us up with his eyes. We were upsetting

1:01:22

someone, yeah. I know, of course. But currently

1:01:25

Aaron said he's the ball's best player. Yeah.

1:01:28

Like when he gets the ball, but it's based

1:01:30

on now and maybe it's because the

1:01:32

ball's, you know, we haven't

1:01:34

seen them as much. Currently Aaron said he's 100%

1:01:37

scoring a half trick next week at Franklin's Garden,

1:01:39

isn't he? 100%. But

1:01:41

if you went based on like the South

1:01:43

Africa, if you went based on the World Cup, you'd

1:01:45

probably, well you would say him, wouldn't you? I think

1:01:47

it's probably helped that Peno and

1:01:49

Feuwabosa were absolutely brilliant this weekend

1:01:53

to make our minds up, doesn't it? Yeah, when

1:01:55

you look at the stats on Feuwabosa just from

1:01:57

the weekend, 15 carries, 106 metres May

1:02:00

12 defenders be? I

1:02:03

got to be honest, I'm actually surprised it's not

1:02:05

more than that. It felt like it was more

1:02:07

when you're watching the game. But it's not even

1:02:09

the beat in the defender, is it? It's like

1:02:11

the meters after. Yeah. And

1:02:14

we've mentioned it, but that then meters around.

1:02:16

And quite often sometimes those stats could be misleading

1:02:18

from a back three point of view, because

1:02:21

obviously the wingers are catching it deep and bringing it

1:02:23

back. But there wasn't a huge amount of that in

1:02:25

his game on the weekend, was there? So those meters

1:02:27

were hard-earned meters as well. They've

1:02:29

got themselves a very, very

1:02:31

good player in that. How bitter

1:02:33

did he sound there? No, it's

1:02:35

nothing to do with it anymore. It's nothing to do

1:02:37

with it. It can't be my fault anymore. He's done

1:02:39

that. But just on that, a

1:02:42

shout out to Ethan Roots as well. 28

1:02:44

carries in the game as well. So

1:02:47

he was great. Do you see the

1:02:49

celebrations after? And this is how I view

1:02:52

rugby, right? Is I'm looking for stuff off

1:02:54

the ball and after the game. So when

1:02:56

they all jumped into each other, and

1:02:58

I was just a stroke off Joe Andra, I don't

1:03:00

know if you remember it, but they called it a

1:03:02

clash head. There was one at the weekend, so Faye

1:03:04

O'Boson's gone straight into Vincent, and he's on the floor

1:03:06

after I think he broke his nose. Faye

1:03:09

O'Boson jumped into him, but

1:03:11

he's good for Exeter. Been brilliant. Vincent.

1:03:14

Delivering pizza a few months ago. A

1:03:16

little story. A little story. But again, gift

1:03:19

to the athletes. Yeah, dynamic, quick, a

1:03:21

little bit in the mold of a Sam Simmons

1:03:23

type of player. Exactly. And it sort

1:03:25

of replaced like for like-ish in that

1:03:27

sense. So yeah, again, Exeter,

1:03:30

I thought Exeter had blown it, to be honest, because that

1:03:32

wind was so strong on the weekend. So,

1:03:35

so strong in terms of some of the conversion attempts

1:03:37

and some of the box kick attempts were just, you

1:03:39

know, they were laughable, weren't they, in terms of that.

1:03:42

So I thought to go in at 12.5 down

1:03:44

at halftime after having that strong a wind. But

1:03:46

I thought the second half, again, Faye O'Boson

1:03:49

came to the fore. Vincent came to the

1:03:51

fore. Ethan Routh

1:03:53

came before, just knocking and knocking and

1:03:55

knocking on the door. Old school, yeah. Old school,

1:03:57

yeah. Oh, that was that was an Exeter

1:03:59

performance. five, six years

1:04:01

ago, just getting the job done in the 20th.

1:04:04

They seemed to just spend all the time in

1:04:06

the 22, just picking and going, even to the

1:04:08

point where I think they saw

1:04:10

it right on halftime, they had literally had five

1:04:12

guys over and they just continued to pick and

1:04:14

go and pick and go. And I thought at

1:04:16

that point the game was gone. And I actually

1:04:18

thought Bath clearly didn't help them losing fin Russell

1:04:21

so early on. But I thought

1:04:23

Bath managed that first half really, really well

1:04:25

and to go in 12, five ahead was

1:04:28

a big plus. And I thought they'd see it

1:04:30

home then, but I thought actually, like I said, just

1:04:32

roll the sleeves up into that into that wind in

1:04:34

the second half crowd got behind them and they

1:04:37

just looked, they looked fit and they looked strong. They looked

1:04:39

a better team in the end and yeah,

1:04:41

so much. You forget the champions. They wanted you're

1:04:43

in COVID, didn't they? So I Hoggie, I completely

1:04:45

forgot. I was chatting to Stuart Hoggies. Oh, when

1:04:47

we won the champions, I was like, look at

1:04:49

that. I was like, Oh yeah, you actually did.

1:04:52

But no one remembers COVID, are they? They're very much

1:04:54

in a transition period. They've got

1:04:57

a lot of young players who

1:04:59

are clearly, clearly going to

1:05:01

be very good players. You know, your Christians,

1:05:03

your, your Dave Jenkins, your Vincent, your, your

1:05:05

guys like that. But they

1:05:08

probably need to spend two, three, four, see a

1:05:10

little bit like what North Hampton have done in

1:05:12

terms of they kept that core group

1:05:14

together for three, four, five years. And

1:05:17

now it's kind of paying dividends. Whereas I think

1:05:19

Exeter at the minute are probably in a little

1:05:21

bit of that stage. Are they good enough to

1:05:23

win the premiership or to win the champions

1:05:26

cup? Right now I,

1:05:28

I'm not sure, but I

1:05:30

think if they keep that group together, you can

1:05:32

tell that they're building something and they've obviously got

1:05:35

a track record of producing very, very good players

1:05:37

and, and championship winning teams. So I

1:05:39

think they've probably got the toughest test

1:05:41

going away to Toulouse this weekend. They'll

1:05:44

have belief in their own group. But I think,

1:05:47

I think Toulouse will, will, will be

1:05:49

relatively comfortable on the weekend. Yeah, I

1:05:51

agree. You know what I like about

1:05:53

Vincent is how fucked he looks at the end of

1:05:55

a game. He's like, no zagging off his face is

1:05:57

all over. That's cause we both had better than us

1:05:59

though. Yeah, but you see him last week as

1:06:01

well. He was the same. Yeah, I know zagging off Yeah,

1:06:03

there's some players who sort of look like after 80 minutes

1:06:05

Just look as if they've just been for a 10-minute spin

1:06:07

on the bike don't they and then there's others who? Make

1:06:10

it look yeah I tell

1:06:12

you why cuz I interviewed him last week and

1:06:14

then I thought when I was like looking back

1:06:16

at stuff and my memory of Michael Hooper was

1:06:18

he always looked fucked Yeah,

1:06:22

there's certain players like that. Yeah him someone

1:06:24

like Justin Tipperick looks as if he's just

1:06:26

sort of literally just strolled Strolled around the

1:06:28

pitch for for 18 minutes, but there's and

1:06:30

Andrew Porter walks on the pitch and his head's

1:06:32

bleeding Yeah, Alan winder and always look fucked to

1:06:35

me I was fucked from minute one, but he

1:06:37

had the most incredible engine to just keep digging

1:06:39

in for another 79 minutes Yeah, so

1:06:41

we always made a joke when we said we

1:06:43

actually think he's actually very unfit But

1:06:46

he's just got the most incredible digging and then

1:06:49

Yeah, just to keep going and going and going

1:06:51

so you looked as if he left it all out

1:06:53

there didn't they us for sure Rob

1:06:55

anything else happening in ruggles? Well,

1:06:57

it's about four weeks later on put men a

1:06:59

cello winning the six nations play with a tournament

1:07:01

So math or melon chenno you called

1:07:03

it didn't you it some name as well, isn't it? Oh,

1:07:05

I need and his body was in his bed a damn

1:07:08

bigger and Jim Hamilton, isn't it? He's

1:07:10

in the bottom of it. Yeah Gosh

1:07:12

thoroughly deserved Thoroughly deserve people

1:07:15

don't think that people are calling Ben. Oh, I mean

1:07:17

Ben. Oh, it was brilliant Yeah, no, but but if

1:07:19

Ben would want it I'd have been saying exactly the

1:07:21

same thoroughly deserved I think you could have gone either

1:07:23

way with it I don't think you'd have had any

1:07:25

complaints from anybody if Ben Earl had won it I

1:07:27

don't think you can have any complaints that men and

1:07:29

cellos won it. What about them Stephen

1:07:31

kits off He's had enough of the weather island did

1:07:33

a bit of digging in this actually Stephen

1:07:35

get your kits off. We did a live show

1:07:38

with him in Dublin really nice bloke So

1:07:40

a few things should I say what I've heard?

1:07:42

Yeah, yeah fire away Well all the

1:07:45

talk in South Africa at the minute is around next captain

1:07:47

So they're looking for the next captain So that's one part

1:07:49

of it and his name is in the ring The

1:07:52

other one I've heard is that Rasi wants them

1:07:54

back playing in South Africa as well So

1:07:57

that's the kind of the headline of why he would

1:07:59

go back captaincy things available

1:08:01

but things clearly aren't good at Ulster

1:08:03

are they? And you think about in

1:08:05

terms of what they need as a team and this

1:08:07

is chatting to Stevie Ferris going back and forth and

1:08:10

he said is it a bit weird? And he said

1:08:12

it's not weird, he said we don't need a loose

1:08:14

head, the Scrummer's struggling anyway and Steve hasn't

1:08:17

improved that, it's just the same because it's more

1:08:19

than the loose head. He's like

1:08:21

so the fee that he probably gets, the fact that

1:08:23

it's rained for six months in Ulster and he's been

1:08:25

going back to Cape Town, going home quite a lot,

1:08:28

he's got his business there. I thought

1:08:30

it was a weird, I thought it was a

1:08:32

big signing for Ulster. Huge signing, yeah. But a

1:08:34

weird kind of sign of him, maybe it was

1:08:36

the Duane for Muhland effect but I don't know

1:08:38

if Ulster are struggling aren't they, loads of things

1:08:40

like the pitch. Yeah, they obviously had a good

1:08:42

win on the weekend against Montpellier but on

1:08:45

the whole they've been struggling.

1:08:47

CEO's gone. CEO, head coach,

1:08:49

I think Richie Murphy's in

1:08:51

the interim job at the minute

1:08:53

isn't he? So yeah it's uncertain and obviously

1:08:55

I think Billy Burns is leaving for Munster

1:08:57

next year so at the minute they haven't

1:09:00

really got a household name as a

1:09:02

10 so they can actually do a bit

1:09:04

of work before the start of

1:09:06

the season but yeah it's a strange one because

1:09:08

like you said a big big sign in, three

1:09:11

year deal and to let him go after

1:09:13

a year things clearly haven't worked out, like

1:09:16

I said whether it's what they really needed, whether it's

1:09:18

you know they need to free up some money as

1:09:20

well because that's the way the game is

1:09:22

as well at the minute in terms of like you said

1:09:24

they may need to spend whatever they were

1:09:27

spending on Kits off on maybe bringing a

1:09:29

household name for 10 in. Yeah,

1:09:31

the interesting model in Ireland as we

1:09:33

segue, Chantus Davey did a bit of

1:09:35

insight because I was like well

1:09:37

why are like they're not funded like Linster

1:09:40

for example and he said they've only got

1:09:42

one centrally contracted player which is Ian Henderson

1:09:44

so the rest is like as it were.

1:09:46

It's got to be funded by Ulster. Exactly,

1:09:50

which will be ridiculous so it's a really interesting

1:09:52

model isn't there? I know they've got that a

1:09:54

little bit of friction, does a Harry Byrne go

1:09:56

up to Ulster, does a Ronan Kelleher go

1:09:59

up there? I don't know but it's a shame

1:10:01

to see them because they were going in a

1:10:03

good direction. It's just literally I can come crumbling

1:10:05

like Yeah So things are clearly not right to

1:10:07

Elster and they're gonna need a little bit of

1:10:09

work on and off the field I think ahead

1:10:11

of the head of the next year But you

1:10:13

know who knows a big win away

1:10:15

in Claremont which you know a challenge cup

1:10:18

could could save the season and and bring

1:10:20

Some positivity to it. But yeah, things

1:10:22

clearly aren't quite right there at the minute Alright

1:10:25

down. Let's round off the upcoming

1:10:27

fixtures. We're throwing some challenge cup ones there Yeah,

1:10:29

as well. Let's do it. There's only one challenge

1:10:31

cup winner Feel

1:10:36

like we should we should pay it some attention. Yes.

1:10:38

Let's do it. Let's do it Right.

1:10:40

So well actually your old club go

1:10:42

into King's home on Friday night Gloucester

1:10:44

Ospreys Yeah, I

1:10:46

think Gloucester turn the corner a little

1:10:49

bit of mail. Yeah, they have the big win against

1:10:51

Lester Zach Mercer obviously in brilliant

1:10:53

form. Yeah won the Prem Cup win down at

1:10:55

Walford Road There's always a bit of a

1:10:57

catalyst wasn't it that Prem Cup to

1:10:59

boost the season a little bit. So yeah, so I think Ospreys

1:11:02

have been in really good form actually for they've been

1:11:04

sort of flying the flag for the Welsh regions top

1:11:07

Welsh region in the URC which probably

1:11:09

isn't that difficult to be at

1:11:11

the minute, but they're going okay They seem to have

1:11:13

got a good a good team spirit

1:11:15

there Toby Boo's doing a decent job But I but

1:11:17

I think at home home again

1:11:20

home advantage is big and I think Gloucester

1:11:22

will will just pip it just pip it

1:11:24

Agree that'll be class. We'll round up

1:11:26

the Champions Club and then we'll talk the challenge

1:11:28

good board. Oh Quins. We both agree Bordeaux

1:11:31

Bordeaux Lents the Lara shell.

1:11:33

Did you give your prediction? I did I

1:11:35

think I just think Lentsa look at us

1:11:38

Hey, we're all on tune you've come in

1:11:40

Rob if you disagree on any of these as

1:11:42

well, Northampton balls Well,

1:11:45

I'm done. We pause slightly I'm

1:11:47

going both. Well, I am we go just

1:11:49

cuz I said Tell me why you're going

1:11:51

balls just mate. They are traveling a long

1:11:54

way because Aaron's is gonna come out and

1:11:56

score four tries On

1:12:00

the bench, big shout out to George Hendy.

1:12:02

Yeah, big shout out to, he was brilliant.

1:12:04

He was, the Scotsman. So the Challenge Cup

1:12:06

on Saturday, we mentioned Clement versus Ulster. Clement,

1:12:08

I think, will just take up. I'd be

1:12:11

very surprised if Ulster went. I don't think both teams are

1:12:13

in particularly great form, because Clement only just got past the

1:12:15

cheaters on the weekend, I think it was 27, 22, but

1:12:19

Clement at home, I think, will just

1:12:21

take up. Yeah, the Hollywood Bet Sharks

1:12:23

versus hashtag always Edinburgh. Sharks

1:12:25

are going better now. Sharks are going better.

1:12:27

Exactly, CEO, didn't they? My mate

1:12:29

owns the Sharks as well, and I met the CEO,

1:12:31

I like the CEO. Really? They're clearly

1:12:33

going to invest in the club. They've got

1:12:35

Andrej Hesse, the Hazen. Coming back. Coming back

1:12:38

as well. Trevor and Kanye? Oh yeah, yeah,

1:12:40

he's coming back. He's coming back, yeah. And

1:12:42

they've obviously got Ebonette, Sabath, Bongioumba, Nambi, they've

1:12:44

got Mazzoli, Mepimpe, looking around, they've

1:12:46

got some good players. They

1:12:48

shouldn't be where they are. Well, exactly, so

1:12:51

there's changes happening there, but Edinburgh, Matt, Edinburgh,

1:12:53

a good team like Glasgow. They're a good

1:12:55

team. I was impressed with Edinburgh on the weekend, actually.

1:12:58

I mean, again, Bayon sent a

1:13:00

second team, but Edinburgh still had to do

1:13:02

the job, and I thought they were worthy

1:13:04

winners. But if they're going to be in

1:13:06

a way win, I fancy maybe

1:13:08

Edinburgh to sneak up. Yeah, they lost

1:13:10

a couple of weeks ago. I fancy,

1:13:12

yeah, I think Edinburgh may sneak up.

1:13:15

Yeah, big shout out to Hamish Watson

1:13:17

on fire, again, just signed another year,

1:13:19

at least. Good player. Right,

1:13:21

Sunday, Toulouse, Exeter. Toulouse

1:13:23

by a couple of scores, I think. Yeah,

1:13:25

I had that as well. And the big one,

1:13:28

Benetton versus Conant. Feel

1:13:31

bad saying that. Half 12 on a Sunday. That's

1:13:33

the graveyard shift, isn't it? That's the graveyard shift, aye? But

1:13:36

it's lovely. Treviso's a lovely place, and we love

1:13:38

many fellow. There'll be some

1:13:41

lovely sort of pizza and peroni in the

1:13:43

town afterwards. I mean, like now, if I

1:13:45

was to play in a game, right

1:13:47

now... That's the one you're choosing? That's the one I choose.

1:13:50

I'd be like, right, put me in there, I'll come anywhere.

1:13:52

You'd be in Treviso Square, sipping on a nice cold peroni

1:13:54

by 3pm. I really would, but I'd be happy. That's the

1:13:56

game for me. Who do I think

1:13:58

will win that? I think Benetton... and being at

1:14:00

home will take that. Agree Rob? Yeah.

1:14:04

Pollard? Nice. They're

1:14:06

being harsh. Right lads,

1:14:09

we've got a few shout outs before we go. Isn't that right

1:14:11

Rob? You're going to shout out as well. We've got a few.

1:14:14

Yeah there is there. So Tyler, just dropped us an

1:14:16

email this week. Right Tyler. To say

1:14:18

that the Milan rugby community are organising for 50

1:14:20

rugby players from the Ukraine to come to Italy

1:14:22

this summer. For two weeks

1:14:24

of rugby camps at various clubs. All of

1:14:26

these players are obviously being greatly impacted by

1:14:29

the war. So they're arranging this trip to

1:14:31

hopefully offer them some respite from the situation

1:14:33

over there. So big hand to Tyler

1:14:35

and everyone involved over in Milan for sorting this out.

1:14:37

I liked how Rob read that. It was like he's

1:14:39

reading it but you're putting your own spin on it.

1:14:41

Yeah. Very

1:14:44

natural. You're engaged

1:14:47

in Tyler, what they're doing for Ukraine, like the Italian,

1:14:49

like a bit of a two week camp. Big shout

1:14:51

out to Tyler. Massive shout

1:14:53

out to Will Todd from Eastley RFC donating

1:14:56

a kidney to his brother. And because of that

1:14:58

we'll have to retire. We actually played his last

1:15:00

ever game this weekend at Romsey. So fair play

1:15:02

to Will and we hope everything goes well with

1:15:04

this. Right big shout out to Will.

1:15:06

Got another shout out Danny Brown. He's been in touch.

1:15:08

He's asking if we'll give him a shout out. Of

1:15:10

course we will. Because it's the mighty Coventry who in

1:15:12

front of a bumper 3000 fans bested. I'm

1:15:17

going to say beasted Cambridge. Is there beasted? Yeah basically

1:15:19

I've seen the score line. It's 64 points to

1:15:21

12 with Toby Venner scoring a

1:15:23

hat trick on his home debut. Well

1:15:25

in Toby. And a shout out to everyone

1:15:27

at Coventry. You know when I go home to cough? Like

1:15:29

I'll go round the old haunts and stuff like that. I'll take the

1:15:31

kids for a drive round the council states where I used to live.

1:15:34

And I was ball boy at Cov back in

1:15:37

the day when they were at the Butts Arena or

1:15:39

whatever close to me house. So it's weird, nostalgia. You

1:15:41

know like anything I see with like Coventry that

1:15:43

comes up it takes me to this weird place. They haven't

1:15:45

offered you like a player coach role right in general. No

1:15:47

I don't know. No. It doesn't appeal to you or? I

1:15:50

haven't got time. I don't want to put my hat in

1:15:52

the ring. Like there's a lot going

1:15:54

on but I have thought about giving back to the game.

1:15:56

So but just not yet. This is just giving back. I'm

1:15:58

giving a shout out. Big shout out to Coventry. James

1:16:00

Di Giorgio. Di Giorgio, yeah. That look

1:16:02

good? Yeah, that's it. So he emailed

1:16:04

in asking for a shout out to

1:16:07

the amazing under 13s from Maldon Rugby

1:16:09

Club who went on their first

1:16:11

international tour. Loose? Yeah. For

1:16:14

the parents. Yeah. They played

1:16:16

6 and won 5, so not a bad result, especially as

1:16:18

well because they were considering they played some under 14s as

1:16:20

well. So playing up against each group. But

1:16:22

James just wanted to say thanks to all the coaches

1:16:25

for taking them and all the lads themselves for being

1:16:27

brilliant. Yeah, I do love a tour. Yeah, we used

1:16:29

to go down to Temby down in West Wales, Caravan

1:16:31

Park. Kiln Park, I still remember it. You know that

1:16:33

the Caravans have all got their electricity plugs. Yeah. We

1:16:36

used to go around as a 13, 14 year

1:16:39

old pulling the plugs out of the electricity out

1:16:41

of the Caravans. So making sure people who've

1:16:43

got the lights on. So apologies to anyone

1:16:45

who was in Kiln Park 15, 16, 17

1:16:48

years ago had their electricity pulled up. I

1:16:50

do have a thing about Caravans. Beck's dad, a

1:16:52

Caravan salesman, made loads, lost loads, has brought it

1:16:54

back up to a level now and I go

1:16:56

around to the place where it's got all the

1:16:59

Caravans and I don't fit in it. It's

1:17:01

hilarious hearing him. He's like, mate, this one, you know, you put

1:17:03

an awning on the side, you'll be all right, you can stand

1:17:05

up. The toilet, like how small are the toilets? Who's

1:17:08

living it? That's worse than Tempe

1:17:10

Park. Yeah, it's not my choice

1:17:12

of holiday for that way, but each

1:17:15

their own gem, each of their own. It

1:17:17

is, yeah. Yeah,

1:17:19

I think a shout out to you, Gem. Thanks, Gem. Let's

1:17:21

give a shout out to Gem. I do feel a bit

1:17:23

shaky even today. A bigger shout out to

1:17:25

Gem for saving a man. Yeah, we don't know if it's

1:17:27

true. I might have completely made it up, but

1:17:30

the Rastafarian man, if you were there, please get in

1:17:32

touch with producer Rob and say it was there. Otherwise

1:17:34

I'm a psychopath and I need to go and get

1:17:37

some help. Right,

1:17:39

Biggs, thank you, mate. Absolute pleasure.

1:17:41

Thanks for having me. It's great to be

1:17:43

in studio. Yeah, it's awesome. Hopefully be back

1:17:45

again soon. Yeah, you definitely will. And producer

1:17:47

Rob as well. Cheers, lads. Cheers and thanks

1:17:49

for all the listeners. You're the most important.

1:17:52

So don't forget to check us out on

1:17:54

YouTube and make sure you're subscribed on... Spotify.

1:17:57

Does Biggs know what we do at the end? Well, we'll find out

1:17:59

now. He

1:18:03

doesn't listen. What

1:18:06

would your wife say if she was on her? She

1:18:08

would go rugby pod pod pod pod pod. There you

1:18:10

go.