0:00

The things that matters. I mean, they did have to split the money

0:02

21 ways. Oh, good. Okay, that's

0:04

true. It's true. It's for 21 people, so I saw

0:06

it. Yeah. Was that true? Yeah.

0:08

Yeah, that's why they had to split in the

0:10

21 seconds. Everyone had 21 seconds

0:12

each. It took each spit. Everyone's bar was 21 seconds. And

0:15

21 people sang that song? Mm-hmm. Yeah. I

0:17

don't know if it was 21's best. Okay, maybe not 21. No, no, no, not on

0:20

the song. No, you got the 20 like that. 21, and the whole crew, because

0:23

there's some that were in jail and stuff. Okay,

0:25

wait, so no, no. Yeah, no, wait. It was,

0:27

they had to divide it by how many people

0:29

was in the crew, and it came

0:31

to 21 seconds. Oh, okay. But how many

0:33

people were on the bus? On the

0:35

actual song, I think it was probably like six. Nah,

0:38

it's more than that. Is it more than that? Brent,

0:40

are we recording? Yeah. Oh.

0:44

I should know this. All right, since you guys know, say fucking much about

0:46

21 Sonic Crew. No, it's so Sonic Crew,

0:48

sorry. That was my era. How many members are so

0:50

Sonic Crew? Can you name? Ooh.

0:53

Ooh. Mega Man, Lisa Mafia,

0:55

Asha Dee, Romeo, the

0:58

one that said he worships the devil, and everyone was

1:00

like, is that him? Scat Dee

1:02

don't snitch. Yeah, and he's worshiped the people to

1:05

get rich. Okay, and then Harvey. Harvey.

1:07

Harvey, oh yeah. And then Oxide and New Tuna, was they

1:10

were part of it as well? Were they part of it?

1:12

Yeah, they were. Yeah, they were. And then there was the

1:14

other two guys. Remember that, oh, they made that song, not

1:16

Silent Witness. Oh, what was that song? It

1:18

was like a slow song, and there was a singer, and he was, I

1:20

think he was like Asian. Do

1:22

do do do do do do do do do do

1:24

do do do do do. I'm not even trying to

1:27

be funny right, but if you heard Asian slimes. Slaps.

1:30

It's. Why does it slap? Why

1:32

does it? Why does

1:34

it slap? Why does it slap? It's almost like

1:36

a music. It's almost like. Yeah, it's when we

1:38

tried like time. Yeah, yeah, that was time vibes.

1:41

Yo, but there's this kind of slap. Yeah. That

1:44

song. Yeah. See that one too.

1:46

I had this slap. Yeah. Come to

1:49

Asian music. How's that? Hi everyone. Hello.

1:51

What is this? You've walked in on

1:54

us mid conversation. Hi guys. And welcome

1:56

to episode one nine nine. I think

1:58

it is. Yeah, before

2:01

my... Yeah, yeah, it

2:03

is. And besides 199 of the

2:05

Veseet's podcast. Ba-ba-ba-ba-ba! Yeah!

2:11

We have a special guest that you might have

2:13

heard. You probably have definitely heard. Definitely have heard.

2:15

We're going to talk about why it's taking us

2:17

this long for... Yay! Big

2:20

problem! Two

2:23

other guests in this episode. But let me

2:25

introduce Isha Girl Tolly T. Just call me

2:27

Audrey. And... ZZ V! Ba-ba-ba-ba!

2:31

Yay! We're

2:34

going to do the proper introduction. No, we've done

2:36

it because ZZ's in a lot right now. Right, okay.

2:38

So, we have a special guest in the

2:40

building. She is a household

2:42

name. You are? A big,

2:45

bovar contestant. Mm-hmm. A

2:47

social commentator. Mm-hmm. A troublemaker.

2:49

A specialist. A social influencer.

2:53

Radio personality now. Radio personality. ZZ presenter. You

2:55

put your own show. Your very own Miss

2:57

ZZ Miss! Whoo!

3:01

Thank you! Thank

3:03

you. Hello, hi, how are you? Welcome,

3:06

ZZ. Hiya, girls. Hiya, honey.

3:09

Yes, thank you. So, for years and years of hosting this podcast, we've

3:11

always been, Get ZZ on, get ZZ on, get ZZ on. And

3:15

I had to act like I didn't see it. I had to

3:17

just say, act like I didn't see it. And to be sweet,

3:20

you're not talking to me. You're

3:22

not talking to me. You're not talking to me.

3:24

You're not talking to me. And

3:26

so, me and ZZ had beef. Yes.

3:30

But it was like a real world. It wasn't

3:32

a real beef. Do you know what? It was

3:34

a short beef. The industry does

3:36

that, but... Our beef is like how I feel

3:38

like grown women should be. Why,

3:41

okay, okay. Because it's like,

3:43

we didn't... We never said

3:46

anything about each other. We never said anything about

3:48

each other. We just kind of,

3:50

I don't know what it was, we just didn't

3:52

mesh well together. I think that's

3:54

what it was. I think I know what it was. What it was,

3:56

was I was introduced to you by the internet. Right, okay. And

4:00

I think if that's all you slowly know with you, I

4:02

was like, why is she saying this? Every

4:05

time there was certain things I'm like, why is

4:07

she saying this? I was initially introduced to you with

4:09

the whole district thing. And then I was backing

4:11

you, I was just like, wait, because people were like,

4:14

oh, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And I was

4:16

like, no, we can fight all fights. I remember tweeting,

4:18

I was like, it's a fight we're fighting because

4:20

we can fight all fights. You have

4:22

every right to be like, hey, why are you not letting black people in

4:24

your clubs? That is a fight we're fighting, cool, that's

4:26

that. And I think there was other things that I

4:28

was like, I think it's the thing of that, because

4:31

I am so happy, like, I love women, women, women,

4:33

women, women, you're not necessarily like that. Well,

4:36

see, this is the thing, I think that

4:38

people get it misconstrued. I think

4:40

they think that I'm not women,

4:43

women. My thing is kind

4:45

of like, I'm just I like to look, I sit

4:47

in the middle sometimes, which is people don't get. As

4:49

in I will look at things holistically. But I look

4:52

at it and if I think I agree with the

4:54

women on this point, then I agree with the women.

4:56

If I agree with the men, then I agree with

4:58

the men. But also what happens as well is that

5:00

when I do say stuff about the women, the women

5:02

are the ones that react the most. And if I

5:05

say something about the men, the men, they don't care.

5:08

If that makes sense. So I think what it

5:10

was with me and you is that I know

5:12

what it was is somebody had sent me

5:14

something on the podcast where someone

5:16

had said, oh, I think someone said, oh, we should get

5:19

a run. And then you kind of dismissed it and said

5:21

something. And then someone had sent it to me. And I

5:23

think quite a few people said it to me. And I

5:25

felt the fact that quite a few people had sent it

5:27

to me made me feel like I

5:29

didn't like that. We had now it was

5:32

now like a thing that people could spot.

5:34

There was something. And I

5:36

think what it was was I think I think

5:38

you didn't necessarily agree with me, maybe talking about

5:40

who men dated. I think it was something along the

5:43

lines of that. I think it was something like you.

5:45

Why do we care about who they date? Yeah, yeah,

5:47

yeah. And I was kind of like, I get that.

5:49

Yeah, yeah. But also, I also

5:51

know that it's difficult for black women

5:53

to be in this space. So I'm

5:55

kind of even if

5:57

I don't like a person, if they're doing something great.

6:00

I kind of separate the both. But yeah, yeah, absolutely.

6:02

So I won't necessarily, if I don't necessarily like you

6:04

totally, I'm not going to say I don't like receipts. Yeah, yeah,

6:07

yeah. You get what I'm saying? Because I understand what you've

6:09

done and I understand how hard it is to get

6:11

in the spaces that you're in. And you know what

6:13

I mean? At the time you guys were like

6:15

really, you had the billboards and everything

6:17

like that. And it was a lovely, beautiful thing

6:19

to see. So I would never take that away

6:21

from you guys. So my thing was, why did

6:24

we have to make it like a public thing?

6:26

I was thinking we never had a thing until

6:28

Ghana. Yeah. I think we were on the same

6:30

table in a club in Ghana, just a club in

6:32

Ghana. I know, right. That's a bitch nigga's table.

6:34

To bring girls together. We

6:37

were on the table. And then I think you

6:39

was just like, is there a problem? And it wasn't in the

6:41

sense of like, yo, what's your problem? It was just like, what

6:43

exactly? Yeah, there's nothing here. Yeah, there's nothing here.

6:45

It was a problem sort of thing. And I was like, you know

6:47

what? They kind of... And we kind of just spoke

6:49

it. We left it. Yeah. Like everything

6:51

we just said here, we said there

6:53

in Ghana. And it was done

6:55

as that. Because ultimately, I respect

6:57

everything you guys have done. Thank you. Regardless

6:59

if like, maybe if I've seen you out

7:01

and I've been like before, and you were

7:03

like, no, I haven't said hello to the

7:05

police. It was always that I respect what

7:08

you guys have done as black women because

7:10

it's extremely hard to do whatever we want

7:12

to do. No, no, no. In an opinionated

7:14

being what, etc. And that's

7:16

why I say I think it was mature because we could be in

7:18

the same room and we would never... And it would be... No

7:20

one would ever know. It was like a mature thing. And that's why

7:22

I always say like, sometimes I don't... She might not mess with people.

7:24

I don't think she might even like seeing people. I

7:27

think there is a thing of like conflicting views can exist

7:30

without it being I hate this girl. Yeah, right. Yeah, yeah,

7:32

yeah. I wish it down for me. I just don't agree

7:34

with what she said. And I think talking about this is

7:36

probably the same thing because I don't agree with that. Yeah.

7:38

But I don't wish you ill. I don't wish you down

7:40

for it. I just don't agree with that. I think that's

7:42

also about maturing as well. Yeah, definitely. When we are younger,

7:45

we do think that like if someone disagrees with you... That

7:47

they hate you. But as you get older,

7:49

you be like actually like even in friendship circles,

7:51

your closest friend, your parents, whatever, you disagree with

7:53

them and then you move on. They don't even

7:55

hate them. I feel like with you, that's one of

7:58

my favourite things about you because... I

8:00

know that you can take it and I feel like that's something

8:02

that people don't necessarily give you

8:04

credit for. Like, Zizi can ditch but she can also take

8:06

it. Like, you can sit here in this conversation and we

8:08

can have a back and forth and you're not going to

8:11

take it personally. It's not personal. We

8:14

can have a conversation about it and move on. But

8:16

people do pick people up against each other. It's like,

8:18

just because you don't agree doesn't mean you dislike each

8:20

other. Like, you can have completely different

8:22

views. Like, always say like, Zizi's

8:24

one of the nicest people in the industry.

8:27

We always say that. Like, every time we're

8:29

out, we're like, no, Zizi's the nicest person. You

8:31

treat them and I'm like, why is Zizi doing it?

8:34

Like, why is she doing this? She's

8:36

like, she's a nice girl. It actually is what I

8:38

said, why is she doing this? Literally,

8:40

like, I'm across the shadow of my question.

8:42

She's actually so good. Do you like to

8:44

troll the people? No, but I

8:46

probably am going to get onto it. But

8:48

this is the reason why I wanted to

8:50

do Big Brother. Yeah, because I wanted people

8:53

to see that I am that. Like, I'm

8:55

also this as well. I don't

8:57

know, anything wrong with you doing Big Brother? No, as in like, I

9:00

am multi-faceted. I am, I

9:02

can be dig, dig, dig, dig, but

9:04

I also am just a calm girl.

9:06

Like, we've had conversations where you are

9:08

extremely soft. Yeah, exactly. Very much

9:10

so. And then I do talk about it, it's

9:12

almost like her mental health must be set up differently. Yeah, let

9:15

me tell you. I don't know how you take the noise. Yeah,

9:17

how do you do it? There's certain things I think that I'm like, it's

9:19

not worth me talking about because I don't want the noise. No,

9:22

no, no. And as time has gone on, even though

9:24

it might be hard to believe, I've had to learn

9:26

what hills I want to die on. Yeah, because of that.

9:29

Literally, we're seeing what we're talking about now because there'll be

9:31

times when I'm just annoyed.

9:33

I'm snapping at people in my everyday life

9:35

for no reason and I'm wondering why. It's

9:38

probably because someone has said something to me on the internet and

9:40

I've had to refrain from telling

9:43

them to piss off. Yeah,

9:45

I was like, no, no, no. And then I

9:47

take it out on the person close to me. But you have

9:49

to. But yeah, I know there's times when

9:51

I'll have a cry. There's times

9:53

when I've got really good support system. So

9:55

I can call people and I can have

9:58

like a then. And then also. what

10:00

I have learned as well is, is

10:02

do I want to debate or is this just

10:05

my opinion? So sometimes if I want to have a

10:07

debate, then I will read the comments. And then other

10:09

times if I don't want to debate, if this is

10:11

just literally like I'm putting my thing out, I put

10:13

it out there and I won't read the comments. It

10:15

is what it is. Everything has been said. I can't

10:17

do anything now. But it

10:20

is, if it's, and

10:22

it's been going, I've learned like that for

10:24

about five, six years now. It's been a bit

10:26

longer, you know. And also you've been in it

10:28

for five, six years. Because I think I'm

10:31

definitely at a stage with the internet with commentary to

10:33

be like, oh, there's time to say that. Do

10:35

you know there was a time you said yes to every

10:37

baby of five. I said yes to every audience

10:40

of the business, I'm coming on this. I say

10:42

no all the time now because ultimately it's not

10:44

worth the ag. It's not worth the ag that

10:46

comes with it. And I'm just trying to like,

10:48

here's what I give you, leave me alone

10:50

for anything else. You know what I mean? I'm

10:52

not, I don't, I definitely purposely took myself out

10:54

of that space to be the voice. I'm

10:56

not a social commentator. I talk on the back.

10:59

Leave me alone. Yeah. I think because

11:01

how I started was always giving my opinion.

11:03

So for me now, it's like I still,

11:06

the thing is I actually genuinely do like

11:08

give my opinion. Yeah. There'll be times like

11:10

when I won't want to give my opinion.

11:12

And then now like recently I've been at

11:14

home, I've been like, oh, maybe I

11:17

should do like a little thought of the weekend. I'll

11:19

go and just set up a camera and share my

11:21

opinion because sometimes I genuinely just want to get stuff

11:23

off my chest. And then there's sometimes when I don't

11:25

and I kind of enjoy that I'm getting to a

11:28

stage in my career now when I can maybe

11:30

decide what I want to talk about, what I

11:33

don't want to talk about. Whereas in the beginning

11:35

I did feel as if I had to always

11:37

speak on every week on what was happening and

11:39

what was not. But as you were saying, for

11:41

your mental, it's just not good. And

11:45

also as you get older, you don't actually care

11:47

about that much stuff. You actually

11:49

genuinely don't care about that many.

11:52

There's certain things that would rub me

11:54

up the wrong way three Years ago.

11:56

And Now I feel it. I'm thinking I don't

11:58

lose anything. The Internet? I

12:00

people debate about that as you don't either. Yeah,

12:02

why would you look at Africa as. Well,

12:06

as I say, we got yeah, I see that.

12:08

I've stopped not be close. I just feel like.

12:11

The. Internet's getting mean of in Lena and

12:13

some because there was. A time I was that

12:15

person as well like even before that before the Pa

12:17

cause I had a a bit of a follow it

12:19

actually considering others and I once had a bit of

12:21

a follow in you as it is because I sit

12:23

in June ninth and I use as a three or

12:25

my opinions. Of everything mad things and

12:27

slide. Now I've stopped because I've

12:29

seen how careless people can be

12:31

and you innocently get involved in

12:33

the conversation and then. They.

12:35

Such how to do you out of a thing. yeah

12:38

I mean and I'm just like all that some of

12:40

I'm gagging. Stay above. That there was something I don't sweat

12:42

the of they know seconds give my pin in Mumbai. Know

12:44

because they might try to you. I behave.

12:46

And then the i know where say it's

12:48

been good if in this way to success

12:50

for a specific thing I think you I

12:53

see many people realize. I don't know like

12:55

what of advice don't know the passengers them

12:57

as of the make sense I can make

12:59

them for yeah that happens often but. When

13:01

used in now with everything that has he

13:03

sees of majesty's was a social commentary or

13:05

is within them this know I love to

13:07

social commentary. Had not given my opinion if

13:09

I could. The. Easiest way I

13:11

would. Probably be able to

13:14

describe myself. A thing called Charlemagne.

13:17

Like. I say even how was your son

13:19

of I think I have spoken of might

13:21

as well yeah I mean said but he

13:23

gives his opinion where he feels lucky me

13:25

give you the Pnc eyes and also he

13:28

sits in so many different spacey yeah he

13:30

sits in politics sometimes it's nice and easy

13:32

seat so a nice claims as they know

13:34

they have the things instead he needs. The

13:37

all star he's does radio said so

13:39

time he is. Kind of like what

13:41

I'd like. That type of been able

13:43

to see insulates different things and to

13:45

speak one. When. I. When.

13:48

I feel to speak one thing that makes.

13:50

Sense. Yeah, you know what has a sister? Had

13:52

to think that it's on Superbike as we like.

13:54

I think we'd we'd be a whole band on

13:57

women's hood and life. i'm very adamant

13:59

that how I was brought up, I, women

14:02

heavy, I'm very like, everything I do is

14:04

like a love letter to the black women who

14:06

love me, especially, but women, like that's like the lead

14:08

of my thing. To the point that we said no

14:10

to many things that were like, oh, women

14:12

might feel a way about that. Like even if it's not a

14:14

70 hour, like, I'll fight to fight, we're like, oh, or we'll

14:17

send no to welcome to the band because they wasn't like a

14:19

specific woman. Right, okay. Oh, like that kind of thing, we'll be

14:21

like, oh no, we won't do this, because in a way that

14:23

it's actually black fired and I'll ask it. I'm not doing

14:25

that anymore. I'm not doing that anymore. I'm

14:30

going with the baggies. We didn't get

14:32

that in return when we were

14:34

in smoke. Right, right. And we were like,

14:36

in the back end, the man of things who said no

14:38

to you, the man who gets money that we've been like,

14:40

this man is not a woman, this person. Like,

14:43

it's a point that's not having you on it. We'll be

14:45

like, oh, girls don't really love her too much. You might

14:47

be a problem then. Do you know what I mean? Just

14:49

like, because we're so, oh, women at the

14:51

forefront. And I think what, weirdly, I find the sign

14:53

about you, it's like, I care about me in this

14:56

industry. See, this

14:58

is the thing. Am I wrong to think that?

15:02

See, I feel... So

15:05

I feel like you're an island on your own, but in a good way.

15:07

Is this how it comes across? No, but I

15:09

feel like you do your own thing with like,

15:16

your own apology. I don't think it's a bad

15:18

thing at all. I feel like in turn of

15:20

me doing my own thing, hopefully that shows other

15:22

people that it can be done. That's

15:25

why I think it's a good thing. It's kind of like, and

15:27

also, again, the

15:31

thing that warmed my heart the most when

15:33

I came out of the house was all

15:36

the, was the response from black

15:38

women, obviously. You were amazing on me brother. You

15:40

were so amazing. But the black women, because you

15:42

know what it was? How

15:44

are you, what you describe is sometimes how I

15:46

feel like black women might think about me. Yeah,

15:48

yeah. Like I might not necessarily, this is not

15:50

what you're saying, but that I might not be

15:52

for them, or I might not be for women

15:54

as a whole, or I'm on my own

15:57

and I'm not like, maybe how other

15:59

people are. But my thing was

16:01

when I came when I went on that show.

16:03

It was to try and so black

16:06

women in the best possible way that

16:08

I. Know. That we are

16:10

as blacks in the idea that they're not

16:12

all of us and. You. Know

16:14

we were said so many different types

16:16

of lack the means and and although

16:19

we might be very opinionated were also

16:21

very soft am will very Aussie club

16:23

We also very intelligent and a half

16:25

the caviar cells in situations were not

16:27

these like yes there are as we

16:29

can be loud by is so I

16:31

they says what would my heart was

16:33

a bathroom he said thank you for

16:35

the my a good representation of of.

16:38

Of. What black women can be are

16:40

black women are so said me like

16:42

that was what made that's what makes

16:44

me feel like oh I'm. For.

16:46

Women if that makes sense for me. Now

16:48

like living your life? What did? What's what's

16:50

you seem to apply it to know what

16:52

me like? I don't have your own Some

16:54

definite yeah. Not. Even that

16:56

apple capacity to live representation is very it's

16:59

very important they said me if I'm in

17:01

the public eye or some it where people

17:03

can see the best thing I would like

17:06

to conceive of the women is the kind

17:08

of time myself in the way the I

17:10

would. Ask who lost his. Nice.

17:14

In. A way holistically kind of even. I'm

17:16

really happy name Id say I'm sick sometimes

17:18

that as a black than he can see

17:20

or other people outside of our culture can

17:23

see a blast. Oh at black women are

17:25

not aggressive will decide if that makes sense

17:27

I hear what you mean for I feel

17:29

like if it a problem if it's a

17:32

thing where you have to accept know because

17:34

this me yet or what I'm saying is

17:36

it's just like. So.

17:38

Said means that of me necessarily because I

17:40

don't assume wide so no one trying to

17:43

say. sometimes I feel like when women are

17:45

sites on for women I can't say I'm

17:47

for women because I've not always gonna agree

17:49

with everything. I mean thing I see what

17:51

happens now is that when you say that

17:53

your. Fault with you Thought you can't correct women

17:56

if that makes sense. They said me the

17:58

best ways The kind of like. Be.

18:00

For women is to try to carry

18:02

myself in the best way. Said that

18:05

people. Yeah the a representation of. Of.

18:08

Black women if if I make and I bet you

18:10

are making sense that exact way sense of like I'm

18:12

going to be with his at myself in a way

18:14

that because it's that woman is a whole yeah why

18:16

was I think C B night. Obviously

18:20

the as many things that women do on a

18:22

daily basis. You do

18:24

that for I make a jackal fine. but I

18:26

suppose when Ms let's not what they want to

18:28

give up. I think we're in a pet a

18:30

society where. We. Can to keep

18:32

women so out loudly in the world I

18:34

give an example of like black cinema. My.

18:37

Head if I'm black shows that he did

18:39

I wasn't as a shit. What I'll never

18:41

say about the Eiger when not enough tasty

18:43

and where did was I could see such

18:45

a good at what she and then again

18:47

she and the gym and and know why

18:49

filings are supported much. I see that in

18:51

the same of like I'm for the encyclopedia

18:53

anaheim. Then. I would you do as

18:56

much as I'd like if anything that you couldn't he

18:58

said i didn't mean it said if we would never

19:00

sit on his in my case I didn't benefit in

19:02

a negative and of my of so if any suggestions

19:04

able to but then do not feel like. So.

19:07

Then. What? About when it's

19:09

such as the groups and then sometimes as

19:11

well that's what sometimes I think half as

19:13

meet people dancing com target in said why

19:15

specifically but if I say oh i feel

19:17

like women sometimes we don't know what we

19:19

want yes but we're not. Day at the

19:21

site allows you to see can say it

19:23

here you can stay on the site would

19:25

I laid low by audiophile who listens to

19:27

be have enough that say not legally Saturday

19:29

but I do. This is a thing I

19:31

don't agree. Anyway is a safe space on

19:33

the internet. The press know the people up

19:35

analysis. The hot weather is to talk. About

19:38

this is my through like this is a

19:40

podcasts we are anything for me this bit

19:42

now in ah say the I now so

19:44

a can take this put on say I'll

19:46

ask them anything I say this I mean

19:48

anything I say yes. out in

19:50

the open elicits between me and my mates

19:52

and the group chat and what have i

19:54

am is wanted his own that's the only

19:57

times gonna be personal but the moment now

19:59

on any open platform I think it's,

20:02

everyone hasn't opened this up yet. Yeah, yeah,

20:04

yeah. I feel like with the big

20:06

brother thing, I think with you, a

20:08

lot of people, if you're only familiar with

20:10

someone online, it's really easy to just

20:13

paint the entire picture that the person is

20:15

that way. Yeah, of course. So I feel

20:17

like with big brother, I don't even think

20:19

you were performing representation of black

20:21

women. I think you would just think

20:23

of yourself and showing the other side of you,

20:25

which is the side that we know. Yeah, and

20:27

that's what I was saying. That was for me,

20:30

that was my thing. Because I've also talked, when

20:32

I talk about black women in reality shows, I

20:34

say, unfortunately, I know, I've said

20:36

this before, well, it's not up to her

20:38

to represent all black women. And I'm always

20:40

said, well, unfortunately, it kind of is because

20:44

we don't, luckily it

20:46

was me and Marisha on big brother, so those two

20:48

black women, two different types of black women as well.

20:51

So that was kind of the first one that we see. Normally,

20:53

there's just one of us in there and that's it. Whereas

20:55

when there's other races, there's about four of them,

20:58

so there's different types of white women that you

21:00

get to see. So unfortunately, we

21:02

do end up becoming the representation of all black

21:04

women in the UK, because everyone is now reminded.

21:06

And I think when you do go into those

21:09

types of shows, you have to kind of understand

21:11

that, that you are going to be representing a

21:13

lot of all black women. So for me, I

21:16

was just, I was aware of that.

21:18

But also when I went on there, like loads of my

21:20

friends that knew I was going on, they said to me,

21:22

oh, make sure you're careful, make sure you're this method to

21:24

those of you. I am not

21:26

going to be any different how I am in the

21:28

real world, because in the real world, I have to

21:30

monitor how I think, how I see as a black

21:32

woman every day when I go into a certain environment,

21:34

I have to be like, oh, is my tone too

21:36

much? Because I don't want them to think I'm aggressive.

21:38

I don't want them to think this, you know what

21:40

I mean? So there's actually no different apart from being,

21:42

it's the camera in your face. But every day is

21:45

black women. And I think that's why loads of black

21:47

women, I think that's why when people watched it, they,

21:52

loads of black women resonated with it because it's

21:54

like, this is us in our workplace every day.

21:57

Like without a camera, this is the microaggressions that I have

21:59

to kind of. deal with. So yeah,

22:01

that was, it was just, that's

22:03

how I kind of, that's what I mean about speaking

22:06

negatively about us on the internet. Not objectively, but

22:08

because I'm like, because we don't get the free

22:10

will of people being like, Oh, that's just a certain group. Right.

22:13

Okay. So then if one of us is saying, and again,

22:15

just like, it's not on you, it's like, to people who

22:17

take it, because when you're saying, you're not saying all black

22:19

girls are dumb. Yeah. But then there's some people that are

22:21

like, and I think what all this gets me is that

22:23

it's not you, it's the male replies. Yeah, it's what like

22:25

about these, you should have pulled up the girls. Yeah, the

22:27

girls are dumb. You got

22:29

my call. That's

22:34

the whole point. So that's the man on purpose.

22:36

It's something that men have been very good at

22:38

for a long time, pin women against each other.

22:40

Yeah, it's, you know what I mean? And which

22:42

is why that, you know, they say like, pick

22:44

me and stuff like this, because at the end

22:46

of the day, you're the beneficiary of these things.

22:48

You know what I mean? If you can get

22:50

the male approval or whatever. So men do that

22:52

on purpose, because they're trying to further cause division.

22:54

Do you know what I mean? So even

22:56

though I feel like more time, I don't even

22:58

know what they're agreeing with. Do you know what

23:00

I mean? They can just, they're just happy that other

23:02

women are in the uproar about it. And that's enough.

23:06

As black women, how do we connect each

23:08

other? Well, this is what I'm saying.

23:10

This is fake. Yeah. Sometimes, don't get me wrong. There

23:12

are times when I think people also do

23:17

think this about me. Like I say things and I'm like,

23:20

but I do generally think about things that I'm going to

23:22

put out there. And then like you said, there's loads of

23:24

times when I've seen things and I'll be like, what

23:27

is going on here? And I'll just be like, oh man. And

23:29

I just think, I'm not even going to say nothing. The most

23:31

recent is like, I'm a lay one. I saw it and I

23:33

was like, yeah, no. It's not

23:35

what we're talking about. I'm just talking about it. Whatever.

23:37

I've injected my two bits. There's

23:43

like times when I've been like, oh, do I

23:45

do what? And then I think to myself, okay,

23:47

but then how do we have these discussions? How?

23:50

Do you know what it is? Unfortunately, and

23:52

I know it's not realistic to not have

23:54

a group think when it comes to us,

23:57

but I honestly think the only way is

23:59

if we. just accept that we're not

24:01

monolithic. For everyone

24:03

less like you there is a zeezy, and

24:06

that's what feminism is supposed to be, freedom of

24:08

choice. And so once we accept that people are

24:10

different, there's not going to be everyone is not

24:12

going to be living by a code. Not everybody

24:14

is going to be doing the black. Guess what?

24:16

Some people just want to exist, you know? And

24:19

I'm not even, I'm not mad. Every day

24:21

I'm trying to lean, because all

24:23

this fight, fight, fight

24:25

becomes very exhausting. Like we saw on the other end

24:27

of like when you give and give. And

24:30

it doesn't always pay off. We

24:32

don't want to talk about a lot of

24:34

the things we do behind the scenes

24:38

to empower. We're not loud about it, you know what

24:41

I mean? But I feel like those things in

24:43

a way more important because you're actually making a

24:45

stand when it affects money and

24:47

representation, all of that stuff. And that's a lot of things that we do behind

24:49

the scenes. But if you just accept that people just,

24:51

some people just want to exist, I'm not mad at

24:53

those people at all. Not everybody wants to think about

24:55

their hair. Not everybody wants to think about, you

24:58

know, this group think mentality. Not everybody wants to be

25:00

one, not everybody wants to live on code. And I

25:02

feel like on Twitter, especially, it is

25:06

like that. Like people expect everybody to be

25:08

monolithic and it's just, you just can't. So

25:10

once you start to accept that, you just

25:12

think, oh, it doesn't, it doesn't matter. Essentially

25:14

what Zizi says, because one, she's not talking

25:16

to me. Like I'm not going to wear that,

25:18

that shoe doesn't fit. And two,

25:20

like, so just let people be. And so

25:22

basically we don't actually need to correct each other. Yeah,

25:24

because I just let people see and make

25:26

their own miss. I mean, if it's dangerous, but

25:30

then yes, I feel like we are

25:32

going down a dangerous road.

25:35

Because we're not correcting each other. Yeah. I just

25:37

think that, and also if I agree with you,

25:39

I think it should be one way or the

25:41

other. I think what I find confusing now is

25:44

that we, and I think also we

25:46

are all a little bit confused as well. I think there's

25:49

times of changing, like a lot of people don't, men don't

25:51

really know what they're supposed

25:53

to be doing anymore. Like we, we kind

25:55

of, like we said one minute, we kind

25:57

of like, we want to be, and then we're

25:59

like, no. And then we kind of, but

26:01

that's because we're all trying to think about. We're

26:03

right in that transitional phase. We're

26:05

right. We are the transitive. And everyone, the

26:07

dynamics of the world has changed, women and

26:10

now, we actually, I saw some evidence,

26:12

it's like, we, I don't, men and women, we

26:14

don't actually like need each other for the reasons

26:16

why we needed each other back in the day.

26:19

And I think because we kind of, that's what

26:21

we've all been brought up on, don't have moral

26:23

values now, we kind of don't know what to

26:25

do. We don't know why we need each

26:27

other. That makes sense. Do you know what I mean? So everyone's a

26:29

bit confused. I say, I think it's

26:31

because we don't need each other that we're not

26:33

confused because it has to be a want. Right.

26:35

Yeah. When I think about dating or who

26:37

I'm dating, whatever, I don't necessarily need you, I have to

26:40

want you. And I think it's really hard to be wanted

26:42

as a man, especially. Yeah. It's easy

26:44

to be needed. Like, I'll pay for this. I'll pay for this. You need

26:46

me to get a mortgage. You need me to get a bank account. And

26:48

I don't need you to have to want you. I'll shit

26:50

my personality matters. Yeah. I treat you matters.

26:52

What I say matters, what I believe matters. I think it's harder to be

26:54

wanted than it is to be needed. And

26:57

then that's why there's always this like power dynamic

26:59

struggle now as well. Yeah. Because it's

27:01

like, like you said, that they want to

27:03

feel needed or that we need them. And

27:06

it's like, why don't need you? I don't need you.

27:08

I would like to have you around me and that's

27:10

nice. But then they kind of don't know where to

27:12

place their value because they've been told basically that it's

27:15

all a part of them providing. Yeah.

27:18

Yeah. Like manhood is put in.

27:20

Protect and provide. It's a provider. For

27:22

the women, they can't really do that. And

27:24

it's mad though because all these femininity coaches and

27:27

stuff like that who pissed me off tremendously, they'll

27:29

say things like, okay, yeah, men need

27:31

to feel needed. So, you know, as women,

27:34

maybe there's things that we should do to

27:36

just basically pander to their ego a little

27:38

bit. So, you know, just pretend that you need

27:40

help fixing your car. I

27:42

do though. Or like pretend that I would

27:44

do things like to help them out. Oh,

27:47

I am. I

27:51

am a loud one. This

27:53

is another thing. I think maybe you, I

27:55

feel like Audrey, you, I feel like me

27:57

and Tolly, we have, we might come across

27:59

similar. on the internet where I feel

28:01

like you come across quite softly. Oh, do

28:04

you feel like you're like a bit likeable?

28:06

I've learnt to play the internet game. I

28:08

never, never mind. I feel like you forgive

28:10

me. I never, all I'm saying is like,

28:12

no. As in,

28:15

no, not even internet games. I

28:17

feel like if you was like single, the mandem

28:19

would not. Oh, there were lots of...

28:21

Right, that's what I'm saying. When I

28:23

was in my separation... What's it called?

28:25

I'm like... I'm

28:28

bendy. I'm freakin' a bad guy. I'm a

28:30

pick me in the sheets. Oh, yeah, I'm a pick me

28:32

in the sheets. No, what is it? I'm

28:35

a freak... No. She's a freak. I'm

28:37

a feminist in the sheets and a pick me in the

28:39

sheets. Oh, they're like... I'm a

28:41

freak. I'm a freak. That's

28:44

what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. But

28:46

the thing is, with me and all of

28:48

that stuff, I'm like that with everybody. You know

28:50

what I mean? So it's not just for men.

28:52

In my relationship, I am that way. But I'm

28:54

very hospitable. I like

28:56

doing all of that stuff. If you come over, I'm going

28:58

to have a charcuterie board. If

29:00

anyone comes in... The

29:02

police came to my house the other day for nothing too

29:04

serious. And I had a charcuterie board. I'm

29:07

on the police. I'm

29:09

like, I'm ready. They didn't even

29:11

come. I was pissed. Yes,

29:14

that's just my plan. It was funny for hosts.

29:17

I know. I

29:21

think when we were surprised, we were like, we're similar.

29:23

Because I think you talked about if Amanda Sylls... I

29:25

think we had that Amanda Sylls effect. People think they

29:27

meet you. A guy will be like, she's going to

29:30

be a lot of work. Yes. And

29:32

then we'll say the price of the art. I'm

29:34

so sweet. I'm so

29:36

soft. I'm being loved

29:38

on the way I want to be loved on and

29:40

give no attention. I'm so... Just

29:43

tell them what to do and I'll do it. The whole thing

29:45

of allowing a man... I know it sounds amazing. People

29:47

don't want to hear it on this podcast. The

29:49

game's the game. I will make it happen.

29:51

I'm not mad at that. The game is the game. Because

29:53

it's like bonus do heavy. But

29:56

also, I'm not even pretending. If you make

29:58

me feel like I genuinely... I will

30:00

need you for things that I shouldn't need you for. Like

30:04

now I'm calling you for dump. You

30:06

will know that I need you because

30:08

you've allowed me to feel that. On a

30:10

normal day, I do it myself because I have

30:12

to. Right. If there's someone there,

30:14

why wouldn't you? But I feel like the internet

30:17

tries to make women feel bad about that because

30:19

now there's this thing of like, you're either supposed

30:21

to be happy to die alone or

30:24

you're supposed to find that 1% of the

30:26

guy that's perfect, he's good looking,

30:29

he's woke, he lets you work, but

30:31

he pays all the bills. I'm sorry, those guys, they

30:33

don't exist. I don't think they do. They do

30:35

not exist. I'm so tired of hearing all

30:37

these narratives about these guys. To me, they

30:39

don't exist. And if they do, there's not

30:41

enough of them to go around for everybody.

30:43

Or you're supposed to just be happy to

30:46

just die alone. I'm sorry, there's a nice

30:48

middle ground. Not everybody, just because you don't

30:50

wanna die single, doesn't mean that you're a bad

30:52

person or you're less of a woman or you're less

30:54

of a feminist. That pisses me off so much. I

30:57

hate that narrative, but I see it all the time. I'm

30:59

trying to find it, I found it. A really good thread

31:01

about this woman who wrote kind of what you're saying, I'm

31:03

gonna read it. She says, I'm gonna be really honest. I

31:06

really hate the idea that as a single

31:08

person, I have to create this whole fulfilling

31:10

life for myself before the universe seems

31:13

me as worthy of partnership. I

31:15

have a life it's full. I have friends,

31:17

hobbies, a job I don't hate all the

31:19

time. I have projects and fitness. I go

31:21

to yoga, I do therapy, I'm reading, I

31:23

travel, I'm bored, I'm so fucking bored. I

31:25

crave adventure and passion and romance and the knowledge that I

31:28

want someone to come home to. Someone who chooses

31:30

me and wants to be with me even when I'm having

31:32

a bad day. Someone who challenges my wit and wants to

31:34

hear my thoughts. I'm really done with the idea that I

31:36

have to apologize for that desire or stuff

31:38

it down because I still must not

31:40

be ready because I don't have it yet. She's

31:43

like, I'm tired of being alone. I'm tired of pretending I'm not jealous

31:45

of people who don't have to be alone. And if I'm

31:47

being honest about how much learning is fucking stuck, it's

31:49

wrong. Then I don't care because trying to be right

31:51

isn't right working for me anymore. And I think it

31:53

was such a good point to be like, you

31:56

know, in the quote, but in the quote, people

31:58

will be shaming her. and telling that together

32:01

and all your plans. You learn to love yourself.

32:03

And I just think it's so out of order. Like

32:06

I saw another tweet like that and then. Yeah,

32:09

like what the fuck. I saw another tweet similar

32:11

to that. In the quotes people are like, oh my

32:13

gosh, singleness, you're not gonna, singleness won't kill you people.

32:15

You're not gonna be like, and I was thinking shut

32:18

the fuck up. Someone is allowed to design. No, but

32:20

they, wasn't it during the pandemic where they were like

32:22

saying that loneliness has actually been killing.

32:24

The goalpost is always moving. It's

32:27

always moving all the time. It's

32:30

that killing women's desire to want it. You

32:32

were allowed to want it and not be

32:34

a pussy. Yeah, exactly. Like man-census. Yeah,

32:37

like a man-census. You've been allowed to crave

32:39

not being by yourself. I don't like, allow

32:41

women that softness as well and stop having

32:43

them to love. Like I swear to you,

32:45

like if I love myself anymore it's a

32:47

problem. It's actually a problem for me. And

32:49

I can't tell every time, oh, you need

32:51

to learn something. It's like, hello, I've been

32:54

living on my own for the last six

32:56

years. I know how to love myself.

32:59

That's your own company. You don't keep yourself busy.

33:01

Thank you, I know how to do all of

33:03

that. I'm watching four shows, reading three books. I'm

33:06

working. Seven articles, all of my

33:08

opinions tonight. I can keep

33:10

myself busy. I'm still bored.

33:12

And that desire doesn't die. No matter how

33:15

busy you keep yourself, the desire for it

33:17

doesn't go away. And there's only so many

33:19

like girls trips you can go on or

33:21

girls little getaways you could go on before.

33:23

It's just like, I just want penis. The

33:27

one thing about me is that there's certain countries I'm

33:29

saving that I can't go on. I

33:31

can't fucking go with my girls. Like all that is my

33:33

35th this year. And all the girls, I want you to

33:35

do, I want to go on holiday. I'm like, oh, come

33:37

on girls, I'm like, no. No, I'm not gonna

33:39

tell you 35 and not, no. What do you

33:41

think of it? I've started playing the girls trip on the day.

33:44

I don't want to. I know, I want to go on what?

33:46

I want to go on the girls trip for your 35th thank

33:48

you. I know, all the girls in my first, no,

33:50

I want to go to Jamaica with a man. I don't

33:52

want to go with a girl. Okay, so

33:54

like how much do you need to like this man

33:57

to go on the holiday? As in could

33:59

you like meet someone? and just have like a nice, because

34:02

you know what, sometimes I feel like I want to have

34:05

just six months of like wildness.

34:07

Season company. We've been saying that since we

34:09

started talking. No! I need my heart

34:11

to be done in here. We're

34:13

gonna be a wrap up with you. Yeah.

34:16

I mean, someone that I know, you're fun.

34:19

Literally, someone that I know, I shouldn't even be touching.

34:21

And when it's funny like, oh, that was a good

34:23

one. Yeah, it was bad. Yeah, and then, your name

34:25

is sad, because you know that Fertil is never gonna

34:27

be for you. You know, he's just fun. Just

34:30

fun. Yeah, a little bit of both

34:32

of them. Just a little bit. A little bit of

34:34

both of them. Oh no, it was never supposed to

34:36

push. It was all like, damn. But

34:40

those are always the fun ones. They're always the fun

34:42

ones. They're always the ones you shouldn't be with at

34:45

the heart of fun. Yeah. Oh

34:47

my God. And then it's the, I guess it's almost the almost the

34:49

way of getting caught, because I've been there with someone that I shouldn't

34:51

have been with, and people ask for pictures, I

34:54

think, God. Oh my God. Oh my God. Oh

34:56

my God. Not me in the back.

34:59

I'm like, for me. That's not where I

35:01

should be. But yeah, good six

35:03

months. I could do a holiday with someone like that.

35:05

Yeah, that's not, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's what I

35:07

would, I could do that. I could, and then, but,

35:10

but then do you ever, I've get into the stage now

35:12

though, where I'm like, I'm

35:15

saving these holidays for said person. Do I

35:17

just start going on these holidays? No, but

35:19

why are you guys asking if the country's

35:21

gonna evaporate once you go with your girls? You can

35:23

just go back with the guy. No, no, no, no. Or

35:25

you can save them on the first place. Yeah.

35:29

Okay, right, okay. That makes a difference. I'm like, I

35:31

want you to go barly with their girls. I'm fucking

35:33

going. I've been going on girlshits since I was 18.

35:36

I know. I've done a girlship with

35:38

every one of my girl groups. See,

35:41

I, this is interesting. My

35:44

girl group is so bad. We are the notorious

35:46

in the group chat. It never comes out. It's

35:48

not a group chat. Okay. But

35:50

we literally, yesterday, we finally booked

35:52

like our first little one for

35:54

my 35th. And

35:56

then my cousin, she's moved to Bali. I love

35:59

your cousin. I know. She's

36:02

absolute bad, miss her every day, but she actually lives

36:04

in Bali now, you know? She's funny. Yeah, she's like

36:06

packed her shit and gone to Bali. She didn't eat

36:08

love and pray. I thought she was on holiday. No,

36:11

no, no. What about her? No, she

36:13

lives there. Why? She just,

36:15

yeah, got a job every day, did her

36:17

thing. I love... What do you

36:19

call people from Bali? Balinese.

36:21

I don't know. What are they called, Brent? Balinese.

36:25

Balinese. I don't know. People

36:27

from Bali. Yeah, she loves it there. Every time

36:30

I FaceTime, her skin's glowing. She looks so good.

36:32

So I'm going to go to see her for

36:34

my 35th in Bali. I'm going to

36:36

go. But yeah, I was hoping round my 35th, I would have had

36:38

a little day. I thought, yeah.

36:40

I think July the 30th. I guess July the 30th. I

36:42

guess July the 30th. I guess July the 30th. I

36:45

guess July the 30th. I guess July the 30th. It

36:48

does. It is a big one, because there's

36:50

nothing in between 30 and 40, so it has to be 35. It feels...

36:53

No, it feels like it feels... Deep Audrey.

36:55

Deep, deep, deep. Deep, deep, deep. Deep,

36:58

deep, deep. That was one of the... Unpack that. You

37:00

know what it feels like? It feels like, wow, I'm

37:02

actually becoming an adult. I

37:06

don't know how to

37:08

describe it, but 35

37:11

really feels, oh my gosh,

37:13

I'm not far from 40, and 40, you are

37:15

actually a big woman. You can't move. You're on

37:17

the big... You can't move anymore. You can't

37:19

move. You can't move. You can't

37:21

move. You can't move anymore. And your eyes are big

37:23

woman. Those days are actually over. I like to focus.

37:25

Because when you're in your 30s, you still can be...

37:28

Yeah, anything before 35, you're still kind of

37:31

like a baby girl, kind of. But

37:33

35, you're really on the other side, and you guys are

37:36

catching up to me slowly, I was 35 a minute ago. But

37:38

yeah, it really is very transitional. I think it's the most...

37:40

I've never been with one of those people that, oh my

37:42

God, I'm really staying, am I doing this? I'm

37:45

actually quite excited to send 30. I think 35 feels like

37:47

the most daunting... The most I've ever thought about my age

37:49

in my life. Do you think that's also got to do

37:51

with maybe kids as well? I think so. It

37:54

feels like number. Yeah, I think. Yeah, they put the 35

37:56

number, it's like, J.B.A.C. I

38:00

feel as almost 35 is the age where you maybe have

38:02

to start making actual life decisions.

38:13

As in these decisions I make now are

38:15

set for my life now for the duration

38:17

of my life. Because if

38:19

you decide, if I decide at 35,

38:21

okay, I'm probably not going to have

38:23

kids, that is it now probably for the rest of

38:25

my life. If I decide now that I want kids I

38:27

have to go for it. Oh my God, that is so scary. That

38:29

is so scary. Oh my God. It's

38:32

so funny. Not

38:34

getting real deep. That is scary. Often

38:37

when you are this age you have to make up like

38:39

it's all fine. I can also go find my own car,

38:41

it's all fine, it's all fine. But

38:44

I put the biggest fears of

38:46

my life. I am so scared.

38:49

I'm scared of so many things. I'm scared that my parents

38:51

are getting older. Yes, scares the shit out

38:53

of me because my mum was sick so I was in

38:55

a shift to being the parents. I've seen that

38:57

shit, it's like fuck. It's

38:59

like real life shit. I've seen uncles

39:01

and older relatives dying now. I

39:03

feel like shit is actually becoming

39:05

a norm. You're seeing even

39:07

your friends are getting sick and things like, it's like

39:10

probably we're still young, why are these things happening to

39:12

us? You're seeing people in the middle of the country,

39:14

people are like, you know what, I don't want to be here anymore.

39:16

It's actually mad to think you've got friends at Liverpool. Yeah, yeah, they're

39:18

just like, I don't want to be here anymore. People have moved for

39:20

love. Two of my friends are like, yeah,

39:22

I've met someone abroad, I'm going. What

39:25

do you mean? What? We're doing

39:27

adults. Yeah. Yeah,

39:29

yeah, yeah. Bro, where

39:32

are we going? We're going to go past all of

39:34

them so like, what's going on? Yeah, even though that's

39:36

not true. When I moved to South, I thought I

39:38

was doing big people thing. When I moved from Essex

39:40

to South, I was like, alright, mum, don't

39:43

forget me. I was

39:45

terrified that I haven't

39:47

made the right decisions. What,

39:50

this far? That far in life. Yeah.

39:52

You've made amazing decisions. I don't believe,

39:54

I don't feel like that. I feel

39:57

almost a little bit, I'm. happy

40:00

with the decisions that I've

40:02

made so far because

40:04

of where I am in life. And also I look back and

40:07

think about all the times when, which is

40:09

interesting, when I felt maybe like this when

40:11

I was younger, if that makes sense. What do you

40:13

mean? So like when I was 25 I

40:16

remember feeling like this, but

40:18

now that I'm 35 I look back at 25

40:21

I remember thinking why was I feeling like that?

40:23

So now when I get to

40:25

like 45 I'm gonna look back at 35 and be like

40:27

why was I worried? So I kind of remember that

40:30

feeling of you always go on and then you think

40:33

you had nothing to worry about and you're gonna be okay

40:35

like you was because at 25 I remember thinking oh my

40:37

god what am I gonna do? I'm

40:42

gonna be 30 soon and that means I'm an adult

40:44

so it's just a cycle. I always say like those

40:46

markers are so dangerous especially for

40:48

women when like we put age

40:50

on milestones in your life because you

40:53

could just never, life is so unpredictable. Like

40:55

yeah if there's certain things that you know

40:57

you want then absolutely like I don't necessarily champion

40:59

just being like willy-nilly if you know there's certain

41:01

things you want. Like if you know you want

41:03

to have kids and it's like not in the

41:06

foreseeable future but you know it's something that you

41:08

want then absolutely be proactive now. Someone asked

41:10

me so you know you want kids.

41:13

Have you given yourself an age or have you ever met someone by

41:15

day you're gonna try it by yourself? I

41:22

really don't want to have to. Wait

41:24

what did you do on your own? I really don't

41:27

want to have to. See this

41:29

that's that's how I know. I don't want to

41:31

have to feel a face in my hands. I

41:33

don't I really don't want to have to. I

41:35

really don't want to have to. I could never.

41:37

I wouldn't I wouldn't even. I think at the

41:39

moment I want a family more than I want

41:41

a kid. Is that me? Does that

41:43

make sense? So my thing has always been that so

41:45

when I when I was younger I always I always

41:47

said I wanted kids. It's like I want to have

41:49

kids I want to have kids I want to have

41:51

kids but I think that

41:53

was because it was attached to my

41:55

idea of a family and love in

41:57

a family and creating a love. life

41:59

with somebody that I love and watching

42:01

that, you know, doing it together. And

42:03

I think as I've got older and

42:05

the idea of love has diminished more

42:08

and more and more, I

42:10

think that my desire

42:13

for kids has also diminished with that

42:15

love because for me, they're joined. Like

42:18

I have to be in love with someone to have a child with them. So

42:22

the idea of doing it on my own and also being

42:25

a product also of

42:27

a single mother, who

42:29

I think my mum did a brilliant job and

42:31

everything. But I don't know if I would want

42:34

my child to go into that. Like

42:36

actively put yourself in my house. Yeah,

42:39

I don't know. I don't know. I don't see people tick

42:42

off with their fathers now. I'm like,

42:44

I know that's so sweet. And really,

42:46

all my friends that I'm close to,

42:48

all my friends that I'm close to,

42:50

they have really good relationships with their dad.

42:52

So I've grown up seeing all my close friends

42:54

have really good relationships with their dad. And that

42:56

kind of... It's never been like one of the

42:58

things where I'd be like, oh my God, I'm

43:00

so sad. But it's been one of those things

43:02

where it's like, oh, that's nice. And kind of

43:04

like, wouldn't mind that. And not like a longing,

43:07

lasting thought. But yeah. Do you still think,

43:09

I've seen you say on like several interviews and stuff

43:11

about like the time

43:13

span of love is like 10 years. Yeah. That

43:15

we still, that's pretty much what we've got in

43:17

us. Yeah. You still think that. I agree. I

43:19

think if you start now, not like you. Yeah.

43:23

Because you've had... But we had our

43:26

break around that mark. Oh,

43:29

fair. Do you know what I mean? But then you've got another. But

43:31

now... We've got another. Is that what I'm getting at?

43:35

I think, I feel like if you started,

43:37

you know that when you see these things

43:39

and someone's like, oh, I

43:41

met my husband six months. So

43:43

then we got married after seven months. And

43:46

now we've been together 15 years and everyone's in

43:48

the college. Like, oh, see? And I'm like, it's

43:50

a different time. Like 15 years

43:52

ago, there was an Instagram, which is

43:54

basically a dating app where you have

43:56

your... There

43:58

was a mad option for your... partner to see so

44:01

yeah 15 years ago that could work you

44:03

would date to think now with all the

44:05

options that everyone has and also

44:07

just the way our we

44:10

have also all been programmed, look I said this

44:12

time of the day and I

44:14

think it's interesting that everything

44:16

else in life we're taught

44:18

if you don't like it upgrade if you don't like your

44:21

job upgrade if you don't like this maybe

44:24

you're not moving that

44:26

we think it's gonna stop when it comes

44:28

to people that people are just now gonna

44:30

start thinking that oh you know when when

44:32

it comes to the person that's why now

44:34

people soon as they don't like you they're

44:36

out the door because I've been alive these

44:38

years I think it is the

44:42

preaching of that you never say that okay

44:44

just go I didn't even I saw something I was

44:46

saying I understood

44:48

why they're saying it's like teaching your child like if they're not

44:50

comfortable with something and I was like I get it like you

44:52

have to yeah of course children all these

44:54

classes but also on the flip side you

44:57

are also teaching your children that if they just

44:59

don't like something to just give up like you

45:01

get what I mean like oh don't do it

45:03

don't do it and I'm thinking I get what

45:05

everyone's doing here but we have to understand that

45:07

all these behaviors are gonna just seep into everything

45:09

else in your life because I think that my

45:11

plans are gonna be not every discomfort needs you

45:13

to leave right sometimes you need to teach you

45:15

that at the end of the

45:17

discomfort is the goal is where you're at that's

45:20

the thing it's not this doesn't feel good many of

45:22

things that I've done great and there are many moments where

45:24

they didn't feel good do you get what I mean yeah

45:27

the other end yeah there's many moments where like

45:29

this doesn't feel good yeah yeah yeah exactly

45:31

yeah yeah and I think that is

45:33

a good point to be like yeah we tell everyone to

45:36

get up and go if they're not happy while I

45:38

think that pendulum has swung very

45:40

far to the other side and I always say like I

45:42

feel like the core thing has to be whether you're in love

45:45

but I feel like that's where it's tricky because I feel

45:47

like sometimes people don't know the difference of whether whether

45:49

they're still in love with the person or if they love the

45:51

person and I was gonna you know I was watching something

45:53

yesterday I was gonna say it was a great philosopher but

45:55

it wasn't it was Carlos King Chow and And

46:00

he was basically, oh God, this is so bad. And

46:05

he was talking to Bambi from Love and Hip Hop. Oh my

46:07

God. It's collect. The level

46:09

was so high. And,

46:11

you know, they were talking about, he was talking about

46:13

the difference between loving someone and being in love with

46:15

someone. And he was like, oh, when you love someone,

46:18

you just want the best of that person. When

46:20

you're in love with that, when you're in love with

46:22

that person, you want to be the best

46:25

for them. Do you know what I mean? Like you

46:27

won. And obviously you know the differences between being in

46:29

love and loving someone, but I feel like that is

46:31

the core. Like if you've fallen out of love with

46:33

someone and you feel like there's

46:35

no going back, but at

46:37

the same time, you have to have exhausted all

46:39

measures. Do I think that people are exhausted all

46:41

measures before they walk away from relationships? And

46:43

this is of course, let's not be, let's not be

46:46

obtuse, this is not including abuse and stuff. We're not saying

46:48

don't, saying abuse is like, we're not talking about that. We're

46:50

not talking about that. We're just talking about that. Like, and

46:52

let everybody connect their heads. Because unfortunately when you say

46:54

that, if people in

46:56

abuse, that's like, take off. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

46:58

So the message gets the wrong people. The

47:00

message gets the message. The one who gets

47:03

the message, no one's telling

47:05

you to say somewhere, well you're being abused and you're being

47:07

hurt. No one's saying that. And fight for the plot. Whatever

47:09

the thing about it, this doesn't just piss me off right now. It

47:11

doesn't. And we get

47:13

so many dilemmas. I feel like that's probably our top

47:15

three dilemmas. Like I've been in this relationship for years

47:17

and years. I wanna walk away, but I do still

47:20

love them. Should I stay? We've been together for years.

47:22

I don't know if I wanna explore new things as

47:24

the grass green are, that sort of thing. And so

47:26

yeah, I do think. I saw something the

47:28

other day as well. Like it's this like, I think we used

47:30

to say, I read a book, but now we just say TikTok.

47:32

Yeah. Instagram. But I

47:35

saw this thing on Instagram and he was

47:37

saying there's like five stages of relationships. Okay.

47:40

I think it's like honeymoon period and

47:42

I'm not even gonna remember all of them, but I

47:45

just remember him saying that the honeymoon period and that

47:47

can last for like six to two years

47:49

sometimes. And then after that, that's why everyone

47:51

then is like, oh, this is not working.

47:53

And then you go into that stage of

47:55

like, you don't really know if this is

47:57

like what you wanna do anymore. And it's

47:59

like. you're trying to figure out, are we,

48:01

should we be together? Should we not be together?

48:03

And then most people, he's saying most people don't

48:06

even make it to stage three. Most

48:08

people only make it to one and two. So then you

48:11

go to that stage two, which is like, Oh, this is

48:13

getting a bit boring now. What's happening? Yeah. Do

48:16

I even love this person? It's not the

48:18

sparks gone now. And then most people

48:20

break up here and then repeat and

48:22

go back to the honeymoon hearing. And then

48:24

there's five stages. He said most, he

48:26

said like the that was ridiculous more

48:29

than we don't even get to stage two. The majority of

48:31

that's only to get to stage two. I think chasing a

48:33

spark is so stupid. Yeah. I promise you, you feel like

48:35

we all

48:39

do it then because we all meet the guy that we think,

48:42

Oh, he's not really giving us the butterflies.

48:44

And then we, like your friend, you know, you go

48:47

on the day and your friend's like, how was that

48:49

guy? And you're like, it was just, you know, he

48:51

just wasn't busy. Every guy you thought that about, if

48:53

you know what you're giving the go, were they disappointing

48:55

or not? No, some of them I've learnt to

48:57

love. No, but do you like

48:59

that spark thing? I think that spark thing is

49:01

different at the beginning. You know,

49:03

because I can learn to love. I feel like

49:05

if it's not with it, I can learn. If

49:08

you treat me nice, there has to

49:10

be a level of attraction. Obviously, there has to

49:12

be a level of attraction. There can't be a

49:14

level of attraction. There can't be zero to 100. There's

49:16

some guys that I meet and I see

49:18

and I'm like, Oh my God, I fancy

49:21

the pants off. You

49:24

know, you're going to say you're so excited. And

49:26

there's some guys I can go out with and I'm like, okay, those

49:38

guys, I'm like, okay, I'm not sure

49:40

there's nothing there. Those guys, I can grow

49:43

to be absolutely obsessed with. It's a

49:45

point where I can't even believe this was

49:47

the thing that I was not interested in

49:49

the beginning. How much self convincing does that

49:51

paper? No self convincing. It's not one of

49:53

those things where I'm just like, just like,

50:00

I couldn't do that. They've almost

50:02

like nicely into falling for them. I'm

50:04

like you. I like guys that like

50:06

me. Do you know what I mean?

50:08

So if you like me enough and

50:11

you show me, out giving me the

50:13

ick, I'm probably going to fall for

50:15

you. I'd love to. I don't believe

50:17

in unrequited love. Yeah, I don't want

50:19

to work. The ultimate goal, I think, is

50:22

to wait there, wait for someone to suddenly

50:24

wake up and be like, wow, it was

50:26

always her. You should know from day one, bruv.

50:28

Get out of my way. I don't want to. Oh

50:30

wow. No, you can't. I would wait

50:32

for someone to suddenly realise it's you. But you

50:35

know the spark thing though? Yeah. Do you think

50:37

that that's like in

50:39

the beginning, because I feel like you have the, like

50:41

obviously everyone has the right to do whatever, but I

50:43

feel like in the beginning you're allowed to be fussy

50:45

about the spark thing. But it's more like

50:47

when you've had the spark and then

50:50

it develops into a relationship and then

50:52

trying to reignite the spark. Because I feel

50:54

like that's where people kind of like are

50:56

like, oh, you know, they're not really trying. But

50:58

I feel like in the beginning, if you don't have the spark,

51:00

then I don't see where you have to push through. Do you

51:03

know what I mean? Because I need

51:05

this. I need it in the beginning.

51:07

I see. I see. I can't just

51:09

do that. See, this is going

51:11

to sound so bad, but it depends

51:13

who I am in life. So

51:16

sometimes there's been a

51:20

time when the person came out of

51:22

really good time in my life when I

51:25

needed that kind of, I needed

51:27

that companion. So normally

51:29

I might have not gone for him. But

51:32

because he came at a really good time

51:34

when I was, you know, I

51:36

need it, he just fit. But so then it,

51:39

but he didn't have to fight, but he wasn't, it

51:41

took, it was more of the way he treated me.

51:43

You were more open. Yeah. Like him

51:45

more than the initial, like, oh my God, I want to rip his

51:47

clothes off. I just think

51:49

we'll say women need to learn. And you know what? Sometimes

51:51

women, women, you

51:54

need to learn the difference between men that you

51:56

want to bone and men. But people

51:58

don't think we have. that

52:00

and that's not me because we're not

52:02

just emotional features that want relationships all

52:07

the time like I'm sorry there's a difference

52:09

same way they categorise art there's some community

52:11

here and husband material I don't want to

52:13

wife you I just don't want to be

52:17

part of these I don't want to wife

52:19

you you'd be a terrible husband but a

52:21

great lover yeah because he's the problem

52:23

was he was like I know you want something serious I was like

52:25

not with you no I do but yeah not

52:27

with you I think I'm going

52:29

to say this but I'm not with you you

52:32

are not husband material honey but yeah if I'm

52:34

taking you I think we are all here for

52:36

my love I don't want to be serious with

52:38

you like seriously there's some guys I look at and

52:40

I think you would

52:43

rock my world and I will rock your world

52:45

and we will have really good fun together and

52:47

that is it thank you very much please exit

52:49

stage no one needs to know about us keep

52:51

it us no I will deny you you deny

52:54

me thank you very much thank you yeah it

52:56

doesn't need to be anything else and then there's

52:58

the guys that you just think yeah you like

53:00

we should yeah I want to wife you yeah

53:02

I want to wife you yeah watch the men

53:05

take this out of context at all it's not

53:07

me so what swear girls are going to write

53:09

acting like who's that it's just like no one

53:11

cares like so I mean we could do

53:13

what we want everyone be safe everyone do whatever

53:16

it is true that people deny women a desire

53:18

that they can just want sex they deny women

53:20

yeah we're not supposed to just want sex but

53:22

those deny also that desire thank you they don't

53:24

want it that's why girls are not getting the

53:26

sexless relationship because he pays the bills

53:28

but that's not enough exactly that and

53:30

you know who do you know who

53:32

actually like what annoys me

53:34

sometimes sometimes when I do see

53:37

I get everyone some different spiritual

53:39

journeys yeah I understand that but

53:41

I I think it's

53:43

really important that women release like

53:46

we have to really yeah yeah yeah you understand what

53:48

I mean and you know sometimes people like yeah I'm

53:50

not and I I don't know when like when you're

53:52

in a certain space I'm not like we say everyone

53:54

use brains now I'm not I'm not if you're not

53:56

in the right space to be yeah yeah yeah that's

53:58

fine I understand it but there we As much

54:00

as we talk about celibacy, I think we should

54:02

talk about the importance of releasing and getting those

54:04

frustrations out of your body. Because I'm sure I've

54:06

read loads of like scientific things that actually say

54:08

that it is important for us to have that.

54:11

Orgasms and all those things. Those orgasms and orgasms

54:13

and things. You were speaking at church at one

54:15

point, weren't you? Oh my God, yes. I was

54:17

there speaking in tongues, honey. I'm fascinated by that

54:19

version of you. Yes, I was. Because there was

54:21

someone else that was really, really big in the

54:23

church and then has now kind of come

54:25

out of it. Yeah. I don't know

54:27

if it's what knowledge, whatever it's like. What

54:30

was that transition? What made you... Where

54:33

were you at before? Are you still with

54:35

us? Yes. See, I definitely believe in God

54:37

still. And I still believe that there is

54:39

obviously a higher being and spiritually and all

54:42

those types of things. But I think for

54:46

me, because I grew up in the

54:48

church, I

54:50

always just remember the Bible saying

54:52

that it's better, you should

54:55

never be lukewarm, right? And

54:57

I feel sometimes a little bit hypocritical

55:00

knowing that I'm definitely

55:02

leading a life that is not of

55:04

God and then praying

55:07

to God. I completely hear you. Knowing

55:10

that I'm doing... I

55:12

think, and I always have the impression everyone always gets

55:14

their back up against the wall and whatever and I

55:16

get it. But for me, I just feel

55:18

like I'm taking the

55:20

pee out of God as in it's

55:24

not the same and everyone's like, it's not the same

55:26

because man is not God, but it's kind of like

55:28

a man cheating on you and then being like, no,

55:30

but you know my heart though, babe. You

55:32

know my heart, you know my heart, but you know my

55:34

heart, you know what, you know I love you though. And

55:36

then he'd say, but forgive me. And you say, okay, I

55:38

forgive you. And then he does it again. But you know

55:40

my heart, babe, you know my heart. And I feel like

55:43

me knowing that I'm

55:45

gonna fornicate or knowing that I'm gonna

55:47

do this or do that is

55:50

not being respectful to God and almost disrespecting

55:53

him by doing that and then asking

55:55

for forgiveness, knowing that I'm probably gonna

55:57

do it tomorrow. That's how I feel. I

55:59

have that. but my guilt comes from asking

56:01

for things after. Do you

56:03

know what I mean? So I feel bad that I

56:05

know that I'm going to sin. I'm a human being, do you

56:07

know what I mean? But then I have to get with Bethany

56:09

to ask for something after. And I know it doesn't work

56:12

that way, but I feel that guilt. Do

56:14

you know what I mean? That's where my guilt means, and asking for,

56:16

sometimes I don't ask. Do you

56:18

know what I mean? But I do always pray, but

56:20

in my prayers, I very rarely ask for things, because

56:22

I feel like I'm not deserving because I'm gonna go

56:24

sin, but I always give thanks to the

56:26

things I have. Do you know what I mean? I know

56:28

what you mean. So I think there's a difference as well,

56:30

if you're like practicing, as in, and that's why I also,

56:33

at one point I'll say, I'm not a

56:35

practicing Christian, because I'm not going,

56:37

I know I'm not going by what

56:39

the Bible says. So I

56:42

think there's a difference if you, because there was a time when I was

56:44

going to church, and obviously I would sin

56:46

because I'm a human, but I was actively

56:48

trying not to. And I think the difference

56:50

is now I'm actively trying, I'm not actively

56:52

trying not to. Because I'm gonna go and

56:54

do fuckery. You know what I mean? I'm

56:56

not saying, do you know what? I shouldn't

56:58

go out tonight because that is not. And

57:00

then maybe- And your conviction hasn't led you

57:02

to something. Yeah, so that's why I

57:05

struggle with it. And then I think what

57:07

happened with when I was in the church,

57:09

I was with, I

57:11

got my heartbroken in the

57:13

church. So it was

57:15

kind of, which is not black people

57:18

always again, it was like, obviously your

57:20

relationship wasn't strong enough with God and whatnot. But

57:22

I think also your first

57:24

heartbreak is something very hard. And

57:29

I think also when it's connected to you, maybe thinking

57:31

that you've got to marry that person. And also when

57:33

it is in the church, when it is in the

57:35

church, it's very competitive. Because

57:38

you already know kind of your doing your doing naughty.

57:40

But in the way you kind of justify

57:42

it, because you think I'm gonna get married

57:44

anyway. So fine, like technically I did.

57:47

Like I know he was doing all

57:49

the technicalities. And then yeah, I just,

57:51

I kind of, yeah, it

57:53

just made me, because of who he was. And

57:58

because he was quite well known. it then made

58:01

it difficult for me to kind of

58:03

be in that space because then everyone be like,

58:05

oh, how's it in there? And then we wasn't

58:07

together. And then it just made it me not

58:10

want to be in that same. And

58:12

then I turned

58:14

into a fully fledged heathen and then it was hard.

58:17

You're right, you go back. But I feel like

58:19

my mum, she still goes to church, she still

58:21

is very much in there and I still do

58:24

believe. And also I think as you get older

58:26

as well, you

58:29

start to question some of the

58:31

things they teach you or the

58:33

things or religion and spirituality. And

58:35

then obviously the more you read

58:37

about different things and all these

58:39

other and whatever. And you

58:42

know, there's loads of other things that you learn. So yeah,

58:44

that's where I kind of learned. But I would never deny

58:47

it if that makes sense. I'm not one of the people

58:49

that are like, no, I don't believe in any. But I

58:51

know it's just like, just it's

58:53

a journey. Yeah, because I when I was like, me,

58:58

what I might say, for example, if I'm

59:00

in a religious place, I'm in church, if

59:02

I'm in like a concert, a religious concert,

59:04

whatever, whatever. And people recognize me as totally,

59:06

I call it instant guilt. Right. I feel

59:09

like they see that I'm not a

59:11

pure Christian. Like it's such a weird thing.

59:13

I was like, shit, that means they listen to the podcast.

59:16

Or they've heard me say this, or they've heard me tweet

59:18

this. So instantly I'm like, I feel like

59:20

I'm not pure enough

59:22

to be in those spaces. But when I'm a

59:25

heart of hearts, I'm very much a Christian. I believe

59:27

in this. And like, I've

59:29

got enough, I've got

59:31

enough freedom to say that I'm picking this now. When

59:33

I was younger, I could say, we got to church

59:35

with my mum. And also I was also brought up

59:37

in a way that we're never forced to church. Me

59:39

neither. I was never. In fact, I loved it. We

59:41

never went to the same church as my mum. Like

59:44

I was from mum's always been a Christian, but chances always always in

59:46

that house, it was always you. Go

59:50

to church. Like, there was never a wake

59:52

up right now. I

59:56

never had that in my household. It was just, I've

59:58

always been aware that Christianity and my faith

1:00:00

is something I have picked. I

1:00:02

didn't get baptized until I was 24.

1:00:04

I was quite, in

1:00:06

fact, yeah, I was in my 20s when I got baptized.

1:00:08

But when I got baptized, next day I went to Croatia

1:00:10

at a party the other day. You see that's my problem.

1:00:13

I'm not the best at it. She's

1:00:16

multi-layered, hun. Literally, the day after I

1:00:18

travelled, it was the Fresh Island Festival. The

1:00:21

day before. You feel guilty. Yeah, but what's on

1:00:23

the venture festival? Nah, you can't do

1:00:25

that. I don't know, it's off the well. I

1:00:27

think there's an off the well. And

1:00:30

like, if I understood myself, there is a

1:00:32

lukewarmness of it. I

1:00:37

feel like as Christians, I

1:00:39

think because like you say, because I know how

1:00:41

much I was in it

1:00:44

when I genuinely was a Christian, whatever that

1:00:46

means, and how much I

1:00:48

took it seriously. Like I genuinely, like

1:00:50

I didn't, like I didn't lose,

1:00:52

well, it doesn't mean anything, but I didn't

1:00:54

lose my journey until later on. I was

1:00:56

like in my training because I genuinely was

1:00:58

like, I'm not having sexual marriage. And I

1:01:00

was like, I was at the youth service.

1:01:03

I used to do the hosting for all

1:01:05

the, I was like in it and I

1:01:07

think, and I enjoyed it, like you said,

1:01:09

like yourself. I, that was like my teenage

1:01:12

years. I thoroughly, thoroughly enjoyed

1:01:14

it. So now, because I know how dedicated

1:01:17

I was to it then and

1:01:19

how serious I took it then, I

1:01:21

know that I'm not taking it seriously now, if that

1:01:23

makes sense. And that's what makes me be like, I'm

1:01:26

not doing this properly and maybe I shouldn't do

1:01:28

it at all. Because I'm either in and out,

1:01:30

because I genuinely couldn't do those back in the day.

1:01:32

I'd be like, no, I can't. I can't listen to

1:01:35

anything. I can't do this. Because I would see

1:01:37

it as, I would feel guilty. I would feel

1:01:39

like that's of the world. Yeah. I feel like

1:01:41

we don't, I feel like we don't, and maybe this

1:01:43

is just me trying to justify my nonsense, but I feel

1:01:45

like we don't give

1:01:47

God enough credit for maybe

1:01:50

understanding that this shit is hard.

1:01:52

Do you know what I mean? I feel like God gets it.

1:01:54

I don't think that God is like, you're

1:01:56

being banished to hell because you listen to Jay-Z. No,

1:01:58

no, I don't think. I don't think that, I

1:02:00

don't think that either. But I do think there was a thing where

1:02:03

you were saying that we're like, where you're trying

1:02:05

and when you're not trying. Like, as in like God

1:02:07

gave us free will. You have the free will. But

1:02:11

I thought, I saw a video that I have a date and it was actually

1:02:13

quite funny. I was excited now. And it was this girl, she's like, a

1:02:16

Bible scripture that came to humble us. And it

1:02:18

was all kind of the

1:02:21

scriptures that kind of what you

1:02:23

were just saying now to make us feel better about

1:02:25

things, not doing what we know we shouldn't do it.

1:02:27

It was stuff like, oh, why don't

1:02:29

you go and ask the crystal bearers to save

1:02:31

you then? Like all of these things that God

1:02:33

was saying, you know, all these things, we're like,

1:02:35

no, you can do crystals and be for God.

1:02:37

And it was all these things that we tried

1:02:39

to make it. And it was like, no, oh,

1:02:41

you want to go and party? Okay, but it

1:02:43

was even for something like, you keep saying Lord,

1:02:45

but why you say Lord when I've told you

1:02:47

already, like I've already answered you. So why do you keep asking

1:02:50

me again? Or you don't even chat

1:02:52

to me normally. So why you say Lord? You know how I

1:02:54

say it. And all these things where

1:02:56

we kind of make ourselves, because also I think

1:02:59

with Christianity, it's

1:03:02

not supposed to be easy. Yeah.

1:03:04

And I think Christians have told ourselves that. That

1:03:06

is right. And even stuff like what you just

1:03:09

said now is like, God knows that, yeah, God

1:03:11

knows it's hard. And that's why it's a sacrifice.

1:03:14

That's why it's a sacrifice. It's

1:03:16

supposed to be like, rah, I would love to

1:03:18

go to that rave. But because I'm with God,

1:03:21

I'm not going to that rave. It's

1:03:23

almost like you should know that you're not

1:03:25

quote unquote missing out, but you should know

1:03:27

that I'm not in that. Yeah, I'm not off the world.

1:03:29

I shouldn't even be in that. I wouldn't, but I'm not

1:03:31

supposed to be. Like for years, I didn't go carnival because my

1:03:33

mom said I wasn't allowed to go. She was

1:03:36

like, it's carnal. That's like to carnival.

1:03:38

I'm like, it's carnival. I'm

1:03:41

like, why can't I go carnival? She's like, because it's of

1:03:44

the flesh. Carny. And

1:03:46

I'll be like, carnival, the flesh. I'll

1:03:49

be like, oh God, you can tell my

1:03:51

work's so proper now. We're

1:03:53

just proper Nigeria. So I was

1:03:56

even allowed to read Harry Potter books. I was like,

1:03:58

no, Harry Potter. What's the next one? Oh

1:04:00

my God, I want to watch that. And

1:04:02

my mum was Harry and Tamara. I'm like,

1:04:04

it wasn't like, we didn't have those, sometimes

1:04:07

back home they do, but it wasn't that. She was

1:04:09

westernised, so my mum didn't have any of those. But

1:04:11

when we went to the Nigerian church, oh no. Harry

1:04:14

Potter, I had to beg my mum to be extra

1:04:16

in Harry Potter because our school used to let

1:04:18

you be extra. Everyone has the same life. You'd

1:04:20

be extra. I would mention the same life. Oh

1:04:22

my God. I would mention the same life. I

1:04:24

would mention the same life. I had to do

1:04:26

all the great work. I had to

1:04:29

beg my mum. She was like, no, no,

1:04:31

because they're doing real

1:04:33

witchcraft spells. And

1:04:36

I would be like, no, mummies. Everyone's

1:04:38

getting to do it. It's a good experience to

1:04:41

be on set. She's like, OK, cool. But yeah,

1:04:43

I was like, yeah, I was in it. Did

1:04:47

you still have acts and dreams? Actually,

1:04:50

that's how I was introduced to you, your diaries. The

1:04:53

headcraft diaries. That's what I

1:04:55

introduced to you. That was a year ago. Yeah,

1:04:57

that was a year ago. It was district for

1:04:59

me. And I remember I tweeted you just

1:05:01

being like, thank you. No, no, she was like, OK. And

1:05:04

I was like, thank you for all your

1:05:06

work on colorism. I really rate it because

1:05:09

I'm really passionate about that topic. So when

1:05:11

you were speaking out about it so loudly,

1:05:13

I was enamored because I was

1:05:15

like, it's not really something that people put

1:05:17

their necks out on the line for. That's

1:05:19

what I thought. She said that whole district

1:05:21

thing, that's what actually really did spark my

1:05:24

passion for talking and speaking

1:05:26

because I think when I

1:05:28

did that and so many women, different

1:05:30

women, messaged and said, oh, thank you

1:05:32

for, I realized then that, oh, wow.

1:05:35

I think when you're a louder person

1:05:37

and you just speak for the sake

1:05:39

of speaking, you think everyone is like,

1:05:41

yeah, yeah, yeah. What should we be asking? There'll

1:05:43

be a lot of people in the back side that

1:05:45

are like, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Have

1:05:48

these feelings, but they just can't. Yeah,

1:05:51

yeah, never. They like other people.

1:05:55

They actually need a voice. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

1:05:57

And I think that's kind of what I was

1:05:59

saying about. the BB thing. Some people

1:06:01

are never gonna be in their workplace and

1:06:03

be able to be like, don't talk to

1:06:05

me like that. Or there's a lady from

1:06:11

wherever and she's judging the black woman at

1:06:13

her workplace. So you can just watch a

1:06:15

bit of this, like BB and be like,

1:06:17

oh actually Monica isn't aggressive, you're just a

1:06:19

bit, oh okay cool, do you know what

1:06:21

I'm saying? So for me like, yeah district

1:06:24

and all that kind of stuff, that's when

1:06:26

I realised, oh there's actually women out there

1:06:28

that feel this but they're not,

1:06:30

they're just not that person, they're quiet and whatever

1:06:32

and that's what kind of sparked my passion to

1:06:34

be like, oh there's other things as well that

1:06:36

I might want to say and that other people

1:06:38

might want to say, kind of like what you

1:06:40

were saying earlier Audrey about, there's someone that's gonna

1:06:42

think like me and someone's gonna think like you

1:06:45

and they're gonna be happy that you said it, you know what I

1:06:48

mean? So there's any thoughts that you take back Monica, oh I don't

1:06:50

actually think that anymore. Yeah

1:06:52

there are things that I've said as I've

1:06:54

got older, I'd be like, oh I maybe

1:06:57

not, yeah or as you got older you

1:06:59

realise, oh it's not that simple anymore or

1:07:02

you know, yeah it's a

1:07:04

bit complicated, it's not just black and white

1:07:06

and it is a bit different, yeah definitely

1:07:08

there are things but I think that comes

1:07:10

with just growth

1:07:12

in it, like and learning the world and

1:07:14

also talking to different people, learning from different

1:07:17

people, being in different environments as well. That's

1:07:19

when I always say that's one of the

1:07:21

best things about this podcast really is

1:07:23

just, it's opened up my world so much, yeah

1:07:25

yeah yeah, like so much, I'm thinking to people

1:07:27

who have like, oh I wouldn't have thought of

1:07:29

it like that, oh that's what you thought, oh

1:07:32

yeah yeah, I never thought that. The podcast has

1:07:34

absolutely shaped my world view because I

1:07:36

would have just been living

1:07:39

like an FHA mob really, yeah

1:07:41

yeah, like everybody that I follow on socials

1:07:43

is like me hearing the same opinions, like

1:07:45

I probably would be quite ignorant you know,

1:07:47

if it wasn't for this platform and

1:07:49

probably social media because I

1:07:51

wouldn't have been open-minded to other opinions. lives

1:08:00

on social work and having these

1:08:02

conversations and watching these things and taking these

1:08:04

things in. So it's like, yeah, I'm

1:08:07

very thankful for that. It's nice to have like to

1:08:09

be a woke kind of... Just us about Big Brother.

1:08:11

What was that process? Oh my God. When did they

1:08:13

scout you? Did you apply? How does it

1:08:15

work? They approached us. Okay, nice.

1:08:17

And then, yeah, they approached us and they said,

1:08:19

you know, we'd love you to do it. And

1:08:21

then I was kind of obviously very sceptical about

1:08:24

doing it. What were you even shook about? Just,

1:08:26

you know, being a

1:08:29

black woman in those

1:08:31

spaces, like we've kind of seen it all

1:08:33

the time. It doesn't always end

1:08:35

nicely. Because we were talking about when Eddie was

1:08:37

here, this idea that like when you are black

1:08:40

in a entertainment space, you do need to go to

1:08:42

a show like a Strictly Big Brother. You reach that

1:08:44

elevator. Yeah, because otherwise you just

1:08:46

kind of... Yeah, yeah. Let's be honest, you

1:08:48

space that as well. You need to do

1:08:50

something that just... if that's your aspiration to

1:08:52

kind of... Just to do... There's

1:08:54

a fear in each other. There

1:08:57

was definitely a fear. And

1:08:59

I kind of...

1:09:01

like we had a chat. You do like the

1:09:03

call and the interview, whatever. And you

1:09:05

have had a chat and I just

1:09:07

voiced kind of like my opinion, like

1:09:09

voice like how I was

1:09:12

a bit worried about how I was going to be

1:09:14

portrayed and whatnot. And they kind of just reassured me

1:09:16

and said, you know, that's

1:09:19

not the vibe that we're going for with this show. It's

1:09:21

not to be like mentally or

1:09:23

anything. I like more family orientated,

1:09:25

nine o'clock, whatever. And

1:09:27

ultimately what they kind of also said as

1:09:29

well was like, we can't pay you out

1:09:31

to be anything that you're not. Like, however

1:09:34

you are is how we have to show you. I

1:09:36

mean, if you have an argument and there's a

1:09:38

resolution, we have to show that. Like if you...

1:09:40

you know, everything has to be shown because ultimately

1:09:42

we are a show. You can't... if we represent

1:09:45

you in the wrong way, we can be liable

1:09:48

for that. So we have to show you that.

1:09:50

So when they said that, I was like, that's

1:09:52

actually that put my mind out. Yeah. My thing

1:09:54

was as long as I show myself in the

1:09:56

truest form and I get

1:09:58

enough time in there. Yeah. You

1:10:00

might not get enough time to act for

1:10:03

your character. Then

1:10:05

I should be okay. Like that was my thing.

1:10:08

So yeah, that was like my main thing,

1:10:10

my main worry. But apart from that, it's

1:10:12

like Big Brother. I grew up watching it.

1:10:14

It was celebrity. It was iconic. Like it

1:10:16

was iconic. Like it was just. Imagine

1:10:19

you watching Big Brother. I think you've heard. One

1:10:21

day, because I'm so relentless. When

1:10:23

people tried to pull up my tweet about Pamela Anderson, I was

1:10:25

like, that is so dumb. Because at the end of the day,

1:10:27

you were commenting as a regular person.

1:10:30

Now you're in there. So if anything is

1:10:32

aspirational to me, I was commentating as a

1:10:35

regular civilian and now I'm on there. So

1:10:37

you're people are there. Pamela Anderson. Yeah, exactly.

1:10:39

Pamela Anderson. Yeah. That's what

1:10:41

I'm saying. And also, at the time now,

1:10:43

which is so interesting, because I do feel

1:10:46

like reality shows have done, probably

1:10:48

because of Love Island, they've done like a 180. Yeah,

1:10:51

yeah, yeah. And the stigma around them

1:10:53

is not, because even there was a point, remember

1:10:55

there was a point. When your career's gone

1:10:57

significantly, like when it was a family, because

1:10:59

it was a four-person, like I'm a celeb

1:11:01

back in the day. People didn't want to do,

1:11:04

I'm a celeb because of that type of thing

1:11:06

of like, oh, it's seen as your trying to

1:11:08

get back home. But now, everything now, where you

1:11:10

speak to people, everyone's like, I'd love to do it, I'm

1:11:12

a celeb. Like that's the one I'll do. I would literally, every

1:11:14

single person was like, I would love

1:11:16

to do it. And strictly, it's one of those types of

1:11:18

things. So at the time, that was the culture. So yeah,

1:11:20

when I said, that was quite fine when

1:11:22

I said, but yeah, it was a really good, it

1:11:26

was one of the best experiences ever.

1:11:28

You have across the league. And that

1:11:30

was, I was so happy with that. When

1:11:34

I came out and I was reading all the tweets I was

1:11:36

saying earlier, I was so happy. If there's a

1:11:38

black, I was nervous for you. I'm

1:11:40

like, I'm nervous. Yeah,

1:11:42

I feel nervous for all black women, they see things,

1:11:44

I'm like, what are they gonna do? I'm nervous, I'm like, as

1:11:46

long as you can make it, but I was like, we can't. Yeah, you'll

1:11:48

be all right. You were like, I wish we could do half a week

1:11:50

once, you'd be good. You'd be good. But Louis

1:11:52

really tried it, when he tried to put you up and then

1:11:55

blame Sharon. Did you watch it back? I don't think, the

1:11:57

thing is, I only watched the top one. If you

1:11:59

haven't watched it back, because that man is something else.

1:12:01

And I said it, not me. I literally,

1:12:03

I haven't watched it back. I watched the

1:12:06

police episode back because me and David were like, that

1:12:08

was funny. The past was really good. The past was

1:12:10

funny. because I

1:12:13

heard things, I heard like, I

1:12:15

knew the people in the house that

1:12:17

didn't necessarily like me, but

1:12:19

I was definitely shocked by Levi. I'm not gonna

1:12:21

lie about that. Yeah, they were like, they were

1:12:23

like, I didn't wanna watch anything that was just

1:12:25

tricking me up. Yeah, absolutely. And I've done it

1:12:28

now. Yeah, I'm the same. I don't watch about

1:12:30

anything. I know, I had an inkling, people

1:12:33

would say things like that. But then I think to

1:12:35

hear it is another thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I feel

1:12:37

like respectively, with Levi, neither wants to be a good

1:12:39

black. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.

1:12:43

100%, yeah. Like again, we all have different worlds that we came to

1:12:45

play with. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. He wants to play the role of

1:12:47

a good black and he wants his sauce to still be selling.

1:12:50

So, and you know what? I just,

1:12:52

I, that was, yeah,

1:12:55

that was, yeah, I was,

1:12:57

that was the one thing that did. That

1:12:59

made me feel a little bit. Because what came up,

1:13:01

actually, I was saying to you about it privately, you

1:13:03

were having a conversation. Cause I think Levi's talking about

1:13:05

someone being jealous of Oh, that was like, I can

1:13:07

see. The white girl, or I can see that was like, He tried to blame the

1:13:10

edit in 2024, that girl, really. People

1:13:12

were jealous of her. And, cause we, when the whole JT

1:13:14

and Young Miami thing was happening as well, and you used

1:13:16

to see it all the time, I guess it was us

1:13:18

as well. It's so quick to say

1:13:20

the black girl was jealous of the light Why is that girl with

1:13:22

the white girl? Of the white girl? Of the darker girl? And

1:13:25

that's just... But nobody ever wants

1:13:27

to believe this other way around. It's

1:13:29

impossible. But only

1:13:31

probably because they're jealous. But it's like, of what?

1:13:33

It's so lazy and lame. Tell me

1:13:36

what's of what. It's

1:13:38

such a lazily, like, I know you look, they

1:13:41

are, cause there are some dancing girls out there that still

1:13:43

think the lighter girls are better than them. I

1:13:45

don't think that. Me either. That's not

1:13:47

enough of me to think that's not enough for me

1:13:49

to be jealous. I don't think anyone's better than me. No

1:13:51

one's better than me. Unless I think it. No one's better

1:13:53

than me. Anyone I do think it, no

1:13:55

one's better than them. We did just a I

1:14:00

don't know either, I don't know that. I'm

1:14:03

putting the worst of me against the best of them.

1:14:05

It doesn't make any sense to me. How can I

1:14:07

do that? But it's such a repeated thing you see

1:14:10

all the time. It's always

1:14:12

a darks and gels somehow jealous of the

1:14:14

larky girl. It's

1:14:16

just what? It's just straight up colourism and

1:14:18

laziness. That's what it is. And that's why

1:14:20

you just have to... Colourism

1:14:23

was one of the things where I

1:14:26

would talk about and my

1:14:28

blood would boil. And I'd have to literally...

1:14:31

Sometimes I have to endure myself from conversations

1:14:33

because you would be banging your head against

1:14:35

the wall. And then now you're

1:14:37

again, the more you now try to tell people...

1:14:39

You're jealous of the girl. Now you are angry

1:14:42

and now you do look like an angry person.

1:14:44

You're angry and you're done with it. And now

1:14:46

you're even fixing your faces. You'd

1:14:48

be giving statistics, you'd be giving examples. You'd

1:14:53

be breaking racial theory, you'd be doing it. And then they'll

1:14:55

just turn around and be like, Oh my God. I

1:14:58

know. It's ridiculous. And

1:15:00

yeah, I just... But

1:15:02

it was a really good experience. I had such a good time.

1:15:05

Even all the down days that I had... Let

1:15:08

me tell you something. That place

1:15:10

challenges you. That can imagine. That's

1:15:12

when you realise how emotionally mature

1:15:14

you are. How like...

1:15:18

Anything that you think you worked on yourself on, yeah. Is it

1:15:20

because of the isolation from your friends and family? Yeah. So

1:15:23

I didn't realise how much I

1:15:25

sound bored of people. Or

1:15:27

how much I would call somebody to be

1:15:29

like, Oh my God, can you believe this

1:15:32

is happening? This is how I

1:15:34

feel. This happened and duh duh duh duh. Because

1:15:36

some things will happen in the house, right? And

1:15:39

you will want to like... Just turn to

1:15:41

someone and be like, Am I moving? Yeah. And

1:15:44

this is how I feel, but then they say duh duh duh.

1:15:47

But I thought then they said that. But you're

1:15:49

fully aware that there's cameras. The

1:15:51

cameras are not hidden. The cameras

1:15:53

are not hidden. You can see it move, can you?

1:15:55

The cameras are basically like... This is

1:15:57

the camera. I

1:16:00

was thinking about forget the camera set,

1:16:03

bush it. Their motherfucker's

1:16:05

moving as you're moving sometimes. Sometimes

1:16:08

you'll be there like doing your make up,

1:16:10

you're like... Oh, here we go. It's

1:16:13

like they're doing your make up, you're freaking there, the camera's

1:16:15

moving at me now. Or you'll be talking to someone and

1:16:17

you just hear it, like you'll just see it

1:16:19

move. Not so much here, but you'll see it move, so you'll all like

1:16:21

that. But

1:16:24

you forget in the sense

1:16:26

of when you're talking, because

1:16:29

obviously you're having a free conversation, so sometimes

1:16:31

you might say something. But then again, that's

1:16:33

what I'm saying, I just think that that's

1:16:35

people that are not self-aware. Because I'm a

1:16:38

self-aware person on a day-to-day thing, do you

1:16:40

know what I mean? And I feel

1:16:42

like as a black woman in this world, you have to be... Even

1:16:45

as like just, you know, sometimes

1:16:47

I'm having conversations, simple things

1:16:49

like you're in like Seho House, you might

1:16:51

be having a conversation. You've got to be

1:16:53

careful about who's name you're saying. This, because

1:16:55

next thing you know, Spotify exec sticking behind

1:16:58

you, you're cutting off one item. So

1:17:01

you're always kind of like, in

1:17:03

this world, you're always kind of like, okay, let me,

1:17:05

I've got to make sure I'm in the back of

1:17:07

the room, you know what I mean? All these things

1:17:09

I can't say, this person says, because this person... You

1:17:11

know what I'm saying? You're kind of like, I'm an

1:17:13

aware person, that's what I'm saying. When I went in

1:17:15

there, nothing really changed about how aware I am

1:17:17

of what's going on around me. But yeah,

1:17:20

it is, and it's intense, and the lighting as

1:17:22

well. Is it like set to

1:17:24

make it like it's daytime all the time? Yeah, it's

1:17:26

like this type of light is all the time. And

1:17:29

then like even around the bed, when

1:17:32

you go to bed, I could read a book at night when

1:17:34

they turn them lights off. Because

1:17:36

they have red lights around the whole of

1:17:38

your bed. Every single one of our beds

1:17:40

has like red lights. So if you get

1:17:42

out, they know you've got LED lights just

1:17:44

around the bed all the time. And that's

1:17:46

trippy. Yeah, so you're sleeping, but you're not

1:17:48

really... How was your move after it? Do

1:17:51

you know what? It was fine. The only thing that

1:17:53

it was... No, no, no. Yeah, I was gonna say

1:17:55

the only thing that I found a bit weird was

1:17:57

actually talking to the camera on when

1:17:59

I... went to like do stories and

1:18:01

stuff. That was only that which was kind of

1:18:03

interesting. I just found that weird because it was

1:18:06

filming yourself after you had kind of asked you

1:18:08

to know you've been filmed for like three weeks of

1:18:10

you know what I mean and also just not having

1:18:12

your phone. Like that was... I can't even know

1:18:15

what I was doing. I really enjoyed not having

1:18:17

my phone. I really I like it. It's so

1:18:19

nice because you genuinely you actually just don't know

1:18:21

what's happening there as well. Quite nice. And that's

1:18:23

what was quite scary. Like every so often Louis

1:18:26

would be like, I just

1:18:28

don't know what's going on out

1:18:30

there. No one actually knows what's

1:18:32

happening. But you know if anything's awful they'll tell you.

1:18:38

Anything that happens to like come out, anything

1:18:40

like that. I would know. It

1:18:44

would be cool but yeah honestly the

1:18:46

best experience and you know what anyone

1:18:48

I would say anyone in our world

1:18:50

should do black ladies, black men or

1:18:52

whatever. I think it's a bit different for men. So

1:18:54

I only speak for the black women because I'm

1:18:57

a black woman. But anyone in our world, if

1:18:59

they approach you, I would say do

1:19:02

it. Really? You feel like you can like carry

1:19:05

yourself. Is it a high pressure environment? You have

1:19:07

to know how to bend and whatnot. But like

1:19:09

I said that's actually a real world

1:19:11

every day. And if you're like that I

1:19:13

think it's a really good experience.

1:19:16

You're never gonna... I'm never gonna

1:19:18

get that experience again. It was good. It was really

1:19:20

good. I think that was the only one I could see myself

1:19:22

doing. Yeah and I think yeah. I couldn't do any of the

1:19:24

other task related ones. I'm too lazy for that. Me too.

1:19:26

I'd like to get really bored. Yeah and that's the

1:19:29

thing I think people realize how boring I am. I

1:19:31

sleep all the

1:19:33

time. And I might with the group that

1:19:35

I have, so when you do

1:19:37

like the calls they say you know like there's a

1:19:39

lot of downtime. I'm talking about a lot of downtime

1:19:41

and I'm like cute. I was just like brilliant. Is

1:19:43

it true they don't let you sleep? So

1:19:47

I would always end up taking sleeps during the day

1:19:49

and they would never be... they would say something. Then

1:19:51

randomly sometimes someone might take a seat and be like

1:19:53

please remember big brother does not want you to sleep

1:19:55

during the day. That would be...

1:19:57

but I would take that sometimes. But they would

1:19:59

say... you know, you know, there'll be a lot of

1:20:01

downtime. How'd you feel? I was like, brilliant.

1:20:03

I love downtime. My favourite thing is to do nothing. I'm not

1:20:05

a good judge for it. When your phone call you, like what

1:20:08

you do you have to pretend you're doing. Oh yeah,

1:20:10

yeah. I really did absolutely nothing.

1:20:13

Nothing. So I was like, yeah, brilliant. But my

1:20:15

housemate, oh my gosh, we would finish doing a

1:20:17

task and they'd want to do a game. They

1:20:20

were like, they were the, like my housemate. The

1:20:22

boys seemed to be energetic. Oh my, the boys

1:20:24

were their most energetic. Like at

1:20:27

one point they were so funny at one time and they went,

1:20:29

say something to Louis and Louis went listen. I'm

1:20:31

all gamed out. And that was our scene

1:20:33

for the next like two weeks. Someone says,

1:20:35

I'd be like, I'm gamed out. Yeah, we're

1:20:37

fine. Because we are literally, Bradley blessed him,

1:20:40

loved him so much. And we would do

1:20:42

it one time, one time, that's

1:20:44

when Big Brother knew they'd maybe pushed us too far

1:20:47

when Bradley fell asleep during the day. And

1:20:49

that's when they said, oh. You can rest. You

1:20:51

guys can rest. Yeah. Because when they

1:20:53

said Bradley was sleeping, that's when they said, Bradley's

1:20:56

always on tennis. Maybe we fell too much faster.

1:20:59

Maybe they pulled him in and was like, Bradley,

1:21:01

just want to take you as a kid. Because

1:21:03

he's always on the hundreds. Like always so

1:21:05

energetic. So when he was like on

1:21:07

decline, that's when I was

1:21:09

just like, OK, maybe the entire, but it

1:21:12

was, yeah, when I came out

1:21:14

of there, towards the end I was thinking I cannot

1:21:16

wait to just sleep and

1:21:18

also not be switched on. And not be switched on. And

1:21:22

not have, but it was honestly good. I had

1:21:24

the best time. When you were saying about how often you

1:21:26

storyboard, I realised that with myself last year. And one

1:21:28

of my solutions this year was to trust myself more.

1:21:30

Right. It's not everything you actually need to ask

1:21:32

for someone else's thing tonight. Right, right, right. If

1:21:35

you, like, Yeah, like I said, OK,

1:21:37

you want to do this, just do it. Yeah, yeah,

1:21:39

yeah, yeah. Do you want to date this person? Do

1:21:41

it and tell them after. What I realised is, is

1:21:44

that not on purpose,

1:21:46

I've isolated myself more because of it. Yeah.

1:21:50

Like I realised that a reason, I've actually really isolated

1:21:52

myself from a lot of people. A lot of people.

1:21:54

And it's not a problem, it's just nothing. It's just

1:21:56

because I'm not going to them for, hey, what do

1:21:58

you think about this? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then

1:22:00

when you don't, sometimes people don't know what well

1:22:02

they play anymore. You don't need to soundboard your

1:22:04

life anymore. Yeah. And I would thought, hey, again,

1:22:06

you're going to be 35. Some

1:22:09

decisions you like, you did it because you want it. Yeah.

1:22:11

Yeah. And like, so if it goes to shit, it's

1:22:13

like, oh, yeah, I decided that. Like, I think this

1:22:15

thing I did. Yeah. Yeah. I think

1:22:17

there is something interesting yourself. I do think the start

1:22:19

of it does kind of isolate you from everyone a little

1:22:21

bit because you just

1:22:23

have to make a decision. Yeah. Yeah.

1:22:25

I'm very, I'm like, my soundboarding is

1:22:28

more like. I just

1:22:30

want to get everything off my chest. You don't need me

1:22:32

to talk sometimes. I'm just like, can you believe this happened? And

1:22:34

then it's just, yeah. No, no,

1:22:36

no, no, no. And it's more times my thing sometimes

1:22:38

also is actually because I know I can overreact

1:22:40

a lot. So

1:22:42

I will maybe call my friends and be like,

1:22:45

this happens. Do you think I overreacted? Yeah.

1:22:47

Or do you think it was or do you

1:22:49

think it was just, you know, but

1:22:52

more times decisions are more. I know what

1:22:54

I'm going to do. Yeah. Kind

1:22:57

of like, you know, business

1:22:59

stuff work wise, I'm actually, which is

1:23:01

quite interesting because I remember when I was looking for

1:23:03

management, I remember one guy was like, I

1:23:05

see you're just going to be really hard to manage because you're just not

1:23:07

going to let anyone tell you what to do. And

1:23:09

I think I'm actually quite easy to manage. I

1:23:12

think you're fine. I know my manager, she's in there and

1:23:14

happening right now. She could be there. But

1:23:17

I know what I like. And then I'm also very

1:23:19

open to if someone I think my team know better,

1:23:21

then I will be like, would you like to think?

1:23:23

But also something about being managed by someone who knows

1:23:25

you. Right. Because I feel like I trust my agent. Most

1:23:29

times she will. I didn't think you do it, but for your knowledge. She's

1:23:31

the thing. Most times she's actually

1:23:33

right. Yeah. I would have done that. Yeah. She's like, well

1:23:35

done. You absolutely smashed that because I didn't know you could

1:23:37

just do that. So I think it's been managed by

1:23:39

the right person. The same for all the clients. So

1:23:42

what happened to the ZZ Mill Show? And are you still

1:23:44

doing it or is it? ZZ Mill Show. The

1:23:46

ZZ Mill Show is such an interesting

1:23:49

thing because that is my baby. That's

1:23:51

what kind of propelled me

1:23:53

out there. But I think. You

1:24:00

don't know I'm not

1:24:02

done with this easy more show him I think

1:24:04

what it is is because I named it this

1:24:07

easy meal show and I am ZZ meals I

1:24:10

feel like sometimes I don't always feel like I

1:24:12

have to do this easy meal show to be

1:24:16

To do it to say

1:24:18

it to feel like something's happening with the ZZ

1:24:21

one. Yeah, I mean so there's loads of other

1:24:23

things happening So even if I do capital X

1:24:25

try to ever it always keeps This all on

1:24:27

for sure. Yeah, if I decide tomorrow if I'm

1:24:29

gonna be like, oh I'm gonna do interview It's

1:24:32

still if I put it out, it's still not like

1:24:34

oh what shit. Oh, where does that where she going? But

1:24:37

I do My dream is

1:24:39

yeah, I would love to definitely

1:24:41

be more regular like I was with

1:24:43

this easy more show back in the day but

1:24:45

also Maybe

1:24:48

do something different as well But

1:24:51

the same kind of format

1:24:53

and stuff like interviewing people. Yeah, I

1:24:55

genuinely do in enjoy doing that but

1:24:57

I do think that this

1:25:00

easy meal show People

1:25:04

have like a stigma

1:25:07

around it I think sometimes

1:25:09

of That

1:25:11

I'm just gonna like go to the jugular. Do you know I

1:25:13

mean? Yeah,

1:25:16

we have that as well I feel

1:25:21

like I Still

1:25:23

want to interview people but I'm kind of maybe

1:25:26

I don't know maybe a different type of format

1:25:28

Oh, yeah, and also there's just something about I

1:25:30

know we've had this conversation of just like Especially

1:25:33

I'm gonna say they're really high profile black men in our

1:25:35

industry just need to focus with it. Yeah Yeah,

1:25:39

yeah. Yeah, and also and but you know

1:25:41

what? Charlie I tell you come on the

1:25:43

show that come on and

1:25:45

but I'm I am so tired

1:25:49

of asking

1:25:55

I'm right now where I just

1:25:57

like is because I just I

1:26:00

just be rolling my eyes.

1:26:02

Because the thing is, you can't expect black

1:26:04

entertainment or these black channels or whatever, or whatever you

1:26:06

want to call it, to elevate. If we don't have a

1:26:08

certain caliber, we don't have a caliber, yeah. It's not

1:26:10

gonna grow. And it's just, it's

1:26:13

as simple as that. Like

1:26:15

it's as simple, it's literally as simple

1:26:17

as that. We saw it with, and

1:26:20

it's so interesting because you know the

1:26:22

Bobby girl in America. And

1:26:24

then she did it, she did,

1:26:26

and then everyone's saying the funny Marco guy.

1:26:29

Oh yes, of course. And

1:26:31

then there was even this, is the other girl, I

1:26:33

can't remember what was her name? Was it Zaza? And

1:26:35

her show got? It got the back girl. Yeah, yeah,

1:26:37

yeah, yeah. And it got cut as well. And people

1:26:39

was like, and then I remember there was a whole

1:26:41

discussion online, and I was saying, look, the thing is,

1:26:43

yeah, is if the reason why

1:26:45

her show got cut is because there's

1:26:48

a sort of caliber that is not going on

1:26:50

her show. If a certain caliber

1:26:52

was going on her show, the

1:26:54

network is not cutting the show. And then

1:26:57

the other day, all of a sudden, Bobby

1:26:59

went to her. And the show is not

1:27:01

getting canceled, thank you. And I hate what's as simple as that. And then

1:27:03

people are like, oh yeah, but obviously her team will not reach

1:27:05

out. The team, I guarantee they'll reach out

1:27:09

every single time they reach out. But for some extreme reason,

1:27:11

they're not gonna go on the show, they're not seeing. Because

1:27:13

one thing, when you have a show, what your team would

1:27:15

do, you have a good team is tell you, who were

1:27:18

your dream people? You'd be like, come on. And you will

1:27:20

name all of these people. So they will always reach out.

1:27:22

And you'll do it at a time they've got something to promote. You

1:27:24

need people to be like, oh, let me see. They're

1:27:27

just coming, they're just coming. But yeah, if you're

1:27:29

not included in that lineup, that's not what you

1:27:31

can do. And I think that's also, yeah. So

1:27:35

for me, I

1:27:38

wanna have really good discussions with people. I

1:27:40

wanna have different types of caliber of guests

1:27:43

on it. It's always, with the Dee Dee

1:27:45

Milshite, it was always more about a story,

1:27:47

more than necessarily, oh, it has to be

1:27:50

this amazing person. It was always like, I'm-

1:27:52

Something's happened. Yeah, something's happened. I would like

1:27:54

to speak to that person. But then there'll

1:27:56

be times when I have really nice interviews. It's like,

1:27:58

big nasty, like, I think, what is- all these

1:28:00

interviews that, you know, they did

1:28:02

really well, but people forget them and only remember

1:28:04

the ones where I'm like having an argument with someone.

1:28:06

Yeah, because that's what's so important. I mean, that's what it

1:28:09

is. It's just also like as a celebrity,

1:28:11

you know that you can say that I'm not

1:28:13

talking about this, you know, you know, you can

1:28:15

expect yourself. Yeah, exactly. Because you're a PR, you're

1:28:17

like, no, they're not talking about that. You can

1:28:20

have approval, but yet you choose not to even

1:28:22

try it. I can even engage. Yeah, it's really

1:28:24

frustrating. It's like, fuck me off. And that's

1:28:27

exactly how it is, literally with me as well.

1:28:29

But the ZZ Moshe, I love, it's my baby

1:28:31

that will always like be there. And I think,

1:28:33

and I love it when people are like, oh,

1:28:36

what's happening to ZZ Moshe? Is ZZ Moshe happening

1:28:38

and whatnot? Yeah,

1:28:41

but it's still there. It's always going to be there.

1:28:43

It makes sense. And I always pull for it

1:28:46

when I'm just take out the back pocket and be like, you

1:28:48

know, last year I did, I think I did like six

1:28:50

episodes last year. Yeah. As

1:28:53

a when I wanted to talk to somebody and

1:28:55

I saw something interesting happening. And also actually had

1:28:57

quite a few Americans on

1:28:59

the show. Yeah, Jada was there. Jada, yeah. And

1:29:01

that was that was that did like nicely that was

1:29:03

well. So even then you start thinking about maybe you

1:29:06

just have to start doing cross over as well now.

1:29:08

Oh, oh, yeah, because the American

1:29:11

audience is generous as well. They

1:29:13

really are. Do you know

1:29:15

what it is about the American audience? They believe in paper

1:29:17

stuff. Yeah. They

1:29:22

believe in being like, hey, you're anticipating us here is

1:29:24

this thing. Hey, and famous, we're going to subscribe. And

1:29:27

that's why Patreons are like, hey, here's my money.

1:29:31

Yeah. I think here we see it from back. We're

1:29:34

going back to having a such hard time. Yeah.

1:29:39

But actually, I used to pay for it. Like when

1:29:41

it started, when they started charging, I would pay for

1:29:43

it because I was like, I was consuming it when it was free.

1:29:45

I mean, I don't. And

1:29:49

when it's like black content and there is

1:29:51

a paywall, I will support it. Like, and

1:29:53

I know, you know, this is might be

1:29:55

controversial. I paid for butters. Well

1:29:57

done. Yeah. And I know you had to.

1:30:00

take on it and we talked about this at Nella's dinner

1:30:02

anyway, it was you know, we took it to the web

1:30:04

and it's completely fine but I paid for that because I

1:30:06

thought you know what, I'm not

1:30:08

necessarily the target audience but I

1:30:11

feel like what Lani did, whether

1:30:13

or not we like the content of it or

1:30:15

we agree that it's you know the best representation

1:30:17

of black women, she still did that shit. No but

1:30:19

I said that. And you did say that yeah, you

1:30:21

did give her a pop and she said that as

1:30:24

well. I tweeted it and I said it on one

1:30:26

thing, I said the only, what she's

1:30:28

done like we what we're

1:30:30

both saying even though the content and the is, it's

1:30:34

mad. What she's done hats

1:30:36

off to her. She's through girls. I

1:30:39

don't watch things like that. But

1:30:41

as we know from production side, what

1:30:43

she's done, supply them girls out, get

1:30:46

a camera, get the big, get

1:30:48

mad with her own coin. Well done. See

1:30:50

like that's why I said that that is,

1:30:54

that's one good thing. That's what Lani is very good

1:30:56

at. That's one thing she's very good at and I'll

1:30:58

give her props for that. But and also like yeah,

1:31:00

give her her money, let her recoup her money. I

1:31:03

don't want her to not recoup her money. Do

1:31:06

you understand? Let her recoup her money. But yeah,

1:31:08

it's just a unit. The content. Yeah. It was

1:31:10

like, her name is Talani. I know. Yeah.

1:31:13

We both think that we just have way through it. Lani

1:31:17

is salty. Like exactly. Yeah. But

1:31:20

we've got the will. The will. We've got

1:31:22

the will. So we have a will. I love

1:31:24

it. I love a good will. That we spin

1:31:26

around or we have a guess. Our very

1:31:28

own bread, bring them along and

1:31:31

spin it around. Oh that's what you're

1:31:33

thinking already. Because that's after the poor

1:31:35

thing too. We didn't win the will.

1:31:38

Because I'm feeling cos you like it

1:31:40

like that. I

1:31:43

don't know the actual words though. I don't know where to

1:31:45

end the song. I don't. I don't need to say anything.

1:31:47

I feel what I want them to say. An audience of

1:31:49

Kylie Minogue was so good. Shout out to you Kylie. Was it?

1:31:51

I think that was so good. I was going to give it a

1:31:53

watch. Really good. Yeah. You should be able to watch it on replay

1:31:55

or whatever it's called. I'm going to give it

1:31:57

a watch. Yeah. Oh. The

1:32:00

last DM he said. Right,

1:32:03

so what happens, how it goes is we spin

1:32:05

the wheel. Okay. And whatever it lands on, you

1:32:07

tell us or you do. All right. Okay. Are

1:32:10

you ready? Or what you want to play for

1:32:12

the housemates? David

1:32:14

and Marisha. Oh. Right.

1:32:17

Or do you think she's honest? Yeah. Shouldn't.

1:32:19

Didn't. I wouldn't stop spinning. Doo doo doo

1:32:21

doo. Is

1:32:25

there a celebrity big over what's that? Yeah.

1:32:27

Is there a celebrity big over what's that? A

1:32:29

man's a genius. Yeah, there is.

1:32:31

What's it called? It's just like,

1:32:33

just the CBB24. It's active.

1:32:36

Not really. Aww. That's

1:32:39

a shame. It's, it's, it's, it's, um, yeah.

1:32:43

Is fun button in it? No.

1:32:45

Oh. See, it's fun. See,

1:32:48

that's why I love it because I knew it was going to

1:32:50

happen. But does everybody know it exists? Oh, but it's

1:32:52

only fun. It's fun. It's fun. It's

1:32:54

fun. It's fun. No, it exists. Oh, but

1:32:56

it's only starting to be like. Sorry, let's

1:32:58

just move on. It was kind

1:33:01

of, if the boys, it was like, it's

1:33:03

me. It's like the boys. The

1:33:05

young people. The Marisha. Oh, okay. Yeah. Yeah. That's

1:33:07

it. It's not like only. It's the people who

1:33:09

got on, which is fine. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

1:33:11

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

1:33:13

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, good.

1:33:15

I was supposed to have fun acting on that

1:33:18

show. Who? Oh, I'd like fun. I

1:33:20

know. They're going to do that. But. No,

1:33:26

I don't know. That's what I did. Wait. Did it.

1:33:28

Did it. Did it. Yeah. Yeah.

1:33:31

What gives you the it kind of day? Oh. Nothing.

1:33:41

Okay. If I like you, if

1:33:43

I don't like you, like I went out with

1:33:45

someone the other day and I realised it like

1:33:47

him because he was that. My legs

1:33:49

were like we was underneath the table and

1:33:51

his legs like touched my legs and I was

1:33:55

like. And I just knew I didn't like him. And

1:33:58

that's what I mean. I don't actually have X. If

1:34:00

I don't like him anything can annoy

1:34:03

me. And he actually did nothing wrong.

1:34:05

He just accidentally touched me. I was

1:34:07

like, I just don't even want this

1:34:09

guy to touch me right now. So why can't you go

1:34:11

to love him? I'm trying.

1:34:13

Okay. Why are you trying?

1:34:15

Oh shit. Oh shit. Oh shit.

1:34:17

Oh shit. Oh shit. Oh

1:34:20

shit. Like why are you trying? He's

1:34:22

a good guy? He's a good guy. Okay.

1:34:25

So there's nothing wrong with him? There's nothing wrong with

1:34:27

him. There's nothing wrong with him. It's

1:34:30

just... No.

1:34:35

It's, there's nothing wrong with him. And that's the

1:34:37

thing. That's all. Okay. And that's what

1:34:40

makes me so sad. Yeah, yeah. What's

1:34:42

my problem? What the fuck is my problem? Yeah. You're

1:34:44

my problem. I'm like, there's nothing wrong

1:34:46

with him. He's actually quite calm and

1:34:48

like, do you know what I mean? But also I

1:34:51

just think my heart is somewhere else. Okay,

1:34:53

fair enough. It could be like that sometimes. Yeah, yeah.

1:34:55

It could be like that. And I think I need to

1:34:57

just be over that thing. And then I can like concentrate. How

1:34:59

do you get yourself to be over something though? What do you

1:35:01

do? Normally under someone else. But

1:35:04

he's also, I don't want to get under this.

1:35:06

Yeah, okay, fair. Also I kind of also know

1:35:08

if I like someone, how quickly I want to have sex

1:35:10

with them. And you don't want to? I don't

1:35:12

have sex with him quite quickly. I know. Like

1:35:15

when I meet a guy and I think, oh, I

1:35:17

can't wait. But I don't do it straight away. I'll

1:35:19

withdraw. Like, you

1:35:22

know. But if I am looking at you

1:35:24

thinking, I

1:35:26

can't actually, I'm not excited to

1:35:28

rip your clothes off. Then I know it's probably

1:35:31

not going to, it might be a grower.

1:35:34

When I used to do that measurement as well. Like if I

1:35:36

was on the date, this was back in the day by the

1:35:38

way, I

1:35:40

would know. Like there would be some dates I'd be like, I'm

1:35:43

definitely sleeping with you today. Like 100% of

1:35:45

it is happening. Oh

1:35:49

no, no, no. All by fire. No, no,

1:35:51

no. That's the time out. You know what I mean?

1:35:53

I still believe in like, are we too old

1:35:56

to this now? You know, like you shouldn't give it up.

1:35:58

I've never believed in that. I was like,

1:36:01

I'm genuinely, I was just like, would you

1:36:03

give him the best date? Yeah. I never believed

1:36:05

that. Oh, listen, he's lightweight. I was fucking

1:36:07

the best date. I never, ever. Listen, listen.

1:36:09

I never, you know why? Do you

1:36:11

know why? I never believed that from early

1:36:14

on. So I had that experience like early

1:36:16

and it didn't, it didn't take anything. You

1:36:18

know what? See, this is the thing. I

1:36:21

don't care, but I would say this to my friend that

1:36:23

I was eight. There's certain

1:36:25

guys that I've dated that I know you're ignorant.

1:36:29

I know you are. You're gonna get a new part. Yeah,

1:36:32

yeah, yeah, yeah. If I was fucking

1:36:34

with you right now, you might get a second date. You're

1:36:37

right. It's because I don't want you. That's a

1:36:39

lot of things judging me. That's

1:36:41

a lot of like, oh, man, man, man, man. You

1:36:43

know what? You saying that has made me realize

1:36:45

that the only reason I felt comfortable is because

1:36:47

the guys were progressive. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But

1:36:49

there's other guys I would have never, even if I liked

1:36:51

them, because you're gonna jump in, you're gonna cut.

1:36:54

Yeah, yeah. I'm not thinking I had agency. Yeah,

1:36:57

yeah, yeah. I thought I had agency. I was

1:36:59

like, what's up with me? It was them. That

1:37:01

was literally them. Literally. I think the

1:37:03

guy would do it with the guy that I'm like, no,

1:37:05

I know you're stupid. I know you're stupid. I know you're

1:37:07

stupid. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. A lot of them are still

1:37:09

so stupid. A lot of them really are. Why don't some

1:37:11

of them believe in their own thoughts? Why

1:37:13

don't you believe that you're good enough to make me understand? You

1:37:16

never had girls to be like, I don't know why you do this and I was

1:37:18

just lying. But no, I love you guys. I

1:37:20

love you guys. I believe in you just too. Yeah, but

1:37:22

do you believe when a guy says that to you, I

1:37:25

kind of do something. Nah, I never do that. I like

1:37:27

that. What do you mean? No,

1:37:29

I've seen this. I said, do you know, when I

1:37:31

did that video the other day, we're not special. That's

1:37:34

how I date. I date like I'm not special. No,

1:37:36

do you know how I date beef and I've only started dating

1:37:38

like this because I'm biased from a friend.

1:37:40

And for years I'd be like, him, shut up, shut up,

1:37:43

shut up, Jacob. Right, right, right, right. I sat sharp, sharp,

1:37:45

you're chatting shit. He was like, you need to compete.

1:37:48

Oh, can I tell you something about Jacob one time?

1:37:50

I don't know if you can. No, no, no, no,

1:37:52