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hi this is alex patent on from ann arbor

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michigan i , finished

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my first year working as school counselor

0:33

providing mental health support to middle

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schoolers this podcast

0:37

this recorded at you will six pm

0:39

on monday thirteenth things might

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have changed by the time you hear this but

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i'll be enjoying my summer break taking care

0:46

her mental health i hope you are taking

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care of your mental health as well okay

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here's the show

0:55

well deserved break

0:57

hey there is the npr policy clinton

0:59

some susan davis cover congress i'm cli

1:02

get son is they also cover congress

1:03

and i'm dominica months in our senior political editor

1:05

and correspondent

1:06

and today the committee investigating the

1:08

january six attack on the capital

1:11

heard from team normal that's

1:13

how trump's former campaign manager bill step

1:15

he and characterize the people around the

1:17

president's telling him he had lost

1:19

the election there

1:20

was no fraud i didn't mind

1:23

being shouted rise there were two groups

1:25

of family we call them and might

1:27

seem and receive

1:29

didn't mind he characterized as a part

1:31

of see normal

1:32

witnesses repeatedly testified

1:34

that taught members the former president's

1:36

cabinet legal team and even own family

1:39

told him he had lost the election and the claims

1:41

he was making and continues to make

1:44

that it was stolen from him or simply

1:46

not true korea

1:48

it was really stretching to just here

1:50

in rapid order so many

1:52

of top voices in the trump administration

1:55

saying administration the time does

1:57

all solstice is all false and that trump

1:59

lost the election right we heard

2:01

from bill step he and then attorney general

2:03

william bar and this was followed

2:05

by members of trump's

2:07

own family ivanka trump

2:10

jared kushner we also

2:12

heard from former department of justice

2:14

officials this includes jeffrey

2:16

roseanne brick donahue giving us a

2:18

little bit of preview of the next hearing but

2:21

yet was really striking hearing from

2:23

these members of

2:25

trump's inner circle and how hard they

2:27

were battling to get this message

2:29

to the former presidents that

2:31

he had lost that there was no election

2:33

fraud to speak of and trying

2:35

to tamp down the stolen election

2:38

campaigns and really is

2:40

mentioned team normal did not

2:42

get through to the former president in the

2:44

end we should also note that a step in

2:46

it was video deposition from testimony

2:48

he had given earlier this year he was

2:50

supposed to testify in person today but

2:52

his wife apparently went into labor we

2:55

could not attend in person

2:56

i talked to step in attorney

2:59

earlier today kevin marino

3:01

and he said that in terms

3:03

of stuff he ends missed appearances

3:05

he was here in washington d c

3:08

with his attorney they were ready to go

3:10

but step in got this call his wife

3:12

was in labor in new jersey so

3:14

they had to read assemble

3:17

all their player and stepping into cost

3:19

into meet up with his wife and labour

3:21

will marry and stayed behind to lift committee

3:23

council know about this cancellation

3:25

and appearance said he offered for stepping

3:27

into appear into the future before the committee but

3:29

they wanted to rely on these clips for

3:31

now let the public know what said

3:34

i'm hoping there's been clear arc over the

3:36

trump presidency of a lot of people

3:38

who know the reality who know the truth

3:41

who aren't able to get through to

3:43

former president trump and who

3:45

i guess for one reason another thought this

3:47

time would be difference that there would be line

3:50

for trump said he wouldn't try to cross

3:52

said that he wouldn't try to concoct his own reality

3:55

up but this something he's done repeatedly

3:57

over and over in his life whether

3:59

was business a in new york

4:01

whether it was a during the for his

4:04

campaign through his presidency and

4:06

there are people who wind up leaving his administration

4:09

who've come out and said you know if

4:11

know if there then what would've

4:13

happened and and look here's the

4:15

reality there were people who tried to tell

4:17

them the truth that he was going to lose

4:19

then he lost that these claims

4:21

of widespread fraud were all these

4:23

multiple words that b that the former

4:25

attorney general bill barr used idiotic

4:28

a bs once again over

4:31

and over again saying that a and

4:33

it didn't matter he wound up pushing

4:35

those people away and insulating

4:38

himself in a bubble of conspiracy

4:40

and listening to only people who would tell what he

4:42

wanted to hear the

4:43

may go to that end today there was lot pretty

4:45

damning testimony again

4:47

rudy giuliani who became sort

4:49

of the center of trump's legal

4:51

fight in trying to contest the election

4:53

which again we should note was all thrown out

4:55

course yeah , giuliani

4:57

was one of those three people

5:00

at least two kind of came to light today

5:02

as the people who became the trump inner

5:04

circles or after he sort of

5:06

pushed out these quote unquote truth tellers

5:08

or team normal as they wanted to call

5:10

themselves because you're giuliani

5:13

ah sydney pal though lawyer

5:15

who was going off telling all kinds

5:18

of false conspiracies about the election ah

5:20

as well as peter navarro his former traitor

5:22

buzzer there

5:23

was one other point i heard from step

5:25

in the tourney today marino who

5:27

said when giuliani entered the picture

5:30

that's when the campaign took off in completely

5:32

different directions and in sense

5:34

left team normal behind

5:36

it didn't sink as in politics there's always someone you

5:38

gotta throw under the bus is , somewhere

5:41

up not knowing i'm great they everybody's

5:43

gonna scapegoats someone gonna scapegoats and pain

5:46

or somewhere who's really responsible for

5:48

still look at me i wasn't

5:50

problem i didn't lead us to this point

5:52

it was these guys and that's kind what part

5:54

what you're seeing and you have to kind be have lots

5:57

of read between the lines on some of that what

5:59

you there was a maybe little tantalizing

6:01

element today's into

6:02

that wasn't quite expecting and i admit

6:04

raises some questions for me of this is elaine that the

6:06

committee's gonna go deeper

6:07

down but they talked about the money

6:10

that trump raised a in

6:12

the the days and months after the election

6:14

mean just a stunning amount of money two

6:16

hundred and fifty million dollars was raised

6:18

basically in fundraising efforts off

6:20

of his false claims about the election right

6:23

this is one of the most closely

6:25

held parts of the investigation yet

6:27

this is one of the first questions of panel

6:29

was asking how did the former president

6:31

turn a losing campaign into

6:34

money making machine after the

6:36

election loss well he called it

6:38

stop the seal campaign and the money

6:40

kept rolling in that two hundred and fifty

6:42

million and what's really impressive here

6:44

is the panels just scratching the surface in terms

6:47

the evidence they've uncovered there in the middle

6:49

of a legal fight with the

6:51

republican national committee who

6:53

filed the lawsuit against the panel

6:55

saying that they wanted to stop subpoena

6:58

of one of their vendor sales force who

7:00

helped host all these emails

7:02

to seek donations under

7:04

this kind of stopped to steal premise

7:07

and are still in the midst of this legal

7:09

fight in the committee wants to get to the bottom

7:11

of those records that this vendor has

7:13

and get a sense how was this money

7:15

spent where did it go to ha what

7:17

role did these emails play so

7:19

it's clear they're still digging here and there's lot

7:21

more come

7:22

the thing is we do know where some of money to

7:24

apparently wound up going according to the committee's

7:27

the and two hundred and fifty million dollars

7:29

going to nonprofits that had

7:31

some connections to the former president

7:33

that work promoting him and a

7:35

lot these charities including a

7:38

one with connection to former

7:40

trump's chief of staff mark meadows and

7:42

the the committee is really building this

7:44

case that the president and

7:47

the people connected to him who were sending out these

7:49

emails out really were fleecing

7:51

them as a base monday nights

7:53

was really interesting about the voices

7:56

in today's hearing the wrong

7:58

republican they were all

8:00

the people who worked in the trump administration

8:02

who worked on trump campaign and i

8:04

think it makes it harder to sort save

8:06

this is partisan which on this is democrats

8:09

going after the , presidents

8:11

mean these were his people these his allies

8:14

and that was their their testimony today

8:16

sort of recounting and very vivid detail

8:19

that the efforts to raise this money and this money

8:21

else

8:22

right in it it is coming from the mouths

8:24

of republicans telling the story that's

8:26

what makes so powerful course we know chris

8:29

star walt was it fox news it

8:31

it we were not clear if he's a republican himself

8:33

but he does in terms of his role

8:35

when he was with fox communicate

8:38

to a lot of republican voters

8:40

so that is why there's such a

8:42

big impact here because once again

8:44

as we saw the first hearing or seeing it again it's

8:46

members of trump's inner circle it's

8:48

republicans that are largely telling

8:50

the story on the committee's the house or the sick

8:53

a quick break and we'll talk more about the hearing when we get

8:55

back

8:56

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9:00

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secure your account and help prevent cyber

9:04

attacks. Even if your password is compromised,

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your account. With this additional of protection.

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9:17

On

9:18

this season of the storycorps podcast from NPR stories

9:21

about the helpers people who reached

9:23

out a even when they didn't have to

9:25

most people see. he wanted

9:27

some money and they do love the way

9:29

so ounces wonder what

9:31

made to talk to me that

9:33

the may my day a lot better that

9:36

you are new key then it's out now

9:40

and back and we should know that there have been

9:42

a lot people who have faith consequences for

9:44

election lies in the people ah

9:46

the storm capital on january sixth

9:48

and live cd has the top

9:51

republican on the committee she made that point today

9:53

chairman hundreds of our fancy

9:55

men have faced criminal you many

9:58

are serving seminal sent it because

10:01

they believed what donald trump said

10:04

about the election and they acted on it

10:06

they came to washington dc at his

10:08

request they marched on capital

10:11

at his request and hundreds

10:13

of them besieged and invaded

10:15

the building at heart of our constitutional

10:18

republic

10:19

the may go i know it's hard say because we're

10:21

early in these hearings but there

10:23

any signs or any sense of what

10:25

the impact of them is having

10:27

while mean first of all on on that point

10:30

about or what liz cheney was saying

10:32

they're up in a lot people who

10:34

have face the consequences are

10:36

sort of you know lower on the totem

10:38

pole so to speak ah you know

10:40

if you're thinking about trump thing

10:42

at the top some pyramid of

10:44

conspiracy for january six

10:46

to happen yeah a lot harder to

10:48

get up that run what you've seen as as npr

10:50

supported more than eight hundred

10:52

and forty people have been charged with crimes

10:55

related to january sixth and

10:58

those are the people who are inspired

11:00

by the lies as the committee would

11:02

have painted so you know the people

11:04

being affected are not exactly

11:07

the people at the top at least just year the

11:09

this committee has

11:10

no authority to charge anyone with

11:12

crimes right like this is just

11:14

said investigative body but i'm

11:16

watching this on tv and i'm thinking v

11:19

lawmakers really seem to be making

11:21

be making case against

11:23

the criminal prosecution for will trump added

11:25

obviously up to the justice department to make

11:27

that decision

11:29

what is it seem fair say that congress

11:31

in this committee seems like they're there

11:33

they seem to be very methodically laying out

11:36

a case against him right

11:38

it seems that they've been beating this strom

11:41

on when comes to the former president

11:43

what role he played in

11:45

obstructing the

11:47

effort to certify the election on january

11:49

six from the months previous

11:52

to the day off and

11:54

it seems like they're beating that drums even

11:56

louder through these hearings and yes

11:58

this panel does not the any criminal

12:00

legal authority they cannot issue any

12:02

kind of criminal charges but they can

12:04

set the played if you will

12:06

for the justice department to step

12:09

in and that's been a complaint that many

12:11

members have articulated for many

12:13

weeks and months now is the believe

12:15

the justice department should step in that should

12:17

pursue a criminal probe against

12:20

former president and his role with

12:22

january sixth and it seems that these

12:24

hearings are trying to get the message to

12:27

the justice department in they could in

12:29

the an issue a referral for

12:32

the justice department to look

12:34

at trump's when it comes to criminal

12:36

efforts and trying to ramp up that pressure

12:39

on attorney general merrick garland

12:41

before we go we should acknowledge that was the news

12:43

over the weekend ah a bipartisan

12:46

group of senators including ten

12:48

republicans most notably announced

12:50

that they have a framework of a deal on a

12:52

gun safety legislation it's

12:54

you know remains to be seen if it can actually get through the

12:56

senate but if it does it would

12:58

be the first gun related legislation congress

13:00

has taken up in basically

13:02

generation sure you've been covering

13:05

this what did they agree to will

13:07

nothing nothing legislation would actually

13:09

affect any one's ability to purchase

13:11

a gun but what it would do is plates

13:13

a slightly more thorough level of background

13:15

checks on people under the age of twenty one

13:17

when they seek to purchase weapon

13:19

they would look juvenile records it would

13:22

encourage states to expand red flag laws

13:24

which make easier to take weapon away from someone

13:26

if law enforcement or member their family

13:28

thinks they could be danger to themselves or other

13:30

p though i prefer crackdowns

13:32

on gun trafficking more money

13:34

for schools for mental health resources

13:37

so it's pretty thorough piece of

13:39

legislation i would note that all gun safety

13:41

groups of essentially the amount endorsing it so it has

13:43

lot of early support and president biden is

13:45

basically the he said he would sign it if they can

13:47

pass

13:48

yeah i think it's clear that this mass

13:50

shooting we saw in you've all the texas

13:53

has really put senators

13:56

on notice that they can't

13:58

continue to see bees the incident

14:00

go by without any actions it'll

14:02

be interesting to see this tax come together

14:04

and potentially see this legislation

14:06

moved to the senate floor and see

14:09

finally some sort of agreements

14:11

and starting place in terms of trying

14:13

to address these kind mass shootings

14:15

in our country

14:16

all right lets leave it there for today but

14:18

dont forget m p our dot org slash

14:21

podcast survey to take our survey m

14:23

susan davis i cover congress m claudia one

14:25

also cover

14:26

and i'm dominical months in our senior political editor

14:29

and course then thanks listening to

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