0:02

Welcome to Good Intentions, the podcast where we explore the world around us to find meaning and intention in what we do. I'm Kelly Harvard , and I'm on a mission to spread positive stories that will inspire you to live a more meaningful and connected life. Nazarene Abdullah has a very unusual job title. She's the Happiness Editor at Kish Times . I was fascinated to speak to someone whose whole job revolves around optimism. Nazarene is tasked with finding human interest stories that speak to our hearts, that uplift and inspire us. There's a revolution happening in news with a huge desire from consumers to read and watch positive stories. And it was so insightful to speak to someone on the front line of content creation. We talked about how it feels to have a job like this, how she tackles the difficult stories in times in her life, and how her support system gets her through the challenges that she inevitably encounters at work and in life. Nazarene and I share a passion for storytelling, and I found her love of her job and her commitment to helping others. Very uplifting. We talked about why it's important to tell stories that matter, and how a love of Brazilian jiu-Jitsu gives Lazarre purpose and meaning. If like me, you are an eternal optimist who loves storytelling, then this episode is for you. I hope you enjoy it. Thanks so much for joining me today, Nazarene. I'm delighted to be able to speak to you.

1:21

Pleasures all mine. Thank you for having me on your show.

1:23

It's so exciting for me. And congratulations. I think you have one of the most interesting job titles of anybody that I've spoken to so far. It's just incredible. Um , where else in the world for this be the case? Um , you are the Happiness editor at Kish Times. I mean, please tell us more about what, what this involves and what , what it's all about,

1:40

<laugh>. Well, it is a conversation starter at a lot of places and I'm, I'm really thankful for the title because most people when I meet them, they don't forget me because of the job title. Absolutely. But it is not a job that makes me write only stories related to happiness. Yes, I do have a huge focus on human interest stories because that a lot of happiness comes from that, but otherwise it is quite like any other job. But I love being able to put that spotlight on human interest stories because I am someone who is very curious about people. And when I speak to people, I like to ask them about their jobs, what they do. So it helps me find human interest stories more easily. But , uh, yeah, I love my job. I love the title. When I was first offered it, I was like, really ?

2:39

Yeah, I can imagine. It's just so different. I love the fact that you say people will never forget you because you just wouldn't. Right. Why would , why would you? And , um, you're gonna disappoint me now and say that you don't have an office that's full of like, I dunno , sunflowers and puppies and kittens, and you're gonna ruin it awfully , aren't you? You're tell me. That's, I kinda , I like to imagine that's why you go to work when you go to the office as well.

2:58

Oh , I don't wanna burst your bubble now, <laugh> . Okay . Let's, let's just , let's leave

3:01

It at that. Let's just, I I'll keep imagining the pop . Yes .

3:04

<laugh>

3:05

And I mean, you know, joking apart, we do live in a country, the UAE has a minister of happiness. I mean, you know, Sheikh Hammed very famously, he asks people like, are , are you happy living here? You know, he, every time you use an app, we are asked to rate how happy using the app made us. I mean, do you feel there's anywhere else in the world? It feels like we're in a very unique place, you know, someone that really prioritizes happiness and , and I know that you're well traveled. I mean, do you feel that we are in a very unique situation. Is there anywhere else quite like the UAE for prioritizing happiness? Like , like it does.

3:35

I'm sure there are countries when countries are rated on happiness index. Yes, there are countries that value happiness, but I'm someone who was born and raised in the uae and I would like to think that honestly, there's no place like ua . There's no place like Dubai. Very recently, I traveled somewhere in the Gus and it's when you go outside that you realize how much Dubai has spoiled you . Because we'd get to situations that we'd be like, oh my God, why is this so inefficient? You should see how we do it in Dubai,

4:14

<laugh> . Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely.

4:17

It's only when you travel, I mean, wherever you travel that you realize how Dubai is so efficient. Everything is just a click away. Whether it's you wanna see a doctor, whether you wanna get your, you wanna start a business, you wanna get your papers started, you wanna get go to the bank. Everything in Dubai is just so seamlessly integrated. Everything is so easy to get done. The city, the country really spoils you.

4:47

I know . It really does . Doesn't know . It's, it's incredible. It

4:50

Is. And um, I think because he , especially my, my father came here in 1977 and over these years he, to an extension, I , we've seen how Dubai has sort of evolved. So there are a lot of countries that, you know, have online services. But from where Dubai was to reach where it has, it is just the vision of our leaders that, you know , they're constantly on the lookout on how to improve things here. And that feeds in a lot to the happiness of the people.

5:23

100%. I've only been here, only been here 15 years and I, I feel it's changed so much in the time since I came. And just last week my daughter wasn't very well. So , um, at one point I think I WhatsApp the pharmacy to check on some medication and , and they were delivering it to me. And then I thought, oh, I better fill the car up with gas. So I , I went onto cafe and I, I ordered the gas and then there was something that I needed from all of the Emirates, but I couldn't go anywhere cause my daughter was sick. So I I , they have a digital concierge service. So I watched that from all of the Emirates to check if something was un stocked . They then said , yeah, we'll deliver it to you in three hours. And because everyone was sick, I then went on to Deliveroo and ordered my dinner. So I did like four different things in the space of about three minutes and just thought, my goodness, you know, and it's not just those convenience things, I think there's a palpable feeling , isn't there, that we often talk about that there is this ambition and this vision, like you say, from the leadership to make things better and, and to make things the best they can be for people. And I think that's very uplifting when you listen, you can feel it.

6:18

Yeah, exactly. That convenience. And you know, like a lot of things, especially during my recent travel, I, you know, you realize that the leaders want you to be happy. They want to make your lives easy , otherwise there's no reason for them to invest so much to be so involved in getting things, you know, up to speed, to making things so easy. It's just that they strive to make us happy and that's a great feeling. Yeah, I

6:48

Completely, I couldn't agree more. And I'm curious, what does a typical day look like for you as a happiness editor? You mentioned like human interest stories. Are you out sort of speaking to people, do stories come to you? I assume that you get sort of first dibs on a lot of the great announcements that are coming out because you know, you're working at Kish times. Tell us what a typical day might look like.

7:06

If you ask me, my day began like yesterday. So <laugh>, especially when you're a journalist, you just have to keep the ball rolling. So, especially like when you go on a holiday e even on a holiday, you know, people are constantly messaging you, you're constantly trying to arrange things. But if you ask me that's, I love that bit about being a journalist. So most of the times my day stories, I've already either like, you know, I have an idea in my head the previous night and during the day there , there's a lot of social media vetting involved because that's where most of the nice human interest stories come from. And sometimes you just walk out and those stories are there. Like, one of my favorite stories is, is the one that I did , um, from Global Village where I met a guy who was working in a tea stall . He was a financial controller and he had retired and gone to India and someone asked him, oh you know, we are putting up a Starling Global village, do you wanna come? And he thought, oh, you know, that's a challenge. That's, that might be nice. I think I'll enjoy it. And he came and before he'd reached here, he had never made a cup of tea in his life. <laugh>

8:20

Amazing. Gosh, what confidence.

8:23

<laugh>. Yeah. And then when he came here the first day he was like, it was just tea powder and milk and water. And then, you know, he started adding a little bit of cinnamon and he started adding things. And then soon, like his tea was the most talked about tea in global village and people would come looking for it because it was a nice carrot chai. And I was like, wow, th this is like such an amazing story from a financial controller to like, you know, a tea maker who was so passionate about his job.

8:54

Absolutely. And I , I think we're seeing kind of a movement I feel towards people wanting, they want good news like this now, you know, there's actual whole accounts dedicated to this on Instagram. You know , there's like the good news movement. Do people want these good news stories? Do you feel, do you, I mean I'm sure you get feedback on which stories are getting the most traction sort of online and um , on your socials. Is , is that reflected? Are people sort of drawn towards these stories perhaps more than, you know, the more tragic ones that we say

9:18

In the world? Absolutely. From our uh, numbers we see that human interest stories, especially like , you know , positive stories, they really, really do well in terms of readership as opposed to, but I'm gonna be honest with you, so do accident stories, those also do incredibly well. I don't know why people, I don't really understand the emotion behind it, but , um, a crime accidents, those also do really well .

9:48

Oh gosh. I can kind of understand that though. Cause I think there is something back sometimes as human beings, we want to understand when things go wrong as well as when things go right. So there's that not mortgage , but it's, it's a strange feeling of wanting to know, I've made the choice in recently as to not to not know <laugh> , I have to say. Um , I've tried to focus more on the positives and the human interest. You , there's a lot of , lot of research about how a negative news story has got a half life within your body of like four or five hours or something. You know , if you read something really negative in the morning and then kind of stays with you, which is not to, you know, lock yourself in a bubble and , and that these things are not happening in the world. But I think you do have to my personal view anyways , that you do have to be quite careful with how you consume news these days just cuz it can have a huge impact. And I mean, and speaking of that , so sometimes things are gonna happen that aren't so positive. I mean, do you ever feel, you know, your happiness editor, do you ever feel you have to sugarcoat things or do you feel you just, you know, you just have to report things as they are? How do you cope with those stories?

10:42

Sugarcoat? No, I mean, and you know, my job isn't completely happiness focused . It's news and you know, you do news as it happens. But , um, a lot of times I have to sort of cushion the blow a little bit. And also me as a person, you're a human being and sometimes some of the stories really, really disturb you and you know , like, so you have to sort of cushion yourself as well. So for me, I consider myself as the sort of sounding board for how I write a story. So if something really disturbs me, I try and, you know, really sort of , you know, mellow it down a little bit so that it doesn't affect people too much. But yeah, I do tend to, especially in terms of crime and death and those kind of stories, I try to mellow it down because it is a difficult, you know, job to do. And I mean some of the stories like that I've done like some, some events it happened like about eight to nine months ago, but it's still there fresh in my mind and I just keep thinking back to those stories and thinking back to the people who were involved in it because it was quite difficult. So I try to not let people take the brunt of it. I take the brunt of it, cushion it, and give people only what they need to know. That must be

12:05

Such a heavy lift then Nina. I mean to kind of take, I mean whenever someone tells you their story, you're kind of holding that space for them. I mean, how do you sort of do that and tell the story? I mean you say it stays with you. How do you kind of manage that? Because that must be really hard and a really heavy lift to carry around with you afterwards.

12:20

Yeah, I share it with, of course I share it with my husband and uh, he is someone who's like, you know, a very positive person. So he helps me work through my feelings. We both help each other, but he is not someone who gets easily affected by those kind of stories. And he'll always help me see some positive out of it. Sometimes it's hard. Some of the stories that I'm thinking of now, I don't,

12:44

I don't really

12:44

Wanna share cuz I feel like it's really heartbreaking some of the stories. But I think he helps me a lot. But otherwise , um, I try to just let it go and not think about it too much. But what really affects me is when the stories involve children and you are a mother, you have children, that that's when it really like, sort of affects me. There was, you know, a case about the death of a teenager and I, I keep thinking about the mother and sometimes I, I like, a lot of times I stay in touch with the social worker who was dealing with the case and I check with them like, no , how is the mother doing? And you can't even approach them because at the end of the day, you're a journalist, they think you're there for a story even if you are just there to offer some sort of comfort. So you have to know your limits, you have to deal with it carefully.

13:37

Yeah, it must be very challenging. I remember , um, I mean a very long time ago, I don't dunno if you know the Don Blaine shooting that happened, it's the only time it was ever a shooting in the uk and I was working in a newsroom on a daily newspaper in the UK at the time. And I remember, I remember it's giving me chills even now . This guy walked into the school and shot at the kids and shot a number of the children and, and one of the school teachers, huge tragedy as the town that Andy , um, Murray comes from the <inaudible> up in Scotland. And I can remember being in so clearly being in the newsroom, this was just as it happened, but then all the machinations of the newsroom kicked in so straight away . And quite rightly the news editor was like, right, okay, see if we can get on a plane to Scotland, see how are we gonna get people there? Have they closed the airport? Can we get people there? You are gonna do this. You, you researched the family, you researched the schools , you researched UK gun laws like , and it just switched into like, how are we gonna cover the story? I was sent out to find children on the street to take them into the local cathedral to light candles for the kids. And it was just, I mean, it stayed with me and after that I thought, I don't , I don't think I'm cut out for this because quite rightly the story had to run, but the center of it, like say there's 20 kids that I can't remember how many children were sadly killed, but there's all those children, all those families, all those mothers. And yeah, it's 20 , 30 years on , it's um , it has stayed with me. So you having to deal with

14:53

I tend to compartmentalize. Yes . Like when I'm on a news story, it's almost like I, I lock away my emotions. I mean one case I can probably talk about it happened. So for me , I was a journalist about 10 years ago and then I took a long break when my kids were young and then I came back into journalism about a year ago. So when I was initially a journalist, there was a case about a four year old boy who was killed in a mosque on either day eight is probably one of the worst stories involving children that happened in the uae. But I was eight months pregnant and I was sent out to interview this lady who had just lost her child in the most horrific manner that a parent can ever imagine. Again, that story, it has always stayed with me and I always think about that boy , I always pray for that boy and his parents. You know, it again, you know, you don't forget these things, it stays with you.

16:00

Of course not . They are gonna stay with you for sure. Yes . It's not all , um, positive story. You're having to handle all these things as well and, and juggle them all together. I'm curious about, so the job title is Happiness Editor and how would you define happiness, if you can, Nazarene is this , is this something that changes as we, you know, go through our lives as we get older? How has it changed for you? You know, you mentioned 10 years ago when then you came back. I mean , how, how do you, how do you sort of translate that into your life now?

16:28

Uh, oh my god, happiness, the definition has hap of happiness has changed so much over the years. In fact, I was just reading the question and my daughter said, oh, when you're young, happiness means fun things. And when you're old, happiness means boring. Things, like things you guys do, <laugh>,

16:48

I mean, sounds like she's got it exactly. Nailed .

16:51

Yeah . Honestly, for me when I was young , happiness meant something completely different. But now happiness means my family, you know, just being at home, spending time with them and friends. I mean, over the years I've been incredibly blessed to have a group of friends who have taken me through thin , thick and thin who are very honest, who keep me grounded. And I used to be a people pleaser and now I'm just saying , oh, you know, I have enough friends, I don't need people to like me.

17:25

Excellent. Very bold. I like it. I'm a recovering people pleaser. I don't think I'm quite there yet. I don't think it helps working in PR to be honest. Cuz your whole residential is around pleasing people all the time professionally. So , um, oh , <laugh> . I don't think, it's not massively impossible , but I'm working on it.

17:43

It's hard to come out of that.

17:44

It is hard. I know , especially I think it's a gender thing as well, you know, I think as women, like you see it from, you know, from being quite young girls are, you know , they have the glue and they're the oil that kind of pulls the family together. And then there's certain expectations. I definitely, I have not met as many, I don't try to think about , I haven't met a male people pleaser a couple, but not many. I really dig deep to try and think of some people that I know that are male people pleasers. So anecdote is not date there , but that's, that's my experience. And I mean, do you ever feel sort of under pressure to always be positive and optimistic because of your job and, and the title that you've got? I mean, people , you know, if you're, if you're an event and they're like, there here's no three and the happens editor and, and you're scowling cause you're having a really bad day. I mean, how does that translate

18:26

<laugh> ? Uh, no, thankfully at work I don't have that. Um , you know, the burden of always trying to be positive, but generally I'm a very positive person. But again, I was, I was reading this question and my, my kids say , oh, when you're in a bad mood , we avoid the room that you're in. We go into our room and we discuss what could have put you in a bad mood. Clearly my kids keep me very grounded.

18:52

Absolutely. We should get them on. That can be my next guest .

18:55

They've

18:56

Got a lot of wisdom . <laugh> .

18:59

Yeah, I'm usually very positive cousin , but Touchwood , I have an amazing boss. I have an amazing , um, group of coworkers . Our team, if you're having a bad day, they'll just let you have the bad day and they'll just step in and help you and just give you a little bit of breathing space.

19:16

Yeah . And , and I was gonna ask you about bad days. I mean, you know, you've happiness editor , I'm sure you do have bad days. I mean, how, how do you handle those when they call ?

19:24

You just, you just handle it. But again, like I said, I have a team and sometimes, you know, I'll tell my boss, okay, listen, I'm in a really bad mood. And he'd be like, okay , why don't you just take it easy and I'll assign the story to someone else. But also because I was away from journalism for so long, now that I'm back, I really, really enjoy myself and I love my job. I love being able to tell these stories. So even when I'm having a bad day, I'm deep down, I'm really thankful that I've been given this second chance to do this job that I love so much and that gets me through it.

20:05

Do you think you've always been an optimistic, positive person Re or did you have to learn it? Were you always like this from being a kid? Or did it come later? Yeah,

20:13

I, I think I was a , a very positive, very cheerful, always smiling kind of person. Also, I'm an only child. I wasn't very happy as an only child. I found it very boring. There are days now that I think, you know, maybe it's good, I'm an only child, but on the whole, I wish I had siblings and I have two kids now, and I'm, I'm very happy for them to have that sibling love . But again, like, you know, when you're an early child, you spend so much time with yourself , you end up having to try and find your own fun things to do. And you're generally quite positive, I feel.

20:54

Yeah, no , it's nice to hear someone saying something positive about it. Yeah, definitely. I'm , I'm very good with my own company. I could, I mean, I , I travel alone. I'll eat out alone. I'll go to the movies alone. Nothing, you know, I, I find myself quite a good company. Um , I don't need, I don't need have anyone with me. I'm quite self-sufficient, almost to the point of being a bit too self-sufficient sometimes. But , uh,

21:13

<laugh>,

21:13

Yeah, I really, I need my own space, my own time pushing what

21:17

I like, having my friends. I like hanging out with my friends, but sometimes, you know, I'll be really quiet and my parents be like, why are you so quiet? And I'm like, no, I'm having such an interesting conversation inside my head. <laugh>,

21:30

I know exercise is super important to you. You say it's like a , it's a passion of yours. It's an integral part of everything you do. And, and not only exercise, but you do something slightly unusual. Nazarene, which is Brazilian jiu-jitsu. And correct me if I'm wrong, but this seems like a very masculine, whenever I look at it, it seems to be men doing it very sort of like testosterone fueled sport. I mean, tell us like, how did you get involved in this? Like, are more women taking it off ? I mean, it just sounds , um, fantastic to , to see you doing this.

21:58

Okay , so some very, very funny story. I am someone A, who hates being touched, and b, who doesn't like to hurt other people. Like even if I'm giving someone a massage, I'd be like, oh, are you okay? Are you okay? And I come into the sport where the first thing they teach you is how to choke people and how to break their hands. <laugh> .

22:26

Okay, yeah. They take the spot for you stop everything, <laugh> , quiet , violent desk killing death , killing sport . And here we have to read . Brilliant.

22:37

So basically my kids, they, they do something called TaeKwonDo

22:40

My daughter too .

22:42

Yeah , yeah . Oh , right , yeah . So sh you know, they , uh, go to an academy, it's really nice place. The people are really nice. So their master once said, oh, you know what, we are starting , um, jiujitsu, why don't you join us? I had never heard of the sport . I had never heard anything about it, but I was like, oh, you know what, it , it's the same place my kids go to. It's walking distance from our house. I was like, I'll just go, I'll just hang out there. I'll meet all their teachers, I'll , you know, probably be friends with them. And I walked in there and I was like , uh oh , where have I come? What is this thing that I've got myself into <laugh> , but you didn't walk out. And once I went, I couldn't quit because these were people I would see every day if I quit. And they'd always think of me as a quitter. So I quit .

23:33

That's the people blazing the train . It's no <laugh> . Yes,

23:36

<laugh>

23:37

Bit .

23:39

But you know, I started off with , um, doing jiu-jitsu once a week and now I do it at least four times a week.

23:48

My goodness. I thought you were gonna say twice, four times a week. My goodness. You , you have a black belt?

23:53

Uh, no, not yet. I've just , uh, black belt is gonna take a while. But , uh, blue belt , um, I've been doing it for two years now, so I've recently got my blue belt and yeah , I have been really enjoying myself. So again, jiujitsu, it was brought into the UAE by the Rolling Family. They discovered it, they brought it here, and then now it's an integral part of , uh, ua. Some of the best jiujitsu martial arts are in this country. Some of the best competitions happen here. It was taught in schools in the uae , there was a UA jitsu school program. And we have like really great champions like Shamal Albani, and you know, a lot of Emirati women and men who have got into it. So jujitsu has literally become an extension of the ue and I'm super thankful I found it and I'm, I'm in this great community of athletes.

24:47

So what is it about it Serino ? How does it make you feel? Like, why do you keep going back? I mean, four times a week is pretty extreme. There must be something very magical and there's a very strong call for you. So what , what is it? How does it, how can you articulate what that is?

24:59

A couple of years ago I found fitness and I was super into it. So when I went into my first Jiujitsu class, I thought, oh, you know, this is gonna be fine. And it was a two hour class and I came out of it and I just sat on my sofa for two hours, unable to move. I felt like a truck had hit me. So, you know, the, the stamina, the strength involved was alien to me. And that same me, I can probably do two or even three classes a day now because, you know, I've built the stamina and just the flexibility and the way your body moves while practicing jiujitsu, it has been a huge revelation to me in terms of overall fitness. For me, overall fitness was really important. Just everything about it. The thrill that you get in a fight every day, every single day, even if you do the exact same moves, the exact same techniques, every day is different. You learn something new. Yeah. That

26:01

I've heard people speak about. I know Russell Brown is quite famously a Brazilian jujitsu fan, and he talks about the physicality of it and how there's something very grounding about the fact that you are, you know, you're touching someone and you are like so close to them. And , and the trust that I think he said, I had him on the podcast the other day where he said, you know, one minute, literally this guy's got his arm around your neck and he could snap your neck and kill you. But then you just tap like the lightest tap just means that's it finished and then it's gone. So you have that trust for someone that they could do something so damaging to you. I think there's something very sort of, what's, what's the word? There's something very, a very basic human level about the touching and the movement that seems to be very powerful.

26:39

Exactly. And it's very humbling. You are a blue belt who's been doing it for two years, a white belt who comes in today, you could learn something from them, they could defeat you. There's nothing that makes you better than another person. It's a very humbling, very grounding experience.

26:59

Wow . Yeah, it sounds amazing. My daughter does TaeKwonDo, which I mean obviously very different, but has that whole martial arts mentality of respect and control and yeah, I recommend that to anybody. Um , especially people with younger kids , especially for girls. I mean, I think it's so important that women do, you know, exercise and movement, they all know about, you know, as you get older, osteoporosis and all that kind of stuff happening to your bones. I just think

27:22

Absolutely

27:22

In general, just for women to be fair to do something that is so, you know, it's basically based around fighting that you are hopefully never gonna have to use. Which sounds counterintuitive. Yeah.

27:31

But it , it, it builds a , a fighting mentality in you, which is applicable to every faction of your life. It's amazing.

27:37

And , um, I mean this podcast, I mean, it was called good intentions and it's all about sort of how we can try and, you know, keep ourselves at optimum level, how we can encourage our own positive energy. I mean, have you got any sort of practical tips about how to do that apart from the Brazilian jiujitsu and, and apart from having a great boss, which sounds like you do, is there anything that you use, anything that you do in your life that can perhaps help help anyone listening to this podcast?

28:04

I would say two things that, that I always try to keep in mind are , you know, my intention every day . One is to help people either by telling stories or by in, in whatever small way you can. Whether it could be a smile, it could be anything. Just try and make someone's day better. Some people say, you know, oh, I , there's nothing I can do. No, that's not right. Everyone can do something to help another person. I feel like if you had that mentality you need to try and help people, I think the world would be a much better place. And another thing is fitness. I am someone who did not have anything for fitness . I avoided gyms. I, I avoided any kind of fitness activities, but again, I had good friends who dragged me into a gym and who got me hooked onto it. And this is something I tell everyone, no matter how old you are, how young you are, please have just find 15 to 30 minutes every day . Do something. Especially please try and get into a gym. Please try and do some lifting. Even if you are 70, 80 years old, lifting, you know, strength training can have profound impact on your life, on the quality of your life. And that is something I wish everyone would do.

29:36

Yeah. Now I have to say weightlifting and strength training that's next on my list. I'm doing plenty of cardio , but um, yeah, that's something which I'm realizing as I need to get older. And I like what you say as well about sort of like normalizing, going to the gym and letting your kids see that you exercise as well and that you have something that you are doing even when you don't always want to. You know, I don't always want to go play tennis. I don't always wanna go for a run. I don't always wanna go to the gym when I say this to my daughter and then I do it anyways. She sees, you know, it's like it's, you won't always want to do it, but I think, what's that phrase someone said to me recently, move, move a muscle change of thought. So when you are feeling in a slump or when you're feeling round , sometimes exercise, I mean, sometimes you feel so down that you can't move and that's also okay . But a lot of the time, you know, eight times out 10 for me, if I do move, I'm gonna feel better. I know that I will. So that's why I do it, even though I'm groaning and moaning all the way sometimes in my head, all the way to the, to the beach for a run. I don't wanna run, I don't wanna run. I really don't wanna run. I can't , running's awful, I'm an awful. And then you get there and you do it, then it's

30:36

So yeah. Yeah.

30:37

Now like, okay , great .

30:39

Yep . Sounds exactly like me. I mean, a lot of times I just don't wanna do it, but it's been scientifically proven that movement actually helps with your, you know, with your happiness as well . And I'm a person trainer as well. I'm a qualified as a level three person trainer and I've done , uh, person training for older adults. And from all my coursework work , I have come to realize that strength training and being active is this single most important way. How you can ensure that you have a fit body and mind or improve the quality of your life as you get older. Especially for women.

31:23

Yeah , absolutely crucial. No , I , I couldn't agree more. If you had to get into the Brazilian jiu-jitsu ring with anybody, Rene , and you could pick anyone here, world leader, celebrity, I mean, who would you like to spa with? Oh ,

31:37

That's an interesting question. I'm just gonna pick this person because I know that he got into Jiujitsu fairly recently. I think it would be Mark Zuckerberg. Oh my

31:48

Goodness. Is he , oh wow. That makes sense . I'm surprised he's come to it so late.

31:53

Yeah, I was quite surprised when I saw that, you know, he was actually sparring and so on. But yeah, I would love to get him into a ring and uh, talk to him while he taps me <laugh> .

32:06

Yeah , it's got , it's gotta be a great level, A level that I , uh, tell me about the algorithms mark as you , um, having <crosstalk> .

32:12

Yes . <laugh> ,

32:12

Tell me the truth. How do you know though ? I want to buy a new car in three months and my favorite Yes . Thread and yeah, yeah. Tell, tell how, how are you reading my mind about <laugh> ? Interesting. I wonder why do you think he's taken it out

32:25

Again? I mean, like I said,

32:26

It's

32:26

A great, you know , avenue for fitness as well as um, you know, it keeps you grounded. So when you are, you know, when you have too much going on, this is a great way to get on a mat to choke a few people, to learn things, to keep you grounded. It's so many things in just one, one sport.

32:47

Yeah . He probably has quite a lot of stress to work through at the moment as well, I would imagine . Although maybe the billions maybe help, I dunno ,

32:53

<laugh>

32:55

And we'll love to talk about books on this podcast. Have you got any books that have sort of changed your life, shaped how you live, that you give as gifts ? Anything you'd like to recommend that we get hold of

33:05

Just my life? Um , I mean I love reading and I read a wide variety of books, but , um, nothing that's really one book that, that I think about quite, quite often, even though I read it as a really young, I think I was 13 or 14 when I read it. It is the autobiography of a guy called Lee Iacocca . And um, he was a automobile industry big way . So the one thing that he wrote about in his book that I've carried with me is wearing a seatbelt . He's like, you know , written quite extensively in his , uh, book about, he was at the head of Ford and then he was fired from there and I believe he went to Chrysler . Anyway, he was not a big fan of airbags, but he kept talking about seat belts and how it was so, so important. So that's one book and one tip I've always kept in mind. But otherwise I think I absorbed a little bit from every book that I read. I love books, I love reading. My childhood favorites. Were probably little women and , uh, Anne of Green Gables.

34:20

Oh , both fantastic. But Little Women, I think there's been a

34:23

New

34:23

Movie recently, if I'm correct . Yes, a really new one. I know they made into a movie a while ago. Um , cause my daughters up asking me about it ,

34:31

Skeptical about movies made on my favorite books. <laugh> .

34:34

I know, I know exactly what you mean. My daughter mentioned it and I was like, well no, we have to read the book first and then you can watch the movie. Cause that's just, that's how it works, right?

34:42

Yes,

34:43

<laugh> . But yeah, no, I loved it as a child. I thought it was , yeah , it's quite much , it's interesting how some of these, some of these childhood books have sort of stayed and they're , they're just the , the test of time. They've completely passed it. And then some, you know, you read and , and then they're gone.

34:55

Even the little prints, I think the

34:57

Little prints, it's , I mean we've got a couple of copies of that actually. And it comes up and you know, we have our little free library outside the house . It comes a few times, Uhhuh maybe like once a month it turns up, but not so, so often. We have a few copies in the house. That's a really beautiful book as well.

35:10

Yeah,

35:10

One of those ones that I think read it as a kid and you read it on a surface level, then you read it when you're older and you realize there's a lot more.

35:16

Exactly. As an older person, it's a completely different perspective. Yeah,

35:21

Completely different. Have you read a book called , um, Jonathan Livingston Seagull?

35:25

I had it with me , but I never read it.

35:27

So is that's a very similar book in that on surface level it's about seagull and he, you know, lives with his seagull friends and he flies and he lives his seagull life. The end, like, that's it. But actually it's all about comparison and trying and, and, and how you live your life and there's all these fantastic life lessons in it. We've got a couple of copies in our house. It's one of my husbands, I recommend reading it cuz again, the title just seems so simple. You're like, well , it's Seagull, but actually yeah, it's a really, yeah, my mom picked up and she was like, why have you got a book about Seagull who wrote seagulls? So I was like, no, no. Read it Mom . It's ,

35:59

It's a great book. <laugh>. Okay , I've got , I've got to read

36:03

That. Yeah, I , I promise I'll, I'll get a copy of you if you don't have one . It's a seagull book . And one big question to end on Nazarene, what do you think is your greatest achievement? Oh,

36:10

Dear Lord, that's a very loaded question

36:14

And I have a huge variety of answers for everybody has a different answer for this question.

36:18

I wanna say, I hope, I mean, because I've not reached that level yet, but I hope that my greatest achievement will be kids who go out and do good. I think that's you as a person. There's, there's only so much you can do and achieve, but when you raise , um, little humans and you give them the , the right kind of values and then they go out and do good for other people, that is an achievement. But my kids are still young. They have not flown the nest yet. So I wouldn't know that now, as of now, I would say my job as a journalist, because again, I get to tell stories that matter. I think of it as a blessing and an achievement when I'm able to do something for someone. Recently there was a post about a lady who was in, you know, dire straits. She needed something, I don't wanna advertise it, but basically she needed something and I thought people would be like, you know, help would be flocking, but it wasn't. And I just did something really simple, connected her to someone and what she wanted was also so basic and uh , they were able to sort it out for her. And she thanked me and I was, it was such a small thing, but I was so thankful I was able to do that for her. And it just made me realize, again, how important a job I have. It goes beyond telling people's stories. It , it also puts me in a position where I'm able to connect people to get things done, which might be a big deal for them, but not for the people for whom it really matters. So I'm really, really grateful for my job. That's

38:22

Incredible. Yeah. And if you can make these connections, then isn't that a whole point of life, right? Mm-hmm . Yes . To be connected absolutely to one another. That's how we're supposed to live. Not, you know, separate and disparate as we sometimes are, but actually to support and care for and love one another, which, what a gorgeous point to end on. Lazarre .

38:41

Thank you so much, Kelly . I really enjoyed speaking to you.

38:45

I love speaking to you too. Thank you so much.

38:47

Take care. Bye.