Yascha Mounk and Coleman Hughes discuss the difference between race blindness and racism blindness.

Coleman Hughes is a writer and the host of Conversations with Coleman. His new book is The End of Race Politics: Arguments for a Colorblind America.

In this week’s conversation, Yascha Mounk and Coleman Hughes discuss why race is a poor proxy for setting public policy; why being colorblind doesn’t mean disregarding one’s own cultural affinities; and how we can continue to make progress against racial discrimination without making the concept of race ever more central to our culture and politics.

This transcript has been condensed and lightly edited for clarity.

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