Episode Transcript
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0:04
From the Australian, here's what's on the
0:06
front. I'm Claire Harvey, it's Tuesday, May 21.
0:13
A convicted sex offender will walk free
0:15
years before his prison sentence was due
0:17
to end, and it's all because of
0:20
an error by ACT authorities. Victims
0:22
of Stephen Leonard Mitchell say the Office
0:25
of the Director of Public Prosecutions was
0:27
warned about the child sex offender's bungled
0:29
plea deal, but they were too preoccupied
0:31
by the rape trial of former Liberal
0:34
staffer Bruce Lammon to fix it. You
0:38
can read that story exclusively at
0:40
theaustralian.com.au Labor
0:47
wants to slash the superannuation
0:49
of federal judges, but barristers
0:51
and legal experts say the
0:53
new legislation could compromise the
0:55
judiciary's independence and push judges
0:57
to state courts in search
0:59
of better pay. Iran's
1:03
hardline Islamic regime has suffered
1:05
a major blow after President
1:07
Ebrahim Raisi was killed in
1:09
a helicopter crash on Sunday
1:11
night. That's the
1:13
assessment of the Australian's chief international
1:16
correspondent Cameron Stewart. In
1:18
today's episode, Cam unpacks what Raisi's
1:20
death means for the region and
1:23
why conspiracy theories are blossoming.
1:39
One of the oldest civilizations on
1:41
earth, a society glittering
1:43
with knowledge and sophistication, a
1:46
brutally repressive regime with ambitions
1:48
to change the world. Iran
2:01
is one of the most mysterious
2:04
and intriguing places on earth, ruled
2:06
by men who've vowed to
2:08
destroy Western civilization. No
2:11
wonder it's inspired a legion of
2:14
espionage thrillers like the Apple TV
2:16
series Tehran, which follows a wildly
2:18
beautiful young agent of the Israeli
2:21
spy agency Mossad as
2:23
she infiltrates Iran in the attempt
2:25
to destroy its nuclear program. Mossad
2:29
sent me to Tehran on a mission, but
2:33
then everything went wrong. Feels
2:37
so! That's
2:41
why when on Sunday night a
2:43
helicopter carrying Iran's President and Foreign
2:45
Minister went down, thoughts immediately ran
2:47
to conspiracy. Was
2:50
this an assassination? This
2:52
operation is highly classified. We need
2:54
to send them calls. In
3:02
Iran's spectacularly beautiful northwest, the
3:04
rugged mountains give way to
3:06
expansive plains. When the
3:09
weather turns, those peaks are covered in thick,
3:11
heavy fog. And it
3:13
was into this fog that the
3:15
chopper-carrying President Ebrahim Raisi and Foreign
3:17
Minister Hussein Amir Abdullah Yann vanished.
3:21
We know that President Ebrahim Raisi
3:23
was returning to Iran from a
3:25
trip to Azerbaijan where he was
3:28
inspecting infrastructure projects. When his
3:30
helicopter crashed in what we've been told
3:32
is quite mountainous terrain in a
3:34
remote part of Iran. A
3:37
large-scale rescue operation sprang into
3:39
action with dogs and drones to
3:41
search the areas too dark, too dangerous
3:44
or too difficult for humans to traverse.
3:49
On Monday, the Chief of Iran's
3:51
Red Crescent humanitarian organization said the
3:54
chopper, which had evaded detection for
3:56
hours, had been found, but the
3:58
situation was not good. I'm
4:06
joined by the Australian's Chief International
4:08
Correspondent Cameron Stewart. We're speaking on
4:10
Monday afternoon and this situation is
4:12
very fluid. Cam, who
4:15
is Ibrahim Raisi? What does the
4:18
President do in Iran? Cam,
4:20
the President in Iran is the
4:22
second most powerful person in that
4:24
country. He is subordinate only to
4:27
the so-called Supreme Leader, that is
4:29
Ayatollah Khomeini. And Ayatollah Khomeini
4:32
sets the parameters of what
4:34
happens in Iran. The
4:36
military policy, political policy,
4:38
social policy, theocratic policy,
4:40
etc, etc. And
4:42
he is appointed by clerics. He is not a
4:44
popularly appointed leader. And so it's
4:47
an authoritarian country. The President is elected by
4:49
the public but they're considered widely
4:51
to be sham elections. So
4:53
therefore, the Ayatollah, who is
4:55
a very conservative religious hardliner,
4:58
only chooses as his President
5:00
a conservative religious hardliner, which
5:02
is precisely what President Raisi
5:05
was. As we
5:07
began speaking, Iranian rescuers announced
5:09
that they'd found the wreckage
5:11
of the helicopter but no sign
5:13
so far of any survivors. What's
5:15
the context of this in terms
5:18
of Iran's capability? Could
5:20
they have top of the range helicopters
5:22
that could fly safely in foggy conditions like
5:24
the ones that are being reported out of Iran? Iran
5:27
has very old equipment in
5:30
lots of areas and surprisingly this
5:32
helicopter was actually quite old. It's
5:34
a very old helicopter. It's one you'd be quite
5:36
surprised frankly that they'd be putting the President and
5:39
the Foreign Minister and very important
5:41
officials into. It remains to be
5:44
seen of course the exact cause
5:46
of the crash. We've seen the vision
5:48
and footage and certainly the weather is
5:50
very bad. There's lots of fog and
5:52
it seems to initially be being blamed
5:55
on bad weather. But of course with
5:57
this sort of thing, especially with Iran's circumstances, there's a
5:59
lot of at the moment in the Middle East
6:01
and the war that we've got
6:03
with Hamas Israel, Claire there will be a
6:05
lot of conspiracy theories which are always already
6:08
bouncing around the internet. Let's
6:14
dive right into those conspiracy theories then
6:16
Cam. Why would Israel be involved in
6:18
this in any way? Look
6:21
Iran and Israel that the long-term enmity
6:24
between the two countries has really
6:26
peaked, Claire, since the Hamas Israel
6:28
conflict which began of course on
6:30
October 7 and
6:32
it's becoming more and more
6:34
tense. Iran has authorised its
6:36
proxies like Hezbollah in Lebanon
6:38
and also its proxies in
6:40
Syria and Iraq to launch
6:42
short-term attacks on Israel through
6:44
missiles etc. But last month
6:46
it really became extremely
6:48
heated when Iran launched its
6:51
first ever direct attack on
6:53
Israel hundreds of drones
6:55
and missiles. It's fired towards
6:57
Israel in retaliation for an
6:59
Israeli attack on its forces
7:01
based in Syria. Now while
7:03
that attack was very unsuccessful,
7:06
all but a handful were actually
7:08
shot down by the Israelis before
7:10
they got to Israel, that was
7:13
a real turning point in Iran.
7:15
It's Iran's history to actually make
7:17
a direct attack on
7:19
Israel and I think that really
7:22
underlines how under President
7:24
Raisi and this Islamic regime
7:26
Iran has hardened its position
7:28
on Israel. Cam,
7:30
one of the other conspiracy theories is
7:32
that this is about the power plays
7:35
within Iran itself. As you told us
7:37
the Supreme Leader of Iran is a
7:39
religious figure, the Ayatollah Ali Khamenei. What
7:42
are the prospects that with the apparent
7:44
death of President Raisi that
7:46
things change significantly in Iran?
7:49
There will certainly be a lot of people
7:51
outside Iran, Claire, who will hope that this
7:53
will lead to some form of change. It
7:55
will certainly lead to a
7:57
power struggle within the ruling elite.
8:00
over who actually replaces him as
8:02
President. Under Iranian law there will
8:04
be elections within about 50 days
8:06
for a new President but these
8:08
elections are widely considered to be
8:10
rigged so it's most likely the
8:12
Supreme Leader will choose to a
8:14
degree who that candidate might be
8:16
but even so there will
8:19
be some tensions within this elite
8:21
between more liberal forces and
8:24
the hardliners as well and that will be
8:26
fascinating to see how that plays
8:29
out. Whether we actually see any visibility
8:31
of those tensions it's not at all
8:33
certain that we would because things are
8:35
very much a close chop in Iran
8:37
at that high level. But
8:39
certainly opponents of Iran's
8:42
Islamic clerical system will be hoping that
8:44
this will lead to some sort of
8:46
greater liberalisation among the ruling elite but
8:48
I think that is probably a fairly
8:50
optimistic assumption. Subscribers
9:00
to The Australian are the first to hear
9:02
breaking news updates like this one. A subscription
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also includes newsletters tailored to your
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9:12
like Cam do their thing in
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person. Check us out
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at theaustralian.com.au and we'll be back
9:18
after this break. My
9:22
name is Manny Carutas and I'm a
9:24
former New South Wales policeman turned investigative
9:26
reporter with a passion for missing persons
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now wherever you get your podcast and early
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in ad free on Crime X Plus on
9:52
Apple Podcasts. According
10:04
to state TV Iran's supreme
10:06
leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei commented publicly
10:08
on the helicopter crash that killed
10:11
President Raisi late on Sunday.
10:13
He said the nation of Iran should not be
10:15
worried and anxious. No disruption will
10:18
occur in the country's affairs. Thousands
10:21
of people, mostly men, took to the
10:23
streets of the Iranian capital Tehran on
10:25
Sunday night to pray for Raisi and
10:27
his fellow travellers. Under
10:35
President Raisi Iran has hardened its
10:38
treatment of Iranians too, particularly women.
10:40
There have been reports of a
10:42
serious crackdown on rules like women
10:44
wearing hijabs in public. There have
10:46
been women who have disappeared from
10:48
the streets of Iran after being
10:50
photographed not wearing head coverings. In
10:52
those terms, Kham, who is Ebrahim
10:54
Raisi, is he a hardline conservative?
10:56
He's a very hardline conservative. So Raisi,
10:59
he was the guy who was basically
11:01
authorising that crackdown and more than 500
11:04
people died in that terrible street
11:06
violence that we saw and oppression
11:08
that occurred towards those protesters. So
11:10
I think his death will certainly
11:13
not be mourned by a lot
11:15
of younger Iranians. There's an inherent
11:17
tension in Iran today
11:20
between younger Iranians who love
11:22
Western clothes, want a more
11:25
Western lifestyle, want greater freedoms
11:28
and the old Islamic
11:30
mullahs, the ruling elites
11:32
basically. And Raisi
11:34
represented absolutely the old style
11:37
Islamic hardliner. So there will
11:39
be no mourning of him
11:43
from many younger Iranians.
11:49
Instability in Iran is obviously a
11:51
big story for the whole region and
11:53
for the world because Iran controls or
11:55
has influence over militias in a whole
11:57
lot of countries from Yemen. to
12:00
Lebanon, to Syria, to Iraq.
12:03
Can we talk about some of those, Cam? For
12:06
example in Yemen that's where the Houthi
12:08
rebels are based who have been attacking
12:10
shipping in the Red Sea. What
12:12
do you think his death will mean for
12:14
those Iranian proxy forces throughout the Middle East?
12:17
Well this is probably the most important
12:19
single question I think to arise from
12:22
his death because since the October 7th
12:24
Israeli Hamas conflict Iran has played
12:27
a very curious role in the
12:29
sense that it encourages terror proxies
12:31
in the region like Hezbollah and
12:34
all sorts of proxies in
12:36
Iraq and Syria to attack
12:39
Israel and in fact US forces in
12:41
the region too but also as far
12:43
as Hezbollah is concerned to attack Israel
12:45
in such a manner as to really
12:48
distract Israel but not actually
12:51
in such large degree as
12:53
to create a larger conflict.
12:55
So in fact Iran had
12:57
quite a finely balanced policy
12:59
of provoking Israel since
13:01
October 7 with its proxies in
13:04
the region without triggering an actual war. Now
13:06
that is a deliberate and
13:08
finely balanced policy coming out
13:10
of Tehran, coming out of the
13:12
Islamic regime there. Now whether President
13:15
Raisi's death will change that
13:17
balance is a critical question for the
13:19
region. Is
13:25
there a possibility that this makes everything worse in the
13:28
middle of the Middle East that it escalates tensions? Look
13:32
if it were able
13:34
to be proved or shown that in
13:37
fact the crash was a sabotage
13:40
I think that would be a very
13:42
dangerous situation for the region if
13:44
the Islamic regime chose
13:47
to blame Israel or
13:49
the US or a Western country
13:52
because that would really ratchet up
13:54
the tensions enormously at a time
13:56
when tensions are already massive over
13:59
the Israeli regime. conflict over
14:01
the constant bombing of northern
14:03
Israel by Hezbollah and the instability on the
14:05
West Bank and with the Houthis in Yemen.
14:08
I mean the whole Middle
14:10
East is in a tinderbox really and I
14:12
just think that if there was a confirmation
14:15
that this was an act of sabotage that
14:17
would be a very dangerous position for the
14:20
region. Cameron
14:24
Stewart is the Australian's chief international
14:26
correspondent. To
14:31
read the latest updates on this developing story and
14:34
for all the nation's best journalism
14:36
visit the Australian Bookroom
14:38
Staryog. I'm
14:59
Sarah Lamarque, editor-in-chief of Stella and host
15:02
of our podcast called Something to Talk
15:04
About. Every weekend we publish a new
15:06
episode where you'll hear compelling personalities, strong
15:08
opinions and thought-provoking conversations. I wanted to
15:10
be able to do it in my
15:13
time when I was ready and speak
15:15
my truth when I was ready. The
15:17
topic of when do I become a
15:19
mum that is in my mind 24
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