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1:40

What's up, everybody, Welcome back to the Draymond

1:42

Green Show, Snana.

1:44

It's always honored to have a guest, but win.

1:47

When you have a Hall of Famer NBA

1:50

champion, one of the goats,

1:52

you can't help but be thankful and be

1:55

honored.

1:55

And today I have the honor of being

1:57

joined by two.

1:58

Time NBA Champion NBA Finals

2:00

MVP in nineteen ninety,

2:02

the year I was born. Such a great year,

2:05

incredible year, nineteen ninety

2:07

baby, twelve time

2:09

NBA All Star, three time All NBA

2:12

First Team, two time All NBA Second

2:14

Team, and his number eleven

2:17

is retired by my hometown,

2:20

my home state, I should say, Detroit

2:22

Pistons, Isaiah Thomas,

2:25

d Isaiah Thomas zeke to go.

2:27

Welcome to the Draymond Green Show, my friend.

2:30

Thank you, and it is an honor to be here. Awarded

2:34

shirt just to represent

2:36

us and we represent for the state

2:39

of Michigan and appreciate

2:41

you and thank you for inviting

2:43

me on your show and proud to be

2:46

here with you are your talent,

2:49

your executives, and mom who

2:51

stepped in in the background earlier right

2:54

on New.

2:54

Media, Yes sir, new

2:57

Media baby.

2:57

By the way, for those of y'all out there listening

3:00

interview, my mom

3:02

just stepped to hoped on here for a second

3:04

before we started. Zeke

3:06

is my mom's favorite player, obviously growing

3:09

up in Saginaw, Michigan.

3:10

Her teams the Detroit Pistons.

3:12

Growing up, Zeke comes and brings

3:14

us hope, him, Joe Dumars, the bad

3:16

boys.

3:17

They come.

3:17

They bring two championships to the state and

3:20

my mom ever since I

3:22

can remember, you know, everybody grow

3:25

up talking about who their favorite player is. Ever

3:27

since I could remember, my mom

3:29

talked about Isaiah Thomas.

3:30

So this this is huge, This is this is

3:32

big for me.

3:33

But before just getting into it, man,

3:36

how long have you been working

3:38

in the NBA. Because you've obviously

3:41

been a player, you have obviously

3:44

done TV as you're doing now, you've been

3:46

front office, you've been a coach. How

3:48

long has it been that you've been working

3:51

in the NBA

3:53

ron.

3:53

That's a great question, you

3:56

know, I I was

3:58

nineteen

4:00

when I came in, and actually

4:02

I played my first games I was twenty, so

4:08

like maybe forty three years. You know,

4:11

I'm basket you know, rather playing front

4:14

office, own and managing

4:16

TV. I've been a part

4:18

of the NBA. I'm on my third commissioner

4:20

now. I started with Larry

4:23

O'Brien and you're familiar with the Larry

4:25

O'Brien trophy, and I went

4:27

to David Stern now Adam Silver.

4:29

So I've seen a lot and being

4:33

a former president of the Union, so I've

4:36

I've been around a long time. And not only

4:38

have I been around a long time, but I've seen

4:40

the growth and the changes that

4:43

have occurred. And I

4:46

would encourage you and all of

4:48

the young fellas are who are coming out.

4:51

You know, basketball, this career,

4:55

it can last a long time. It doesn't

4:57

end when you stop playing. Now,

5:00

your second career starts and you're

5:02

on you know you're doing that now.

5:04

You know you're you're being basketball

5:07

forty fifty years and that's the goal,

5:09

you know, that's the goal for all of us. You

5:11

know, not to play

5:13

and then lead, but play, stay

5:16

and extend and give the knowledge on to

5:18

the next.

5:19

Generation being

5:21

that you've seen.

5:23

And number one, I thank you for that advice.

5:25

Uh.

5:25

You know, like you said, obviously, I want to set

5:27

up my path so that I can be a part of this

5:29

league for a long time. You

5:31

know, the NBA has done such an incredible

5:34

job. I think of creating these

5:36

different avenues that we as players

5:38

who obviously do our part

5:41

in growing this game. And I think

5:43

it's a beautiful thing when you have these

5:45

different avenues that we can continue

5:47

in when we're done playing. Because

5:50

the reality is, you know, for a

5:52

lot of us, all you know initially is the NBA.

5:54

You know, you come out of college, you come into the NBA,

5:57

and that's all you know. And when

5:59

you get out of that, so many guys

6:02

struggle because you don't know anything

6:04

else. You don't know And I say

6:06

air quotes, you don't know the real world,

6:08

you know. I always say, like we

6:11

do like real work and we have real

6:13

responsibilities. But the NBA

6:16

always says a fantasy land, like you

6:18

get to play basketball every day, you

6:20

get to hang around great people. It's

6:23

not always that way. I've been fortunate enough

6:25

to be on one NBA team, but the

6:28

you know, the travel, the hotels, all

6:30

of these different things, they are greater. And so I always

6:32

say like it's a fantasy land for us. So, you

6:35

know, just to your point of staying in this, I

6:37

think that's an incredible thing.

6:38

Yeah.

6:39

Absolutely. And and I got some I

6:41

got some good advice at a very

6:43

young age. And it actually came from Kareem

6:46

Abdul Jabbar. It

6:48

was, you know, our first

6:50

All Star game and

6:53

he was sitting there reading a book and

6:56

nobody you know, was coming

6:58

up speaking to him or anything. And

7:01

you know me, I'm I mean, you know me,

7:03

right, I'm like, hey,

7:06

So I wound up to it and I just you

7:08

know, trying to gain some knowledge,

7:10

you know. I said, if you can give me any advice

7:13

you know, coming into this, you know NBA,

7:16

you know career that I'm getting ready to start, what

7:18

advice would you give me? And I still hold

7:20

on to it today. He said, as

7:22

best you can, try to stay

7:25

normal, wash your

7:27

own clothes, iron your clothes,

7:29

still, do the dishes, still take out trash,

7:32

you know, do do the things that

7:35

normal regular people in society

7:37

do. Because as you just explained, Draymond.

7:40

It's a fantasy world. It's a fantasy land

7:43

in NBA. And when you come

7:45

out, right, you ain't gonna be on the

7:47

private plane all the time. You may

7:49

have to go to the airport. You know, you may

7:51

have to stand in line, You're gonna have to get your bags

7:53

out of baggage claim and everything everything

7:55

that regular people do, right, that's

7:58

what you should keep trying to do. And

8:01

and the second thing I would say along

8:03

that journey what I figured out, you know,

8:05

And I think the reason why you

8:08

know, your mom would say I'm a favorite player,

8:11

not because of what I did on the basketball court,

8:13

but what I did off the court, just

8:16

by showing up in the neighborhood, just by

8:18

talking to people, just by being regular,

8:21

right, you know, being an AWFU person, Uh

8:24

that that carries a lot of weight. And the

8:27

thing that you can do, you know, I

8:29

would say, for yourself

8:31

and for others who are listening, former

8:33

players, current players, hey man,

8:36

just just to try to

8:38

stay amongst the people, not

8:40

above the people. Always

8:43

be one who are amongst the people and

8:45

never above.

8:47

Man. That's wonderful.

8:49

Coming from the West Side of Chicago and

8:52

then getting drafted to the Detroit

8:55

Pistons. Uh do you do

8:57

you think that kind of helped your transition in

8:59

the sense of Detroit being a similar

9:01

type of city at Chicago and

9:04

you know, the people being similar, you

9:07

know, just kind of having that that that's

9:09

that feel of being at

9:12

home when you got.

9:13

To the city of Detroit.

9:16

You know, I'm you know, I'm like

9:18

you in a lot of ways. We were raised very

9:20

similar. You know, we didn't we didn't travel

9:22

outside of our state. We didn't have no money

9:24

to do it. So, uh,

9:27

you know, when I first got to Detroit, I knew

9:29

nobody, and but

9:31

my mom, just like your mom, had made

9:33

some phone calls and it

9:36

was like, hey, they keep my son when she

9:38

when he when he gets there. And

9:41

one of the people that she called

9:43

that I had no idea that she

9:45

even had this type of cloud. Right,

9:48

she called Mayor Coleman Young

9:50

and said, when my son gets there,

9:52

I want you to look out for him. So

9:54

when I get to Detroit, I get

9:56

a welcome back from from the mayor,

9:59

you know, from Coleman, and then you know, he

10:02

he introduced you know, a Rita and everyone.

10:04

So I always felt and I still feel

10:06

like this today that I

10:09

feel like in Michigan, I'm

10:11

everybody's cousin, brother,

10:14

brother. I feel like I'm a family

10:17

member of everybody, like, and everybody

10:19

treats me that way. I go back

10:21

home to Michigan and you know, it's

10:23

like, hey, I try

10:26

to check out at the hotel. They say,

10:28

you don't have to pay. I try

10:30

to. I try to buy some food in the restaurant.

10:33

Manager come out say no, that's a me. So

10:35

it's being from the West Side

10:37

of Chicago, but then coming to

10:39

Detroit and feeling in love and being

10:41

embraced by everybody in Detroit, and

10:44

still today it is. It

10:46

is no place on earth

10:49

that I get treated better than

10:51

than when I'm in Detroit.

10:54

Man, that's so incredible. That's so incredible.

10:58

You a lot like myself. I've

11:02

had the so far had

11:04

the pleasure and honor of being with

11:07

one team like yourself. And

11:11

obviously I'm still playing, but

11:13

you know, our ownership group has been

11:16

absolutely amazing. Like I couldn't have

11:18

asked to play for a team with a better ownership

11:21

group. And since you've been a

11:23

Detroit Piston, that's changed.

11:27

How have you how?

11:28

How how is the reception and

11:30

like you're treated how you're treated by

11:32

franchises.

11:34

Is that the same? Is it different from.

11:36

You know, the owner being who was the owner

11:38

when you were playing there, Bill Davison

11:41

and now the owner being timed girls Like, it's

11:43

that same olive branch still extended

11:46

to you the way it was when

11:48

the previous owner was there.

11:51

So the olive branch is extended

11:54

as a as a guest. You're always

11:57

welcome as a guest. But

12:00

I'm not. I'm not inside

12:03

the organization, right and

12:05

and it's okay because they have work,

12:07

they have managers, and they have to do their thing.

12:11

But from from a knowledge standpoint,

12:14

what I what I think

12:16

a lot of organizations miss, which

12:20

now that I'm in corporate America, they never

12:22

miss. They never let

12:25

knowledge and brains walk out of the

12:27

door, right they they

12:30

have advised us, consultants,

12:32

board members, everything else. That

12:35

historical institutional knowledge

12:38

never gets to walk out of the door. What

12:40

happens in the NBA for

12:43

former players, that knowledge base, it

12:46

gets to walk out of the door and

12:48

it goes someplace else. And

12:51

uh, that's the That's the

12:53

one thing that I think like owners

12:55

do miss in this space. They

12:58

don't recognize that the instruitutional

13:00

knowledge that has been built

13:02

up over years, and they let

13:04

it walk out of the door. Now case

13:07

in point, Joe

13:09

Dumars leaves

13:11

the floor. I left the floor, and

13:14

I was the first owner,

13:17

part owner of a team to Toronto

13:19

Raptors that started in Toronto, first

13:22

international team. So I left

13:24

the floor transition right into

13:26

management, right into ownership of

13:28

an expansion. Joe

13:31

Dumars leaves the floor with

13:33

that same Detroit Pistons institutional

13:35

knowledge and he goes into the front

13:38

office and they

13:40

win a championship, you know,

13:43

with with Ben Wallace, Chauncey

13:45

Ripped, you know, Rashid that group,

13:48

and so they kept mister d kept

13:50

that institutional knowledge inside. New

13:53

owners they come in and everybody

13:55

wants to make a splash and they wants to, you

13:57

know, input, imprint their own

14:00

name on the team. So they always bring

14:02

in new people. Well, when you bring in new people,

14:05

it takes you know, you lose

14:07

twenty thirty years of institutional

14:10

knowledge that walks out of the door.

14:12

Most corporations don't

14:14

do that.

14:17

That's interesting.

14:18

I didn't even think about it from that perspective, but I

14:21

think that's a great perspective because

14:25

you're right when I look at

14:28

some company, it's like, Okay, this guy is

14:30

the CEO. Now he's the chairman.

14:32

You know, so you know Phil Knight, for instance,

14:34

we'll go Phil Night, right, like Fiel Phil Knight,

14:37

founder of Nike, was the CEO

14:39

for so many years. Then he became the

14:41

chairman of Nike. And

14:43

so you're still sitting in the board meetings.

14:46

Maybe you're not making the final call. Although

14:49

if you're still sitting there, you have some

14:51

say in the final call, and you're

14:53

not trying to replace all those things. And I

14:55

think that's a brilliant thing that more

14:57

NBA teams need to need to star are

15:00

taking into account, especially with

15:02

this younger generation of guys that's coming

15:04

in, because they come in, you know

15:06

a lot of these young guys, they come in not being

15:08

fans of the NBA. You know, like when we came

15:11

up and I sound

15:13

like I'm way older than I

15:15

am, but you know, when we were coming like,

15:17

we were huge fans of the NBA,

15:20

you know, like a huge fans of this

15:22

player. You knew who that player was. You

15:24

know, we have some of these young guys

15:26

now don't.

15:28

Know who World be Free is. We say, World

15:30

be Free they're like, who.

15:32

We had a young guy a few weeks ago and

15:34

Chris Paul was talking about world be Free and

15:36

he like world what is that?

15:39

And CP started telling him about world

15:41

be Free?

15:42

And he comes back like, yo, he averaged this amount

15:45

of points, like this is crazy. But they don't

15:47

know that these days. And I think that that's obviously

15:49

just a small part of it.

15:51

Right, that's

15:53

a small part of it, but that's a huge

15:56

part of it. And now I'll

15:58

take you back to the Union, right because

16:02

as a as a former

16:04

president of a union and now a past

16:06

president, but we always

16:08

try to ensure is that you

16:11

know the next man up at

16:13

institutional knowledge and

16:16

then your generation changed that a little

16:18

bit. Right. But when you look

16:20

over across the across the aisle at

16:22

the NBA, I mentioned Larry

16:25

O'Brien, underneath

16:28

him was David Stern who took over, and

16:31

then underneath David Stern who

16:37

took over. So they never

16:39

let that knowledge walk out of the door, whereas

16:41

in the Union we always

16:44

let this guy come out. We'll get

16:46

a search committee to find that has

16:49

the NBA ever had has the has

16:51

the owners ever had a search committy?

17:00

Sorry, but it's like we

17:03

we we constantly let it walk

17:05

out of the door. And you

17:07

know, there's an old African proverb that

17:09

says, each one teach one and

17:13

we don't teach. We don't, we

17:16

don't pass on the knowledge to

17:18

each other. As a matter of fact, we get

17:20

separated. And the

17:23

the okay, I'm gonna call you new

17:26

media, but old media, right

17:29

was was was a lot about pitting

17:31

us against each other, making

17:34

us, making us not like each

17:36

other, making us not communicate

17:38

because then it was best for the

17:41

audience that they were serving. But

17:44

new media coming along, insiders

17:46

who have like yourself,

17:48

you know, who like you know, Matt

17:51

Barns and and that crew, I mean

17:54

y'all making everybody now communicate

17:56

and talk. And because we're communicating

17:59

and talking and guess what we're doing, we're

18:01

teaching and with spreading knowledge.

18:04

And that young fellow who just found out about

18:06

world be free. Right, that's

18:09

not nobody else's fault except

18:12

ours, because we're not talking to

18:14

each other. They make us, you

18:16

know, don't like each other for some other

18:18

reason.

18:19

But I agree facts,

18:22

I agree one hundred percent. I remember when I first

18:24

came into the league, maybe like my

18:27

second year in the league, I want to say, could

18:30

have possibly been now, I'd say my second

18:33

year, at least the summer going into my second

18:35

year, we were going

18:37

through the search committee. We were

18:39

about to replace at the time

18:41

Billy Hunter as the NFL,

18:44

NBA PA executive

18:48

what is it, executive president, executive

18:52

executive directed. And

18:55

I remember you were in the room and

18:57

you were in a sense trying to go

18:59

for the job. And if I

19:01

if my brain, if I can jog

19:03

my brain correctly, it wasn't

19:06

taken very seriously at all. It

19:09

was almost like guys were fighting against it,

19:11

if I remember correctly, Uh,

19:15

did.

19:15

You kind of get that sense when you were trying to

19:17

do that? And what's that?

19:20

The reasoning behind it is what you're speaking

19:22

to now is about that knowledge and being

19:24

able to pass that knowledge down, being

19:26

through three commissioners and kind of understanding

19:29

the layer of the land.

19:31

Yeah, you've kind of righted the ship now

19:33

because you got Andree running your

19:35

reunion. So now

19:37

now you got a chance to course

19:39

correct. So that day you're talking about,

19:42

if you remember myself,

19:46

Spencer Haywood and

19:50

I'm not sure if Oscar Oscar Robertson

19:52

came that day, but we were we were all

19:54

trying to meet with y'all just

19:57

to say, hey, here's a

19:59

history lesson that you need

20:01

to be aware of before you, before

20:04

you, you know, go down this track.

20:07

Let us tell you where where, where

20:09

we've been so you can make the

20:11

correct decision, or at least involve

20:13

us in decision making. And

20:15

I'll never forget David West in that meeting,

20:19

Love love what he do?

20:21

You remember him.

20:22

Groop economic roof economics,

20:24

economy group economics.

20:26

Absolutely, yes, so

20:29

much so.

20:30

About fifteen minutes into it, he kept

20:33

saying that they were ignoring him.

20:34

D West got up and walked out.

20:36

Yes, and and

20:40

and what what happened

20:42

that day?

20:43

Did I?

20:43

Did I get upset? No? I didn't get upset

20:47

because I understand the game

20:50

that they play with y'all, and my

20:52

goal and my job has always

20:54

been, is to inform and

20:56

give you the knowledge right. And

20:59

people on the outside they get

21:01

mad at me, and they spread

21:03

a lot of rumors or stories about me, and they

21:05

don't want y'all talking to me because

21:07

they're like, well, he gonna he gonna tell you this,

21:10

he gonna tell you that. Don't believe

21:12

this, don't believe that. And before you know it,

21:14

you've got disconnected from the information.

21:17

And because you get disconnected from the information,

21:21

they can take advantage of some of you, not

21:24

all of you. But as you know, we got some

21:26

players who are still getting taken advantage of.

21:29

And my goal as a as

21:31

a former president was always

21:33

spread the knowledge and to give information.

21:37

And you're you should ask the guy

21:39

who represents you how

21:41

he got into the business.

21:45

I know y'all got that connection.

21:46

And Andres from Springfield for

21:49

Chicago, I definitely, I definitely know

21:51

a relationship.

21:53

Oh Rich Paul.

21:56

Ask him one day to tell

21:58

you the story of how he into the business.

22:02

Okay, all right, I'm

22:04

gonna have to come back to y'all, Draymond

22:06

Green show listeners with this one.

22:08

I have to come back to y'all with this one.

22:12

But speaking of the richest

22:14

mentors to get him.

22:16

Started, I

22:18

respect that well. I tell

22:20

you this.

22:21

I appreciate you because he's been

22:23

incredible for me, the

22:25

knowledge that he's been sharing with me the

22:28

business.

22:30

He's helped me sign some great contracts.

22:33

And when I say great contracts, I

22:35

don't mean just the money, because

22:38

it's not all about the money.

22:39

The devil is in the details, and

22:42

the.

22:43

Details in my contracts

22:45

I am so pleased with because it

22:48

ends up being worth more than

22:51

just the money the dollar amount

22:53

that you see when you start adding in kickers

22:55

and payment schedule and all of these

22:57

different things. It ended up

23:00

being worth more than just that dollar. You

23:02

see that flash across the ticker.

23:04

So I'm gonna say this for you right here.

23:06

I appreciate you because that

23:08

man has helped me a tone. But

23:11

speaking in terms of pitting players

23:14

together. In twenty twenty, and I

23:16

know you've heard this lot, in twenty twenty,

23:19

were all sitting at home watching

23:21

the Last Dance with nothing else to do, and

23:24

I was just wondering, Number one, did you

23:27

watch that? And if you did watch it,

23:29

what was your experience like watching

23:31

that, being that you were such a huge part

23:34

of the Last Dance and or just

23:36

the bulls becoming who they became as

23:38

a whole. Did you watch

23:40

that and if you did, what was your experience

23:43

like in watching it?

23:44

Yeah?

23:44

I watched it, and I watched it with you

23:47

know, my It was doing COVID, So

23:50

so you know, the family, we gather

23:52

around and you know this is this

23:54

is going to be great because for

23:57

me and you understand

23:59

this, I say this being a champion,

24:01

right, the

24:04

first time I really got a chance to peep

24:06

behind the opponent's

24:08

kurtain, right, And

24:12

no one else could understand that, right, but

24:14

you would understand. It's

24:16

like, okay, now we get ready to see,

24:18

like what's behind the curtain. And

24:23

and and I and I must say that.

24:26

I was.

24:28

I was disappointed at what I saw. And

24:31

here's why I was disappointed. You

24:36

you have you had Bob Myers

24:38

there as your as your president

24:41

GM. The Chicago

24:43

Boys had Jerry Krouse as

24:45

their president. The

24:48

way they treated Jerry Krouse, in

24:51

the disrespect that they showed

24:53

for him,

24:56

I was blown away,

24:58

totally blown away. Now

25:01

can you imagine Bob Myers getting on y'all

25:04

championship bus and

25:06

y'all dogging him and

25:09

calling him out his name and everything else.

25:12

You can't even fathom that. So

25:16

we were thinking, you know, in

25:18

our era, these were the

25:21

dudes. Jerry

25:23

west read All

25:25

Back, Jack McClosky,

25:28

Wayne Embry, Jerry

25:30

Crops, those were the

25:32

dudes. And to

25:35

watch how they treated him

25:38

and the disrespect and lack of respect

25:40

that they gave him as a person and

25:42

as a man, it

25:45

was cringe worthy watching

25:47

that. I cringed for him and his family.

25:50

And then the man you know, he was dead,

25:52

right, so they it's

25:55

going off on him in the dock now.

25:57

In terms of Jordan and I,

26:00

as I said, my little nephew lived

26:02

with Jordan, lived with him for like,

26:04

you know, five years, and

26:08

and then was a ball boy for the Chicago

26:10

Bulls, and so

26:13

my my whole family was

26:15

like, you know, we were all interacting and everything

26:17

else. The All Star

26:19

Game, Michael

26:21

Jordan's last All Star game. I coached his last

26:24

All Star game. Vince

26:26

Carter. Yeah, Vince

26:29

Carter had won the starting spot.

26:32

It's Michael Jordan's last All Star game. I

26:35

took Vince Carter aside and

26:38

I convinced him to give his spot

26:40

to Michael Jordan. He

26:43

said why, I said, because I

26:45

gave mine to doctor j when

26:48

Doctor j was voted on that.

26:50

That's how it goes, right, Vince

26:52

Carter gave up his spot Michael

26:55

Jordan. You know, we

26:58

interacted everything else. I

27:00

never knew this dude felt

27:02

the way he felt until the

27:04

last Dand wow,

27:06

really, I'm like, all

27:09

these years you've been standing behind

27:11

a tree, throwing stones and

27:13

letting somebody else take the fall for it.

27:17

I never knew he had dislike an

27:20

anger for me. Had

27:23

I known, Okay, you know, I'm

27:26

grown man. I ain't got no problem. You

27:28

know, we come from the same place.

27:30

You know, at one point in time in my life. I used to fight

27:33

really really good, and I

27:36

know I can't do that. I used to

27:39

not but

27:44

but we wouldn't throw hands or anything. But I'm

27:46

just saying, had I known you felt that way,

27:50

I definitely would have treated you differently.

27:52

But I was very gracious to him,

27:56

not only in Chicago but everywhere

27:58

we went. I never I never

28:00

thought there was any type of you

28:02

know, he ahmad

28:04

and I when I stopped playing, we

28:07

went out to dinner several times. So I never

28:09

knew, like until the last dance,

28:12

like this dude really felt this way about

28:15

me. Now some people will say, oh, Isaiah,

28:17

you should have known. How could you not

28:19

know? I only know how

28:21

people are with me when they treat

28:23

me, Like when you and I to

28:26

talk, it's like it's love. Right

28:28

now you walk away and you like dogging me. I

28:31

don't know that. I only

28:33

know how we interact and

28:35

when you and when and I interacted

28:37

was always good. So now some people

28:40

will say, well, why didn't you shake his hand? Let

28:43

me give you all a history lesson. Okay,

28:48

the champions

28:50

and I went to every NBA finals, Boston

28:53

Celtics, the LA Lakers,

28:55

Philadelphia when they were

28:57

all competing. At

28:59

the end of the game, they

29:02

always left the court and

29:05

they would let the other team

29:07

celebrate, and then

29:09

they would come into your locker room after

29:12

the game and shake your

29:14

hand and say congratulations.

29:17

Larry Bird and Magic Johnson. Y'all

29:19

find me the tape in

29:21

the video that showed

29:24

them shake the hands at

29:26

the end of their championship

29:29

wins or losses. Showed

29:31

me the tape, showed me the video where

29:33

they all like chicking. Heck, where Larry Bird

29:35

and Magic Johnson taking air. I want

29:37

to see that now. In

29:40

the locker room, you

29:42

walk out, then

29:44

you come back and you shake hands and

29:46

you congratulate their back in the locker room. So

29:48

when the Boston Celtics walked off

29:51

the floor on us, we

29:53

understood the program.

29:57

You would see afterwards.

30:00

See Jones, Jimmy Rogers, a

30:02

couple of the players. They came into all locker

30:04

room and they congratulated us.

30:07

Okay, that's how it

30:09

goes. Chicago, they're

30:13

the only champion that

30:16

still cries about somebody not shaking the hand.

30:22

Interesting, So

30:24

I asked you that question. I

30:27

appreciate those facts. I got a couple questions

30:29

for you. Number one,

30:32

do you regret like the way

30:35

that that all played out with

30:37

it almost being like, I mean,

30:39

you were essentially, for

30:41

lack of a better term, demonis for that.

30:44

It was like, oh that was Isaiah, Isaiah

30:46

ducked. It was all

30:48

Isaiah didn't want to.

30:49

Shake their hands because he got a thing against

30:52

MJ. Do you regret

30:55

that now in seeing how it all played

30:57

out?

30:59

Of course, the way it all played out, right,

31:03

have we known that this would

31:05

be the impact? Of course

31:08

we all stopped the shit, do

31:10

shake your hands? But but nobody was

31:12

thinking like that back then. It

31:14

wasn't like that. It really wasn't

31:16

a theme til

31:19

they made it a thing. Yeah,

31:21

and we're sitting here, what

31:23

is it almost thirty years later and

31:27

they still making it a thing?

31:31

Sure, almost forty years later now,

31:36

No, listen, I get it. But

31:38

I have also a question when

31:41

when you didn't make the Dream Team, as I all

31:43

think, I think we all would agree you

31:45

should have been on a Dream Team, did

31:47

you not think in us like

31:50

that that possibly came from MJ,

31:53

like that MJ would have that type of power,

31:56

so that you don't make that team.

31:57

Did you feel like that then or at

31:59

any.

32:02

When I didn't make the team, my

32:04

first reaction was why

32:07

did not make it right? And

32:10

and and that was the first time I

32:12

had never made the team. You know, you yes,

32:17

when you tried for a team, and remember they used to

32:19

write your name up on the wall.

32:21

You made it right. My

32:24

name was always on the wall. I

32:27

was always always made the team,

32:29

right. And so that was the first time

32:32

I didn't make a team. And

32:34

so of course I was like, I was

32:36

hurt. But at the same.

32:38

Time, it never

32:41

done on me that I

32:43

didn't make the team because

32:47

Michael Jordan didn't like me. That

32:49

that that thought never crossed my mind.

32:52

I went to the selection committee and

32:55

John Stockton is a is a is a personal

32:57

friend of mine and it has been a personal friend of mine

32:59

for a long time. Jeff Hornisack,

33:02

you know, his dad coached me in high school,

33:04

right, So so when you look

33:06

at my relationships, you know with

33:09

with Hornorsack Stocked and you

33:11

know we we've known each other for

33:13

years. So when I never thought

33:16

like, okay, I wasn't

33:18

gonna make the team. But when I

33:20

looked at the com you know who they

33:22

picked. You know, it's like, okay, well they

33:25

picked this guy, they picked John, they picked

33:27

this now. And then then

33:30

I started thinking, okay, well, and

33:32

you know you always want to make the team. Okay, I'm

33:34

like, okay, but Larry hurt, Magic

33:37

ain't even in the league no more, right,

33:40

you know, stocked

33:42

and injured. Okay, I got a chance.

33:45

It never crossed my mind that

33:48

I wasn't gonna I wasn't on a team because

33:50

Michael Jordan didn't want me on a team. And

33:53

by the way, at that time, you're

33:56

not thinking like somebody would have

33:58

that much power because

34:01

that was that first championship. Now

34:05

I had I had won two,

34:07

should have won three. Magic

34:10

and Bird I think had five. Magic

34:12

had five, Bird had three. I

34:15

had two. We had won

34:17

the most championships in that era. So

34:21

I didn't I was I wasn't

34:23

thinking like, it

34:26

just wasn't crossing my mind. Some people will say,

34:28

oh, Isaiah, you should have known it,

34:31

But that ain't how I operate. That

34:33

ain't how I think. I wasn't like going

34:35

to you know, oh, this

34:37

guy didn't want me on the team.

34:39

That's why I'm not on the team. And

34:41

then it started coming out weeks later, well,

34:44

Jordan don't like Isaiah, he didn't want him

34:46

on the team. And then Michael Jordan

34:48

did an interview or he did a made a

34:50

quote and he said, Hey, I had nothing to do

34:53

with Isaiah not being on the team, So

34:57

why wouldn't I take him at his word? That's what he

34:59

said. Last dance said,

35:03

Oh, this dude been lying for a long

35:05

time.

35:10

You know.

35:11

That's when

35:13

now now you see me like wait

35:15

a minute, okay, because now I'm like, okay, I'm

35:17

pushing back now. But it really wasn't

35:19

nothing to push back on at that time

35:22

because I didn't make the team. Robmin

35:24

didn't make the team, Robin was three

35:26

times Defensive Player of the Year. Joe

35:29

Dumars didn't make the team. Joe

35:31

Dumars was you know, eighty

35:34

nine NBA Finals

35:36

MVP. I was ninety Finals

35:40

MVP. We're the only backcourt

35:43

that's ever been back to back NBA

35:46

Finals MVP's. So

35:49

Joe wasn't on the team, Robin wasn't

35:52

on a team. I wasn't on the team.

35:54

So now we're like, oh, well, the League

35:56

hate us. We never said

35:58

Jordan hate us.

36:01

He's like the League hate

36:03

us David Stern because we was fighting with David Stern

36:05

in the in the NBA. Ever

36:07

since I got into the NBA, that's been

36:10

all fighting, right right,

36:12

So but I never I never

36:14

went to George, But

36:17

now I am.

36:20

I respect that is where is your

36:22

relationship at today?

36:23

And is that salvageable?

36:26

Dude?

36:26

No, not salvageable? Now

36:29

we.

36:31

The only way this is salvageable.

36:35

This dude got on national television,

36:39

international television and

36:41

called me an asshole somebody

36:43

who has been really good to him.

36:47

And until he apologizes

36:50

on international television,

36:53

we you know, conversation. You can't.

36:55

You can't apologize and have a private

36:58

dinner when you and me

37:00

publicly. If you

37:02

didn't mean it, say

37:06

it publicly. Now if you meant

37:08

it, let us stand. I'm

37:10

good with that.

37:12

M h. I respect that. And

37:17

switching gears.

37:18

Uh, you know, we always talk about the drastic

37:21

styles of play and

37:24

or drastic changes, I should say, to

37:26

the style of play from when you guys played

37:29

even to the early years

37:31

of say Lebron and Kobe

37:34

you know, and those guys the early two thousand

37:36

Shack Duncan and

37:39

to you know, twenty tens and to

37:42

where the game is today. Uh,

37:44

it's totally different. It's officiated differently,

37:47

rules, some rules are different. But

37:49

I think we all know and see

37:53

the changes to the offense. And there's

37:55

been some recent reports coming

37:57

out that the NBA is looking about looking

37:59

at shifting back to

38:02

some of the rules that you guys played with, possibly

38:04

being able to hand check again. Uh,

38:06

being able to play a lot more physical on

38:09

the defensive end as you have been

38:11

able to in recent years. It's kind of tilted

38:13

a bit, so it seems to

38:15

favorite offense. What

38:17

are your thoughts on that? Do you think that's good

38:19

for the game? Do you think that's

38:22

needed? Or like do the offense

38:24

get way too too much freedom

38:26

of movement and all of those things nowadays?

38:28

Well, what are your what is your sense on that?

38:30

I think that well,

38:34

yes, it definitely has changed and it

38:36

has shifted, and

38:39

I would say skill wise, skill

38:44

you have more skilled players

38:48

on the roster and on the team

38:50

than we had back then. Now what do I

38:52

mean by skill? Mhm,

38:55

everybody can shoot everybody.

39:00

I mean you can't leave nobody. I

39:03

mean everybody can shoot. And then the

39:07

three point line in the distance in

39:09

terms of where guys are shooting from, is

39:12

is mind blowing. It's it's remarkable.

39:16

Now in terms of the

39:19

defense swinging back to

39:22

where it was. I think we think we have to

39:24

be careful because we can,

39:26

we can all have these

39:29

thoughts of how it should be, but

39:31

it's really gonna come down to the officials.

39:35

Now. Back then,

39:37

all officials knew like okay

39:40

and check in, you know, being

39:43

physical with you know there. They

39:46

could have called a foul on every single

39:48

play, but they were selective

39:50

in terms of what plays they would call on. And

39:52

we knew as players, you

39:55

know, kind of how the game was gonna go.

39:57

They would set the table early in

39:59

terms, okay, these are the rules.

40:02

This is how this game's gonna be played. Now

40:04

Tomorrow night games may be different, right,

40:08

like we knew like like Magic

40:10

Johnson has a and

40:12

by the way, I watched all the Olympics and

40:14

I rooted it for the US. But I

40:17

but there was there's a scene in

40:19

there with Magic and Larry. I taken

40:21

a picture with Michael Jordan and Magic

40:23

goes or you can't get too close. You know, they gonna

40:25

call the five right that

40:28

lot so yeah,

40:31

so you just know, like, I

40:34

don't know if these officials today

40:38

can really control the game

40:41

the way those officials back then were

40:44

able to do. So when you're talking about changing

40:46

the rules and everything else, you

40:49

know, you have to take into account the

40:52

temperament and the personality of

40:54

the officials who are going to be

40:57

officiating the game and

40:59

that mhm. I okay,

41:03

So I'm watching I'm watching

41:05

some players like, okay,

41:08

you you take a you take a look at Okay,

41:11

let's use Kevin Durant and Steph Curry

41:14

right now. Ever

41:17

since they've been talking about

41:19

you know you you we're gonna

41:21

we're gonna let you hold

41:23

in hand check a little bit. I'm watching

41:26

Steph. I'm watching Kevin,

41:29

and these guys are getting held now away

41:31

from the bar. And I'm sure you're watching too. I mean, they

41:34

you know, they they have an arrestle and they they

41:36

getting beat up. I don't know if that's

41:38

really good. But this generation,

41:41

now fall generation, we were used

41:43

to it, right, so we were used

41:46

to you know, you put in on our show, you you're

41:48

hacking us, you're hitting upside to head. But

41:50

if you just go drastically into

41:52

it, now, you know, some

41:55

some of your best players are

41:57

really gonna get hurt by it.

42:02

And speaking of Steph,

42:05

how do you look at the how do

42:07

you look at the all time great

42:10

point guard conversation? Like, obviously

42:12

you're right up there, Obviously STEP's right up

42:14

there, obviously Magic's right up

42:16

there. But how do you look at that debate

42:19

or do you even think like those

42:21

should be debates.

42:22

They they should be debates because

42:25

they're good for basketball and it's good

42:27

for you know, we always want the

42:29

general public to be interested in what we're

42:31

doing. Good of that.

42:33

Absolutely, So

42:36

when you when you

42:38

when you define the position of point

42:40

guard, you know,

42:44

this isn't an era where they say we are positionless.

42:48

But but then you want to

42:51

say, okay, well he's a point guard. He's

42:53

not a point guard. So let me let

42:56

me just tell you what the way I think about point

42:58

guards and

43:01

the Golden State Warriors. You

43:03

are the point guard. You

43:06

you you have more assists

43:08

than Steph. You,

43:11

you bring the ball up, you,

43:13

you initiate the offense, you

43:15

set the defense. You you

43:18

you run the show. Steph

43:20

comes off screens, he catches,

43:22

and he shoots, and he's one of the greatest shoots shooters

43:25

ever, and

43:27

and what he's been able to do for this generation

43:30

of play and the way he's one

43:32

with it, Key Worrid, the way he's won

43:35

with it has been different than anybody

43:37

else has ever tried to do it. I

43:40

won a different way as a point

43:42

guard. I led my team and I may

43:44

be the only one who's done this as

43:48

a point guard where I've led

43:50

my team in scoring and

43:52

assists to back

43:55

to back championships. I

43:57

don't think Magic led his team and scored

44:00

and assists in back to back

44:02

championships. He may have led them

44:04

and assists. He may have led them in scorn.

44:07

I'm the only one who's done it in both categories.

44:10

Now, what Steph? When I look

44:12

at Steph, I look at Steph when

44:16

he talks about the people that

44:18

he's emulated. He

44:20

talks about Reggie Miller, he talks

44:22

about Ray Allen, he talks

44:24

about you know, guys coming

44:26

off catching and shooting, and

44:28

he by far has taken

44:30

it to another level. But

44:33

when you talk about the point guard position,

44:36

the way I was taught and the way

44:38

I think of it, not today's

44:41

point guard, but I

44:44

would I would say that the Michigan

44:47

State point guards right, So

44:49

Eric Snow had Alan Iverson, right,

44:53

Alan Iverson is not the point guard.

44:55

Eric Snow was the point guard. They'd never

44:57

want to give Eric Snow the credit for being

45:00

point guard. But that's who ran the team

45:03

for the Golden State Warriors. You're the point

45:05

guard, and that's okay. Now,

45:08

what Steph is Steph is.

45:11

Steph has been able to do something at

45:13

his size that

45:16

no other player has ever been able

45:18

to do, so he

45:20

really does have his kind of own category,

45:24

just like I think I have my category.

45:27

But if you want to say who's the

45:29

best point guards between us,

45:31

it all depends on what era you want to put

45:34

us in. Now, I

45:37

think Magic Johnson Oscar Robertson,

45:39

because of their size, they

45:41

always have an advantage over

45:44

me and Steph in a real

45:46

basketball game, right, and

45:52

Magic could score, he could

45:54

run the show, and he to me,

45:56

he's the best to ever do it. Second

45:58

best is Oscar Robertson. And

46:01

I would say, in terms of the way

46:03

I had to do it in my era, the

46:06

little guys don't nobody

46:08

compete with me. But I would

46:10

also say with Jef Curry, the

46:12

way he has done it, nobody

46:16

could compete with him. Alan Iverson

46:18

was the closest small guy to come

46:22

to doing it the way Steph

46:25

is doing it, you know, but he

46:28

by far is in a different category.

46:32

So point guard, shooting

46:34

guard, whatever you want to call him, you

46:37

know that the assists number

46:39

for the point guard is always

46:41

what we We were like, okay,

46:44

can you do this right?

46:46

That's what really what you were judged on. We

46:48

weren't judged on how many points

46:51

we scored. We were judged on how

46:54

can you help your teammates score.

46:58

I can apprec shit that answer

47:00

because I was gonna sit here and argue with.

47:02

You by my point guard.

47:04

But then you said he's in a whole different

47:06

category and how he goes about things.

47:08

I can accept that.

47:10

But I also do think like

47:12

when we were playing for Mark

47:14

Jackson, Steph had the ball more,

47:17

he led the team and assist and all of that.

47:20

Once Steve came in, it's not quite

47:22

the offense, you know, like the offense

47:24

is. It's all, you know, swinging the basketball,

47:27

move the ball to the next guy. Ultimately,

47:29

I remember when Steve first was implementing his offense.

47:31

We're like, man, like you keep

47:34

telling us and swinging the ball, You keep telling telling

47:36

Steph to pass the ball and then pin down like

47:39

Steph's supposed to get these shots man. And

47:42

I remember Steve telling us like, you

47:44

guys are looking at me like I'm crazy because

47:47

I keep telling this guy to swing it

47:49

and Clay to swing it, and they should be pinning

47:51

in.

47:51

Too, he said.

47:52

But I'll tell y'all, the shots are going

47:55

to find the guys that they're supposed to

47:57

find.

47:57

I can promise you that. You just got to trust it.

48:00

You trusted.

48:00

I promise you the shots will find the guys that

48:02

they're supposed to find. And so I do

48:04

think, you know, like the way our offense

48:07

run and me having the ball a lot and initiating

48:10

some of the offense, I do think

48:12

you know that is also kind of a product

48:15

of our system as well.

48:17

You know, where Steph isn't going to

48:19

dominate the ball.

48:20

You know, he's not going to have the ball all

48:22

the time, making play affter play

48:24

after play, because it's just not like

48:27

if Steph did do that, Steve would lose

48:29

his mind, Like Steve would go ape

48:31

shit if Steph just sat there

48:33

and like, what's trying to

48:35

make every play like he just had a We

48:38

were lanning the next the other day and I was

48:40

trying to wave Moses through to

48:42

get Steph coming off the pen down. He pulled me to the

48:44

side. He's like, yo, just swinging to Moses,

48:46

Like like, stop trying to get the ball to Steph. Like it'll

48:49

find Steph. You got to swing that ball to Moses.

48:51

And I'm like, all right, cool, I got you. But

48:54

I think Steve will lose his mind if Steph

48:56

was trying to lead to you know, if

48:58

he was putting himself in a position to lead the

49:00

team and assists or do it that

49:02

way. I don't think it would necessarily work

49:05

for the way Steve wants us to play either, you

49:07

know.

49:08

Yeah, So now'm gonna give you a

49:11

history lesson. Okay, the

49:13

offense that you run. I

49:16

played for the guy who invented it. His

49:19

name was Bob Knight.

49:21

And absolute money.

49:24

Yes, I won championships at

49:26

Indiana University as a student

49:28

under Bob Knight. When I got into

49:31

the NBA, I

49:33

had never ran a pick and role in my

49:35

life. I

49:38

has never ran a picking role in my

49:40

life. I played passing game in

49:43

high school. I played passing game in

49:45

college. When I got to the NBA,

49:47

and they gave me a playbook and told me I

49:49

had to remember the plays. I'm

49:51

like, what play

49:54

seventy two played? Thirty two down

49:57

fifty two US seventy What the

49:59

hell is this?

50:01

So what

50:05

you're describing and

50:07

in terms of your style

50:10

of play in Steve

50:12

Kurr's basketball philosophy, that

50:15

passing game, read and react, move

50:18

the basketball, set screens, that

50:21

comes from coach Knight's philosophy

50:23

and how offensive basketball ship

50:26

be played. And by the way,

50:28

your team is very successful with it

50:31

and have been successful with it. And

50:33

that's what makes Steph Curry such an

50:35

anomaly because he

50:38

You guys don't really have a point guard. You

50:41

don't have traditional one

50:44

two, three, four five man.

50:47

You don't post up, you

50:49

know, and put it in the boat. You move,

50:51

re, react, backcut, dribble, handoff.

50:54

You force the defense to

50:56

play every single

50:59

action m hm. And if

51:03

that defense isn't on the stream,

51:05

it only takes one man to break right.

51:09

And if that defense isn't on the stream and

51:11

they don't understand how to

51:13

defend down screens, cross screens,

51:16

flare screens, dribble handoff,

51:19

you know, split cuts, if they don't

51:21

understand how and they not tight enough

51:23

to defend all that, then guess what you're

51:25

gonna get a layup. I'm

51:27

gonna go one step further, right, You

51:31

know that I've gotten to know Kevin Durant extremely

51:33

well. Now he's one of my favorite

51:36

dudes. Now, right now,

51:39

I understand why Kevin Durant left

51:42

OKAC to

51:44

come to Golden State. It had

51:46

nothing to do with you

51:48

know, I don't like this. Gotta

51:51

Kevin Durant being as

51:53

subvant, as smart as he is. You

51:56

Steph clay moving

51:59

reading reaction plan that

52:03

that's the way he wants to play.

52:05

That's the way we all want to play. Steve

52:08

Kerr brilliant enough and

52:11

he trusts y'all enough and

52:14

keyword that I'm getting ready to say, he

52:17

trusts his teaching enough

52:20

that he gives you the freedom,

52:24

the freedom to play. So

52:27

therefore, you never know

52:29

if Steph is gonna start in the corner, if he gonna

52:31

start on the wing, if he gonna

52:33

start on the box. You know, you never

52:36

know. So the perfect

52:38

randomness of play that

52:41

Bob Knight invented that

52:44

I came up in that I won

52:46

championships at Indiana. That's

52:49

the way you play, and that makes

52:51

it so difficult so

52:54

yeah, it's a beautiful

52:56

thing.

52:57

What I appreciate

52:59

that history less and I'll be honest

53:01

with you, I can go

53:03

well speaking to Kevin Durant, I'm

53:06

happy to hear you say that because

53:09

I've known this all alone.

53:10

Right, Like he wanted to come here. He loved the

53:13

style of play.

53:15

He would always say like, yo, I

53:17

just wanted to play basketball the right way.

53:19

Like I haven't played the game of basketball.

53:21

The right way and I don't know how

53:23

long, and I just want to play the right way.

53:26

When he was coming here and there was this whole you

53:28

know Uproar Trademond was recruited in this

53:30

that and he no, dude wanted

53:32

to play the game the right way. And so

53:35

in saying that, probably

53:38

didn't make the right decision in leaving, because

53:40

not many teams play like that.

53:42

It's going to be hard to find that.

53:43

Although I think with

53:45

Book, you know, Book likes to play the game the right

53:48

way, and so I think they're

53:50

finding some of that in Phoenix.

53:52

But it's never quite

53:54

going.

53:54

To be this because I think we do play

53:57

a different brand of basketball.

53:59

But before we get out of.

54:00

Here, before

54:02

you come wait, let me make let me make a both

54:05

here yes, sir, and

54:08

I hope this don't upset you, but because

54:11

I'm saying, I'm giving you

54:13

our compliment. Before

54:16

Kevin Durant arrived in Gopen

54:18

State, Golden State, y'all

54:22

were on the verge of and

54:26

being and being remembered as the

54:28

team that wins seventy three and nine

54:32

and lost to a

54:34

Cleveland Cavalier team in the

54:36

finals three to one. You

54:39

up three to one and probably

54:41

one of the biggest collapse in

54:44

NBA Finals history from

54:46

the seventy three and nine historical

54:49

team. Kevin Durant

54:51

comes that summer

54:55

and really saves y'all basketball

54:58

legacy and and

55:00

you win two championships after

55:02

that, and now you're the

55:05

Golden State Warriors dynasty

55:07

that you're going to go into the Hall of Fame own

55:09

and everything else. It is cemented

55:13

because if Durant

55:15

don't come that summer and

55:17

you guys are remembered as the seventy

55:20

three and nine team that lost

55:22

three to one in the NBA Finals,

55:25

all of your legacies are

55:28

different. So

55:30

all of you with Kevin Durant, y'all,

55:34

are you know right?

55:38

And that was that was a powerful moment in sport

55:41

that he should be rewarded

55:43

for, but also your team

55:45

should be rewarded for accepting

55:49

a juggernaut like that and being able

55:51

to incorporate it. And what y'all

55:53

did was beautiful. Man, it was beautiful.

55:56

So I hope that didn't hurt

55:58

you in any way, but I did want acknowledge

56:01

him and y'all for that beautiful moment.

56:04

Yeah. No, it didn't hurt me at all.

56:06

I've actually gone public and said before,

56:09

like, yo, K coming here opened

56:11

up a totally different thing, Like, you

56:13

know, we were destroying everybody. The

56:16

most feared action in

56:19

the NBA was a

56:21

Steph Curry Draymond Green

56:23

pick and roll twenty

56:26

fifteen, twenty sixteen. It was

56:28

the most devastating action

56:30

you can get to an NBA. During

56:32

that time, teams started figuring

56:35

out how to guard it. When teams started figuring

56:37

out how to guard that, you know what we did. Kevin

56:40

Durant came in, It's like, oh, you figured that out,

56:42

all right, Well, let's go see you figure this out.

56:44

Now, we're gonna get a ball to this dude. He gonna

56:46

go score.

56:47

And if you dare sent a double team, you're

56:50

only gonna double off me. You're never leaving

56:52

Steph, you're never leaving Clay.

56:55

So if you sent a double team,

56:57

you're only helping off me. Well, now we got to

57:00

to that too. You go double off of me. I'm

57:02

a catch and if I'm not shooting, I'm handing off

57:05

to one of these guys and they shooting your eyeball

57:07

off.

57:07

And so we came up with counter.

57:09

So all of that and I think, you

57:11

know, I am never one that's going to be like yo,

57:14

k't got championships because because

57:17

he came here, Like no, he helped

57:19

us get championships. Now, what I will say

57:21

is he never gets a championship if

57:23

he doesn't come here, because I just don't

57:26

foresee that happening anywhere else or else. We would

57:28

have saw it again, happened somewhere else. But

57:31

it was a match made in heaven. You had us

57:34

in the way we played our brand of basketball and

57:36

him wanting to play that style of basketball.

57:38

You have a face of a franchise

57:40

and Steph Curry who's so secure in himself

57:43

that he's not worried about another jugger

57:45

not coming over and what that does to him

57:47

or his legacy or how that you

57:49

know, makes him where his standing is

57:52

in a franchise, and so all of those

57:54

things coming together. I agree

57:56

with you like it was.

57:58

It was absolutely insane. What I will

58:00

say is definitely blue

58:03

three to one lead. No one likes to talk about me

58:05

can suspended Game five with them boys was about

58:07

to get a gentleman sweet No one likes to talk

58:09

about that, And it's okay. I'm cool with that.

58:11

I don't mind. It's totally

58:14

fine. But I am

58:16

not one of those people who's on the bandwagon

58:18

of like Kevin didn't do nothing.

58:20

Kevin doesn't deserve them rings, like you don't

58:23

win two finals MVPs if you don't

58:25

deserve rings.

58:25

That's just kind of a dumb thing to say, you

58:28

know.

58:29

Yeah, so I'm with you. I'm

58:32

gonna hit you with this right because

58:34

they always talk about the Lakers

58:37

and when they repeat it, but they never

58:40

mentioned they got their phantom foul.

58:43

So that that.

58:44

Gentlemen, absolutely.

58:56

Isaiah Thomas, we should have been the first one

58:58

to three pete in all air. The

59:00

other thing I do want to I do want to give

59:02

Steve Kurr some credit, you know,

59:04

because the brilliant

59:07

mind and the way he's

59:10

he molded and got all

59:12

of you to trust and believe that

59:15

this was a great way to play. You

59:17

know, so all the things that you said,

59:20

I do want to add Steve Kurve on

59:22

top of that because coaching really

59:25

does matter, and he

59:27

was the coach.

59:30

Steve was great.

59:31

One more question before we get out of here, because I could

59:33

talk to you all day.

59:34

I'm sitting here, I'm learning and

59:37

this is great.

59:38

Just one last question is this guy was

59:40

born in Saginaw, Michigan. Popsters from

59:43

Saginaw, Michigan. Obviously

59:45

he didn't grow up in Saganow, but he

59:47

got that Saganaw water somewhere in his veins,

59:50

and so he is the way he is, I would like

59:52

to think because he got that Saganaw blood.

59:55

But Kenya Martin Senior once

59:58

took Karl Malone out of a

1:00:00

game and said he did

1:00:02

that elbowed him because

1:00:05

he cost you fourteen stitches.

1:00:06

How have y'all ever talked about that moment? So

1:00:09

how did that make you feel?

1:00:11

I called him up and said thank you and

1:00:16

actually gave me you know, you

1:00:19

know, I'm going to supposedly

1:00:22

hard guy. So I took forty two stitches

1:00:24

in the head, not fourteen, right, But

1:00:28

but and this is what I want to say

1:00:30

to you, right, you you

1:00:32

never know who you touch him, and

1:00:35

you never know who that little kid is going

1:00:37

to grow up to be. I

1:00:39

had no idea that

1:00:42

I had impacted Kenyan

1:00:44

Martin, you

1:00:46

know, NBA player Final,

1:00:49

you know, in the NBA Final. I had no idea

1:00:51

that I had impacted his life

1:00:54

from Saginaw that way. I

1:00:57

had never met him, didn't didn't didn't know

1:00:59

it. And when I when I when

1:01:01

I heard the story, right, you

1:01:03

know, it's like right

1:01:06

on, of course, I'm happy for that. But

1:01:10

the fact that we in Michigan

1:01:14

to this day, I

1:01:16

don't care young or old. If

1:01:19

it's a fight or get back, I'm

1:01:22

down, right, I'm down.

1:01:24

We were coming and

1:01:27

it's like when you when you got in your little dust

1:01:30

up. I call Rich I don't know if he

1:01:32

said the first call. I was like, hey, man, tell

1:01:34

Draymond, I'm here.

1:01:36

You know, absolutely, I'm here.

1:01:39

I mean that that

1:01:41

that's the community in the

1:01:43

state, that in the bond of

1:01:45

basketball that's been formed there. And

1:01:48

you know, it made me feel good that, you

1:01:50

know, he got him back because I

1:01:52

wanted to get him back, but you know, I want big

1:01:55

enough to get him back. So I'm glad he got him

1:01:57

back.

1:01:59

Shout out the man. Kmart has

1:02:01

some gray years in this league and

1:02:03

was a dog. Shout out to him. Hey,

1:02:05

but og Zeke, I appreciate you man,

1:02:07

Thank you. You always welcome here. You want to

1:02:09

talk about something, you want to drop some more knowledge

1:02:12

the Draymond Green Show listeners

1:02:15

and obviously myself can't

1:02:17

thank you enough.

1:02:18

We would love to have you any time you want to

1:02:20

come.

1:02:21

But also I just thank you for what you've been

1:02:24

to the state of Michigan and the presence

1:02:26

that you and Joe d and your guys brought

1:02:28

to the state of Michigan as far as

1:02:31

basketball goes, like I

1:02:34

don't take that for granted, being a kid

1:02:36

that grew up watching that you know, and for all

1:02:39

that you've done for the game of basketball, being

1:02:41

a legend that you are, the gyms

1:02:43

you share.

1:02:43

As far as business like, people don't.

1:02:45

We didn't even get the chance to talk about all

1:02:48

the things that you're doing in the business world.

1:02:51

It's absolutely amazing.

1:02:52

So from myself but also

1:02:55

other players like we thank you for being

1:02:57

who you are, what you've meant to this league, and what

1:02:59

you continue.

1:03:00

Me well, we love

1:03:02

you and we're very proud of you. And

1:03:05

you know you keep doing your thing, brother, because

1:03:07

you

1:03:08

you're changing the world, and

1:03:11

you inspiring a little kid

1:03:13

somewhere that's never met you.

1:03:16

But one day we'll tell the story about how

1:03:18

Draymond Green inspired him.

1:03:20

So keep doing your.

1:03:22

Things, yes, sir, well do.

1:03:24

Thank you so much. I really appreciate

1:03:26

you.