0:26

Welcome to today's episode of Thanks for Coming

0:28

Back . I am thrilled to introduce

0:30

our extraordinary guest , Doris Jackson

0:32

Shazier , a seasoned leadership

0:34

coaching consultant . Doris has

0:37

over 20 years of experience and she's

0:39

held various leadership roles , from manager

0:41

to director , and she has a very

0:43

palpable passion for developing others

0:45

. When she transitioned out of corporate

0:48

America , she honed in on what she loved

0:50

the most coaching others in

0:52

the ways of authentic leadership . Today

0:55

, Doris will share her journey insights

0:57

on fostering collaborative environments

0:59

and the importance of psychological

1:01

safety in both professional and personal

1:03

spaces . Get

1:10

ready for an inspiring conversation with the incredible Doris Jackson

1:12

Shazier . All right . So , Doris , tell us about your career

1:14

journey and what inspired you to become a

1:16

leadership coach and consultant .

1:18

Wow . So over the last 20 years

1:21

, I've led others . I've been in

1:23

a manager role either a manager

1:25

, a district manager , a regional leader , a director

1:27

leader and when I decided

1:29

to step away from corporate America , I

1:32

really there were elements of my job

1:34

that I enjoyed , and so , as

1:36

I'm building my next career , I wanted

1:38

to incorporate the things that I enjoyed

1:40

the most . So I don't have

1:42

the bureaucracy of corporate America

1:44

necessarily holding me back , but

1:47

what I enjoyed the most about that infrastructure

1:50

was the resources and my ability

1:52

to develop other people . So

1:54

when I decided that I wanted to go out on my own

1:57

, I'm like you know what I'm going to focus in

1:59

and hone in on what has made me successful

2:01

and what I enjoy doing the most , and that's

2:04

coaching others , building their leaderships

2:06

toolkits and helping

2:08

them to find great balance or helping

2:10

them to understand how to use

2:13

their leadership skills in the business

2:15

and at home .

2:16

Love it , love it , but I feel like we got

2:19

to go back a little bit further , because I

2:21

can imagine that in your 20 years

2:23

there's that transition between

2:26

being an individual contributor but

2:28

able to influence others and

2:30

then being a leader of , over

2:33

, you know , thousands of team

2:35

members at some point , right ? Can

2:37

you talk to us a little bit about what

2:39

that transition looked like and

2:41

what changes you had to make as you

2:43

went from an IC to

2:45

a people leader ?

2:47

So here's what's interesting is

2:49

I experienced , um

2:52

, my first leadership position was at 19

2:54

, going on 20 years old , so I've

2:56

always led other people , always

3:00

let other people wasn't even . I had a esteem

3:03

kind of at the later part of my career where I was an

3:05

individual contributor and , to

3:07

be honest with you , it was a little lonely for me because

3:09

my leadership style had adapted

3:11

so much to working

3:14

with others , identifying

3:16

and leveraging other people's strengths . I'm definitely

3:18

a strength finder . I'm one that my

3:20

style or approach doesn't focus on necessarily

3:22

your weakness . I identify your

3:24

secret sauce , I see what you're great at and

3:26

then I place you and position you to

3:29

leverage in your strength . It makes for an easier

3:31

coaching situation . So most

3:33

of my experience literally is leading

3:35

people , since I have been in management

3:37

since I was 19 , 20

3:39

years old , but , yeah , even as a child

3:42

, like I'm the older sibling , so

3:44

I've been . So I'm used to having a set of people that is looking to me for direction . So I'm

3:46

used to having a set of people that is looking

3:49

to me for direction . So

3:51

, yeah , when I had my role as an

3:53

IC , I found it to be kind

3:55

of isolating , and

4:01

now , even as an entrepreneur , I'm really focused on building my community of clients

4:03

and colleagues , because I definitely operate better as a team member .

4:06

Very interesting I have

4:08

had in my experience . I've

4:10

been primarily an IC enroll

4:12

. I've had a few leadership , direct

4:14

leadership opportunities , but I've always

4:17

been responsible for leading without

4:19

direct authority , which I think is a skill

4:21

set . Everyone should have a title , but I have

4:24

to get you to see the vision to help move things

4:26

forward and

4:33

to want to do it .

4:35

You get really good at persuasion and

4:37

influence , because that's what I learned in my

4:39

IC role . I thought I was good at it . I

4:41

was pretty good at it with the direct reports , but

4:44

I underestimated how much my title

4:46

and position helped with

4:48

my leverage . And when I got in that IC

4:51

role it became very evident for

4:53

me that my title had been helping me and

4:55

I had to lean in more to my persuasiveness

4:58

and influence and I

5:00

know it made me a better relationship builder

5:03

. Experiencing that role .

5:05

Ah , relationships , the freedom

5:07

of it , all right .

5:09

Now .

5:09

I know you have a very heavy focus

5:11

on collaboration and collaborative

5:13

leadership , and when you say relationships

5:16

and influence , I think about how

5:18

those things are connected . Can you talk about

5:20

that for us a little bit ?

5:22

So for me , relationships

5:24

, creating collaborative work environments

5:27

, all of that good stuff for me it's about psychological

5:29

safety , Like how do you

5:32

create an environment where you let others

5:34

know it's okay to make a mistake with

5:36

me , it's okay to challenge my thought process

5:38

and my ideas , it's okay

5:41

to fail and get back up and it's safe

5:44

? And I think that's important to do , not only

5:46

in your personal relationships that's

5:49

the foundation of great friendships but

5:51

also in the workspace . It's the foundation

5:53

of good collaborative work and it

5:55

drives innovation . When people aren't afraid

5:57

of being judged or reprimanded

6:00

all the time and things like that , Now you have to

6:02

have order , but when

6:04

you're thinking about that psychological safety

6:06

to people that feel comfortable and not in fear

6:09

, it just drives innovation and it

6:11

drives a collaborative work environment . So I think

6:13

that's fundamentally what needs to be

6:15

there in both relationships and collaborative

6:17

work environments .

6:18

Could not agree with you more , especially when you

6:20

think about factors like resilience

6:23

and adaptability , and not just

6:25

for your team members . Right , I have

6:27

conversations with my team all the time and

6:30

I share with them that I'm going to look

6:32

for right-sizing their challenges . Right

6:34

, I borrowed that from Liz Wiseman . She

6:37

has a book called Multipliers and it's all about

6:39

what you just described amplifying

6:41

someone's secret sauce , amplifying

6:44

their gifts , versus focusing on the

6:46

things that they may not be as strong at . But that's

6:48

where looking across your team

6:50

and saying , hey

6:53

, I've got someone who's really strong here and someone who's really strong here , and if

6:55

I amplify all of those things , we

6:57

can be a well-oiled machine where

7:00

everyone sees their contributions and the impact

7:02

is nothing right .

7:03

Exactly but .

7:04

I always tell them if I don't find

7:06

ways to challenge you in

7:09

the right way , then I

7:11

miss out on opportunities too , because

7:13

you can't be the leader who's like . If it's to

7:15

be , it's up to me , and you're out

7:17

doing everything , or people

7:19

don't weigh into your point . They don't feel safe

7:22

sharing their thoughts , which can

7:24

be the difference between the success

7:26

between today and tomorrow , right ? So I

7:29

love what you just shared there . So

7:31

you're a mom of four , right ?

7:33

Yep , I'm a four and an interesting

7:36

lineup . I have an interesting lineup .

7:38

Okay , you have to tell me about this .

7:40

So what's unique about my parenting

7:42

experience is I have a

7:44

daughter that just graduated college , her

7:47

bachelor's in business , super excited about

7:49

her . Yes , my first to walk across

7:51

that collegiate stage . And that's

7:53

just her second degree , because she got her associate's degree

7:55

also . But she's 19 years old

7:58

. And then I have a son who's

8:00

going into his senior year . So

8:02

my second child is going to his senior year . And then

8:04

I have another senior in the house my

8:06

fifth grader graduations on

8:08

Tuesday . He's going into

8:10

sixth grade . And then I had a graduation

8:13

this past Tuesday my baby

8:15

from pre-K to kindergarten . So

8:18

I have a child in kindergarten , sixth grade , 12th

8:20

grade , in graduating college .

8:23

Doris , you are busy right now . You're going to be busy

8:25

for a while . It's for a long time

8:27

.

8:27

And it's just as crazy as it sounds Like I've been

8:29

trying to hide it from people . They're like that and it's just as crazy as it sounds

8:32

Like I don't even try to hide it from people Like that sounds crazy , it is . It

8:34

is what you learn in this situation

8:36

.

8:36

I learned that the hard way , but not as a mom of four

8:39

. I've got two . I've got one

8:41

who's 26 and one who's 12 . And

8:43

so that's a story in and of itself . But

8:46

my parents had six of us , and

8:49

everyone is

8:51

born in pairs right , but

8:53

they're like seven to 10 years apart

8:55

in those pairs . So I've got two

8:57

older siblings and they're about nine

8:59

to 10 years older . Then there's me

9:02

and my Irish twin , so we're 11

9:04

months apart , and then , seven

9:06

years younger than me , is my oldest

9:08

youngest .

9:09

Also they had three different sets of kids .

9:11

Yeah , I

9:14

learned what you just said . There's a bit much

9:16

and you can't please everybody . I

9:19

remember my older siblings saying that

9:21

my parents were way too lenient on us . I

9:23

remember thinking this is nothing compared

9:25

to what they're doing with the other one .

9:29

My kids did the exact same thing because

9:31

me , as parents , we learn and grow

9:33

also , and so I

9:36

am a different parent , or

9:38

I guess I'm a way more established parent

9:40

with my five-year-old than I was with my 19-year-old

9:42

, and so , yeah , they get a different side

9:44

of me , but I think I only got better

9:47

.

9:48

And , whether the oldest recognize it or

9:50

not , they are benefiting

9:52

from what you learned and how you've gotten

9:54

better too . I know my oldest . She's

9:56

always like , wow , you're just

9:58

so chill now Like

10:00

you're my oldest .

10:01

There was no chill . There was no chill then . I

10:04

had all the energy . For that . The energy

10:06

is not as high now .

10:09

That's how right . So tell us , how do you

10:11

integrate your experiences as

10:13

a leader , as a mother and

10:16

as an author into your coaching

10:18

and consulting work ?

10:19

So for , me it requires

10:22

the same core skills to

10:24

do all of those roles and I think sometimes

10:26

that's a miss for women . I think that we think

10:28

of our home life or our family or our

10:30

role as a mother as a separate

10:32

kind of thing that we do , and then we walk

10:34

into corporate America or walk into

10:36

these executive and management and director

10:39

level positions and think that it's a different part

10:41

of us . We're still using the same

10:43

core skills . So

10:45

in my coaching business and at home

10:47

, I still use influence , I use

10:49

patience , I use curiosity

10:51

you know , to seek to understand . I use empathy

10:53

, active listening , teaching

10:56

, responsibility and accountability , maintaining

10:59

morale . You know those are all the same

11:01

things . So I like to tell people that mommy

11:03

was my first leadership title , because

11:06

I learned a lot in raising my own

11:08

children and becoming a mom . That

11:10

helped cultivate my leadership style . Now

11:13

again , there's some different outcomes

11:15

in the business world . They're not my family or my

11:17

children . Am I going to coddle them in

11:19

certain ways ? But definitely

11:21

it's beneficial to them

11:23

that I can exude patience and

11:26

curiosity and empathy , and

11:28

I learned those or I honed those skills in

11:30

motherhood . Curiosity and empathy

11:32

and I learned those or I honed those skills in motherhood . So I take those skills

11:35

in every role as a coach and as a consultant .

11:37

Absolutely . Those are great characteristics for the

11:39

audience to really focus in on

11:41

. If you didn't write it down , write it down , you

11:44

know , kind of figure out hey , where

11:46

am I great at right now ? What can I maybe

11:48

do a little bit better ? If we

11:50

strive to be a little bit better every day , we'll

11:52

see immense growth in a

11:54

very short period of time before we know it right

11:57

, definitely so . I mentioned

11:59

you as an author and I know you

12:01

have a book coming up very soon

12:03

, raising Justice Lessons Learned from

12:05

Motherhood . Can you talk to us about

12:07

that and what leadership parallels

12:10

you drew from your experience

12:12

, from your very first role leadership role

12:14

as mommy , through

12:17

everything else that we can expect

12:19

to see amplified in your new book ?

12:21

Right . So some of the things I mentioned . So each

12:23

chapter has like a different

12:25

competency or thing that

12:27

I learned or a thing that I learned . So

12:30

I talk about intuition and advocacy and leadership and transparency

12:33

and the difference

12:36

between mental toughness and mental health

12:38

, like when is it crossing the line and this is

12:40

affecting you ? This is not about being mentally tough , you

12:42

know . So I learned and I explore

12:44

these different learnings and how

12:46

they came about , and they were through experiences with

12:49

my oldest child , and so

12:51

Raising Justice is twofold . My

12:53

daughter's name is Justice , so literally I raised

12:55

Justice . But also Raising Justice

12:58

is almost like a parenting style . It's

13:00

me implementing this

13:02

parenting style that I didn't necessarily

13:04

experience . And sometimes as parents , we

13:07

end up doing what we saw done to us

13:09

and it just happens

13:11

. And there's days I'm my grandma , like I

13:13

just literally I say it , and then I hear the

13:16

echo and my mind is like , oh my . God

13:18

, I just sounded like my grandmother , but it was this

13:20

conscious decision to raise her in

13:22

a way to have the things that I wish

13:24

that I had and that was a mom that

13:26

I could talk to and a certain level of closeness

13:28

and openness and supportiveness , and

13:30

so everybody can raise justice

13:32

. It's a style of parenting

13:35

that I'm sharing with the world , and then

13:37

I draw a lot of parallels into

13:39

those same qualities . I took

13:41

that into the workforce and it helped me to

13:43

be successful with building team

13:46

and reducing turnover and

13:48

I won the awards and the top performance

13:51

and the sales and the track record to back it

13:53

up , and all I was doing was applying

13:55

some of the same things that I applied

13:57

in my home to others .

14:00

Now , one parallel I heard

14:02

you draw that immediately

14:04

came to my mind is when I think

14:06

about leaders in the workplace . A lot

14:08

of times , you know the old adage

14:11

of people don't leave companies they leave their

14:13

managers Right . And I think

14:15

about a lot of leaders in their

14:17

development and their experiences

14:20

, and a lot of times they're just mimicking

14:22

what they've seen in the past Not

14:25

that it necessarily means that was successful

14:27

, but there's some level of success associated

14:30

with it . Necessarily means that was successful , but there's some

14:32

level of success associated with it , right

14:36

? Because if you were a leader in the past , then obviously that means that worked

14:39

. So this is what I should continue to do Versus what I hear you say

14:41

, which is , hey , just because I experienced

14:43

this in the past , I realized there were things

14:45

that I wanted for myself

14:47

and those are the things that I wanted to give

14:49

to my daughter , and so that is where

14:52

this path , this change , this divergence

14:54

came from . What are your thoughts

14:56

on that , especially for people

14:58

aspiring to be leaders and they're like hey

15:01

, I must have to do that thing over there because

15:03

that's what someone else has done .

15:05

I'm happy that you drew that parallel and offered

15:08

me the opportunity to just elaborate on it

15:10

. I think you're spot on , because it happens

15:12

in the infrastructures that we work in

15:14

, where we see or we experience

15:17

something , and it's hard to pour from a

15:19

cup that's not getting poured

15:21

into . And I was fortunate

15:23

enough to have some great leaders

15:25

over the years , so I did have

15:28

people over the years that poured in my cup

15:30

and then I experienced the ones that didn't really pour in

15:32

my cup at all and I had to find the

15:34

in its strength to not be the type of leader

15:36

that someone was being to me . And

15:38

it's hard and it takes courage and

15:40

it takes discipline and it really takes a

15:43

high level of focus and intentionality

15:45

to be able to do that . But yeah

15:47

, I would encourage someone focus

15:49

intentionality and stay

15:52

grounded in empathy . And

15:54

if you're experiencing it doesn't mean you have

15:56

to do it to someone else . You can still

15:58

treat people the way you wish you were treated . You

16:00

can still role model from

16:02

your position . You can still coach

16:04

up also . So there's

16:06

different ways that you can help inspire . So there's

16:09

different ways that you can help inspire even

16:11

those that are above you in title .

16:14

Absolutely . It's

16:18

the courage to challenge the norm . And I love that about some of the generations

16:20

that are entering the workplace right now , because

16:22

I imagine that that

16:25

when you and I were younger , we

16:27

probably just said okay , you know what . This

16:29

is the rule , this is what I'm being told to do . Let

16:31

me just go ahead and march to the orders , right

16:34

? I'm going to make this the best possible

16:36

outcome because I'm going to put my stamp on it

16:38

, but I'm not going to question why

16:40

am I doing this ? How does this contribute

16:42

to anything ? And , if I'm being

16:44

honest , I've had leaders who don't necessarily

16:47

offer that background , like hey and me

16:49

asking you to do this is because

16:51

this is going to lead to this , this

16:54

new generation . They are all about the . Tell

16:56

me why I'm doing this . If you tell me , even

16:58

if I still don't quite get it , I might

17:00

be more inclined to do

17:03

it , because I get it .

17:04

They require way more information

17:07

before they move , and so you have to admire

17:09

it . It's this generation in that way . But

17:11

, much like you described , I spent certain

17:13

parts of my career . I had a reputation

17:15

for being courageous . I had a reputation

17:18

for challenges , status quo

17:20

, but I also was one that really

17:22

was ambitious and wanted to

17:24

move up . So I would play the game

17:26

. So I would be very subtle

17:29

about that , or I'll push it , but

17:31

if it seemed like it was going to do something , I'll let

17:33

off the gas because I didn't want to push

17:35

it too far . So I did have a reputation

17:37

for just trying to play the game at some point . And

17:40

then , as I got older , more authentic

17:42

, more confident , and I saw my

17:44

way of doing things was working it

17:50

made it harder to play the game in that manner oh , there's okay , do we

17:52

go there ?

17:52

Let's go there . So

17:55

, as it got harder to play the game in

17:57

that manner , what adjustments did you find

18:00

yourself making ? Because I imagine it

18:02

fueled your transition from

18:04

corporate America to the space that you're

18:06

in right now .

18:07

Yeah , I had to make some tough decisions . Corporate

18:10

America to the space that you're in right now . Yeah , I had to make some

18:12

tough decisions . You

18:15

know it was hard to leave a director level position , a six figure earner , to now go and rebuild

18:17

my career , especially with as long as I'm going to be raising

18:19

children Like it's not like , oh , I got a child

18:21

graduating out of college and that's not a responsibility for

18:23

me anymore . No , I'm well aware , as

18:25

I'm moving into this space , that I

18:27

have a certain set of responsibilities for

18:30

an extended period of time , and

18:32

so it was a tough decision for

18:35

me . I had to choose myself

18:37

first . So my mental

18:39

health had started to become impacted by

18:41

the environment I was exposing myself to

18:44

, and it's almost like putting on your own oxygen mask

18:46

first . What good am I going to be to other

18:48

people if I'm not being good to myself

18:50

? Also , what I had

18:52

to recognize is who

18:54

I am and what I do are

18:57

different things , and when I say that , I

18:59

mean who I am are the roles that I can never

19:01

take off , and what I do are the roles that

19:03

people can take away from me . So , yes

19:05

, I was a senior director of field leadership development

19:08

, but that's just a part of what I do

19:10

. I'm a mom , I'm a wife

19:12

, I'm an aunt , a daughter , a

19:14

godmother , a friend . Those

19:16

are things that no one can take away from

19:18

me . I'll always be those things , and I had

19:20

to make sure that my and

19:23

I would recommend this to anyone do your actions

19:25

align with your ultimate goal and

19:27

purpose . Do your actions align with your

19:29

ultimate goal and purpose . And so I was up here and I was doing a great job and making

19:31

this company a lot of money , but it wasn't in alignment with my

19:33

overall purpose . So

19:36

I needed to get in alignment , and

19:38

so that's what it took for me . I was given an opportunity

19:40

to take on a different role and

19:42

I was like you know what ? I'll take the package , give

19:45

me the package and I'm gonna go , go and rebuild

19:47

my life and align my

19:50

better , align my actions with what I feel

19:52

like is my goals and my purpose . And

19:54

if that means that I have to start over or

19:56

move back and wanted to move forward , then

19:58

I'm willing to do that .

20:00

You know , I love that . There were a couple

20:02

of words . You had a word wrapped

20:04

up in there . But I love what you

20:06

just described , because even in corporate

20:08

America sometimes you have to take a step

20:10

back or a step to

20:12

the side right . And historically

20:15

we might have looked at that and said , well

20:18

, if I take a step back , does that somehow reflect

20:20

what I bring to the table

20:22

, who I am ? And you answered

20:24

it no , it's not a

20:26

reflection of who you are inherently

20:29

. It's a reflection of , hey , this

20:31

might be a growth opportunity . Is

20:34

this for me ? Is this aligned with who I

20:36

am inherently ? And what's the

20:38

? I mean I again

20:41

, I love how things are evolving in

20:43

the workspace because some

20:45

of the things we used to think back then are just not

20:47

in play . I know some senior executives who

20:49

are like , hey , I had to take that

20:51

step back , I had to take that lateral

20:54

. And then I had to take a few more laterals in

20:56

order to get to where I felt like I would

20:58

have the most impact and where I had the

21:00

most alignment

21:02

to my purpose . So I

21:04

love what you just shared there .

21:06

Yeah , and I would encourage people just not

21:08

to be afraid of it , and I'm not

21:11

. I would be untruthful if I said the thoughts

21:13

didn't come in my head Again . I've been in this

21:15

system for so long . I know what people

21:17

are going to think or assume about me . Or

21:19

, oh my God , she . You know , people are very surprised

21:22

that when I left my company because

21:24

I had a stellar career and I had been promoted

21:26

four or five times and all that good stuff

21:29

and on paper , I should

21:31

have been happy . I'm making good money , I'm

21:33

working from home , I have the flexibility , I had a

21:35

company , car , you know just all those different

21:37

things and I was happy . I

21:39

was happy . I just wasn't in the line with my

21:41

purpose and for me . I

21:44

got to a place that mattered more

21:46

to me .

21:47

We've talked about children , right

21:50

, and the word that comes to mind when I

21:52

think about children is growth , and

21:54

we go through several seasons

21:56

in our lives . What motivated

21:58

me when I was in my early twenties

22:01

, starting my career , was

22:03

so different by the time I hit my mid

22:05

twenties , which is so different by the time I hit , and

22:07

by that time I had a middle

22:09

schooler and all I was really . You

22:11

know , I came out of high school and had a great

22:14

internship with a very prominent company

22:16

and all I kept thinking was I'm going

22:18

to be like the people I saw

22:20

on Valley of the Dolls . Now I just aged myself

22:22

, right , that's an old show , y'all go look it up . I'm

22:30

going to be jet setting and I'm going to be doing all of this stuff and I'm going to make a

22:32

buttload of money . None of that stuff mattered to me as much as I

22:34

got older . It was really more about

22:36

my experiences . It

22:38

was more about how can I make sure that

22:40

I'm home for the things that matter

22:42

, for the things that are going to resonate for my

22:44

family , so that we're not all

22:46

sitting in therapy later on and talking

22:48

about it Exactly .

22:51

I want to raise children that don't have to heal

22:53

from their childhood . Absolutely . You

22:58

know we're all going to have something . They're going to find something to talk about . In my parenting

23:00

style and I'm okay with it Like any other parent , I'm doing the

23:02

best that I can , but with

23:05

knowledge you just do better , and so there

23:07

are things that I know that I'm intentionally

23:09

making sure that they won't be healing from that . Absolutely

23:13

. I don't know what they'll come up with , but certain

23:15

things it won't be .

23:17

It's about deposits , right Deposits

23:19

and withdrawals . As long as I can leave you

23:21

with more than what you had at

23:23

the end of the day , I might've had a few withdrawals

23:25

and if I've done

23:28

this right , you can forgive me because

23:30

you know I'm human and we can move on .

23:32

Exactly , yeah , and

23:34

in the Raising Justice book it really talks

23:37

about that . I did a book launch recently that

23:39

featured my daughter and I and you'll see

23:41

more of that online . But to hear how

23:43

my daughter spoke about me to

23:45

the audience , it just did

23:47

me such an honor and it just

23:49

it filled my cup because she says I'm

23:51

close to my mother , I trust her , I am

23:53

proud to call her my mom , she's

23:56

been there for me , she

24:03

advises me . I listened to her talk about mother-daughter challenges and she was like I think

24:05

communication is one of them and I appreciate that my mom will apologize to me

24:07

or my mom would say hey , give

24:09

me a moment and let me come back to you . You

24:11

know things like that . So it was just awesome to hear her

24:14

and know that she noticed that I

24:16

did those little things because I didn't

24:18

want to , you know , burn everything down

24:20

in the moment , but I felt those emotions

24:22

and tried to maintain composure and come

24:24

back there . So for her to acknowledge

24:26

that publicly and speak well of me

24:28

, that's what honor is a parent and I want

24:30

all my kids to feel that way about me .

24:33

I love that . I love that . Have

24:35

you heard mom remember when you used to

24:37

tell me X , y , z and it

24:39

used to annoy me ? Well , it turns

24:41

out you were right . Have you heard a lot

24:43

of that she's really good about letting me

24:45

know when .

24:48

Just what you said , mom . You know really

24:51

good about affirming when I'm told her something

24:53

. But again , because our level of the trust

24:56

with each other , she listens and

24:58

I think sometimes it's a little different . I hear my friends

25:00

talk . She listens to me because

25:03

she knows and trusts that I have her best

25:05

interest at heart . So if I tell her something

25:07

and she's not a think on it but she's like I

25:10

know you won't lead me in the wrong spot , so she's more

25:12

apt to kind of go with it . But

25:14

there's times that she's challenged me and she set

25:17

certain boundaries like hey , this is the way that I

25:19

would prefer to do it , and I say , okay

25:21

, that's your way and

25:23

I respect it , so that's a perfect

25:26

segue then .

25:26

So that's a perfect segue , then , because you've touched on

25:28

psychological safety in the workplace and

25:31

, like you said , even if I fail , I

25:33

know that I was in a safe space to do so Can

25:35

you speak to what types of things

25:37

leaders can do to foster

25:40

a collaborative environment ?

25:43

Yeah , I think I'll go back to

25:45

the things that align with creating

25:47

psychological safety . So build trust , build

25:50

relationships . Don't assume that

25:52

people know . Say it out loud hey , it's okay

25:54

to do this , there is no

25:56

dumb question . I prefer if you ask

25:58

the question than to leave here and it

26:01

keeps you up at night , be

26:03

curious , so outwardly encouraging

26:05

those type of behaviors . And

26:07

I think it's important to set clear expectations

26:10

. People have expectations that are in their head and

26:12

then you want to hold them accountable to the expectation

26:15

that's in your head . You got to have some

26:17

really good communications , set clear

26:19

expectations , give people the resources

26:21

and the autonomy to meet

26:24

those expectations and have

26:26

good follow-up not micromanagement

26:28

follow-up meaning you

26:30

know where I am , you know how to reach me

26:32

, we've established the indicators or whatever

26:35

that will require my help . So

26:37

if you approach this type of situation

26:39

, then that's a situation you need to bring me in on

26:41

. But establish those things up front

26:44

proper delegation , delegate based on what people's

26:46

strength . But I think doing all of those things and

26:48

fostering communication is just really

26:50

really key to building a collaborative

26:53

workspace .

26:54

If I'm an IC , I'm an individual contributor

26:56

and this is not

26:59

necessarily the environment I currently

27:01

work in , but I

27:03

think I have some sort of responsibility

27:06

in helping to foster that . What

27:08

do you advise someone in that position

27:10

? What can I do without any direct

27:12

authority to help us get there ? Yeah

27:15

, I think that's when you have the model .

27:18

I think people do what they see . Representation

27:20

matters and I think that you

27:22

begin to be very intentional

27:24

about treating people the way that you want them

27:26

to be treated , that you want to be treated . And

27:29

again , open communication , again

27:31

not understanding the full totality of the environment

27:33

. You know who you work with , but

27:36

is there an opportunity to

27:38

have a direct conversation ? Are

27:41

the barriers in your head meaning you

27:43

feel uncomfortable doing it , or is

27:45

it really an unsafe place to do it ? Because

27:47

I find sometimes we just think

27:49

it Okay . So what were the indicators that made you believe

27:51

you could have that conversation ? Well

27:53

, just because of their title . Well , I mean , that's

27:55

not enough of an indicator . And so sometimes

27:57

, especially when I'm coaching clients , I find

28:00

that a lot of the limitations they

28:02

have , they place them on themselves

28:04

or they observe the situation that

28:06

they didn't observe in full context . Maybe

28:09

they saw the outcome Like , oh , I saw it happen

28:11

to this person , but were you there ? Do you know what that

28:13

person did ? Or did they say , or are you going

28:15

to do exactly what they did ? You know , and

28:18

so it's just legitimate . They're

28:20

in a toxic , unsafe environment

28:22

and they've learned or seen

28:24

enough to know that it's ineffective

28:27

or it won't work . And

28:31

again , so I would have to weigh in on that . But I would say

28:33

that challenge your own belief system , try

28:35

and have a direct conversation , and

28:38

if you're truly , truly that unsafe thing

28:40

, now I'm going to question why are you still there ?

28:43

Yes , what's your ?

28:44

exit strategy . What's your timeline ? How long

28:46

do you need ? Why

28:48

would we stay in this unsafe environment ?

28:51

Which will probably go back to something else , that

28:53

they've built an anchor on

28:55

a belief , that they've built an anchor on

28:57

right . Well , the news , you

29:00

know , the job reports say that

29:02

. You know we're in an election year , so I might

29:04

not be able to . Well , I might

29:06

not earn as much if I go somewhere else

29:08

.

29:09

Is it worth whatever it's costing you to stay

29:11

there . So , for me again , I

29:13

left and I was seeing on LinkedIn how people

29:15

were filling out hundreds of applications

29:18

and not landing a role and

29:20

all of that stuff , and it still

29:22

wasn't enough to make me stay . Like

29:24

anyway I'm not going to say that it's

29:26

completely like it may never , ever

29:28

happen . The right company , the right environment

29:30

, the right circumstances . I know that

29:33

I could be a high level contributor to the

29:35

right type of breed , but as

29:37

of now , my mindset

29:39

has been around entrepreneurship , and

29:41

so it's been over a year for me . But , yeah

29:43

, I left in the thick of all the layoffs and

29:45

all that other good stuff . But it's

29:47

about alignment for me , and so that's

29:49

what I would challenge that person on . Is

29:52

you're enduring it ? You want to stay

29:54

there ? Okay ? So how are you going to influence it or

29:56

change your environment ? If you're not going to change your environment , how are

29:58

you going to change your mind about the environment

30:00

?

30:01

Touched on around . Questioning your perception

30:03

and your beliefs , especially in the moment

30:05

, can be challenging , right

30:11

, I know I've had to walk away from situations and come back the next day and go you know what

30:13

. I guess it wasn't really as bad as it felt

30:15

yesterday , right , but

30:18

that's also a part of crucial conversations

30:21

, right , being able to say in

30:24

this moment am I hearing what I

30:26

believe that I'm hearing ? Is that person

30:28

really speaking

30:31

from the place that I believe that they're speaking

30:33

from ? Is it an opportunity to

30:35

be curious here ? Let me ask more questions

30:37

. I've been known for saying it

30:40

could just be me and if it is , I

30:42

appreciate you just giving

30:44

me an opportunity to clarify , but it sounds

30:47

like you said giving

30:49

me an opportunity to clarify , but it sounds like you said X , y Z . Exactly . I love

30:51

that . I love that . Thank you for putting that out there

30:54

. What other misconceptions about

30:56

leadership have you encountered

30:58

and how do you address those in your

31:00

coaching ?

31:02

All right . So misconceptions

31:04

there's a lot of things that

31:06

I could go into about misconceptions

31:09

. There's a lot of things that I could go into about misconceptions

31:11

. I'm going to go with my top two . Leadership is

31:14

a title or position . People

31:17

think that I'm in a role where I'm not the boss

31:19

or I'm not the manager . They associate

31:21

leadership with the title

31:24

or the position and it's like let's think about

31:26

this different . The elements

31:28

of leadership is influence and things

31:30

like that . You have influence , even from your position

31:32

. Just because that's your boss doesn't mean that you're

31:35

a secondary leader or that you can't lead

31:37

them . Leadership is

31:39

what you do , is what you exert

31:42

, is how you behave , but it's not

31:44

a title or position . So

31:49

oftentimes it's impact and it's regardless of position . So oftentimes it's impact and

31:51

it's regardless of position . So I find times that that's a big misconception that I come

31:54

across with leadership is that , well , I don't

31:56

have this title , or I'm only this

31:58

or what . Their title is that

32:00

and it's like I've advised

32:02

a CEO of a Fortune 500 company

32:05

. You know they came in and asked me what I thought

32:07

, or they saw my results and asked me how I got

32:09

them . That's leadership . There it's

32:11

irregardless of my title . It's about influence

32:13

and impact . The other

32:16

thing that I would like to call out

32:18

that I think is a big misconception and something

32:20

that has worked in my favor is

32:22

that leaders can't be vulnerable . My

32:25

favor is that leaders can't be vulnerable

32:28

. I don't know why and I know

32:30

why , but it's an old adage in terms of this stoic presence

32:33

. Now I have to be honest with you . I do

32:35

believe that leaders are like flight attendants

32:37

in terms of when there's turbulence

32:39

, I should be able to look at the flight attendant and

32:41

know that , okay , we ain't going down because she

32:44

looking like this is normal . But if I look

32:46

at her and she's

32:48

nervous , okay , now

32:51

, this is uncomfortable for her . She's here statistically

32:53

more than I am , so she knows something's wrong

32:55

. So I do have that element to

32:58

me that leaders need to have some level of composure

33:00

, but it doesn't mean that you're not allowed

33:02

to be vulnerable , because you're a leader . That's

33:05

passion , that's authenticity , and

33:07

so I encourage people to share a little bit

33:09

of vulnerability . What's wrong with

33:12

your team ? knowing

33:14

that you're disappointed or

33:17

that you're having a bad day or

33:19

that you know we could do better , or

33:22

those type of things . That's authenticity , Like I

33:24

think it's important to you know , grow

33:28

our emotional intelligence , know

33:30

how to display our emotions in

33:32

a professional manner , but

33:34

be authentic . And so that

33:36

would be my top two misconceptions that

33:39

I think it's just so important for people to just wrap their

33:41

mind around differently . Leadership is not

33:43

a subtitle position and

33:45

leaders can be vulnerable Like

33:48

yes , yeah .

33:50

In today's world where transparency

33:53

is so critical to everyone

33:55

and so you can

33:57

kind of get a sense of are

33:59

they holding something back ? I

34:09

tell people all the time I have dreaded the age of video conferencing because , regardless

34:11

of how I say it , you can see it all right here and I'm working on it . I've been

34:13

working on it for years . But I

34:16

feel like if I'm going to have

34:19

one-on-one conversations , or even team

34:21

conversations , I need to be

34:23

transparent about certain things . Otherwise they're

34:25

going to pick up on something not

34:27

being shared , and even

34:29

if I can't share it , maybe it's as simple as

34:31

saying you know , I can't divulge everything

34:33

, but here's what I would like to

34:35

share with you . Right ? I can trust

34:38

someone who will at minimum tell me

34:40

hey , I can't give you everything . I

34:42

need you to walk in faith , and then everything else

34:44

I do should be grounded in that , because

34:47

if I've never let you down before , if

34:49

I've been transparent with you before , if

34:51

you've been able to trust that in our

34:53

exchanges what I do is

34:55

really for your good , you believe that I genuinely

34:57

care , and that is where it is coming

34:59

from , then we're probably in a solid

35:02

place where you can trust me , even if

35:04

I can't tell you everything , but I also

35:06

think about and this kind of goes back to the

35:09

collaboration piece One

35:11

of the reasons I've heard recently more

35:14

of that people don't share

35:16

is because they question

35:18

whether or not there's value in what they

35:21

share , not necessarily based

35:23

on title , but also based

35:25

on experience . Share

35:28

not necessarily based on title , but also based on experience , and I've always found

35:30

that to be very interesting because I'm in the space of learning and development

35:33

and some of my favorite

35:35

SMEs are the people who don't know

35:37

how we usually do it right

35:40

, because they're the ones who are going to say

35:42

so , why do we do it this way ? Or

35:44

well , I see

35:46

how we got from this point to this point

35:48

, but I don't understand the rest

35:50

of this . Like there's a gap here . They're

35:53

the ones because they don't . They don't

35:55

know the process or how it's usually

35:57

done . They can tell you those things

35:59

, but someone to

36:02

say I shouldn't give feedback or I

36:04

shouldn't weigh in or speak up because

36:06

I don't have the experience everyone else in

36:08

the room has , can cost

36:10

lives . I mean not to be dramatic

36:12

, a story I heard recently

36:14

where an astronaut they

36:17

were doing like this space simulation

36:19

and he had a newbie on

36:21

board with him and the newbie

36:23

saw something off but said

36:26

this guy's been doing this for

36:28

years . I'm new to this

36:30

, it's probably just me . As

36:32

it turns out , they get a last minute

36:34

. Hey , you've got to change your course

36:37

immediately because

36:39

you are in a direct path of collision with

36:41

someone else . And they did

36:43

, and everything crisis averted

36:45

.

36:46

Think about what it costs us when crisis isn't

36:48

averted . 1985 , January

36:50

28th , 1985 . And I often use

36:52

this example in encouraging people

36:55

to speak up with . I think it was like

36:57

the old ring or whatever . And they had

36:59

the research and it was a

37:01

, you know , a junior level scientist

37:04

who knew , knew

37:06

that there was something wrong with

37:09

that piece and it would not withstand

37:11

the pressure . And what was it ? Eight

37:13

astronauts lost their lives on that day

37:16

because , number one , the

37:18

environment wasn't created , but that person felt

37:20

comfortable speaking up . And they didn't

37:22

have the courage , but they were able to find that the

37:24

notes and the evidence and everything to

37:27

tell them that that what happened was

37:29

there , but because the environment

37:32

had been created , where this person felt comfortable

37:34

, challenging the people that was

37:36

around it

37:38

cost people their lives . So we have a real

37:40

life , not

37:43

only in terms of the intangible

37:45

that it causes with people's lives , but

37:47

then in the money that it costs for

37:51

someone to not just

37:53

speak up or for the right environment not

37:55

being created for someone to speak up , and

37:57

the credibility right

37:59

Like you miss an opportunity to , even

38:02

if you don't know the fact that you ask

38:04

excellent questions will

38:06

open doors for you .

38:07

right Like I wonder why this

38:09

is like this , but when you don't speak up and

38:11

there's evidence that you had an opportunity

38:14

to , that could almost hinder

38:16

you more than just not saying anything

38:18

at all .

38:19

Definitely I agree Awesome

38:21

.

38:22

Awesome , all right . So

38:24

talk to me about some challenges

38:26

that leaders face , especially . We've talked

38:28

about the complexity of how

38:31

things used to be back in the day

38:33

versus how they are

38:35

now , especially post pandemic . Right

38:37

, I think we are encountering some

38:40

very different , even

38:42

just energies in the workplace right

38:44

now different

38:47

, even just energies in the workplace right now . You've got some people who are trying to return

38:49

home or return to work from home . You've

38:52

got some companies who you know . You

38:54

know they recognize the challenges that

38:56

you have in your personal life that may prevent

38:58

you from doing that , but then there's this cultural

39:01

impact that may be happening if you don't

39:03

bring people back to work and everything

39:05

in between , of course . So talk

39:08

to me about some common challenges that you see

39:10

leaders whether again former

39:12

leaders , former roles or not

39:14

that they're having to navigate today

39:17

.

39:18

So I

39:20

think what you said , my number one thing would be adapting

39:23

to change , and not only just

39:25

the things that the pandemic brought about

39:27

with the flexibility of how we work , because

39:29

now we're like in a gig economy People want to be able

39:31

to pick up and put down their job when they feel like

39:33

it . So they're rather DoorDash or Uber

39:36

Eats , you know , because they can do it on their time

39:38

when they feel like it , and they can , you know more

39:40

flexibility . So that ability

39:43

to adapt to change is super important

39:45

. And then we have technology advances AI

39:48

, chat , gpt . I don't think it's necessarily going

39:50

to take away jobs , but it's going to require a different

39:52

skill set , just like social media

39:54

influences wasn't a job 20

39:56

years ago . Like nobody said , I'm going to be a social media

39:58

influencer . I think we're going to have

40:01

more data analysts and people that know

40:03

how to leverage AI better

40:05

. So there's a lot of change

40:07

that we have to adapt to . So I think it's probably the number

40:09

one challenge that we're facing in

40:12

the workforce , but also managing

40:15

more diverse teams . We have a whole nother generation

40:17

entering the workforce who thinks a

40:19

lot differently than the generation before them

40:21

, and so , as a leader , them

40:23

, and so as a leader , you're managing such

40:26

a wide range of different

40:28

people . And again , me

40:38

as a young leader . I've had employees from 16 to my oldest employee was 81

40:40

. And so managing completely different generations . And how do I exercise situational leadership

40:43

in order to lead all of them ? Decision-making

40:45

under uncertainty it's

40:48

another challenge . You don't have

40:50

all the facts , you don't have all the information

40:52

. You have to consider so many other

40:54

components . How does this land social media-wise

40:57

with this group of people versus this group of people . There's

40:59

just so many things to consider . And so how

41:01

do you move forward as a leader without

41:04

all the details , especially right after

41:06

the pandemic ? You know the world is

41:08

evolving differently , people want to work differently

41:10

, and so you're having to make a lot

41:12

more decisions without you know

41:14

a level of predictability or evidence

41:17

to kind of support it , and

41:19

that's common . And then I think the other thing

41:21

that is just sitting on my mind

41:23

right now is balancing accountability

41:26

and morale . We either know how to set

41:28

the expectation and hold people to the standard , or

41:30

we know how to have a good relationship with them , and it's like you

41:33

know , we can have both right .

41:34

That's right , and now talk

41:36

about that , though , because I

41:39

don't think that that was a new issue . I don't

41:41

think that's a new challenge . I think I've seen that

41:43

for eons , right . So what would

41:45

you recommend ?

41:47

Yeah , and so that's what I specialize in actually is

41:49

teaching people how to create high accountability

41:52

, high morale environments , and

41:54

so , yeah , it's about how you build

41:57

relationships and that you build them with

41:59

good trust and proper boundaries . You

42:02

have to build the type of relationship that a person understands

42:04

that I'm not being offensive or demoralizing

42:07

or requiring this out of you

42:09

. This is a part of my job

42:11

. This is a part of your job . I mean , at the end of the day

42:13

, when you go to work , you're there

42:15

to provide a service in exchange

42:18

for compensation , and so that has

42:20

to be established and respected as a part

42:22

of the relationship , and we can still have a relationship

42:24

, but we have to remember that we're

42:27

both here to provide a service in

42:29

exchange for compensation , and so it's

42:31

just an element of our relationship

42:33

. And I'm going to hold you accountable . We're

42:36

going to schedule regular check-ins so that you

42:38

don't get nervous every time I

42:40

put a team's notification on your

42:42

calendar . Oh my God , what does she want to talk

42:44

about ? No , we talk every week anyway , so this is

42:46

just our standard check-in . So there's a lot of practical

42:48

strategies and things that I advise people to do

42:51

to create a level of comfortability

42:53

and trust and predictability

42:57

in their relationships

42:59

. That drives that high accountability

43:02

. But it protects that morale and that experience

43:04

with the person .

43:05

Now ask in your experience

43:07

as an IC , what did that look like

43:09

? Because I think that even as an individual

43:12

contributor , you have to still be able to tell

43:14

your partners hey , I have

43:16

a responsibility and you are part

43:18

of this right . My preference would be to

43:20

co-elevate right , but at

43:22

minimum I've got to be able to come to

43:25

you for what I need . In order for

43:27

me to provide you with what you need . What

43:29

adjustments did you have to make without

43:31

direct authority ?

43:33

Well , I'm telling you , it's exactly the way you described

43:35

. Again , you lean more into the persuasiveness

43:37

, because you don't necessarily have the authority

43:39

in the same way , but

43:41

you all still have the same obligation You're

43:44

there to provide a service in

43:46

exchange for compensation . That's

43:48

the same for everybody , irregardless of title

43:50

, and so all I'm trying to do is

43:53

provide the services that they're asking me to

43:55

provide and assist you in doing the

43:57

same thing . So how do we help each other in

43:59

achieving the goal for both of us

44:02

? And I think sometimes , if

44:04

a situation seems like , okay , we're posturing

44:06

right now and this is getting weird , I

44:08

bring it back down to the foundational thing

44:10

hey , look , we're both here to

44:12

provide a service in exchange for compensation

44:15

. Like , let's dial this all the way

44:17

back and maybe we have different goals

44:19

and ambitions and you sit on

44:21

a different seat on the bus

44:23

, but we're on the same bus here . How

44:25

do I help you ? Help me , and then

44:27

you know what do you need from me

44:29

or what can I do for you . But I think

44:31

it's pretty much a similar approach

44:34

, because the approach is irregardless of

44:36

authority in my mind , because it's

44:38

about the relationship .

44:39

That's right . Now . You mentioned boundaries

44:42

and being

44:44

able to establish

44:46

them , and I've experienced this myself

44:48

. You know I'm trying to balance personal

44:51

boundaries and professional boundaries

44:53

. What recommendations would

44:55

you make towards an aspiring

44:57

leader or even someone

44:59

who's more seasoned but they're looking to have more impact

45:02

in the space that they steward over

45:04

? When it comes to leveraging

45:06

boundaries to be effective as a leader

45:08

? I mean especially tying back to what you just

45:10

shared about hey , you've got to still hold people

45:12

accountable and have

45:15

proper relationships right , so

45:17

what advice would you give ?

45:19

Again , I think it's foundational

45:21

. I think when you're establishing the relationship , it

45:24

really is about helping others to

45:26

understand your position on the bus

45:28

and understanding their position . Again

45:30

, we're both on the same bus but we have

45:32

different vantage points . We may have , you

45:35

know , I may be getting off on a different stop than you , so

45:38

we've got different goals and things like that , but we're

45:40

on the same bus together and we could help

45:42

each other and we could support each other

45:45

. However , it's about communication

45:47

, so I'm very transparent in what

45:49

my goals are . Again

45:52

, it almost allows me to play with my cards

45:54

up a little bit . So it establishes

45:56

trust and I'm not going to say that people haven't taken

45:59

advantage of that style , because

46:01

you're going to have the people that take advantage of your authenticity

46:04

or your ability to be a truthful

46:06

communicator and you have to decide whether

46:08

it's worth it to you . It's just worth it to me to just

46:10

be myself , but what I would say

46:13

for others is high level

46:15

communication , empathy

46:17

towards other people's position and

46:19

the courage to state yours . I'm

46:22

going to say this it's a colorful statement , but I

46:24

tell you I mean it and I live it . I

46:26

may not be everybody's cup of tea

46:28

, but I'm somebody's flavor , and so

46:31

I am not concerned and caught

46:33

up with being liked

46:35

by everyone , and I think sometimes

46:37

people are . I will be respected

46:39

.

46:40

I will be respectful , but

46:47

you don't have to like me necessarily for us to work together and have a great relationship

46:49

. It better than I do . I . I've told people like I'm not for everybody

46:51

and that's fine . We can

46:53

still make this happen and

46:55

then we'll wish each other well . But I

46:58

love the different . I may not be everybody's

47:00

cup of tea , but I'm somebody's flavor . I

47:03

I'm that .

47:03

I'm definitely somebody's flavor

47:06

and I know that . I know that I'm not everyone's

47:08

cup of tea and I'm okay with that . However

47:10

, I'm effective , I'm respectful

47:13

, I pour into others , I

47:15

love people . There was a time where I

47:17

thought , oh my God , people get on my nerves and I was like that's

47:19

not true . Actually , I love people . They

47:22

get on my nerves , but I love people . I really

47:24

do and I respect their boundaries

47:27

, so I respect . If I'm not their cup of tea

47:29

, that's okay . However

47:31

, we're on the same bus at this moment , so

47:33

how do we help each other , and our

47:35

likability doesn't necessarily have to be an

47:37

obstacle for us to achieve

47:39

the goals that we want to achieve .

47:41

And our ability to be authentic has nothing

47:44

to do with doing what somebody else may be doing

47:46

because it looks like it works . You

47:48

have to be true to who you are . Yeah

47:51

, love it All right , doris

47:53

, what final thoughts or advice would

47:55

you like to share with our audience , especially anyone

47:58

looking to empower themselves as leaders or

48:00

just looking to strengthen their family bonds

48:02

?

48:03

into strengthening their family bonds

48:05

. I would say high accountability

48:08

, high morale . It

48:12

exists , it can work . You just have to balance it . So I would encourage people that if you're looking

48:14

to again strengthen your family life , looking to build a relationship

48:16

that you have at work , it's

48:19

high accountability , high morale . So now

48:21

, what I currently do on LinkedIn is I have a newsletter

48:24

I started it about a month ago but it's

48:26

called High Accountability , high Morale and Business

48:28

and Life and I talk about those different things

48:30

. I'm sharing different ways . I will be publishing

48:33

a book with the same title , but

48:35

I'm sharing the strategies and the things that I've

48:37

used over the years to be able to build

48:39

those type of safe spaces and

48:42

the results that I've been able to achieve

48:44

by doing so . Again , I have a 19-year-old

48:46

college graduate . Again

48:51

, I was with a company and promotion up into director level positions advising

48:54

C-suite executives . So I

48:56

have the track record to kind of substantiate

48:58

that it can be done . There

49:00

is a way to find that balance and it just

49:02

takes intentionality in order to do

49:04

it . But I would encourage you to focus on

49:07

ways that you can build the accountability

49:09

but also the morale at the same time

49:11

.

49:12

Tell the audience more about Raising Justice

49:14

and when they can expect it .

49:16

All right . So Raising Justice is available

49:18

now on my website . It's my name

49:20

DorisJacksonShaziercom

49:22

, and so if you purchase now

49:24

before June 27th that's part

49:27

of my pre-sale event you will receive

49:29

an autographed copy from me , so I'll be personally

49:31

mailing those books out and signing them myself , so

49:34

it's really special . And you'll have a free

49:36

gift included with any pre-sale

49:38

books Now

49:40

. On June 27th it will publish

49:43

nationwide , so it'll be available

49:45

on Amazon . On June 27th it will

49:47

publish nationwide , so it'll be

49:49

available on Amazon , apple , google , barnes , noble . So

49:54

I'm excited to share with everyone again my journey in motherhood , the different

49:57

lessons I've learned and how again , mommy was my first leadership title

49:59

and the things that I learned in the relationship

50:01

I built with my daughter and

50:03

my other children , how it transitions

50:06

into the world , like everybody again

50:08

can raise justice . It's just a

50:10

parenting style .

50:12

It's been a pleasure to have you on our show today

50:14

. You've been amazing , sharing great

50:16

insights , nuggets all over the place

50:18

. Got to have you back because I feel like

50:20

there are several topics we could dive so

50:22

much deeper into and I just want to say

50:25

I would love that opportunity . Yes , absolutely

50:27

. I just want to say yes , absolutely .

50:32

I just want to say thank you again . This has been amazing .

50:33

Thank you so much for having me . I appreciate it . Well . That wraps up today's episode

50:36

of Thanks for Coming Back . Well , that

50:38

wraps up today's episode of Thanks for Coming Back . I

50:41

hope you enjoyed our conversation with Doris Jackson

50:43

Shazier as much as I did . Doris

50:45

shared invaluable insights on leadership

50:47

, collaboration and creating

50:49

psychologically safe environments that we can all

50:51

implement in our own ways . If

50:54

you're an aspiring leader or a current leader

50:56

looking to make a bigger impact , now

50:58

is the time to take action . Start

51:00

by fostering trust , promoting open

51:03

communication and leveraging the strengths

51:05

of your team . Be sure to check out Doris's

51:07

upcoming book Raising Justice Lessons

51:10

Learned from Motherhood , available for pre-sale

51:12

on her website dorisjacksonchaiziercom

51:15

. That's S-H-A-Z-I-E-R

51:18

. Pre-order

51:24

before June 27th to receive a signed copy and a special gift , and don't forget to

51:26

subscribe to Thanks for Coming Back so you never miss an episode . If you found today's discussion

51:28

helpful , please leave us a review and share

51:30

this episode with your network . Let's continue

51:32

to elevate our leadership skills together . Thanks

51:35

for listening and until next time , keep striving

51:37

to lead with purpose and a meaningful

51:39

impact .