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0:46

is Sounds Like a Cult, a show about the

0:49

modern day cults we all follow. I'm Issa Medina

0:51

and I'm a comedian. Every

0:53

week on our show, we discuss a

0:55

different fanatical fringe group from the cultural

0:57

zeitgeist. From diet culture to

0:59

doomsday preppers to try and answer the

1:01

big question. This group

1:04

sounds like a cult, but is

1:06

it really? This

1:19

week, I'm so excited to bring on

1:21

my very smart and funny friend, writer,

1:23

content creator, Yale graduate, Lydia Keating, to

1:25

chat about the cult of Reddit. But

1:28

before we get into the episode, I

1:30

just want to let everybody know this

1:32

is my last solo episode on Sounds

1:34

Like a Cult and Amanda and I's

1:37

last joint episode will be coming out

1:39

December 12th. But Sounds Like

1:41

a Cult will go on and I hope you all

1:43

keep listening. I've loved being a

1:45

part of this podcast from the beginning as

1:47

a co-creator and host, but

1:49

don't worry, I won't be too far away.

1:51

I'm really excited to start a new project.

1:53

I'm starting a new podcast with today's guest.

1:55

You'll be hearing more about it soon and

1:57

I can't wait to show you what's coming.

2:00

what we have in store for you.

2:02

But for now, here's my last total

2:04

episode with my friend Lydia Keating on

2:06

the cult of Reddit. There

2:08

are so many different categories of cults that

2:10

we've covered on this podcast, you know? Doomsday

2:13

cults, political cults, sex cults,

2:15

religious cults. And I feel

2:17

like Reddit is really where

2:19

all of those things join

2:21

forces in individual little threads,

2:24

subreddits, big Reddits, all the

2:26

little Reddit threads that exist.

2:29

It's also often said that culture founded

2:32

on ill-informed and outlandish ideologies. And I

2:34

think what is more loco than a

2:36

bunch of people with no profile pictures

2:39

getting online and upvoting each other's

2:41

wild theories with very limited resources

2:43

or no resources to back them

2:46

up. But it can also

2:48

be a fun place to build community

2:50

and laugh. And honestly, the original source

2:52

for a lot of the most famous

2:55

memes. I mean, it's known

2:57

in the comedy space that a lot

2:59

of comedy content is actually stolen off

3:01

Reddit and repurposed on Twitter where people

3:03

instead of threads can collect followers and

3:05

monetize content. So is Reddit a cult?

3:07

And if so, is it a live your life, a

3:09

watch your back or get the fuck out level

3:11

cult? Today, my very special

3:13

guest and I are going to talk

3:15

about it. The positives, the negatives and

3:18

the worst case scenarios, of course, with

3:20

some cheeky personal stories where we almost

3:22

fell into the cult Reddit rabbit hole

3:26

and took advice from total strangers.

3:29

So without further ado, here is the

3:32

cult of Reddit. Lydia, I'm

3:34

so excited to have you on the

3:36

podcast and for us to be podcasting

3:38

together. I know, it's so exciting to

3:40

be back on, sounds like a cult.

3:42

I was here in the very beginning.

3:45

You were literally one of our first guests

3:47

on the cult of marathon running. But for

3:49

those of you who haven't met you before,

3:51

can you please introduce yourself and who you

3:54

are to our listeners? Yes,

3:56

I would love to. My

3:58

name's Lydia Keating. I'm I'm a

4:00

writer, I'm a content creator,

4:03

I'm a former comedian, although I might

4:05

get back into it, and

4:07

I'm a friend of Isa's and coincidentally

4:09

just ran my seventh marathon. That's so

4:12

braggy of me. No,

4:15

I don't think so. I think it's actually something you

4:17

should brag about. Yeah, well,

4:19

okay. I didn't mean that in a braggy

4:21

way. I just was like, oh, the timing

4:23

is so fun. Here

4:25

I am back. But yeah, you know, I'm trying

4:28

to run 10 before I turn 30. And

4:30

if I do that, then it will

4:32

be something worth bragging about. Yeah. Oh

4:34

my gosh, that would be really cool. What is 26 times

4:36

10? That's so

4:38

many miles. Plus

4:41

all the training. Oh. Okay,

4:44

I was thinking

4:47

26 point

4:49

whatever, the decimal numbers. Oh,

4:51

but I like... I think it would

4:54

be 280, not just trying to be like

4:56

a math whiz. But point two times... Okay,

4:58

with the decimal, you know the exact number

5:00

two? Well, point two times 10 is two.

5:05

Oh no, yeah, point two times 10 is two. Okay, no,

5:07

no, no. So it would be 200. Okay,

5:09

you don't have to flex. Yeah, yeah, it's fine. In

5:12

fact, I was trying to flex, but now it's not a

5:14

flex. And then you

5:16

couldn't. Yeah, I couldn't quite make it to

5:18

the finish line on that, on the math,

5:20

but could on my seven marathons. Yeah,

5:23

you could. You did it all the way through.

5:25

I never thought I could do one, but

5:27

I don't know. I ran a half marathon. I ran

5:29

my third half marathon last year and it wasn't

5:32

as bad as like the previous ones because I just

5:34

ran it at a really good pace. So

5:36

I do feel like it's all about

5:38

the pace. Yeah, also, I don't know

5:41

if I've ever told you this, but you

5:43

strike me as such like an active

5:46

person. Like you're full of vigor. And

5:51

I feel like you're just like a doer and

5:53

you really do give like marathon,

5:56

like you could 100% do a marathon. If

5:58

I were to think of people in my life. like, oh,

6:00

who could complete marathon? You would 100% be

6:02

someone who would come to mind. I'm

6:05

going to take that with me and

6:07

carry a ton to when I run

6:09

one. But today we are

6:11

here to talk about the cult of

6:13

Reddit. It

6:15

has been a highly

6:18

recommended topic by listeners. And I

6:20

also think it's pretty relevant to

6:22

kind of the new podcasts that

6:25

we're starting in a way, which

6:28

I'm so excited about. And we

6:31

can't say too much, but we're pretty

6:33

much going to have a podcast where

6:35

you learn fun facts. Yep.

6:37

We have a fun, giggly banter

6:41

and you just tune in every week to learn

6:43

something new and have a good time. And I

6:45

feel like with the cult of Reddit, we can

6:47

kind of do that. Yeah,

6:49

I think so too. I think this will

6:51

be like a little teaser for

6:54

what's to come with our podcast.

6:57

And yeah, I'm so excited about it. I feel like I

6:59

don't know how much we

7:01

can or should say, but all you guys need

7:03

to know is it's going to be a good

7:05

time. It's going to be

7:07

a good time. It's going to be positive

7:09

vibes, good energy. You're going to want to

7:11

tune in a week after week. You're going

7:13

to turn greedy. Yeah. You're going to be

7:15

like, I

7:21

want this on my commute every single day. And

7:23

I don't know if we can give that to

7:25

you, but we can't, but we can do one

7:28

a week. Yeah. One time, one

7:30

commute. Yeah. But today

7:32

we are still going to do a classic sounds

7:34

like a cult structured episode. And we're going to

7:36

talk about the cult of Reddit and just kind

7:38

of to get the conversation going, Lydia, do you

7:40

use Reddit? I am a

7:43

consumer of Reddit. I

7:46

have never posted on

7:48

Reddit. I actually like

7:50

the last time I was regularly going

7:53

on Reddit every day, I had a

7:55

little bit of a scarring experience and

7:57

I, yeah, it was, it was during very

8:00

dark period of my life and like

8:02

Reddit I feel like almost facilitated that

8:04

darkness and it's not probably

8:07

what you're thinking which is just

8:09

like as someone who has like a

8:11

public online personality there are I

8:13

think I've seen like a couple threads about myself

8:15

but none of them really have been that bad. I

8:19

just don't think I'm like big enough or like

8:21

people care about me enough to shit on me

8:23

which I ever that is a sign like if you

8:25

have a big following like if you

8:27

have haters that is a sign of success. So

8:30

sometimes I'm like thank you then. I

8:33

am so successful. Yeah

8:36

you're killing it. No but I'm literally

8:38

killing it. It's true it's like if

8:40

you have people talking shit about you

8:42

on an anonymous online forum your

8:45

your career is taken off. Yeah

8:47

that's funny I mean I'm the same as

8:49

you I personally I've never used Reddit like

8:51

I've never posted on it but I have you

8:54

know I scrolled around as one does on the

8:56

internet and I really thought it was something that

8:58

like people like that like people you got

9:00

got really high and like went on yeah

9:03

kind of scroll on like

9:05

late at night you know it's like a very

9:07

college-y thing. Yeah I associate with like 17 year

9:10

old boy.

9:12

Exactly. Yeah and in fact

9:14

sometimes I feel like when I'm on I

9:16

feel like the fact that I discovered Reddit

9:18

as like a woman in my late 20s

9:20

it makes me kind of feel cool like

9:22

I'm like tapping into I'm like this is

9:24

what the kids are doing and this is

9:26

like deep cut internet shit and

9:28

it makes it make me feel like I'm

9:30

like almost alt to be on

9:32

Reddit. Yeah yes that's so true I

9:34

mean Reddit is one of the few

9:37

like social media platforms that still is

9:40

kind of like janky looking you know

9:42

what I mean. Oh yeah yeah and

9:44

I think that's been so intentional uh

9:46

that they've kept it they've kept it

9:48

like early 2000s internet vibe.

9:50

Exactly and that it that is when it

9:52

was founded it was founded in 2005 by

9:54

three UVA alumni. Hello. Hi. They

10:00

were UVA roommates Alexis Ohanian and Steve Huffman,

10:02

and then their third friend, not a roommate,

10:04

sorry my guy, uh didn't make the cut.

10:07

Aaron Swartz, they founded it, and

10:09

then it was acquired by Conde

10:12

Nast Publications in 2006, and

10:14

you'd think that it was like

10:16

always super independent by the fact that they

10:19

haven't like really developed it into like a

10:21

prettier website. But little

10:23

by little, they have been raising tons

10:25

and tons of money. In

10:27

2014, they raised $50 million

10:29

of funding by Sam Altman,

10:32

including investors such as Noop

10:34

Dog and Jared Leto, and that put their company

10:36

at a $500 million valuation at the time. And

10:41

then in 2017, they raised another $200 million, so they got up to

10:43

a $1.8 billion valuation. And then in 2019, they raised $300 million funding,

10:45

which put them at a $3 billion valuation. And

10:57

then in August of 2021, they

10:59

raised another $700 million, which

11:01

put them at a $10

11:04

billion plus valuation. So

11:06

it's not a small company, but

11:09

a stretch of the imagination. And

11:11

then in December 2021, it

11:13

IPO'd, which is actually one of

11:15

my favorite terminology. Wait,

11:18

only in 2021 did they IPO? Yeah.

11:22

That's kind of shocking. I don't know. I just,

11:24

I, when I think of Reddit, I

11:26

think of it as a platform that's

11:28

up there with Instagram, with Twitter, with

11:30

TikTok. I mean, personally, as like a

11:33

consumer of social media. I don't, it's

11:35

so, I would consider, it is

11:37

social media. Well, okay, there's two

11:39

reasons I go on Reddit. And

11:41

this was what I was alluding to earlier

11:43

about like, like the dark period

11:46

of my life when I was really using

11:48

Reddit. But were you like privy

11:50

to the Moscow murders that happened

11:52

last winter? Around actually this time,

11:55

I think it was like, no,

11:57

right before Thanksgiving. It

11:59

was these four days. students in at University

12:01

of Idaho who got stabbed in

12:03

there. Oh yes you told me about

12:06

that and I was on I saw a

12:08

bit of it on social media. Yeah oh yeah

12:10

there were two actually Reddit threads that

12:12

formed and I was like checking both

12:14

every hour and it became it

12:16

was like quintessential internet flu thing

12:19

and then like people who like

12:21

suspects who were seen on certain video

12:23

cameras like where some of the victims

12:25

were last seen became like doxxed because

12:27

people on Reddit figured out their identities

12:31

which is super harmful especially when

12:33

the individuals who were doxxed ended up being

12:35

completely innocent and it was like a kid who

12:38

had to like leave campus because these Reddit

12:40

threads had like exposed him but

12:42

yeah I became like all consumed I

12:45

never contributed so I say that

12:47

because I think there there is some

12:49

like ethical I don't

12:51

know stakes on the line when you're contributing

12:53

to threads like that but yeah and I

12:56

mean I think that kind of paints the

12:58

picture that it is this cult that you

13:00

can observe from a distance but it also

13:02

is a cult that I feel like is

13:04

as soon as you start participating outside of

13:07

just like up voting and down voting and

13:09

as soon as you start commenting on the

13:11

thread and like potentially adding

13:13

to misinformation spreading then you

13:15

are very much a part

13:18

of the cult yes and

13:20

you are not only contributing

13:22

to its growth but you are

13:24

contributing to like the effects that

13:26

it can have outside of the

13:28

website and into real people's lives

13:30

yeah and there's like this idea

13:33

of anon I

13:35

always mess up this word

13:37

anonimity anonimity anonimity when

13:40

is like me ESL

13:42

and I know anonimity

13:45

there like I there's

13:48

some parts of reddit where

13:50

like being anonymous like makes

13:52

a lot of sense like the ACOC

13:55

adult children of alcoholics there's reddit

13:57

threads there and like yeah and

13:59

it makes that you maybe want

14:01

this space and this forum to

14:03

talk to other people who have had this

14:05

shared childhood trauma and

14:07

you don't necessarily want your name attached

14:09

to that account. I don't

14:11

know, I think that's great that

14:13

there's a space on the internet where people can

14:16

find this community but not expose themselves

14:18

and feel comfortable. But then

14:20

I think of the

14:23

threads, let's say influencer snark

14:25

threads, which are now I think a

14:27

big thing. For me, I just

14:29

think if you are an

14:32

anonymous user contributing

14:34

to threads like influencer snark threads,

14:36

which if you don't know what that is, it's just people

14:38

who are shitting on content

14:41

creators and influencers on these anonymous

14:43

threads. I really do think it

14:46

has to beg the question that you

14:48

as an individual have to ask yourself,

14:51

why am I okay saying

14:54

this on an

14:56

anonymous forum? I

14:58

don't know, it's like, how does that

15:00

not cross your mind when you're commenting

15:02

hate on these, it's

15:06

so weak, to me it's like.

15:08

Yeah, I feel like it allows

15:11

people to separate themselves from their

15:13

ethical persona because they have a

15:15

whole, and that's the very culty

15:17

thing about it. It's like when

15:19

you talk to people

15:21

who have survived cults or people who

15:24

have escaped cults, they almost describe their

15:26

experience as something that they were an

15:28

entirely different person, and

15:30

they didn't see themselves, they saw themselves in

15:32

a different light, and I feel like that's

15:34

the thing about creating

15:36

an alternate persona online is that you

15:39

are able to draw this invisible line

15:41

of being like, that's me online, but

15:43

I'm kind to people in my day-to-day

15:45

life, and I also don't know what

15:47

the consequences are of my online actions,

15:50

so I can go to bed at

15:52

night and sleep like a baby. Yeah,

15:55

yeah, I mean that's the whole,

15:57

and there's already sort of this

15:59

like, divide. that people I think

16:01

feel between like reality and

16:03

like their behavior online just on

16:05

normal social media that isn't an

16:07

honest like TikTok hate comments

16:09

and Instagram hate comments and all that but

16:12

then there's this other buffer on on

16:15

reddit that makes it even more

16:17

insidious I think so

16:37

we were just talking about how anonymity

16:40

on reddit is a bit more

16:42

insidious than other social

16:44

media platforms because everyone is

16:46

anonymous and you can't really become

16:49

an individual influencer on the platform

16:51

and I think that in that

16:53

way it's a very democratic platform

16:55

which makes it super decentralized because

16:57

it's up to the people to

16:59

like upvote the comments or download

17:02

the comments but who

17:05

do you think is the

17:07

ultimate cult leader in the

17:09

cult of reddit do you think it's like the founders

17:12

do you think it's the tech

17:14

investors the people where do you

17:16

think the biggest influence comes from

17:19

I kind of feel like because there

17:22

is no algorithm

17:24

like working to convince

17:28

people of one thing or trying

17:31

to drive people to care

17:33

about a certain

17:35

topic it feels

17:38

like reddit is a platform that is fueled

17:40

a lot by confirmation bias and people

17:43

have existing feelings have these existing

17:45

beliefs and just want to hear

17:47

someone like I have like research

17:50

some random ash like put in some

17:52

really random like search

17:55

keywords and reddit just to find one

17:57

other person out there yeah So

18:01

random. But just like having one

18:03

person out there who's like shared an experience, and

18:05

I can't even remember exactly what this is, but

18:07

I just know I've like searched some

18:09

like hyper, hyper specific thing. And it's

18:11

just simply because you're looking for someone

18:13

who's like maybe also had

18:16

this one very specific experience. And

18:18

so in a way, it feels like the cult leaders

18:20

are like the individuals like

18:23

you're literally just looking for people to confirm

18:25

stuff you already know, I think a lot.

18:27

Yeah, it's almost like a mirror, a

18:29

mirror like platform like, you know, like you're looking

18:31

for the cult leader and you're standing in front

18:34

of the mirror. It's you, babe. Yeah. And

18:36

you're like, this is so fun. Like I can't

18:38

believe I found these people who like

18:40

completely align with like my past experiences

18:42

and my beliefs about the world. It's

18:44

like you literally like looked for them

18:47

and like, you typed in the most

18:49

specific search words to find these people.

18:51

This isn't random. I'm trying

18:54

to think of an example of like, what

18:56

to do if your boyfriend texts

18:59

his sister that he's annoyed at

19:01

you after you

19:03

ate his leftovers. No,

19:05

and I'm like that. Yeah, exactly.

19:09

Yeah, that's really funny. I definitely I

19:11

can think of something I've typed about

19:13

my relationship. Okay, wait, one has I

19:15

can't it's because it's mean. Sorry, I'm

19:19

not. I said

19:21

that but I just want to say that

19:24

like, in my like deep down, like when

19:26

I was like down bad and things were not going

19:28

well, I like literally wrote like

19:30

such a specific, honestly, multi

19:32

sentence search about like, wait,

19:35

I get one example that comes to mind, which you do not

19:37

have to confirm or deny. Okay,

19:39

yeah. What

19:41

is why is my boyfriend like,

19:44

not staying hard. That's

19:47

definitely not it. But no, that wasn't

19:49

it. But like, yeah, like, boy, like,

19:51

here's here's here's an example. This is

19:53

not mine. But like, this is a little play on what you

19:55

just get gave. Yeah, boyfriend can't

19:57

stay hard during sex, but

20:00

says I am the love of his life should we

20:02

break up you

20:05

know and then you find people who've had

20:08

this experience and you're like you will literally

20:10

find like a subreddit word for word yeah

20:12

it has like three comments underneath and you

20:15

like take them as gospel yeah yeah yeah

20:17

you find like one other lonely person out

20:19

there and you're like oh wow this

20:21

is a shared universal I should

20:23

say in this relationship yeah that's

20:26

so funny but I think those are all

20:28

really good points I mean it is really

20:30

controlled by confirmation bias I did look into

20:32

this a little bit but read it does

20:34

have a little bit of an algorithm in

20:36

that it will process the first

20:39

few votes to weigh whether the content is

20:41

hot or not but then

20:43

after that it really is up to

20:45

the people because unlike liking a video

20:48

and versus not liking a video on

20:51

Instagram you can literally upvote

20:53

it or downvote it that's

20:56

kind of what makes it

20:58

to me a more green flag cult

21:00

is that the comments are controlled like

21:02

the popularity of the comments are controlled by

21:05

the people yeah not the platform

21:07

yeah it's it's not an algorithm

21:09

like the people are the algorithm

21:11

right um but again to your

21:13

point like the negatives are the

21:15

propensity to spread misinformation yeah and

21:18

hate yeah yeah but

21:20

like that that could be that's true for

21:22

so much social media now right like it's

21:24

true for every platform okay so I want

21:26

to know what do you think are some

21:28

of the cultiest groups on reddit or have

21:30

you ever come across one that you think

21:32

was giving red flags honestly

21:34

like the the Moscow murder reddit

21:37

threads really I felt were

21:39

gave because what it was

21:41

I think it was a lot of people

21:43

who were really deeply disturbed by what had

21:45

happened and they were vulnerable and they were

21:47

scared and the reddit threads

21:50

gave them some sense of

21:53

comfort control and community all those scary

21:55

things at the same time but that

21:57

must be kind of similar to like

22:00

the psychology of

22:03

why people get into cults because they're

22:05

scared, right? Yes, yeah,

22:08

I think it's like there's a combination

22:10

of people who seek community

22:13

through cult-like groups are

22:15

people who not only

22:17

are scared and not always

22:19

scared but they're people who feel a

22:21

little bit lost and who are seeking

22:23

answers. And we always joke about

22:25

this with the live

22:28

your life level cults, but it's almost like

22:30

we live in a society where we have

22:33

like decision overload, you know? Like we have

22:35

so many decisions to make on a day-to-day

22:37

basis that I mean, we've seen memes about

22:39

it everywhere. You kind of want to be

22:41

like, I'll join a cult just so I

22:43

don't ever have to make a decision ever

22:46

again. Yeah, yeah. It's like, tell me

22:48

what to do and tell me how to live

22:50

my life. And so I think when it comes to murder

22:53

and true crime, particularly the

22:55

Moscow murders, people were

22:57

scared and they were looking for answers and

23:00

they wanted to have someone tell

23:02

them either it was gonna be

23:04

okay or that there is a particular

23:07

way to solve the issue or just

23:09

like a next step, you know?

23:11

Like when you're struggling

23:13

with your life, you wanna plan and

23:16

you wanna list of what

23:19

you wanna do next. Yeah, and it's

23:21

interesting that you say that because I

23:24

think when the Moscow murder threads were

23:26

at their cultiest, it was when the

23:29

police didn't have a suspect in custody for

23:31

like two and a half, three weeks. And

23:35

so I think that big unknown

23:37

and that big question mark made

23:40

the threads have this sense

23:43

of like, well, we're solving it here

23:45

then. And like the sense of like

23:47

action taking that the police were obviously

23:50

doing, but not talking about because they're

23:52

literally doing a murder investigation. I think

23:54

that's one of the cultiest

23:56

red flags is when one of

23:58

these... cult-like group

24:01

creates some sort of like actionable

24:03

stance outside of the group itself.

24:06

It starts to affect everyday people

24:08

in their everyday lives and there

24:10

were innocent people who were identified

24:13

as potential suspects who then had

24:15

to leave college because

24:17

they were being harassed, right? Yeah,

24:19

and the parents of

24:21

the victims, there started to be

24:23

some very harsh criticism of them

24:26

and like I don't know

24:28

if that had actual tangible effects on these

24:30

families but it was a thing where

24:32

like the impact of

24:34

these threads started to

24:36

expand beyond the people who were

24:39

willingly participating. That reminds me of

24:41

the Reddit forum for Wall Street

24:43

Bets and what

24:45

happened with the Game Stock price

24:47

as an example of Reddit

24:50

threads and sub-Reddit that have

24:52

done that, like have kind

24:54

of expanded outside of Reddit

24:56

during the pandemic. For

24:59

those of you who don't know, there was

25:01

an army of traders on Reddit with a

25:03

forum which was like r slash Wall Street

25:05

Bets that helped drive the meteoric rise in

25:08

Game Stock price and it

25:10

forced halts in trading and caused

25:12

a major headache for short sellers

25:15

betting against it and essentially it

25:18

created this whole story kind of

25:20

like the David and Goliath vibe

25:22

of like the everyday people rallying

25:24

together to fight

25:26

against Wall Street and I think that was like one

25:29

of the most amazing shows

25:32

of like public

25:35

unity against a

25:37

corporation. So I wanted to

25:39

give this as an example of what good can

25:42

come out of Reddit. Thank

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podcast in the survey and be sure to select our

27:19

show in the drop-down menu that follows. I

27:41

think one of the main sources of good that

27:43

comes out of Reddit is like something we've already touched

27:45

on it's like giving people who

27:48

maybe are a little community-less the

27:50

sense of community like even I

27:52

don't know there's what's the I

27:54

think the biggest Reddit thread is

27:56

literally called askreddit do you

27:58

know this one where it's like it poses a question like

28:00

what's the most embarrassing thing that's ever happened to you?

28:02

And I don't know sometimes the questions

28:04

don't hit but sometimes the questions like pop off

28:06

and like the reddit thread goes viral and gets

28:09

like thousands and thousands of responses. Yeah,

28:12

all that is is like people

28:14

sharing stories and fostering

28:17

like this kind of

28:19

strange sense of connection and with

28:23

other humans and what I love about it and

28:25

what I find so strikingly different around between that

28:27

and like kind of the

28:29

the connection that forms on

28:32

other social media platforms namely Instagram

28:34

and TikTok which is

28:36

like the parasocial one that exists between like

28:38

content creator and consumer of

28:41

content is like reddit is literally

28:43

a place where people it like an egalitarian

28:45

platform where people are sharing

28:47

their stories with each other and

28:51

there isn't it isn't like centered

28:53

around one person one creator one

28:55

influencer and I think it's like

28:57

it's kind of giving campfire. It's giving everyone

29:00

around in a circle holding hands talking

29:03

about sometimes their darkest secrets

29:06

and there's I think that is like

29:08

there's inherent goodness in that. Yes,

29:11

and that also makes me think

29:13

of the fact like the way that you describe

29:15

the community it's like everyone's telling stories around a

29:17

campfire. It also makes me

29:19

think of like the fact that people

29:22

bring stories from other platforms. They bring

29:24

stories from Twitter they bring stories from

29:26

TikTok they bring stories from Instagram and

29:28

there isn't this there is not like

29:30

an us versus them mentality on reddit

29:33

against other social media platforms. Right.

29:35

It's not like people like where

29:37

reddit like with the same pride

29:40

of like reels versus TikTok you know,

29:42

yeah, like there is like a

29:44

culture around comparing Instagram to TikTok and being

29:46

like, oh this one's better this one's for

29:48

Gen Z this one's for millennial where reddit.

29:51

It's all generations. Yep, and all people

29:54

jumping into the campfire to tell

29:56

their stories whether they be truthful.

29:58

True and I remember I have

30:01

two things today. One of them is that I remember I

30:04

had a very impactful experience on Reddit that actually

30:06

kind of did change my life, not to

30:08

be dramatic, but it was

30:11

an Ask Reddit thread and the question was

30:14

what was the best piece of advice someone's ever given to you

30:16

or what is the best piece of

30:20

advice you would give to your 20-year-old self.

30:26

Someone's advice, and I'm paraphrasing here,

30:28

was it's never too late.

30:31

You're never too far in a relationship

30:33

to break up. You're

30:35

never too far down the line in a

30:38

career to switch career paths. There

30:40

was other examples, but you can always, you

30:43

can still change your mind. Because,

30:47

let's be honest, I think once you start getting

30:49

married and having kids, yeah, you can

30:51

change your mind, but it's going to be tough. Getting

30:54

a divorce with children, I

30:57

cannot imagine. No, yeah. But

31:00

I think people, I know friends

31:02

who they've been in

31:04

the same relationship for their entire 20s,

31:06

maybe they met their partner in college,

31:09

and they definitely have, maybe they're not

31:11

totally happy and there's a version of

31:13

them out there that could be

31:15

happier, but they have this sunk cost mentality

31:17

where they're like, it's

31:20

been nine years, so might as well make it a 10th and then

31:22

might as well get married. And I

31:24

think that whether that be a relationship or whether

31:26

that be a career, it's totally a thing where

31:29

even when we're so, so young, in

31:31

your 20s, you're so young. In your 30s,

31:33

you're still so young, but you still are

31:35

like, well, I'm old now because I'm not

31:37

12 years old, suddenly

31:39

I'm old. Anyway, this is a

31:42

tangent, but basically I saw this piece of advice

31:44

and it's something you know, but then when you

31:46

see it written down, you're like, whoa, that's really

31:48

real. And I was at this kind of like, you

31:51

know, very much like a pivot point

31:53

in my life. I had to like

31:55

really do some navel gazing about what

31:58

I was leaving behind and whether I actually

32:00

wanted to return to exactly that and

32:03

I kept thinking about that. And then I

32:05

ultimately did decide to make

32:07

some pretty major changes to

32:09

my life. And that was a good thing that

32:11

came from, like that is like incredible that I

32:14

read something from a stranger and it's like, wow,

32:16

it radically changed my life. Yeah,

32:18

I like that you mentioned that you read

32:20

it and it was like literally, not that

32:22

you literally read it. I read it. You

32:25

read it on Reddit and it's giving Bible.

32:28

It's giving, it's just like. You

32:30

kind of have to see the words written on paper to

32:32

believe them. Yeah, you need the ink. Yeah,

32:35

you need the ink to be

32:38

painted onto your heartstrings. Yeah.

32:41

And that's so important. I do think

32:44

that's like almost like a spiritual thing

32:46

about Reddit in a non-red flag way,

32:48

in a way that you can read

32:50

something and then you can process it

32:53

throughout time and

32:55

then come back to that thought later. And then to

32:57

your point of like, it's never too late to

33:00

break up with someone or there are

33:02

people who kind of just stay in

33:04

relationships for a long time because it's

33:06

easier. That's why I've

33:09

never dated anyone. They're like,

33:11

it's not gonna die alone.

33:13

That's actually why I'm single because I

33:15

don't wanna get caught. Yeah, for sure,

33:17

it's real. That's a real fear though.

33:21

That's my commitment, phobia. Yeah, I

33:23

do wanna say though, that there

33:26

is like again, like championing Reddit

33:28

here. There is like

33:30

that piece of advice, it's never too late. Kind of

33:32

a, like we've heard it before,

33:34

like it's not like the most like unique, original

33:37

profound piece of advice, but like I said, it

33:39

did have a profound effect on me. And

33:41

I think one of the

33:44

reasons for its profundity, profundity.

33:46

Profundity. Profundity. Is

33:48

that a real word? Yes, I don't know

33:50

if I pronounced it correctly, but yes. Oh. Profundity.

33:53

Profundity? It

33:55

doesn't have an S in it, does it? No, no, no,

33:57

no, it is profundity. is

34:00

because I think there's something

34:02

really powerful, like

34:06

what you were talking about earlier about

34:08

Reddit enabling sub-Reddit. So there was all

34:10

sorts of pieces of advice given

34:13

on this one Ask Reddit thread, which was what's the

34:15

best piece of advice you've ever, you'd give to your

34:18

20 year old self. But

34:20

then the one that really impacted

34:22

me had a whole chain of

34:24

people commenting under that, either sharing

34:27

anecdotes of how they did make

34:29

these radical changes in their 20s and

34:31

they were so grateful for it, or people who were like, I

34:34

wish I had heeded this advice when I was

34:36

that age because it really

34:39

bit me in the butt. And

34:42

that is such a different experience

34:45

as a reader, than for

34:48

example reading that advice from

34:50

someone's self-help book, which might

34:52

be a super smart, wise

34:54

self-help book. But I

34:57

don't know, when you're reading about real people's experiences

35:00

who are not, they're also, no one's profiting

35:02

off of sharing this advice. People

35:05

are saying this because they feel so compelled

35:07

to share it that they really think it

35:09

matters. Yeah. Whereas

35:11

an author, a psychologist author who's giving

35:13

you advice, it's like, okay, you wrote a book and

35:15

it has great advice, but you're also making money from me buying

35:17

it and reading it. I don't know, there's

35:20

some sort of falsehood. There's more, I

35:22

feel, biased or personal interest involved in

35:24

the consumerist culture of giving

35:27

advice on platforms outside of Reddit.

35:29

Yeah. Yeah. So

35:31

I think Reddit is very unique and special

35:33

in that way, where it's like people are

35:36

speaking up just for this because they believe

35:38

what they have to say is like important,

35:40

not because they're clout chasing, not because they're

35:42

making money from it, just because they're like,

35:45

I want other people to know

35:47

this. Yeah. And

35:49

I don't wanna harp too much on the

35:51

point of like literally reading, but you mentioned

35:53

it again and how like it's up to

35:55

you to interpret those words like

35:57

in a non-biased way. And I think that you're

35:59

able to. to do that more

36:01

when you read something, when

36:04

it doesn't have a face to it. Of

36:06

course there are people on TikTok or Instagram

36:08

or even Twitter who are giving advice and

36:10

who are telling stories with advice attached to

36:13

it but let's see I see a video

36:15

of a girl telling me like, oh I

36:17

wish I would have done this in my

36:19

20s. I'm a human and

36:22

so I'm gonna watch that video and

36:24

I'm gonna judge it based off of

36:26

her looks, her voice, her tone, her

36:28

delivery and that's going to like alter

36:30

my perception of the advice given and

36:33

so I do think that that's like

36:35

a really precious thing about Reddit that

36:38

like it's up to interpretation. Right. That

36:40

kind of like again Bible, Constitution

36:42

vibes you know. Yeah,

36:45

yeah. Giving up to interpretation. Yeah

36:47

like you receive what how you internalize

36:50

things from Reddit is like much purer

36:53

than yeah how you

36:55

would receive like maybe the same piece of

36:57

advice on Instagram. The other thing that I

36:59

was gonna say is I know I was

37:01

like poo-pooing the like it's or the

37:03

the snark influencer snark pages

37:05

on on Reddit

37:08

but this is this is really for me to show

37:10

if anyone's a snarker I'm about to show you

37:12

how enlightened I am. If you're

37:15

on these Instagram snark pages honestly

37:17

I think there's value in those

37:19

too even though it's people just

37:21

spreading hate and vitriol against strangers

37:23

that they don't know. It's

37:25

offering who the users

37:27

of you know the snarkers on those

37:29

reddit some sense of

37:32

community which clearly they desperately

37:35

need. They desperately need

37:37

some sense of

37:40

people who are like

37:42

minded and whether that that thing

37:44

that's bonding them is hate or

37:47

not. I don't know maybe

37:49

that's not important. If it's giving people comfort I don't

37:51

know this is like a little bit of a utilitarian

37:53

perspective of it for them

37:55

as long as like the people who's snark

37:57

who they're snarking never read it like Like

38:00

if it's giving you some sense of

38:03

comfort and being okay, then that's creating

38:05

utils. And that's

38:07

good, you know, whatever. Yeah, and it also

38:09

gives people a voice because I mean like

38:11

even it's kind of like a dumb example

38:13

but it's kind of like I

38:15

do watch like Bachelor in Paradise and sometimes

38:18

when I watch it alone, I'll go on

38:20

Twitter to like tweet my thoughts because I

38:23

want to have a voice. I

38:25

have an opinion. I'm watching something and I'm having like

38:27

an immediate reaction and I want to put it out

38:29

there and so you're right, even the

38:31

threads that aren't necessarily

38:33

like net positive have

38:36

some sort of like community element to them. Yeah,

38:39

yeah. And I'm like all about community.

38:41

So however you can find it. I

38:44

will say though to push back on that a

38:46

little bit. I'm gonna

38:48

push. Is that

38:50

when people when

38:53

people stop prioritizing having community

38:56

outside of the internet, like

38:58

making real life friends, you

39:00

can have real life discussions

39:02

with about your thoughts and

39:04

about culture or social

39:06

media or influencers or the news.

39:10

That is when it can be

39:12

a little concerning because then they're

39:14

only talking to people online and

39:17

the same way that it's great that texts

39:20

and written words are up to

39:22

interpretation. It can also be

39:24

a bad thing because someone might be writing

39:27

a response that they think is

39:29

like neutral and then you might read it as

39:31

an attack. Totally. Yeah.

39:34

I feel like conversations

39:36

online or take either

39:38

the form of like you exist in a

39:40

bubble and you're just being people are just agreeing with

39:42

you or you're in

39:45

like a vicious fight with someone. And

39:47

that is not like that's

39:49

not what debates

39:52

and disagreements and conversations in

39:54

real life are like. And

39:56

so if you're only having

39:58

those sort of. like disagreements

40:00

or discussions online, then you're really

40:03

losing touch with reality. Yeah.

40:05

And it reminds me a little, like obviously

40:08

it's very different, but this conversation

40:10

reminds me a little bit of like the

40:12

cult of Peloton in that there is this

40:14

online community and you can like high five

40:16

people and like you can avoid going to

40:18

a gym for the rest of your life

40:20

and making friends, but that's

40:23

fine. It's all fine and dandy. If

40:25

you are online a lot, I just

40:27

think like, again, it's just

40:30

important to keep yourself in check and make

40:32

sure like, Oh, I still have friends IRL.

40:35

Okay. This is like fascinating because I

40:37

also think the opposite of someone

40:39

who's like a Luddite who rejects all

40:42

social media and kind of like shits

40:44

on social media and shits on any

40:46

of the, all of these platforms. Like

40:48

sometimes I think that like, I feel

40:50

like those people are like revered

40:52

as these like super socially healthy

40:55

people who have like, we're completely

40:57

tapped out of this, like the

40:59

digital landscape. And part

41:01

of me is like, I don't think that's

41:04

healthy either because social media is whether we

41:06

like it or not part of the fabric

41:08

of our society and these like online discussions,

41:10

online debates, like it's, it's

41:12

literally like to be like almost

41:16

like culturally literate. You have to have

41:18

like some knowledge of what's going on

41:20

over here. What's maybe not necessarily what's

41:22

going on on Reddit. I'm walking here.

41:26

Yeah. But like you, you like,

41:28

I don't know when someone's like, Oh, I don't,

41:30

I don't, I don't use Instagram. Like I've never

41:32

ever seen Instagram. I've never seen TikTok. I'm like,

41:34

grow up. Yeah. It's

41:36

like, okay, well then you like don't really know

41:38

what's going on because like, and

41:41

that's why they are happy because

41:43

ignorance is bliss, but also ignorance

41:46

is ignorance, babe. Yeah,

41:48

you're ignorant. Yeah. Yeah.

41:50

And you stay ignorant. So yeah, I think there are

41:53

positives of online communities, but there are also negatives

41:55

of online community. So we've talked about

41:57

like all these scenarios and I want

41:59

to bring up the worst case. scenario

42:01

where a Reddit discussion and a Reddit

42:03

thread kind of manifested itself in real

42:05

life outside of Reddit. Um,

42:07

so I wanted to talk about

42:10

the January 6th insurrection because that

42:12

was actually an idea that was

42:14

partially planned on Reddit, according to

42:16

a Washington post article written by

42:19

Craig Timbers and Tom Hamburg, Trump

42:21

and his supporters used social media

42:23

sites to spread falsehoods about the

42:25

validity of Joe Biden's victory over

42:28

Trump in 2020. And

42:30

many posts in those threads called

42:32

for extraordinary action, including violence and

42:35

in some cases to prevent Biden

42:37

from ascending to the White House.

42:39

And on January 6th, Congress was

42:41

meeting to certify the election results.

42:44

And as you probably know, hundreds

42:46

of Trump supporters bashed their way

42:48

physically, aggressively and violently

42:51

into Congress, the building

42:53

as a part of clashes that

42:55

left five people dead. Um,

42:57

and it is wild that

43:00

that really happened, but Congress has been

43:02

trying to hold social media companies accountable

43:04

and no social media company has provided

43:06

full accounts of its role in spreading

43:08

these falsehoods. But because

43:10

they haven't really been

43:13

open to helping Congress solve

43:15

where these riots came from the

43:18

January 6th committee subpoenaed tech giants,

43:21

including Reddit, Twitter, and Facebook to

43:23

hand over information that could help

43:25

them in their investigations. So

43:29

that's kind of a worst case

43:31

scenario. Right. Right. Uh,

43:34

five people dead, literal coup,

43:37

what the fuck? Yeah. That's

43:39

like as pretty much as bad as it gets.

43:42

Do you think that Reddit was a leader

43:44

in this? Do you think it was kind

43:46

of played a cult leader role or do

43:48

you think that this could have

43:50

happened with or without Reddit?

43:53

I don't think it could have happened

43:55

at the scale and therefore like the,

43:57

what actually happened, like the old, the

43:59

reason why. why so much violence occurred

44:01

and why five people died was because

44:03

it was like the amount

44:05

of people that came to

44:07

the January 6th insurrection. It

44:10

was enough people that could like storm the

44:12

Capitol and actually enter the building. But

44:15

you know, I think everyone who found these

44:17

Reddit threads, they had these

44:19

beliefs prior. I

44:21

think I would wager that they sought

44:23

out the community that aligned

44:26

with beliefs that they already had. I

44:29

don't think Reddit was the reason they

44:31

believed that Biden's presidency

44:35

was fraudulent. Yeah,

44:37

it's almost like they were already and we see

44:39

this a lot with cults. It's like people who

44:42

are susceptible to one cult are susceptible to other

44:44

cults. But it's like they

44:46

were already in the cult of Donald Trump. So

44:49

what was to prevent them from

44:51

joining another like subcultural cult of

44:53

that cult? It was just like

44:55

the next level of ascendance for

44:57

their Trump cult. Right,

45:00

right. Okay, I do have one

45:02

more question for you before we wrap up. And

45:04

that is, do you think the cult of

45:06

Reddit is a live your life, a

45:09

watch your back or

45:13

a get the fuck out level cult? Probably

45:19

watch your back. Like

45:22

if you find yourself returning daily

45:25

to a Reddit thread, I

45:28

think you should ponder

45:30

that and figure out like what

45:32

it is you're actually seeking. And

45:37

get a life and

45:40

fucking stop being a loser. Yeah,

45:43

just kidding. Just kidding. No, but like,

45:45

yeah, I don't know. It's like you

45:47

got to think about why you're going

45:49

there and why you're you're you're snarking

45:53

and like what why why you're doing that. And I think that

45:55

could be true for so many different Reddit threads.

45:57

But yeah, just think about it. Give

46:00

it a good navel gaze. Talk to your therapist

46:02

about it. Yeah friend. Literally. I think if you're

46:04

not I don't know. Maybe this is a reach

46:06

but like I Feel

46:09

like if you are not comfortable

46:13

having Like the

46:15

things you're looking for the conversations

46:19

that you're looking for on reddit if you're if

46:21

there's no one in your real life That

46:24

you're not comfortable having that conversation with if

46:26

there's not one person in your real

46:28

life That you would be

46:30

comfortable having that exact conversation with and saying

46:32

that exact thing with I

46:35

think that's an issue I don't know. Do

46:37

you yeah, I mean like there I would agree.

46:39

Yeah, like like yeah There's just

46:41

if you if this is the only place

46:43

you feel like seen on this specific subject

46:46

matter. I think then There's

46:49

something maybe wrong Yeah,

46:52

and I actually think that there's made something

46:54

wrong in like a not an insulting way Like

46:56

we're not saying like you're a bad person We're

46:58

just saying like maybe see what

47:00

steps you can take outside of the internet

47:02

to find that community in person Because

47:04

it is so important as a

47:06

human being to have that right right and if

47:09

you find like like an example I can think

47:11

of that makes me feel like really bad

47:14

for people is like LGBTQ youth You

47:16

know right like they who don't feel

47:18

comfortable coming out to their family and

47:20

who don't feel like they can talk

47:22

to anyone in their Lives about it

47:24

seek this community online and I think

47:26

that's a perfect and valid

47:29

Community and stepping stone to have

47:31

those conversations But you can't

47:33

live the rest of your life not having anyone

47:36

in person who you can confide in

47:38

Totally so, you know safely and cautiously

47:40

however, it works for you take those

47:42

steps to find that community in person

47:45

Whether that's like an after-school club or

47:47

whether that is like reaching out

47:49

to someone in a safe way to see like

47:52

Oh, maybe it's another kid in my school feels this

47:54

way or another person and at my job feels this

47:56

way, you know Yeah, it this

47:58

like is a little bit of a

48:00

reach but I my coach in college used

48:03

to say and I think this

48:05

is maybe like a Buddhist thing

48:07

but true happiness is when what

48:10

you think what you say and what

48:12

you do are all in alignment and

48:15

I think about that often and with

48:17

like reddit like this

48:19

example you're using about like LGBTQ

48:21

youth like that that is

48:24

maybe the if they're you know about

48:26

you know on the thinking about coming

48:28

out what they're thinking

48:31

and what they're saying on the

48:33

internet maybe like

48:35

aligned but what they're doing

48:37

is not quite there yet and that's okay because it's

48:40

like a long journey and it's like you have to

48:42

be gentle with yourself but like yeah

48:46

like I guess like you maybe would I don't know if

48:48

this is like maybe I'm gonna cancel for this but

48:50

like you haven't achieved full happiness yet

48:52

because what if yeah in your real

48:55

life what you're doing isn't aligned with

48:57

those two things then like yeah and

49:00

I feel like you probably mean like it's not that

49:02

you're you're not incapable of happiness but you will

49:04

be a lot happier

49:06

totally once you are

49:09

true to yourself and it's okay that it

49:11

takes time but I urge

49:14

everyone to like take steps towards that yeah

49:16

totally yeah well

49:19

you heard it here first folks reddit

49:22

is a hard hard watch

49:24

your back yeah you agree yeah

49:26

100% yeah I think it's

49:29

very good for community I think it's

49:31

very good for just fostering discussion allowing

49:33

people to express their opinions but I

49:35

think like a lot of

49:38

internet culture it's really important to not

49:40

let your get yourself get sucked up

49:42

into it yeah too long and too

49:45

hard mm-hmm and

49:47

I feel like this conversation

49:49

was really like reflective

49:51

of like a lot of the things

49:54

that we're gonna talk about on our

49:56

new podcast yes I

49:58

know and I'm so excited Yeah,

50:00

I am too. Is there anything you want to

50:02

like tell the listeners about the new podcast or

50:04

about yourself? Um...

50:07

Like where can our listeners like find and

50:09

follow your cult? Yeah, well people who listen

50:12

to Sounds Like a Cult. My

50:14

name is Lydia. I'm a content

50:16

creator on mostly TikTok and Instagram.

50:19

My content like has taken so many

50:21

different iterations, but I would say mainly

50:24

I'm a kind of like

50:26

recreational running content creator. And that's what

50:28

a lot of people know me for.

50:31

I also do a little bit of food content, but

50:34

um... Yeah, I just moved

50:36

to New York and I'm just out

50:39

here. Yeah, that's what I'm doing. I'm

50:41

moving to New York. And I know

50:43

I used to stand up in the early, early

50:46

days when I used to

50:48

live in LA. And um...

50:51

Yeah, so I guess sometimes I'm

50:53

like still a little bit funny on the internet, but not in

50:55

a normal way. I think you're hilarious and so smart.

50:57

And I think Lydia is like a very

51:00

humble person. She literally, I just have to

51:02

say it, she went to Yale. Oh, that's

51:04

kind. She went to Yale. She

51:07

rode in college athletic and she also

51:09

got her MFA in writing. So we

51:11

have a smarty pants on our hands

51:13

and I'm just so excited to like

51:15

start this new podcast where we

51:18

can banter and be funny and

51:20

also informational and do

51:22

it week after week. Yeah, yeah,

51:24

I always say that I feel

51:27

like I, there's like, there's

51:30

obviously many brands of humor, but

51:32

I think there's like two big

51:34

categories and one is cynical humor

51:36

and the other is earnest humor.

51:39

And I feel I'm like often like,

51:41

like compelled by cynical humor. Like when

51:43

a man is like cynical

51:46

and funny, whoo, like I like

51:48

fall in love. But ultimately I

51:50

think that humor, it

51:53

reaches a dead end after a little bit. There's like

51:55

only so many times you can like make fun of like

51:57

our of someone before it gets kind of, I have a

51:59

point here. that I'm gonna make, by the way. But

52:01

like there's only, yeah, there is a point that I'm

52:03

about to make. Anyway, I feel

52:06

like both of us, like

52:08

I just feel like we are both very

52:11

earnest, but then also, and this is me

52:13

like kind of pumping my own tire here,

52:15

but I'm like mainly trying to give you

52:18

a compliment, but like also very funny. And

52:20

that ultimately I feel like comedy, the

52:23

point of it is like to get at a deep

52:26

truth. And when

52:28

you're earnest and you can still be

52:30

funny and you can still laugh, like

52:32

that is like the language that needs

52:34

to be used to get it like

52:36

the truest of truths. And

52:39

this is the thing guys, for those of

52:41

you listening, that's what we're gonna be

52:43

doing on our new podcast. We're gonna be earnest,

52:45

we're gonna be funny, and we're gonna be exposing

52:47

the truths of this world. Yes,

52:50

we are. And

52:54

I'm so excited to do that with you

52:56

in New York, but we're

52:58

also gonna have so many truths to tell. We

53:00

will, yeah, and we'll, oh sorry, go on. No,

53:03

you go on. Well, just that. The whole podcast is

53:05

just not being like, no, you go. You go. Nope,

53:08

go ahead. Just

53:10

that, I think like we're gonna

53:12

also be getting to these truths

53:14

with fun guests as well. Yes,

53:16

with fun guests who are gonna

53:18

be experts and they're gonna

53:21

be comedians and they're just gonna be people

53:23

with experiences on the different topics that we're

53:25

gonna cover every week. Yes, it's

53:27

gonna be great. Well,

53:29

that's our show. Thanks so much

53:31

for listening. We'll be back with a new episode

53:34

next week. But in the

53:36

meantime, stay culty, but not

53:38

too culty. ["Amena

53:44

Montal." by Casey Kolb and Isamadina.

53:52

Our theme music is

53:54

by Casey Kolb and

53:56

I'm on Instagram at

53:58

Isamadina. I-S-A-A-M-E-D-I-N-A-N-A-N-E-N-E. or you can find me

54:01

on my website, isacomedy.com, I-S-A comedy.com, where

54:03

you can tell me where to perform

54:05

standup or find information on my new

54:08

podcast that I'm launching in 2024.