0:01

Due. To the nature of this

0:03

case, listener discretion is advised.

0:05

This episode includes discussions of

0:07

incest, murder, kidnapping, sexual abuse

0:09

of minors, and substance use.

0:11

Consider this when deciding how

0:13

and when you'll listen. Imagine.

0:21

You're driving to work. in the morning,

0:23

you've got your coffee, the sun's shining,

0:25

your favorite music playing, and they're barely

0:28

any cars on the road. Then you

0:30

pull up to a red light. There's

0:32

a beige Ford station wagon in front of

0:35

you. It looks a little worse for wear,

0:37

but there's nothing out of the ordinary about

0:39

it. Until. You notice

0:41

movement in the back seat. Before

0:43

you can process what's happening, you're

0:45

staring at the faces of two

0:48

young girls not yet teenagers bound

0:50

and gagged. Their eyes are racked

0:52

with fear. You fumble to find

0:54

a piece of paper and jot

0:56

down the license plate. But the

0:59

girls muted screams draw the attention

1:01

of the man in the driver's

1:03

seat. Your eyes meet in the

1:05

rear view. He sees you and

1:07

runs the red light, speeding away.

1:10

All. You're left with his appeared

1:12

your stomach and a partial plate

1:14

d M T six. He didn't

1:16

even catch what state it was

1:18

from. You don't know it

1:20

yet, but you just became one of

1:23

the only witnesses to a crime that

1:25

will take more than. Four decades

1:27

to solve. This

1:30

is the story of the

1:32

lie and sisters. I'm

1:34

Vanessa Richardson and this is Serial Killers.

1:37

A Spot of I podcast. You can

1:39

find us here every Monday. Be sure

1:41

to check us out on Instagram. add

1:43

Serial Killers Podcast. We'd love to hear

1:45

from you if you're listening on the

1:48

spot. if I app swipe up and

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deposits for two days early depends on thousand of

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us mission of the pay me fall from bear.

3:33

Amongst the many sources we used. We.

3:35

Sound A book, The Last Stone

3:38

by Mark Bow Them as well

3:40

as the documentary who Killed The

3:42

Lion Sisters. Extremely helpful. To. Our

3:44

research. This

3:49

case gets complicated. It. Spans

3:51

decades and travels across state

3:53

lines into isolated communities. we

3:56

still don't know how many

3:58

people. Were involved. How many

4:00

killers there were? How many

4:02

more victims they might have

4:05

had? But as a story,

4:07

it starts out small, simple,

4:09

even in the suburbs of

4:11

Maryland. in a town called

4:13

Kensington. Believe. It or

4:15

not, I called that tiny town home

4:18

for sixteen years. It was small, it

4:20

was safe, and it was not at

4:22

all the place. You expect a

4:24

story like this to happen? Let.

4:27

Me Take you back to March Nineteen

4:30

Seventy Five. Kate. And

4:32

Sheila Lion our sisters Kate's ten,

4:34

Sheila's twelve And since they're on

4:36

school break, they decide to spend

4:38

the afternoon at the local mall.

4:40

Their mom, Mary's letting them go

4:42

on their own unsupervised. They may

4:44

be young, but it's a test

4:46

of sorts can see. Trust them

4:48

to behave and be home for

4:50

dinner by four pm. Time.

4:53

Will tell. Qaeda. And

4:55

leave the house sometime around eleven

4:57

am with the whole afternoon ahead.

4:59

Of them do. Looking forward to

5:02

seeing these two decorations. And grabbing a

5:04

slice of pizza for lunch. Since.

5:06

The mall is the place to be

5:08

for kids of all ages Qaeda and

5:11

she'll His older brother J also ends

5:13

up there with his own friends. He

5:15

sees his sister's around two pm but

5:17

he doesn't say hi. He assumes hill

5:20

see them at dinner. But

5:23

cheat and sheila never make it

5:25

home. A family

5:27

friend sees the girls walking away

5:29

from the mall sometime between two

5:32

thirty. And three o'clock presumably on

5:34

their way home. And no one

5:36

knows what. Happens to them

5:38

after that. The. Girls: four.

5:41

O'clock curfew comes and goes with

5:43

no sign of them at first

5:45

their parents Mary and John Lion

5:47

are worried they got their daughters

5:49

schedules wrong with. For active kids,

5:52

it's hard to keep everything straight.

5:54

Maybe Qaeda and Sheila had a

5:56

sleep. Over they forgot about or

5:58

some extra curricular active. The. But.

6:01

By the time night falls,

6:03

panic sets is. Marion

6:05

John start placing phone calls

6:07

driving. The streets and knocking on.

6:09

Doors. As. I said

6:12

Kensington is considered safe. It's a

6:14

small town with only about twenty

6:16

thousand residents. The girls couldn't have

6:18

gotten. Far on their own, but

6:20

by eight pm, the Lion Sisters

6:23

still. Hadn't been found. Marion

6:25

John report their daughters. As

6:27

missing to police. The. Next

6:29

day posters of Qaeda and She'll

6:31

are hung around town. The.

6:34

Two Sisters looks strikingly similar. They

6:36

both have blond hair, blue eyes,

6:39

but it's size to Sheila slightly

6:41

taller and where's wire framed glasses?

6:43

She was last seen wearing a

6:46

navy blue sweatshirt and corduroy pants

6:48

with a slight care running down

6:50

one leg. Kate had

6:52

on a floral t shirt, dell bottom

6:55

jeans, a bright. Red Jacket and

6:57

a beaded necklace. With her name on

6:59

it. Authorities do everything

7:01

they can to try and

7:04

find them. Scuba divers to

7:06

read lakes, the National Guard

7:09

scours the forest, volunteers trudged

7:11

through storm sewers and search

7:13

vacant lots. Their efforts ultimately.

7:16

Amount to one of the

7:18

largest missing person investigations ever.

7:20

Performed in the Dc area. But.

7:23

The lions sisters are never

7:25

found. They're missing

7:28

person posters wither and yellow

7:30

with time. As investigators wade

7:32

through a sea of witness

7:34

statements, Anonymous tips and leads.

7:36

Most are dead. Ends: Ransom

7:39

Scams Psychics Fall sightings, the

7:41

scattered thoughts of lonely people

7:43

calling. Just talk. Only a

7:45

few pieces of information stand

7:47

out as promising. Like how

7:50

on the day Cheat and

7:52

Sheila disappeared, a witness reported

7:54

they saw a teenage boy

7:56

following. Girls through the mall. They

7:59

said he was. The Bible: Levin a

8:01

hundred and forty pounds long, dark

8:04

brown hair, a moustache, and had

8:06

a distinct. Is acne scar

8:08

on his left cheek. an

8:10

artist. Marks up a sketch in the

8:12

Police Added. To their case files. But.

8:15

They're ultimately more focused on another

8:17

person of interest. And. Individual who

8:19

would come to be known as. Tape.

8:22

Recorder Man. Multiple

8:24

witnesses saw a man with salt

8:26

and pepper hair interviewing children at

8:28

the mall that day. The man

8:31

had a briefcase and a microphone

8:33

attached to a tape recorder. He

8:35

apparently told his subjects he planned

8:37

to put them on. The Radio.

8:40

Police never learn the identity of

8:42

tape recorder mans, but they come

8:44

suspect it may. Be a man

8:46

who's made their short list

8:48

of potential suspects: A convicted

8:51

petty criminal named Raymond Molests

8:53

key senior. Mullah. Ski

8:55

bears a striking resemblance to the

8:57

physical descriptions of tape recorder man.

8:59

Detectives can place him a block or

9:02

two away from the Lion family

9:04

house. A week or two before the

9:06

girls were abducted. Not to

9:08

mention shortly after Qaeda and She'll

9:10

his disappearance. he contacts authorities on

9:13

two different occasions, ones to tell

9:15

them that they may want to

9:17

offer immunity to the person who

9:19

kidnapped Qaeda and Sheila, then again

9:21

to claim. He saw tape recorder

9:24

mans and another mall trying to

9:26

lure children into a car. But

9:29

he doesn't provide authorities with any details

9:31

that hadn't already. Been widely

9:33

publicized. The. Strange self

9:35

insertions draw suspicion, but investigators can't

9:38

pursue molest either way they'd like

9:40

to. They don't have any hard

9:42

evidence to suggest he was. Actually

9:45

involved or even it confirms you was

9:47

at the mall that day. The.

9:49

Girls were just there one

9:51

moment and gone the next.

9:53

No witnesses remember to struggle

9:55

and no one heard any

9:57

screens. And now

9:59

weeks. After going missing they. Could

10:01

be anywhere even. Miles away

10:04

in another state. Thirteen.

10:08

Days after, the lion Sisters disappear

10:10

a. Man living forty miles

10:12

away in Manassas, Virginia calls

10:15

police with. A story around.

10:17

Seven thirty that morning. He stopped

10:19

at a red light behind a

10:21

beige. Ford Station Wagon. In the

10:23

back of the car he saw

10:26

what looked like to blonde girls

10:28

around she and keeps age and

10:30

they appeared to be bound and

10:33

gagged. He tried to. Jot down

10:35

the license plate. but before he could

10:37

finish, the driver drove through the red

10:39

light and sped away. He couldn't remember

10:41

what state it was. The.

10:43

Man provides police with a partial.

10:46

Plate but when authorities run it through

10:48

their system. They don't find

10:50

a match. It's another

10:52

dead end and eventually the case

10:54

goes. Cold. Even as

10:57

suspicion around. Raymond Molest

10:59

T deepens. Two.

11:02

Years after the Lion Sisters disappear.

11:04

Molest. He shoots and kills his

11:06

wife and seventeen year old son.

11:08

According to Molest, he he and

11:10

his wife had gotten into a

11:12

fight over the use of their

11:14

car, but detective suspect there may

11:16

have been another. Motive for the killings:

11:19

On. The night of the double

11:21

homicide, authorities found a slip of

11:24

paper on Molest Keys Weiss bedside

11:26

table and it had John Lyons

11:28

phone number on it. They wonder

11:30

if maybe molest his wife and

11:32

son were about to reveal that

11:35

he had a hand and Qaeda

11:37

and she'll his disappearance and he

11:39

killed them before they could. Either

11:42

way, if molests Key also killed

11:44

the lion sisters. Detectives.

11:46

Have a serial killer on their hands.

11:51

According to the books, The Last

11:53

Stone by Mark Bout and police

11:55

interview multiple witnesses who claim Muskie

11:58

was known to quote. Gabi

12:00

young boys and girls. Four sacks

12:02

male and female survivors

12:05

come forward and testimony

12:07

one. Says molest. He would throw

12:09

sex parties at his home with

12:11

groups of pedophiles. They would apparently

12:13

swapped child. Pornography and groom

12:15

and share victims. Adding.

12:18

Fuel to the fire While in

12:20

prison molest he talks about to

12:22

my and sisters to other inmates

12:24

claiming. He knows where their

12:26

bodies are buried. The.

12:29

Comments: lead investigators. To excavate

12:31

his old back yard and basement

12:33

that the searches come up empty.

12:36

Without. A confession or more

12:38

evidence investigators can't time a

12:40

Key to Kate and Sheila.

12:43

Everything they have is to

12:45

circumstantial. And. So the

12:47

disappearance. Of the Lion Sisters

12:50

remains a prominent stain on

12:52

the Montgomery County Police departments

12:54

record the most notorious cold

12:57

case they have. Generation after

12:59

generation of detectives try their

13:01

hand and cracking it, but

13:04

progress. Real progress doesn't. Happen

13:06

for decades. By

13:09

two thousand and thirteen, it's been

13:12

thirty eight years since the Lion.

13:14

Sisters Disappeared. Detective Sergeant

13:16

Chris. Hallmark has spent a good

13:18

portion of his career. Obsessed with

13:21

their case. It's. Taken a toll

13:23

on his mental health. He. Knows

13:25

John and Mary Lion are in their

13:27

eighties now and they might not get

13:29

answers before they die. He's.

13:32

Convinced array molests, key abducted

13:34

Kate and Sheila and is

13:36

tried every angle possible. Ripped

13:38

out the old carpet in his basement

13:40

to inspect the concrete floor. Dug

13:42

up a plot of undeveloped land

13:45

molest. Beyond that, he never sound

13:47

the. Girls remains. And he

13:49

needs that kind of evidence at this

13:51

point, because a confession. Is

13:53

out of the question. Molest.

13:56

Skied died in prison in two

13:58

thousand and ten. One

14:02

night, Hombre decides he's ready to

14:04

give up. According to him, he's

14:06

come to terms with never knowing

14:08

what happened and he's confident a

14:11

lion family will understand his decision.

14:13

But then, as he's getting ready

14:15

to put all the case files

14:17

away, He stumbles upon

14:20

something new. He's. Familiar with

14:22

every single paper inside the twenty

14:24

boxes. Of the Lion Sisters case

14:27

files and yet use the six.

14:29

Page statement made by an

14:31

eyewitness back in Nineteen Seventy

14:33

Five. The keys never seen

14:35

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14:37

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system. In

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the summer of two thousand and

15:57

Thirteen, detective Chris Hum Rock finds

15:59

a six page witness statement an

16:01

Ally and Sisters case. Files. It

16:03

was made on April first,

16:05

Nineteen Seventy five about a

16:07

week after Qaeda and Sheila

16:09

went missing I an eighteen

16:11

year old named Lloyd B.

16:13

Welsh. Lloyd was a

16:15

seventh grade. Drop out a carnival worker

16:18

and addressed her. He showed up

16:20

to the Montgomery. County Police Department

16:22

Stoned. And said he wanted to

16:24

tell police what he witnessed that day

16:26

at the Wheaton Plaza Mall. This is

16:28

the story. He gave. Lloyd

16:32

was at the mall with his

16:34

wife. Hell, he saw two girls

16:36

who fit the Lion Sisters description

16:38

talking to a man with a

16:40

tape recorder. The man looked older.

16:42

His hair was graying around his

16:44

ears. He stood about six feet

16:46

tall, And war a brown suit with. A

16:48

white shirt and black tie. He had

16:50

a brief case with him. Okay,

16:53

none of this information was new to

16:55

police. Is it all appeared in the

16:57

papers except. For what bullied claimed

16:59

next city. Watch the two girls

17:01

leave the mall with tape. Recorder

17:03

Man and drive away. They got into

17:05

a read A Camaro with light seats.

17:08

The car had a dent on the

17:10

back bumper and one of its tail

17:12

lights was busted. Before.

17:14

Ending the interview void added

17:16

one final detail. She. Said

17:18

the man with a tape. Recorder walked with

17:21

a small limp. Back.

17:25

In Nineteen Seventy Five, police didn't

17:27

take Lloyd seriously. They had no

17:29

reason to. Be. Administered a

17:31

lie detector test that lloyd it

17:33

fails. And while polygraphs are now.

17:36

Considered less than reliable. Lead admitted

17:38

he made everything up after the

17:40

results came back and many of

17:42

his lies could easily. Be d

17:45

but. He. Said he was twenty

17:47

two years old and married when he

17:49

was actually. A team with a

17:51

girlfriend to police. Blade was

17:53

just one. Of many liars

17:56

inserting themselves. Into the case to

17:58

collect reward money. Con

18:00

man. As mark belt and road

18:02

in his book. The last Stone

18:05

Lloyd quote seemed stupid,

18:07

not suspicious. But. Investigators

18:09

working the case in Nineteen Seventy

18:12

Five missed an important connections you

18:14

remember. There was a witness who

18:16

saw a teenage boy following young

18:18

girls around the mall that day.

18:21

He had long hair, a moustache,

18:23

and acne scars. On his left

18:25

cheek. Detective. Harm

18:27

Rock pulls out the composite sketch

18:29

made in Nineteen Seventy Five and

18:31

compares it to a photo of

18:33

a young Lloyd. Li Welsh.

18:35

The similarities are self

18:38

evident, which means Lloyd.

18:40

Might have been a legitimate witness

18:42

to the Lion Sisters kidnapping after

18:44

all. Suddenly. That

18:46

nineteen Seventy Five testimony. Takes

18:48

on a whole new meaning. Detective

18:51

Hum Rock stares at some of

18:53

the final words. Lloyd told police

18:56

that tape recorder. Man walked with

18:58

a small limp. It

19:00

must have been molested years before

19:03

the Lion Sisters disappeared, molest he

19:05

was shot in a leg by

19:07

police during a home break. He

19:10

walked with a limp ever since.

19:15

Detective. Hum Rock brings his findings

19:17

to his colleagues. And he can

19:19

barely contain his excitement. It could

19:21

be the break they need to

19:24

sign leap in the abduction on

19:26

the list geek even posthumously. It

19:28

would be a victory. But first,

19:30

they need to track down Lloyd

19:32

Li Welsh and get some answers.

19:34

What really happened. At the mall that

19:37

day. The. Good news is

19:39

finding Lloyd doesn't prove difficult.

19:41

At fifty six years old,

19:43

he's created quite the paper

19:46

trail. His rap sheet is

19:48

filled with charges including drunk

19:50

driving, burglary, assault and battery,

19:52

and public drunkenness. He's now

19:54

serving time at a Delaware

19:57

prison for sexually assaulting a

19:59

to. Year old. After.

20:01

All these years it finally feels

20:04

like they're on to something. Detectives

20:06

pay Roy to visit in prison

20:08

and immediately their reassured there and

20:10

the right place. The first words

20:12

out of his mouse are. I.

20:15

Know why you're here. You're

20:17

here about those two missing

20:19

kids. The. Bad news

20:21

comes later. With. Microphones on

20:23

Investigators ask Lloyd a series

20:26

of questions. Now before we

20:28

get into detectives interviews. With

20:30

Lloyd and. There are many I have

20:32

to save. The way he responds reminds

20:34

me a lot of Ted Bundy's. Interviews

20:37

with journalist Stephen Me show

20:39

for those familiar their long

20:41

winded and evasive. Detectors

20:44

are hoping to get answers about

20:46

molested, but they don't want to

20:48

tip their hand right away so

20:50

they take things slow. They let

20:53

Lloyd talk about his relationships, his

20:55

kids, his abusive childhood. Aussi perpetuated

20:57

that cycle of abuse. At some

21:00

point, she talks about a man

21:02

who used to given rise to

21:04

his girlfriend's house. Detectives ask for

21:07

the man's name, thinking maybe it

21:09

was molested but void says he

21:11

doesn't remember. After a

21:13

break, detectives decide to place a

21:16

photo of re Molest Key in

21:18

front of Lloyd, and he immediately

21:20

reacts. That's the freaking guy

21:22

he says, referring to the man who

21:25

used to give him rise from time

21:27

to time, even after detectives provide more

21:29

information about why they're interested in molest.

21:31

he is history of sexual assault and

21:34

his possible link to the Lions Sisters

21:36

void insists that molest He was a

21:38

little theory, but that's it to him.

21:41

He was nothing more than a stranger

21:43

with a car. Eventually, detectives

21:45

ask if Lloyd remembers getting a

21:48

statement to police and Nineteen Seventy

21:50

Five. Lloyd tells them he

21:52

does. He remembers how authorities didn't

21:54

take him seriously. Then when asked

21:56

to repeat what he saw that

21:58

day. Lloyd tells the

22:01

following story. He

22:03

was miles away from the Wheat and

22:05

Plaza Mall near his girlfriend's house. It

22:08

was already dark outside and he

22:10

watched a man dressed in all

22:12

black in a black hats, shells

22:14

two young girls into the back

22:16

seat of a black car then

22:18

drive away Lloyd said and his

22:20

girlfriend's insistence. He called police almost

22:22

immediately and gave his statement. He

22:24

placed a call from a phone

22:26

booth and an officer. Came to meet

22:28

him. It

22:30

completely contradicts his original statement:

22:32

the locations difference, the cars

22:35

different, the timings difference. Not

22:37

to mention, investigators know Lloyd

22:39

didn't file a report. The

22:41

police until a week after the

22:43

line sisters. Went missing. Later.

22:46

When detectives finally present Lloyd

22:48

with his original statement, he

22:50

says he's legitimately doesn't remember

22:52

being at the mall or

22:54

giving that statement. He. Blames

22:57

all the drugs he did

22:59

back then. Lsd speed day

23:01

fried his brain. Detective.

23:04

Stress that they're focused on the less

23:06

d not Lloyd and they provide a

23:08

little more background on Molest Gates how

23:11

he used to give teenage. Boys drugs

23:13

in exchange for helping him lure

23:15

kids. Back to his house, they imply

23:17

that if that were true for Lloyd,

23:20

see was a victim in their. Eyes

23:22

not an accomplice. Still,

23:25

Void insists see wouldn't do

23:27

anything like that. The

23:30

interrogation ultimately last into the

23:32

evening. Lloyd. He contradicts himself

23:34

countless more times, but around

23:36

our eight, he tells detectives

23:38

what they want to hear.

23:40

that. yes, molest. He was

23:42

the man he saw take

23:44

those girls at the mall

23:46

in Nineteen Seventy Five, But

23:48

he maintains that Molests Key

23:50

never abused him. They barely

23:52

knew each other, and Lloyd

23:54

was certainly not involved in

23:56

any crimes. Before.

23:59

Wrapping up there, First interview detectives

24:01

ask Lloyd for his opinion.

24:03

What do you think? Ramiele.

24:05

Less key did those girls. They. Asked

24:07

Lloyd tells them see

24:10

sinks molest he raped,

24:12

killed and. Probably burned

24:15

down. The.

24:18

Answer immediately Raises red flags.

24:21

It's an unusually specific hypothetical.

24:23

Detectives return for another interview

24:25

in February two thousand and

24:27

Fourteen, and hook Lloyd up

24:30

to a polygraph. They

24:32

ask the obvious questions. Have

24:34

you ever lied to someone? You loved

24:36

or who trusted you? Did

24:39

you have anything to do with the lions? Sisters

24:41

Disappearance. Did you

24:43

do anything to cause the girls

24:46

disappearance in Nineteen Seventy Five? His

24:49

replies are all the same. No.

24:52

No. Of course not.

24:54

But after the results of

24:56

the polygraph indicate deception, Lloyd

24:58

panics and tells investigators there

25:00

is something he's been keeping

25:02

from them back in Nineteen

25:04

Seventy five, Raymer Less Key

25:06

wasn't to someone who gave

25:08

him rides from time to

25:10

time. He knew molests key

25:12

well. These. To get high

25:14

together pretty regularly and on one

25:17

occasion he saw something he. May

25:19

be shouldn't have. This

25:21

was after Kate and Sheila. Disappeared.

25:24

Lloyd went to molest his house molests

25:26

key and a bunch of other men

25:28

were there. Lloyd didn't know most of

25:31

their names at some points. Boy took

25:33

a set of stairs from the back

25:35

yard to the basement and that's where

25:37

he saw them. Seat. And

25:40

Sheila Lion were inside.

25:42

They were naked, drugged,

25:44

and not alone. There

25:46

were also two men.

25:48

they're sexually assaulting them

25:51

Void didn't recognize either.

25:53

One. He ran from the

25:55

house scared. that's why he eventually went

25:57

to the police and invented his a

25:59

rich. Statement he was hoping it

26:01

would help lead them there. Now.

26:06

If you're frustrated listening to Lloyds

26:08

ever changing stories, imagine being the

26:10

detectives interviewing him at a certain

26:13

point. they don't really know what

26:15

to think. Clearly. Lloyds

26:17

a liar but with some of

26:19

that is true. One of these

26:21

finally being honest. If he

26:24

is, that means there were other

26:26

guilty parties involved more than Lloyd

26:28

More. Than molested. So detective decide

26:31

to keep pressing on. They even

26:33

go public with some of the

26:35

information they have. Two months after

26:38

his polygraphs in March, two Thousand

26:40

and Fourteen Void finally provides detectives

26:42

with an explanation for his evasive

26:45

behavior. He basically says he's lied

26:47

so many times because he's afraid

26:50

of one of the men involved

26:52

in a Lion Sisters disappearance. and

26:54

he's not talking about Ramiele. Less

26:57

Key. In fact, really

26:59

does a one Avian molests key.

27:01

He now says he wasn't involved

27:04

at all. It was his

27:06

cousin, Teddy Wells who kidnapped the

27:08

girls and Teddy was working with

27:10

someone else, someone whose name conveniently.

27:13

Escapes Lloyd. Detectives.

27:16

Of course, or a skeptical of

27:18

this story as the others they

27:20

ultimately learn. Teddy Welsh was eleven

27:22

years. Old and nineteen seventy five.

27:24

He had. Not one, but two

27:26

broken arms at the time. Not

27:29

someone who could have orchestrated the

27:31

kidnapping of two girls. But even

27:33

though detectives. Don't trust Lloyd.

27:35

They decide to trust the process.

27:37

He clearly knows more than he's

27:40

letting on. And somewhere in all

27:42

the lies, He's weaving. They're hopeful

27:44

to find a real with should

27:46

admit to read they can pull

27:48

on. Then. In

27:50

July two thousand and fourteen

27:52

boy to miraculously remembers the

27:54

name of his cousin Teddy's

27:56

suppose it accomplice. it was

27:59

his uncle. He he says

28:01

a man who in nineteen seventy

28:03

five, worked as a security. Guard

28:05

near the Wheaton Plaza

28:07

Mall. Dickey was Teddy's

28:10

uncle to and Lloyd

28:12

implicates himself even further.

28:14

She. Says that on the day

28:16

Caden Sheila disappeared see got in

28:18

the car with his Uncle Dickey,

28:21

Teddy and the Lions sisters. After

28:23

leaving the mall void got out

28:25

of the car to get ice

28:27

cream and Uncle Dickey went to

28:29

last the girls in his basement.

28:32

Which mirrors the description Lloyd previously

28:34

gave us Ramiele Less Keys. Then

28:37

Lloyd supposes that after the

28:39

kidnappings his uncle Dick, he

28:41

might have driven Qaeda and

28:43

she'll us down to Virginia

28:45

where some relatives live near.

28:47

Taylor's Mountains presumably in

28:49

his car. A

28:52

beige board station wagon.

28:55

People always say have a nice day

28:58

Nice. Why not have an alternate say

29:00

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29:02

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29:05

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29:07

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29:09

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29:12

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29:14

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few weeks. After the Lion Sisters

30:01

disappeared in Nineteen Seventy Five, a

30:03

witness in Virginia saw two girls

30:06

bound and gagged in the back

30:08

seat of a base Ford station

30:10

wagon. Thirty nine years

30:13

later. Lloyd Li. Wells. Tells

30:15

detectives his uncle Dickey kidnapped Kate

30:17

and Sheila lock them in his

30:19

basement, then later may have driven

30:22

them to Virginia in a beige

30:24

Ford station wagon. Detectives.

30:26

Make the connection between the

30:29

two statements right away. After

30:31

so many months that wading

30:33

through lies they feel like

30:36

void Finally gave them something

30:38

real and he included a

30:40

destination they had relatives up

30:43

on Taylor's mountains. It's.

30:45

Were Lloyd Li well spent his

30:47

childhood and where many members of

30:49

the Wells family still live on

30:52

a hilltop in the Blue Ridge

30:54

Mountains of Appalachia intentionally isolated from

30:56

mainstream society, officials travel to the

30:58

area in the summer of two

31:01

thousand and fourteen. It's only to

31:03

quickly learned that finding the information

31:05

they're looking for will be. Difficult

31:08

for starters. It's a

31:10

sprawling wooded landscapes. If there are

31:12

any clues buried in the mountains,

31:14

detectives note that it will be

31:16

like finding a needle in a

31:18

haystack. Plus, there's a culture of

31:21

privacy on the mountain. Suspicion of

31:23

outsiders is part of the areas

31:25

history. People. Tend to keep

31:27

to themselves and even among

31:30

the locals. the Wells family

31:32

are considered social pariahs, quick

31:34

to violence, comfortable living below

31:36

the poverty line, and skeptical

31:39

of authorities. In fact, longstanding

31:41

tensions between the family and

31:43

local police have led to

31:46

an unorthodox, unspoken agreement. The.

31:48

Police don't. Patrol the mountain

31:50

anymore they leave. The Welsh is.

31:53

To their own devices, Throughout.

31:57

The Investigation Detectives. Learn.

32:00

Cost of that isolation incest

32:02

had become common place according

32:04

to reports. Many children in

32:07

the Welsh family would go

32:09

on to become survivors of

32:11

physical abuse and sexual assault.

32:13

Lloyd and his cousin Teddy

32:15

we're not outliers and even

32:18

still, many family members remained

32:20

tight. Lipped when investigators show up

32:22

on their doorstep with questions. Months

32:25

into their investigation in October.

32:27

Two thousand and fourteen detectives catch

32:29

a break. One. Of Lloyds,

32:31

many cousins still living in the

32:33

area decides to come. Forward Her

32:36

name is Connie and. She

32:38

tells detectives the following story.

32:42

Back. In Nineteen Seventy Five,

32:44

Connie remembers boy deserting her

32:46

family and Taylor's Mountain. He

32:49

showed up carrying a large green

32:51

army. Duffel bag that appeared to

32:53

be stuff to the brim and he

32:55

was wearing blood stained. Clothes,

32:58

Connie. Asteroid about the bag, he told

33:00

her it was filled with beef that

33:03

he had planned to cook. But

33:05

has since gone bad. Later.

33:07

Honey suggested void might have

33:09

recruited her brother, Henry to

33:11

help him build a bonfire

33:14

that could destroy the bag

33:16

and it's contents and they

33:18

succeeded. Henry. Reluctantly corroborates the

33:20

story. The. Fire ended up

33:22

being so big that when

33:24

investigators. Speak to some locals

33:26

day. remember it vividly. It

33:28

raged for days, maybe even

33:31

a full week and. According

33:33

to them, it's still the area

33:35

with an odor reminiscent of burning

33:37

hair and. Some

33:40

described the smell as

33:42

like burning rats. Why

33:46

that information didn't cause more concern

33:48

at the time More make it's way

33:50

to police. We can't say it probably

33:52

has something to do with the culture

33:55

of privacy on Taylor's Mountain. But for

33:57

investigators working the Lions Sisters. Case now.

34:00

How can he? Story calls to

34:02

mind a statement Lloyd Welsh made

34:04

during. His first interview. That.

34:07

He believed Ramo. Less key

34:09

killed, raped and burned at

34:11

the Lions Sisters. Ab

34:14

their intuition was right Maybe

34:16

void had been feeding them

34:18

partial truth this whole time.

34:22

Detected. Search the plot of

34:24

land where the bonfire allegedly

34:26

took place and they find

34:28

their first ever clues. It's

34:30

not a lot of material,

34:32

but it's something a piece

34:34

of wire that investigators believe

34:36

could come from Sheila's glasses.

34:39

A string? possibly. From the necklace

34:41

Kate War. And a

34:43

singular human bone. Fragment.

34:48

It feels important at first

34:50

but test come back. Inconclusive.

34:52

There's not enough Dna to link

34:55

any of the items to Kate

34:57

or Sheila. not even the bones.

35:00

So in January two thousand and

35:02

fifteen detectives pay Lloyd Welsh another

35:04

visit in prison. When.

35:06

They last spoke. Lloyd said his

35:09

uncle Dickey drove the girls down

35:11

to Virginia. He never mentioned a

35:13

duffel bag or being there himself.

35:15

He certainly didn't mention blood. Or

35:17

a bonfire. Hoping

35:19

to link Lloyd the Colonies

35:22

testimony, detectives ask him if

35:24

he ever went to Virginia

35:26

after the girls were take

35:28

him, and he's surprisingly forthcoming.

35:30

He tells them. It's

35:32

a very strong possibility. And

35:35

when they ask what he would have

35:37

used for luggage at that time, he

35:39

tells them he had a green army

35:41

duffel bag and his description match the

35:43

one Connie and her brother Henry. Gave

35:46

police. When. Lead learns

35:48

about the story Connie and

35:50

Henry told investigators. He denies

35:52

everything he claims Teddy must

35:54

have said Connie and Henry

35:57

the lie but eventually Void

35:59

realizes this. Tuition He. Then he

36:01

changes his story again without straying

36:03

too far from his latest version,

36:05

the one where he teddy in

36:07

their Uncle Dickie. It's got into

36:10

Dickey's car with the Lion Sisters.

36:12

He insists. That by the

36:14

time he got to Virginia, the

36:16

bonfire was already raging. But before

36:19

investigators are done talking to Lloyd,

36:21

he adds another. Accomplice to

36:23

the story louise father leave

36:26

who died back in Nineteen

36:28

Ninety Eight and that's not

36:30

all bullied tells police see

36:32

knows where the girls' bodies

36:35

are. They're. Not in Virginia.

36:38

Their. Back in Maryland. According.

36:42

To Lloyd see in his Uncle Dickey's

36:44

to go fishing at this one particular

36:47

sport. Sometimes it was down the street

36:49

from Uncle Dickey's house in High It

36:51

still Maryland a town near Kensington. right?

36:54

We're a small bridge crossed the

36:56

Anacostia River. Bullied. Said

36:58

it was well hidden especially at night

37:00

and he sure his uncle and father

37:02

took cheat and steal his body's there

37:05

after. Murdering them, It

37:07

could easily be another lie, but

37:10

investigators don't want to take any

37:12

chances. One detective Detective Dave Davis

37:14

drives down to highest still Maryland

37:17

and finds the location Boyd pointed

37:19

them to. Except it's nothing like

37:22

Lloyd described. No intelligent person would

37:24

dump a body there's it's out

37:26

in the open, highly visible, and

37:29

the water doesn't even look deep

37:31

enough to fish. It's.

37:33

Feeling like Lloyd sent them

37:36

on another wild goose chase.

37:38

Until while driving away, Dave

37:40

looks up and notices an

37:42

address of one of the

37:44

nearby houses, forty Seven Fourteen.

37:47

Baltimore Avenue. he's seen the Address

37:49

many times before and the Line

37:51

Sisters Case. Files Lloyd listed it

37:53

on his Nineteen Seventy Five Police

37:56

statement. It's the home his

37:58

father. Li Welsh. On. On

38:01

a hunch, Dave knocks on the front door

38:03

of the house. He shows the new occupants

38:05

his badge and asks if he could possibly

38:08

take a look at their basement. They.

38:11

Say Yes! He heads around the

38:13

back of the house and finds

38:15

a small set of stairs leading

38:17

to a padlock door. Which

38:19

opened in to have basements.

38:24

The. Basement itself is dark.

38:26

Musty and split. Into two

38:29

rooms, neither are connected to the

38:31

rest of the house. The space

38:33

can only be accessed from the

38:35

outside padlocked door. The ceilings. Low

38:38

and old Furniture is. Piled high,

38:40

it feels immediately familiar to

38:42

days he's walking into the

38:44

place. Lead Welsh first described

38:47

as re molest his basement

38:49

and then as his uncle

38:51

Dickey's. Turns. Out

38:53

it was really well. she's

38:55

house all a long. She.

38:58

Assumes that's where the Lion Sisters.

39:00

Spent their final days.

39:03

The next day, investigators said a

39:05

forensics team to the house. They

39:07

scanned the back room with a

39:09

blue light and the whole room

39:11

lights up. A staggering amount of

39:13

blood had been spilled in the

39:15

space as author Mike Bout and

39:17

put it. It had been

39:19

bathed in lod. After.

39:22

Forty years of searching.

39:25

Investigators found their.

39:27

Crime scene testing reveals

39:29

the bloods conclusively. Human,

39:31

There's not enough dna to link

39:34

any of it is Sheila or

39:36

kids, but it doesn't matter. In

39:38

May, two thousand and fifteen detectives

39:40

confront Lloyd with what they found.

39:43

And. He cracks at the

39:45

edges. He breaks down and

39:47

confesses to a new. Part

39:49

of the story. He was there

39:51

in the. House when one of the

39:53

lions sisters tried to escape. He's

39:56

pretty sure it was the younger one

39:58

his father lead broke. Their neck.

40:00

Then his uncle placed her body

40:03

in a duffel bag. Lloyds.

40:05

Not sure what happened to Sheila,

40:07

but he believes she was taken

40:10

to Virginia and killed. That

40:14

years Dick Welch's brought in front

40:16

of a grand jury and questions

40:19

he's seventy years old and multiple

40:21

family members have come forward. To

40:23

speak out about his history of

40:25

violent abuse, but under oath. He

40:28

denies all allegations of abuse

40:30

as well as any involvement

40:32

in Alliance Sisters abduction and

40:34

murders without evidence and without

40:37

a confession. He's never charged.

40:40

Two. Years later, in September.

40:42

Two Thousand and seventeen. Void:

40:44

Li Wells Jr. is put

40:46

on trial in Virginia even

40:48

though Lloyd technically only confess

40:50

to assisting. And Qaeda and she'll

40:52

as abductions. A judge can convict

40:55

him on felony. Murder charges in

40:57

the states. Plus, capital punishment

40:59

is legal in Virginia and

41:02

prosecutors hold Lloyd. Will plead

41:04

guilty to avoid. The Death penalty

41:06

which is what ends up happening.

41:09

He pleads guilty to two

41:12

counts of felony murder. And.

41:14

At sixty years old, he's

41:16

sentenced. To forty eight additional

41:18

years, he will most likely

41:20

spend the rest of his

41:22

life in prison. Forty.

41:30

Years in the making and it's

41:32

not necessarily a satisfying. Ending, but

41:34

it's something, even if there's

41:36

still. A lot of open

41:38

ended questions like what happened

41:40

to cheat and Sheila's bodies,

41:43

what really happened in Virginia?

41:45

Who. Is any one else was

41:47

involved? There are so many names

41:49

that have come up over the

41:52

years. Dick and Li Wells re

41:54

Molest eats at various points. Over

41:56

the years detect is considered a known. Child

41:58

predator names are. There are

42:00

a and a sexual sadist and

42:02

serial killer named James Mitchell. the

42:05

bar to lay them sometimes known

42:07

as the mall passer. They.

42:09

Couldn't eliminate any of them. Could.

42:12

One or more of them have been

42:14

associates. When. You examine all

42:16

of Lloyd. Stories Together you

42:19

can draw conclusions. You

42:21

can try and piece together what

42:23

actually happened on March Twenty Fifth,

42:25

Nineteen Seventy Five, and in the

42:27

weeks that followed, But

42:30

with so many persons of

42:32

interest aging or dead, we

42:35

may never know the whole

42:37

truth. but there's always hope.

42:39

After all, if nothing else,

42:42

the Lion Sisters case proves

42:44

that. years of dedication and

42:47

persistence. Can pay

42:49

off. Thanks.

42:56

For listening to Serial Killers, a Spotify

42:58

podcast or here with a new episode

43:00

every Monday. Be sure to check us

43:02

out on Instagram at Serial Killers podcast

43:04

and we'd love to hear from you.

43:07

So if you're listening on the spot

43:09

a Fiat swipe up and give us

43:11

your thoughts. We sound a book The

43:13

Last Stone by Mark Bout and as

43:15

well as the. Documentary Who Killed

43:17

The Lion Sisters. Extremely helpful

43:19

to our research. Stay.

43:22

Safe out there. Serial

43:26

Killers is a Spot of Fly

43:28

Podcast: This episode was written by

43:30

Lorrie Marin Alley and Connor Sampson.

43:33

Edited by Mickey Taylor, Chelsea Would

43:35

Maggie Admire and Alley Wicker Researched

43:38

by Mickey Taylor.