0:00

Welcome to the Practical Growth podcast

0:02

with me , ebi Johnson , author

0:04

, nlpmp and cognitive reappraisal

0:07

coach . This is the podcast

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created for people like you , people

0:12

looking for more , more

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health , more peace , more

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happiness . Each week , I

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explore new topic in pop psychology

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and help you build a better life and better

0:22

relationships . Join me for

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special guests , exciting ideas and

0:27

practical advice that you can use to improve

0:29

your life from the inside out . Let's

0:31

get into it . Hello

0:34

, hello , hello , my lovelies , it is me

0:36

, ebi , your favorite podcast

0:39

host , your favorite mediumcom writer

0:41

, your favorite tick tock

0:43

coach , nlp , cognitive

0:46

reappraisal specialist and beyond

0:48

, and we are back , back back this week with another

0:51

great episode for you . What

0:53

are we talking about today ? Now , this is one I've

0:55

gotten a lot of questions on lately . I've

0:58

had a few of you ask me about it on Instagram

1:00

. I've definitely had some questions

1:02

on tick tock , and I get questions about

1:04

this every single time . I write about

1:06

or speak about narcissistic

1:09

family dynamics , specifically dark

1:12

triad family dynamics

1:14

and the fact that you know my mother was a dark triad

1:16

, and I know that a lot of you have dealt with

1:18

a dark triad personality in the past

1:21

. So what are we going to be talking about today

1:23

Specifically ? We are going to be talking

1:25

about Machiavellianism

1:27

. Machiavellianism , it is that kind

1:29

of third leg of the dark triad

1:32

, right ? It is that third really negative

1:34

personality trait which leads to really

1:37

a level in behavior

1:39

, in in psychopaths

1:41

, in narcissists and a lot

1:44

of toxic personality types . So that's what we're

1:46

going to be talking about today Machiavellianism . What

1:48

is it ? What does it look like , where does it come from

1:50

and , most importantly , how do we

1:52

protect ourselves from it ? So

1:54

, if you are ready to learn more about

1:57

this toxic personality trait , buckle

1:59

up . This episode is going

2:01

to have everything that you've

2:03

ever needed to know about the

2:06

Machiavellian personality type

2:08

, machiavellian behaviors and how

2:10

it disrupts our relationships

2:12

. So you ready ? Let's jump in

2:14

. All

2:18

right . So let's just start right up at

2:20

the top , right up at the beginning . What is

2:22

Machiavellianism ? What am I talking

2:25

about when I say Machiavellianism ? Because it's not really

2:27

a clinical trait , right ? This isn't

2:29

something that's in the DSM-5 per se

2:31

. It's not something that necessarily

2:33

has specific diagnostic criteria . So

2:35

what am I talking about when I say

2:38

Machiavellianism or Machiavellian

2:40

person ? Essentially

2:42

, in the simplest terms , machiavellianism

2:44

is a personality trait that describes

2:47

someone who is like , inherently

2:49

, deeply manipulative . Ok

2:51

, this is a person who will say and do anything they

2:53

have to in order to get what they want . They don't

2:56

care what it costs themselves , they don't care what

2:58

it costs the people around them . If it hurts the people

3:00

around them , ok , a

3:02

Machiavellian person is someone who's extremely

3:04

prone to lying , OK

3:07

, to deceit , to being cynical

3:09

, deceitful . They lack

3:11

empathy , ok , that's like

3:13

one of the biggest markers and that's why you find it so

3:15

often with psychopathy and

3:17

narcissism , right , they lack empathy

3:20

and they lack respect for other people

3:22

, especially and this is

3:24

important , especially where their desires

3:26

, their personal desires , whims

3:28

, wishes , are concerned . Ok

3:30

, so that's again . This is very often when you find

3:33

this character trait , this Machiavellianism , as

3:35

that third leg of the dark triad

3:38

personality . It combines so well

3:40

with narcissism and psychopathy , which

3:42

we will see more on that in a minute when

3:44

I kind of break down more about this for

3:46

you . So the term Machiavellianism

3:49

where does that come from ? Because it's

3:51

quite complex . It actually

3:53

comes from Nicolo Machiavelli

3:55

, who was an Italian

3:58

Renaissance philosopher

4:00

. For the better part of the term , he was a philosopher

4:02

, ok , and his biggest work was called

4:04

the Prince , and the Prince was

4:06

essentially a manifesto

4:08

. Ok , it was released in 1516 . It was a

4:10

manifesto for one of the Medici

4:13

rulers and it essentially

4:15

was about . A king has a right to do and say

4:17

whatever he wants in order to get whatever

4:19

he wants . Ok , these rulers , these aristocrats

4:22

? They have the right to just say and do whatever they

4:24

want . It doesn't matter how they affect the people around

4:26

them , because their desires , their

4:28

wishes , their ideas take superiority over people

4:30

. So that is where we get

4:32

the term Machiavellian

4:34

from . Okay , because he really pushed these traits

4:37

. Funny enough , this

4:39

book was a great favorite of King Henry

4:41

VIII , so take what

4:43

you will , but essentially

4:46

, this is where we get the term Machiavellian from

4:48

. Now , according to Shay Macintosh

4:50

, who is an expert

4:53

in this right , she's an incredible psychologist

4:55

who studies these Machiavellian

4:57

traits . Shay says that

4:59

a person with Machiavellian traits is , and

5:01

I quote , deeply centered on

5:03

cunningness , selfish behavior

5:06

, manipulativeness and indifference

5:08

to morality . Okay , and

5:10

that's a big thing . That's why it pairs so well with

5:12

narcissism and why you see the two go hand in

5:15

hand so much , because it is that indifference

5:18

to morality which springs from a lack

5:20

of empathy . This Machiavellianism

5:23

is kind of one of the active mechanisms behind

5:25

a narcissistic person's actions . Okay , you can think

5:27

of it like where the rubber of their toxic

5:30

choices meets the roadway

5:32

of their desires and their destructiveness

5:35

. Okay , the Machiavellian personality

5:38

trait has been studied for years , for years

5:40

and years and years , so this is not some new buzzword that

5:42

I'm throwing at you . Okay , they've been writing books on

5:44

this personality trait since the 1970s

5:47

, okay , and even back then . What's really

5:49

crazy is psychologists writing

5:51

these books , doing these studies , who marked

5:54

these Machiavellian specifically Machiavellian

5:56

traits . They noted that people

5:58

with Machiavellian traits , with Machiavellian

6:00

personality types , they were incapable

6:03

of forming true bonds

6:05

and real , lasting relationships . Okay

6:08

, because , to them , people were disposable

6:10

, people were interchangeable , they were things that

6:12

were to be used for

6:15

ultimate gain , for ultimate

6:17

benefit , and , again , it

6:19

comes from this lack of empathy . It comes

6:21

from this lack of empathy because a Machiavellian person

6:23

has no sense of conventional morality . Okay

6:25

, they don't . They don't . People are

6:27

just like tools to them . What

6:31

you need to remember , though , is Machiavellianism . This

6:33

is a non-clinical term , okay , and it's

6:36

the same thing with narcissism . This

6:38

is kind of a descriptive term of a series

6:40

of traits . Machiavellianism is non-clinical

6:43

. It is actually , it's actually the

6:45

primary part , the only part of this

6:48

dark triad that is non-clinical , because , clinically

6:50

, right , you can establish narcissistic

6:53

personality disorder . Clinically , you can establish

6:55

psychopathy . Machiavellianism

6:57

is a little different , okay

7:00

, it's a little bit different , and so some clinicians

7:02

actually question if it exists

7:05

at all . They theorize

7:07

there are some theories out there that Machiavellianism

7:10

is not a mechanism

7:12

by itself , that it's actually just

7:14

a form of lower functioning

7:17

psychopathy or narcissism . Okay , sounds

7:20

easy , right it sounds . You know a Machiavellian

7:23

person and someone who's saying do anything

7:25

to get what they want . That is

7:27

actually a lot more broad than you might think Because

7:30

, as we've said before with narcissists , every

7:32

narcissist manifests differently . Same

7:35

thing with Machiavellian traits . Machiavellian

7:37

traits can manifest in different

7:39

ways and it can be borderline

7:42

, impossible for a non-professional

7:45

to even like identify the traits . They

7:47

can be so subtle , so manipulative

7:49

. Even some professionals

7:51

still don't agree

7:53

on how to diagnose the traits . Some don't believe

7:55

in the assessments , some believe in assessments

7:57

, yada , yada , yada . But essentially

7:59

, when we're looking at a Machiavellian

8:02

person , machiavellian

8:04

behavior , we're looking for pervasive

8:07

traits , and there's generally six of them , six

8:09

pervasive traits that we

8:11

can identify and these form a long-standing

8:14

pattern of behavior . I'm talking years . Okay

8:16

, you could go back for years and identify this

8:18

pattern and behavior in someone . And

8:20

these are the six of them . Number one

8:23

manipulation . Biggest

8:25

sign a Machiavellian person will lie , cheat , flatter , they'll

8:27

twist and bend the truth at every opportunity

8:29

to get what they want and to change

8:32

the minds and the behaviors of the people around

8:34

them . That's another big thing . It's not all about like getting

8:36

money and attention . Sometimes they want to manipulate

8:38

how people , how the people around

8:40

them , see the world and how they behave . They

8:42

are calculated strategists and they know

8:45

how to use people's fears and weaknesses against them and

8:47

they do it , and they do it consciously . They

8:49

bend rules , they fake sympathy

8:51

. So this is again why

8:54

you see this kind of going along with this covert narcissism

8:56

, and they will even engage in smear

8:58

campaigns . Okay , and that's all via that

9:01

chain , macintosh . Okay , they

9:03

can be charming at first , super , super , super charming

9:05

, but cross them and the switch gets

9:07

flipped and those behaviors immediately

9:10

change to bullying and aggression if

9:12

they're not given what they want . Because again

9:15

, there's no morals here . A

9:17

Machiavellian person has no morals . Their

9:19

morals is I want what I want in

9:21

this moment . That is the only morality they know

9:23

. So they are willing to cause harm

9:25

if it means satisfying themselves . Number two

9:27

, the second trait to look for self-interest . Machiavellians

9:31

always choose themselves first , and

9:33

what's really interesting about this is they'll justify it right

9:35

. They justify it by saying well

9:37

, everyone else is only looking out for themselves , so I'm

9:39

looking out for myself , so I'm allowed to hurt

9:41

them before they hurt me . That

9:44

is how the mindset of a Machiavellian person

9:46

works and it's because , again , they

9:48

lack empathy . They

9:51

lack empathy , they don't think

9:53

of others , and because they don't think of others and

9:55

they don't rate others highly , they don't think

9:57

anyone else thinks of others and they don't believe in anyone else

9:59

like rates other people highly . Power

10:02

and prestige mean more to them than

10:04

people , so they are always

10:06

going to be out to feed their desires and they

10:08

will harm and discard anyone that they

10:10

have to in order to keep feeding

10:12

those desires and keeping those desires on track

10:14

where they want them . The third trait to look out

10:16

for deceit , deceit to

10:19

the Machiavellian personality type . Deceit

10:21

is fundamental . It's fundamental , and

10:23

their deceit is always rooted in knowledge , because

10:25

to them , knowledge is power . Taking

10:28

knowledge away from you and using it against you

10:30

, that is a form of power . Leaving their

10:32

knowledge of specific events out in

10:35

order to manipulate your reality that's

10:37

also a form of deceit that they like to use

10:40

to control , shame

10:42

other people . You name

10:44

it . There's all kinds of ways that

10:46

a Machiavellian person will go about using deceit

10:49

. Using deceit and using information

10:52

to harm other people

10:54

okay , but they will do it . Information

10:56

that you share with them will

10:58

be used to harm you in future if it becomes necessary

11:01

, and they will not ever give

11:03

you any deeper information about themselves

11:05

, because it would mean exposure and it would give you ammunition

11:08

to use against them in the future . The fourth

11:10

sign , number four no emotions . There

11:13

is a significant , significant

11:16

lack of real emotion in

11:18

a truly Machiavellian person . Okay , and

11:20

that's because there's a significant lack of empathy

11:22

and compassion . Because they

11:25

don't have this empathy , this compassion , they can't even

11:27

really identify their own emotions and they certainly

11:29

are not willing or able

11:31

to identify emotions in others or to hold

11:33

space for the emotions of

11:35

other people . Okay , that's why it's so easy

11:37

for them to cause harm and push people around . They

11:39

don't feel things and they assume that everyone

11:42

else doesn't feel things , so they can hurt

11:44

you , right ? Because you're not going to feel it . So

11:46

that makes it easy for

11:48

them to dispose people

11:51

and it makes it hard for your average

11:53

empathetic person to see this and

11:55

to understand that someone could move

11:57

through the world without the same kind of feeling

11:59

that they have . Number five

12:01

the fifth big sign here that you

12:03

want to look for the long-term pervasive

12:06

sign of Machiavellianism ambition

12:08

, ambition , ambition . There

12:11

is a reason again that we have used

12:13

the name of Nicola Machiavelli

12:16

to title

12:18

these behaviors right , because he wrote

12:20

about princes obsessed

12:22

with status who , because of their status

12:25

, were morally superior to everyone

12:27

around them and therefore had the right to subjugate

12:30

everyone around them if they so desired

12:32

. Ambition is a big piece

12:34

of that wanting to be over

12:37

other people , wanting to take power

12:39

, wanting to have prestige that you can use

12:41

as a tool . Okay , machiavellian

12:43

people want that . They want an audience

12:45

of people behind them , because that's an

12:47

army . If you have an audience , you

12:50

have an army that you can weaponize against

12:53

people , right ? We've seen that

12:55

over and over again on social media . It's

12:57

way more than a power trip For a Machiavellian

13:00

person . It's not just about having a sea of people

13:02

who go you're the best . That's great

13:04

for them , but they like having walls

13:06

of people that they can put between them and those

13:09

who would expose them . So ambition

13:11

is a big part of it for the Machiavellian

13:13

person . Building a platform is

13:15

a big part of it for the Machiavellian person who

13:17

wants to be able to push people around and

13:19

have power over others . Last but

13:22

not least , number six competition

13:24

, competition , competition , competition . Just

13:26

like the narcissist , a Machiavellian person

13:28

and again , this is why you find the comorbidities so

13:30

commonly Machiavellian people

13:33

personalize everything . They see everything

13:35

in their environment as a direct reflection

13:37

of them , their lives

13:39

, their worth , yada , yada , yada , yada yada

13:42

. So they are constantly in competition with

13:44

everyone and everything around them

13:46

. They think that they have

13:48

a right to push everyone down to the bottom of the

13:50

pyramid and so everything's a competition , because they're

13:53

looking to subjugate everyone

13:55

around them . Okay

13:57

, then all that's tied into their power , their self-worth

13:59

, yada , yada yada . So they switch

14:01

between cooperative and competitive tactics

14:03

at ease , whatever works best

14:06

for them to again put people at the bottom

14:08

of that pyramid . Now , where does this mock-a-velianism

14:11

come from ? And this is going to be a very brief little

14:13

kind of segue before we get into how to protect

14:15

yourself , but I feel that this is worth saying

14:18

because so much has gotten twisted right . A

14:20

lot of people have gone with narcissism and they've run

14:23

off online and gone . You can only become

14:25

a narcissist if you've been traumatized , and

14:27

that is not true . That is absolutely , categorically

14:30

untrue . Do a lot

14:32

of narcissistic people have trauma in their backgrounds

14:35

? Absolutely , absolutely

14:37

. Does every single narcissist person

14:39

with NPD , an abuser with

14:41

NPD , have a traumatic

14:43

background ? Absolutely not . It is not

14:46

a prerequisite . It

14:48

is not trauma-genic . Npd

14:50

is not trauma-genic , which means coming

14:52

from trauma alone . Now the

14:54

same thing applies to mock-a-velianism

14:56

. The same thing applies

14:58

. The primary mechanism

15:00

for someone to become mock-a-velian

15:04

is genetics right . There

15:06

has to be a genetic predisposition

15:08

to it . There's probably a parent

15:10

or a grandparent or somewhere in the ancestral

15:13

line where this gene was being carried

15:15

and they got it right . That is absolutely

15:18

without a doubt . Now , according

15:21

to Dale Hartley , who is a PhD

15:23

, mba , retired professor of psychology

15:25

and the author of Mock-a-velian's

15:28

Golling the Roobs , which was an extremely

15:30

popular blog post on psychology

15:32

today , which was posted in 2017 . I

15:35

highly recommend you go and look it up he

15:37

says that in a lot of mock-a-velians

15:40

it's a combination . It is a combination of

15:42

genetic predisposition

15:44

, which is important . You got to have that

15:46

kind of trigger in there , combined

15:48

with some kind of negative

15:51

early start in childhood . Now that

15:53

may be outright trauma , it

15:57

may be neglect or

16:00

it could be something like a traumatic brain injury

16:02

. There are different ways

16:05

that it is thought because , again

16:07

, there's no confirmation on this . Mock-a-velianism

16:09

is still very misunderstood

16:11

and not widely researched . This

16:15

is how it is thought to kind

16:17

of manifest itself in

16:19

those who show up with

16:21

the behavior . Let's get into

16:23

now what really matters . Right

16:26

, we get that , we get where it comes from

16:28

now we understand how the

16:30

behaviors kind of show up in people and we

16:32

understand what it is . But here's

16:34

what's really important and this is what most of the questions

16:37

that I've got from people online

16:39

over the last couple of weeks have really centered around , and

16:41

it is how do I deal with this

16:43

? How do I deal with a mock-a-velian

16:45

person ? Because the thing is , a lot of you have parents

16:47

who you suspect have this trait . You've

16:49

, the last couple of years you've been doing your work , digging

16:51

deep , you've recognized narcissistic traits

16:54

in your parent . Maybe some of you recognize

16:56

some dark triad traits , and now you've kind

16:58

of hit that mock-a-velian groundstone

17:01

and you're going , uh-oh , what

17:03

do I do ? Because maybe you're going no contact

17:05

, maybe you're not in that playshed , maybe you're dealing

17:07

with this personality trait in a boss

17:10

, in a co-worker , in someone

17:12

you have to co-parent with and that

17:14

you can't fully escape . So what do

17:16

you do ? How do you deal with a person

17:18

who will say and do anything to anyone

17:21

in order to get what they want

17:23

. Well , I'm going to give you five

17:25

tips , but before we get into these five tips , you

17:28

need to remember right

17:30

off the bat If any

17:32

of you have come in here , think that I'm going to tell you any kind

17:34

of advice that will allow you to change

17:36

the behavior of this mock-a-velian person . You're

17:38

delusional , I'm sorry , I'll just say it . You're delusional

17:40

. You cannot , you

17:43

cannot , change Machiavellian

17:45

behavior in someone else . It's never gonna happen . You're

17:47

not gonna love them enough , you're not gonna encourage them enough , you're

17:49

not gonna push them into therapy . None

17:52

of that , okay , and

18:28

I will also tell you this I spent

18:30

about six hours researching for this podcast

18:33

episode total over the last week or two and pulling

18:35

things together and these little excerpts and these studies

18:38

from these professionals who have mentioned so far in the episode

18:40

. Every single one of them said the

18:42

primary way and the only guaranteed

18:44

way to protect yourself from a Machiavellian

18:47

person Is to avoid them at

18:49

all costs . And If you

18:51

have that option in any way , shape

18:53

or form , that is the option , the solution

18:56

that you should select every single

18:58

time . You should avoid interacting

19:00

with someone who displays Machiavellian

19:02

personality traits at

19:04

all costs . Okay , whether they

19:06

are confirmed or suspected , you should

19:09

stay away from them . If you've seen proof

19:11

of those behaviors . Now , for

19:14

some of you , that's not possible . It might be a parent

19:16

You're not ready to go no contact with , or

19:19

sibling , some kind of family member You're not ready

19:21

to go no contact with . Or , like

19:23

I said at the top of this segment , you

19:26

might be dealing with a co-worker , you might

19:28

be dealing with a boss . So what can you do

19:30

? I'm gonna warn you now , it's limited . Okay

19:33

, it's limited because there is nothing you can do to counter

19:35

their behavior . They are going to do what they are going

19:37

to do , and what you do doesn't really matter . So

19:40

the goal here should be self-protection , building

19:43

up yourself and Finding

19:45

ways to create divisions and walls between

19:47

yourself and this Machiavellian person . So here

19:49

we go , get your pen and paper out . This is

19:51

how you're gonna deal with the Machiavellians in your life

19:54

. Number one Set clear boundaries

19:56

. And this is gonna be really hard and really uncomfortable

19:58

, and you can't get here if you haven't worked on your self-esteem

20:01

. But set clear boundaries . You need

20:03

to verbalize to them what is and isn't okay

20:05

. You will not speak to me this way . I will not work

20:07

during these times , after these hours , on

20:09

these dates . I will say

20:12

no to these things , all of

20:14

those really tense , scary things

20:16

that are a part of setting boundaries

20:18

. You have to do them Consciously

20:21

, intentionally , even though they are hard , even

20:23

though they are uncomfortable . Okay , every

20:25

time that person violates your boundaries

20:28

, every time they push you around , bully , you

20:30

make a remark . Whatever it is , you need to write it

20:32

down . It needs to get written down in a physical diary

20:34

date , time , what

20:36

boundary was violated , how it was violated

20:39

and how it made you feel . I'm not kidding . If

20:41

you need to get in a spreadsheet , make a freaking spreadsheet

20:43

. You need to keep a record of every single time this happens

20:46

. Now that protects you for sure

20:48

legally in a work position . If

20:50

you are in a family relationship , it's

20:53

not so much about being able to legally protect

20:55

you from them . It's about free . When the

20:57

time comes for you to do the hard work of no contact

20:59

, you have a reference to go back and see all the times

21:01

that you were abused and then decide

21:04

if you're going to remain complicit in that abuse or not

21:06

. Number two Focus

21:08

on yourself . You , you , you

21:10

, you , you . Their behaviors are going

21:12

to be so emotionally harmful and upsetting

21:14

. And guess what If you can't go

21:16

? No contact with them . There's nothing

21:18

you can do about that . Again they will be

21:21

hurtful . They will lie to

21:23

you . They will deceive you . They will lie to

21:25

other people about you . They will deceive

21:27

other people about you . They will find

21:29

ways to disrupt your life

21:31

emotionally in any way that

21:33

suits them To getting what they want

21:36

. You can't change that right . So the only

21:38

thing you can do is change your ability

21:40

to respond to that environment . You need to focus

21:42

on your goals Making your

21:44

emotions as strong and regulated

21:46

as possible , as healthy as possible . Get

21:48

your body healthy , get your mind healthy . Surround

21:51

yourself with good people . Get your life

21:53

Outside of this person looking

21:55

exactly the way you want to look now

21:57

. If you're trapped in a work environment

21:59

, a part of this focusing on you is

22:02

also making sure that you get the skills , abilities

22:04

, finances , platforms

22:07

, whatever it is , to get yourself the hell

22:09

out of there . Okay , that has

22:11

to be a part of focusing on you building yourself

22:13

up so that you are strong enough to

22:16

get away from the environment where this person

22:18

is . Because if you continue

22:20

to exist in an environment with a Machiavellian

22:22

person , you will continue to be miserable because

22:24

, again , they ain't changing , but

22:26

they will keep harming you . Number

22:29

three Self-esteem , self-esteem

22:31

, self-esteem . If you are spending every day in

22:33

an environment with a Machiavellian person , then you need

22:35

to be spending at least 15 minutes every single

22:37

day doing self-esteem building exercises

22:39

for yourself . Now , this

22:42

might look different To different people

22:44

. I always tell my clients the fastest way to

22:46

boost your self-esteem is to hang around good people

22:48

and To do things that you're

22:50

good at . Okay , those are the two fastest

22:53

way , but essentially you need to increase your self-esteem

22:55

and you need to focus on building

22:57

a strong sense of identity that is so

22:59

strong and so undeniably

23:02

yours that the

23:04

Machiavellian person cannot destroy you

23:07

or it when they go to someone and tell a story

23:09

, your image , your Self-identity

23:11

needs to be so strong that a you don't care and

23:14

be . The people who hear the story Don't even believe

23:16

it , because you know who you are

23:18

and they see that and they know

23:20

that that conflicts with the lies that the Machiavellian

23:22

person is telling . A number four here Keep

23:25

your circle small . If you are dealing with

23:27

Machiavellian people , okay , keep

23:29

your inner circle strong . Stop

23:31

telling all of your business to people who are

23:34

close to that Machiavellian person , people

23:36

who have proven time and time again that they are willing

23:39

to be Manipulated by that person

23:41

, who are susceptible to being manipulated or

23:43

played by that person . Keep

23:45

your circle of close , trusted people

23:48

small . Don't look for support in

23:50

people who are close to the Machiavellian , because

23:52

it's not going to happen . They will disappoint you

23:54

every time , they will always be swayed , they

23:57

will always be manipulated . So

23:59

make sure that you are building support systems

24:02

, groups , friends outside

24:04

of the environment where that Machiavellian person

24:06

is Number five . Last but not least , ask

24:08

for professional help . Get yourself some professional

24:11

help . If you've got like I had someone who was asking me

24:13

the other day about their mother who they highly suspected was

24:15

Machiavellian , and they were like asking for stuff , for

24:17

questions on TikTok in the comments and

24:19

that's great . I understand that they were looking for information

24:21

and I was happy to help . There's only so much help you can get

24:24

from a TikTok comment section . Yeah , you

24:26

need to get professional help from someone who can

24:28

help you protect yourself and put

24:30

systems in place so that you can

24:32

escape that environment where that Machiavellian person

24:34

is causing all that damage . So

24:37

ask for professional help . Put yourself

24:39

out there , get in a group , get coaching , get a

24:41

therapist . Do what you've

24:43

got to do to get the knowledge and the willpower

24:46

and the strength and the plan

24:48

in place to get away from and

24:50

protect yourself from this Machiavellian person

24:52

, right

24:54

? So that's the gist of

24:57

it . That is the gist of it . That's the gist

24:59

of Machiavellianism and how

25:01

it looks and how to protect yourself . But there's

25:03

some things , there's a few more things I need to

25:05

kind of give to you before I leave you , okay , and

25:07

there's a few things I want you to remember . One

25:10

is this Some Machiavellian people can

25:12

be benign . I don't want you guys to take

25:14

this episode and run away and think I'm blanketing

25:16

all Machiavellian people as these like sadistic

25:19

, serial killer type people , because that's

25:21

not true . Okay , to some

25:23

extent you could say that everyone , especially when we've

25:25

grown up in toxic environments we've

25:27

only had a

25:30

negative , toxic example

25:32

of how to behave from our parents , our families

25:34

, our caretakers Then

25:37

you could have some of these traits

25:39

, right , you could pick up

25:41

some of these behaviors , have some of these traits

25:43

that maybe you're not fully aware of or you're just starting to build an awareness of

25:45

Machiavellians

25:48

the way we talk about them here , the bad ones

25:50

, the dangerous ones . You'll see them refer to quite often

25:52

as high mocks , like

25:54

people with high Machiavellian traits . The

25:57

reason that they are considered high mocks is

26:00

because they choose to use

26:02

their behaviors , their traits , that lack of empathy , that

26:05

desire to put themselves above others . They use

26:07

it for bad . They choose to

26:09

capitalize on those instincts and

26:11

use it to harm others . Okay , and

26:14

that is the really , really , really big

26:16

thing here we're talking about people who choose

26:18

to use their words and deeds to consciously inflict

26:20

harm on others . Okay , and someone like

26:22

that cannot be fixed by the love of another person

26:24

. That's not a thing

26:26

. The only way someone

26:28

with Machiavellian traits can

26:30

improve themselves and I'm not saying cure , because

26:32

there's not really enough knowledge here . We don't

26:34

know if it can be cured , but what we do know is

26:37

that someone with these traits can

26:39

always choose to go

26:41

to a trained psychotherapist , ask

26:44

for help and reprogram

26:46

their brains and their behaviors . Now , that

26:48

is a thing that absolutely can be done , but it can

26:51

only be done when that person intrinsically

26:53

, is motivated to do that , and

26:55

you can't push someone to do that . They either have

26:58

that in them or they don't . Okay

27:00

, and that's the big thing , and some Machiavellian

27:02

people ? They may not get help , but they also may

27:05

not really use their

27:08

traits for bad right , they may just kind of

27:10

harm themselves and be a bit selfish , but they don't

27:12

go out of their way to harm people . So it's important

27:14

to see the sliding scale and to keep in

27:16

mind that you're looking for longstanding

27:19

I mean years worth of harmful

27:21

and dangerous behavior . What

27:23

do you think ? Do you have any Machiavellian

27:26

people in your life ? Have you dealt with Machiavellian

27:28

personality types before ? How

27:30

did that hold you back ? How did that harm you ? Did

27:33

it disrupt that kind of connection with self ? Did

27:36

it disrupt the way you were able

27:38

to grow , interact

27:40

, believe in yourself in the world ? I

27:43

know a lot of us have encountered this and a lot of

27:45

us are still working to recover

27:48

from the damage done . But the good news is we can

27:50

right , we can always choose

27:52

to be better people , and that

27:54

is the real difference between us and the people that

27:57

harmed us the choice we're making

27:59

, the choice right now to

28:01

be better than they were , and

28:03

that is such a powerful choice

28:05

to make . Thank you so so much for

28:07

listening today . I hope you learned something , I

28:10

hope you gained something . I hope that

28:12

this has given you a little bit more confidence to

28:14

go out into the world and to build yourself

28:16

and to protect yourself and to create

28:19

that life that you love , because you do deserve

28:21

that . You do deserve

28:23

that . If you'd like to work with me

28:25

, I do have applications open now

28:27

for my 2024 programs

28:29

, but I will let you know . Applications

28:32

are already coming in . This is not a joke . So if

28:35

you would like to work with me in 2024

28:37

, one-on-one coaching make sure

28:39

you head over to therealevejohnsoncom

28:42

and click on Working With Me . There you'll find

28:44

out more about me , my coaching programs

28:46

and what it takes to apply with me . I will

28:48

say my programs are not for everyone

28:50

. Okay , my programs are not for everyone . It's for

28:53

people who have done the work , who are continuing

28:55

to do the work , people who have plateaued

28:57

in therapy and who are ready to get active

29:00

results , who are ready to take

29:02

action in their lives , create better

29:04

lasting relationships with themselves and

29:06

with the people around them right now , and

29:08

to recalibrate and reprogram

29:10

their nervous systems for greater life

29:12

satisfaction , for greater emotional regulation

29:15

, for greater peace and

29:18

rest . Okay , so if that sounds

29:20

like you , make sure you head over to therealevejohnsoncom

29:23

and click on Working With Me to apply for

29:26

everyone else . Thank you again for listening . Keep

29:28

following me on Medium . You guys have really

29:30

caused a buzz over there and it's helped me out immensely . I

29:33

appreciate that greatly . Keep following

29:35

me on TikTok and Instagram and YouTube

29:37

and I'll be back back

29:39

, back back next week with some juicy

29:41

goodness . Until then , keep

29:43

your heads up , keep your eyes on the stars and keep

29:46

moving forward . Bye-bye .