0:04

Welcome to Nothing is Real, a podcast about the Beatles. Everybody

0:06

thinks they know the Beatles, but how much do we really

0:08

know? My

0:18

name is Jason Carty. My

0:20

name is Stephen Cockroft. And we are

0:23

live on tape from Dublin and Belfast. In

0:25

the ever expanding universe of the 16 songs

0:27

of 66, it seems to make sense that

0:30

we should have a 17th song of 66.

0:32

This is a bit like The Hitchhiker's Guide

0:34

to the Galaxy being a trilogy in five

0:36

parts, but there is a 17th song

0:38

that came out in 1966 and it

0:41

is Everywhere It's Christmas, the Beatles fan

0:43

club Christmas single. Everywhere It's

0:45

Christmas. I think that counts 17 songs. I

0:48

think it does. I mean, we're not counting,

0:50

you know, there were other songs that they were working

0:52

on towards the end of 66, but they

0:54

didn't come out in 66. This is, does have

0:57

a true claim to be the 17th song of 66. Absolutely.

1:01

And if you want to be specific, I

1:03

think the song is Please

1:05

Don't Bring Your Banjo Back. We

1:08

come on to that. We come on to that in

1:10

a second. Now the Beatles

1:12

Christmas records are a fantastic parallel

1:15

universe and I still feel that

1:17

they are, even though we got

1:19

the 2017 box set, there's still a

1:22

bit of a secret history in terms

1:24

of the Beatles story. They're just a little bit

1:26

hard to get your hands on. And the thing

1:28

I love about this sort of secret history in

1:30

the Christmas records is, you know, they made seven

1:32

Christmas records from 63 to 69. This 66

1:37

record is right in the middle. So you

1:39

have three before three after the 66 records

1:41

right in the middle. And even if you

1:43

just followed the Christmas records, you can see

1:46

the Beatles evolution. Even if you just look

1:48

at the cover of the Beatles fan club

1:50

records, you can see the evolution of the

1:52

Beatles. So they're, they're a fantastic resource, the

1:54

Christmas records. The Beatles, the characters of the

1:56

Beatles at each stage in their career in

1:58

terms of the sort of young innocent

2:00

mock tops to the slightly more sophisticated stuff

2:03

in the mid-60s to the records

2:06

being recorded separately and

2:09

sort of pieced together. So even in the

2:11

way that these things are recorded, the way

2:13

they are produced, it's a parallel history. And

2:15

they are underappreciated because although we

2:17

did get that box set, I've

2:21

never played those records. What?

2:25

I bought the box. I bought the box. The

2:27

box is a cool thing to have. I actually

2:29

bought two, somehow by accident I

2:31

acquired two copies. Two boxes, yeah. That happens

2:33

to you a lot Steven, where by accident

2:36

you end up with two copies of things.

2:38

It does indeed. It's not to put you on

2:41

the box. I'd listen to them on YouTube. I

2:44

do think they're just not accessible.

2:46

They're not readily accessible. Why aren't

2:48

these things on streaming? But

2:51

I like the fact that they are

2:53

not readily accessible. I

2:55

never really sat down and listened to them all from

2:57

start to finish until the box set came out. I

3:00

have gotten into a tradition now where I

3:02

pack the box set away with my Christmas

3:04

decorations. I'm not looking at it all year.

3:06

Then when I take my Christmas decorations out of the attic,

3:09

this is sitting on top of one of the boxes. I'm

3:12

like, oh, it's time to give these all a spin again.

3:14

It's a very pleasant box set. I

3:16

think the 1966 Christmas

3:19

record is probably the pinnacle, 66 and 67. But

3:21

the 66 record is

3:24

a pinnacle because it sits right in the middle

3:26

between these early records where they're like, hello, we've

3:28

had a lovely year. And these records at the

3:30

end where they're just talking to each other. The

3:33

thing we should give a bit of credit

3:36

to is that the Beatles Christmas Flexi disc,

3:38

and it would come to just UK fan

3:40

club members as a flexible disc in the

3:42

week before Christmas, would come through their letterbox.

3:45

It's actually a very far

3:47

sighted idea that, you know,

3:49

in 1963, they were so popular,

3:51

they become so huge, there was no

3:54

way they could keep up with their

3:56

correspondence. So to do something special like

3:58

this for their fans, very

4:00

clever idea. It was

4:02

a very clever idea and we should

4:04

go back to friend of the

4:06

show Tiny Barrow. Tiny Barrow,

4:08

he's another star. He's the breakout

4:10

star of season

4:13

eight. But this

4:15

is apparently his idea more or less isn't it? Supposedly.

4:18

There are times when he will say yes it

4:20

was his idea, there are other occasions in which

4:22

he would say no no it wasn't his

4:25

idea. So just to

4:27

place Tony Barrow

4:30

in context, he is basically

4:33

a he has a job

4:35

as a freelancer writing pop

4:37

and rock reviews for the

4:39

Liverpool Echo. He's 17 when

4:41

he starts doing that. What were you doing at 17?

4:43

Were you enterprising enough to go

4:46

and start hawking your wares to the...

4:48

No, that was Cousin Pat did that.

4:53

Yeah no he's doing a he's kind

4:55

of working in 1954 as a 17 year

4:57

old schoolboy writing freelance pop rock reviews and

4:59

1954 is a good year

5:02

to start doing that kind of thing. Absolutely,

5:04

but arguably couldn't have done it before

5:06

1954 but you know he's there at

5:08

the beginning. So he's building up that

5:11

experience. He moves to London,

5:13

he starts to work for Decca where

5:15

he's doing sleeve notes you know for the

5:18

back of album covers etc but he's still

5:20

contributing. Discur is the weekly

5:22

record column to the Liverpool Echo

5:24

and in

5:26

that context he comes to the attention

5:28

of Brian Epstein who assigned the Beatles

5:30

in 1961. He gets in touch with

5:32

Barrow for professional advice and Barrow

5:35

basically recounts that Epstein asked him to write

5:37

a column for the band and

5:40

that he then arranged to get the Beatles an

5:42

audition. It's

5:44

a lead through informal arrangement where

5:46

Barrow becomes the Beatles sort of

5:48

part-time press

5:51

slash publicity consultant. So even

5:53

after they signed to EMI

5:55

he's doing press From

5:57

his desk at the Record Company....

6:00

Dhaka from his desk at their house. On.

6:02

Eventually he will end leave data on

6:04

Move To Names and May Nineteen Sixty

6:06

Three. Johnny Bower

6:09

opens Epstein first London

6:11

office on Then begins

6:13

to promote and task

6:15

as roster supply chain

6:17

Kramer the foremost. He.

6:20

Develops and and strategy so he

6:22

he thousand during telephone interviews with.

6:24

With regional. Newspapers and

6:27

then. Supposedly.

6:29

He comes up with this idea of you

6:31

without the smiley com we got your one

6:33

point the worth. Eighty thousand people subscribing to

6:35

the song. And dance.

6:39

Do. This. In

6:41

of this goodwill gesture and it might

6:43

limit the damage done to the grid

6:45

suffocation by the delays in responding biggest,

6:48

they're actually responding to individual letters. At

6:50

this point I'm thinking of ring Go

6:52

On The Simpsons Dear Marge, thanks for

6:54

your picture is a P M. Yeah

6:56

he is. He's quite far sighted and

6:58

it is a we take for granted

7:00

that the people do press junket so

7:02

they have a day where they sit

7:04

down and neither do a load of

7:06

interviews or to allow the phone calls

7:08

from. But I wasn't the prevailing at

7:10

media. Culture. In the early sixties is

7:12

in in British pops oh dear. he would

7:14

get people to sit on the phone, ring all

7:17

the local newspapers, give a few words and

7:19

kind of get the Beatles out there and this

7:21

kind of flexi discuss a similar idea that she

7:23

kind of spend money to make money artist to

7:25

get to get capital with the fans because think

7:28

Brian thought it was gonna be a bit

7:30

of a am a loss me a bit of

7:32

a last actually bother to do this and

7:34

didn't want to do it so Tony kind of

7:36

presses on the Beatles themselves to do with

7:38

yes that's exactly right. So he. Will.

7:41

Say in Nineteen Eighty Three he says it's

7:43

the Queen's Christmas. it's inspired him to do

7:45

this. He writes a book later and says

7:47

no not wasn't my idea at all but

7:49

I think be accepted thing is he went

7:52

to Brian. Brian says absolutely not gonna cost

7:54

money. To finance. The specific

7:56

give them away. Borrow. Think

7:58

this is a good idea and keepers and

8:00

he goes. Essentially behind Brian, Spock

8:02

goes and speaks to the Beatles who

8:04

think it's a great idea and then

8:07

they talk to Brian. I'm Brian to

8:09

sort of bounced into this so the

8:11

fan club get there first Beatles Christmas

8:14

message I to succeed threaten. Us

8:16

for the first three Christmas Records role

8:18

kind of of a type really Sixty

8:20

three, Sixty Four, Sixty Five, The Cockpit

8:22

of Christmas Record and Other People's Christmas

8:25

Record and the Beatles third Christmas record.

8:27

very very original but even across those

8:29

first three records you can see a

8:31

bit of a loosening of bird bird

8:33

that the kinda the structure of these

8:35

things because they're they're inevitably they start

8:37

to play to type that get out

8:39

of the four of them are are

8:41

there and eat you know the a

8:43

kind of started it's always something that's

8:45

don't with. A little bit of extra studio

8:47

time, We've got an hour to kill. Let's

8:50

do the Beatles Christmas record So kind of

8:52

starts pretty traditionally and sixty three were there

8:54

in the studio and they're just. Saying.

8:57

Hello and thank them back kind of thing.

8:59

Yes to This is basically scripted by Tony

9:01

Barrow and you know they're doing towels on

9:03

their to saying what a wonderful year Thanks

9:05

for all the presence cetera et cetera. It's

9:07

all very straightforward. There are so many people

9:10

in the fight club that they have to

9:12

do a second press sign. Of

9:14

the single that because I didn't The

9:16

New Year or in February by Ninety

9:19

Sixty Four. As

9:21

you say, they're sort of slipping into type

9:23

here, so again, it's sort of scripted. Paul.

9:26

Is trying to follow the rules to the were

9:28

would be with I to eccentric cetera John. Is.

9:31

pretty sarcastic so they say why would

9:33

you be is not and the beatles

9:35

and he says in the army probably

9:38

on they sort of mock the whole

9:40

say and they're deliberately misleading the script

9:42

and the sense of humor comes across

9:44

and as you said there's a sort

9:46

of listening ah of of the the

9:48

reins you that break the night from

9:50

the script year and and they'd the

9:52

second christmas record gets a run of

9:55

sixty five thousand copies which comes along

9:57

with a beatles newsletter and by the

9:59

time we to 65, they're a little

10:01

bit more aware, they're supposed

10:03

to be doing versions of songs,

10:07

but you know there's kind of Vietnam references and that kind

10:09

of thing slipping in. Yes, so there's

10:11

a little bit of politics

10:13

as they said in the 80s creeping

10:16

in, they're doing yesterday and it's

10:18

almost a send-up of yesterday because

10:21

I suppose there's a slightly

10:23

mocking aspect to themselves or

10:25

specifically the idea of Paul, you know it's the

10:27

way they would introduce it and I've heard Paul

10:29

McCartney have heard Paul, opportunity knocks. So they're making

10:31

fun slightly of the fact that Paul

10:34

has had this almost solo song,

10:36

but this is where it starts to, I

10:39

think for a modern audience, it's quite meta, is that

10:42

the word, where they're sort of referencing themselves

10:44

and making fun of themselves. That's

10:47

probably where their individual characters start

10:49

to emerge most. If

10:52

you got a fan club record in 1965,

10:54

you would have been one of the tens

10:57

of thousands, but there was an even more

10:59

elite Christmas record in 1965 that had a

11:01

run of checks notes, three copies. Three

11:04

whole copies and this is Paul

11:06

McCartney's Christmas album. What?

11:11

Wonderful Christmas time. Wonderful

11:13

Christmas time, decades early. So

11:16

yeah, in 1965 he records a Christmas album

11:18

of sorts as a gift to

11:21

his three bandmates. So there are only

11:23

three discs created and

11:25

Richie Unterberger describes this and

11:28

he said, unforgettable. For years it

11:30

had been reported that Paul McCartney

11:32

recorded an album at home around

11:35

Christmas 1965, specifically for the other

11:37

Beatles. Supposedly it includes singing, acting,

11:39

sketches and only three copies

11:42

were pressed and McCartney confirmed

11:44

this in the Many Years From

11:47

Now book and he said it was really a kind of

11:49

stone thing. And in 1995 with

11:51

Mark Lewis, he also confirmed

11:53

that it existed and went into a little

11:55

bit of detail. So

11:58

what we're saying here is that Paul McCartney... McCartney invented

12:00

the mixtape, the playlist. He was

12:02

a man ahead of his time.

12:04

It's almost like

12:07

a podcast you could say that he created.

12:10

He invented the podcast because that's what it

12:12

is. He invented everything. It

12:15

seems to be a sort of

12:17

mix of tapes and sketches

12:19

and skits and he has the wherewithal to

12:21

record this at home and he

12:23

also has the collide to get it pressed

12:25

up into a record. It does the tapes.

12:28

Yeah, and it's called Unforgettable and it starts

12:30

with Nat King Cole singing Unforgettable and then

12:33

Paul is kind of a cheesy US

12:35

announcer and he

12:39

gets pressed at Dick James' studio and if

12:41

only there was some way to hear this

12:43

in 2023. And

12:46

weirdly, weirdly, there is.

12:49

So in 2017 an 18.5 minute tape appeared on YouTube

12:51

with Paul

12:55

doing the impression of this jockey and

12:57

he plays Unforgettable, Someone Ain't Right by

12:59

Peter and Gordon, I Get Around by

13:01

The Beach Boys, Heatwave by Martha and

13:03

the Vandalas, Don't Be Cruel by Elvis,

13:05

Down Home Girl by The Rolling Stones.

13:07

So it is

13:09

out there and you can hear it.

13:11

Paul in describing it to Mark Lewis and said,

13:13

I had two Brinnell tape recorders set up at

13:16

home in which I made experimental recordings and tape

13:18

looks like the ones in Tomorrow Never Knows and

13:20

once I put together something crazy, something left me

13:22

and just for the other Beatles, a

13:24

fun thing which I could play late

13:27

in the evening. It was just something for the

13:29

mates basically. Around this time there's talk about Paul

13:31

McCartney's solo album and he was going to call

13:33

it Paul McCartney Goes Too

13:35

Far and John was sort of encouraging

13:37

him to do this. Paul, he's not

13:39

prepared to put this out in the

13:41

style of electronic sign or two versions

13:44

or whatever but this is a forerunner

13:46

of the sort of thing that John

13:48

does or George does and if

13:50

you remember all the way back to the Zappal

13:52

episode that we did where they talked about these

13:55

disposable almost like magazines. Yes, Zappal

13:57

would put these out. There would be interviews that

13:59

would be pulled. and ratings and he describes it

14:01

to Mark Lewis and in those times he said

14:03

it was like a magazine program full of weird

14:06

interviews experimental music templates and some tracks I knew

14:08

the others hadn't heard it was just a compilation

14:10

of odd things so

14:13

you know credit where credit is due Paul

14:16

is prefiguring in

14:18

late 65 what they

14:20

will try to do with Apple and specifically that what

14:22

Barry Miles will try to do with this Apple label

14:24

in 68. Yeah when

14:26

you listen to the YouTube version it does seem

14:28

more like a mixtape it doesn't seem quite as

14:31

experimental as he perhaps remembers it but it's still

14:34

it's still quite unique and you do have

14:36

to wonder how does something like that get

14:38

online because there's there's obviously

14:40

the original tape that was made of

14:42

the show so to speak the unforgettable

14:45

show there's three acetates made

14:47

so where did that tape come from it can

14:49

only have come from his archive to go online

14:51

and it does bring into the wider question which

14:53

is something we asked from time to time which

14:55

is oh my god what else is in that archive you

14:57

know what what other tapes and

14:59

demos and magical things from the 60s and 70s exist

15:01

there but it is incredible that this does exist and

15:04

it is online if you want to have a listen

15:06

to it yes what is

15:08

that archive again if they need some archivist to

15:10

come along and listen to everything totally

15:12

happy to do that also

15:15

sitting in this archive is apparently another

15:17

Paul McCartney Christmas record he's

15:19

never done making Christmas record well

15:23

this came to light in 2019

15:25

that he has a private Christmas record

15:27

that he has compiled over

15:29

the years at home that that's crossed

15:32

out every Christmas in the McCartney has sold yes

15:35

so he said in 2019 years ago

15:37

I thought there's not very good Christmas

15:39

records really so

15:42

I actually went into my studio over a couple

15:44

of years and I made one the kids like

15:46

it it's something they've heard through the years you

15:48

know and now it's the grandkids getting indoctrinated with

15:50

my Carol's record and he was asked you know

15:52

can we expect this to come out and he

15:55

said I will never release this is despite it

15:57

being popular it will never come out so

15:59

it'll come eventually I'm sure. We'll

16:01

expect it next year, anytime,

16:04

in multi-coloured vinyl editions. You

16:06

see there's another iteration of

16:09

McCartney 3 coming out? Is there?

16:11

Yeah, different colour cover

16:14

or something. Really, three

16:16

years down the track we've got another McCartney

16:18

3 coming? Apparently. It is a Christmas record

16:20

in McCartney 3, that's a hill I will

16:22

die on. But this brings us

16:24

to 1966 and by the time we get to 1966 and the Christmas record it

16:26

has its

16:30

own universe. It's not like here's

16:32

another message record, it has a

16:34

title which is Pantomime, colon, everywhere

16:36

it's Christmas. And what's

16:38

nice to think about it is they

16:41

have returned to the studio in

16:43

November 1966. They start work on

16:45

Strawberry Fields and then,

16:47

you know, we think of Strawberry Fields

16:49

as this very serious, very austere, experimental

16:52

piece of work and then they

16:54

take a break from Strawberry Fields to do

16:56

this which is very fun, playful, mop

16:58

top type behaviour and

17:00

perhaps not exactly what we think is happening

17:02

in the background of Strawberry Fields as creation.

17:06

No, you think of Strawberry Fields which is sort of

17:08

leading into 67 as being

17:10

sort of acid-fueled and very

17:12

serious and experimental. There

17:14

hasn't been a Beatles recording session for five months.

17:17

We can kind of walk through the evolution

17:20

of Strawberry Fields and that turns up on

17:22

Anthology 2, it turns up on the box

17:24

set, etc. They will go

17:26

back on the 28th of

17:28

November and sort of have another attempt

17:30

at that but in between, so it's

17:32

actually sandwiched in between the two recording

17:34

sessions, on the 25th of November

17:37

they said don't record their Christmas record for

17:39

66. So one I would

17:41

say very late in the day, in the

17:43

year to be doing this on the 25th

17:45

of November. Secondly, as you

17:47

say, this is a different type

17:50

of Christmas record because it's something

17:52

that they have scripted or more

17:54

specifically Paul has scripted. There's a

17:56

structure to it. He has a different type of record. He

17:58

has an idea and And this

18:01

idea of sort of pantomime in inverted

18:03

commas, which is quite an English thing,

18:06

I suppose, you know, maybe American listeners or

18:08

people outside England or outside the UK. Pantomime

18:12

is just, what, fairy tales

18:14

on a stage. There's people

18:16

dressing up, you know. Oh,

18:19

no, it isn't. Oh, yes, it

18:21

is. Oh, no, it isn't. It's

18:24

a very English Christmas tradition. And Paul

18:26

obviously has this in mind, but he's

18:29

controlling everything from the scripting to the

18:31

recording to the production to the cover.

18:33

This is very much Paul's

18:35

baby. Yeah, it is.

18:38

I mean, you're right. They've left it to the

18:40

11th hour. Usually they record these things more, you

18:42

know, the usually late October that they get recorded.

18:44

But obviously the Beatles have not been together near

18:46

a microphone for months. John's been doing, you know,

18:48

they came off stage at Candlestick Park at the

18:51

end of August. John went off to do How

18:53

I Won the War. George went

18:55

off on his travels. He's

18:57

kind of doing their own thing. And

19:00

this is the first time they've had the opportunity to

19:03

record. So yeah, the 24th of November,

19:05

66 is when they're back into the studio after

19:07

five months. They're doing this very

19:09

early version of The Final Apology 2 of Strawberry

19:11

Fields. And they're due back in

19:13

to work on Strawberry Fields on the 28th. But

19:17

it's in between on the 25th that

19:19

they start to work on this Christmas

19:21

record. And it's also unique because before

19:23

it's been kind of Tiny Barrows job to put

19:26

it all together. This time George Martin

19:28

is the producer and George

19:30

Martin is involved. And it's not happening at

19:32

Abbey Road either. So yes, so they will

19:34

record this in Dick James studio in

19:37

71 to 75 New York, straight London. So

19:41

this is just a very small studio

19:43

that Dick James, our music publisher, uses

19:45

to record demos and

19:47

things like that. But before they end

19:50

up there, they go to see Jimi

19:52

Hendrix at the Bag of Nails. Now

19:55

this is amazing that this is the day after

19:57

they start Strawberry Fields before they work on their

19:59

Christmas Clapton

22:00

grows his perm realizes there's a new

22:02

kid in town. It's all up for

22:04

grabs That is

22:06

such a weird thing for Eric Clapton to

22:09

do To

22:11

grow you see me Hendrix you think oh I'd

22:13

like an afro too and then I can be

22:15

like Jimmy Hendrix that's such a you know Clapton

22:17

was regarded as the the

22:20

greatest guitar player in London at the time and It

22:23

just seems very odd to me that it's like

22:25

a fanboy thing that that I'm

22:27

gonna go and get my hair cut, you know I

22:30

think in many ways Clapton was a trailblazer

22:32

in cultural appropriation. Let's put it that way

22:37

So yeah, so after Seeing

22:39

Jimi Hendrix kind of set the world on fire They

22:41

go into a small studio in New

22:43

Oxford Street to record a very silly

22:47

proto Monty Python kind of

22:49

post goons type of You

22:52

know Christmas record Yes,

22:55

and John Eden who is a recording

22:57

engineer He says it was an in-house

22:59

recording facility built within the confines of

23:01

an office structure and its main use

23:04

Was for songwriter demos so

23:06

it is not a sophisticated

23:08

studio. It will lead on

23:10

to DJM Records,

23:12

which is an independent record label in the late

23:15

60s Elton John is probably

23:17

the most famous but horse lips the

23:19

tremolos Danny Kerwin Dennis

23:22

Waterman he writes the theme songs.

23:24

He plays the theme songs People

23:27

outside the UK won't know what that means

23:29

and best to last John Inman released

23:32

records on the DJM label and

23:35

and also Jasper Carrot released his records

23:37

on the the DJM label as well

23:39

who Subsequently went on to become

23:41

a millionaire by being behind a production company

23:43

of who wants to be a millionaire That's

23:45

what Jasper Carrot does these days. Well,

23:48

he was better production company manager than

23:50

he was comedian as I remember I

23:53

went to Jasper Carrot live a few years ago in Dublin

23:55

and it was by 2018 and I thought

23:57

okay I'm gonna see Jasper Carrot live And

24:00

it was bizarre. It wasn't

24:03

funny, but he was kind of just telling stories

24:05

off the top of his head and being quite

24:07

charming about it. And then towards the end he

24:09

decided he would tell a great story about the

24:11

Royal Family and how friendly he was with them.

24:14

And that for some reason the Dublin crowd

24:16

were like, yeah, we don't need care about

24:18

this one, Jasper. And so

24:20

the show kind of hinted on a bit of

24:22

a lull. But it was very strange. Anyway, that's

24:24

enough Jasper carrot chat. But

24:27

back to pantomime everywhere, it's Christmas.

24:30

Yeah, they're in this tiny studio. Lord knows why

24:32

they wouldn't just use Abbey Road for

24:35

the purposes of it. But yeah, and

24:37

it's scripted by Paul. It

24:40

is scripted by Paul. I suppose

24:43

there's a narrative of sorts. It's

24:45

very strange. But yeah, he

24:47

scripts it. And this is something I only

24:49

found out when I was researching

24:52

this, is that I knew that he'd done the cover. But

24:55

he said, I drew the cover myself. There's a

24:57

sort of funny pantomime horse in the design if

24:59

you look closely. But if

25:02

you look at the cover, and we'll put this up

25:05

on X and on Facebook,

25:07

you can sort of see. You

25:09

can sort of see. No, I was squinting at

25:11

it last night like one of those kind of magic

25:14

eye pictures. And I'm like, oh yeah, there is a

25:16

horse shape there. The little bubbles are the legs and

25:18

the P and the T are kind of at the

25:20

bottom of the head. And I'm

25:22

kind of right here pointing up at the top. I do get

25:25

it. And once again, if you

25:27

are outside the UK or Ireland, the notion

25:29

of what a pantomime horse is might not

25:31

necessarily be readily apparent. So I do

25:33

feel we have to point out that a pantomime horse is

25:35

a character in most pantomimes where two people dress

25:38

up as the front and rear end of a

25:40

horse and then sort of gallop

25:42

around as

25:44

part of the show. My memory is that US

25:46

audiences would have been exposed to this on the

25:50

Late Late Show with Craig Ferguson, who had a

25:52

pantomime horse for many years running around in the

25:54

background. But yes, that's a pantomime

25:56

horse. It does look like a

25:59

pantomime horse. I'm squinting. at it now but you'd

26:01

have to be maybe a little bit chemically

26:04

altered to fully see it. So

26:06

it is Paul's baby, so

26:08

what is the logic of the story or is there a

26:10

logic to the story? Well

26:13

there are ten parts to this

26:15

story. It's all sort of

26:17

recorded, everybody sings on it, Paul plays

26:19

the piano, it then goes back to

26:21

George Martin who chops it up. So

26:23

it lasts for six minutes and

26:26

it includes various sketches including Poggie

26:28

the Bear and Jasper which is

26:31

probably my favourite, favourite

26:33

thing. There's a title tune, Everywhere

26:35

It's Christmas which is a very

26:37

kind of music called Vaudevillian style

26:40

and Ringo talks about this. He said we worked it out

26:42

between us, Paul did most of the work on it, he

26:44

thought up the pantomime title and

26:47

the two song things and we're

26:49

firmly back in Goons territory here

26:52

I think. And of course George Martin

26:55

is background in comedy records with

26:57

Peter Sellers, Spike Milligan, Goons etc

26:59

etc. Ken Wilmach in his

27:01

book Maximum Volume the Life of

27:04

producer George Martin says Paul McCartney once

27:06

remarked that everybody from Liverpool is a comedian.

27:08

This was certainly true of the Beatles whose wit

27:10

featured in many of their releases. In many ways their

27:12

shared love of comedy and witnesses brought George and

27:14

the band closer together and

27:16

this is probably the prime example of

27:19

that. So should we just briefly go through

27:22

the running order of what happens? Yeah. Follow

27:24

the plot. It opens with

27:26

the theme song Everywhere It's Christmas, Everywhere

27:28

It's Song London, Paris, Rome, New York, Tokyo,

27:31

Hong Kong, blah blah blah everywhere it's Christmas

27:33

at the end of every year so that's

27:35

there the kind of the overarching theme and

27:37

then it opens in Corsica where

27:40

a bearded man in glasses conducts

27:42

a small choir and there

27:44

is a sort of chant, Orowania,

27:46

Orowania that they chant and then

27:49

we go to the Swiss Alps where

27:51

a pair of elderly Scotsman munch on

27:53

a rare cheese and then to the

27:55

long dark corridor of Thelpen mansion home

27:57

of the Germanic Count Baldur. Even these

28:00

these names are all straight out of

28:02

the goons. Yes, it's very,

28:04

very goons. And yeah,

28:08

it then kind of proceeds through

28:10

this kind of evocative setup into the story

28:13

of Pudgy the Bear and Jasper, which as

28:15

you say is probably the best

28:17

one where, you know, they

28:20

have no more matches left and they have to go

28:22

buy some and then they need

28:24

to buy candles. So, you know, there's no

28:26

paper to write on Pudgy. No need to

28:28

worry Jasper, you just keep saying to yourself

28:31

matches and I'll keep saying candles until we

28:33

reach the shop. Then we won't need to write

28:35

it down. Who will remember the

28:37

buns Pudgy? We both will Jasper. And

28:39

then we'll just repeat the chant matches, candles,

28:43

matches, candles,

28:46

matches, etc, etc.

28:51

You're getting sleepy. What's not to love?

28:56

And then where we kind

28:59

of move on to getting to the Banjo

29:01

song that makes its first appearance. So

29:03

the title is Please Don't Bring Your Banjo

29:05

Back and the lyrics are Please Don't Bring

29:08

Your Banjo Back. I don't know where it's

29:10

been. I wasn't hardly gone a day when

29:12

it became the scene. Banjos, Banjos all the

29:14

time. I can't forget that tune. And if

29:16

I ever see another banjo, I'm going out

29:18

to buy a big balloon. That's the hit single

29:20

that never was. Well, you know,

29:22

between the two kind of songs and the chants

29:24

and everything else, there is, you

29:26

know, I said this is a hidden history. You

29:29

do have these little hidden beetle nuggets of songs,

29:31

you know, like in a year

29:33

or two, we'll be hanging on to nuggets

29:35

like, you know, Can You Take Me Back

29:37

on the White Album, you know, these little

29:39

kind of wild honey pie moments, but these

29:41

little fragmentary kind of melodic moments all start

29:43

on these types of

29:45

records. And it's all

29:47

very evocative. It is.

29:49

And I think it's very funny that Rolling

29:52

Stone gave it quite a serious review in

29:54

2017. So it said, though

29:56

brief, the songs are evocative and in

29:58

some cases quite memorable. Orowania,

30:01

ostensibly sung by a Corsican choir, is

30:03

a strangely beautiful pop hymnal that wouldn't

30:05

have sounded like a place on a

30:07

smile-era Beach Boys album. And the baudevillian

30:09

wink of please don't bring your banjo

30:12

back, I don't know where it's been,

30:14

is as funny as it is baudy.

30:16

And I think hilariously

30:18

funny that Rolling Stone are treating

30:20

it as

30:23

a straightforward review. And also

30:26

Brian is present at the recording which is

30:28

nice as well. Yes, that

30:30

is a nice thing that he's there. It's a shame that

30:32

they didn't get Brian to play

30:35

the part of Poggio or Jasper. No,

30:38

but we do have a special

30:40

guest star in Mal Evans. Mal

30:42

appears on the record. Mal does

30:44

appear on the record, absolutely. Which

30:46

is pretty wild. So

30:48

the kind of the single, it's the

30:50

first double-sided single, it's over six minutes

30:53

long and it finishes

30:55

again with Everywhere It's Christmas, the

30:57

theme song. And because there working

30:59

to a very tight schedule, you know,

31:01

they recorded on the 25th of

31:03

November, George Martin Goes Away puts it

31:06

all together, it's mixed on the 2nd

31:08

of December by Jeff Emmerich and Tony

31:10

Barrow and it gets released on the

31:13

16th of December 66. And it

31:15

comes in its usual

31:17

kind of fan club newsletter which is, you

31:20

know, written by Good Old Frieda and Anne

31:22

Collingham. So it has

31:25

an update and I think the thing we need

31:27

to remember is that the Beatles are,

31:29

for the first time, will not have a new release

31:31

out for Christmas 67. So, you

31:33

know, the previous three Christmases we've had with the

31:36

Beatles, Beatles For Sale, Rubber Soul, you know,

31:38

December 66th. There's no new Beatle product in

31:40

the shop. There hasn't been any new Beatles

31:42

material since August. And this

31:45

is the new Beatles single that, you know, the

31:47

people have to look at to see, well, what

31:49

are they up to? Are they still together? Are

31:51

they still doing stuff? And

31:54

yeah, the kind of the fan club letter covers

31:56

all of that and tells people what's been going

31:58

on in the recording. studio and even has the

32:01

lyrics to please don't bring your banjo back in

32:03

everywhere it's Christmas and so people are

32:05

waiting for this to pop into their letterbox to see what

32:07

the fab four are up to. Absolutely

32:09

and you think if you sold in a

32:11

vertical was 20 or 30 thousand copies of

32:14

single today would be number one. Yeah

32:17

the first Christmas record had the bank

32:20

club message printed on the sleeve but all the

32:22

subsequent ones come with this sort of folded newsletter

32:24

and as you say it's a sort of message

32:28

to say this is what they're doing this

32:31

is how it was recorded you know it

32:33

was done just after Paul came back from

32:35

Kenya wishing everybody happy Christmas

32:37

and a successful 67. This

32:39

is this is the single that

32:42

never was. How

32:44

long before we get the two songs,

32:46

all the songs extracted and put

32:49

together. Oh man we

32:51

really need Peter Jackson on speed dial the

32:53

thing I liked about their fan club note was

32:56

it was two things they talked about you know

32:58

Brian was in the control room and there was

33:00

a closed circuit television system so the people in

33:02

the control room could see what was happening at

33:04

the studio at the other end of the corridor

33:06

which sounds very very high tech and

33:08

you know the other thing that they

33:10

said they're quite clear in the fan

33:12

club newsletter to say unlike previous productions

33:15

this year's disc doesn't include actual Christmas

33:17

greetings from the Beatles instead the boys

33:19

devised this pantomime idea and it's longer

33:21

than any of the three earlier fan club

33:23

records so they're you know they're telegraphing it

33:25

in an appropriate manner. It is

33:27

reported in the music press so

33:30

for example it says Beatles

33:32

this is in the disc and music

33:34

echo so this would be tiny Barrow

33:37

doing this and it says into about 60,000

33:40

letterboxes this week slips a new

33:42

Beatles single and

33:45

then it talks about songs everywhere

33:47

it's Christmas please don't bring your banjo

33:49

back it would make you join the

33:53

fan club to hear what is

33:55

being titled as a new single and

33:57

again it's all treated very seriously.

34:00

Chris Hutchins writes, the Beatles survived good

34:02

humor once again. Instead of the usual

34:04

Yuletide gridding, they devised a pantomime as

34:06

a seasonal offer. This is definitely a

34:08

record, I think, the coverage is such

34:10

that it would make you want to

34:13

join the backdrop just to get these new songs. Yeah,

34:17

if you look at these press reports at

34:19

the time, again, you know, there's a Beatle

34:21

blackout in terms of new material, but all

34:23

of a sudden you have articles headlined, you

34:25

know, the Beatles, the best single money can't

34:27

buy, and the Beatles goon it up again

34:29

article that Chris Hutchins article, you know, has

34:31

a picture of Paul's cover, and

34:33

it has the kind of the front and

34:35

back cover of the single, and it even has

34:37

the dialogue of matches and candles, matches and

34:39

candles, all there. So, you know, for

34:42

people who are hungry, and you know, the only thing

34:44

that is coming into the shops from the Beatles

34:46

is a collection of Beatles oldies is coming

34:48

out. But yeah,

34:50

this seems very exciting.

34:53

But again, it doesn't really even though

34:55

it's a new type of Christmas record,

34:57

it doesn't really give anything away that

34:59

you know, the music they're

35:01

recording is Strawberry Fields Forever in between

35:03

all of this. No, there's

35:05

no hint of what's coming in Sergeant Pepper

35:07

or the Strawberry Fields Penny Lane single.

35:10

I suppose if anything, it is

35:12

a throwback to

35:15

radio comedy shows of early 50s, early

35:18

60s, but done in a very

35:21

surrealistic way. And I suppose

35:23

the only hint of what might

35:25

be to come is the fact that they're using studio

35:27

production techniques. And it's not just

35:30

a straight to microphone. This

35:32

is John speaking with his voice. Have

35:34

a lovely Christmas. Yeah, if you wanted

35:36

to get totally highfalutin about these kinds

35:38

of things, certainly

35:40

throughout the flower power 67 era,

35:43

there's very much this regression into

35:45

childhood motif that comes up where people

35:47

are looking back, whether it's kind of

35:49

the Victorian of the clothes or these

35:52

kind of childhood kind of memories, which you see

35:54

with said Barrett's work as well. So you can

35:56

think, well, actually, this is a little bit of

35:58

a harbinger of that because they're is

38:00

doing his thing in the 70s, people

38:02

are much less forgiving about the silly and the

38:04

goofy side of things. If he's saying, I'm going

38:06

to do a Bond theme and I'm going to

38:08

do Bruce McMouse and hope he can stop me.

38:11

I think it's the same kind of mind at work

38:14

there, whereas when he's in The Beatles, and he's like,

38:16

yeah, I've written a pantomime with silly songs, they're like,

38:18

yep, let's do it. The Beatles,

38:20

it's incredible how they kind of got away with being

38:22

able to do that, whereas by the time we get

38:24

to the 70s, John and

38:27

George are being very serious and Paul

38:30

still wants to play a little bit.

38:32

And that kind of goes out of fashion in a

38:34

way. That's a good point. I suppose by 1970, Rock

38:37

was taking it sort of extremely seriously. You

38:39

mean you would like to hear Led Zeppelin's

38:42

Christmas record? In

38:46

1970 or 1971, I was trying to

38:49

think, as you were saying, that, you know, would

38:51

the Stones do this? Would the

38:53

Who do this? But then I suppose the Who sort

38:55

of do that on the Who

38:57

sell out, where they put little skits

39:00

and ads and things in

39:02

between. So the Who have that comic

39:05

side to what they do as well, as

39:08

well as being incredibly pretentious

39:10

at times. But once

39:13

Who's next rolls around, they're

39:15

not going back there. They're

39:17

not going to do

39:20

that again. But I suppose the Who record is

39:22

the one that I would think of as being

39:24

comparable. Yeah, I suppose so. And a

39:26

quick one while he's away, but I haven't just read a

39:28

book, another book about the Who. I've read

39:31

the authorized biography of John Entwistle, which is

39:33

called The Ox, which I would recommend. I'd

39:35

put it on the long finger because I

39:38

didn't want to start hating John Entwistle. But

39:40

I've now read a Keith book, a Pete book, a Roger

39:42

book and a John book. And what you kind of realize

39:45

from a group like the Who in particular

39:47

is how did they get anything done because

39:49

they really hated each other's company all the

39:51

time forever, which is

39:53

very unlike the Beatles. The Beatles kind of

39:55

enjoyed being together up until up until

39:58

they didn't. And as soon as they didn't reach enjoy being

40:00

together they knocked it on the head which is kind

40:02

of quite remarkable whereas the

40:04

who from the get-go were never all

40:06

they were never a four-headed monster that's

40:09

just a side point it's it's kind

40:11

of curious and had the

40:13

who managed to get anything done can I just ask

40:15

whenever you say you recommend this book are

40:19

you recommending it in the same way that

40:21

you recommended the Phil Collins autobiography no

40:24

no I'm not I think the John

40:26

M. Twistle book is good he's a very strange man

40:28

I think he

40:30

he couldn't control himself for you

40:33

know he seems to have an

40:35

awful lot of compulsive disorders

40:37

going on in terms of how we would

40:39

spend money and acquire things and do everything

40:41

to excess but it is

40:43

a it is an interesting it is an

40:45

interesting read and because it's it's based on

40:48

a you know some of the papers from an

40:50

official autobiography he was trying to write in the 90s

40:52

it kind of dips into his own voice from time

40:54

to time and you know I kind

40:57

of feel sorry for him a little bit and

40:59

but you know he seemed to live the

41:01

life he wanted so maybe I shouldn't feel sorry for him it's

41:05

it's a three-day times but I would recommend okay

41:07

okay I think it is a good point

41:13

they enjoyed each other's company and they are

41:16

the point you made you know Paul has

41:18

been off in Kenya George has been in India

41:21

John and Ringo have been in Spain this

41:24

is the this is the second recording

41:27

session in six months

41:29

you know so they come back they

41:31

do a pass at strawberry fields and then they go in

41:33

and do this and it's maybe a nice way for them

41:35

to reconnect after

41:37

that time apart we should probably

41:39

give a nod to the final three

41:42

Christmas records because this 66 one is

41:44

right in the middle it's number four

41:46

of seven and you know the Christmas

41:48

time is here again in 1967 is

41:50

possibly the best well-known because it has a

41:52

fantastic actual song attached to it which is

41:54

the theme tune Christmas time is here again

41:56

which is lost on the B side of

41:58

free as a bird If you want to

42:00

that's the only place you can get the full

42:03

Christmas time is here again single But that is

42:05

actually a Beatles song that could exist as its

42:07

own standalone Song it's a brilliant bit

42:09

of 67 pops like it healing

42:11

and it does exist as

42:13

a standalone song on Ringo's Christmas album

42:17

He does a recording. Hey, yes, it I

42:19

have to say I I really

42:21

recommend that album That is such a good song

42:23

and there's a song on it called Christmas

42:26

dance which is

42:29

Fantastic Christmas song, you know

42:32

it my heart sank when I heard that

42:34

Ringo was doing a Christmas album I just thought this

42:36

is gonna be terrible and there are some terrible songs

42:39

on it. But half of it is

42:41

absolutely fantastic including a

42:43

sort of Well, people

42:46

should go and listen to it, but it's a kind of Harry

42:50

Nilsson style punning song

42:52

on it. Yeah. Yeah, I recommend

42:54

it. I recommend it But

42:57

yeah Christmas time is here again also has the kind

42:59

of them the same bit

43:01

of sketch work that they had in the 66 one

43:04

where John Lennon resides when Christmas

43:06

time is over when the Beastie bag drum button

43:08

to the Heather and little in and be frightened

43:10

ultimate tether to your Arms once back again. Oh,

43:12

come away your Bonnie. It's nice to think that

43:14

in 1967

43:16

for Christmas they were doing a single

43:18

a TV special a double EP and

43:20

also a fan club record They were

43:23

giving it their all still at the end of 67 value

43:26

from mine But the last two Christmas

43:28

records are very different These are 68

43:30

and 69 and these are not recorded

43:32

together And in this notion that

43:34

the the Christmas records are a parallel history of what

43:37

happens with the Beatles Them

43:39

not recording the Christmas 68 and Christmas

43:41

69 records together is emblematic of that.

43:43

Yes Absolutely. So

43:45

by 68 they're recording things

43:49

Separately and and sort of slotting it together And

43:51

if you look at the liner notes, it says

43:53

recorded in November 1968 at

43:55

the lush London homes of Beatle John and

43:58

Beatle Paul and in the back of Beetle

44:00

Ringo's diesel part removal fan somewhere in

44:02

Surrey. The voice of Beetle George is

44:04

heard because, eursofidfully, the GPD

44:07

did something right and joined up

44:09

6,000 miles of telephone links

44:11

at an appropriate moment. Additional material was

44:13

recorded earlier in the elegant eater home

44:15

of Beetle George during the

44:17

rehearsal sessions for the Beatles LP album set.

44:19

So they're making no bones about the fact

44:23

that this is all recorded separately.

44:25

So we get a little acoustic

44:27

number from Paul, John

44:29

besides, jock and yono, and

44:33

Once Upon a Pool Table. But

44:35

the highlight is not from a beetle,

44:38

the highlight is from Tiny

44:40

Tim, who shows

44:42

up singing, singing Nowhere

44:44

Man, Nowhere Man. Is that not

44:46

your, that's the highlight of your unpacking

44:49

your Christmas decorations and Beatles box set

44:51

to hear Tiny Tim singing Nowhere Man.

44:54

If you want a depressing book recommendation, read

44:57

Tiny Tim's biography. That is a hard read.

45:00

Yeah, 68 and 69's discs are

45:02

put together by Morris Cole, aka

45:04

Kenny Everett. The Christmas

45:07

69 one exists in that realm that

45:09

we call Schrodinger's Beatles, where even

45:11

though the Beatles have supposedly split up, they

45:13

have still decided to put together a Christmas

45:15

record and send it to all the fans

45:18

in December 1969, which,

45:20

you know, features all

45:23

four Beatles on a record in December 69. Yeah,

45:27

so, you know, Paul does quite

45:29

well, he's committed. John has

45:31

a chat with Yoko. George, I think gets

45:33

one line, and Ringo

45:36

just says, hey Kenny, could you

45:38

plug Magic Christian, which is

45:40

the movie. And Kenny Everett manages

45:42

to turn that into a little kind of speeded

45:44

up jingle.

45:46

So as you say, it absolutely

45:49

reflects the fact that they are

45:52

apart. They're not even prepared

45:54

to get in the studio together.

45:57

To do this. Yeah.

46:00

but there is Beatle business to be done which

46:02

is curious however by December 1970

46:04

there isn't a Beatles Christmas record anymore because

46:06

there isn't a Beatles so they just assemble

46:08

them all together and put them

46:11

out of the compilation of P called

46:13

From Then to You and you could argue

46:15

that this is perhaps something that should

46:18

have been maybe made more official if

46:20

people wanted to hear these things but

46:22

1970 is also you know we're in

46:24

full tilt bootleg boom time

46:26

and so this kind of

46:28

Christmas collection gets essentially

46:31

circulated as a as a bootleg.

46:34

Yeah so it becomes one of the most widely

46:36

available bootlegs and it makes it

46:38

very difficult to determine you

46:40

know it's difficult to tell the bootleg

46:42

from the original so the original LP

46:46

version goes for serious money but

46:49

most of the ones that I've ever seen

46:51

I'm pretty certain have been copies

46:56

these were never available outside

46:58

the UK so the

47:00

seven messages in America put out in

47:02

it's really came out in the spring

47:04

of 1971 that's the first time

47:07

these things had been available in

47:09

the US until 2017 when we

47:12

got our box set and I think

47:14

the box set is nice should it be more widely

47:17

available should you be able to pick it up whenever

47:19

you want yeah there's arguments for that I I think

47:21

there is an argument for not releasing it as a

47:23

general release because I don't think a lot of people

47:25

would understand I know they would think it would be

47:28

a an album of Christmas classics and it's it's not

47:30

and I would annoy people but it's

47:32

out there if you wanted and the box sets in

47:35

2017 is a nice thing however it's

47:37

going for about 250 quid these days

47:39

which is about twice what most

47:41

people paid for it originally but

47:43

it's a nice you know box

47:45

with seven colored vinyl records in

47:48

reproduction sleeves and you know

47:50

a covering book to tell us

47:52

all what we need it's got the nice original

47:54

Beatles logo it doesn't have to drop T logo

47:56

it has the curly B with antennae logo which

47:59

is nice to see on an official Beatles

48:01

release. I think I must now

48:04

go and play it for the first time. You

48:07

should go and treat yourself. I mean, these discs, if you do

48:09

want to buy them in 2023, do have a value. The

48:13

63 to 65 discs are going for about 30 quid,

48:16

but the one we're talking about today, the 17th song

48:18

of 66, 150 quid is pretty valuable. 67

48:23

goes for about 50 quid, 68 goes for about 100 quid, and 69

48:25

goes for 150. And

48:30

the 1970 record goes for 350 pounds. So

48:34

people can convert that into their own local currency.

48:36

But that is, you know, if you have a

48:38

full set, you'd make a good bit of money.

48:40

Make a tidy sum. I have the first three

48:42

that I've picked up for sort of 20 quid

48:44

each. And I would dearly love to

48:46

get the rest, but I couldn't possibly justify spending

48:48

150, 200 quid. If

48:51

I win the lottery, that's what I'll go on. I

48:54

think you could justify it, you know. That

48:57

set of completion, that John Entwistle gene

48:59

that you have to buy one of

49:01

everything. Yeah, that's true. That

49:04

OCD, I need the set, I need the set.

49:06

But yeah, that is the 17th song of

49:09

1966. So

49:13

the 17th of the 16 songs that

49:15

came out to about 60,000

49:17

UK fans from whom it dropped into

49:19

their letterbox in

49:22

order to give an indication of what the Beatles

49:24

were up to when it seemed like they'd been

49:26

quiet for a relatively short time

49:28

in 2023. I said, four months? Oh

49:30

my God, what could the Beatles have? All months.

49:32

But they're not finished. This was an indication that

49:35

they were back in the studio, that they were

49:37

still funny, they were still entertaining. And

49:39

yeah, I think everybody should go away and dig

49:41

out their Christmas records box set or see which

49:43

bits and pieces you can find on YouTube. They're

49:45

not all on YouTube. It's a bit tricky. I

49:47

think Apple kind of champed down a few years

49:49

ago on them circulating them on

49:52

YouTube. But they are always a fun listen at

49:54

this time of year. So

49:56

yeah, I think you should break out your box, Steven. I

49:59

will do that as soon as possible. as we finish

50:01

recording this I'm going to spend the day in front

50:03

of a crackling log fire roasting chestnuts and listening to

50:06

the Beatles singles. You

50:09

heard it here first. But what do

50:11

you think everybody? The 17th song of 1966. We want to

50:15

thank all our ACAS Plus supporters. You

50:18

know we have to leave 2023 on a nice Christmassy

50:22

note and obviously we're available in all

50:24

the usual places www.nothingisrealpod.com x

50:27

the Nothing Is Real Facebook group. Give

50:29

us a nudge and tell us what you think about

50:32

all the Christmas records. But for now my name

50:34

is Jasper and my name is Podgy the Bear.

50:37

Candles, matches, candles,

50:41

matches, candles, matches,

50:47

matches, candles, matches,

50:51

candles, matches,

51:13

I don't think we can fade out on that. That's

51:15

enough to drive people crazy. Thanks

51:19

for listening to Nothing Is Real. We hope you

51:22

enjoyed today's episode and if you did why not

51:24

become a member. You'll get access to ad free

51:26

content, bonus episodes and so much more. Follow the

51:28

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51:30

Plus or visit our website nothingisrealpod.com