0:12

Hi, How are you good?

0:14

Thanks? How are you doing?

0:15

I'm good? So you've been on here once

0:18

before? Can you tell

0:20

everybody what are you? Because I

0:22

have a woman who I work with who's a psychoanalyst.

0:24

I've been working with her for years. I never knew exactly

0:27

what she is. She could be a b diatrist

0:29

for all I know. She's very, very helpful, and she listens

0:31

and she's smart. But she's a psychoanalyst.

0:34

So what are you?

0:35

I'm a psychologist. I

0:38

work what you would call a CBT psychologist,

0:40

so cognitive behavioral therapist. So

0:43

within psychology

0:45

there's many different orientations

0:47

how do we do things? So

0:50

I work a lot with people with

0:53

the way that they think their rational thoughts

0:56

as opposed to their irrational thoughts, how their irrational

0:58

thoughts affect their behavior. But

1:00

I take it from a different approach. I take it from a

1:03

family systems approach where they come from.

1:05

So I specialize in family.

1:08

You know, doing what I do, it's hard not to

1:10

write because we all come from family. So if you don't

1:13

understand a healthy family dynamic or what

1:15

an unhealthy family dynamic creates, it's hard

1:17

to do what you do. So I specialize.

1:20

I like to say, I specialize in people, and

1:22

I treat the person so

1:25

a lot of anxiety, a lot of a lot of depression,

1:28

a lot of trauma work. So it all

1:30

depends on what they're bringing me. I

1:32

want to I think it's very important that

1:34

we look at that person and understand

1:37

who they are and where they come from and treat

1:39

that.

1:40

And you work with kids and adults.

1:42

Correct.

1:42

Okay, So I

1:45

recently experienced a

1:47

death and it's become this conversation

1:49

that has been surprisingly shockingly

1:53

not shockingly, but surprisingly

1:56

engaging, because I think so many people are

1:59

repressing these discussions

2:01

and not talking about it. People don't

2:03

always talk about sex, people don't always talk about

2:05

money. People certainly don't talk about

2:07

death in like a complex way. They'll

2:09

talk about they experience the death, they're

2:12

sad about their situation, but there aren't

2:14

these sort of cross channels of discussion that

2:16

I'm finding, particularly in women and

2:19

the what's going on. And it's sort of like

2:21

there's like a one size fits all death grieving

2:24

model versus like the different

2:27

types which I sort of came to. So

2:29

I was realizing a couple things. I was realizing

2:32

one that there's

2:34

obviously no right

2:36

or wrong, but every single type

2:38

of death is different, and each death

2:41

has a different dynamic. So, like I've

2:43

said, someone could be ninety six years old, had a beautiful

2:45

life, had a great family, everything was

2:47

healthy. That's sad they've been around so long.

2:50

Somebody else loses God forbid someone I can't even

2:52

say it out loud, but younger than them, or

2:54

someone takes their own life, or there's addiction,

2:57

it's an unexpected accident, and

2:59

like each thing has a different tone

3:04

to it. And then

3:07

as a cousin to that, there are

3:09

many different brands and types of grieving.

3:11

I thought about all of this during what I chose to

3:13

do, just based on my own gut, but

3:15

there are many different types of grieving. So

3:18

I've seen really only Shiva

3:22

and Catholic and wake and everyone

3:24

together and laughing and food

3:26

and flowers and jokes and getting drunk

3:28

and stories and photos, and I

3:32

did not I've done that. But

3:35

in my recent loss of my mother, I

3:37

feel like in both scenarios, it

3:40

was kind of an unusual circumstance

3:42

with the death and the grieving, So

3:46

I kind of wanted to get into both of those

3:48

situations because me bringing up

3:51

the fact that it was a complicated relationship.

3:55

You don't want to be disingenuous and like act like

3:57

you're like So I was sobbing more than I

3:59

was for people that I had a good relationship with, which is

4:01

crazy, but I didn't want you don't

4:03

want to be disingenuous where you're acting like you had this amazing

4:05

relationship. You're just telling I was just telling the

4:07

truth about what the deal was, right. And

4:10

then also it's not like it's a

4:12

very insular thing, this particular death. So I wasn't

4:14

like having a bunch of people over to tell me how great

4:16

it was and as she lit up the room, so

4:18

it was like a different deal. So

4:21

what do you have Let's we'll get into details after.

4:23

But what do you have to say about both of those constructs?

4:26

No, I think that's very interesting and something

4:28

that we don't really give

4:31

enough credit to is that other kind

4:33

of deaths be more and also so the

4:36

death of a relationship, when the death of a job

4:38

or a situation or an experience, right,

4:42

there are many things we mourn, and there

4:44

are many things that trigger our responses

4:47

in the same way when things

4:49

don't happen. So when you had

4:51

when you say you had a complicated relationship with your mom

4:55

when she passed, Yes, you

4:57

could be mourning the passing of

4:59

your mom, but you can also

5:02

be mourning the potential of a

5:04

better relationship with her. You could

5:06

be mourning having

5:08

that sadness of mourning the loss of a childhood

5:10

that you wish you had. There's

5:13

so many there's so many more complication and

5:15

complicated layers to that

5:17

that it's not you know, it doesn't

5:20

say enough to to say, yeah, I'm sad,

5:22

I'm mourning the loss, because it's it's how many

5:24

losses. There's a lot of losses there.

5:26

Right, And what was shocking to me different

5:28

than any other time. Sometimes

5:31

the stages agree for predictable what people say.

5:33

But in this particular grieving, it

5:35

was like coming out of my body in

5:38

ways that I wasn't expecting. Like I

5:41

was not you're right, like you couldn't

5:43

help, but you were just feeling. And it was like

5:45

I was a going to the

5:48

movie of my entire life that I haven't watched

5:50

ever. I've never watched the movie. I haven't allowed myself

5:52

to go in and see that movie. It's too hard a movie. So

5:54

I watched the movie part of the

5:57

movie was super like happy moments as a child.

5:59

Part was frustration for like not being able

6:01

to continue that and like why. Part

6:03

was the person who passed

6:06

away, like mourning

6:08

them, like their poor life, like

6:10

my poor life, their poor life. The loss

6:13

wasn't really the thing. I was mourning because I

6:15

didn't really have a great relationship. I was mourning.

6:18

I was feeling sorry for myself in many of the

6:20

cases. And I also could only

6:22

live in that movie.

6:25

And then after like a couple of weeks, it just

6:28

like it passed like the movie was over and

6:30

I thought I would never get out of this movie good and bad.

6:32

Yeah, yeah, you know, it's funny with It's an interesting

6:35

analogy that you make. But I'll disagree

6:37

one thing when you say that you never watched the

6:39

movie, right, it's sort of

6:41

we don't go to movie theaters anymore, right, But when you know, when

6:43

you go to a movie theater and you're waiting for

6:46

your theater to open up, but the other theaters

6:48

are playing movies and you sort

6:50

of hear things you don't

6:52

maybe you don't understand the dialogue.

6:55

You hear an explosion, you hear a car chase,

6:57

you hear some left. You hear traces

6:59

of what that movie, but you just don't know what that movie is

7:01

going on. Those memories that are

7:03

really hard to understand, the really hard to take,

7:05

or memories that we had

7:08

that were so harmful and painful

7:10

for us that we pushed back, those

7:13

are like that where they're there.

7:15

It may not be fully aware of them, then

7:17

we may not be fully in touch with them, but

7:20

they're there and they're affecting us, and they're going to affect

7:22

our decisions that we make and how we define

7:24

who we are.

7:26

Right and your subconscious in a

7:28

lot of way. So it's weird how this was a pinata

7:30

that cracked open. I've worked with a psychoanalyst

7:33

for years. She really didn't she knows

7:35

about me because it's drive by explanations.

7:37

Oh yeah, and that used to hap when I was a kid, and that like you're

7:39

saying, but it wasn't ever going there

7:42

and I

7:46

and You're about to get on a rock. It first

7:48

happens and you are like, wait, what's going to happen now?

7:51

Like I remember getting the call and I'm thinking, because

7:53

for many years, I've thought what happens

7:55

the day that she dies? And I've thought

7:57

it was a drawer, and I'd be fine with it because

7:59

it was in a good relationship and it's not at all what you're

8:01

gonna expect. And all of a sudden you're on this

8:04

roller coaster and you're like, we're going on a fucking

8:06

ride right now, and you don't, and it's about to start,

8:08

and you're on the floor, collapsed in the hallway,

8:10

just like needing to be next to the bathroom tile by yourself.

8:13

And then you're in shock, and then you're in denial, and

8:15

then you're in sadness, and then you only are willing

8:18

to listen to one kind of music, like a fucking weirdo,

8:20

and you're up. I still haven't slept a full night

8:22

since it, right, but like things,

8:25

so you know.

8:26

You know, I'll tell you what though, when when I've

8:28

had people in therapy who will

8:31

who will tell me what their life was like, and they'll

8:33

and they'll say it like boom bom boom boom boom,

8:35

sort of like you real quick bullet points,

8:37

this is what it was like, and I I

8:40

have to slow them down. So wait, waite,

8:42

what do you mean, what do you mean that happened? And what

8:45

did you experience? From that and what how did you how

8:47

did you experience that? How do you define that?

8:50

What does that mean to you? Right? And I'll

8:53

be honest with you, I stay away from that real

8:55

douchey psychology question. How

8:57

does that make you feel? I hate that question? Everybody

9:01

that question, right, But you want to

9:03

want to get to that how do you define that? What

9:05

did that mean to you? Because then

9:08

when we slow things down there, it's like, well, I'm in therapy

9:10

and you know I'm doing

9:12

the work well.

9:13

Because some people want to be well, it's like going to the gym

9:15

and just like saying, because you walked in the gym, yes,

9:17

but I will tell you this from my perspective,

9:20

and yes, my therapist has asked me that too. It's

9:23

something that often you're

9:26

in preparation for game day because the truth

9:28

of the matter is you

9:30

saying how to them make you feel? Or whether

9:32

you say what was your experience or whatever you say, it doesn't

9:34

matter. Like this was like I'm

9:37

not saying therapy. Therapy is great and it's amazing,

9:39

and it's like stretching all the

9:41

time, and when the big race

9:43

comes then you're kind of almost prepared

9:45

but not quite. But I will say,

9:48

there's nothing like someone smashing that pinata

9:50

with a bat or doing ayahuasca people

9:52

talk about, or doing emdr or doing like

9:55

this was not something that ten years of therapy could

9:57

do for me. Like people, I think, you just have to be aware

10:00

when the car crash comes or when something

10:02

happens, how you're going to brace yourself

10:05

or how you're going to deal with it. And

10:07

that's where I come up with the not

10:10

going and drinking and laughing

10:12

and getting the pictures out and distracting, Like

10:14

I didn't

10:16

like proactively choose my body,

10:19

chose to just lean

10:21

all the way into it, to get

10:23

outside and take a walk, to listen to the music, to

10:25

cry through it. And

10:28

I didn't know that I was necessarily doing the right thing,

10:31

but it's what I did.

10:32

M Well, maybe it was the right

10:34

thing for that moment and the

10:37

right thing for you at that moment.

10:39

Right, Yeah,

10:42

Now I want to talk about this

10:44

emotional trauma, this generational

10:47

trauma concept. I'd never really heard that term

10:49

before. My followers are so savvy, so

10:51

smart. You everyon want to learn something, go into my comments

10:53

and read their experiences. So

10:55

I've gotten easily a

10:58

thousand messages from people estranged

11:00

from this person that person it's complicated,

11:03

or they're the parent, or you know, like all

11:06

of it. And this really made people

11:08

stop and think. So I felt like it was great

11:10

that I was taking on the responsibility

11:13

of at least if I made mistakes,

11:15

or if I had these experience, or if I didn't make

11:18

mistakes, just having this experience. I

11:20

this has definitely helped a lot of people on this conversation

11:22

will but this generational trauma

11:24

thing where we

11:27

know it but we don't really think about

11:30

it, and it doesn't mean you have to do the same negative

11:32

thing. I know people who came from abusive backgrounds

11:34

and they're too kodily to their kids because it's

11:36

a pendulum the other way. But I

11:39

did learn through this process that

11:42

my you know,

11:44

mother, she her

11:46

sister, and her brother were beaten the absolute shit

11:48

out of and the brother, the uncle who did not

11:50

choose to ever have kids, who happens to live in

11:52

the next town. I found out he is

11:55

more like me in the sense that he went he was swat

11:57

team, he was military, he was cop, he was control

12:00

flies helicopters like methodical like

12:03

you know, textbook control

12:06

like me, organizing package

12:08

like you see the difference of how we all

12:10

like managed. But it also

12:13

and you see whatever his father did. But

12:16

this was the sec the seventies. No one

12:18

was cut. I've had people come out and say now that

12:20

they lived next door to me in Rockville Center, Long Island,

12:22

and that they were worried for my safety

12:25

because the cops were there, and there was a lot of abuse in my

12:27

house. And it was the seventies. You

12:29

drove drunk, you didn't wear a seatbelt, you

12:32

let your kids out the back door, you smoke while you're pregnant.

12:34

Like this is why this is a whole

12:36

different deal today my life

12:38

as a child, someone would be coming over to the house and taking

12:40

me out of there, right, So

12:43

what about all this generational trauma.

12:46

A lot of these moms that I'm talking to, these

12:48

women are children of the seventies

12:50

and the sixties, and it's a different deal.

12:53

Right, right, So

12:55

when you go back as far as that, you

12:57

can understand how people how

13:01

their trum affects the way they see themselves,

13:04

right, and how it skews the way that they see

13:06

themselves and looking

13:08

for that control. It's

13:10

an interesting word to use. Someone

13:12

who's believing, like your mom think

13:14

about how controlling she was. I mean, outside, her

13:16

life must be very chaotic, right, But

13:19

what's the one thing she was able to control.

13:23

Well, she had that crutch of every meal going

13:25

to the bathroom afterwards. And it's

13:28

so self loathing, and I want

13:30

to talk about that. I'm going to have an ed expert on here too.

13:32

But I'm sure you know a decent amount about this. I

13:34

have never seen. I've heard of a lot of people in

13:36

college. I've heard a lot of people with eating disorders.

13:40

My mother was a brick shit house. She was ninety pounds.

13:42

She would come home from studio fifty four. My stepfather

13:44

would lock the door. She would smash her fist through

13:46

the window. I've seen her go head

13:48

to head with truck drivers and kick with her

13:50

cowboy boot their truck. She was

13:53

a fucking bad bitch. Like she was

13:55

insane and tough and smart

13:58

and strong and scary. And

14:00

you can imagine where I can be tough

14:02

and strong and scary, but it's under control.

14:05

So I think about the

14:07

fact that she had

14:09

she had a life long never

14:11

once admitted it to anyone. Every believe I've

14:13

ever heard of has admitted it to someone, or you hear the

14:15

story later or something. I've never heard of a person

14:18

that I have stood outside of a bathroom,

14:20

heard her throwing up for an hour and a half, gone

14:22

in, seen it around the toilet, smelled

14:24

it, seeing it in her eyes, all of it,

14:27

and her lie about it my whole

14:29

life. And I've never before this experience thought about

14:31

what the hell that did to me. I was embarrassed

14:34

of her. I was I was shameful. I

14:36

watched her lose her beauty. I didn't

14:38

want her to come over anyone's house. I was always

14:41

on edge, and she was always on edge,

14:43

smashing everything in the house, torturing

14:45

waiters for the way things were. And I think

14:47

about what the hell that life was like, how

14:50

she survived, how she lived as long as she even

14:52

did right and every

14:54

meal.

14:55

That effects of what that affects a child.

14:57

So you know how that's gonna affect your young set

15:00

health, right, And that if

15:02

I'm better, she wouldn't be doing this. If

15:04

I'm a better kid, she wouldn't be doing that. I'm

15:07

not good enough, right, And hey, listen,

15:09

maybe she was thinking that too when she was growing

15:12

up. If I'm better, my dad won't beat on

15:14

me. If I'm better,

15:16

my dad won't beat on my brother. Let's

15:18

keep it calm, let's keep it quiet. So

15:20

we take as a child, we take responsibility

15:23

for the actions of our parents

15:26

because we put them up on pedestals. Not

15:29

until later on we realize that

15:31

if we ever do, but by that time

15:33

we already have established the way

15:35

we feel about ourselves, our sense of

15:37

self. And that's what's really damaging,

15:40

is that we take on responsibility of things

15:42

that we don't have any control over and

15:45

then think that it's our shortcoming that we can't

15:47

fix it and change it, and

15:50

then we overcompensate for that later on in life.

15:53

And it can go either way. Either we feed

15:55

into it that I'm a piece of shit and I'm not good

15:58

enough, or we go over and

16:00

we try to control and become

16:02

like almost narcissistic and like little kings in our kingdom,

16:05

and then become become abusive

16:07

as well. So we can fluctuate

16:09

within that continuum. It doesn't

16:11

have to be, but many times we

16:14

can see that. And then and then we

16:16

replicate those relationships, right,

16:20

something that is something called replication and rectification,

16:22

right, So we can replicate a relationship

16:25

with somebody else that kind of makes

16:27

us feel the way that our parent made

16:29

us feel. And because if we can fix

16:31

that person, then we're actually

16:33

fixing our parent and we're feeling better about ourselves.

16:36

And that's where you're saying, coming into being

16:39

very aware of where you come from when you're making

16:41

choices with a partner, and it could seem like it's in a

16:43

good package, but it could be for a different for

16:45

sure.

16:46

For sure, and then you get that generational trump

16:48

because it continues onto the next

16:50

one, onto the next one, onto that.

16:52

It may not be directly with you and your kid. It could be you

16:54

with your husband, It could be the choice.

16:55

It could be sad, of course, but if

16:58

you pick that spouse, that's unstable,

17:01

right, the same level of instability with a spouse.

17:04

What kind of family dynamic are you creating

17:06

for your kid?

17:08

Right? Well, what's inferting.

17:11

But certainly atable one.

17:13

Yeah, I feel I

17:15

can remember the resounding feeling that people

17:18

may relate to if they've been in the house with I had an alcoholic

17:21

and a boalimic chainsmoker,

17:23

like with then my stepfather

17:26

gambler. There were always bookies coming to my house

17:28

and like gambling all the football games, so I had a lot

17:30

of addiction and physical abuse

17:33

in my house, so my resounding

17:35

feeling was

17:39

walking on eggshells and always

17:42

like worrying about what everybody else like. I

17:44

remember coming into my twenties like

17:48

are those two getting along with the table? Like everybody

17:50

like reading every situation

17:52

in every room, which has been very good for me in business

17:55

because I can be in a boardroom and understand what

17:57

the hell everyone else is doing, thinking, saying, smelling.

17:59

I can read and eating disorder from two blocks

18:01

away. A nuance. I was on a show

18:03

with someone and it really triggered me because I can smell

18:06

something before anyone else can smell it. In

18:08

lying and stealing and cheating,

18:11

I can feel it because and

18:13

I had I had never really made that connection.

18:15

And Melinda, my therapist, said, because

18:17

I've seen things in other people that I've caught really

18:20

fast before even

18:22

people in my life who are around it more

18:25

caught it. My stepfather was living with my mother for

18:27

all those years. I was the one who let him know about

18:29

the eating disorder. I just from very

18:32

young, from seeing all this physical abuse and

18:34

all this stuff, I just I just knew I could clock

18:36

anything anywhere. And it's kind

18:38

of like being a it's not great because it's like being

18:40

a cop, you're like constantly it's like

18:42

that movie where Jim Carrey

18:45

could hear every single thing that everyone was thinking about it,

18:47

or Matthew McConaughey. It's kind of

18:50

it's because you're so your instrument is so in

18:52

tuned to chaos and like dysfunction.

18:55

And it's the role that you had. Because

18:58

if you're so tuned into the dysfunction and

19:00

the chaos, then your role, like you called yourself

19:02

a cop, well, what's the cops role? To serve

19:04

and protect, right, to make

19:06

sure maintain order. So your role

19:08

there is to make sure everyone's okay? How

19:11

can you possibly be able

19:13

to make everything okay?

19:15

How old were you started

19:19

the fighting in the house, right I have to call the cops

19:22

was like five? But the throwing up of seven

19:24

that I first.

19:25

Caught it sure, So

19:27

that a seven year old is going to make sure everyone's

19:29

okay or everyone is going to be well

19:33

and healthy, it's impossible. So

19:35

you were destined to fail. So how do we feel

19:37

when we fail? We

19:39

don't feel good. Doesn't make us feel good.

19:41

To fail doesn't matter that

19:44

what we're failing at is something we can

19:46

never do right. That doesn't

19:48

matter. What matters is that we fail

19:50

and we feel like a failure. And so

19:53

that comes part of our building block of who

19:55

we think, oh, we are as a person, which

19:57

is why that drives people sometimes

20:00

maybe such as yourself, to be successful, but

20:02

tries to prove that you are you

20:04

do have that worth.

20:05

It's all the time, yes, And I see that even with

20:08

my father, who treated me so poorly and

20:10

he was so successful, and he dangled it over his head

20:12

and he bragged, like to this day he's dead,

20:14

and I still want to shove my success

20:17

up his ass. Not my mother, because I have more

20:19

compassion. My mother was jealousy. She

20:21

wanted to be famous, she wanted to be

20:23

relevant, she wanted to be fashionable. She liked

20:26

the trappings and the nice things. But like Melinda

20:28

would say, like I'm living out their goals.

20:31

She feels that there's like a definite connection.

20:33

Forget the skinny girl and

20:35

alcohol, like, oh my god, Freud

20:38

is knocking on my door. But

20:40

the because people always want to know

20:43

where the drive comes from. And sometimes I just simplify

20:45

it to my father as a hall of fame horse

20:47

trainer, and he was a He was

20:49

a worker, and my mother to the day she died, I was a

20:51

worker like I come from. No complain,

20:54

no explain, no shortcut workers, you

20:57

know, put the exception of dysfunction from

20:59

her, but they just are there's a

21:01

work ethic. But I think it's more than

21:03

that, like you're saying, like you were saying, drive,

21:06

that's like and it's and it's

21:09

it's been insatiable. But really

21:11

recently, in the last couple of years, I keep getting

21:14

towards a point where I really won't

21:16

do anything that I don't want to do. And I don't

21:18

go just for money ever. But the more that

21:20

I am truthful about what I

21:22

don't want to do and the more that I say no, the

21:25

more that walks in the door, Like the more the tables

21:27

get hot, the more that I don't like desperately

21:29

cling on to it right.

21:31

Right, Because you're starting to learn how to

21:33

define success and define yourself in

21:35

different ways. And I think that that's super

21:37

important, right because as

21:39

a child, when we especially

21:42

you don't think that you know, I'm just picturing you as a

21:44

five seven eight year old, nine year old

21:46

and having people over and they're all

21:48

gambling there if they're

21:51

focused on what they're gambling on. Right,

21:53

Then I focused on you, right,

21:56

So then it's not it's not you're you're

21:58

you're a window dressing at that point.

22:01

Right, So, not only could a

22:03

child feel like they're not good enough

22:06

because they're failing at their role, they're

22:08

also not good enough because one's paying attention.

22:11

Right. I think you mentioned that you're raised by

22:13

wolves, right, like, no one, no one paid attention.

22:15

You raised yourself, right, Well, if you were good, you were

22:18

worthy, if you were worthy of

22:20

it, then they would have raised you. So that's

22:22

that's the pathological thought

22:24

process that we can easily engage

22:27

in that were not conscious of it. Just

22:29

it just starts that way. Continue.

22:32

You also have a lack of sometimes empathy because

22:34

so when I was no one ever made

22:36

doctor's appointments for me. I remember having chicken pox

22:39

and my friend no one believed me, and I got one hundred and five

22:41

fever. My friend's parents had to take me to the hospital.

22:43

I broke, I fell down a scheme mount and ended

22:45

up in a helicopter. My my ex

22:48

my exes fam like. I was always

22:51

clamoring for that, But I find that people

22:54

who grow up like that it's hard

22:56

for them to empathize with people who are whining

22:59

about basic things, you know, like

23:01

other people that are like that have things handed

23:03

to them. You're almost are jealous

23:05

or like you just don't have a lot of tolerance

23:07

for people that are like complaining

23:10

and explaining.

23:11

Sure, of course, of course, and

23:14

it brings up a you know, you

23:16

have to put up a little wall there too, that

23:18

you don't want to get close to those people because they have it so

23:20

easy obviously

23:22

not like me, because they were good

23:24

enough to get that easy. And I find interesting

23:27

too. And when you get older and get to

23:29

those teen years and you start picking your

23:31

partners and you get to

23:33

your twenties, I find a

23:35

lot of times people will push healthy people

23:37

away from them because there's

23:39

something about me that isn't right right.

23:42

I'm growing up always thinking that there's something about me

23:44

with something that that's not right. I may not be able to

23:46

put my finger on it per se, but I know there's

23:48

something there. So

23:50

what's wrong with this person that they like

23:52

me? They seem so good, don't

23:55

they see what I see? That there's

23:57

something that right about me? So there's something

23:59

wrong with them? Or I'm not worthy

24:01

of that, so I'm gonna push them away. I'm gonna go

24:03

towards someone who may not treat me

24:06

well, who may not treat me that great, who

24:08

may be somewhat of a liar

24:11

here, or you know,

24:13

cuts the corner there and turns

24:15

into something bigger later on, because well,

24:18

that's what I'm used to, right, and that's

24:20

what I'm worth. And of course

24:22

they're not healthy. They like me so,

24:24

and that's that's sort of how we perpetuate

24:27

what we'd learned.

24:28

Yes, but it also could be like I remember younger,

24:30

this is all change. I'm older now. You really don't realize

24:32

anything until you get older. But like I used to be, you

24:36

know, I used to get a bad haircut and

24:38

my stepfather would take us down to Florida, or we go

24:40

to Vegas and go to the craps table, like action

24:42

junkie. You know, that explains a lot

24:44

of how I am. Like, let's go, let's do it, let's

24:46

figure it out, let's solve it, let's go do three hundred million

24:48

dollars in relief, no problem. You know I

24:51

had had somebody once say to me, and now you're

24:53

gonna see what I was like on the basketball court. And I was talking

24:55

to my stepfather the other day after a while, and he was

24:57

like the basketball court. I was like the racetrack, Like it

25:00

becomes like I literally

25:02

grew up at a place where it's the fastest sport

25:04

period. Like it's just action and gambling

25:07

and drinking and money and highs and lows.

25:09

So it's hard to you know,

25:13

I do crave stability, and I'm so much of a homebody.

25:15

Thank God, I want that direction. But it's

25:17

hard to get to that place.

25:31

And it took it. Did it take you time to get to that place.

25:35

Totally? And you don't even know you're on the

25:37

the role code, you don't even know you're on the racetrack,

25:39

You're just on the race. Well yeah, I mean all

25:41

those years before I had a kid, it was great that I had kid,

25:43

lad because I was running on that racetrack like a.

25:45

Maniac, right right, and

25:47

there was probably you know, there's that part of you that

25:49

was healthy. I mean no one's all you

25:52

know, holy unhealthy where you have healthy parties, right,

25:55

so that healthy part of you and you I have to wait, right,

25:57

I'm not I'm not ready for that. I have to

26:00

through this until I'm ready for that next

26:02

part of my life. And I think that that's

26:04

that's very telling. I mean, that's very good.

26:07

So what about well

26:09

two qu what about

26:12

memories and flashes

26:15

of sexual abuse that your mind

26:17

plays tricks on you? You know it happened,

26:20

you kind of pretend it didn't happen.

26:22

There's nothing you can really do about. How does that manifest

26:24

itself? What what comes out in people

26:27

with situations like that? What does that

26:29

create for them?

26:32

Is it lack because for me it would be lack

26:35

of trust of males?

26:36

I mean it can be for sure, right, it

26:40

depends on how what the age was? What

26:42

was the age.

26:44

Seven seven to seventeen

26:48

or eighteen? And I say seventeen or eighteen because in

26:50

that case it was you're an

26:52

adult. But it's people that were in

26:54

a parental figure,

26:57

like a very close family

26:59

friend that you thought was family, trying

27:01

to sleep with you, but in a different way because you're an

27:03

adult now, like propositioning you and being

27:06

sleazy with you, where when you were younger, it

27:08

was people taking advantage of you. And in

27:10

my case, my whole entire childhood was being around

27:13

a bunch of racetrack degenerates at all

27:15

times when if you know, you know, there's

27:17

horse trainer and my stepfather's a horse trainer, and

27:20

he had all these guys

27:22

around with different nicknames, and

27:24

they were just always around the house. It was like a

27:26

degenerate posse and me

27:29

and my mother was never there. So

27:31

my stepfather was there, which was admirable that

27:33

he was the only one staying with me when my mother

27:35

was away having affairs in Wales

27:38

with this guy and then went away to an institution.

27:41

But I was always with a bunch of different

27:43

men, always just dropping me off, picking me up like

27:45

I was always of men. So I can imagine what

27:47

that was like with these race track degenerates.

27:49

Sure, sure, so there's definitely you definitely

27:51

can create

27:53

some trust issues for sure. Right, it's

27:56

very confusing. It's very confusing

27:59

for a child. You

28:01

know that their their bodies could betray

28:04

them. Right as you get

28:06

older, they betray your body

28:08

could react in certain ways, so your

28:10

whole idea of of sex and your

28:12

sexuality gets in puts a question

28:16

you feel, No, there's a there's potential for

28:18

feeling abandoned and

28:22

abandoned in different ways, right, so abandoned

28:24

by your mom who didn't protect you from them men

28:28

hyper sexualized of

28:31

thinking that this is what you need to do in order

28:33

to get what you want.

28:35

You know, feeling it can go either way, or being

28:37

super repressed, being.

28:38

Super repressed that you know, the difficult

28:40

thing about this field that I'm in is

28:42

that there it can go either way, right,

28:45

there's no hard truths to it, which

28:47

this is why it's very important to treat the person, not

28:49

the problem.

28:50

That's exactly right, So exactly because I

28:52

have heard of situations that you're talking about where a woman

28:54

becomes extremely promiscuous, and

28:58

I experienced at

29:02

an normally latent time

29:04

to even consider using

29:07

any kind of a toy or masturbation or anything.

29:09

It was not even like it was never I don't remember

29:12

it ever being discussed with me, but it was something that

29:14

obviously you've heard about. It was like a block until

29:16

I mean into thirties, okay, and

29:19

I remember the first time I

29:21

ever felt that I could trust someone in a

29:23

sexual situation.

29:25

Did you see it as a tool? Did you? How? Did you?

29:27

How do you ever do it?

29:28

No? It's a it's it's it's

29:32

not it's not something to do for just

29:34

like only pleasure. It's something to do to really

29:36

connect with someone and you're then in a relationship where there's

29:39

an expectation from someone like

29:41

someone must someone would have to be legally

29:43

bound to call you if you've had sex with them, like

29:46

that would be the ultimate violation if

29:48

they weren't. And even insex, you don't trust people

29:50

sometimes, right, right, even

29:52

if you even if you're in a relationship with them, you may not trust

29:55

their intentions.

29:55

Yeah, I'm curious. I'm curious as a child what

29:58

you how you understand

30:00

to what mom was doing after she

30:02

came back from the hospital and beatn and then having sex

30:04

with her.

30:06

She I knew she despised it. I could

30:08

tell obviously she was doing it as an obligatory

30:11

thing, right or some

30:13

like tumultuous highs and lows

30:15

addiction thing. But there's

30:17

no way because that's where money came into

30:19

and she stayed with us. She used to tell me she stay with all these

30:22

men because of the fact that they supported

30:24

her, and like there was all this information that I was privy

30:26

to. Yeah, there's a lot of noise there

30:28

for me with sex and money and all this

30:30

type of stuff because of all that stuff.

30:32

Right, and that you see, well, all those things that

30:34

swirl around you. They don't have anything to

30:36

do with you as a person. And that's

30:39

when you say noise. It distracts about

30:41

who you are as a person. And I mean

30:44

you you, I mean us in general, but it

30:46

distracts who we do and how we define ourselves

30:48

as a person.

30:50

Right, yeah, But we also can't a la

30:52

carte menu this thing. I wouldn't be so successful

30:54

and be who I am and be able to communicate

30:57

in this way and do this if

30:59

I didn't have this background.

31:00

I mean, there's a great

31:03

I'm gonna reference

31:06

a song home Slash song Class

31:08

of ninety nine always use your sunscreen. I

31:10

don't know if you ever heard it. It's

31:12

great, and it's basically giving advice.

31:15

And one of the lines

31:17

is live in California, but lead before you

31:19

get too soft, and leave and live in New York,

31:22

but lead before you get too hard. Right,

31:24

So yeah, I mean it's important.

31:26

I did both. I literally did

31:28

both. I was in California and left before I got too soft after

31:30

ten.

31:30

Years, exactly right. So

31:33

you know, when we have these types of experiences,

31:37

they don't necessarily have to entirely

31:39

do us, right. You don't have to end up on

31:42

a dirty match or somewhere with a hyperdertic

31:44

meanal in your arm. Right, you can

31:46

use those to propel

31:49

you to do things that are healthier. But

31:52

it's when you're not fully in touch with things

31:55

where it can go off the rails, right.

31:57

And I think that that's what's really important. And sometimes

32:01

things happen in our lives that will bring

32:03

us back, wake us up, ring that bell

32:05

and realize, holy shit, I got to make that

32:07

change. I can't do it too much. I have to

32:09

make a shift, right, And I

32:12

think that that's important to listen to those to

32:14

listen to those bells. Right.

32:16

It's so true because this guy

32:18

Breck that I know, who's a life coach, he always he says he doesn't

32:20

believe an obligation and doing things just because you have

32:22

to. And it's funny, like I often

32:24

see people with

32:27

other people that are abusive to them or mean

32:29

to them or family members, they tolerate it.

32:31

It's the dynamic and it's

32:35

I believe negativity like it's contagious,

32:38

it like gets on you. I don't want it anywhere near

32:40

me. And when I was talking to a friend from

32:42

high school, because I've opened up and started to reconnect,

32:44

I've talked to my uncle. I talked to friends. I opened

32:46

up a door I haven't opened up in years, and

32:49

one of them just said it the best. She said,

32:51

it feels like because I've felt guilt, And

32:54

what about these letters that she wrote me saying she loved

32:56

me and should I have gone there six months ago? And all this stuff,

32:58

and like it was remembering things like

33:01

only I was remembering no bad. I was like delusional.

33:04

She said, it sounds like you

33:06

had to let go or you both would have drowned. Because

33:10

I always needed a justification. I would talk to different

33:12

therapists about the fact that I just stucked this in a drawer and was

33:15

not opening it because every time I opened

33:17

it it was utterly nasty, utterly abusive,

33:19

just felt like a place I didn't want to be. And I

33:21

didn't want that on my daughter at all. Even

33:24

when it started to get on my daughter a little in certain

33:26

language and talking about my

33:28

mother, you know, oh I gained fifteen

33:30

pounds even though she was eighty pounds, or you

33:32

know, saying just some nasty things like I

33:35

was like, I shut it down. I didn't want any

33:37

of that on my kid.

33:41

Do you have any idea why you may have kept

33:44

those letters. Come

33:46

come.

33:46

I didn't know I had I didn't even know I had them. I didn't

33:49

even know I had them, and they were only from one period,

33:51

and I was looking for a photo, and

33:54

I was like, what the it was on my most raw day.

33:56

She died Friday Sunday. I was literally I'd been

33:58

obsessing over these pictures of when she looked

34:01

beautiful, because her vanity was such a thing,

34:03

and her beauty was extraordinary, And the

34:05

pictures that I had was really when she started to rot,

34:08

which was when she was forty, which I thought was

34:10

old when I was a kid, and now being fifty three, like

34:12

I realized, even when she was like fifty

34:14

three, she looked like she always

34:16

looked like she just all of a sudden, it escalated

34:19

real fast. You can hang on to a disorder

34:21

like that in your thirties, but I don't know, it's just like infinite

34:24

dogyears. When you hit forty, she just deteriorated.

34:27

And I always wanted

34:29

people to see her in the way she

34:31

was when she was young and beautiful. She wasn't

34:34

even an interior designer. She was an interior architect,

34:36

like doing her own drawing. She was a bad, badass.

34:40

But the

34:43

letters. I was on a Sunday and I was looking

34:45

for photos because I was looking for these specific photos

34:47

of when I remember being happy. This

34:49

nature photo and I remember being happy, and then ones

34:52

when I remember her being beautiful, like having

34:54

the light before it went out. And

34:56

I opened up these letters and it was

34:58

I have the chills. I was like scream

35:01

I was not like I was screaming.

35:03

And they were all the same year, and it was a time that she

35:05

had been to the institution and she had stopped

35:08

drinking for a period and they

35:10

were like barely

35:12

account accountable, but just like you didn't have it

35:14

easy, but you're my light. You're the

35:16

love of my life because she did love

35:19

me. And I feel like a fraudulence. And

35:21

I had fun in my life and I traveled and I went

35:23

to places and I had nice things, and my father's partner

35:26

got me a Rolex at thirteen. Like I wasn't living

35:28

like Panhands. I'm not trying to explain this,

35:30

Like I never had fun. I went to Disneyland.

35:32

I'm sure I was drinking alcohol and going to night clubs

35:34

at thirteen, but I was having fun. I mean, it sounds crazy,

35:37

it was not all.

35:38

Bad, right, but those women,

35:40

those letters seem like a window, right.

35:42

I mean, at some point in your life you consciously

35:45

chose to keep them.

35:46

I guess, yeah, we made that choice.

35:48

And those letters are saying that you

35:50

had it hard and I love you. I

35:52

think that's what you wanted to hear all those

35:55

years. And that's like a window of health

35:57

that she had, almost like almost

36:00

like a dementropatient kind of comes out one

36:02

day and says, oh, Hi, you know they

36:04

have a window of resemblance. But

36:06

that's a window that you

36:08

recognized of what you've always wanted.

36:11

Very weird, but you didn't have the entire

36:14

life. I think that's why you kept it, and

36:16

that's why you had such a hard response

36:19

to it, right, It's an emotional response to

36:21

it.

36:21

It was I've never gone in a cabinet. It was so

36:23

strange. Why I do believe in all these other energy you

36:26

moved?

36:26

How many times you've always took those with you.

36:29

Yes, I haven't seen it for I haven't seen it for

36:31

thirty years. No, exactly, I've never seen I've never seen

36:33

them since they were written. As what I'm saying, I don't know where they came

36:35

from. It was very strange and they were on Ziggi

36:38

and Hello Kitty stationary

36:40

that was my childhood stationary that she had

36:42

kept and written them on. It was like, very strange,

36:44

it was traumatic, but it did break something

36:47

open. Yeah, yeah, it did break

36:50

something open. And what about

36:53

specific eating disorders? What makes

36:55

someone choose a specific or it chooses

36:57

them? Or what is bolimia in this she

37:00

was blaming you with with with lax it is,

37:02

which I think is a version of blaemia. Also, what

37:04

is that? What is what is that versus

37:06

being at arexic or some other thing exercise

37:09

or ecxic or whatever.

37:10

You know, what I can tell you is that

37:13

eating disorder is believing specifically.

37:15

You know, they're they're anxiety disorders, right, So

37:17

it's it's when we have an anxiety

37:19

disorder, it's it's

37:21

basically a need for control that we just

37:23

don't have and trying to gain control

37:25

in some way. So you

37:28

know, look, if your mom,

37:31

if your mom recognized that her beauty

37:33

was the way she was getting through life, maybe

37:36

she had that thought right you saw

37:38

her as a badass, that she was so talented and all these

37:40

other things. She may not have seen herself

37:42

as that.

37:44

Yeah, but what about the fact that you aren't. She was

37:46

so smart. Aren't you intellectually realizing that you're ruining

37:49

your looks by vomiting the most disgusting

37:51

shit all over yourself?

37:52

That But at that point, that point,

37:55

it's you don't. You're not seeing the reality.

37:57

Right, there's a body dysmorphia going on

38:00

where you're looking yourself in the mirror and you

38:02

see something vastly different

38:04

than what's really there. Right,

38:07

that's by this morphic disorder is something

38:09

that's very real and affects

38:11

people in all different areas. But

38:13

what she could be experiencing that is

38:15

being so afraid of losing her youth,

38:18

so afraid. I think I heard you say something that she

38:20

got really mean to you verbally

38:23

mean later on, like when you were in your twenties,

38:26

she was.

38:26

She was always verbally mean.

38:27

She's always verbally yeah.

38:29

Yeah, she's saving.

38:30

But again saying that.

38:31

She had got more, it got more, Yeah,

38:33

it got heightened. Well that way.

38:35

When it got worse or heightened is

38:38

exactly when you said that it got it got escalated

38:40

for her, right her

38:43

forties, you're.

38:44

Twenty oh oh, her eating just a

38:47

well, no being caught escalated. I think.

38:49

I mean, of course it's not going to be the same when you're younger and dabbling

38:51

in it. But I was seven, she was twenty seven, so I

38:53

don't know when it started. I think it started when she was sixteen.

38:55

No I'm saying. I'm saying it got worse. And how

38:58

when she was loose, when she realized she was losing

39:00

her beauty and losing that avenue,

39:03

that that vehicle for that, I could

39:05

see how she right,

39:07

she would become more vicious. She become

39:09

more vicious for herself or vicious for you.

39:12

You know, I wish I was you, as I wish I would

39:14

your life. I wish I was yous. A. Yes, that's

39:16

a that's worse

39:20

than a left handed compliment, right, you know

39:22

it's it's that's a really harmful,

39:25

hurtful thing to say.

39:26

She's that's so funny because I've never saw it that way

39:28

as a kid, but she said it to me so many times. She wanted

39:30

my life right, And I didn't see it as

39:32

harmful. I just saw it. But she said

39:34

it from when I was a really young kid. I remember

39:36

that being a thing, and I remember other people

39:39

reacting to it the way you are thinking that,

39:41

but I didn't. I'd all think it.

39:43

I like we could tease. I tease my kids all

39:45

the time. Yeah, I wish I had.

39:46

Your life, right, you know, no, different, different.

39:48

Way different. It's way different.

39:50

And I think that that's what that's

39:53

what she was doing. You know that it was looking

39:55

It wasn't about you, It was about what she didn't

39:57

have, what she lost.

39:58

Well, she also said she gave her life for me many

40:01

times and stayed with these men for me. I

40:03

stayed with these men for you, Like it's a very.

40:04

So that's not a lot and a

40:07

lot of guilt, right, So you experienced

40:09

a ton of guilt, I would imagine, right, and

40:12

not from her resent her resentment.

40:14

I don't know. I just know that I remember that

40:16

statement my whole life, like it's I don't remember a lot of

40:18

things. And even before this past week

40:20

of like two weeks of going

40:23

through it, those always stuck with me,

40:25

like I gave up my life for you, like that was That's like a

40:27

stain that's been on me my whole.

40:29

Life, right, all right, all right, So

40:31

so say so what kind of stain, like how did that

40:33

affect how does that affect your your behavior. It's

40:37

an interesting statement to make. It's a stain of my life. That's

40:39

powerful.

40:39

So what why

40:45

I mean, I think I intellectually did

40:48

not believe it. But also

40:50

I don't think I under it related to money

40:53

a lot. I think it has everything to do with going to make

40:55

your own money. I mean, money is such a massive you

40:57

know, it's ironic because I could be a

41:00

billionaire if I wanted to by killing, you know,

41:02

killing myself. And I love my

41:04

free time and I have a good balance, and there's a million

41:06

things I've turned down, way more than I've taken. So

41:10

I can't say that money like It's not like I see

41:12

people like the Kardashians. They take, they go for all

41:14

of it, like I've had so many opportunities I've turned

41:16

down. So it's not that I'm

41:19

been obsessed with it, because that's not

41:21

the case. But my whole

41:23

life I've been acutely aware of

41:26

never wanting to have to depend

41:28

on a man for money. I mean since I was extremely

41:31

young, and it

41:33

was exasperating even when I was broke in my late thirties

41:36

and had I had a man who I loved say

41:38

give up this business, and why are you doing all this and why

41:40

are you killing yourself? I'll take care of you, and

41:43

I still it sounded so easy,

41:45

and in some one part of me I wanted to be I

41:47

was fighting myself because I've always wanted a man

41:49

to financially take care of me, but

41:51

then I would never do it. I could never gold

41:54

dig or It's like it's been this complete rub

41:56

where I would love. I love a man to take care

41:59

of me and shower me because I have that from my childhood,

42:01

but could never really really allow them

42:04

to. I could never really want to, like, you

42:06

know, share property or like

42:08

anything like that.

42:13

It's time to hear her

42:16

side of the story.

42:17

I love the show so much. I

42:19

was like, please throw my name in the mix. I need

42:22

to be in on this.

42:23

We were sure she was going to be the next

42:25

bachelorette and then something

42:28

changed.

42:28

I'm keeping things very very hush hush.

42:30

Fans of The Bachelor know exactly what

42:33

we're talking about. Joe and Serena

42:35

sit down for an intimate conversation

42:38

with Maria Georgis on Bachelor

42:40

Happy Hour.

42:41

I have to ask, I heard a

42:43

rumor that you were dating

42:45

at one point one of Drake's best

42:47

friends.

42:48

Oh, we have more Sayami.

42:50

Listen to Bachelor Happy Hour on America's

42:52

number one podcast network, iHeart,

42:55

open your free iHeart app and search Bachelor

42:57

Happy Hour. Listen now everywhere,

43:00

listen to podcasts, and don't miss part two

43:02

Monday Night.

43:18

So what do you have to say to people

43:21

who are witnessing generational

43:24

trauma in their own life? They know

43:26

they're in a relationship with someone, they've just experienced

43:28

death. They don't know what to do with it, you

43:31

know that sort of thing. What do you

43:33

what do you blanket statements say about that?

43:36

So? I guess you know. The most important

43:38

thing is is too is

43:41

to treat yourself with grace. Right, we have to treat

43:43

ourselves with grace. I don't think we do that enough, especially

43:45

when you're bad about yourself, right we we

43:47

we are really good at

43:50

being angry at us. Our internal voices

43:53

are are are scary, right,

43:55

and mean and difficult, and they're

43:57

just they're playing assholes, right, I

44:00

mean, they just though So I

44:02

think that when we realize

44:04

that those thoughts

44:07

that we're having are simply thoughts,

44:09

right, they're just thoughts. They're not truths, their

44:12

thoughts, and that they those thoughts

44:14

can be easily swayed and changed

44:17

based upon our past experiences.

44:20

Then we could take some of that sting out of them

44:22

and allow ourselves to be treated, to treat ourselves

44:24

with grace, to know that, and to redefine

44:27

who we are, what we're about.

44:30

And maybe not everything that happened had to do with

44:32

us per se. Right, We're just wrong

44:34

place, wrong time. Right. Who's

44:36

to say you know that the

44:39

reason why I was treated a certain way is

44:41

because.

44:42

I deserve has anything to do with me any Yeah,

44:45

you know.

44:45

People we take

44:47

the way we're treated as kids extremely

44:51

personally, which sounds

44:53

ridiculous. Right of course we do, but

44:56

many times it's not personal,

44:58

has more to do with the other person will have to do with us,

45:01

right, right.

45:03

And it's funny when I you said,

45:05

they want to get it off them. They're miserable, they're

45:07

unhappy, it's toxin. They want to throw it up, they

45:09

want to get it out.

45:10

I want to get it out like a drowning

45:12

victim. It doesn't matter who's rescuing, and they just want

45:14

to get up. So I got to push down whoever is in front

45:16

of them to get up.

45:17

Yes, what about yeah,

45:20

exactly? What about people who can't afford

45:22

therapy for me. I think there are a lot of online

45:25

therapy options. But also I think with

45:27

the internet, like I've I

45:30

there was something that I looked up. Oh,

45:32

I didn't really know about formative years.

45:34

I've heard it. I studied psychology and college. I forgot,

45:37

but I didn't really realize if by ate like you're

45:39

formed as a human in many ways, Like that's

45:41

insane. That makes a lot of sense now I thought

45:43

of that that last week of all the shit that was happening

45:45

to me between childhood, how many

45:47

homes i'd been in and eight years old,

45:50

Now I realize a lot Like so I

45:52

think that people just using the internet

45:54

with these terms, these generational

45:56

trauma terms or anxiety disorder

45:59

or alcoholism or I feel like people

46:01

can find a decent amount on the internet to

46:03

help themselves.

46:04

They can, But you know, it scares

46:06

me. It worries me, right because there's so much misinformation

46:09

on the internet as well fair so

46:11

much it's misuffair.

46:14

But then support groups something that's economical.

46:16

There's definitely a lot. There's definitely a lot of support

46:19

groups. There's definitely a lot of more economical

46:21

ways. I think mental health

46:24

we're in We're in a mental health renaissance

46:26

right now, I think right where it's

46:28

more accepted, people are talking about

46:30

it more. It's

46:33

more in our common ridacular.

46:35

Right. I have so many of my teenage patients

46:38

telling their friends, yeah, I can't get together because I have there after

46:40

that day, right, I mean right, fifteen twenty

46:42

years ago that was not the case, right.

46:45

Never. I think that

46:48

you do have to be careful where

46:50

you get information from, where you get advice

46:52

from. There's a lot of bad characters,

46:55

right, bad actors in any field, including

46:57

mine. Unfortunately, it

46:59

worries me. I think, you know, health insurance

47:02

is a totally different topic. We can

47:04

talk a whole thing about where you

47:06

know, the health insurance companies aren't really here

47:08

to help us, right, They're not the profits.

47:11

So it's hard. It's it's definitely hard to find.

47:13

And I think there's a scarcity around.

47:18

And I'll be honest with you in that in that

47:20

vacuum, there have been other other

47:23

agencies and different

47:26

people who have offered help that may not

47:28

be as qualified. I think the

47:30

most important thing that I'm gonna

47:32

should suggest to people is to

47:35

not give up finding that right person. It's

47:37

not necessarily the you know.

47:39

I know, I know some social workers who were great.

47:41

I know some psychologists who are great. I

47:43

know some social workers were awful and psychologist.

47:46

No, it's a it's a chemistry thing. It's like the same

47:48

thing. You could go into vinyasa yoga. You could go into

47:50

hot yoga. You think you hate yoga because

47:52

you didn't go into the right class. You could think about like lettuce

47:54

because you had a rogola, not on dive. Whatever it is.

47:57

I agree. I agree with that, keep

48:00

going and tell your story over

48:02

and over and over again until you find that one

48:04

person that you feel comfortable with.

48:06

And sometimes and.

48:07

Different people are good for different things, like

48:09

this guy that I know for years, a life coach. It's more

48:12

like not worrying about happened to you when you were

48:14

a child, but like intervening

48:16

in your behavior now. Some people want to get all the

48:18

way back, and it's

48:20

like a toolkit. You can use different people for different

48:22

things. I think, yeah, wow, all

48:24

right, well this was amazing and

48:28

very grateful and I think will help

48:30

a lot of people. And I want to keep this conversation going

48:32

here about these different things because I haven't

48:34

been I didn't realize I hadn't been willing to talk

48:36

about any of this myself in my own life, and

48:38

it's easier to for it to be tangible because

48:40

people know me and they know that they really don't know so much about

48:43

me. So so many people have so many

48:45

things that most people don't really know what's going on with them.

48:47

And you know, I think what's it's a

48:49

beautiful thing is that you're also learning, you know,

48:51

learning who you are along with it.

48:53

Yeah, right, of course, which is which is.

48:55

Great, you know, And I think that are our

48:57

own personal evolution should never end, never

49:00

end, right, We continue

49:03

to grow and learn about ourselves and how

49:05

we got here and where we want to continue to go. And

49:07

I think that's super important. So I'm

49:11

thankful for and grateful that you gave me this

49:13

opportunity to thank you. Thank you, and

49:16

uh no, like, keep the conversation going.

49:18

It's great, all right, good, we'll talk soon. Thanks.

49:21

Take care