0:03

Doctor, Doctor, give

0:06

me the news

0:08

I got a

0:10

whole lot of

0:13

questions for you

0:16

This kid's gonna test my

0:18

will I got lots of

0:21

learn and my baby's due

0:36

Welcome to the Informed Pregnancy and Parenting

0:38

podcast. I am your host, Pregnancy Focus

0:40

Car Director, Dr. Elliot Perlin. My

0:43

guest today is the Communications Manager

0:45

for Stillbirth Prevention Program, Count the

0:47

Kicks. She's here to talk about

0:49

the Count the Kicks app, her

0:52

own experience with pregnancy and

0:54

motherhood, and common myths surrounding

0:56

movement monitoring in the third

0:58

trimester. Kimberly Iceberg, welcome

1:00

to the podcast. Hello,

1:02

thank you so much for having me. I'm excited

1:04

to be here. I'm so glad that

1:07

you're here and I think the topic is

1:09

really important and relevant for pretty much everyone

1:11

who listens to our podcast and

1:13

I have a lot of questions about it too.

1:15

So this is going to be an informative episode.

1:18

Why don't we jump right in from the beginning? Where

1:20

are you from originally? I am

1:22

from a small town in northwest

1:25

Iowa of about 4,000

1:27

people called Emmitsburg. Oh, Emmitsburg,

1:29

what's it near? It's near kind of the

1:31

Iowa Great Lakes so you might have heard of Okoboji

1:33

or Spirit Lake so it's about 45 minutes

1:35

from there. Wow, that sounds

1:37

peaceful. Is it peaceful? Yeah,

1:40

it was very nice, you know, small town life.

1:42

Small town life. And now,

1:44

as I mentioned at the beginning, you're

1:46

the Communications Manager for Count the Kids.

1:49

How did you get into that? So

1:51

I studied journalism in college

1:54

and always enjoyed, you know,

1:57

communicating and after having came-

2:00

They just became really passionate about

2:02

helping says support other appearance to

2:04

have educate them kinda share some

2:06

in the thing is i then

2:08

now as the when i found

2:10

this particular position the it combine

2:12

my experience and journalism and my

2:14

interests and maternal house and pregnancy

2:16

and so it was just a

2:18

really great set. We've. You came

2:20

from accounting for those on people. Were.

2:22

Was coward sort. Well.

2:24

As he college was not that different

2:27

honestly because I chose a small college

2:29

sell off as I went from a

2:31

town of about four thousand to college

2:33

of about four to five thousand. So

2:36

I if I stayed in my little

2:38

you know college bubble it was about

2:40

the same fewer variations in age I

2:42

got, but roughly the same amount of

2:44

people. but it was in the capital

2:47

city of Iowa as our the city

2:49

itself was quite a bit better. Off.

2:52

Your. I was going for homeless pro.

2:54

Perfect. You. So.

2:57

I feel connected. Fit. For

2:59

her to come visit sometime I would love

3:01

to with them a Brasco for your so

3:03

room with John My room. Pay

3:06

for us. Okay, so you're. You're

3:08

implicates is very specific. Did you have sort

3:10

of a vision When you've studied journalism? What

3:12

you wanted to do. Ah,

3:15

I thought I wanted to work in

3:17

magazines. that a things The underlying thing

3:19

that always drew me to journalism is

3:21

wanting to do work that mattered that

3:24

help people that made an impact. And

3:26

so I think that's absolutely what drew

3:28

me to this work with couch. Or

3:31

longer be been doing. I'm going with Cancer

3:33

Cakes for about four and a half years now. Are

3:35

well on soil? Kids? Yes,

3:38

Perhaps. And Sussman Bowyer own

3:40

personal juri motherhood. Yes,

3:43

I have two kids blaze they are.

3:45

it's an enzyme in. A salon

3:47

he ended. It. as a lot of of. Prefer

3:50

to. Play A little bit more

3:52

independent than those young tampering baby

3:54

years so I am enjoying that.

3:56

Always knew that I wanted to

3:58

have kids the it. Added

4:00

of their journey for asked to be able

4:02

to have kids so I think that kind

4:04

of frames money they parenting but out of

4:07

the summer. Job for told me Juri. Yes

4:09

we tried for two and a half

4:11

years or so before we that pregnant

4:14

with her first child and then similarly

4:16

costs more than he air arms have

4:18

are such as. So was Yeah, so

4:20

he kept you waiting but suppose be. Dead

4:22

but we had to earn it. Me:

4:24

Off So when you submit for hims

4:27

your parenting style because we also have

4:29

a fertility struggle or my work for

4:31

months do you mean like to said

4:33

different approach to. Sort. Of be

4:36

excited when they scream at two o'clock in

4:38

the morning as a similar there I mean

4:40

as a member letters. Yeah, a little

4:42

that yeah. I think it definitely

4:44

made me appreciate parenting more and

4:46

also gave us a couple of

4:48

years to the older and wiser

4:51

i guess so defeat though he

4:53

know we really, really enjoy it

4:55

once we had kids and appreciated

4:57

that they. Were in our lives. I never

4:59

thought of of a book the I guess with

5:01

her but we had to wait a few years.

5:03

Made me older. Americans

5:06

and our Mobo I were

5:09

both ends in your pregnancies.

5:11

Did you know about third

5:13

trimester freedom movement? mom ago?

5:16

So. I dead are programs are did here

5:19

in Iowa and so I you seek

5:21

out the kicks materials and a lot

5:23

of places poster thing in under law

5:25

and the doctor's office. your provider are

5:27

you know say like, is your baby

5:29

moving her? how's your be moving? Can

5:31

a thing so subtly familiar with that

5:33

that the pressures I'm with my first

5:35

pregnancy I can have followed all the

5:37

rules you know, being a first time

5:39

on and so every night. yeah at

5:42

that time I'd sit down and pays

5:44

us into his movement and see how

5:46

long it's again. the moves she was

5:48

always really active again at that bedtime

5:50

time when i was laid on go

5:53

to sleep that was when he was

5:55

cysts doing somersaults in my belly and

5:57

then with my second baby i see

5:59

I think I felt more comfortable, more

6:02

knowledgeable, and I wasn't quite as

6:05

dedicated to counting kicks, but I definitely

6:07

was still aware of his movement patterns

6:09

and his active times, and

6:11

he was just a less active baby during

6:13

pregnancy than my first, but still, you know,

6:15

lots of movement, just kind of a little

6:17

more mellow. Well, all

6:20

this talk about movements and the

6:22

counting and sort of monitoring what's

6:25

normal versus abnormal is

6:27

definitely stirring up a lot of questions. I

6:29

wanna take a quick break, and when we

6:31

come back, we'll get into the whole idea

6:33

and what count the kicks is and what

6:35

we can learn from you guys. We'll be

6:37

right back. Hey.

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hisex.com/socks. Welcome

8:13

back. We are talking to Kimberly Iceberg

8:15

from Count the Kicks. Okay, let's

8:17

just jump into Count the Kicks. What is Count

8:19

the Kicks? So, Count

8:22

the Kicks is an evidence-based

8:24

stillbirth prevention program. It teaches

8:26

expectant parents how to get

8:29

to know their baby's normal movement patterns in

8:31

the third trimester and helps empower them to

8:33

speak up if they notice a change in

8:36

their baby's normal. Okay,

8:38

why third trimester specifically? So,

8:41

the third trimester of pregnancy generally is

8:43

that time when your baby

8:45

is bigger, you can feel them moving in

8:47

your belly consistently, and they tend to get

8:50

into a recognizable pattern kind of close to

8:52

the beginning of the third trimester, which is

8:54

26 to 28 weeks. Okay,

8:58

so at that time, you start

9:00

to keep an eye on looking

9:02

for that pattern? Yeah,

9:05

so, Count the Kicks has a free app,

9:07

but we also have paper charts, we have

9:09

a web counter, so kind of

9:11

any of these methods that you want to

9:13

use, you're going to take a time every

9:15

day around the same time, a time when

9:17

your baby is active. So,

9:20

earlier, you know, I was talking about how my

9:22

first baby was always active when I went to

9:24

bed, that kind of evening time when I was

9:26

winding down. So, that

9:28

would be a good time to count kicks.

9:30

So, kind of just getting familiar with when

9:32

your baby is normally active and counting around

9:34

that same time every day. Is

9:37

it, I don't know, never had one, I

9:39

never really thought about it, never had a

9:41

baby inside me, but is it not like

9:43

activity all day long? It isn't

9:46

activity all day long. They have

9:48

sleep-wake cycles, similar to newborns, and

9:50

so you may find that

9:52

they're always active in the morning after

9:55

you eat breakfast, or maybe it's

9:57

that bedtime, you know, or maybe it's after you

9:59

eat breakfast. eat dinner. So just

10:01

kind of being familiar with those patterns can

10:03

help you and then when you're

10:06

counting the kicks, you're going to time how long

10:08

it takes your baby to move 10 times. Okay.

10:11

So even if they're not moving all day

10:13

long, but it still sounds like there are

10:15

multiple times throughout the day where

10:17

they might move. If they're sleeping, not

10:20

so much movement but then wake patterns. Or

10:22

you're saying that there's generally a time

10:24

of day for each baby where that is

10:26

their active time. There

10:28

are multiple times a day that a

10:30

baby would be active in your pregnancy,

10:32

but with counts of kicks, it's really

10:34

just about picking that one time a

10:36

day to kind of tune in, count

10:39

how long it takes your baby to move

10:41

10 times, pay attention to the strength

10:43

of that movement. And

10:45

then by doing that every day around the

10:47

same time, you're going to get to notice

10:49

that pattern, that normal amount of time it

10:51

takes your baby to move 10 times. And

10:54

if that ever changes either a decrease

10:57

or an increase or the kicks aren't

10:59

as strong in that time that you

11:01

normally count, that's an indication

11:04

that you need to contact your provider.

11:07

Okay. Is there sort of a normal

11:09

amount of time it should take for them to

11:11

do the 10 or does each baby have their

11:13

normal? Yeah, each

11:15

baby has their normal. So that's

11:17

really the key. Every

11:19

baby, every pregnancy are different. So

11:22

what you're wanting to do is really get to

11:24

know what's normal for your baby. So that may

11:26

be 10 minutes for my baby and it may

11:28

be 20 or 30 minutes for somebody else's

11:31

baby. I know

11:33

myself, like I would definitely be there thinking,

11:35

was that a kick? Was that a kick?

11:38

Is there a way to reassure somebody that

11:40

they're doing it right? Yeah.

11:42

So I would say once

11:44

you get to their third trimester, the kicks

11:46

are pretty recognizable or the movements. And

11:49

again, you're not counting just kicks,

11:51

but you can count kicks, pokes,

11:53

abs, rolls, swishes, pushes, any

11:56

type of movement where your baby

11:58

is intentionally moving. thing

12:00

that doesn't count are hiccups. And the

12:02

difference between like a kick and a

12:04

hiccup would be those hiccups are gonna

12:06

feel a little bit less strong and

12:08

they're gonna be very rhythmic. So

12:11

if you think about when you have

12:13

hiccups, it's a recognizable pattern. You

12:15

know, pretty close together too. Yeah. I

12:17

can see the TikTok video now. Hick

12:19

or kick, you decide. Well

12:23

this is quite interesting. So I'm gonna get into

12:25

the app shortly because that I think will help

12:27

a lot of people to have a system for

12:29

doing it and some tools. But

12:32

this is really interesting. How did

12:34

the organization begin to count the

12:37

kicks? Yeah. So our organization began

12:39

in the early 2000s. We were

12:41

founded by five Iowa moms who

12:44

all lost daughters to childbirth or

12:46

infant death in that time frame.

12:48

Oh wow. Yeah. And

12:50

so they were told that childbirth

12:52

isn't very common but it doesn't

12:54

happen a lot anymore. And they

12:57

came together, you know, through friends

12:59

and, you know, connections

13:01

within the community and, you

13:03

know, in their grief realized, you know, we've

13:06

heard that this isn't very common but it

13:08

happened to all five of us in the

13:10

short amount of time within, you know, a

13:12

year or so. And they

13:14

really wanted to do something to prevent it

13:16

from happening to other people. Wow.

13:19

I mean it's so tragic

13:22

and I think that also sometimes I

13:25

don't know if I'm that person that when I get

13:27

kicked hard like that, if I

13:29

have the strength to pick myself up, to

13:31

dust myself off, let alone sort

13:34

of rise up and use my experience

13:36

to help others not have

13:38

a similar type of experience, that's

13:41

really powerful. But

13:43

still, how do you go

13:45

about creating a program finding

13:48

the information, getting it out

13:50

to people? Yeah. So these

13:52

moms started by creating a stillbirth

13:54

registry here in the state of

13:56

Iowa so that we could gather

13:58

more information on what

14:00

was happening in our state, how often it was

14:02

happening, why it was happening. And

14:05

they attended a conference and at that

14:07

conference they saw a presentation on some

14:09

research in Norway that showed a 30%

14:12

reduction when moms were educated on paying

14:14

attention to

14:17

their baby's movements and getting to know their

14:19

movement patterns in the third trimester. 30%

14:21

reduction? 30% reduction. Wow.

14:25

Yeah. Tremendous. It

14:27

is. And they said, hey, if they can

14:30

do that there, we can do it here. So

14:32

they worked with the Iowa Department of

14:34

Health and Human Services and

14:37

a local marketing company and they

14:39

created this mom focus empowering educational

14:41

campaign that was focused

14:44

on syllabus prevention. Wow.

14:46

And has there been a way to

14:48

sort of track its effectiveness here? Yes.

14:52

So in the state of Iowa,

14:54

we saw a 32% reduction in

14:56

the syllabus rate in the first 10

14:59

years of the campaign. Wow.

15:01

And then have you learned? I mean, it

15:03

seems like the longer it goes on, the

15:05

more data you get, the more you can

15:08

fine tune and learn. Have

15:10

you been able to learn other things

15:12

like to further reduce? I mean, you

15:14

can't save them all. Right. Right.

15:17

Yeah. Every syllabus is

15:19

not preventable. That is definitely true. But what

15:22

we have seen is that within that 32%

15:24

reduction, we saw a 39% reduction among syllabus

15:30

in African American families. So

15:33

as with many other maternal

15:35

health and birth outcomes, black

15:37

women face an increased

15:39

risk of experiencing middle birth almost

15:41

two times that of their white

15:43

counterparts. That's

15:46

a huge number. And

15:48

so you're saying that in that

15:50

population, there was a greater decrease

15:52

in stillbirth when they adhere

15:55

to the count that kicks protocols? Yes. So

15:58

in the state of Iowa... In

16:00

the first five years of the

16:02

program, the silver three among African

16:05

American women and decreased by thirty

16:07

nine percent. Okay,

16:09

Remember are there other things web you're able

16:12

to work overtime? It just seems like you

16:14

must be collecting a lot of beta. Yes,

16:17

we are and what is the most

16:19

amazing pieces of data or information that

16:21

we gates is when families reach out

16:23

to us and they say your program

16:26

helps my. Baby get her safely.

16:28

To we have heard from more

16:30

than one hundred and thirty families.

16:32

Censor program began in the assembly's or

16:35

in six different countries now as

16:37

well. Meaning though complicates

16:39

notice something is not every hub mm.

16:41

Go get help and realized there's a

16:44

nicer that they can take care of.

16:46

Reports to wait. Yes,

16:48

Wow. That's incredible. Words or meme. How

16:51

are you have a reverse company? I

16:54

don't know. I don't know if I

16:57

will is hearing these stories from families

16:59

that say you know county kicks help

17:01

my baby It complicates save by the

17:03

the they those stories are incredible and

17:05

they make me cry every single time.

17:08

Know or it's we are gonna

17:10

take a mobile, the brakes on

17:12

some box or wanna jump into

17:14

two things with you. Number one

17:16

more about how the app works

17:18

on the other complicates tools. Also

17:20

just fine tuning a little bit

17:22

more about some of the myths

17:24

and clearing up that vs friction

17:26

when it comes to managing civil

17:28

movements with take a little Break

17:30

will be right back. Sergeant

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and mr. Smith, you're gonna love

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it the right way, Restrictions apply.

18:00

You can vary iceberg from count. the

18:02

kids are it's the tools let's talk

18:04

about the app for So where can

18:06

some get the up and what is

18:08

it him? Yasser,

18:10

The app is available in either in

18:13

the I Last Apple App store or

18:15

the Google App store. It is and

18:17

twenty different languages so it's really a

18:20

now widely available to anyone. The County

18:22

Kicks Ass is really easy to use.

18:24

You just open a click on start

18:27

counting and it will time how long

18:29

it takes your baby them is ten

18:31

times and then when you reach that

18:34

since movement and then homer saps it

18:36

will let you read the strength of

18:38

your baby's movement. Because research

18:40

also shows that the strength of your baby's

18:43

the admits his and importance and of their

18:45

wellbeing. and then you can take any notice

18:47

that you wanna take whether it's what you

18:49

a sad day or maybe where you're at

18:52

or question for your doctor it's and then

18:54

finishers I send and again if he killed

18:56

every can around the same time it's any

18:58

so you graph of how long it takes

19:01

a meeting in is ten times each. Day

19:03

and you'll begin to see that history over

19:05

time. Does. It's in virtue

19:07

to if there's a change. So.

19:10

No again, every baby and every

19:12

pregnancy or de France. Oh and

19:14

change for been mom might not

19:16

be a change for another man's

19:18

and again, there's no like threshold

19:20

of what's normal for every single

19:22

baby. So it's really just you

19:24

looking at the data that's in

19:26

your app and being able to

19:28

the okay, you know it has

19:31

consistently taken my babies and fifteen

19:33

minutes to move ten times and.

19:35

Today. It seeking forty five

19:37

or six seed and you.

19:39

Know that is not normal for your

19:41

baby and that's when you really want

19:43

to contact your provider and say hey

19:45

I noticed a change in may be

19:47

business Vince Can Eczema Nuggets. Girl.

19:50

Was raped or was is where you

19:52

live. Once you establish a baseline for

19:54

your baby, them to free up Say

19:56

where the second mirror off base here.

19:58

Amazon. Very busy. That into the i

20:01

asked him from vertebrates but so you

20:03

could see the day that clearly without.

20:05

and if we're taking the time the

20:07

can't the kicks museums you'll notice that

20:09

there's been a change. Yeah. I.

20:11

Wondered I managed to see patients of

20:14

my office every day when we do

20:16

a lot of pregnancy all day long

20:18

and some people just not really connected

20:20

at all. My just going about life

20:22

outside the womb. you know they just

20:25

moving slower but otherwise nothing's changing. And

20:27

you know strong find healthy. it's does not

20:29

all that connected to the baby and other

20:31

people that him so connected. I could that

20:33

all that on. so I just wonder if

20:35

the app and the could be forgiven for

20:37

different people with as the up. Make.

20:40

People less anxious or

20:42

more focused. Effort

20:44

as it. Is a

20:46

great way to burn. It you baby. It's

20:48

really taking his team to slow down

20:51

to enjoy your pregnancy, the band of

20:53

your baby to get to know their

20:55

personality a little. That's as a great

20:57

way to involve your partner or you're

21:00

beating older siblings and we have actually

21:02

son that well you might hear that

21:04

in Cook County and has increased anxiety.

21:06

Weather app users actually tell as as

21:09

at seventy seven percent of them sad

21:11

as have to reduce their anxiety about

21:13

the lobbying of their babies and more

21:15

than eighty percent of them said. That

21:18

and have to increase their feelings of bonding

21:20

with their baby. Oh. Else

21:22

I didn't even think of it.

21:24

From bring other family members and

21:26

to the bonding process yeah it's

21:28

anyway. so when temperature like old

21:30

toddler with the hand on the

21:32

belly and you know. There's a

21:34

kid. Yeah, that's the

21:36

great. Thing about that you it's so

21:38

easy to use like when you pull it

21:41

off at Sunderland Big Kill. but press on

21:43

the screen and as a clerk sneezes tap.

21:45

The set trends are really anybody. Can

21:48

do it at thirtieth

21:50

or it so there's

21:52

some misunderstandings abodes, movement

21:54

monitoring, And. Lightness, Gas

21:57

and there are a lot of misconceptions out

21:59

there. The that he only talked about

22:01

with an increase in anxiety. I think

22:03

another one is that if your baby

22:05

is only them says you don't need

22:08

to take time to come for kicks

22:10

but they decide what's important is really

22:12

getting to know it's normal for your

22:14

baby. Even active babies. Can experience to

22:16

serve and so that. Kinda been popping

22:18

quickly and there may not be other

22:20

one insane. So that's the reason that

22:22

this is important for everyone to do.

22:25

Not just people who are high risk

22:27

or you know, people who have it

22:29

baby that Navy doesn't even act as.

22:32

Your. Where I'm from, Philly. If

22:34

you get person for this movement generally

22:36

them new feel, secure, remote perhaps below

22:39

your science can be hard to notice

22:41

a change and pattern or change some

22:43

nuance. And simmer deliberate with

22:45

monitoring mm I do here and

22:47

I wonder like who would now

22:50

like as the baby gets bigger.

22:52

And the third trimester would say those

22:55

words. There is a reason most people's

22:57

faces running out. There. Says vision

22:59

this idea that the baby doesn't

23:01

have much room anymore so. Does.

23:04

The movement pattern change.

23:07

Though. The movement. Hundred said night

23:09

scenes. It's a tyson movement thing.

23:11

You feel me change. He may

23:13

feel more jobs, more switches in

23:15

in a seal, maybe those big

23:17

kick their roles that he might

23:19

have felt earlier in pregnancy? It's

23:21

But again, if you're counting around

23:23

the same time every day, you

23:25

said take the same amount of

23:27

times a day. The news. Ten

23:29

time. And. The same because

23:32

you're writing it Went on skill one

23:34

to five a strong. The may answer

23:36

to the movement's will still be similar

23:38

strength. As he said,

23:40

something similar sang so you might not feel

23:42

a cake the you might feel a bag

23:44

it's in a nudge or a purse. Yeah,

23:46

and they should still. Be the molecular

23:49

zang. Yeah, roughly the same. Well.

23:51

Okay, I guess the concern. of

23:54

a know if it goes up or goes down

23:56

as a good closer to the end but i

23:58

use my courses to these movements change even

24:00

a couple of days before labor? Like, is

24:02

there a time where we would expect to

24:04

see a change and that's like, oh, that's

24:07

normal? Or no, always report

24:09

the change. Nicole Lee Always reports a

24:11

change. Your baby should move up to

24:13

and even during labor. So, if you

24:15

notice that your baby isn't moving or

24:17

isn't moving as much, that

24:19

is a red flag and a reason that you

24:21

should call your provider. David Ensign Okay,

24:23

good to know. I've learned a lot and hope

24:25

that our audience is learning a lot too. I

24:27

know they are. And it's interesting

24:29

you have like a clear passion for the

24:32

work that you're doing and who

24:34

wouldn't, again, how they ever leave that company.

24:36

But you also have some

24:39

videos, Count the Kicks videos

24:41

and other educational materials. I

24:43

know that some of them

24:46

are available to Informed Pregnancy

24:48

Illusioners through Informed Pregnancy Plus

24:51

under Count the Kicks. And

24:53

there's how-to videos. There's powerful

24:55

stories on there. Where else

24:58

could people find information or

25:00

tools from Count the Kicks? Nicole

25:02

Lee Yeah, so we have a website

25:04

where you can find a lot of

25:06

information on how to

25:08

count the Kicks. We have

25:10

printed educational materials that can

25:12

be ordered for anyone who

25:14

works with expectant parents, whether

25:16

providers or community-based organizations. David

25:19

Ensign Are those things that you hand out or like posters that

25:21

you put up? Nicole Lee Yeah,

25:23

there are brochures that you could hand out.

25:25

We have app cards, just a little, you

25:27

know, business card size card with the QR

25:29

code on there that goes directly to the

25:31

app to download it and

25:33

posters to put on the wall. So really

25:35

anyone who works with expectant parents can order

25:38

those materials on our website and share them

25:40

with the families that they work with. David

25:42

Ensign Amazing. I asked all the questions I can

25:45

think of immediately. Did I leave something out that

25:47

you want to share? Nicole Lee I

25:49

think just would encourage everyone to

25:51

learn more and visit

25:53

us at countthekicks.org and also follow

25:56

us on our social media platforms.

25:58

David Ensign Are they also... about Count

26:00

the Kicks? Yeah, so we

26:02

are at Count the Kicks

26:04

on Instagram, at Facebook,

26:06

and TikTok. Oh,

26:09

wow, TikTok, for real? Yeah, yeah. Thank

26:12

you again, Kimberly, thank you so, so

26:14

much. This seems like not only one

26:17

of those topics that it's important to

26:19

educate ourselves about, but also

26:21

important to share. Like, the more people

26:23

that know, the more people that learn,

26:25

the more people that do the self-monitoring,

26:28

seemingly, the more babies will be saved,

26:30

will realize early enough that there's an

26:32

issue and be able to intervene.

26:36

And in all the areas of medicine,

26:38

to me, we have so many medical

26:40

marvels in modern medical history, but I

26:42

think some of the greatest are NICU.

26:45

And, you know, once we're able to get

26:47

those babies, access to the babies, there's so

26:49

much we can do now to keep them

26:52

healthy and keep them strong. Yeah,

26:54

you're absolutely right. And it's really just

26:56

something that we're working towards making sure

26:58

that all expecting parents know this, that

27:01

it is common as taking a prenatal

27:03

vitamin in pregnancy or taking

27:05

your baby home in an infant car seat.

27:07

We want every expecting parent to know that

27:09

when you get to the third trimester, you

27:11

count the kicks. That's an

27:13

important topic to speak about. Thank you for

27:15

joining me and for sharing. And

27:17

we will visit you online at Count the

27:19

Kicks. And at home,

27:21

thanks for listening to our podcast.

27:24

For more pregnancy and parenting information,

27:26

visit us online at informedpregnancy.com. you