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Impact of influence. Covering

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0:33

Seton was in Charleston,

0:35

South Carolina on April 1st for

0:37

Alex Murdoch's sentencing hearing. By the

0:39

way thanks to CNN. I popped

0:41

on CNN on the

0:43

morning of the 1st. Do a little break

0:46

with them about Alex Murdoch's sentencing

0:49

hearing and federal court for

0:51

the financial crimes and was there

0:53

a crowd? You know

0:55

there was a big crowd of media

0:57

outside and they did have an auxiliary

0:59

courtroom open for media so I chose

1:01

to sit there because you could have

1:03

your technology with you. Okay. And you

1:05

can't in federal court have technology in

1:08

the main courtroom and even though we were

1:10

allowed to have technology in the auxiliary courtroom

1:12

you're not allowed to record anything or take

1:14

any sort of pictures. That's just that's

1:16

the way it is with the federal government. So you

1:18

can take your notes on a laptop

1:21

or phone or whatever. Right. And I think

1:23

you're allowed to live tweet or things like

1:25

that. But yeah you're not allowed to record

1:27

it and they did come out and tell

1:30

us that ahead of time. When

1:32

the episode last week we hadn't heard the

1:34

response from Jim Griffin

1:36

and Descartes Pootley and Alex

1:39

attorneys about at

1:41

that point all we had was that

1:43

the feds said Alec Murdoch was a

1:45

liar and that he failed his

1:47

light addictive test on many levels

1:50

showing dishonesty so we hadn't heard

1:52

the response so if

1:54

you haven't heard Let's

1:56

get him up to speed about

1:58

that, because. There.

2:00

Was a plea agreement. With.

2:02

Under federal like were you failed? They. Want

2:04

to have an and this agreement potato that was

2:07

part of that. I'm and part

2:09

of the argument that are the

2:11

defense made was that. At

2:13

their they had not been provided

2:15

with the polygraph chart to have

2:18

an independent expert examine it. So

2:20

they want the full results, all the

2:22

questions, all the things the defense does.

2:24

That. Joy sorry but your lox

2:27

and oh we had also.

2:29

Wondered. Aloud. The.

2:33

Lie. Detector or polygraph is not.

2:36

Admissible in courts, yet.

2:38

They. Were doing it as part of his plea agreement. Well,

2:41

I was told that it has.

2:43

It's very typical of the federal

2:45

government to require a polygraph examination

2:47

if there is a plea deal.

2:50

And I typically.

2:53

When. This is done if someone. Fails.

2:55

It. They're. Aware of it right away.

2:58

And that it a I think. Maybe.

3:00

The defense as an opportunity

3:03

to question the examiner. Where you

3:05

bring that up is it was failed in October. It. Was

3:07

that a was down in October? I think

3:09

that they probably are. Were aware that he

3:11

sale before you think? Yes, This is all

3:13

just come to light to us. Is.

3:16

My. Sense. because well, that I thought

3:18

Harpootlian Griffin said something about this last

3:20

minute. Week.

3:23

But the they may been referred to last minute as

3:25

would accepting the plane that last minute as we know

3:27

he fielded. Well. I think last minute

3:29

meant that they are the government said

3:31

were abandoning the play. They fall, they're.

3:33

Not the fact that they. Didn't

3:36

know you. Feel. The polygraph your

3:38

where a said referring to the

3:40

last minute they were technically referring

3:42

to. Possible. Levy

3:45

Albion bringing down. Which. Is

3:47

different, right? Yes, I mean. It's.

3:50

Defense did agree to the terms

3:52

of display agreement and part of

3:54

that is requirements. Take this polygraph

3:57

examination. And they didn't find out about the fleet Remit

3:59

do I was sweating. The thirtieth or something

4:01

was was shortly before. The.

4:04

Sentencing hearing. Okay, so. In

4:06

that filing they have some parents.

4:08

They say that the pre interview

4:10

process was odd at best. The.

4:13

He described. Examiner. Time

4:15

bird off that he didn't believe that he had killed

4:17

his wife and son. On. And

4:19

that he had just com from

4:21

Alabama where he had conducted a

4:23

polygraph examination of Jordan Vander Slid.

4:26

He. Was the man? ah, about the

4:28

border of Natalie hallway? So

4:30

they're just say that odd but doesn't

4:32

really mean. What? Are

4:34

what does it mean as far as the legitimacy of

4:37

the polygraph? Just that it's odd isn't? Certainly and up

4:39

in not going to be the Feds? probably. Anyway, on

4:41

this. Yeah, I want. I'm tired. Really?

4:44

Dive into the polygraph examination. Issue.

4:47

More me, I think that polygraph examiner's

4:49

when they initially meet with someone there

4:51

are about to. Conduct.

4:54

An examination where they try to make

4:56

them comfortable. And. It was. If you say I

4:58

didn't think you change your. Life. A kid who

5:01

that would make him for Canadian. Make him comfortable.

5:03

You want to break the ice because I

5:05

think most people going into a polygraph examination

5:07

are probably pretty nervous. And I

5:10

will. I'm working on this polygraph expert

5:12

whenever on shortly so that be cool.

5:14

Interview: Okay, so. They.

5:16

Want of You know that? and we we all kind of

5:19

knew that wasn't gonna go anywhere. By and

5:21

there's another thing I think that was

5:23

probably not gonna go anywhere was they

5:25

had filed a motion requesting to. Unseal

5:28

The documents that the government had

5:31

requested remain under seal because there's

5:33

an active investigation. And.

5:35

To at. Alec Murdoch's crime and

5:38

were all this money and. Years possibly

5:40

other attorneys. And.

5:42

What Sets Sets We talked that this

5:44

and our last episode. There's.

5:46

Another lawyer who apparently as the is under

5:49

investigation and that was in filings it said

5:51

there was another layer of that's Now has

5:53

come out and said that his attorneys crisp

5:55

lesson. As fits news, it's news

5:57

isn't just about the to com.

6:00

And Chris Wilson was a good friend.

6:02

A Valid Murdoch. He was actually on

6:05

the phone with Alec Murdoch on his

6:07

way to the mother's house the evening

6:09

that emerged. Maggie Model Times? Yeah, more,

6:11

Yes, multiple times. On A

6:13

also in the footage of Alex.

6:16

Birthday celebration for a few whatever was

6:18

a week before the murder or something

6:20

and. He testified during the murder

6:22

trial on there was an issue

6:24

about. Missing. Finds They were.

6:27

How Council on a case And I

6:29

think. There. Was some

6:31

confusion navy possibly on Christmas part

6:33

where them where the funds were

6:35

going and P P was seeking

6:38

to. Find. Out where these funds were

6:40

and. Ah, and then Chris says

6:42

his sword and some money from Alec. He paid

6:44

him part of the money. To. Spare

6:46

anybody in alex. Circle.

6:49

Or bit. Had

6:51

some money taken from them, right? So

6:53

he he testified that now he

6:55

has possibly under investigation by. The.

6:58

Feds, Than him and an urgent and under

7:00

this occasion Doesn't mean charges, Doesn't mean indicted

7:02

doesn't mean they will come of it. Doesn't

7:04

make that clear that as of this moment

7:06

he's not charged with anything. At

7:09

Iso, this trial was set to start

7:11

at ten am and didn't start till.

7:13

I think Ten twenty one. And. They

7:16

appeared to be in chambers on a

7:18

Dick Harpootlian was out there. We had

7:20

it gym Griffin and it. Fell.

7:22

Barber are on behalf of the defense.

7:25

Said. Clearly they were probably working

7:27

out some issues and chambers and.

7:29

When ever want him back into

7:31

court the defense withdrew their objects

7:33

and regarding the polygraph examination. And

7:36

there was also some sort a dispute about

7:39

the criminal history. At the

7:41

government wanted to include this.

7:43

Tax. Evasion. Ah, as

7:45

part of his criminal histories not charged

7:48

with that. It was kind of interesting.

7:50

As gym Griffin said well ah he

7:52

couldn't really fess up to these charges

7:54

because then he would receive here. yeah

7:56

I er s I saw this money

7:59

but I. That either, Taxes on

8:01

Earth. Part of the Odyssey a month of guess

8:03

so long but I'm gonna pay taxes on I'm. Exactly

8:05

on and it didn't seem to

8:07

be any sort of objects and

8:09

to their restitution of. Over

8:12

a point Seventy million dollar. That coaster Alec

8:14

doesn't as far as we know, have a point

8:16

seven. Two million dollars. I had a says monopoly

8:18

money at this point. To hear be a live

8:20

it's a even if it's hidden on some offshore

8:22

account or buried in the swamp is not going

8:24

to admit to it. Nap. A It. Was

8:27

a gurgle, agreed to let the federal sends

8:29

run concurrently with the state times to doubtless

8:31

actually part of the plea deal and he

8:33

agreed that yeah, great date, they should run

8:35

together. I'm and is to

8:38

refresh evelyn memory he received twenty

8:40

seven years. Or. A D

8:42

State Financial Crimes. Of. Which

8:44

he will serve at least twenty two of

8:46

those years, The. Masses something like

8:48

seventy sixer, seventy seven years old

8:50

Cervix. He does an episode the

8:53

Double Life Sentences, but miraculously. To

8:55

say exactly this is all just assuming that

8:57

he gets a new trial in and as

8:59

found innocent of the murders of his wife

9:01

and son. Griffin.

9:03

Some Griffin, the attorney for. Alec.

9:06

Talk. About a turf war or something. And

9:08

I had seen some headlines about this

9:11

at. You know that there was a

9:13

turf war between the South Carolina Attorney

9:15

General's Office in the said about this

9:17

case. Arm. And girl quickly

9:20

sat down and sad are these are separate

9:22

sovereigns and were allowed to do that? Through.

9:25

Adapter for horses are led to know they're allowed

9:27

to do the right thing. To yes you,

9:29

there aren't exactly. And that site over it

9:31

but he ambulance he might even I don't know where he

9:33

was going without but he said adem for we could find

9:35

out against. Demographic mentions like some

9:38

very high profile cases are were

9:40

more money was stolen and the

9:42

amount of time that as certain.

9:45

People. Were given for these crimes.

9:47

I think Elizabeth Holmes I've received

9:49

eleven years and she was that

9:51

theorists is. That. Yeah, she's the one where

9:54

the black turtleneck all the time. Yes, Ah,

9:56

Damn we have the. Ah, Enron

9:58

that twenty. For years,

10:01

the crypto currency thief

10:03

same bagman fried just

10:05

recently. Was. It

10:07

was a twenty Five years was a sense

10:09

to twenty five years. He saw eleven. A

10:12

billion with a be right. Salem

10:14

obviously a lot. Ah, more than

10:16

what Alec Murdoch I. Don't

10:19

know. Gurgles did Japan and

10:21

he said will Madoff diet Ah

10:23

hundred fifty years. Or and

10:26

and Bertie made up was really old at that time to

10:28

the right. Now he died in present.

10:30

Yeah, I'm and then, ah, girl

10:32

did men tend that Alec in

10:34

a stole from this burner, a

10:36

bull individuals, a quadriplegic motherless shelter,

10:38

and. Ah, so he

10:40

said. He. Know it by Mine is thinking

10:42

these things are. Loads of nice

10:44

hammer, more stealing from.

10:47

You people who are. Vulnerable

10:50

as opposed to live in the rich. With.

10:52

The rich people be like. The last

10:54

by billions as. but we're I see where

10:56

he's going with it. Makes. Sense.

10:59

Yeah. No. We have some are more

11:01

not I'm and he says that he is

11:03

filled with. Sorrow. Remorse and

11:06

will. He. Make himself think about

11:08

the victims every day. He. Says that

11:10

the victims may think that he is

11:12

that sorry for what he did but

11:15

that. In. Of he's only sorry that

11:17

pot. Is. No way to know what's inside his

11:19

brain. right? I don't think that's cargo

11:21

was buying that based on his

11:23

demeanor. I don't know that would a matter the

11:25

right of a new. there's a preview plea deal. Know.

11:28

The plea deal was a van and know that whales

11:30

out the cook. That's how the. Okay, it

11:32

was. What? Was it was a

11:34

good doctor down at two years. With. As

11:36

he wrote what would I would I was the

11:38

possibly said that made gurgle go. You.

11:43

Look sad. Wow, You have to. Try.

11:45

Again, as do. And he talks

11:47

about his addiction and odd. That.

11:49

Maybe possibly he was taking all

11:52

these drugs to none himself. Off.

11:54

From what he was doing wrong I'm he says

11:56

he's been clean for nine hundred and thirty seven

11:59

days. Him. Ah, and that his

12:01

addiction contributed to some of the things that

12:03

he dead. Sure they did. Now.

12:05

Girl also doesn't seem to buy this.

12:07

He says what? These. Are very

12:10

complicated schemes. You said some of

12:12

the most or the most complicated

12:14

schemes he's seen. Know if you

12:16

were really as addicted as you

12:18

claim? Could you possibly pulled this

12:21

off? He. Seduced people by

12:23

promises of delivery of large amounts

12:25

of money. And. That. These

12:28

victims place their problems and

12:30

hopes without my rock. Yeah,

12:33

I read I is the scheme

12:35

that complicated If you've got. A

12:38

banker and another Dirty work. And with you. I

12:41

mean anima complicated user say? all right.

12:43

Well, that that semi you haven't They don't know

12:46

we're all this money as it does seem pretty

12:48

complicated to me personally and that they were able

12:50

to get away with it for so many years

12:52

and. Does Gurgle has been on the

12:54

dance I don't know how many years but he

12:56

seems pretty season that and on. As he says

12:59

it was one of his most complicated case as

13:01

your that he says games he seen I believe

13:03

on. Now. We also learned

13:05

about eleven new victims and an

13:07

additional one point three million dollars

13:09

of missing money. And they

13:12

raises yes and many of these

13:14

victims one out remain anonymous and

13:16

a submitted victims impact statements. That

13:19

is crazy there were that we just hear about it now.

13:21

Know we only heard from two victims.

13:23

We heard from Tiny Satterfield and Pamela

13:25

Pinckney. Ah Attorney Satterfield

13:28

says that he praised for Alec Monarch

13:30

daily. And Pamela Pink

13:32

He said I love you with the

13:34

love of Jesus Christ. These are very

13:36

forgiving people. Are say so are better

13:38

people to me now. Gurgle did not

13:40

allow attorneys to speak air planned wanted

13:42

to speak on behalf of the pile

13:45

or sisters and he said he says

13:47

I'm familiar with their case of well

13:49

very familiar with their case. I am

13:51

here to hear from the victim. So.

13:53

Now we hear from Emily Line house with. The.

13:55

Government and she says that there were

13:58

to entrust said the government or. Trying

14:00

to get to the bottom of with display the all.

14:02

The. First was at the location of

14:04

the six million dollars of ill gotten

14:07

gains. Unless the first we've heard it exact

14:09

number. Variety. Of wow the of we

14:11

we the in the. Last. Filing of his

14:13

But I mean up until just as much as

14:15

we have not heard a number it's always been

14:17

like a wonder how much is missing. You are

14:20

now with animated cessna. One point three is

14:22

I think that I don't know. that adds

14:24

to it I'm not quite certain on and

14:26

also holding all accountable. He may have conspired

14:28

with Alec Er Nok. And

14:30

she says that they had for proper sessions

14:32

where they met with Alec Murdoch and he

14:35

had every opportunity. To come clean. Ah

14:37

and she says el Morocco claim that

14:39

he was spending all these funds on

14:41

drugs but this is not make sense

14:44

to her because. It's. When he

14:46

nineteen, the money laundering escalated by

14:48

millions. And. His polygraph

14:50

indicated deception. I think when America's

14:52

given the numbers of how much he had spent

14:55

nearly dozy Dagens people were like that seems and

14:57

you'll be dead. It does. It makes and I

14:59

wonder. Reckless.

15:01

Speculation. If he

15:03

wasn't. Selling. Drugs.

15:05

Other people giving drugs Other people.

15:08

And. Did.

15:10

The says ask him about that will never know

15:12

I guess. Well as we may know which

15:14

is not while the investigation is ongoing, I read

15:17

through. And. Or

15:19

other. She says that the victims were

15:21

not made whole by Alec Mark himself.

15:23

A lot of them have received my

15:25

back to Satterfield, buying insurgents in the

15:27

law firm, and lots of different air

15:29

avenues that some of these victims have

15:31

received money back. But none of these

15:34

victims received anything from Alec Murdoch himself.

15:37

Ah, And they requested

15:39

a thirty year sentence. On

15:42

which would have been an. Upward.

15:44

Of variance to the Us Federal

15:47

court.lines for the truck crimes that

15:49

he was charged. Us

15:51

to then we hear from. Dutch girl.

15:54

On. And he says that he speaks

15:56

to lost since all the time and

15:58

he tells them. That a law

16:00

license is a license to do good. At.

16:03

Know Jim prefer kind of pipes up and says you

16:05

know. Pushing. This polygraph and.

16:09

He. says. That. You know

16:11

he is not putting any way on the

16:13

polygraph. Through garbage group a dog or gargoyles.

16:15

as I don't play any way on the polygraph. And

16:18

that I'd get a polygraph to. Their.

16:20

Use as an investigative technique

16:22

and this is not something.

16:25

That. I. Eat. I.

16:28

Am basing my sense on whether that's true

16:30

or not. I don't know. I. Mean. I

16:32

made a huge the out of a right only to.

16:34

Eat any others as you. you're the one

16:36

you're greeted. s. right? Well yeah, which

16:38

is through we might have had a choice.

16:41

Okay, well. I'm his rear. You don't get a

16:43

plea or you don't get a play. but maybe I. Might

16:45

have been better not. Did not see you I

16:47

have agreed to play in just take a stance

16:49

as with as with as a be with the

16:51

sentencing guidelines. If. We figured out of

16:53

his wife was always ready that even over polygraph.

16:56

Yeah. I'm so. Judge.

16:59

Gurgled gives him four hundred and

17:01

eighty minutes, which is about forty

17:03

years. I'm

17:05

so I think we should. I bring

17:07

on my dad now and break down

17:09

exactly what this four hundred and eighty

17:11

months you get any sort time off,

17:13

exactly how that works. Let's

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let's bring him in. Seton's

19:32

dad met some beat up

19:34

is with us who's Temple Law School. A

19:37

few decades of litigating. Went

19:40

to Penn School of Law and

19:43

he's just a smarty-mcsmarty pants. And

19:47

Matt, it's great to talk to you again. Yeah,

19:50

you're so kind. Thank you, Matt. Seton,

19:53

start us off. Okay, so Judge

19:55

Gergel sentenced Alec Murnock to 480

19:57

months, which is... I

20:00

guess 40 years for which

20:02

is an upward variance for

20:04

the federal court financial crimes. What

20:08

will he serve? Does he get any sort of reduction or

20:10

how does this work? Yeah,

20:13

there was during the Trump administration in 2017

20:15

to 2018 an act passed 18

20:17

U.S.A. Section 3624B,

20:28

which basically is what they call the

20:30

first step program. And

20:32

it went into effect on March 14th of 2022. And

20:38

what it basically does for what you want to

20:40

hear about is for

20:43

what they call good conduct time, you

20:46

get 54 days

20:48

of credit each year. So

20:52

in Alex Murdock's case, that

20:55

means he would get 2,160 hours of good behavior

20:57

time, which

21:03

means that he could get a reduction of 5.92

21:05

years in a sentence. So

21:11

he still has to serve about 34 years. Okay,

21:14

because it was interesting. First,

21:16

Jonathan Ciri with Fox News quoted

21:19

Jim Griffith saying that this

21:22

first step acts that he would

21:24

get approximately 60% off of their time, which

21:26

would equate to more of the 24-year sentence.

21:29

So you don't think that's accurate? Yeah,

21:32

I think you said 40%. But

21:34

yeah, I don't think that

21:36

that's accurate. Now the only

21:38

other way to possibly get a

21:41

reduced time is couple ways.

21:45

One is for some reason he had

21:47

some other information about greater

21:49

criminals and he provided that

21:52

information maybe could negotiate a

21:54

reduced sentence. Another way

21:56

is if he could get some

21:58

sort of pardon. or

22:01

something like that, that

22:03

would be another way in which it would

22:05

happen. But under the first step program, all

22:08

you would get basically is a 15% reduction in his

22:11

overall sentence. Well, and all that

22:13

seems pretty unlikely, the fact that he's failed

22:15

a polygraph where the feds were seeking information

22:17

about his missing ill-gotten

22:20

gains and also who may have

22:23

also been involved in conspiring with him.

22:27

I don't know that the feds are going to

22:29

be offering him any sort of deal. He might change

22:31

his mind. He might change his mind. I'll

22:33

start, you know, whatever. What

22:36

information does he have that could be worth anything? And that would

22:38

be to start naming names who might

22:40

also have been involved in stealing money

22:42

or hiding the money. And this is all

22:45

saying that he gets a new trial for the murders and

22:47

then he gets off. I mean, these are a lot of...

22:49

He's got two life sentences and he's looking at

22:51

it. It's not. So,

22:53

if all he gets is this

22:56

54 days or something

22:58

like that, but do the math, he's probably

23:00

looking... Instead of in his 70s, he

23:02

would be in his 80s when he would be eligible

23:05

for parole, which I

23:07

mean, state prison time

23:09

is rough. I don't know how many

23:11

inmates... Make it to their

23:13

80s? Make it to their 80s. Yeah,

23:17

he's what, 56 now. So, let's

23:19

assume he did got the good

23:21

behavior credit. That means he would

23:23

get out around the age of 80s, assuming

23:25

he was able to get the

23:27

murder convictions overturned. Right. And

23:29

the odds... I mean, that fight's still a few

23:32

years out, all the appeals and whatnot. Well,

23:34

he's already with the state charges. He's

23:36

in there... 27

23:38

year sentence, I believe. We've done the math. He's required to

23:41

serve at least 22 of these years. So,

23:43

I don't think there's any real rush on

23:45

working on these things because he's definitely going

23:47

to be in jail till... for the next

23:49

22 years. Minimum, yeah. So,

23:53

yeah, so, you know, when they were fighting that,

23:55

trying to bring up the things about the polygraph,

23:58

I'm assuming that... You. Would

24:00

agree there's that can be much luck fighting the

24:03

feds on those kind of things that party your

24:05

deal as you gotta take one and then you're

24:07

like, well, throw that sucker out, Yell at me

24:09

to It seems to me that. He's

24:12

gonna ever a tough time

24:14

overturning. Or with the a

24:17

good federal judge. Gave. Them

24:19

in terms of his sentence or

24:21

I'd say to probably the judges

24:23

Righteous I see did not considering

24:25

a polygraph because autographs have some

24:28

endured a great deal of criticism.

24:30

Of many people believe that

24:33

they're unreliable. I'm I'm

24:35

not sure the. You know

24:37

the criteria they used in testing him.

24:39

So. I think what does came

24:42

down to simply posted. The judge

24:44

looked at a lawyer. Who.

24:46

Basically stole money from.

24:48

Clients. Are many people

24:51

have limited means ah with

24:53

or reflect situations. And

24:56

the judge. This was. Deeply

24:58

offended by that. Did

25:01

accept the state recommendation of Thirty

25:03

years. And decided that

25:05

he was going impose a greater setting

25:07

sun goes that simple and I don't

25:09

think as we have of i don't

25:11

begin to have it overtook the trucks

25:14

and that's or censor. I. Know

25:16

we were talking earlier and you've

25:18

mentioned something about what. This. Turf

25:20

War. And you're like, ah, sell it,

25:22

Tell me your thoughts on that. Are the

25:24

turf war between the South, Cal

25:27

State and the Feds. Yeah.

25:29

I think it's just doesn't make sense What

25:32

you know that is as into Griffin is

25:34

a good lord himself. Good job for his

25:36

claim, but that com it really didn't make

25:38

much sense to me. Ah, I mean it's

25:41

yeah, I think that they have probably worked

25:43

out at the same time around St. John

25:45

a deal with both the. State

25:48

prosecutors and and the end of

25:50

Federal prosecutors. For. The twenty seven

25:52

year term. you know. obviously situations

25:54

change your you still gotta go

25:56

before a judge who has to

25:58

accept their recommend. And ah, and

26:01

and it's really the judge who makes

26:03

the determination. And dozen or so. I

26:05

don't think this was really a tough

26:07

battle between the two. I just think

26:10

it was a judge looking at it.

26:12

Believe that this is what the sentence

26:14

is that he deserved. A

26:16

very good thank matter Procedure wise words

26:18

is always. A

26:21

My pleasure or pleasure. Talk to you soon!

26:24

Good. Thank you so much. Thanks. That.

26:27

And to see, never forget that day

26:29

or comments from someone you'd like to

26:31

share. Or this is a consistent

26:34

client. We've gotten a lot. I've really

26:36

enjoyed his podcast. Has anyone ever. Heard.

26:38

Any term from any the family members

26:41

of Maggie Their opinions of the trial

26:43

results with speak volumes. It is

26:45

amazing how quiet they have been. Friends

26:47

you don't even hear from friends and

26:50

they they've really closed. The

26:52

Circle. Even from the

26:54

very very beginning the of we tried bigger fish

26:57

that us have tried to get. Paint.

26:59

A picture of Maggie with the help of.

27:02

Family. Of friends and dead know and thus

27:04

far as been really able to. Found.

27:08

Anyone that's willing to speak to that. Now.

27:10

I mean there was one article in

27:13

the person career were at John Marvin

27:15

and List as about. Their.

27:17

Relationship with her but we really have not

27:19

heard from her. Ah. Size them. Her

27:21

side, the family or from any of

27:24

her friends and. I

27:26

don't know for us probably mart up when

27:28

we're moving on to lots of other different

27:30

things we we keep saying when that was

27:32

a menace seems like it's at it is

27:34

given this kid the at desk of the

27:36

the last Murdoch episode for quite some time

27:38

and mean there are appeals to com and

27:40

Navy will still be doing as podcast. Two

27:42

or three years are now. you'll. Have that

27:44

delays I had. I'm you know we're

27:47

moving to other things. ah that we

27:49

will cover other nice. It. Comes

27:51

right! So we're again had the

27:53

A You Tube channels given a

27:55

week with that for will be

27:57

back with that So please subscribe

27:59

Evergreen Park. As network were

28:01

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can find impact of influence

28:05

on Facebook and comment there

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Please rate and share and

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subscribe. And. Will talk soon

28:11

friend. My. Name is Bill Hoffman

28:14

and I am a former Cleveland News

28:16

producer and I am now the host

28:18

of the podcast Who Kills. I

28:20

began the show focusing on the unsolved

28:22

murder of any Mahalik. And

28:24

now each week are exploring different case

28:27

with a focus on some of the

28:29

victims who don't get the attention they

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deserve. I. Have a deep catalogue of

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He. Let

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introduce you to bury close and

28:59

authorized financial advisor from New Zealand

29:01

and a very special kind of

29:03

stain on humanity. A with

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a very knowledgeable young guy. With

29:07

the rejected financial advisor. Type of

29:09

guy that was bending over backwards to help you.

29:12

Are you could be forgiven for thinking that

29:14

Barry sounds like a great go high and

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you'd be right? Well, right up into the.

29:18

Point when you wrong that with

29:20

all birds fishes to stall for.

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My son who has a disability

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from Asia know. He died a

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lazing. There were all taken care. Of

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a psychopath is somebody who lacks empathy

29:31

act impulsively of It was a strong

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