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Sounds, music, radio, podcasts.

1:19

Hello and welcome to Gardener's Question Time. We're

1:22

back near the banks of the River Thames

1:24

in the borough of Hammersmith and Fulham in

1:26

West London. It's one of the

1:28

oldest parts of the capital. There's evidence of human

1:30

settlement here about 2000 years ago. In

1:34

fact, due to the historical importance of

1:36

this area, keen allotment holders aren't permitted

1:38

to dig below a certain depth, and

1:40

the growing of trees is restricted, but

1:43

not impossible. Just down the

1:45

road from our venue today, which is the Sands

1:47

End Arts and Community Centre, is Fulham

1:49

Palace, which was completed in 1520. The

1:53

palace bishop, between 1675 and 1713, was one Henry

1:55

Compton, a very keen guard He

2:00

arranged for rare plants to be shipped

2:03

back from North America, Africa, India and

2:05

the Caribbean. And during his

2:07

time at Fulham Palace, the gardens were said

2:09

to be home to about a thousand exotic

2:11

plant species, which made Fulham Palace

2:13

one of the most important botanic gardens of

2:15

the time. Our own exotic

2:17

plant lover Matthew Potage will be visiting the

2:19

palace later in the programme to find out

2:22

more about this extraordinary green space. But

2:24

before then, whether you're after a rare

2:26

species or craving the cottage garden, a

2:29

little reference to Fulham Football Club there, I

2:31

thought that was quite clever. I can't believe

2:33

you're groaning. You have come

2:35

to the right place. Joining Matthew on

2:37

the team today are Hampshire's pest and

2:40

disease pioneer, Hippo Greenwood, and

2:42

from Norfolk, allotment king Bob Slardew,

2:44

your Premier League Gardeners Question Time

2:46

panel. Let's

2:55

go into our wonderful audience here in Fulham

2:57

for our first question. Hello, panel. I'm

3:00

Barbara from East Torsley. For the

3:02

last few years, I have grown trombone chino plants,

3:05

lots of them. So I give a few

3:07

to friends and family. Why are

3:09

my neighbours much longer than mine? So

3:13

perhaps, are we in the squash family here,

3:15

Bob? Trombone chinos? Yeah, I

3:17

mean, basically, it's like a courgette that's gone wrong, isn't

3:19

it? It grows,

3:21

I've seen them three, four foot long, curbs

3:23

at the end. Do you

3:25

know, it's Italian, obviously, the name, but

3:27

does it mean trombone? I think it does.

3:29

I think it does, because they look sort of like... It's got

3:31

an e-nal on the end. Little trombone. Little

3:34

trombone. Yeah, the big

3:36

trombones, aren't they? And your neighbours are growing

3:38

much better than yours from the plants you've

3:40

given them. Yes, they are.

3:42

That's really annoying, isn't it? My

3:45

neighbours are travelling all along the fence, over

3:47

the hedge, down the road. So

3:49

what are they doing differently to you? I

3:52

don't know. All of the

3:54

courgette family, the cucabits, the pumpkins,

3:56

the squashes, particularly butter nuts, they

3:59

need really... a lot of richness

4:01

in the soil. If you put them in

4:03

an ordinary soil, they'll do, but they won't do

4:05

that well. If you want to grow a

4:07

good crop of any of these squashes, dig out

4:09

a hole, fill it with muck, mix up

4:11

the soil with more compost and more well-rotted manure,

4:13

pile it up and grow it on that,

4:15

and then you'll grow amazing sized ones. The

4:18

next thing is, if you leave

4:20

the first ones on, then they

4:22

tend to grow and the plant doesn't grow

4:24

much more. People often do this

4:26

with butternuts. You know, oh, I've got a butternut

4:28

coming and they leave it and then they get

4:31

two or three small butternut squashes. If you take

4:33

on the first ones, the plant keeps growing. It's

4:35

going to set up flowers, set up fruit. That's

4:37

what he wants to do. But if

4:39

you make it grow a few more leaves first,

4:41

then get more bigger, then you get bigger squashes.

4:43

So I wonder if that's what they're doing. Or it

4:45

may just be that they're growing

4:47

it in such a way that the early

4:49

flowers are maybe falling off and then the

4:51

later ones are growing and producing these bigger

4:54

ones. I would try richer conditions

4:56

and take off the earliest fruits. Do you

4:58

want to give your taste, good Barbara? Yes,

5:01

they're very nice fried actually. I would

5:03

recommend them. They're great fun to grow.

5:05

The size doesn't always matter. You

5:08

should see them. Thank

5:11

you so much. Let's move along to

5:13

our next questioner. Hello, my name's

5:15

Arthur Lowe and I live in

5:17

Teating. Can the panel please recommend

5:20

a house plant that starts small

5:22

but grows quickly? Ah,

5:25

Arthur, how old are you? 11.

5:28

I believe it was just your birthday, is that right?

5:30

Yeah. Let's have a special round of applause for Arthur.

5:33

Happy birthday. Thanks

5:37

Arthur. Have you been looking after

5:39

plants for a long time? Yeah. Okay, so

5:41

you want something that grows fast. What would

5:43

be a good place for Arthur to start,

5:45

Pippa? Well, can I ask, have you got

5:47

any house plants at the moment Arthur? Are

5:49

you just starting out on this? So have

5:51

you got anything like any of the Monsteras,

5:53

the cheese plants? Yeah. I've got some of

5:55

those. Have you got any of these funky

5:58

variegated ones? No. Matthew,

6:01

what do we mean by very good, just in

6:03

case Arthur doesn't know? Yeah, so rather than

6:05

just plain, boring green leaves, they can have

6:08

sometimes an interesting margin or a splash or

6:10

a speckle. It can be white, it can

6:12

be cream, it can be pink, sometimes it

6:14

can be all three. So sometimes

6:17

if you're of a weak constitution and these

6:19

things make you feel unwell, you can find

6:21

it very stressful looking at variegated leaves. If

6:24

you've got really good taste, which I think

6:26

you have, you will love them. He's saying

6:28

all this because I always say they look

6:30

diseased in me. That's what he's going at.

6:32

I've heard it all before, it looks like someone's

6:34

put weed killer on it. Anyway,

6:37

Pippa is right, so the variegated Swiss

6:39

cheese plants are super cool, it's where

6:41

it's at in house plants. So

6:44

I'm going to recommend to you a variegated

6:46

cheese plant, but there's a mistake and there's

6:48

a good one. So the old fashioned variegata,

6:51

Monstera delicosa variegata, the

6:53

old fashioned variegated cheese

6:55

plant, is not very vigorous.

6:58

It's slow growing and sometimes it

7:00

produces all white leaves, which then

7:02

gets sunburnt. So it does just go

7:04

brown. It'll cost you hundreds of pounds

7:07

and it's a misery. So go for

7:09

one called Thai Constellation. Thai is in

7:11

Thailand and it's all splashed with yellow

7:13

variegation. It's quick growing, it's healthy and

7:16

you'll be able to put it all

7:18

over your Facebook and Instagram and everyone

7:20

will think it's amazing. Okay,

7:22

get it on your birthday. Oh, it's birthday, it could be

7:24

a late birthday present. Have you got your parents here? Yes,

7:27

we can sign this one off now. Yeah,

7:30

yeah. Oh, they're smiling, that's a good sign.

7:32

Yeah. But do you know, I'm

7:35

just saying to you now, the parents here, you're

7:37

lucky enough to have a young chap in your

7:39

life, who's a lovely young chap to start with,

7:42

if I may say so, but also who's interested

7:44

in plants. What happens next and

7:46

whether this lovely thing grows, not just

7:48

the sun, but the house plants and

7:50

the interest is down to you. So

7:52

I found out now, haven't you,

7:54

where you could start a late

7:56

birthday present. Are they

7:58

specifically asked about things that grow? grow fast Bob. I've

8:01

got something. Not only does it grow fairly

8:03

fast, it's absolutely gorgeous and it's very easy

8:05

to root from cuttings because all your friends

8:07

are going to want one and you can

8:10

make a fortune selling them plants. Have

8:12

you heard of the parrot plant? No.

8:14

Right, it actually grows little yellow and

8:16

red parrots. They look just like

8:19

little parrots. It's an impatient, a busy lizzy. Really

8:21

easy. It needs to be kept warm inside. It

8:23

is a house plant. Go on to the internet

8:25

and have a look. You'll see a picture. You

8:27

can buy one. When you've got the first one,

8:29

you can have a hundred within a few months.

8:32

If you grow one really well, it can

8:34

be several feet tall, covered in all these

8:36

beautiful little parrots. And as I say,

8:38

all your friends are going to want one. You can be

8:40

rich by Christmas. And then you can be

8:43

buying any range of these variegated cheese plants

8:45

for what you really want. And you

8:47

can also get a variegated parrot plant.

8:49

There we

8:51

go. Oh, you can't. Can you? No, you

8:53

can't. Hey,

8:56

it's a really great suggestion. And you can root

8:58

them in water. They're fascinating to watch. Rooting the

9:00

cuttings in water. My grandma had a huge parrot

9:03

plant. It's a great suggestion. Really great suggestion. And

9:05

do you know the other thing is, if you,

9:07

well, you thought we're saving up your money for

9:09

some of these more exotic things, think about getting,

9:11

do you like eating mangoes? Yes.

9:14

They're really good fun to grow. And

9:17

if you get the seed, when you've eaten

9:19

the mango off, obviously, and then I found

9:21

it was very slightly trim off the end

9:24

of the sort of really tough

9:26

husk around the seed because then it

9:28

just speeds things up. Basically, they grow

9:30

really, they germinate really quite fast and

9:32

it's fascinating to watch. And then they

9:34

produce these really pretty leaves. They're not

9:36

going to fruit over here. I'm pretty

9:38

sure about that. Sadly, they're not going

9:41

to be the longest lasting house plant,

9:43

but they do look fun. And it's

9:45

another nice, interesting thing to be doing as

9:47

well. And it's free if you're eating the

9:49

mangoes anyway. Lots of

9:51

ideas there for you, Arthur, to get started. And we'll

9:53

put them all on the Radio 4 website so

9:55

you can remember what they said. Thank you for

9:57

coming and thanks for your question. Thank you. Let's

10:00

take our next problem. Hi

10:02

there. Hello, Emma Walker from Fulham.

10:05

What is the best, most giving, idiot-proof

10:07

crop to grow on the allotments? Are

10:10

you a new allotment here, Emma? I'm

10:13

a caterer, so I want to grow something unusual. I

10:15

don't want something I can buy every day. Something

10:18

unusual and idiot-proof. Yeah, and idiot-proof.

10:21

Matthew Potich. Yeah, are you surprised? We

10:23

think volunteering a vegetable question. I'm finding

10:25

myself surprised, because I've got an idea,

10:28

because I know how expensive they are

10:30

to buy around here, and they're so

10:32

easy to grow. Jerusalem artichokes. They

10:35

are so delicious. She doesn't look happy. Jerusalem

10:37

artichoke puree. I know what happens to the

10:39

body afterwards when you've eaten the much. We

10:41

all know, it's why you're laughing. I share

10:44

my allotment with a friend who

10:46

she hates Jerusalem artichokes, so

10:48

they're off the menu, off the menu.

10:50

Why is she dictating to you? Because

10:52

she's lovely. She doesn't sound

10:55

it. Well, anyway, I'm sure she does. But

10:58

they're so expensive to buy, and they are

11:00

so vigorous, and they're reliably perennial. I think

11:02

they're brilliant. But when you know how easy

11:04

they are to grow, you really resent paying,

11:06

you know, over a fiver for a tiny

11:09

punnet of them. But anyway, your allotment friend's

11:11

lovely, so Bob and Pepper can maybe have

11:13

some food she'll approve. We love that you

11:15

came up with a vegetable idea, so thank

11:17

you. I'll have the rest of the act

11:19

night off. Pepper,

11:22

what would you put in this

11:25

idiot-proof plot? Well, I think what you've got

11:27

to bear in mind, you're caterers, you want something unusual.

11:29

And I would say that a lot of veg that

11:31

you buy in a supermarket

11:34

are not worth bothering with. So I

11:36

would say grow some of the, what

11:38

you might call boring veg, and experience

11:40

what they should actually taste like. And

11:42

the classics for me are courgettes, which

11:44

you harvest when they're small, not

11:46

sold by weight, therefore a big one

11:48

is a good one. You want the

11:50

nice, tender ones that are, they have

11:52

a wonderful texture, and yes, and also

11:54

kind of melt-in-the-mouth ability. They're never

11:56

bitter, they're lovely. Something like sweet

11:59

corn, which. the moment you break

12:01

the cob from the plant all the sugars

12:03

start converting to starches and they lose

12:05

their sweetness and you can harvest

12:07

them when they're absolutely perfect and they are

12:10

they're totally different to anything you can buy

12:12

even from a you know even one from

12:14

a farmer's market is old by the time

12:16

you get it home in my mind so

12:18

i would definitely think about those and if

12:21

you want something a bit more flamboyant then

12:23

go for something like borlotti beans or some

12:25

of the flat-potted french beans which are so

12:27

delicious and even renne beans for heaven's sake

12:29

you often see them in supermarkets and

12:31

they look like sort of wok cricket

12:34

bats painted green and who wants

12:36

to eat those you know grow decent ones

12:38

of normal things that you like to eat

12:40

yeah good idea pepper bob you're the king

12:42

of grow your own what would you suggest well

12:44

i think emma you're in the perfect position because

12:46

you've made the logical decision to grow a few

12:49

things you really want rather than trying to grow

12:51

it you can always tell the first person on

12:54

an allotment has just started because they've

12:56

got 73 packets of seeds you know

12:58

that new whereas the old boys they've

13:00

got six right because they know what

13:02

does well and what they're going to

13:04

use now you've got limited time i

13:07

suggest you forget the annual vegetables

13:09

go for the perennials all right

13:11

and not jurisim artichoke because once you've got

13:13

them in you'll never get them out again right that

13:16

is an acquired taste however if you

13:18

like globe artichokes have

13:20

you ever had a good one from a shop

13:22

because i've never never had a good one fresh

13:24

they're like asparagus they're wonderful you put them in

13:26

all you've got to do from then on is

13:28

weed and water you don't need to have to

13:30

water them half a dozen plants

13:33

will fill up most of an allotment

13:35

anyway and they look fantastic the flowers

13:37

are great there's cut flowers if you

13:39

let them go over you've got an

13:41

extremely valuable crop and my god they're

13:43

delicious and the little you can eat

13:45

the little ones whole oh once i

13:47

pickle absolutely gorgeous along with that you

13:49

might consider growing some asparagus again

13:51

all you put the plants in and from then

13:53

on forever all you've got to do is weed

13:55

and crop i mean goodness say you couldn't do

13:57

much better than that and then

13:59

ruba Don't

14:01

just grow the ordinary. Itoria is wonderful,

14:03

but there's a lot of varieties. Grow

14:06

some of the specialist ones. They

14:09

don't taste like cherries, they don't taste

14:11

like champagne, but they are different. And

14:13

again, all you do is weeding and

14:16

look after them. This is the perennials and

14:18

something that I've really got hooked on recently

14:20

is sea kale. You grow this beautiful plant

14:23

during the year, which is sort of green

14:25

and lush, and then in the winter you

14:27

put a pot over it, just like you

14:29

do rhubarb, and you get this bland stems

14:32

of sea kale. And it's like a spiritus,

14:34

very similar, but you can

14:36

eat the whole thing, not just

14:38

the top bit. Absolutely marvellous. Perennial

14:40

vegetables. To get this annual sowing,

14:43

all the green digging, howling, all

14:45

the perennials. Come on, then we

14:47

can have the annuals until your perennials are ready, and then you'll

14:49

see the light and want both. And then have

14:51

73 packets of seeds. I

14:53

hope that provided some inspiration.

14:55

Thanks. Let's

15:01

take another question. Hi, I'm Pam Bate.

15:03

I'm a volunteer at the Plum Palace

15:05

Garden. But I

15:07

wanted to ask you about my silver birch trees.

15:10

I had three stunning ones, and

15:13

they died one by one of

15:15

honey fungus. And

15:18

the trees have been removed, but I'm

15:20

left with fungus coming up in the

15:22

grass. And I just

15:24

want to know how to get rid

15:27

of this evil-looking fungus. You

15:30

move home. Oh,

15:33

no, it can't be that bad. Pepper? Well,

15:36

are you sure that the... Because honey fungus

15:38

is like a gardener's nightmare if you grow

15:40

any number of woody plants pretty well. But

15:42

are you sure that the fungi that are

15:44

coming up in the lawn are necessarily the

15:46

toadstools of honey fungus? Because

15:50

there are an awful lot of perfectly innocent, indeed

15:53

sometimes beneficial, honeyish, yellowish-colored toadstools

15:56

that you might see in

15:58

the garden. And a lot of

16:00

those will live on dead wood. So

16:02

if you've got a dead root, because the

16:04

tree's being felled under the say, your lawn,

16:06

you might have a neat row of toadstools

16:08

coming out of it. They might be bad

16:10

guys, but they might also be innocent. Or

16:12

as I say, they might even be gooders.

16:16

So you want to get somebody involved

16:18

who can check what you've got. But

16:20

the easiest way to see whether it's honey

16:22

fungus or not is

16:24

a really weird thing about honey fungus is

16:27

that the spores are white. And

16:29

most, almost all, gingery yellow-colored

16:32

toadstools, except honey fungus, have

16:34

brown or gingery-colored spores. So

16:37

when you've got these things fruiting, and they'll

16:39

be doing so probably in the autumn, I

16:42

would assume, go out there when

16:44

the caps have just started to open, cut

16:46

a few off, come inside, and then it's

16:49

a bit like a sort of children's science

16:51

program. You can have fun. Get

16:54

a nice piece of paper, half

16:56

of it white, half of it a

16:58

very dark color, ideally black, and

17:01

put these caps of the

17:03

toadstools with all the gills facing

17:05

downwards, so the roundy bit uppermost. Maybe

17:08

put something like a bowl over the top if

17:10

you've got an active house with lots of air

17:13

movement, just so the spores go down onto the

17:15

paper. You'll then either see white spores, which pretty

17:17

well says they're very likely to be a honey

17:19

fungus, if they look like it as well. Or

17:22

you'll see gingery brown spores, in

17:24

which case, you needn't worry at all. So

17:27

I wouldn't panic until you know you've got something

17:29

to panic about. If you do find you've got

17:31

something to panic about, it's

17:33

not easy, understatement, but the more of

17:35

that wood associated with the

17:37

dead silver birch and anything else that's dyed,

17:40

you can get out of the soil without

17:42

digging up your garden, and that's a difficult

17:44

bit, is an advantage, so

17:46

digging those up wherever you can. Good

17:49

point, though, to first check what the problem

17:52

is. Sometimes people go and do terrible things

17:54

in their garden digging stuff up, and it's

17:56

not actually honey fungus. Matthew Pottage? Yeah,

17:58

I wouldn't panic too much. I mean, so

18:01

many old established gardens are full of

18:03

honey fungus. It's not unusual. And the

18:06

honey fungus is gonna go for anything

18:08

under stress normally. Honey fungus is aggressive,

18:10

so sometimes you think, oh, this is

18:13

really annoying. But often these things go

18:15

for things in stress conditions. And the

18:17

climate pattern where moving towards of hotter,

18:19

drier summers does not suit birch at

18:22

all. Birch is not a tree of

18:24

the future in the southeast, sadly. And

18:26

around lots of parts of Surrey on

18:29

sand where birch naturally grow, they're

18:31

often defoliating by midsummer. They're under

18:33

terrible stress because they're so shallow-rooted.

18:36

So even if you have honey fungus

18:38

or not, I would think about looking

18:40

at more climate-resilient trees to replace them

18:42

with. Look at something like a Ligastromia,

18:44

which is a summer-flowering tree. Wonderful bark.

18:46

We'll take any amount of heat and

18:49

drought once it's established. And that tree

18:51

is far less likely to be under

18:53

stress in a hot, dry summer.

18:55

And it will be less likely for the

18:57

honey fungus to move in. But so many

18:59

stressed birch around the last few summers. And

19:02

if honey fungus is around, it's gonna go

19:04

straight in and attack as it has. Okay,

19:07

thanks panel. Good luck, Pam. Thanks. More

19:10

questions from our audience here in Fulham

19:12

very soon. Now earlier I mentioned Fulham

19:14

Palace and its pioneering contribution to

19:16

horticulture. It's a rare sight

19:18

in London in that it boasts 13 acres

19:21

of green space right next to

19:23

the Thames. Well, earlier today, Fulham

19:25

resident Matthew Potich visited the palace to

19:27

meet head gardener Lucy Hart and find

19:29

out what makes it so special. So

19:33

it's a real treat for me this afternoon, literally

19:36

walking around the corner from home. And I've come

19:38

to one of my favorite little, well, I call

19:40

it best kept secret in London, the Fulham Palace.

19:43

And you're greeted at Fulham Palace with

19:45

this amazing old building. And I'm here

19:47

this afternoon to meet Lucy Hart, the

19:49

head gardener, to hear a little bit

19:51

more about what happens here. Hi, Matt.

19:53

Thanks for coming. Really good to see

19:56

you. You would never know you're in zone two of

19:58

London. I mean, maybe except the roaring place. every

20:00

few minutes but this literally feels like

20:02

we could be in Suffolk or somewhere

20:04

it's so dreamy and green and leafy.

20:07

We're a seven minute walk from

20:09

Putney Bridge tube station so yeah

20:11

we're absolutely like in London we're almost on

20:13

the Thames of course you've got Bishops Park

20:16

next door to us. A little place of

20:18

course the museum the natural palace and the

20:20

gardens are free to enter aren't they year

20:22

round? Absolutely we're a you know young

20:24

independent charity we're free of charge to

20:26

get in a lot of our

20:28

income is from private rentals

20:30

also of course we have events

20:33

and private donations. Well as

20:35

gorgeous as the courtyard is Lucy we're here to

20:37

see the garden so where should we start? I

20:40

think we should go to the Bishop

20:42

Compton border Matt and we can talk

20:44

about the collection that we recently got

20:46

national collection status for. Right lead

20:49

on. So

20:52

Lucy these are your Bishop Compton borders but

20:55

before we delve into what we're looking at

20:57

here just go back a few steps for

20:59

us and for listeners at home who was

21:01

Bishop Compton and what's his connection with horticulture

21:03

and Fulham Palace? Bishop Compton

21:05

was Bishop of London who lived

21:08

here between 1675 and 1713 so many years ago

21:10

yeah and he really brought horticultural

21:16

glory and fame to Fulham Palace because

21:18

he was obsessed with

21:20

collecting plants and he

21:23

used his position within the church

21:25

to feed that hobby

21:28

because he was repulsive for

21:30

the overseas English territories he would send

21:33

out his clergy and he would ask them

21:35

to go and collect plants and send them

21:37

back to him. He had

21:39

plants coming in from many places

21:42

India, Canary Islands, South Africa but

21:44

it was predominantly North America with

21:47

Reverend John Bannister being perhaps most active

21:49

of his clergy you know

21:52

like lots of botanists around that

21:54

time Bannister used the

21:56

help of Native Americans

21:58

and enslaved people to

22:01

document, to process, to collect those

22:03

plants, to track them out in

22:05

the wild. We don't know

22:07

who those people were, we don't know their cultural

22:10

backgrounds, but we know that they

22:12

were involved. And in the

22:14

borders here today, obviously telling the story of

22:16

his plants, are these all his introductions that

22:18

were standing among? Yeah, so he would

22:20

get the plants sent back and of course shipping

22:22

was just happening then, and I think it's

22:25

really interesting to know how things were being

22:27

sent back, so they would ask

22:29

the ship surgeon to look after the seeds

22:31

and the plants, because I think they were

22:33

probably the people who could deal

22:36

with trying to keep these things alive, but mostly

22:38

seeds and corns were being sent back. And

22:40

then it was thought that Bishop Compton

22:42

had about a thousand species growing here

22:45

from all over the world. The

22:47

gardens became quite famous and he had a lot

22:49

of visitors from famous botanists, such

22:51

as Plupinet and Petiva, and then

22:53

they would come and take all

22:56

the herbarium specimens. And

22:59

some to this day that are in the

23:01

Hansel and Herbarium. This wall garden is huge,

23:03

how big is the place? I didn't ask you before. It's

23:06

two and a half, two, three quarter acres,

23:08

it's one hectare. The wall garden? Yeah, it's

23:10

massive. Of course, when the Bishop

23:12

lived here, he would have entertained every night, and

23:14

so all four quadrants would

23:16

have been for grown produce. You

23:20

can see the All Saints Church Tower just there,

23:22

I have actually got a photo where you can

23:24

look down, it was taken in

23:26

the fifties, but you can see all the quadrants were

23:28

over to growing. So

23:34

Lucy, this is a monster, tell us about

23:36

this. So this is

23:38

our oldest tree, it's a

23:40

homoque, Quercus islex, we

23:42

know it's about 500 years old

23:44

or so, it's just wonderful. This

23:47

was a mature tree when Bishop Compton was here

23:50

doing all his collecting, and so I

23:52

think that's a really cool thing.

23:55

We're vaping this off, of course the leaf litter

23:57

can now build up, and we've cracked in here

23:59

for this recording. which is good of you,

24:01

but there's so much humus and

24:03

goodness. So yeah, we're putting all this

24:05

back. I mean, it's so deep. And

24:08

I would scratch around more, but I'm in white

24:10

trainers. But yeah, this is brilliant for all the

24:12

fibrous root plate of the tree. And as we've

24:14

come to understand more about trees, we know all

24:16

this active root is in the top 30 centimetres.

24:18

So yeah, you don't need 18 million

24:21

picnics and golf buggers and the world

24:23

and his wife kicking around underneath it.

24:25

Yeah, absolutely. I couldn't agree more. Well,

24:27

if only it could tell a story, eh, but

24:30

what a wonderful thing to have. And of course,

24:32

for visitors that do come, you do have a

24:34

serviceable path really close by. So people can really

24:36

appreciate the spirit of this old

24:38

beast. Matthew

24:42

Potage with the head gardener at Fulham

24:44

Palace, Lucy Hart. You're listening

24:46

to Gardener's Question Time on Radio 4

24:49

and BBC Signs with me, Cathy Clugston.

24:51

On the panel today are Pippa Greenwood,

24:53

Bob Flaardew and Matthew Potage. And

24:55

we're with a lovely audience of gardeners in

24:57

Fulham in London. Hello. Hello. Let's

25:06

get back to the questions. Hi,

25:08

Theo Antipas from Fulham Palace

25:10

allotment. As the

25:13

organiser of the annual Fulham

25:16

Palace Chilli Fest, what we hold every

25:18

year, I'd be really interested to know

25:20

if the panel had a favourite chilli

25:23

and if you had any key growing

25:26

tips that you could pass on to

25:28

us. OK, Bob, favourite

25:30

chilli. Right. The most important thing, and

25:32

I discovered this and I showed it

25:35

to somebody at a great trial. They

25:37

had hundreds of pots of chillis growing

25:39

in this greenhouse. And it

25:41

is that the roots of chillis and

25:43

sweet peppers really hate being in black

25:45

pots in the sun. If

25:48

you've got one in a pot and sitting there and you've had

25:50

it there for a couple of weeks, tip it

25:52

out and look, and you'll see there are no

25:54

roots in the compost on the sunny side. Obviously,

25:57

at the start of the season, they need warmth to get

25:59

going. but they don't like hot roots. So

26:01

if you've got them in pots, put a bit

26:03

of aluminium foil around it or stand it inside

26:06

a bigger pot to keep it chases. It'll make

26:08

a huge difference. And it's the black pot you're

26:10

saying is the problem? Black pots are the worst.

26:14

Red pots just get hot but not as hot as

26:16

the black ones. The black ones really cook the compost.

26:18

Gosh, I've got a lot of work then. I've got a lot

26:20

of black pot. Repot everything. You

26:23

could just paint them with whitewash or just a

26:26

bit of aluminium foil around it. It's quick enough

26:28

to put around. The next thing is they

26:31

don't grow as quickly as sweet peppers. People expect

26:33

them to grow the same. They are a bit

26:35

slower, so you've got to be more patient with

26:37

them. They also produce

26:40

huge numbers of chilies, which is completely different

26:42

to the sweet peppers, which produce only a

26:44

few. So you seldom need to stake them.

26:47

As to the actual varieties, I have given

26:49

up almost all the ones that are sold

26:51

on heat. They're just basically these are people

26:54

who are not gormes. They are sadists. Right?

26:57

You do not want something that is

26:59

so hot you can't taste it. You

27:01

want something with flavor. And the grannies

27:04

bonnet, the Scotch bonnet, the habaneros. They've

27:07

got flavor. They're hot.

27:09

They are very hot actually. But

27:12

what I've got is a trick and it's wonderful.

27:14

If you like things like rice with chili in

27:16

them, rice and beans, which is

27:18

rice in coconut milk with chili and

27:21

thyme to flavor it in a shot,

27:23

put in the habanero just

27:26

before it colors. So it

27:28

wants to be green turning

27:30

to either yellow or red.

27:33

And it must be whole and it must have the stalk on it.

27:35

And you put it into your rice or into

27:37

your other dish, your stews or

27:39

whatever, whole. And you take it

27:41

out whole. You do take it out because

27:43

you don't want anyone accidentally eating it thinking it's a bit

27:45

of meat. And you get this

27:48

most delicious, almost like

27:50

you put a hambone in. It

27:52

gives you a marmalade flavor.

27:54

It gives you a flavor you

27:56

cannot believe and some heat. If

27:59

it's punctured... you get all the heat and

28:01

you kind of lose that wonderful flavour. So that's

28:03

the way to use them. Are you

28:05

interested in the really, really hot ones or not bothered

28:08

by them? When we have the eating competition,

28:10

yeah, they go... Well, they didn't even get

28:12

up to number 12 this year. They only

28:14

got up to the Kraken at number 9.

28:18

Nobody's eating Carolina Reapers. Yes, we

28:20

had the Carolina Reapers. Yeah,

28:23

they are mean. And

28:25

this is the thing. Why are

28:27

we bothering to grow these ones that are

28:30

just so hot? It's the schadenfreude of

28:32

watching everybody suffer. Ah,

28:35

OK, you get that pleasure. A bit of a

28:37

game there. But as I say, grow the habaneros

28:39

for flavour. Pepper, you're a wince thing several

28:41

times during our discussion. Funny,

28:44

I really like tasty non-English types of food,

28:46

including a bit of heat. But I don't

28:48

like anything when it gets past the point

28:50

where you can sort of feel yourself break

28:52

out in a slight sweat across the bridge

28:54

of your nose. I don't get the point

28:57

of it because I can't then taste the

28:59

flavour. And I think it harps back to

29:01

when I was doing my O-levels many moons

29:03

ago. And we had a bet between a

29:05

group of us just before a French lesson,

29:07

not ideal, about eating some chillies that someone

29:09

had brought into school. And I

29:13

won. But I do remember sitting

29:16

in the French lesson with my mouth Irish,

29:18

not being able to close it, thinking I

29:20

was probably going to die before the end

29:22

of the lesson. And I probably said

29:24

a lot less than normal because I think I was probably

29:26

something to dribble. I really

29:29

didn't see the point of it. And to be honest, I

29:31

like a bit of warmth. I don't

29:33

like anything very much. So the only

29:35

one I tend to grow is one

29:37

called Etna, which is fairly hot, but

29:39

not seriously hot. And I don't use

29:41

a lot of it. And I would

29:43

say, obviously, take the seeds out if

29:46

you want to reduce the heat dramatically and

29:48

have more of that flavour that Bob was

29:51

talking about. But no, ever since the French

29:53

lesson, no thanks. Excellent. Great.

29:55

Thank you. Well, good luck. Is there a

29:57

chilly competition coming up? Yes, on the 8th.

30:00

September this year. Oh, Excellent.

30:02

Well, good luck with that. Thanks for you. Let's

30:05

take your question. Hello. Hello, I'm

30:08

Jessie. I'm an apprentice gardener

30:10

for the palace and

30:12

I would like to plant up my parents'

30:14

roof terrace as a 40th anniversary present. They're

30:17

on the fifth floor and the terrace faces

30:19

southwest. It's very exposed to both wind and

30:21

sun. What plants could you suggest I use?

30:23

What sort of size is it, Jessie? It's

30:26

about five meters by three. It's quite large

30:29

and it's got walls on three sides and

30:31

then a kind of low wall at the

30:33

front. And there's no one above them.

30:35

They're on the top. Okay. And this

30:37

is a hard surface, presumably. Yeah, yeah,

30:39

yeah. Okay, where would we start? Bob's

30:42

large. It sounds fairly sheltered. What's

30:44

it like in winter there? I

30:46

haven't lived there for a long time, but um, it's

30:49

windy. It's just somewhere like that. Things

30:53

like lemon trees and so on. Given as long

30:55

as it's not getting down really cold, you

30:58

may have to fleece them up on

31:00

just the coldest nights. But somewhere you're

31:02

up, way up off the ground, right?

31:04

You've got the sky to worry about,

31:06

the cold coming down, but you're away

31:08

from all the cold and the dam.

31:10

I reckon that you might, it might

31:12

be worth trying. Certainly there are a

31:14

couple of the hardier ones. Possibly you

31:16

might come quats. There's

31:18

also the flying dragon. There are

31:21

some of the more hardy ones

31:23

might be worth trying, but if

31:25

they had to just take it inside just for

31:28

the cold or six weeks or so, they're just

31:30

such good value. This isn't a huge terrace. You

31:32

don't want to fill it

31:34

up with things that are going to get very big. The

31:36

lemon trees and all the citrus grow

31:38

very slowly. Right? Yeah. So

31:41

that would be a good start. The next

31:43

thing is tubs. A couple

31:45

of tubs, just mixed herbs, all the

31:47

different things, the rosemary, the thyme, the

31:49

sage, cheap and cheerful, but

31:52

anybody who cooks would love to

31:54

have them to hand. So one,

31:56

two of those, easy to

31:58

do and one costs a lot as opposed to. some

32:00

of the other things you could be going for. Thanks,

32:02

Bob. Obviously, we don't want massive

32:04

things that are too tall, presumably, in this

32:06

sort of exposed area up top. No, but

32:08

the wind will definitely manage the height that

32:11

things can grow to. So plants

32:13

that are really well accustomed to being buffeted

32:15

around and have windy conditions that don't like

32:17

too much cold are a lot of New

32:19

Zealand natives. So you won't go far on

32:22

looking at New Zealand plants. If you want

32:24

a bit of screening or a bit more

32:26

kind of larger plants, look at some of

32:28

the Pittus borums. There's loads of caprosmas

32:31

around there. They've been released. They're very

32:33

pretty, but they can't take outside London.

32:35

They don't survive the winter. But look

32:37

at caprosmas. Aesthelias as well,

32:40

lovely silvery spear-like foliage. They will be

32:42

good for you. Some of the hardy

32:44

aloes, aloe arestarter, and the other plant,

32:46

which will do really well, and they

32:48

don't mind all the wind, but they

32:50

will love the full sun and they

32:52

will love them all the winters, are

32:54

the Agapanthus. So you could go crazy

32:56

with Agapanthus. There's a really cool new

32:58

release called Popin Purple, which is really

33:01

deep, deep dark purple with a very

33:03

full flower head. They're brilliant. So

33:06

look at some of those and they're all good in containers

33:08

as well. Nice long list there

33:10

from Matthew. Pepper, if you anything

33:12

to add? Yeah, I would just

33:14

suggest that if they like cooking,

33:16

you do create a small kitchen

33:19

garden area, which you could do in a series

33:22

of sizable containers. I'm assuming you've

33:24

got no open ground up there.

33:27

Or you could create a sort of

33:29

almost miniature raised bed, provided you know

33:31

all the weight criteria for the area

33:33

you're planting on, please, because

33:36

it would be so lovely to have some fresh food that

33:38

you could go up there and some of it you

33:40

might eat. It might be really simple stuff,

33:42

like beautiful multicolored salad leaves, that sort of

33:44

thing. It could, but you know

33:46

what they like eating and create them that.

33:49

And it's something that they can keep on

33:51

going up there and doing some gardening as

33:53

well as enjoying eating it. And then on

33:55

the more ornamental side, if

33:57

we're talking as wind being quite an issue, you want

33:59

some. low growing things. And how about

34:01

if you're really lovely again, if weight

34:04

will allow stone troughs with

34:06

alpine in them. I think they can

34:08

be so heart lifting

34:11

when you get those beautiful little flowers, depending

34:13

on what you choose, you know, but the

34:15

range is there and you can create a

34:17

miniature landscape or two for them. Wonderful.

34:20

Are they quite King gardeners, Jessie? I

34:22

am the King gardener and I'm trying to sort of

34:24

encourage them, I think. So

34:28

I've run out of space in my own garden as part

34:30

of this present. So you know, I say, yes,

34:32

you may be able to help out occasionally.

34:35

Well, it's a really lovely idea. Yeah, thank

34:37

you. Best of luck. Thank you. Let's take

34:39

another question. Good afternoon

34:41

panel. Louise Courser, Fulham

34:43

Horticultural Society and Fulham Palace

34:45

Meadows Adlopment Association. Why

34:48

is my Daphne eternal fragrance producing

34:50

yellow street leaves and how do

34:52

I stop it? Oh, I see

34:54

you have a little bag. Yeah.

34:58

We love a specimen. Give it to people. It's going

35:00

to be vars. How

35:02

long have you had the Daphne, Louise?

35:05

I think four or five years. And

35:08

this is quite a recent development. It's been

35:10

doing it for the past couple of years. Just

35:12

not all of the leaves, not all over. And

35:14

actually this year, most of the new shoots are

35:17

fresh green, but last year it had quite a

35:19

lot of yellow leaves. Looks very good. Oh my

35:21

God. Give me your address. I'm coming around.

35:25

Gorgeous. It looks so nice.

35:27

It's a very good sport. We

35:30

should play a game diseased or

35:32

variegated. Well, actually the original variegation

35:34

on, oh, I forgot

35:37

the plant now. A butalon. A butalon

35:39

were found to be caused by viruses.

35:41

Oh, there we go. So when we

35:44

say they look sick, actually they are

35:46

sick. Just in a good

35:48

way. In a good way. Yeah. I think that's

35:50

gorgeous. It's really nice. There

35:55

is one Daphne or Dora or

35:57

Imaginata, which has a leaf like.

36:00

this with a silver edge around

36:02

it. I hate to

36:04

say it but these are actually quite attractive

36:06

as variegations go but this normally is

36:08

a virus. Is there a problem pepper here? I would

36:11

say that's virusy and then you can

36:13

regard that as a problem or not.

36:15

Obviously some viruses have got a massive

36:17

host range. I mean Daphne's generally are

36:20

very susceptible to viruses in

36:22

general and the problem with a virus-infected plant,

36:24

even if you do like look of it,

36:26

is it can act as a source of

36:28

infection for other plants in your garden. So

36:31

the classic and there's no telling just

36:33

by eye which one or ones you've

36:35

got in there but something might come

36:37

along say like an aphid and feed

36:40

on this one and then move on to something else

36:42

in your garden stick it scrubby little mouth

36:44

parts into that plant and then spread the

36:46

infection for you. You can even do it

36:48

by handling as well. So that

36:50

is something that worries me. I personally as

36:52

you've kind of gathered don't find this at

36:55

all attractive but if you wanted a green

36:57

leaf plant and you've got this thing that

36:59

looks like a paint fight you

37:01

know you're going to be disappointed aren't you? And

37:05

yes your name's Matthew. So

37:07

personally I would be a bit

37:09

nervous of it but what

37:11

I'd also say is that

37:14

there's a really big correlation

37:16

between stress and virus

37:18

symptoms so very often a plant can

37:20

look absolutely dreadful in the year it's

37:22

really distressed in. It's kind

37:24

of take a straw poll of the

37:26

old one. Matthew's waving the leaf. And

37:29

then when conditions are better the plant

37:31

doesn't show the symptoms and that's really

37:33

really common if it's not a combination

37:35

of viruses that are going to prove

37:37

lethal so it may be it

37:39

had a rough time maybe being a bit

37:41

too wet what didn't. It's definitely

37:43

not too wet. We've got two enormous trees

37:45

at the bottom of the garden and if

37:48

anything it's very dry whereas last year everything

37:50

was happy because it rained a lot so

37:52

I was wondering whether the water may be

37:54

sorted out for this year. It could well

37:56

be that whatever its stresses are in each

37:58

garden in each place in each garden different.

38:00

The stress is making the symptoms come out.

38:03

Personally, if that was in my garden, because I

38:05

don't like the look of it, and because I'd

38:07

be worried about it spreading, I would probably sadly

38:09

dig it up. And sell it to Matthew.

38:12

Give it to Matthew. I'd say come make

38:14

it. Sell it to anyone with good taste.

38:16

There'd be a queue for that. I mean,

38:18

so just talking about that fine line, because

38:20

it is true what the guys are saying

38:23

between virus and variegation. And you

38:25

know, my own cut off as a variegation lover is

38:27

when virus is bad, the leaves

38:29

can be puckered, twisted, look blistered,

38:31

growth can be stunted. That's not

38:33

a stable variegation, because all three

38:35

leaves are different. So it's not

38:37

stable. And that is going to

38:39

maybe replicate in a, you know,

38:42

uniform way. And when a nurseryman would see

38:44

a uniform variegation like that, that's when they

38:46

propagate it, they name it, they release it.

38:48

And we all spend a lot of money

38:50

on it, because generally people like them. Some

38:54

of you. Some people like them. Other

38:57

people make greenhouses, water bottles. Anyway, he's

38:59

laughing, but I'm

39:02

on thin ice. Anyway,

39:04

I would enjoy it as a novelty, or if

39:06

it upsets you dig it up and bonfire it

39:08

like pepper would. But I mean, at the end

39:11

of the day, I think it's quite a fun

39:13

thing, actually. Yeah, probably not lethal, we think to

39:15

the plant. You know, it just

39:17

depends on the plant. And there's no knowing whether

39:19

it's going to be... Live a little. Thank

39:22

you. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks

39:25

Louise. Let's squeeze

39:27

in one more question. Good afternoon panel.

39:29

I'm Sue Pitcher, I'm a member of

39:31

the Fulham Horticultural Society and have an

39:33

allotment at the Fulham Palace. And

39:36

I'd like to know, if you were sent to

39:38

a desert island, what plant would

39:40

you take? Oh, well, I'm

39:43

going to be very strict, very Lauren

39:45

Laverne, and insist that you pick only

39:47

one panel. It can be

39:49

your favourite or something perhaps useful on the

39:51

island. You can decide. Let

39:54

us start with Matthew Potich. It's

39:56

not a favourite, but it could be useful. I'd

39:58

pick bamboo, because within five minutes whole island

40:00

full of it so you can shelter

40:02

yourself make fires and harvest the new

40:04

shoots to eat. Very

40:07

good choice. Pepper

40:10

greenwood. Oh I'm really struggling. Go to

40:12

Bob Nanks. Go on Bob. Well

40:15

I've got a sweet tooth and I

40:17

will grow sugar cane and it's

40:19

also perfect for a desert island because it

40:21

is a hurricane it's one of the plants

40:23

that recovers after hurricane why it's growing in

40:25

so much the Caribbean not

40:28

only can I eat it and there's

40:30

a lot of sugar a lot of carbohydrate

40:32

that can survive on that but I'm sure

40:34

I'll be able to make myself a still

40:36

and make rum. And then I'll be much

40:38

happier on my desert island. You're going

40:40

to have a great time on that island. I

40:42

knew I would. I was just thinking you could make a raft out

40:44

of your bamboo and you know sail away.

40:47

I know. Sail over to Bob's island. Yeah

40:49

exactly. Have a party with Bob. Sounds like

40:52

fun. Pepper any...

40:55

If you only have one plant in the world for the rest of your life. I'm

40:58

going to have to say one of the one

41:00

plants and this is a desert island

41:02

that isn't actually a desert island. It's an

41:05

island that can cope with the climate of

41:07

the plants I love. I've been brought up

41:09

in the UK under the climate's grok but

41:11

I love what we've got in our gardens

41:13

more than any other gardens in the world.

41:15

So I'm going to go but this is

41:17

a slightly mythical plant for a really good

41:20

flavored very crispy very

41:22

juicy self fertile

41:25

apple tree that grows pretty fast. So

41:27

that it can also make you some shade. I

41:30

can have the blossom. Hopefully I'll bring in some

41:32

interesting insects on that blossom. And

41:34

then I'm going to have a lovely selection of fruit. And

41:37

I'm going to message Matthew

41:39

and say send over some of that bamboo and

41:41

then I'm going to thread some of my apples

41:44

on one of his bamboo canes and I'm going

41:46

to roast them over my fire. And

41:49

have baked apples and I might invite Bob

41:51

and Matthew. Bob could make some cider maybe.

41:54

Yes it did go

41:56

well with the sugar cane. I've got the sugar of

41:58

the apples. apple

42:00

tree be variegated? I

42:05

want a long-living vigorous apple

42:07

tree. I think you know

42:10

the answer to that question.

42:12

Sue, do you have a desert island plant? If

42:15

I would take a plant, I don't know

42:17

what I would take actually. I don't know

42:19

but probably something that I could eat like

42:21

a tomato. Yeah. Good question. Thank you Sue

42:23

and thanks to everyone here at Fulham Horticultural

42:25

Society and the Sands and Arts and Community

42:28

Centre for welcoming us so well warmly. That

42:30

is all we've got time for this week

42:32

on our visit to the London Borough of

42:34

Hammersmith and Fulham in West London. Next

42:36

week, Peter Gibbs will be in

42:38

Manchester for the RHS Urban Gardening

42:40

Show. So if you're into houseplants,

42:43

containers and balcony gardens, that is

42:45

the programme for you. Until

42:47

next time from me, Kathy Clugston, the

42:49

panel, Matthew Potage, Pippa Greenwood and Bob

42:51

Flourdew and all the GQT team, have

42:53

a great week. Goodbye. Have

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a catch yourself eating the same flavourless

43:13

dinner three days in a row, dreaming

43:15

of something better. Well, hello fresh is

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me, Geeky Palmer. Let's wake up

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those taste buds with hot juicy

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43:26

shrimp or scampi. Hello

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fresh. Stop

43:31

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43:33

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