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Adlesian. Hey,

1:31

hey, it's Conrad Thompson and you're listening to Fully

1:34

is Pod. And today we're going

1:36

to be taking a look back

1:37

at the character interviews between

1:40

Mankind and Jim Ross in 1997. I

1:43

think this is probably the breakthrough

1:46

moment for the Mankind character, not

1:48

just for the audience, but with Vince

1:50

McMahon as well. We're also going

1:52

to go ahead and revisit the matches from

1:54

King of the Ring 1997. You

1:57

may recall 96 was supposed to be Triple

1:59

H's year.

2:00

It happens in 97 and mankind

2:03

suffers a pretty brutal loss in

2:05

the process. Man, he was pulling

2:07

out all the stops with China and, uh,

2:10

it was quite the match. Hunter and

2:12

mankind in 1997, before

2:15

either guy had really tasted WWE championship

2:18

gold. Well, I don't know the campaign

2:20

or continental title. You know what I mean. We're

2:22

also going to talk about the dude love pitch and

2:25

how the WWF showed some death match

2:27

footage, which seems hard

2:29

to believe that that happened in 1997. We'll

2:32

talk about the king of the ring and what it meant once upon

2:34

a time. Of course, we got to talk about Madison

2:36

square garden and believe it or not,

2:38

we're ever going to talk about that. WAP.

2:40

Whoa. The WAP. I'll

2:43

let you guess what that stands for. Stay

2:45

tuned, boys and girls. We're going to have fun today

2:48

on a very special edition of Foley

2:51

is pod. Hey,

3:04

it's Donette Thompson

3:06

and you're listening to Foley is pod.

3:08

And of course we couldn't do it without Mr. in

3:10

your house, the hardcore legend himself,

3:13

the hall of Famer Mick Foley. Mick, how

3:15

are you, man? I'm doing great. I just

3:17

came from water burger. I'm

3:19

nourished, not just my body,

3:22

but I would say my soul as well. So

3:25

my eyes light up when you told me

3:27

last week that there was a water burger in town. I

3:30

haven't seen you that excited in a while. So

3:33

what's

3:33

your go to order at water burger? You

3:35

know what this is? I think there's a lesson to be learned

3:38

here, right? We can talk about other things as long as

3:40

wrestling is our tether. Sure. Is

3:42

that when I go a little too fancy,

3:45

you know, if I go with the

3:47

sweet and spicy barbecue burger,

3:50

it's good, but it's got so many,

3:53

so many gears and makes involved that

3:55

you kind of lose. You take away. You

3:57

take away a little bit. And so I remember.

4:00

you know maybe in 2014 they were

4:03

doing the Daniel Bryan craze was at

4:05

its apex it

4:07

was clear the fans wanted to see Daniel

4:10

in that man and I think

4:12

I sent out a tweet that said sometimes

4:15

you just want that perfect steak

4:18

you don't need all the toppings on

4:20

it and it felt to me and it's part

4:22

of a necessity because Royal Rumble

4:25

and the January now we got to go nine

4:27

ten weeks or at least two months

4:29

yeah so instead of having your

4:32

your main event set in stone and building

4:34

towards that which you can do with

4:37

a four or five week build now

4:39

you've got a you've got to throw

4:41

in some of the gimmicks and the toppings

4:44

and in some ways it takes

4:46

away from what

4:48

the fans want yeah and

4:51

so I'm suggesting they just move

4:54

the Royal Rumble to the end of February

4:57

and that you have no other pay-per-view

4:59

in between them that it's like boom once

5:02

you win that Royal Rumble you're locked in

5:04

for that main event I mean to doubt

5:06

in two thousand I think it was I'm

5:08

not sure who was 2,000 it may have

5:10

been two doubt yeah maybe in 2000 the

5:14

main event was set but then Shawn Michaels super

5:17

kicked Benoit

5:19

I think and then signed that was a four

5:21

oh four okay and then signed the contract

5:24

and I was like man I'm a stickler for details

5:26

I don't know if that's gonna fly illegally like

5:29

Shawn should have known a three-way main event a

5:31

three-way man I bet you can't do that

5:37

but yeah I've watched the water burger

5:39

reminded me because this wasn't

5:42

the first time I was there

5:44

last night as well oh yeah so that was

5:46

when I had the sweet and spicy today

5:48

I just I went traditional and

5:51

I just ordered the and I did want bacon

5:53

on it I wanted the mustard and then

5:55

they said mustard comes with it so I was wondering

5:58

when where they put in all the gimmicks

6:00

and they did. They came fully loaded. But

6:03

it was the things you expect on a burger.

6:05

You know, a little bit of lettuce, tomatoes, onions. They drug them through

6:07

the garden. And it was delicious.

6:10

Yeah. Delicious, yeah. I'm

6:12

not a water burger guy. Grillo, our cameraman,

6:15

is a huge water burger guy. Well, what are you?

6:17

What kind of guy are you as Jerry Lawler?

6:19

I'm a Shake Shack guy. That's

6:21

a Goldust line. I like that. I like

6:24

Shake Shack. Well, that line was originally

6:26

from Andy Kaupman.

6:29

Oh, that's right. On the David Letterman show saying,

6:31

I could have sued you, but I'm not that kind of guy. And

6:33

then Lawler said, what kind of guy are you?

6:35

And a hush came over the crowd. Were

6:38

you watching that live? I was watching it live.

6:40

It was the first episode of Letterman I

6:42

ever saw. And I was visiting

6:44

my brother John, who was a freshman

6:46

at Indiana University. And

6:49

Indiana had been voted. Bloomington,

6:51

Indiana had one of the top 10 pizzas

6:53

in the country as rated that year. Yeah, it was

6:55

Mama Bear's Pizza. And it was late.

6:58

So my brother ended up being down

7:00

by the loading dock during the entirety

7:02

of the Letterman show. Missed that whole

7:04

thing. And then after that point, Letterman became

7:07

a huge hit with me. Sure. And that

7:09

Lawler, that was something we were talking

7:11

about last week. Where

7:14

the Lawler stuff with Andy

7:16

Kaupman, I thought to myself and

7:18

said to my friends, like, okay, I know the rest

7:20

of that wrestling is. But that,

7:23

brother, that's real. Well, it felt

7:25

real as a fan

7:27

at the time where you quote unquote smartened up.

7:33

I was only smart in the sense that

7:35

I watched a lot. I looked

7:37

for loopholes. I guess I

7:39

wasn't. I guess I was one of those fans

7:42

who thought I knew the deal and then got

7:44

the rude and rude awakening when

7:46

I actually got into training and found I

7:48

thought my my flair for the theatric

7:50

was going to carry me over. At

7:53

that point, you could get in without

7:55

being super athletic. Right. Like

7:58

the wrestling I grew up on was. mainly

8:00

one side of squash matches and it

8:03

was a lot of grinding, pounding meat. It

8:08

was a lot of, you know, guy, heels come in,

8:10

they got to establish themselves in

8:12

the first five or six weeks so they could work with

8:14

Bruno. And that was what I was used to,

8:16

just a bunch of moves and

8:19

then he wanted to see... And some crowd work. Yeah, and some

8:21

crowd work. And it was great, it was just

8:23

a one hour show, I thought it was great. But

8:26

I would look at the loopholes and I would

8:28

see... But then you end up seeing loopholes that are

8:30

not actually there. Where even

8:32

when you see something up below that, you know,

8:34

and make no mistake about it, guy, heels are

8:36

on TV or baby faces, you lay

8:38

that stuff in, right? You lay it in.

8:41

I mean, I found that out the hard way when I did

8:43

my second match and that was against... I went from

8:45

having one match in front of a

8:48

couple hundred people, the Clarksburg

8:50

Armory in West Virginia, against

8:53

Kurt Koppmann to being in front of 17,000 at the

8:55

Providence Civic Center. And

8:58

when my mom saw me the next day in

9:00

the parking lot in

9:02

Hartford, she and my dad had gone to Providence

9:05

and they just happened to see me. It wasn't like we arranged

9:07

it via cell phone. And

9:09

I was so clearly out of it, you know,

9:12

because I had a concussion. And

9:14

my mom said, I thought it was fake.

9:16

And I looked at her and said, mom, nothing ever

9:19

felt more real in my life. Yeah. So

9:22

we most people have no idea

9:24

how hard guys are hitting and women

9:27

too, especially on television

9:29

or the old WWF rings. I was like, man, yeah. Fans

9:33

a lot of times just think, oh, that's all the way. Yeah.

9:37

The Dick Ebersol ring. The rumor is story

9:39

is Dick Ebersol saw the ring

9:41

moving, didn't want the ring on

9:43

Saturday night's main event to move. So

9:46

WWE had new rings built, but then they shipped

9:48

them all around on the house shows. And

9:51

that's why I think the work rate

9:53

was

9:55

not what it could have been and not what it later

9:58

would be. And why guys like Dynamite went. up getting

10:00

the worst player later in

10:02

the life. Well what we're talking about

10:04

today is 25 years ago. There

10:06

is more to the show than just what a burger talk or

10:09

a burger talk from a couple of weeks ago. I think

10:13

I was thinking about that, wondering if

10:16

we should have gone there, but I think

10:18

what we gained was

10:20

letting men and women

10:23

out there know that we all do it.

10:25

We all do it. We all do it. It's just a matter.

10:28

Are you then the type of guy who will seek

10:30

out a place to wash the

10:32

hands or do

10:34

you just go there and pass your burgers

10:37

on to your fellow men? I hope they don't do that. I

10:39

hope not either. So

10:42

we're on track today. We're talking about 1997. We're

10:45

going to pick up where we left off a couple of weeks ago.

10:48

You had just beaten the young upstart

10:50

Rocky Mavia, who did he ever beat, at

10:53

Cold Day and Hill. Now we're going to talk about

10:55

the build to King of the Ring 1997. Everything is

10:59

about to change though,

10:59

because the day after cold and Hill,

11:02

what really winds up being the full

11:05

push towards the cane debut gets

11:07

kicked into motion. You come out and

11:09

introduce uncle Paul, who's all wrapped up in bandages.

11:12

His first appearance since the Undertaker fireball

11:15

and Paul tells taker he's got one last

11:17

chance before he reveals the shocking

11:19

secret of takers past from

11:22

a creative standpoint. Bruce thinks this is

11:24

one of the best stories the company ever told. What

11:26

do you think of a cane backstory?

11:32

I mean, we learned the backstory as we

11:34

went. Yes. We've all conveniently

11:37

exercised Katie Vic. Yeah.

11:39

I like just wrote that one

11:42

off as a huge mistake. Yeah.

11:44

Man, Kane, what

11:46

he got in terms of longevity

11:49

out of what seemed to be a throwaway

11:52

character, throwaway character, one dimensional

11:54

character that could have had a great

11:57

six to eight months, one year run and

11:59

turn. that into a hall of fame career is

12:02

a great credit to Glenn

12:04

and the subtleties he brought with it. So

12:07

I thought that but it was cool. It

12:09

was really and it was played

12:12

so well to the point where

12:15

when Paul Bearer

12:17

and Jerry Lawler have the backstage conversation

12:20

that the camera just happens to capture.

12:23

I mean it just seems legit.

12:25

I think that's one of those things. Now this isn't

12:27

a big move or a fierce feud

12:29

yet but it's one of those things that

12:31

would send people to

12:34

school going that's his

12:36

dad you know like I know the

12:38

rest of the some of that rest but that's his dad.

12:41

It was played so well and it gave me that

12:43

opportunity as we spoke two weeks ago to single-handedly

12:47

grab Kane and console him and

12:49

with the strength in my upper body just prevent

12:51

him from doing any further damage to himself

12:54

or others. I have that type of tendon

12:56

strength. We have no doubt. Talk

12:59

to me a little bit about Paul Bearer.

13:02

We don't talk about him enough as a wrestling

13:04

community and man how

13:05

much fun would he have with the medium we're doing

13:07

right now podcasting he would have

13:10

gone way too soon really a sweetheart

13:12

of a guy. I never met him but that's what I hear from everyone

13:16

but this storyline the reveal

13:18

of Kane and the backstory

13:20

this is probably maybe the pinnacle of his career right.

13:24

Yeah other than turning

13:26

on Undertaker with the end. Of course. Of course.

13:29

If you think it's possible to have two pinnacles

13:31

in your career I've seen it done. Yeah.

13:34

Look I knew Paul from way back

13:37

in world class in 88

13:39

when he was personal Pringle the third. As

13:42

a matter of fact there's not much visual evidence

13:45

of Percy being in my scaffold

13:47

match with Eric Embry but we turned it into

13:49

a tag team. It was me and Akbar against

13:51

Eric Embry and Percy

13:54

and the reason there's not much visual evidence

13:56

is because Ak and Percy pretty

13:58

much got down on their belly. on that ramp and

14:01

stayed there for the duration. Not

14:04

too much in the way of action. And I was

14:06

the guy who took the bump, broke my right

14:08

wrist, ended up being the only guy in wrestling

14:11

history to give a two month notice because

14:13

my broken wrist wouldn't heal correctly.

14:20

But I loved it there and Paul

14:22

Bear, Percy was a baby face

14:25

at the time. I

14:27

babysat for his two children on

14:30

a few occasions, took them to the movies. So

14:32

I already had some history. Then when I

14:34

heard that he went to WWF with

14:37

this character, just made perfect

14:39

sense because Paul had been a real life mortician.

14:43

So it was one of those things that fit like a glove. And

14:46

the Undertaker, the debut of the

14:48

Undertaker was so incredible. And Bruce, you

14:50

know, was obviously right there and that

14:52

was Kane, the Undertaker when he first debuted.

14:55

How long did he keep the Kane name? Not very long.

14:57

Not very long, right? I just really think they realized the Undertaker,

15:00

the most successful of the profession

15:02

characters. Absolutely. I don't even think,

15:04

like we said last time, I don't think most of us even thought

15:06

of him as a profession, but. What's his name?

15:09

The Undertaker, yeah. It is. It

15:11

is. So if somebody came in as the craftsman,

15:14

yeah, he would be a great crafter, right?

15:17

I'm going to put you in my scrapbook, brother. What

15:24

a fancy jagged trim. It

15:28

was so it was so fantastic.

15:31

And the lead up to the

15:33

Undertaker's debut is rumored that he was

15:35

going to be the guy coming out of the egg. It's

15:38

just the egg crazy. I don't know what to think about. You

15:40

know, and then they had to have one of the all time

15:42

stinkers in the gobbledygooker come

15:45

out and then one of the all time great reveals.

15:48

The Undertaker. I was at a friend of a

15:50

friend's watching

15:53

the show and it was

15:55

I'll never forget it because one and

15:57

like on one level, I understand this is the same

15:59

guy. I used to travel with a good friend

16:02

of mine the other another level. He was a different

16:04

guy. Yeah He was a different guy.

16:06

So I think maybe a year after that

16:08

fact after the debut I'm

16:12

driving somewhere in the middle of nowhere and

16:14

I see the hearse He used to drive him

16:16

and Paul would be driven by a guy who had a

16:18

real-life hearse and it's got the

16:21

undertaker You know, it's clearly the undertaker's vehicle

16:23

and I hopped out of my car pursued

16:27

their hearse through the drive-thru

16:29

I think in McDonald's and Sounded

16:31

very much like a 14 year old girl going

16:34

it's me Mark

16:37

it's me he cactus Jack Yeah, you know and

16:39

it just it didn't feel like the guy

16:42

that I traveled it felt like a different

16:44

human being so Paul That

16:46

was a keeping the character in the

16:48

character in public as he did for most

16:51

of his career I can only imagine being a fan

16:53

in that parking lot. Why did I cactus Jack? Talking

16:56

to the undertaste by the way, I got a good recognition

16:59

at water burger Oh really young

17:01

lady said excuse me. Has anyone ever told

17:03

you look like that ruffler McFlurry? Mick

17:06

Flurry that's a straight a McDonald's McFlurry

17:09

McFully, but she was yeah, didn't

17:11

anyone ever tell ya and I didn't have the teeth in so I

17:13

gave her the This lucky on that

17:16

She's are you have not? Yeah,

17:20

so I said Huntsville you've been right I was thinking

17:23

what we need to do at Christmas time Grillo

17:26

fire up the camera and we'll do the Santa

17:28

Claus drive-thru Oh, yeah, Santa goes

17:30

through and he gives out like the biggest

17:33

tip they've ever received for it Yeah,

17:35

that's that's pretty pretty sweet, right? Yeah,

17:38

you know what what we should do is we should figure out

17:40

what episode number We're on at the time. Okay,

17:43

and then we'll just go to a bunch of places and tip people

17:45

that amount of money So for episode 101

17:48

or whatever it is. There you go. I

17:50

love it. Yeah, I love it We went there.

17:52

I wanted my kids to see what I did in the

17:54

red suit You know, so I took my four kids

17:57

and I go dad we can do the drive-thru. Yes.

17:59

We are

17:59

and we go through the Dunkin Donuts drive-thru

18:03

and they don't know minimum $50, a $50 to $100 tip

18:07

and the woman wouldn't sell it at all.

18:10

No smile, no acknowledgement

18:12

that it was Santa had her drive-thru, so

18:15

I didn't give her the tip and we drove

18:17

through, we proceed through and

18:20

my daughter says, dad, do you think she has any idea

18:22

how much money she just lost? Probably

18:24

not. But yeah, we will do the Santa Claus

18:27

drive-thru. And then I can deduct

18:29

that $100 bill on my taxes. Why not?

18:31

Yes. Why not? Yes.

18:34

I mean, it's Santa.

18:35

So you're in the middle of contract negotiations

18:37

in this era as we're getting started

18:39

talking about the summer of 97. You

18:42

mentioned before that you were meeting with Vince and

18:45

that you knew that you

18:47

had conveyed, hey, I wanna be in that $400,000 range. He

18:51

wanted to sort of put pen to paper but

18:53

you don't actually ink that new deal until

18:55

after you do the sit-down interview. I

18:58

believe it's the day after,

19:01

I can't remember if I inked it or if he gave

19:04

me the contract

19:05

that I would later

19:06

and put the ink on. But I was

19:08

dealing from a position of strength

19:11

because of the interviews

19:13

that had just taken place the day

19:16

before. It was one interview cut up into, added

19:18

into several weeks worth of material

19:21

but I knew he liked it. And I

19:23

didn't know to what extent but

19:27

man, that was, it was, it

19:29

was a really organic grassroots

19:32

movement that was fertilized

19:35

by these promos at WJR.

19:37

We're gonna put those in the link for our description

19:40

below too. So be sure to check those

19:42

out. If you haven't seen them in a long time, it's

19:44

worth a look. In this era though, you shoot

19:47

a segment with Sunny for Shotgun Saturday Night

19:49

where she asks you what the secret is.

19:52

Of course, we're talking about Paul Beers' secret and you

19:54

start by responding and yelling, how

19:57

bad do you wanna know? Tammy

19:59

said, pretty polarizing figure in professional

20:01

wrestling, but at this time, boy, she's

20:03

at the height of her

20:06

run. One of the most downloaded

20:08

celebrities in AOL. Well, Sid

20:10

still hasn't returned and you're going to wind

20:13

up doing a few main events with Taker instead of these

20:15

tag matches with Sid. In fact, you headline

20:18

against Taker at the Pepsi arena in Albany.

20:20

You've got 4,792 fans there. The

20:23

next day, you're at MSG and once

20:25

again, you're wrestling the Undertaker. First,

20:28

though, you cut a promo about how it's the anniversary

20:30

of Bruno San Martino beating Buddy

20:32

Rogers for the WWF

20:35

world title and the history is going

20:37

to repeat itself tonight and

20:39

then you insult New York before having the bell rang 10

20:41

times for the injured Paul Bear. It's

20:44

just super fine. Normally reserved

20:47

for someone who's fallen. No, he's just hurt, but

20:49

let's ring the bell either way. This

20:52

is the spiritual home, if you will, of

20:55

Vince McMahon's WWF. His dad ran

20:57

there and ... That's pretty good

20:59

stuff,

20:59

though. Great stuff. Great

21:02

stuff. We've

21:04

always heard fans or the guys

21:06

say that Vince holds

21:09

the garden in such high regard. Like if it gets

21:12

over there, it'll get over ... almost like it's

21:14

the barometer. Was that your experience with

21:16

Vince? He held it in that high regard? I

21:18

remember quoting Vince to Vince

21:22

when Vince's dad passed away or

21:24

when he was inducted into the Madison

21:26

Square Garden Hall of Fame. I can't remember which

21:30

event he said his dad

21:33

told him, Vinny, the garden will

21:35

always be the garden. Yes. And

21:38

if you know, you know. You have to try to explain that even though I guess

21:40

we're going to try to explain it now. It's

21:43

just a very special place. I

21:45

would say before pay-per-views, the

21:48

monthly Madison Square Garden show was

21:50

the show that everyone wanted to be on.

21:53

At that time, WWF was

21:55

running probably three shows a night in

21:57

A-town, B-town, C-town. C-Towns

22:00

would be the high state ran high school gyms

22:03

back in the day. Yeah. And

22:05

everyone wanted to be on that garden show

22:07

because it was the showcase, it was the

22:09

best payoff and it's always, you

22:12

know, retained that special place

22:15

in people's hearts including Vince's.

22:18

And that was true for a lot of territories,

22:20

you know, in Georgia, for Georgia Championship

22:22

Wrestling it was the Omni. For Mid-Atlantic it was

22:24

Greensboro. Yeah. For the West Coast it

22:26

was the Cow Palace. But there's always

22:29

been something special about New York, not just

22:31

in wrestling but just in America. I mean it is

22:34

the number one city that people around

22:36

the globe when they think of America they think

22:38

of New York City for better or worse. And I just

22:41

think it's got to be cool for you as a fan

22:43

who, you know, grew up hitchhiking

22:46

to go see your favorite wrestlers there. Now here you

22:48

are in the main event in a title match getting

22:50

to do mic work in Madison Square Garden.

22:52

Sold out for the purposes of

22:54

our story. Hang from the rest of the day.

22:59

Tanker defeats you in a lumberjack match to retain

23:01

this title. You know what I remember?

23:03

I remember it was a lumberjack match because

23:06

Road Dogg, to this day,

23:09

swears that the chair

23:11

shot the Undertaker hit me with to the

23:14

back was the hardest chair shot he's ever

23:16

seen. His Undertaker had that giant

23:18

wingspan and brother,

23:20

you know, you know, like

23:23

just like a bolt of lightning down

23:25

to my shoes, you know, putting me down

23:27

to my knees legitimately. But we had a good

23:29

match that night. The rest of those lumberjacks,

23:32

Leif Cassidy, who

23:33

we know, also Bob

23:36

Holly, the God Ones, Jesse

23:39

James, Doug Furness, Phil

23:41

LaFawn, and Rocky

23:43

Maivia. All right. So

23:46

Rocky at one point was a lumberjack

23:48

for me. All right. Okay. You

23:51

got to remind him of that next time you see him. You

23:53

had 10,702 fans there. Not a sellout. Not a sellout, but it was.

23:59

Yeah, we were ascending.

24:02

Before we move on, we

24:04

got at least addressed. I know you've told the story

24:06

a few times, but the way we're getting to this

24:08

sit-down interview is Bruce

24:11

understands this conversation you have with

24:13

Shawn Michaels. Apparently he communicates

24:15

that to Jim Ross and Vince and everybody

24:18

else, and they decide, hey, let's

24:20

replicate what we just did

24:22

for Goldust and Marlena with the mankind

24:24

character. Is that pretty much it? Do we need the refresher

24:27

of the conversation between

24:29

me and Shawn? I think I can cover it in about 90

24:31

seconds.

24:32

Shawn and I were having

24:34

some really good house show matches. As a

24:37

matter of fact, if I had

24:39

only two house show matches, I really,

24:42

truly wish that I had on video.

24:46

One would be Shawn Michaels of Madison Square Garden,

24:48

and one was Bret Hart in either Manchester

24:52

or Birmingham, UK. It was

24:55

just a cool house show match

24:57

that worked backwards from the urn

24:59

to the head at the very beginning of the match. It was

25:01

like we took what should have been the

25:03

ending, put it first,

25:04

and worked backwards. I like that.

25:06

It just clicked. I do wish I had a house show

25:09

match with Vader. That was one of the most brutal

25:11

matches I've ever had. It was just

25:13

a house show match in the UK. No cameras.

25:16

A fan said to me years later, only a

25:18

few years later, I was at that match, he

25:20

was in either Birmingham or Manchester.

25:23

I looked at my friend and I said, I can't believe they're

25:25

doing this to each other in a house show. I

25:28

said, that's funny. That's exactly what I was

25:30

thinking. It was more of what

25:32

he was doing to me. I think he was trying to break

25:34

my nose on a house show. It was,

25:37

at that point, I was just concerned about the quality

25:39

of the matches. I kid you not. Anyway,

25:43

Shawn and I had some really good chemistry.

25:45

It's a shame that off that great

25:47

match we had at mind games

25:49

in September 96, that we didn't get

25:52

a shot to do paper use yet. But

25:54

we were tearing it down and doing

25:56

it while Shawn had a back injury.

25:59

finding ways to make the matches highly

26:02

entertaining, maybe not up to the level, they would

26:04

have been if he was healthy, they were still darn

26:06

good and he wasn't taking bumps and he

26:09

was healing while he was wrestling, which is really difficult

26:11

to do. So after one of those matches, at

26:14

one of those venues, I don't know which one, it could have

26:16

been the Garden for all I know, he

26:19

says to me, don't take this the wrong way,

26:21

but, and I've been around a long time, usually

26:24

sentences don't end well with the words that

26:26

begin with don't take this the wrong way, but he

26:29

said, is this the way you always envisioned yourself?

26:31

Mankind was really dark at that time. And

26:34

then I laugh, no, actually I wanted

26:36

to be you. He looked at me kind of quizzically,

26:39

said not Shawn Michaels, and then I told him

26:41

about how I wanted to be the guy that

26:44

the

26:44

children idolize, the women

26:46

love, the men want to

26:49

aspire to be like, and that's when

26:51

I told Shawn, not knowing Bruce

26:53

was listening, about dude love,

26:56

and Bruce goes to Vince, says

26:58

Mick Foley has a much more interesting real

27:00

life than the fictional mankind

27:03

character, and he's got the video

27:05

to prove it. And that really put a light

27:08

bulb over Vince's head. So he wanted

27:11

to make that dream come true. So

27:14

the next

27:14

Raw is in Mobile, Alabama, the Civic

27:16

Center down there. You're not wrestling on it, but you

27:18

are announced as being a member

27:20

of the King of the Ring tournament. Before we

27:22

talk about what else happened on the show, I

27:25

do want to bring up the King of the Ring, because once

27:28

upon a time, the King of the Ring was not

27:30

a televised thing for the company, then

27:32

it became a televised thing. They crowned

27:35

Bret Hart, that starts the whole feud

27:37

with Lawler, Owen gets a shot,

27:39

we build from there. But it did feel

27:42

like the first guy who really made that a platform

27:44

to launch into the stratosphere was 1996, with

27:47

Stone Cold Steve Austin, Austin 316. His

27:50

career's never the same, he's working with Bret after

27:52

that, he steals the show at WrestleMania. I'm

27:55

sure some guys are taking note thinking, okay,

27:58

there's the tag titles, there's the intercontinental. title,

28:00

there's the world title, but now maybe

28:03

this King of the Ring thing actually matters a

28:05

little more and you're gonna wind up being in the

28:07

finals of this one and we're gonna get there but did

28:10

you at the time think man King of the Ring could actually

28:12

be a springboard to the next level?

28:17

Or was that more organic in the promo? Yeah

28:19

I never thought, yeah I never

28:22

thought that titles

28:24

were going to be coming my way so

28:26

and then I would consider King of the Ring to be a title.

28:29

As you're talking I was just thinking of what a great

28:31

job Owen Hart did as the king and

28:35

wondering if Austin hadn't cut that

28:37

Austin 316 promo, would

28:40

we have seen Stone Cold with

28:42

the scepter and the

28:45

crowd for a year? It

28:47

wouldn't have been in keeping right? And as a booker

28:50

it was a great king

28:52

because you sink

28:53

your teeth into it and you play it

28:55

for all it's worth. Sometimes the king

28:57

is only worth what you put into it right?

29:01

So I don't even think that was on

29:03

my radar at the time.

29:05

So along with the

29:07

announcement for the King of the Ring is the first

29:09

of your JR interviews. The

29:12

Observer would write, they did an absolutely fantastic interview

29:14

segment with mankind revealing him as Mick Holle

29:18

showing high school pictures of him saying he used to be

29:20

cactus Jack and totally turning

29:22

him baby face. They're going to show clips

29:24

of his winning King of the Death matches in Japan

29:27

next week. So I

29:29

guess this pause right there, did you know when

29:31

you first sat down to do

29:34

the interview this is going to make me a baby face? No.

29:36

Because you know what the finish is? I

29:38

do the finish is going to be me attacking Jim Ross.

29:41

So that doesn't feel like a baby face but when we

29:43

chop it up, right, well it leans into the baby

29:45

face a little bit there for a bit. It did.

29:48

I remember Stone Cold driving with

29:50

me the day after probably

29:52

from Mobile to wherever we were going. He said, hell

29:55

kids they turn your baby face. I said,

29:58

no I think Vince just wants people. people to

30:00

understand the character a little better and Steve thinks

30:02

about her second is he'll be a baby face

30:05

in three weeks and he was

30:07

correct. So it was it was this real

30:09

organic build that that was the

30:11

turn. It was just every

30:14

week more and more people were getting behind this

30:16

character. They really empathize with mankind.

30:19

So you wrote in your book Kevin Dunn who's the director

30:22

of the Federation came up while I was getting dressed

30:24

and explained their concept which involved appearing

30:26

without the mask is Mick Foley. I actually

30:28

like the mask by this point and would wear it for

30:30

several hours prior to a match. Now

30:32

the damn thing smells so bad I practically put it on

30:35

while my music is playing. I believe. With these

30:37

maple rub. Yeah. Really? Oh yeah

30:39

it was so bad it was so rank yeah. That's

30:41

the key to get rid of it just have something to overpower.

30:44

Just have something to overpower it. I believed in

30:46

mankind and didn't want anyone to see the real

30:48

Mick Foley just yet. So I came up with a

30:50

game plan. I would tell the real life

30:52

Mick Foley stories. I would give Mick Foley's

30:54

opinions but I would do it as mankind.

30:57

In actuality the two weren't that different

31:00

as in most cases the most successful gimmicks

31:02

were simply an amplified extension of a certain

31:04

part of the real life personality. I

31:06

guess in that case mankind was the insecure

31:08

side of my personality. The side that

31:10

never quite felt accepted. It was the

31:12

side that surfaced in the Jim Ross interview

31:15

and it surfaced in a way that was both funny and touching

31:18

and it changed the way people felt about

31:20

mankind. So let's

31:23

time out right there. All right by now you

31:25

know that Mick and I both like to save

31:27

money. He's frugal MacDougall and I've

31:29

been known to save a dollar or two but let

31:31

me give you a little pro tip on saving

31:34

money because that's the old thing we're looking

31:36

for right. It's like we've always heard it's not

31:38

how much you make but how you save. Well

31:40

maybe you're like me and you've fallen for a good

31:42

deal here and there or so we thought.

31:45

Try it free for 30 days. Well

31:48

that's enough time to try it and

31:50

then completely forget about it. I have to

31:52

admit I did this before

31:54

Rocket Money. Rocket Money

31:57

showed me all the subscriptions that I

31:59

signed up for and Dude, I wasn't using

32:01

a bunch of them. I had no idea

32:03

that both my wife and I signed up for Hulu,

32:06

but we watch TV together. We don't need two

32:08

accounts, we needed one account. I

32:10

even had a subscription that was very expensive

32:12

to disown. I bought it over

32:14

a year prior just to watch one fight

32:17

and forgot about it.

32:18

They just kept drafting and I missed it.

32:20

So let me ask you this, do you know how much

32:22

your subscriptions really cost?

32:25

I thought I was spending like 80 bucks a month.

32:28

Man, when it was all said and done, I was spending

32:30

hundreds per month. It's time you

32:32

find out exactly what you're spending

32:34

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32:46

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32:48

they forgot about. Maybe you signed up

32:50

for the Stars app to watch one show, or

32:53

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32:55

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32:58

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33:00

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33:02

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33:05

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33:08

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33:26

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33:33

going to rocketmoney.com slash Foley.

33:35

That's rocketmoney.com slash

33:38

Foley. Rocketmoney.com

33:40

slash Foley. I really like

33:42

that you're just able to just be honest in your book

33:44

and say, I wasn't ready to let everybody

33:47

see Mick Foley yet. And you were having success

33:49

as mankind. So the old adage,

33:51

if it ain't broke, don't fix it, certainly applies

33:53

here. But I do think it

33:56

is a little different from the Goldust interview

33:58

because Goldust was not in full. He didn't

34:00

have the paint on right so maybe they were thinking

34:02

well Let's just do exactly that but

34:05

you wanted a little twist on it, and I think because

34:07

of that

34:08

it was better I think so

34:10

too. It's funny how with time

34:13

you You you

34:15

tell the story As you

34:17

wish it had happened yeah because in my mind

34:20

it was always a conversation in the past

34:23

15 years or so always a conversation

34:25

with Vince pitching the idea and

34:28

me saying hey I've got a lot of work tied

34:30

up in this thing. What if I do

34:32

it? What what you know 100% honest,

34:35

but doing the character mankind I

34:37

recall Vince said you think you can do that

34:38

pal I went oh, yeah I I

34:41

know I can because I did believe in

34:43

my ability to pull off some things as long as it wasn't

34:47

physical you know I realized the limitations

34:49

physically, but I did believe

34:51

that there was a lot to explore there with that character

34:54

and If our fans are

34:56

listening they can nod to themselves no one's

34:58

gonna judge you admit some of you I scared

35:00

the crap out of some of you when you were

35:03

children right that 96-97

35:05

mankind was dark Some

35:07

people still haven't forgiven me for what I did to

35:10

Undertaker in 96 although.

35:12

I'd argue he got his comeback in 98 for

35:14

sure But

35:17

that was a character I felt that would hadn't

35:20

run its course and would not be better

35:22

served by pulling the curtain

35:24

completely open So

35:27

did you film these interviews in Stanford

35:29

are they at the stand Stanford it was done

35:31

in one you know It was one

35:34

interview. So Jim I

35:36

don't know the questions He didn't tell you and

35:38

he didn't tell me ahead of time you had to freestyle

35:40

right I mean I may have been offered, but

35:42

I didn't I didn't want to hear the questions

35:45

And then since I didn't know the questions Jr.

35:48

Has no idea how I'm going to respond

35:51

and it just took on this Legitimate

35:53

look of a real interview with a guy

35:56

wearing a leather mask with divots

35:58

missing from his So,

36:00

I love that you said you didn't want to know the questions.

36:03

There's two schools of thought on that. One is the

36:05

preparation side of all of us who say,

36:07

well, I want to know because I want to make it good. Yeah.

36:10

Then there's the other side that says, well, then it's going to look fake

36:12

and it won't come off, come across as real. Is

36:15

that your thinking at the time? I don't want to know. Well,

36:17

you know, in my experience with late night talk

36:20

shows, and not just late night but any talk show, most

36:23

of them are heavily produced. Yes. To

36:25

the point where you're basically asked to regurgitate

36:28

a conversation you had with a producer.

36:31

And then there are a couple other shows,

36:33

you know, like the Daily Show where they say, John

36:36

likes to do a loose interview. Are you okay? Yeah.

36:39

They say, okay, we'll see you on the side. I was like,

36:41

that's it. It's so much easier.

36:43

And I think, you know, here's the same

36:46

thing with scripted interviews. You

36:48

reduce the possibility of

36:50

striking out, but

36:53

you also reduce the possibility of hitting

36:55

a towering home run. And

36:59

when I started my career, I realized

37:02

that I was kind of

37:04

segueing in a sloppy way, but I was

37:06

like, what if the strikeouts were just as

37:08

exciting as the home runs? Like Reggie

37:11

Jackson, remember back in the day when Reggie

37:13

swung and missed, you knew it like he

37:15

would crack a corkscrew into the ground,

37:17

you know, fall over like he was taking

37:19

his swings there. And I just think

37:22

that when, you know, whether it's late

37:24

night interview or whether it is a

37:28

wrestling interview,

37:30

people can feel the difference. And

37:34

I think we would have probably hit

37:36

a double, you know, a nice

37:38

long, maybe a ground rule double speaking

37:41

metaphorically. But that night instead,

37:43

we hit a towering home run. I love the

37:46

analogy of the strikeouts

37:48

can be entertaining too, because we've

37:50

all seen maybe it's on one of the old Crockett shows.

37:53

Like I'll never forget the first time I saw

37:55

Ricky Morton do a live interview on TBS. Pretty

38:00

bad But then you can

38:02

check back with him a year later. Yeah, he's got a down

38:04

pat. Oh, yeah Well, he's feeling it but

38:07

him having a bad interview was better than it just

38:09

being an interview Yeah,

38:11

it's sort of like that what I hear from wrestlers

38:13

is hey, it's okay if that's here It's okay if

38:15

they boo but you need a reaction you react

38:17

the worst is just nothing And

38:20

so sometimes if it's not great and

38:22

it's not awful

38:24

It's almost nothing to the audience It's just

38:26

sort of there and I think we've seen a lot

38:29

of a lot of that a lot of nothing

38:31

So here's my another is another

38:34

analogy is to from 2007 hardcore

38:38

diaries I like and You

38:41

know the wrestling we see on a weekly basis

38:43

to like that rotate

38:45

that Being in a one

38:48

of the sushi restaurants with the conveyor

38:50

belt And you just come along and like wow,

38:52

I can get you can grab this I can grab

38:54

this and it's all good But

38:58

it's not necessarily memorable It's

39:00

not like sitting down with a homemade piece

39:03

of grandma's pumpkin pie and you just want

39:05

to savor every bite of it Yeah,

39:07

I was like it's it's so quickly

39:10

so much of what we do is digested and forgotten

39:13

That it becomes really difficult But

39:16

all the more important to give people those moments

39:18

that they can remember So when

39:21

you're sitting down to do this interview did you

39:23

have? Anything you

39:25

were trying to accomplish in your mind like

39:28

if there's not if you don't know the script You don't

39:30

know the questions he's gonna ask you know the

39:32

quote-unquote finish you're gonna attack. Yeah,

39:35

do you know anything else like hey? Here's what I want

39:37

to accomplish with this because you said you didn't

39:39

really set out to do a baby face No,

39:41

I didn't I just didn't wanted to create something

39:43

that was compelling. I felt like Jim

39:46

was the perfect guy to do that with You

39:49

have in your mind certain stories you wanted to share no

39:52

Like you knew they were gonna show the dude love footage

39:54

you provided that right? But

39:57

like the worms and all that that was just no I

39:59

don't think the worms the story about

40:02

having worms thrown at me on the school

40:04

yard had ever crossed my mind. You

40:07

never thought in your head before those words

40:10

fell out of your left. I was a good kisser. No,

40:12

that wasn't something a lot of promos

40:14

I did in my mind over and over but

40:17

sometimes they're just promos with some thoughts

40:19

and then you would somehow tie them

40:21

together as you went like I said you

40:23

know I think wrestling I think

40:25

we're overlooked by the general public anyway

40:30

but I think the idea that someone can start

40:32

out with just an idea and hopefully a finishing

40:35

line and take you on a three to five

40:37

minute journey sometimes longer pretty

40:40

brilliant you know especially if it's helping

40:42

people to buy tickets. Sometimes

40:44

it's just done as a if you just look at it

40:47

as a performance that can be pretty exhilarating.

40:51

Your voice inflection in the promo this

40:54

is a character voice so you're

40:57

really being cautious

41:00

in the way you're doing your delivery. You're not just talking

41:02

like you and I are now. There's

41:04

highs, there's low, you're trying to draw people in

41:07

but that character almost felt like to

41:09

me that voice

41:12

probably lends itself to like you

41:14

said a three to five minute thing and now you're going

41:16

to carry it on for a longer period of time. Was that

41:18

a concern of yours? No. You probably ought

41:20

to keep this act up and make it compelling

41:22

and interesting and not

41:24

monotonous. I may have

41:26

seen it as a challenge but you know we think

41:28

we like those challenges. You know although

41:31

we only usually break it out for

41:33

the cameos I

41:35

can take us on a little stroll down

41:38

memory lane okay so this

41:40

will not be the worm story this will

41:42

be the lacrosse

41:45

story.

41:49

Unlikely goalie but tough

41:51

sport I know it's kind of maligned as like the

41:54

preppy sport but it's a physical game

41:56

and as a goalie especially like in middle

41:58

school before

41:59

the

42:02

players are adept enough to

42:04

get in the corners most of the time. You're taking a lot

42:07

of the shots. Those are the

42:09

heaviest. I know this is rife with

42:11

the heaviest of all balls, right?

42:13

I mean, it's the densest. It's the lacrosse

42:15

ball. It's something that therapeutically

42:20

can be used to rub on the soles of your feet

42:23

because of the depth. So anyway,

42:25

when you get hit with one of those, especially

42:27

if you don't have a cup. So I'm setting

42:30

it up that I was the slowest guy.

42:32

I don't know if I said this, but I was the slowest guy

42:34

on the team by far. And to

42:37

aid myself in running laps, I would take

42:39

out my protective cup. When

42:41

I ran, I usually remembered

42:43

to put it back. And on this

42:45

day, I didn't. And I suffered the ultimate

42:48

price for that. So I'm going to take you there.

42:57

Jimmy,

42:59

I went down like I'd been shot.

43:03

It was the only time I remember

43:07

girls looking at my genital

43:09

area. I showed up that next

43:11

day, even though my testicle was the size

43:13

of a grapefruit. And for that

43:15

reason, I considered that day to be the

43:18

greatest day in the history of

43:20

my life because they were

43:22

looking at my genitals for the first time.

43:25

So when that episode

43:28

airs, Vince

43:30

then says

43:32

going into he goes, we're going to hear for more from

43:34

mankind should be interesting

43:36

considering the story about his testicle.

43:40

And that was the first time Vince

43:42

had said the T word on TV. I

43:45

may have been the guy who broke that wall for all

43:47

of us, you know, because I go back like

43:49

as a student of television and radio

43:53

history, St. Elsewhere had a

43:55

story on testicular cancer and they couldn't even

43:57

say the word. The kid had to say something really interesting.

44:00

real bad down there like they never

44:02

actually said the word. So here

44:04

I am just shattering that wall and

44:06

now Vince is like a guy with a new toy.

44:09

And so the testicle became his thing

44:11

and then all of a sudden I go

44:13

from the guy who literally had a testicle

44:16

the size of a grapefruit to Vince taking

44:18

being the guy with the grapefruit. So

44:22

I know it's old hat and you know there's a WrestleMania

44:24

angle there right.

44:27

I can't get over you just put the mask on and did it so

44:29

well. As a fan that

44:31

was really cool to see. Thanks. Thanks.

44:34

Just you have that down path the shifting

44:36

of the eyes all that you can just turn it on turn it

44:39

off but everyone watching at home was

44:41

thinking the same thing I am. How cool is this he's doing

44:43

this right now. Is it cool enough that I

44:45

forgive me for messing up my own line. Yes.

44:48

Because it's supposed to be that the you know it's

44:51

supposed to be the girls looking the next day

44:53

when I came back after I came. We

44:55

were so focused on your performance.

44:57

Thank you. Appreciate

44:59

that. Part two.

45:01

It's not going to take away from my cameo is it. No.

45:04

Okay. We're going to get that at the end of our problems.

45:06

Specifically 14 someone

45:08

asking for 14 year old which

45:10

is why I'm not doing my version

45:13

of WAP. Oh no WAP. No I

45:15

wrote some of the lyrics

45:17

down and it's coming along well.

45:21

Do you just travel with cue cards. Birthday

45:25

boy in the house birthday boy

45:27

in the house. Yeah. So I think

45:29

it's going to be pretty good. I

45:32

need to get in the zone just one of these days

45:34

just just break it out. But

45:37

I was working on it last night. Yeah

45:39

dude singing about a happy ass

45:41

birthday. I was thinking hard about

45:44

your happy ass birthday. Gonna get

45:46

a card for your happy ass birthday.

45:48

So we're working on it. But I don't think that's

45:51

appropriate for a 14 year old. No

45:53

I agree. Yeah. So we're going to do a WAP.

45:56

We had no doubt. So somebody

45:58

out there wants the WAP remix.

45:59

Ask for the WAP remix. Can we do a WAP

46:02

remix as mankind? Yeah.

46:04

Oh my god. Yeah, of course we can. Yeah My

46:07

birthday's in June. All right, so someone

46:09

listening So

46:14

so part two of this interview airs

46:16

while we're all in Evansville It's

46:20

just tremendous we've got the links below go out of

46:22

your way to see you about night on Raw We see Steve

46:24

Austin Shawn Michaels team up to

46:26

become the new unlikely tag team champions

46:29

They beat Owen and Davey boy This

46:32

whole Austin Hart thing is really picking up some

46:34

steam How much of an impact was Vince

46:36

Russo having on creative at the time? Was this

46:38

really like the height of his run do you think or

46:41

maybe the rise of Vince Russo's a better word?

46:43

Yeah Yeah, he was a

46:45

big part of it. I mean, there's a great

46:47

video backstage of with

46:50

the dude with the dude And then

46:52

Vince trying to teach me how to make

46:54

you strut. I said I was

46:56

strutting So I got now Vince McMahon

46:59

teaching me how to strut and Russo clearly

47:01

had a lot of pull and he did he had great Ideas

47:04

and I really he believed in mankind,

47:06

you know, and I really I believed in him not

47:08

some corny But I thought he was a guy with great ideas,

47:11

you know I don't know why he's become such

47:13

a polarizing figure because he helped so

47:16

much of that product in that era and folks who deny

47:18

it To me, I mean, it's just a little silly like he

47:20

did have some great I can defend events

47:22

Russo with one word Your

47:25

pole then and then and

47:28

and Your pole was a real-life

47:30

birthday party clown, but it was Russo's idea

47:32

to get a birthday party clown So

47:34

I know we're not here talking about this is your life

47:37

But I remember him pitching me that idea

47:39

and I said

47:40

Is she gonna have the shoes like the overgrown

47:43

shoes? Oh, bro, she's gonna have the shoes and

47:45

didn't know that that would go on to be Where

47:48

your belong and I are still in touch to this day

47:51

really still trying to tell me this. All

47:53

right The

47:55

maybe we can do this at one

47:57

of your events in the

47:59

future Are you thinking what I'm thinking?

48:01

I think I am thinking what I think well, let me put

48:04

the mankind mask I

48:08

think I am thinking what I think you think I

48:10

think you're thinking Still

48:12

got it What

48:16

we want to do is turn it is

48:18

a specialty photo It doesn't have to connect

48:20

and resonate with everyone because everyone can understand

48:23

boom come in take your picture

48:25

guys Get the hand on the shoulder, right? What

48:28

I want to do Recreate

48:30

that hospital room Oh wow And then

48:33

instead of standing in the middle of mankind

48:35

in your pole or man in a mankind mask in

48:37

case there's a cop You're in the hospital

48:40

bed. You put on the gown right

48:42

and we got you know, we got a bedpan And

48:45

let them hold the bed. Yeah, let them hold the bedpan

48:47

and boom photo out. We

48:49

do a hundred of those I love it. It's pretty

48:52

good, right? I love it. I don't mean you're wrong. I'd like

48:54

to make money grill Yeah,

48:56

yeah, I think your poles available for such a look

48:58

I you know what I tried calling your pole I

49:01

left a message Before

49:04

I did an event in Missouri

49:06

and she didn't get back to me here pulls big-legged and

49:08

you have been because So

49:13

if anyone out there knows your pole You

49:16

could look it up under Jojo and your

49:18

poles fun time palace

49:20

And it could be in Texarkana last

49:23

known address for your pole was Texarkana

49:25

We got a fun near full you have any friends in Arkansas

49:28

I do as a matter of fact our mutual

49:30

friend Stan stands in Arkansas in Arkansas

49:32

It stands an investigative reporter, right?

49:35

Yeah, any a report calm All right,

49:37

Stan get to work on the your pole situation

49:40

if Stan could bring us your pole We

49:42

could get a fake your pole, but we would know

49:44

right? Well, yeah, we're not getting a fake mankind

49:46

No, I mean, that's the legit mankind mask

49:48

right wink wink. Yes, it is. Yes, of course Let's

49:52

talk about the whole Brett Sean. Yeah situation,

49:54

you know, they were originally supposed to be hooking it up

49:56

at King of the Ring We know that's not gonna happen

50:00

Brett's gonna be injured. He's gonna be

50:02

doing some promos from a wheelchair. They're

50:04

gonna go a little long. Shawn Michaels was supposed

50:06

to super kick him before it went off. Brett missed

50:09

his cue. There's some hurt feelings. Eventually

50:11

it bubbles over and there's a fight in the back. At

50:14

this point in 1997, how

50:16

many times do you think you've probably seen a fight in the

50:18

back? A handful

50:20

of times? Five, yeah, I've seen a fight. So it's

50:23

not that common where it bubbles over

50:25

like this, but this one didn't feel like, hey

50:27

man, somebody

50:28

got potatoed in the ring and this

50:31

has been brewing for a long time. These guys

50:33

just do not like each other. Was that common

50:35

knowledge? Are we able to talk about,

50:38

you know, I mean, we got, it's the sunny

50:40

days. It's the sunny days comment. Sunny

50:43

days comment that since I wasn't

50:45

aware, I was aware there's a not,

50:47

you know, a healthy competition there and

50:50

I think there should be, but it was to

50:52

me, it wasn't like it was a, they

50:55

were on eggshells. To me,

50:58

it was the sunny days thing that

51:01

instantly created that. That took it from wrestling

51:04

to real life. Yeah, yeah. And

51:06

just to add context, I'm sure some of our listeners

51:09

don't remember, but Sean did an interview

51:12

where he's in the ring and

51:14

Brett's in the backstage area and Sean

51:17

says something like, I know you've been enjoying some

51:20

sunny days. Yeah. Sunny,

51:22

of course, at the time, is the most downloaded celebrity

51:24

in all of AOL and certainly the hottest

51:26

diva in WWE. She was

51:29

in a relationship with Chris Candido and

51:31

Brett Hart was married to his lovely

51:33

wife, Julie, at the time. Sean Michaels

51:36

was single and ready to mingle and allegedly

51:38

had been enjoying some sunny days, depending

51:40

on how you believe, but when the accusation

51:42

went the other way towards a married man, all

51:45

of a sudden, Brett, who has a wife and kids

51:47

at home and all the kids are watching the product, that's

51:50

probably not the best environment to go home

51:52

to and that feels like it probably

51:54

crossed the line as far as just man

51:57

code and wrestler code, even

51:59

if it were true. and we don't know and it doesn't really

52:01

matter. But you don't say that on TV.

52:03

Right. Did you feel like Sean took it too

52:05

far? Yeah. Everybody agreed with

52:08

that? I think so. So when it

52:10

came time for, these guys are gonna come to

52:12

blows, and allegedly a lot

52:14

of this was over, he said, she

52:16

said, for I won't put you over, you won't put

52:18

me over. In the end, this is

52:20

real life, hey, that dude's messing with my family.

52:23

Yeah. Right?

52:24

So I didn't see the fight.

52:26

Everybody heard about it though. Everybody heard about it. I

52:28

was there in the aftermath, and Sean

52:31

said it was an unsafe working condition. Storms

52:34

out. Storms out. And I

52:36

remember Corney telling me, if

52:38

not that day, then the next

52:40

TV taping that my ship had just come in,

52:43

that, you know, the Sean Michaels, because

52:46

up until then, you know, the love

52:48

handle was going to be Dude Love's finish,

52:51

right? And so I know we're jumping

52:53

around here, but suffice to say, the

52:58

promo with Jim Ross goes over so

53:00

well that Vince calls me on the phone,

53:02

living down in the Florida Panhandle, someone's

53:04

central time, rare day off, because

53:07

we're working pretty steadily, really steadily. And

53:10

he calls me around 6 a.m., which is 7 a.m. Eastern.

53:14

Hey pal,

53:15

how'd you like to be Dude Love?

53:17

And I said, one time, he said, from now on,

53:20

like the idea of bringing that character

53:22

to life and allowing me to live that dream, that's why

53:24

he loves doing that. And

53:26

people can say, what they want about Vince, Vince, is wholeheartedly

53:29

believes in the

53:31

dream and making those dreams come

53:33

true. And I've seen him do it, you know, for

53:37

someone really struggling, you

53:39

know, with life-threatening

53:42

illness. And therefore, we talked

53:44

several weeks ago about a young man named Marcos,

53:47

who I was able to bring into the ring and help create

53:49

this really special day, but he don't do without

53:52

Vince's blessing. So he does

53:54

believe wholeheartedly in that. He wanted

53:56

me to live out that dream of becoming

53:59

Dude Love. for you, he wanted

54:01

the audience to see. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

54:03

And you can do this too. Dreams can come true. I

54:05

mean, it's a great story for the audience,

54:08

and of course, fun for you too. Now,

54:10

is this at the time,

54:13

there's also this storyline

54:17

where Steve is looking for a partner. This

54:20

is- So when the whole thing happens with

54:22

Shawn, we're gonna get there, but

54:25

yes, you're on the right track. All right, so I

54:27

don't become, I'm not dude yet, but

54:31

we want to have a moment, it

54:33

supposedly puts mankind

54:36

over the edge, and I'm showing

54:38

up on a weekly basis,

54:41

helping Steve, fighting off his

54:43

foes, and basically getting stunned. And,

54:46

you know, so getting like the door slammed in

54:49

my face, because Austin's a loner, wants

54:51

no part of mankind, and

54:54

it's good TV on a weekly basis, and

54:57

I'm taking some serious shots too, right?

54:59

Like is his, Steve is, nothing

55:01

is gonna put a dent in Steve's armor as far

55:03

as being the top guy. So

55:06

it's not hurting him, it's only enhancing that

55:09

character to be a stunning,

55:12

poor mankind, but simultaneously,

55:15

people are building up this empathy for

55:17

him. Yes. So you remember

55:19

Cornette calling you, and saying, hey, your

55:21

ship's come in. Yeah. And it was because

55:24

of the

55:26

Shawn Michaels absence at the time. Yeah.

55:29

So I think what was happening is

55:31

these interviews are getting over, the point

55:33

where Steve asks me after week

55:36

one, in my turning baby face, predicts

55:38

I'd be a baby face by week three, which

55:40

I was, and now the company's

55:42

going to invest in me, in

55:45

part because Shawn is gone,

55:48

and that leaves a big hole

55:50

in the lineup. Does your financial

55:53

brain even consider,

55:56

or is it just your wrestling brain, when

55:58

it comes to being a heel, we've heard every- rest of

56:00

the site, oh it's just more fun to be a heel and

56:02

I get that. But it's also

56:04

pretty fun to get a bigger check and if you're

56:06

selling a bunch of merch, you probably get a bigger

56:08

check as a baby face, right?

56:10

And mankind would. Yeah,

56:13

yeah, yeah.

56:16

J.R. had said on his podcast that Austin

56:18

at his height was getting million dollar

56:20

quarterlies just from t-shirts. Yeah. And

56:23

we're not there yet but we're cruising there because that

56:25

Austin 316 shirt, even though it's not

56:27

beating Nitro, it's picking up

56:29

a lot of steam. Yeah. And people are

56:31

really resonating, I mean that's really resonating with a lot of folks and they're

56:33

voting with their wallets. But as a heel,

56:36

that's probably not a regular part of your diet

56:39

at that point. But if you think, wow, a baby

56:41

face character, that might not

56:43

be bad for the old wallet. Well, unless

56:45

it's Austin or one of these incredibly

56:48

popular shirts, WWE

56:51

has their royalties in a way that you're

56:53

making a little bit here off action

56:56

figures there, off videos there,

56:58

it all kind of. It's not substantial you're saying.

57:00

Yeah, it wasn't that substantial. I never felt like there's

57:02

a big difference. But as far as having

57:04

fun, I, you

57:08

know, almost like when you become that baby face,

57:10

you're a somewhat deluded heel,

57:13

a version of your heel self. Yes.

57:16

Whereas I was able to expand mankind and

57:18

bring dude love to the forefront and have

57:20

Cactus Jack come in. So I

57:22

think I had more fun. And

57:24

also,

57:25

I mean, being mankind

57:28

was difficult because it was different.

57:30

I mean, I just said in that book that was

57:32

close to my heart. Parts of it were

57:34

close to my heart as far as being the outsider.

57:37

But as far as being the dark guy,

57:39

you know, who doesn't interact, that

57:41

was difficult to be

57:43

that dark, especially as I did not

57:46

want mankind to be Cactus Jack with a mask.

57:49

Create this backstory. The backstory is pretty dark,

57:51

the boiling room thing. I play it up, I

57:54

think, pretty well to very well depending on

57:56

the night. And so I

57:58

had a lot of fun.

58:00

as babyface

58:02

mankind. Part of when we

58:05

get into 98, the latter end

58:07

of 98, my knees start really bothering

58:09

me and I start having to rely more on

58:11

character stuff than the in-ring stuff. It

58:15

bothers me at the time. Now I

58:17

look back on it as one of the greatest times

58:19

of my career because we had so much fun

58:21

with the character. Yeah. Flair said

58:24

that when his physical skills started

58:26

to diminish, he just had to up

58:28

the entertainment. Yeah, exactly. That's the

58:30

key to longevity in wrestling though, is it not? I

58:33

think the exceptions would

58:35

prove the rule, which is the guys who don't

58:37

find a way to shift into a

58:39

different gear, which is largely upping

58:42

the entertainment and the comedy. They're the

58:46

ones who do much better and the guys

58:48

who don't find a way to do that end

58:51

up floundering. Yeah, no kidding. So

58:53

the Undertaker is going to join with Paul Baer that night

58:56

on Raw and later that week on shotgun,

58:58

you team with Vader and Taker to take on the nation

59:00

of domination. So

59:03

a couple months after Revenge of the

59:06

Taker, I'm now teaming with Taker, who does

59:08

a heel turn of his own. Yeah, he's joining

59:10

Paul Baer because he doesn't want this secret to come out.

59:12

Okay, gotcha. And you're

59:15

working the loop with Rocky in between TVs.

59:18

This is the very young Rocky Navia. He's

59:20

not yet with the nation. He doesn't have this

59:22

heel edge. Are you seeing

59:24

progression? I mean, it seems silly

59:27

that we're talking about it in this way, but he's

59:29

still relatively green. He's a new guy

59:31

and you're the veteran at this point. Could

59:34

you see him improving week to week or did you guys

59:36

have like, here's our standard match and we're going to know

59:38

we, we, I always enjoyed working with him. He's

59:40

a hard worker, always looking to get better and

59:42

he was a natural. He was one of,

59:44

you know, Austin, I would say was an out

59:47

of Kurt Angle and, uh, and

59:49

the rock where the three guys I saw just picked

59:52

it up, but it was not until

59:54

he said the words to me when,

59:57

once he started referring to himself in third person.

1:00:00

That starts it gets it's not just starting

1:00:02

to go or it is over But

1:00:04

the moment he turns to Farooq and says

1:00:06

I

1:00:07

think he even said with all due respect

1:00:10

The fans want to hear what the Rock has to

1:00:12

say and we all all this watching

1:00:14

the monitor went. Oh like oh

1:00:18

Like he was really on to something

1:00:20

and all he needed was that little something

1:00:23

and I you know, he's talked about I

1:00:26

mean it didn't bother him that fans turned

1:00:29

on him. Yeah, die rocky die chance You

1:00:31

got to take that personal. I know because

1:00:33

he's he's he is Portraying

1:00:36

a character who is very close to himself,

1:00:38

right? Well, he's also doing exactly what the

1:00:41

office is Oh, yeah. Yeah, and it's not working

1:00:43

and then when he starts doing things his way it

1:00:45

does start working Yeah, and so that was

1:00:48

night and day But we would have I

1:00:50

don't we got the one star or one in the

1:00:52

quarter I think you were just one star

1:00:54

I said we we should have earned one in a quarter

1:00:58

Personally I thought cold day in

1:01:00

hell was a one and a half star match

1:01:02

and that we were robbed of that half star We're gonna

1:01:05

get up. We're gonna get a hashtag trending about Get

1:01:08

enough sort of acquiesce in

1:01:10

Huntington you defeat Savio Vegas you're gonna

1:01:12

advance in the king of the ring tournament But the real

1:01:14

story is part three of your interview.

1:01:17

They show clips of the king

1:01:19

of the death man Yeah, IWA milter

1:01:21

would say this they did another mankind

1:01:23

segment mainly showing his gimmick matches from

1:01:25

Japan and also showed an ECW clip I

1:01:28

was farewell talking about how he had so

1:01:30

much respect as cactus Jack and

1:01:32

he doesn't have any as mankind It was

1:01:34

great again. He should be an actor

1:01:36

on television rather than a pro wrestler with the way

1:01:38

he can deliver a line This may

1:01:40

be a way to build up the first explosive barbed

1:01:42

wire match in WWF history later this year

1:01:45

Since that sushi, O'Nita has talked

1:01:47

about wanting to do that match in Madison Square

1:01:49

Garden Now that is a fun

1:01:52

sidebar because there is in this era

1:01:54

a famous picture of O'Nita meeting

1:01:57

with Vince in the WWF headquarters

1:02:00

Did you have any idea that that was happening? No,

1:02:02

no, I did not. Wouldn't that have been something

1:02:05

to think you and Arnada as mankind and

1:02:07

Arnada and the WWF? I would

1:02:09

have loved it. I remember in 98

1:02:12

pushing for that match with me and Terry Funk,

1:02:14

something on an island, where you'd have

1:02:16

to worry about explosions or anyone

1:02:19

around ringside getting hurt. It

1:02:23

was a cinematic match before there was a cinematic

1:02:25

match, right? The

1:02:28

idea of it being remote where you couldn't

1:02:30

go and see it or anything like it, I thought

1:02:33

would be a draw. And we've done things like...

1:02:35

Floating rings like FMW or Spring

1:02:37

Break Nitro or whatever. And to break

1:02:39

this out, the exploding bar-bar match

1:02:42

in the United States, I think would have been a great deal.

1:02:45

It would have been tremendous. Were you surprised

1:02:47

that they were able to show that footage?

1:02:50

I mean, the idea that we saw that footage on

1:02:52

WWF programming, when you go back

1:02:54

to that new generation era where

1:02:56

it's Dool Inc. and Bastian Booger and Jeff

1:02:58

Jarrett with the stripper

1:03:01

gimmick, it's

1:03:04

quite the departure to now

1:03:06

we're seeing explosions on Raw,

1:03:08

right? Yeah. It's

1:03:12

such a... I don't know. It's

1:03:14

so cool to Vince to be able to pivot. He

1:03:16

realizes he's getting his butt kicked in the ratings.

1:03:18

He's got to do something different. But the idea

1:03:21

that he's showing footage from other promotions... They

1:03:24

think they just... They found out who had the rights

1:03:27

to it. I

1:03:29

think they had a pretty good working

1:03:31

relationship with Baseball Magazine, which

1:03:34

was the number one wrestling magazine for reasons

1:03:36

I still don't understand. A Japanese

1:03:39

magazine calling itself baseball...

1:03:41

About Raw doesn't make sense to me. But

1:03:45

neither did the fact that they'd have naked

1:03:47

pictures of women in their versions of like Time

1:03:49

and Newsweek. So a lot about the culture.

1:03:51

I still don't understand. But I'm

1:03:53

drawing a blank there. It's

1:03:57

just crazy to me that Vince is embracing

1:03:59

showing other... I didn't actually draw a

1:04:01

blank. I was thinking of some of

1:04:03

the vile things that they would show in some of their

1:04:05

magazines Pointing it out. Oh

1:04:08

my there's a fetish magazine. I sold

1:04:10

it. Oh my god Oh jeez, and I don't

1:04:12

want to say who the wrestler is. He's not here anymore.

1:04:15

Isn't that awful? And all I heard was Isn't

1:04:20

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1:04:24

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Huntington against Savia Vega. It's the first time

1:07:23

I remember you getting a big baby face pop

1:07:25

when you come through the curtain now your

1:07:28

old pal Steve Austin He said he'll be a baby

1:07:30

face in three weeks Yeah The episode

1:07:32

where the third interview airs

1:07:35

you come out to wrestle Savia Vega. There's a

1:07:37

baby face Yeah, were you surprised

1:07:39

or you like 10 minute? He was right or you at this

1:07:41

point excited like okay, that's a new channel I'd

1:07:44

actually been feeling it on a nightly basis.

1:07:46

So then you could feel the injection You

1:07:48

felt it on house shows. We just saw it. Yeah the first

1:07:51

time. Yeah Are you happy

1:07:53

at that point with the transition? It feels like your character

1:07:55

is making or you've been so dark Yeah,

1:07:58

I feel because first of all, it's more me

1:08:01

as a were getting behind me based

1:08:03

on things that were one hundred percent true

1:08:06

our mean ideally give the it's nicer

1:08:08

those who the father did a good performance

1:08:11

what i'm saying things that i one hundred percent

1:08:13

believe him and so this is a character

1:08:16

people think they can get behind this is where people

1:08:18

start to seal the better themselves him

1:08:21

this a lighter mankind of

1:08:23

here is not all as a lightened up much

1:08:27

he adds what they see

1:08:29

a little light at the end of that thomas said

1:08:31

are you most excited to see a swollen testicle

1:08:35

if it's all real hero somewhere i

1:08:37

hope so and so says well

1:08:40

he resists rumored proud

1:08:46

or not agree more like a tan jello and a know

1:08:50

yeah so ah

1:08:53

spar for vicinity serious next i

1:08:55

supposed to air after king of the rain

1:08:57

or shine at the actual pay for view your schedule

1:08:59

for two matches the first as material all

1:09:01

and us here to get the win and ten minutes and

1:09:03

twenty four seconds with the mandible hall know

1:09:05

pallbearer with you because air promote

1:09:07

we face are a meltzer

1:09:10

would say he's gone back to his cactus

1:09:12

jack bang bang trademark now

1:09:14

that he's a face actually

1:09:17

this was not a good interview made even worse

1:09:19

been a lot of crowd reaction in the fact that ten

1:09:21

thousand and in the building the

1:09:23

only person seemingly were acting was with

1:09:25

that man who was laughing at

1:09:27

the humor that nobody seemed to either understand

1:09:29

this is my mind promo yes

1:09:32

so another sub par for but

1:09:34

the king of the ring promo beforehand man

1:09:36

i remember recent years for mankind as it came

1:09:38

out but almost no baby face papa reaction

1:09:42

to his car

1:09:45

to his interview lawler female and assaulted the fans

1:09:47

and in a model are wow all job's baobab

1:09:50

lot either way after messed up

1:09:52

network your spot lawler had a first drop

1:09:54

or a sister office and went for a powder

1:09:56

our but mankind power out and the mandible

1:09:58

call for the win stuff in three quarters

1:10:02

of course lawler at this point it's

1:10:04

weird or a the observer back there he's talking about

1:10:07

lower forty seven as if is way over the hill

1:10:10

our favorite wrestlers are jumping off balconies

1:10:12

in their sixties my grandmother now

1:10:15

ah but lawler here was this up

1:10:17

a fun experience for you growing up a guy

1:10:20

who had such great respect for wrestling

1:10:22

and he knew what lawler was they might not be

1:10:24

this physical bacon forty seven but

1:10:26

as a guy who's grown up loving it had to

1:10:28

be exciting city was exciting to

1:10:29

for were on and on makes for good t v for

1:10:32

me to find out a photo i'll

1:10:35

find a while i'm talking yards

1:10:37

or ever since i saw lawler in that damn

1:10:40

ah letterman thing he'd been some when i

1:10:42

really liked him as i got to know lox

1:10:45

ah brian hildebrand more curtis expose

1:10:47

me more and more to the super lawler

1:10:49

found super law of and i will will

1:10:52

make sure we put in and it's me ah

1:10:54

getting a character therapist or done

1:10:56

in nineteen eighty three whereas call

1:10:59

myself a big guy i wanted to be eyebrows

1:11:01

i should sue ride back over there i should

1:11:03

the big guys and and

1:11:06

i've got the lawler ah crown

1:11:09

now guilty with no

1:11:11

mustache yeah by itself

1:11:13

so he was cool i did mess up their neck

1:11:15

brace or to this day i find

1:11:17

that a really difficult move because

1:11:20

you don't know which way to the guys were

1:11:22

guys going and them

1:11:25

yeah best that move up i never really thought

1:11:27

about that but i'm always in a we know that

1:11:29

here in america guys work the left side but

1:11:31

there's not off now they're always go

1:11:33

after girl yeah some guys do it

1:11:35

differently ham handed say i decide

1:11:38

know that sounds crazy sets one of the more difficult

1:11:40

moves once you know which way

1:11:42

you go and it's not difficult the our dies

1:11:44

difficulty and feel so i did mess up

1:11:47

as been

1:11:48

so saw necessarily a matter of as you and lawler

1:11:50

didn't just click he just think it was just

1:11:52

that one spots ah maybe we

1:11:54

didn't click it's one of those

1:11:56

matches it gets mired in the middle

1:11:59

where i

1:11:59

I don't have a recollection of it. I certainly

1:12:02

don't remember flopping an interview that badly.

1:12:05

Well, that's just like Meltzer's opinion, man. Talk

1:12:09

to me about bang bang though, because you were very

1:12:11

clear a minute ago saying, I didn't want mankind

1:12:14

to be cactus Jack with a mask. But

1:12:16

now at this point, we've acknowledged

1:12:18

that you used to be cactus Jack and you really

1:12:20

long to be dude love. Is

1:12:24

this where we maybe see

1:12:26

for the first time, there are going to be different

1:12:28

faces of Foley because you're embracing. Well,

1:12:30

I think if I was doing a bang bang, I wasn't

1:12:33

banking on their being three. I didn't, I

1:12:35

mean, I was, I had been told Vince

1:12:37

said cactus Jack will never step foot inside

1:12:39

that came I think from Bruce. Yeah.

1:12:42

Never step foot inside a WWF ring.

1:12:44

So even if he was going to give life to

1:12:46

dude love, there

1:12:48

was never a breath about it until

1:12:51

September of I know you're

1:12:53

not Vince, so you don't know. But why do you think

1:12:55

Vince would have said that because he didn't like that once upon

1:12:57

a time the character had the last name Manson or

1:13:00

because he wanted to own it? I know this is bad.

1:13:03

This is before I was even with the company. This

1:13:05

is Bruce. I remember

1:13:07

running into Bruce

1:13:10

at LaGuardia Airport. Maybe I was

1:13:12

with WCW or maybe I was independent

1:13:14

by that time. And

1:13:17

it was only years later. Bruce said, you know, Vince

1:13:20

was with me at LaGuardia. And

1:13:22

I said, hey, do you want to meet cactus Jack?

1:13:25

He said, I don't think I ever want to meet him

1:13:27

and then said that he would never step foot

1:13:29

in a WWF ring. He didn't like the

1:13:31

character. He thought it was sleazy. Thought that

1:13:34

I was sleazy. And maybe that's a compliment

1:13:36

to the character that he thought, well, this

1:13:38

is an awful human being. I think

1:13:41

if he paid any attention to the character

1:13:43

and I do think I've a knock on

1:13:45

Vince for me would

1:13:47

be

1:13:48

if he's micromanaging everything,

1:13:50

which he does, then maybe he could spend

1:13:52

an hour here or there studying a video

1:13:56

so that a guy with 12 years

1:13:59

behind him. doesn't show up and get

1:14:01

judged solely on what one man

1:14:03

sees on a 13-inch TV screen. I

1:14:06

think he's at least changed his

1:14:08

stance a little bit. I mean, I don't

1:14:10

know that I would have, I was a huge fan of Kevin

1:14:13

Steen, but I don't know that I would have seen

1:14:15

Kevin having a success in WWE. Oh yeah, yeah.

1:14:18

Because it felt like not what Vince

1:14:20

was looking for. I think someone

1:14:22

came around and knocked down the door. I wonder

1:14:24

who that would be. I hope that could have been as to

1:14:26

what a WWE superstar could look like. And

1:14:30

he even broke the barrier for testicles. When

1:14:32

you think about it. That guy is amazing. Now

1:14:35

we're going to the big finish here for the King of the

1:14:37

Ring. Helmsley and you are going to go 19 minutes

1:14:39

and 26 seconds. Helmsley

1:14:42

is going to win the King of the Ring tournament.

1:14:45

Meltzer says there was no heat at all for the

1:14:47

first half of the match, despite the fact that the work

1:14:49

itself was solid. To

1:14:51

the fans, at least, the two worked so hard

1:14:53

that it got the crowd into the match. But this was

1:14:56

seen as an unworthy final match.

1:14:58

The second half of the match built to a very good

1:15:00

match, mainly through mankind taking crazy

1:15:03

bump after crazy bump. And the announcers

1:15:05

attempting to paint a portrait of him putting on one of

1:15:07

the most courageous performances in history.

1:15:10

The match just didn't reach that level. There

1:15:12

were even boring, loud chants

1:15:14

at times. Mankind hit a couple of hot shots from

1:15:16

near falls. Helmsley took a flip

1:15:18

into the buckles and later a backdrop on the concrete

1:15:21

floor. Mankind did his elbow off

1:15:23

the apron onto the concrete onto Helmsley.

1:15:26

Mankind hit the double-arm BDT, but China

1:15:28

distracted the ref from counting the fall. Helmsley

1:15:31

went for the pedigree, but Mankind powered out.

1:15:33

Mankind got the mandible claw on, but China

1:15:36

pulled Mankind off Helmsley and out of

1:15:38

the ring by the hair. Helmsley pulled

1:15:40

off Mankind's mask, revealing, well, cactus

1:15:42

check, of course. Mankind got in

1:15:45

and put on the claw, but this time Helmsley

1:15:47

broke it with fingers to the eyes.

1:15:49

Mankind came back with a reverse atomic drop,

1:15:52

did his running clothesline where both

1:15:54

take the bump over the top rope. And Mankind

1:15:56

missed a falling elbow off the apron when

1:15:58

China pulled Helmsley out of the ring. way and

1:16:01

mankind hit his head on the guardrail.

1:16:05

Helmsley whipped mankind into the steps, gave him a pedigree

1:16:08

through McMahon and Ross's announcers

1:16:10

table. China then broke the scepter

1:16:12

they were going to use in the coronation on mankind's

1:16:15

back. Mankind even took the Nestee

1:16:17

plunge off the apron where he cracks his

1:16:19

head on the floor. All the effects was

1:16:22

weakened because he actually crashed into

1:16:24

photographer Tom Buchanan instead of the floor.

1:16:27

Finally, in the ring, Helmsley finished him with the pedigree

1:16:29

and after the match, Helmsley destroyed mankind

1:16:32

with his crown so the gimmick seems to be King

1:16:34

Hunter and Queen China. Mankind

1:16:36

crawled back to the dressing room on

1:16:38

his hands and knees. Three

1:16:40

and a half stars. I think it's

1:16:42

a badass match. I think it's criminally

1:16:45

underrated. I still remember that guardrail spot.

1:16:48

But I'm curious in your head, what

1:16:50

were you thinking on the Nestee plunge and there's a

1:16:52

photographer there? Man,

1:16:54

it's a funny thing because to this day I can remember

1:16:57

every single thing that happened with me and Triple

1:16:59

H

1:16:59

at New York City

1:17:03

Street Fight, Royal Rumble 2000, everything

1:17:05

that happened in

1:17:08

the subsequent month with the Hell

1:17:10

in a

1:17:11

Cell. I don't remember that match.

1:17:14

I remember it was good and I

1:17:16

do specifically remember if there

1:17:18

had been a problem with mankind getting the

1:17:20

babyface reaction before then that

1:17:23

at the house shows especially and I

1:17:26

would say also at the arena shows

1:17:29

when all those

1:17:32

videos reached their completion that babyface

1:17:35

reaction was not an issue. That we

1:17:37

were getting great reactions. I mean there's

1:17:39

a story Hunter and I like to share,

1:17:41

not one of the great wrestling stories but

1:17:45

just

1:17:46

me feeling that response

1:17:49

from the crowd making my comeback and going

1:17:51

this is great. Like

1:17:53

it was so much fun to get that kind of reaction.

1:17:56

Bigger. I had some nice babyface

1:17:58

reactions as Cactus Jack. during my

1:18:00

run but this was I'd say the best pure

1:18:03

babyface reaction and

1:18:05

that you know we're trying to figure out what a guy

1:18:07

with limited offense can do for his comeback

1:18:10

and I'd we decide or I decided 100 decides

1:18:15

one comeback it's not going to be a series

1:18:17

of smaller comebacks and cutoffs that when mankind

1:18:19

makes that comeback it's going to be a big one

1:18:22

then I throw into the loop that okay I

1:18:24

hit one or two moves and now I go into

1:18:27

that

1:18:27

you know seated position

1:18:30

rocking here comes the hair

1:18:32

boom we blow the hair

1:18:35

and then up to do the next few moves

1:18:37

and that was unique no one had done anything remotely

1:18:40

like that for their mankind to go

1:18:42

yeah man kind of guy yeah yeah I

1:18:44

guess I could have like taken off the shirt

1:18:47

and put nobody wants to see that trust me nobody

1:18:50

wants to see that so it was

1:18:52

it was you know you're discovering

1:18:55

things as you go you're throwing

1:18:57

stuff at the wall you don't know what's gonna hit and

1:18:59

what's gonna stick and it turned out that some

1:19:01

of that stuff stuck this one not saying

1:19:03

this to be funny not laughing when I say it do

1:19:05

you think you don't remember the match because you hit your head

1:19:08

on the guardrail maybe

1:19:11

maybe do you remember ever seeing that

1:19:14

hit where you had no it's brutal

1:19:17

I think I've always seen the match once probably

1:19:20

that next day in catering and

1:19:23

I probably haven't seen it since I'm glad

1:19:25

you say it's criminally underrated

1:19:27

though well it's really good because you know

1:19:30

first of all the announced table spot at that point was not

1:19:32

over done so that was a big yeah yeah

1:19:34

your head on the guardrail was a big spot jumping

1:19:37

off the apron with the elbow and missing is a big spot

1:19:39

the nest he flanges a big spot but the thing that

1:19:41

a lot of people miss is the

1:19:44

way hunter continued to get the heat on you

1:19:46

after now allegedly the

1:19:48

hunter wanted no part of being saddled

1:19:51

with wearing that dumb cape and crown

1:19:53

and sector so he destroyed

1:19:55

it and that was not the plan they had

1:19:58

another one recreated he destroyed that one

1:20:00

too. But supposedly this was

1:20:02

like the bane of Bruce's existence because

1:20:04

Fence really wanted him to do it. Hunter

1:20:06

wanted no part. And I'm assuming based

1:20:08

on you laughing, you did not know that Hunter

1:20:11

was supposed to wear that and you just went along

1:20:13

with it. Yeah. Yeah. But I'm

1:20:15

thinking while you're saying that he's a

1:20:18

Connecticut blue blood, he would have, he

1:20:21

would have been a natural. But he didn't want to do that

1:20:23

anymore. He wants to have this

1:20:25

hardened edge. He wants to,

1:20:27

we're not quite to DX, but we're not too

1:20:30

far away. Right. So he wants

1:20:32

to be this bad ass ass kicker now with China as

1:20:34

opposed to her coming out in a goofy queen outfit.

1:20:37

So I get that, but I think it's cool that he

1:20:39

kind of, according to Bruce, as

1:20:42

they say, went into business for himself and destroyed

1:20:44

that stuff. But the little touch of,

1:20:47

you know, let's think back a little bit to WrestleMania 13

1:20:50

when Austin is down

1:20:52

and out and he's passed out and

1:20:54

then, you know, afterwards, Brad attacks

1:20:56

him and ultimately

1:20:59

he wants no help to the back. He fights off

1:21:01

help. He stuns a referee and he limps back

1:21:03

to the back on his own. That's like out of an old

1:21:05

cowboy movie. Yeah. And here

1:21:07

you are crawling back on your hands and knees. That's

1:21:10

a really cool touch. I don't think I remember ever

1:21:12

seeing anyone in wrestling before that crawling

1:21:15

to the back on their hands and knees. Is

1:21:17

that a Foley touch? Is that a

1:21:19

Pat Patterson touch? Do you recall? I'm

1:21:22

not sure. I do remember seeing a Sergeant

1:21:24

Buddy Lee, uh,

1:21:27

Buddy Lee Parker. Buddy Lee Parker crawling,

1:21:30

uh,

1:21:31

down the ramp during battle

1:21:34

ball because, uh, he, Buddy

1:21:36

had been selected as my partner. Abdullah

1:21:39

didn't get that why

1:21:41

I would need another partner. So

1:21:44

he came down some

1:21:47

great light comedy. Abdullah

1:21:49

had a flair for, for some, he

1:21:52

had some comedic gestures and the idea

1:21:54

that in his mind, I'm always going

1:21:56

to be his partner and he, he laid

1:21:59

a beat down on Buddy Lee Parker. Lee Parker and then but

1:22:01

so Abdul was escorted away but I

1:22:03

essentially took on Steamboat and private tire

1:22:05

champion on my own and then when

1:22:07

Buddy came down on his hands and knees

1:22:09

the people really got behind that and then

1:22:12

he was beaten like as soon as he got in the ring he

1:22:14

was beaten so I think I was

1:22:16

discovering my inner Buddy Lee Parker

1:22:19

by the crawl to the back. I

1:22:21

think it's great I

1:22:22

thought it was really really good underrated

1:22:25

in your opinion is this the first great match you had with

1:22:27

Hunter I mean we remember the when Cactus

1:22:30

Jack comes back at MSG and all the great ones

1:22:32

that you listed but this is

1:22:34

probably the first really good one to me. Well

1:22:37

good is a matter of perspective because

1:22:40

I remember Jim Ross telling me when

1:22:42

Hunter and I started working around the loop JR

1:22:46

was booking us in some Falls County anywhere matches

1:22:49

and he was concerned he's I still you know the

1:22:51

back was still a question

1:22:52

and I'm gonna make

1:22:54

really sorry about this we're gonna get you off

1:22:56

of these things as soon as we can I said Jim do you want me to

1:22:58

be healthy he said yes I said book

1:23:01

me in as many of these Falls County anywhere matches

1:23:04

as you can because a Falls County

1:23:06

anywhere match can be anything you want it to be and

1:23:08

Hunter and I would do we get a great amount

1:23:11

of literally a mileage out of a pair

1:23:13

of salad tongs right salad

1:23:15

tongs the genitals and there was the one

1:23:17

night when I've got the salad tongs

1:23:20

Hunter's climbing up that top rope and

1:23:22

he tells me to beel him I

1:23:24

grab him by the nose right and I hear

1:23:26

him beel, beel throw

1:23:31

you know the big exaggerated sort of like casting

1:23:33

a fishing line and

1:23:35

he would take the big bump and so we were

1:23:37

having a lot of fun getting a great

1:23:39

crowd reaction but not having

1:23:42

that Falls County anywhere

1:23:44

there were times when I wouldn't just crawling

1:23:47

back to the back as part of the show I

1:23:49

remember in Savannah Georgia

1:23:52

crawling

1:23:52

back to my hotel room because

1:23:55

I had a Falls County where a match was staying

1:23:57

and I thought we're gonna go comedy and

1:23:59

that when When Stinger had me with

1:24:02

the plunger to the face in the middle of the ring

1:24:04

and the crowd's not buying it, I realized, all

1:24:06

right, they're not buying what we're selling, we have

1:24:08

to sell a different, you know, for merchandise

1:24:11

here. And then it became a really wild

1:24:13

and brutal, you know, backdrop

1:24:15

on the floor type of thing. And those things

1:24:18

really, really took their toll, whereas

1:24:20

you get almost the same pops with

1:24:23

the salad times, the beal throw,

1:24:25

and some good chemistry. Throw in

1:24:28

China, mankind was

1:24:30

becoming that character, you know, with

1:24:32

the comeback. So I would say the

1:24:34

great matches we had, which may not

1:24:36

have been five star or four star matches

1:24:38

on the Wrestling Observer

1:24:41

Scale, but they felt like four star

1:24:43

matches to me were at the tent towns

1:24:45

that co-hashed at Massachusetts, and

1:24:48

there was one in Rhode Island. Yeah,

1:24:51

there was like three or four tent towns. They didn't,

1:24:53

you know, 2,000, 2,500 people, low roofs because it was a tent, but great

1:24:59

atmosphere. So

1:25:02

talk to me about China. You're starting to have some

1:25:04

more interaction with China here. How was she

1:25:06

to work with? I loved working with China, and

1:25:09

I loved Joni. She was great.

1:25:12

We liked her from the moment we met her. Clatt

1:25:14

and I met her backstage and Chad knew good.

1:25:17

It

1:25:20

was that four way with Vader. Final

1:25:23

four. February 97. Yeah,

1:25:25

February 97. I remember her, you know,

1:25:27

coming out of the crowd to shake Terry Runnels

1:25:29

like a rag doll, and

1:25:31

my wife and I talked to her afterwards, and you

1:25:33

know, my wife said it was so impressive. We

1:25:35

all hated her. Did you like it? You know, she was,

1:25:39

like a lot of us, a little bit insecure, and

1:25:42

she found a home, you know,

1:25:44

in this outlandish cast

1:25:46

of characters. Her and Triple H became

1:25:48

a couple. A real

1:25:51

great power couple, and that was

1:25:54

part of the equation in making Triple

1:25:56

H, you know. A big deal. A

1:25:58

big deal. Really big deal. was where everything

1:26:00

with Brett and Sean happens with the

1:26:02

physical confrontation backstage that we talked

1:26:04

about. But as a result, the show has

1:26:07

to be rebooked because clearly

1:26:09

Sean was figured in in a big way and

1:26:11

now he's off the show. So as a result,

1:26:13

you're all over the Dogon show. Hunter

1:26:16

has his coordination and he starts quote unquote

1:26:18

shooting on Vince about how politics

1:26:21

blocked him from winning the year before. Pretty

1:26:23

inside baseball. Really very Vince

1:26:25

Russo talking about the curtain call of course.

1:26:28

But you interrupt him on screen asking

1:26:30

for a rematch and China

1:26:33

says for you to come down and kiss her ass. I said

1:26:35

I'm a good kisser. That's your lucky dad,

1:26:37

I'm a good kisser. Of course you go

1:26:40

down and get your ass beat. And then

1:26:42

JR finishes part four of his interview

1:26:45

with you. This is a big show for you.

1:26:48

You know the night after you lose in the finals,

1:26:50

you have some fun interaction, hit that great kisser

1:26:52

line which normally may be mankind wouldn't have done.

1:26:55

But now I've gotten to know you, part four

1:26:57

airs. And in hindsight,

1:27:01

if you would have known that this interview was going to turn you

1:27:03

baby face, do you think you still would have ended with

1:27:05

the mandible claw? On JR?

1:27:07

Yeah. You

1:27:11

know that turned into something so unique

1:27:14

anyway. Yeah. Because it was

1:27:16

and this wasn't scripted. This is me,

1:27:18

you know, JR started asking those questions

1:27:21

and do you think that maybe this

1:27:23

is your own fault? And I said what I think

1:27:25

is maybe you ought to start doing your damn

1:27:28

job. And then I slowly

1:27:30

lose it to the point where I hit his

1:27:32

hat, you know, and I ran of integrity.

1:27:35

Why I ought to, I said the words why I

1:27:37

ought to, like it's out of a 50s Western. Boom,

1:27:40

I put it on and when

1:27:44

Jim goes down and I get up

1:27:46

as if it wasn't me at all, I go

1:27:49

he's going to need some help out here. He's

1:27:51

going to need some help out here. And so I was showing

1:27:54

great deference from my fellow human

1:27:56

being and then Jim

1:27:58

sold it in a way where he was like,

1:27:59

It's not true for you know the next week on TV

1:28:03

and I gave him the the man of a claw

1:28:05

glove on a hand which is it was

1:28:07

still in his office last I knew. So

1:28:11

even if it wasn't you know maybe

1:28:14

you could say I'd say

1:28:16

it ended well. I think that only added to

1:28:18

the character and

1:28:21

added to the intrigue of the character. The gym

1:28:23

get the real man of a car the

1:28:25

friendly man. Had to give him the real one brother.

1:28:28

Had to give him the real one. Television got to lay

1:28:30

that stuff in. Later that

1:28:32

night you're inserted into a match against Brian

1:28:34

Pillman that was originally supposed to have

1:28:36

Austin taking him on. This

1:28:39

is your first time being around Brian

1:28:41

in the ring like this since the WCW

1:28:44

days but since then we know he had

1:28:46

shattered his ankle in a horrific hummer crash

1:28:49

and he was probably not the same in ring performer

1:28:51

after. Do you remember that match with Brian? Not

1:28:54

too much of it. Do you remember the matches we had in

1:28:56

WCW much better than that one? To

1:28:59

close the episode here it's reported in the Observer

1:29:02

that you had agreed verbally

1:29:04

to a five year renewal. Were

1:29:06

you happy to sort of scratch

1:29:09

that itch? Did this feel like okay we

1:29:12

got exactly what we were looking for we're headed in the right

1:29:14

because you talked before man I could get a handful

1:29:16

more years. A five year deal with

1:29:19

the number you wanted you had to feel

1:29:21

like sense of relief

1:29:23

right? Yeah I did especially I think

1:29:26

the final two years were up in that you

1:29:28

know. Where you wanted to be? In that 400k

1:29:31

range and then none of it

1:29:33

mattered anyway because I went above the

1:29:35

minimum every year of

1:29:37

the contract. And that really

1:29:39

at the time you probably felt like was going to be your last

1:29:42

contract. Yeah sure. Let's again put this in

1:29:44

context we're talking the summer of 97 so five years

1:29:46

later I don't think

1:29:49

you probably imagined you'd be wrestling in O2. And

1:29:51

as it was you know I was done two

1:29:54

and a half years later for full time wrestling.

1:29:57

From your book my contract negotiation had also.

1:30:00

gone well. It didn't make me rich but

1:30:02

it certainly provided security for my family and

1:30:04

if I invested wisely the money

1:30:06

could make me wealthy over time. I was able

1:30:08

to have several advantages, advantageous

1:30:11

conditions worked in and my final

1:30:13

deal was considerably more lucrative

1:30:15

than the one offered a year earlier. So

1:30:18

when you're saying advantageous conditions,

1:30:21

you mean you find first class? No,

1:30:24

I didn't even know what a first class ticket

1:30:26

looked like until I became WWE Champion.

1:30:28

Really? Yeah, so I don't

1:30:29

know what advantageous conditions I was

1:30:32

talking about because the contract

1:30:34

still didn't call for my

1:30:37

travel to be paid, airplanes would

1:30:39

be but hotels and

1:30:41

rental cars, I had tried to get that in

1:30:43

my contract saying that

1:30:45

WWE could look at it as an investment

1:30:48

because they knew I wasn't going to treat myself as

1:30:50

well as I should. JR would counter

1:30:53

by saying that's part of the process, you

1:30:55

know, you've got to examine

1:30:58

your priorities and keep yourself,

1:31:01

you know, keep that machine running. So

1:31:03

I don't know what those, but it

1:31:06

wasn't first class. I remember asking Sean

1:31:08

Waltman specifically like what's

1:31:10

an F fare? I'd never seen an F fare, you

1:31:13

know, you get a Y fare, a Q,

1:31:15

a B and all these, that's first,

1:31:18

year in first class.

1:31:20

And I said, has there been some type of mistake? And

1:31:22

he goes, you're the champion, like

1:31:25

you champion always flies first class.

1:31:28

And then even after I dropped the title

1:31:30

of the rock, those F fares kept coming.

1:31:34

And I thought there'd been some type of mistake. And

1:31:36

then it may have been Sean Waltman telling me

1:31:38

now you're, you're, you're grandfathered in because

1:31:40

that time title changes are still pretty

1:31:43

rare occurrence. It was a big deal to be changed. Yeah,

1:31:45

you wouldn't have six or seven former

1:31:47

WWE champions on the roster. You might have two

1:31:50

or three and it was a big deal.

1:31:53

And I've been really lucky that

1:31:55

that's been part of my deal ever since. standpoint

1:32:00

you know I've often heard wrestlers I think Lou

1:32:02

Albano is the first one created with thing and all

1:32:05

that matters all that's real is the money in the miles

1:32:08

but I've also known in more recent years

1:32:11

guys started to travel by bus for

1:32:13

maybe the last decade now in

1:32:15

hindsight do you think your career could have

1:32:18

been extended maybe you could have had a

1:32:20

longer run had you been

1:32:22

afforded the whole bus treatment I

1:32:25

don't think so I think my career could have been extended

1:32:27

if I had realized

1:32:29

a pivotal point that I didn't need to be 280 anymore

1:32:33

I didn't have to justify the weight by saying

1:32:35

I'm working with the undertaker I've got a pose

1:32:38

of vehicle physical threat to him that's

1:32:40

the point where I could have gone down I was over

1:32:42

enough where I could have gone down 30 pounds

1:32:45

and the audience would have accepted it and

1:32:48

instead I went up 30 pounds so

1:32:50

now instead of being 280 during

1:32:52

the best part of my career I was 300 plus

1:32:57

and that I think contributed to the

1:32:59

problems I was having with my knees and

1:33:01

the and then when my knees went

1:33:03

now it could over-reliance on wild

1:33:06

bumps so I think

1:33:09

I did serve myself really poorly

1:33:11

by not

1:33:14

you know at that point just

1:33:16

but I'm sore every day I'm

1:33:19

beaten up and and

1:33:21

I'm not I'm not a pill guy at

1:33:24

all yeah I'd maybe take it again

1:33:26

a handful of my life and

1:33:28

what did come from me was

1:33:31

those late night stops a little water

1:33:33

burger here a little water burger and it didn't

1:33:35

seem like too much to ask like I'm a guy

1:33:37

I'm on the road 200 plus days a year

1:33:40

I'm hurting when I come home I'm hurting pretty

1:33:43

much all the time what's wrong

1:33:45

with whether it be you know stop

1:33:47

at Perkins for a piece of pie I high

1:33:49

you know that was didn't seem like

1:33:52

it didn't seem like that

1:33:54

much to ask in return for what I was doing

1:33:56

but it was it showed

1:33:58

itself so it haunts I the two

1:34:00

things that maybe would have added more time to

1:34:02

your career. Knee pads?

1:34:05

Yeah, yeah,

1:34:07

yeah, yeah, but I don't think the bus, because

1:34:10

I love driving. I did and I

1:34:14

don't think it was until I came back to Commissioner

1:34:16

that I was pretty much on my own all the time

1:34:19

because I was flying into a city, the

1:34:21

rest of the crew was already there,

1:34:23

they already had their rides and so I was

1:34:26

renting a car, I was getting a hotel,

1:34:28

at that point it may have been taken care of

1:34:30

by the company and

1:34:32

I really enjoyed,

1:34:34

you know, I come out to do these shows,

1:34:37

right? Like I first of all I think

1:34:39

it's better for the show, talk about our

1:34:41

podcast, Foley's Pod, podcast

1:34:43

that's sweeping the coast, yep,

1:34:46

The Nation from Coast to Coast, and you're the

1:34:48

host with the most.

1:34:52

I don't know, I look at those buses

1:34:55

and that just seems like, it

1:34:57

just seems like an extravagance. A

1:35:01

lot of guys use it not to keep from driving

1:35:03

a rental car but to not have to do air

1:35:05

travel, right? So now instead

1:35:07

of being crammed into a middle seat, you

1:35:09

know, row 32 at 200, well anybody who's getting

1:35:12

the bus isn't sitting in a middle seat in

1:35:15

a close-to-heaven way. Yeah,

1:35:17

you know, yeah,

1:35:20

the airport, everyday airport thing,

1:35:22

even though it sucks, even when

1:35:24

it's, even if you go out there

1:35:26

and you're driving most of that loop, there's still

1:35:28

a handful of flights on every, you

1:35:30

know, a 10-day loop. And they get delayed, they

1:35:33

get canceled, you know,

1:35:35

you could miss a connection, I mean it's

1:35:37

a hassle. Yeah. I think a lot of the guys use

1:35:39

it as a way to maybe afford

1:35:42

themselves more time with the family

1:35:45

because on the bus it's okay if your

1:35:47

wife and kid are in a play and play

1:35:49

station or whatever and that

1:35:51

to me feels like, and again I realize

1:35:53

not a lot of guys who are doing that these days

1:35:56

but it's a tax deduction and it make life

1:35:58

on the road a little easier. physically but

1:36:00

also just mentally with your family and

1:36:03

me knowing you or getting to know you better it feels

1:36:05

like if you could have had the Foley clan

1:36:07

with you I think of us they

1:36:10

were with me quite a bit yeah they were with

1:36:12

me whenever they weren't

1:36:14

in school I mean I had them frequently

1:36:17

and we were okay and the guy

1:36:20

I mean I'm a car guy you know a van

1:36:22

guy I'm a van guy and a van guy

1:36:24

it's like that

1:36:26

movie with John Travolta where he calls it the Cadillac

1:36:29

of minivans right and it says yeah

1:36:31

I still love a van you love a good van

1:36:34

so I don't know it seems like an unnecessary

1:36:37

extravagance but if you're telling me it's prolonging

1:36:39

careers and making family lives better

1:36:41

I've just heard a lot of guys say that yeah

1:36:43

that the bus made a big difference

1:36:46

I've heard big show and obviously he's

1:36:48

got a different travel circumstance than a

1:36:50

lot of folks yeah so I could

1:36:53

see how hey man I don't want to cram into

1:36:55

even a first-class seat probably isn't comfortable when you're

1:36:57

seven foot something now but if you have a whole

1:36:59

bed and you can just lounge and have

1:37:02

your wife and kid around okay well that's different

1:37:05

you've heard me talk about it for years AG1

1:37:08

Mick and I absolutely love AG1 we start

1:37:10

each and every day with a simple scoop

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that's it that's all we need one

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1:37:20

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1:37:22

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1:37:24

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your strength your clarity and

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this is just a no-brainer to me think

1:37:33

of it it's like your foundational

1:37:35

nutrition product you know listen we're all

1:37:37

getting busy and we wind up well

1:37:40

I didn't want to do this for lunch but I don't feel like I

1:37:42

have an option or well I know I need

1:37:44

to do this is easy just one scoop

1:37:46

every single day you're

1:37:47

making sure you're taking care of your most valuable asset

1:37:51

you cover all your bases you're

1:37:53

looking for better gut health you want to boost

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in energy you want to support that immune

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system maybe you hate taking pills

1:37:59

or vitamins Maybe you just want a supplement

1:38:01

that tastes good. I drink mine every single

1:38:04

morning. My wife does hers before she

1:38:06

even does her coffee.

1:38:07

It makes her feel unstoppable on her way

1:38:09

to the gym, and I think it gives me more focus at

1:38:11

work. I feel like I'm more productive,

1:38:14

and I don't have that crash in the afternoon. I feel

1:38:16

like I'm more productive all day long. We

1:38:19

started this back even before the pandemic

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started, my wife did, but when the pandemic started,

1:38:23

Bansky had me start doing it. We've

1:38:25

done it every day since. We are huge

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fans. I think you will be too.

1:38:29

Even our daughters are into it now. Morgan's actually

1:38:31

taking some down to Tuscaloosa with her. With

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every single serving, you're setting yourself

1:38:36

up for success. I just can't

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1:39:01

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That's drinkag1.com. Check it out. You'll

1:39:06

be glad you did. Either way, though, this was fun today. everyone's

1:39:09

favorite part of the show. But is it hurt that we've already seen mankind? I don't think

1:39:11

that's possible. All right. And

1:39:17

I'm really glad that we've reached everyone's favorite part of the show. But

1:39:19

is it hurt that we've already seen mankind?

1:39:22

I don't think that's possible. All right. Because

1:39:24

this young man who we do not deem to

1:39:26

be WAP-worthy. Yeah,

1:39:28

WAP-appropriate. Appropriate. I

1:39:31

think everybody's WAP-worthy. So

1:39:33

we're going to see what we have here. If he's

1:39:35

a real big fan of yours, he's going to eventually see the WAP

1:39:38

song here on the show. But

1:39:40

I'd feel bad. It's his mom requesting the video.

1:39:42

I just think... Highly inappropriate. Okay.

1:39:45

So anyway, Elijah? He says

1:39:47

he favors mankind. All right. So let

1:39:50

me see. I like Elijah. He likes mankind.

1:39:52

I've seen a lot of dude love him. I'm pumped for more mankind.

1:39:54

My birthday is June 27th, if you're listening. It's a...

1:39:58

Cameo.com

1:40:01

forward slash Mick Foley even give you

1:40:03

a special deal use the promo code Foley 20

1:40:05

capital F Foley 20 Do

1:40:08

it on the website though. Don't do it on the app. All

1:40:11

right, so we're gonna start out and do love

1:40:13

mode today here today All right In

1:40:17

all land

1:40:19

And

1:40:21

maybe segue into some Into

1:40:24

some mankind here. So what about

1:40:26

whoa? Whoa gonna come back the

1:40:29

water burger is an assist

1:40:31

What we're gonna do is Dude,

1:40:34

love I spent all last night

1:40:36

in addition to writing and rewriting the WAP

1:40:38

song I rewrote dude loves

1:40:40

entrance song. Oh, I think you're really

1:40:43

gonna appreciate it Yeah, the original

1:40:45

song had three words in it dude love

1:40:47

and baby and this one's got just

1:40:49

a few more ready Okay, so here we go Oh

1:40:59

Elijah my man my

1:41:01

main man your eyes are not deceiving you This

1:41:04

is exactly who I think you're thinking. I think

1:41:06

you think I think you think it is There's a hip cat

1:41:08

that I'm thinking you think I think you think I think you

1:41:10

think it is It's none other than dude

1:41:12

love and I understand Amanda

1:41:15

has given dude the word You're celebrating

1:41:18

a very special day and we're not talking

1:41:20

about Groundhog's Day daddy

1:41:22

or take a child to work day. You

1:41:24

know what day I'm talking about Elijah. I'm talking about

1:41:27

birthday

1:41:29

Talking

1:41:32

about your birthday birthday Yeah,

1:41:36

yeah, yeah happy birthday

1:41:39

from your favorite face of holy

1:41:42

birthday. Oh Yes,

1:41:46

Elijah I believe the exact quote

1:41:48

Amanda gave to me is you thought that cactus

1:41:51

Jack was highly overrated and Mankind

1:41:54

not a big deal to begin with because you know

1:41:56

that it was the dude who knew how to

1:41:58

get down and do that way

1:41:59

I was just joking. Oh

1:42:02

man, that really burns my butt. I can't

1:42:04

believe it. Clearly, Elijah,

1:42:06

you are a mankind fan that

1:42:08

you did not ask for dude love. He is not your

1:42:11

favorite baseball league. So let's see if I

1:42:13

can rectify that situation. I

1:42:15

know you eat sleep wrestling

1:42:17

and you want to be a wrestler when

1:42:20

you grow up. You're a great kid

1:42:22

with a good heart. You would love to meet

1:42:24

me in person one day. That can happen,

1:42:27

but not before you meet mankind

1:42:29

through

1:42:29

the miracle of a

1:42:32

video. So hold on a second. Let me see if I can find

1:42:34

the three time WWE champion.

1:42:37

Yeah, I'm right here, Elijah. This is me,

1:42:39

mankind. I don't have a song to sing except

1:42:42

maybe. Ha,

1:42:45

ha, ha. Ha,

1:42:50

ha, ha, ha. Yeah.

1:42:57

Come on, everybody. Ha, ha, ha,

1:42:59

ha. Yeah.

1:43:05

One more time. Ha,

1:43:07

ha, ha, ha. Yeah,

1:43:12

this is mankind. Thank you for

1:43:14

thinking of me to make this day nice.

1:43:17

Oh wow. What a virtuos. I

1:43:19

can't say it's a virtuos performance because

1:43:22

I also had Conrad Thompson and

1:43:24

the great Dave Grillo there. And

1:43:26

this has been your cameo video.

1:43:29

And Elijah, I'll open up the DM so

1:43:31

we can figure out a time and a place

1:43:33

to make that meeting happen. In the meantime,

1:43:36

may all your days

1:43:38

be nice.

1:43:39

Oh, that was a hit, right? Come on now. That

1:43:42

might be the best one yet. You were like my Jordan

1:43:44

Ayres on that one. Dude, ha, ha,

1:43:47

ha, ha. That's that coming. I didn't either.

1:43:49