0:00

This. Episode is presented by Invest

0:02

Porto Rico. If you believe your

0:04

business can go anywhere, Porto Rico

0:06

is the place. Hello!

0:20

And welcome back to Equity a podcast

0:22

about the business of startups where we

0:24

unpack the numbers and nuance behind the

0:26

headlines. Today is April Twenty Six Twenty

0:28

Twenty four I'm Marianne as of a

0:30

know and joining me a senior at

0:32

Techcrunch reporter Alex Wilhelm were switching things

0:35

up a little bit the sweet because

0:37

instead of being in his usual recording

0:39

space, Alex is coming to us live

0:41

from Tech Crunches, Early Stage Event and

0:43

Boston. how's it going over there? Alex.

0:46

A loyal, my voice is shot. I

0:48

am overcaffeinated because we invested in three

0:50

different espresso stations here the venue and

0:52

I was twenty minutes late because it

0:55

turns out I can't read a spreadsheet

0:57

and probably schedule recording time for one

0:59

on off and so we're supposed to

1:01

starve are still on stage. But apart

1:04

from that, Marianne, everything's going pretty darn

1:06

good. Awesome! Glad you could

1:08

still make get on. That's the most

1:10

important thing before we get to the

1:13

show run down. I want to ask

1:15

our listeners please don't forget to rate

1:17

and review as on that Apple's Pods

1:19

Spotify or whatever your preferred pod streamer

1:22

is. We really appreciate it. Now today

1:24

on the show were going to talk

1:26

about a variety of things including real

1:29

bricks, ip yo to Mallows latest fundraise,

1:31

the tick tock ban, and what happened

1:33

at Techcrunch early stage So Alex tell

1:36

us about Rubric. Joe. So

1:38

this is the fourth major technology I

1:40

peo that we've seen this year and

1:42

if you recall, we saw Reddit and

1:44

then Stir Labs and then we recently

1:47

saw a mother company go out and

1:49

finally we have gotten or way to

1:51

Rubric. It's the company that I've been

1:53

most interested in, how he will price

1:55

and trade, and the company actually managed

1:57

to price above it's range at thirty.

2:00

Dollars per share some. And then it

2:02

debuted. Thirty Eight. So Marianne from a

2:04

very high level. I will call this

2:06

one a roaring success, and given the

2:08

circumstances, I'm a little surprised. Are.

2:10

You surprised? What were you expecting? I

2:13

mean less much less educated by record

2:15

companies are original. Twenty to thirty one

2:17

dollar per share price range is gonna

2:19

be worth I think like Five Point

2:22

Five Five Point Six billion to the

2:24

fact that a price above the ended

2:26

with hired me that as diversions got

2:28

comfortably north of six billion now and

2:30

it is a company that is only

2:32

growing so quickly which is why we're

2:34

seeing not very fast in aggregate. Not

2:36

he does have a growth business in

2:38

his claws scripture model but I still

2:40

not. All of it's revenue at a

2:43

very. Unprofitable. so to me looking company outcome

2:45

like our kids little aggressive I thought was

2:47

only going to be the slam dunks that

2:49

we're gonna go out but instead Rubric. I'm

2:51

in college. He had a great pricing and

2:53

train or to me and incredibly boring like

2:56

and I don't mean to take away from

2:58

Rubric. Well done. Congratulations on the runway for

3:00

that. I just didn't expect that many people

3:02

to shop to the party you know? Yeah,

3:04

I got it. I mean, when you look

3:06

at the numbers to slurs in a loss

3:09

of three hundred sixty four million dollars on

3:11

revenue at six hundred and twenty eight million

3:13

earlier this year and say, oh, actually, it's

3:15

a bigger loss than a year prior. With

3:18

two hundred and seventy eight million times last

3:20

year and revenue is six. Hundred million, so

3:22

a lot more the last little bit

3:24

more revenue I could see. wire. Fire.

3:26

That surprise. Yes, But

3:28

inside of that, very small gains from

3:31

six hundred to sixteen twenty eight million

3:33

in revenue year. To your heads of

3:35

fiscal years, it's January thirty one on

3:37

the told muslim there, but that's a

3:39

small detail. The thing is, they've been

3:42

transitioning from my son's revenue to subscription

3:44

revenue, and know whenever you do that

3:46

your overall growth rate goes down a

3:48

little bit as you swap essentially one

3:50

time revenue for longer term recurring revenue.

3:53

And so the slowdown is not an

3:55

enormous shots. The thought that it only

3:57

grew by? that's. Almost thirty out of

3:59

six hundred silver five percent year over

4:01

year. You know that's just not much.

4:03

but it seems that investors sauna business

4:05

and said what we don't care about

4:08

that, we care about the growth in

4:10

your cloud subscription and you'll recurring revenue.

4:12

And we're going to value based on

4:14

that. And we're going to give you

4:16

a relatively optimistic multiple. What What more

4:18

could you ask for us as a

4:20

great frickin' news. And as it's

4:22

good for them, let's see how this

4:24

plays out. long term thou interestingly Lightspeed.

4:26

Venture Partners own twenty. Three

4:28

point nine percent Every Berkshares prior to

4:30

die Peo Gray. Lock. Twelve Point

4:33

Two percent. so if it was Lusk Seedless

4:35

is called six billion for the sake of

4:37

round numbers and or Twenty Three Point Nine

4:39

percent basically a quarter And so that means

4:41

about a billion in a half to light

4:44

speed right at. yeah something like that printed.

4:46

as if we often talk about valuation and

4:48

soon as ownership or we don't actually most

4:50

by them to gas to get Singer and

4:53

I numbers like us Dollar figures yeah my

4:55

so problem I like be put into this

4:57

company is is sold as yours or dogs

4:59

in the near future About a billion Four.

5:02

Billion Five. I mean, that's the check.

5:04

Yasser Arafat, Foul Grill or to I'm

5:06

forty percent less, about half. but still,

5:08

it's hundreds of millions of dollars was

5:11

dusters. some of your An L P

5:13

A degree like or like weeds. Graduations

5:15

you have the i'm coming for the

5:17

having. A good day, light speed and gray

5:19

like L piece of with hi I'm not

5:22

a how do you think this is a

5:24

sign of and I feel market rebound. I

5:26

mean this is the fourth century about company

5:28

to go public. In recent months in America,

5:30

I legitimately struggled to find a way

5:32

to not answer that in the affirmative.

5:34

What's sad is nothing here that makes

5:36

me doubt that this is a both

5:38

sides. And yes, I have spent most

5:41

of today bobbing around this than you

5:43

in Boston talking to people in judging

5:45

disposals. But I still can think of

5:47

anything about this. The feals negative, the

5:49

prices good, The price seamless goods. The

5:51

trading was good. You know it's the

5:53

fourth I feel in a row that

5:55

we see this year. Those price well

5:57

inserted wealth is your a unicorn. Founder

5:59

and. They're on. you know how don't

6:01

know between ninety and hundreds of the millionaire

6:04

are and you're not working towards getting your

6:06

paperwork and place right now. If you're really

6:08

taking a that dad things are gonna be

6:10

a lot better. This user and I'm not

6:12

sure what the that's the case. Yeah

6:15

I mean I see like this kind of

6:17

the out a lot of started out there

6:19

that aren't losing so much money and probably

6:21

aren't too far behind rather eyes so maybe

6:23

the some the for cannot. Give them some

6:25

our confidence, you know it's almost like we've

6:27

got a couple of isn't the news lately

6:30

perhaps. Ridley Gusto Deal remote. I mean there's

6:32

a bunch of companies right now that have

6:34

to the numbers and have the ousted walk

6:37

of losses to ship enough one and really

6:39

make my next we great. So I think

6:41

that if they don't file next week marion

6:43

we should understand that as not indication that

6:46

their business cowards store afraid to visit the

6:48

public markets instead. There it's efforts haters who

6:50

don't want to serve a good have to

6:52

assess which sounds like a personal. Watch

6:55

me. Oh Allah says. Not snacks. Talk

6:57

about my deal of the week. A

6:59

startup called Thumbnail Out And you know

7:01

there's a couple of syntax out there

7:04

with this exact name. So this is

7:06

not to be confused with an Argentinian

7:08

center I covered in the past. This

7:10

one is U based, however it's mostly.

7:12

Right now operating in the

7:15

Philippines. Okay, so. What the

7:17

company does is a little different. It's

7:19

that's why I read about it. I

7:21

have not heard of this before either. They

7:23

are a self described send now pay

7:25

later company and essentially they offer credit

7:27

to people here in the Us to be

7:29

able to send money back to the

7:31

Philippines while at the same time building their

7:33

credit sucks Man thought as he is.

7:36

You can set up an account comes with

7:38

credit cards feet and as the creator

7:40

of the couch you can set limits,

7:42

pause cards view even if you spending habits

7:44

and then you can send cash. In

7:46

the form of credit to family members back

7:48

in the Philippines. And that way they're helping

7:51

the people here a build their credit and

7:53

then they're saying this way that it's it's

7:55

just a more. Secure way to censor

7:57

like monitor where the money is actually. Going

8:00

to be can feed a fever. Spending habits like

8:02

where the money's being. Spat. So if you're

8:04

worried about say your brother or sister back

8:06

home taking that money, as many our video

8:09

games you can see where it's actually going.

8:11

The why I now see what you think

8:13

of my hobbies is as I want to

8:15

drill down on the model her for six

8:18

that I understand I think it's actually brilliant

8:20

selves. I am a person's in the Us

8:22

our to send money to other family or

8:25

friends in the Philippines I can go to

8:27

a wire transfer service like Newswise would have.

8:29

I could send the money that I have

8:31

or ice I could go. Through Mellow

8:33

and say let's send my sister Mary

8:36

Ann in the Philippines hundred U S

8:38

D. And then I effectively owes them

8:40

down hundred or of mellowed out hundred

8:42

dollars after they send it. Therefore, I

8:44

didn't gendered a debt which I didn't

8:46

pay with them hundred dollars I was

8:48

going to send anyways and therefore I've

8:51

dealt with that in a positive fashion.

8:53

Credit score goes up at once. Happy

8:55

The only risk years really that a

8:57

mellow since money and and doesn't to

8:59

paid but obscene be a model for

9:01

that. So they've essentially just. Turn remittances

9:03

into a way to build domesticated. Absolutely

9:06

yeah and I think it is super

9:08

interesting. They're looking to expand to Mexico

9:11

that add a new payment options so

9:13

that users can also send sensors and

9:15

the county cause it's like an equal

9:18

in the Philippines similar to Venmo of

9:20

them and it's us raised. I'm pretty

9:22

decent series around thirty five million dollars

9:25

led by Vi capital which is a

9:27

the by the answer from that's pretty

9:29

secretive and I think back Ilan and

9:32

his purchase an axe and and Founders

9:34

find and a star is. A

9:36

pastor? What it says. Are a

9:38

prime as x l a prime

9:40

capital. I and side and figure that

9:42

out before we sent a recording. They

9:44

also participated in the round. So thirty

9:46

Five million series A Nothing to see

9:49

that in this market. It was mine

9:51

as p Three Boys last feals before.

9:53

Leaving Sanderson. Yeah. I

9:55

really think this is cool. I think this is

9:57

just a super cool model and possibly apply it.

10:00

Two countries like Mexico. There are lots of

10:02

folks in United States who could do well

10:04

to have Miller a boost to their credit

10:06

score and that it's pretty common ask amongst

10:08

everybody's and Ribbons has it in the U

10:10

S A Moscow are incredibly common and to

10:12

big business and served as a way to

10:14

kind of bring the two together. It's one

10:16

of those st Mary's and it will have

10:18

sought by because it's a cool business opportunity

10:20

and he could help people just live better

10:22

lives. So down of a seal that when

10:24

when. Yeah, agreed. And you know

10:27

I don't want to get P D

10:29

Town and the nitty Gritty, but they

10:31

do offer unsecured credit lines or secured

10:33

credit lines depending on the the customer

10:35

and that their underwriting criteria. One other

10:37

click. Know they don't charge interest, but

10:40

they will charge a late fee if

10:42

someone doesn't pay them. Back sounds

10:44

Atlanta. Point that out. Admit at mostly

10:46

makes money from entertains revenue and and

10:48

foreign exchanges smaller component because they cards

10:50

in the Philippine market. So therefore when

10:52

he asked his own custom axles know

10:54

I think this is a circle and

10:56

Mary And if I may be so

10:58

bold as to point out something in

11:01

your nice it's a cool thing to

11:03

do. You know, Manitoba down on

11:05

syntax. Here's a cool and. Ethical and

11:07

and as cosine. How. Recently reported cross

11:09

border fence. It's pretty hot, right? Now.

11:11

When I see to their dinner days

11:13

a couple of weeks fact that was

11:16

a common theme that she saw. There

11:18

were several start ups and that cohort

11:20

focus on cross border syntax. and we've

11:22

even written about another doing at a

11:24

similar thing called Answer that helps various

11:26

thinking needs of minor Central Americans during

11:28

kind of a similar thing that with

11:31

a debit card. So anyway, hot Space

11:33

fund? yeah I enjoyed it on that

11:35

it out. After the break we're going

11:37

to talk about sex talk and of

11:39

what had happened to it here. In

11:41

the Us as it doesn't find a buyer.

11:49

What's. Next, and tax That's not

11:51

the right question is where Porto

11:54

Rico more than just tropical paradise?

11:56

It's innovations paradise where startups and

11:58

global players code. This dinner

12:00

vast and vibrant ecosystem were

12:03

talent runs deep, highly skilled

12:05

and bilingual. Plus the Island

12:07

offers the most competitive tax

12:09

incentives in the Us. If

12:11

you believe your business can

12:13

go anywhere, Twitter Rico is

12:15

the place. Find out more

12:18

I'd invest pr.org/techcrunch. For.

12:21

Marry and Congress is famous for being a

12:23

little bit slow. but in suddenly things happen

12:25

in the Shake loose and I feel if

12:27

we win from the house passing it's Tic.divest

12:30

or band bill than nothing happened for a

12:32

while and then suddenly boom Here we are

12:34

it's pass and gone to the President. It's

12:36

been a whirlwind weeks but the just seems

12:39

to be that Tic.has nine months plus a

12:41

grace period to divest from By Dance Orpheus

12:43

abandoned United States and that sounds like it's

12:45

going to be a ban unless the company

12:48

can send us off in the courts. but

12:50

I'm not. Super optimistic about that. So here

12:52

we are Kind of in the aftermath of

12:54

a meteorite, but I didn't expect to hit

12:56

for some time. Yeah, I mean there's

12:58

been talk about this for a while. It's

13:00

not like it's a new thing we we

13:03

knew was probably cunning maybe to sit realize

13:05

of becoming now and the Us is not

13:07

the first country to ban are considered adding

13:09

tic toc right? I mean that this has

13:12

happened since played out and lots of different

13:14

parts of the world. India is probably the

13:16

most well known tic tac fan right? and

13:18

it's a huge consumer mark and that was

13:20

like let's fight for. Years ago to Twenty

13:23

Twenty Four June twenty one of the I

13:25

thought it was our. but still, that's back

13:27

in the early days of Covert. That's all

13:29

I'm gonna was right? So yeah, they

13:31

ban tic toc. They are

13:33

in India For years ago

13:36

almost Afghanistan is Pakistan's Senegal,

13:38

Somalia, Nepal, well Irans. The actually

13:40

when you look at the countries that have done this

13:42

is not actually that attractiveness of. I

13:44

guess he joined the between the parties America

13:46

for folks who are behind what's the Us

13:49

into this year. I. Believe it is

13:51

mostly privacy concerns, right? I mean, there's

13:53

a lot of worries about privacy and

13:55

I don't know if there's any way

13:57

that could ever be overcome. Privacy

14:00

is interesting, but how much talk to

14:02

you put in the argument that there's

14:04

a propaganda concern of this after being

14:07

misused by his parent company to essentially

14:09

influence the American public at large given

14:11

how popular ticked off your as a

14:13

fraction of our population before and maybe

14:16

even dear in and watch. That's

14:18

a interesting I had not really thought about

14:20

that and I'll be honest, I'm not a

14:23

tech talkies or I'm just not. I never

14:25

got into i'm not much of video person

14:27

in general and know a lot of people

14:29

who use tic tac that d think that

14:31

that could be one of the reasons why

14:34

this is happening right now. I

14:36

think so. and I think the

14:38

concern is that the separation that

14:40

by down for stressed and to

14:43

talk of stress between them is

14:45

essentially artful Bs. That's not true

14:47

that there isn't actually that much

14:49

operational separation between the two companies

14:51

and is that is the case

14:54

given the integration of the Chinese

14:56

government into it's major corporations. that

14:58

means effect of ways to test

15:00

com his party has a seat

15:03

in Sadistic.which has be hard eyes

15:05

and. Mind are so many kids and

15:07

young voters and young adults and just adults

15:09

Know if that's the case is you

15:11

have to come to think is that a

15:13

reasonable risk to allow and one way to

15:16

think about that as do other countries

15:18

allow that risk. For example, does China and

15:20

the answer is no In does India

15:22

have answers notes and as Edu in the

15:24

answer is well they're kind of pissed off

15:27

to so the answer appears me node

15:29

more places I suppose. You know

15:31

my brain is this kind of going over

15:33

time here I don't know and away know

15:35

that makes me think i it is that

15:37

good enough reason now to ban tic tacs.

15:39

The As. Hard. Yes. Even.

15:42

Today and has to put my my brother's

15:44

other people's and kind of on the free

15:47

speech he wing of the free speech party

15:49

nine. I know that puts me at at

15:51

odds with a lot of my generation vitreous

15:53

but in this case I just don't think

15:56

the first I'm in. the protections apply to

15:58

Singapore based companies with China. Headquartered

16:00

parent companies and I'd I just don't

16:03

think we have to offer unilateral vote

16:05

vs. reciprocal access to our market. I'm

16:07

so I think the duster ban is

16:10

a very reasonable approach. What are the

16:12

chances of this happening? Though I don't see

16:14

By Dance selling see so there was

16:16

a lot of chatter free sign of

16:19

this and decide to accelerate a conclusion

16:21

of this saga that By Dance would

16:23

effectively would rather sort of down themselves.

16:26

That always struck me as a little

16:28

bit of bravado versus the mean that

16:30

was really going to come to pass.

16:32

I think the question is what can

16:35

they carve out and sell that would

16:37

be a nos of and excision for

16:39

different astray some of the company from.

16:42

The. By Dance World to placate the American

16:44

regulatory structure and the government at large and

16:46

if there's a compromise to be had in

16:48

that situation that with still a lot tends

16:50

to keep the algorithm the secret sauce of

16:52

what makes ticked off the popular I mean

16:54

that the only thing I know about that

16:57

is that lawyers are going to be eaten

16:59

good a i've worn out or to be

17:01

of like the. And super curious to

17:03

see how this plays out. I can

17:05

imagine there's gonna be outside now. There's

17:07

so many people here in the U

17:09

S the that use it notice for

17:11

pleasure that for business right there is

17:14

marketing people who use it to try

17:16

to sell products. Creators influencers says this

17:18

is in central, have shifted their ad

17:20

dollars friends not As and you know

17:22

I'm Instagram her face back to Tick

17:24

tock Lake. In this has a really

17:27

broad potential impact, right? Photo, but

17:29

that's the sticks. If it didn't have

17:31

a potentially broader impact, we wouldn't care

17:33

about it. Or that's why we're talking

17:35

about the docks. This is done and

17:37

up. The has a million monthly active

17:39

users in the Us is no, not

17:41

that has Tens doesn't or something like

17:43

one hundred and Thirty. A Hundred and

17:45

Forty million monthly active users. Yeah, it's

17:47

a lie. And how many people live

17:49

in the Us Marine? Three thirty. that's

17:52

a damn near pass laps. I'm sorry.

17:54

It as a hundred and seventy million

17:56

for Tottenham Us and sell more than.

17:58

A. Half Okay. so. The

18:00

for his probably hoping that this

18:02

works out. Mark Zuckerberg. Guess

18:05

was marked was famously not making enough money over

18:07

a metre indoors, alphabet doing well enough and the

18:10

advertising market I think this is incrementally good for

18:12

them. I think it wouldn't help books not more

18:14

than those two companies in terms of like government

18:16

or gross hundred kind of us. Not to the

18:19

honest with him, out of Albury adds a lot

18:21

of the Evan Spiegel the I saw that are

18:23

innocent or it's not that. I mean I've never

18:25

really been a snapshot user as think I was

18:27

slightly too old for when it came out and

18:30

that was cool enough when A.the dirt But notice

18:32

like Bible says that is a company that has

18:34

been tenacious and very vision for them. And sir,

18:36

if anyone's ready to jump on the unlocking of

18:39

ad dollars I hope it's them so they'll give

18:41

get a social dance have a run for their

18:43

money. it would be good for X to. I.

18:46

Do think of that, the tic toc

18:48

of occasion of content will persist the

18:50

skill for sure. Hills I think that

18:52

of one thousand bucks. I think that's

18:54

going to stick See Well now I'm

18:56

curious since. I have of that

18:58

and the can you tell us

19:00

what is going on and early

19:02

stage says they're what are they

19:04

saying. What's. The hot topic The

19:07

science. A I mean I. Want to hear and

19:09

are not? You can. You can see what's the topic minus

19:11

the hawthorne. Such as well. I see.

19:13

Now we're gonna, of course I'm at a

19:15

I buy. like what else besides a ice

19:17

as being talked about. The were

19:20

in Boston for which people will note is

19:22

not San Francisco and is not New York

19:24

City so we're not in the to kind

19:26

of like a putz hogs here in the

19:29

United States. And. I

19:31

like that to a degree. We're

19:33

slowly out of center in that

19:35

way, but the Boston area has

19:37

a very rich pedigree in software,

19:39

biotechs, a lot of hard tech.

19:42

Given it's density of higher institutions

19:44

of education, you have enough. Mit

19:46

is around here, and murders around

19:48

here, and Umass Amherst and Williams

19:50

babies also somewhere Roger are going

19:52

to cause head out for that.

19:54

sort of guess I don't remember

19:56

myself as a lot of of

19:58

And so it's. The get here to

20:01

you do get a slightly more biotech he

20:03

robotic see tied crowd and another waterfront but

20:05

the think that's really hit me marianne is

20:07

we're taught a lot about how venture capital

20:10

a slow down and since like a slow

20:12

down and in other stock market gone up

20:14

some but still valuations are loads and if

20:16

you just like. I mean honestly,

20:18

because listen to us, you might get a perspective

20:21

that things are. Nine. Very busy.

20:23

Yeah know, The inner see

20:25

here today and I'm not just on a big

20:28

up. our events are just a lot from such

20:30

as an event the like, it's pop and we

20:32

had a women in technology backs of starts and

20:34

it's than. the A has been pretty much path

20:37

to people standing around the edges and questions have

20:39

been great. I just got off stage for my

20:41

two sessions and it was lovely. People were to

20:43

as very engaged and so you that the biggest

20:45

thing that I'm taking away from the says you

20:48

know don't worry too much about the big picture

20:50

numbers that if one talks about the sounders are

20:52

still hungry and the founders are still buildings and.

20:54

Everything else. Noise. That's. Great

20:56

to hear it or something and he said

20:58

for that and person energy that you feel

21:01

that sort of the that specific in the

21:03

early stages right? Because there's still a lot

21:05

of excitement, a lot of pass and I

21:07

hope for what could be next was what's

21:09

going to happens and you moderated a couple

21:11

of panels right? Tell us about those. Ya

21:14

So I was on the tam panel

21:16

which is always good fun. I had

21:18

an investor Toby from Police's and then

21:20

I had to see cofounder of Silly

21:22

Know and because under oath quotient a

21:24

I and they were fantastic and the

21:26

questions from the audience were pretty satirical

21:28

but clearly people are thinking about the

21:30

best way to put their because the

21:32

forwards sort of other business with the

21:34

dusters and risk much capital as they

21:36

chance so that was very encouraging and

21:38

I I think that was always illustrative

21:40

to me at these events is how

21:42

important is to go. Over the basics because

21:44

I think that if you've done our job

21:46

as long as we have Miriam, you get

21:48

a little that vineyards to hear read about

21:51

pretty but my evaluations and this month but

21:53

for lot of Founders, this is the first

21:55

time they've dips their feet into this world

21:57

and so it's really excited. Cb blocking. Admittedly

21:59

occasionally. The road to be basic

22:01

questions that implies a upwelling and a

22:03

new stream of new Founders that was

22:06

good. And then I had Rebecca we

22:08

whiting from Epigram and See You Did

22:10

are essentially early stage fundraising session talking

22:12

about safes, convertible notes and.was very good

22:15

as once again for basics but also

22:17

for context. And as you put it,

22:19

it's more of a buyer's market and

22:21

the seller's market. And that means that

22:23

the power up there has shifted from

22:26

Founders to the seas. And an hour

22:28

he did. Watch out for. Certain terms,

22:30

certain pitfalls, and certain types of fund raising,

22:32

and so forth. And so in. The A

22:34

was interested to hear her strike that tone

22:36

in a room that was so energetic and

22:38

so forth. But yeah, this is a fullback

22:40

more than Founders. I guess. Maybe to add

22:42

some rice? Both those. Yeah, I mean

22:44

I think clearly we can see that.

22:46

and it was the Sounders Market back

22:49

and Twenty Twenty Twenty Twenty One Odyssey.

22:51

That since I think pretty dramatically and

22:53

the know it's tough guy is a

22:55

tough thing for Founders and away at

22:57

stake. Here we are providing checks we

22:59

can't wait to get the money we

23:01

can't wait to value at a really

23:04

really high dollar amount and then to

23:06

go from that to. Sell.

23:09

Hundred million dollars in revenue. Fell

23:12

I don't know I it's like we talked. About

23:15

for sort of a whip last Tobias? Yes,

23:17

but it's a whiplash only from Vivid the

23:19

finance side and I think that's that's the

23:21

thing that I had that I really stuck

23:23

on because the people building stop are just

23:25

as busy as ever. I had a little

23:27

session called brain Date which is new to

23:29

the current events I think a bit of.

23:31

Third, Party service areas. It's a way

23:33

to like set up. Small shots

23:36

of people's what I did a brain date

23:38

with Three Sanders and I'm not going to

23:40

go through what is whether was working on

23:42

because we take two months but they're not

23:44

slowing down. They're. All going straight

23:47

ahead thinking about their market, their

23:49

model, their products, and so you

23:51

know, I wish there was we'd

23:53

like shot which sounds or energy in the

23:55

same will be contract venture capital though as

23:57

as as I wonder how often those two.

24:00

It's a fun activity. Capital Story is

24:02

just a slot image of what the

24:04

market really is. Very true. Very sad.

24:06

Because I think there's a lot of great started out

24:08

there that are probably not even trying. To Raise

24:10

venture you money right? Let's be real here.

24:12

I mean there are some have been like,

24:14

you know what? I've seen, what's happened the

24:16

other side, apps and car seats, being poor

24:18

that the last minute and he now fighting

24:20

for your life as a result and you

24:23

know I I don't wanna give up all

24:25

my equity to an investor that may desert

24:27

me next time I want to raise money.

24:29

So I mean. Honestly, I'm not trying to

24:31

bass he sees at all. I'm just saying

24:33

that you know I to. I think that.

24:35

What? Has happened over the past couple of

24:38

years as also just made some people realize

24:40

okay maybe there are other ways to grow.

24:42

You. Don't necessarily have to be venture backed.

24:45

To be successful oh yeah I know if

24:47

I'd rather see was be advised the one

24:49

of my daughters of my little session gave

24:51

to another founder who's the about his marketing

24:53

and go to mark the most news like

24:55

you don't need Vc where you live out

24:57

his one inch and I it was it

24:59

was really brave or the table right Listen

25:01

to them and help one another thousand and

25:03

the sun. Now that was probably find other.

25:05

I'm area I think starts a really cool and

25:07

so it's fun to be in a room with

25:09

tons of founders. I mean even to this day

25:12

at all these years of you and I cover

25:14

in this space you know that little bit of

25:16

jazzed you get you touch with under whose really

25:18

excited about and building. Yeah, yeah, it's

25:20

contagious I would say. probably for me

25:22

and As and covering science for very

25:24

long time. Off and on right for

25:27

it since the.com boom and bust. Don't

25:29

think the reason I've always still been

25:31

drawn to covering start ups is that

25:33

they represent hope and a lot of

25:35

ways. Re: hope for change, hope for

25:37

improvements, hope for a better world. Any

25:39

debt you know Panam corny haired that

25:42

you know? Yeah, we've had some bad

25:44

players, we've had some bombs, we the

25:46

has a lot of class and burns,

25:48

but they're still fundamentally. There

25:50

is hope that there is a startup

25:52

it's gonna come along and says really

25:54

chains of ways something. Is happening. whether

25:56

it's Us market every way people are living

25:59

their lives or him luckily or whatever. So

26:01

that that's why on start us I

26:03

mean of his onstage with silly know

26:05

earlier and they wanted once disrupt two

26:08

thousand and twenty one i think which

26:10

was a remote disrupt if you recall

26:12

we it i away from Alabama which

26:14

was not really slows durian person let

26:16

me tell you all day was easier

26:19

on the trouble budget. So

26:22

see her somebody one, she's the

26:24

confederacy else and. It's. Just

26:27

like. Hear her talk

26:29

about how we're going to do targeted

26:31

therapies almost and the individual level for

26:33

what works for you and the different

26:35

bottlenecks they're running into it housing other

26:38

market size was Tam an electoral? You

26:40

couldn't help it. Get excited about what's

26:42

going to exist in thirty years or

26:44

what would become normalized and thirty years

26:46

when it comes to medical staff. And

26:49

that is the power of new companies

26:51

trying new things. Say I'm reading here

26:53

with very little voice Last and until

26:55

I retired, but I am spiritually Sansa

26:58

rejuvenated, Allentown I can see. Yeah,

27:00

that's awesome, that's great are a lot

27:02

to leave it there but don't fear

27:04

Equity will be back on Monday or

27:06

let me rephrase that. Alex will be

27:08

back with Equity on Monday through. Until

27:12

then you can find me on Accent.

27:14

They area writer Alex on acts at

27:16

Alex and Equity under the handle Equity

27:18

Pod on Acts and Thread. And don't

27:20

forget to check out our sister show

27:22

Sound which is a deep into the

27:24

story behind. Started with the founders who

27:26

built them. Thanks for listening. Fi.

27:31

Equity is hosted by myself, Alex Wilhelm

27:34

and Secular. Seen a reporter marry and

27:36

as that else we are produced by

27:38

Theresa Low. Can solo was editing by

27:40

Tell Price Durbin is or illustrator and

27:42

a big thank you to the audience

27:44

development seems and Henry Picky about who

27:46

manages secular audio products. Thank you so

27:48

much for listening and will talk to

27:50

you next time.