0:26

This movie has no quotes page and no tagline, A

0:32

new film by Jane Campion. That's a tagline I'm seeing here on the, on the, on the poster.

0:38

Right? And then there's a pull quote that says spectacular.

0:40

It's a movie quite unlike any other.

0:42

You're likely to see sweetie, as an original it's from Vincent campaign Can

0:45

be the legend. He was right.

0:48

Could I have taken an extra two minutes to look for other places where there's maybe a quote?

0:53

Not on IDB. Yeah. Maybe I could have, I

0:56

don't know. I don't know. That's where it should be though.

0:59

Yeah. I'm not seeing any tags.

1:03

I mean, this is the first time we've had a movie that has neither.

1:06

We've had movies before with no quotes page, but very few, like, like two or three in total.

1:12

I remember when we Built out the quotes page, this one has Got

1:15

lines. This one has got lines.

1:18

Yeah. Official selection can 1989.

1:20

That's a tagline on one of these posters.

1:24

I got one. This is from sinema-fanatic.com.

1:25

And

1:25

they

1:25

do

1:25

a

1:25

movie

1:25

quote

1:25

of

1:25

the

1:30

day.

1:30

And

1:30

here

1:30

was

1:30

their

1:30

movie

1:30

quote

1:30

of

1:30

the

1:30

day

1:30

at

1:30

some

1:35

point.

1:35

What

1:35

if

1:35

it

1:35

does

1:38

die? What?

1:39

The podcast?

1:41

Well, we'll get another one.

1:43

Yeah, but this is all podcast Country.

1:49

Yeah. I don't know.

1:50

I,

1:50

the

1:50

accent

1:50

was

1:53

bad. I did a bad job. It wasn't prepped. I don't know.

1:56

I don't have to tell you.

1:58

Great. Start to a great app graph.

1:59

Look, it's a good keep on going, But

2:03

an absolute failing of the IMDP community, A

2:08

website that's never done anything wrong.

2:10

No. And look, this podcast is not going to die.

2:11

The roots grow really strong. They can split conduit.

2:16

There You go.

2:16

Hello

2:18

everybody. This is blank. Check with Griffin and David I'm Griffin.

2:20

I'm David.

2:23

I'm realizing now, you know this thing where people are logging podcasts on DB.

2:28

I think really like, like what does that mean?

2:32

Yeah. Okay.

2:34

Yeah. Like a podcast is like a TV show and then every episode is like an episode and they add them to people's time.

2:39

DV credits. There's a blank check I'm DB page now.

2:42

And someone should start building out that quotes page.

2:46

Oh God, here it is on my MDB page.

2:50

Right? You got the credit.

2:52

But I think they're the only singular episode listed, praying with anger wide.

2:58

Then no other episodes filled out.

3:02

Well, someone got on that. Not me though.

3:03

Not Me. Not Me.

3:05

No, Thank you.

3:06

This is a podcast about demographies directors who have massive success early on in their careers and are given a series of blank checks, make whatever crazy passion products they want.

3:14

Sometimes those checks clear and sometimes they bounce, sweetie.

3:18

Very

3:21

good. That was a little, that was a little drug.

3:22

It's a mini series on the films of Jane Campion.

3:25

It is called the podcast.

3:29

Yanno, The

3:32

podcast DNO I

3:39

only could hear it when David said it.

3:41

Sorry.

3:43

I think visually it's going to track today.

3:47

We're talking about her second feature film.

3:50

Her first one that was intended purely theatrical, which is called sweetie and returning to the show co-creator of a search party.

4:02

Let's

4:02

start

4:02

by

4:02

that

4:04

bliss. Hi.

4:06

Hi Sarah.

4:08

I feel shy.

4:11

All of a sudden you feel shy. Yeah. Th this happened last time.

4:14

I think too, like when you introduced me, I was like, oh, Then

4:19

you clam up. Right? The pressure is on.

4:20

It's not like the wild west of the first couple of minutes where you haven't been introduced yet.

4:25

You can say anything, but it doesn't count a Little

4:28

pickle here In the little giggle, scattered giggles right off the bat.

4:33

I just want to say there were, there were two big texts that happened in the blank check text thread.

4:38

Last night. One is David sent us a video of, I

4:45

think, just a picture. Was it not, was it not like a live photo or something?

4:49

Was it just This photo? It might be a live photo.

4:51

It might have been a live photo. I don't want to tell tales out of school.

4:54

It was a live photo of his daughter, the boss, baby watching sweetie.

5:03

She did. I just had it on and she was transfixed by it, I think because it's so colorful.

5:08

She doesn't always pay attention if the TV is on.

5:12

But I think because it's just such a, you know, vibrant, stark looking movie, she was, she could not stop looking at it Transfixed

5:20

by Swedish. I mean, she's fully like locked then.

5:25

Yeah. You just said her name there. Which whatever, bleep It

5:27

out, bleep it out, bleep it out. Bleep it out.

5:29

Boss, baby boss, baby.

5:32

I saw this when I was a kid too clearly older than a baby, but my mom was watching it and I too was transfixed in a way that that really got under my skin.

5:44

So Yeah.

5:45

Chirping being varied, especially.

5:50

Yeah. Super bleak and disturbing.

5:52

And I, you know, but yeah, it's just funny to hear about your baby.

5:58

Also having the same reaction I did as a child.

6:03

How old were you? I think that I was, I think I want to say I was nine.

6:08

Like, I don't know. Yeah.

6:09

Something like that.

6:12

Th this movie has like the aesthetics of a children's film though.

6:16

Like it feels like a wall doll adaptation or something, you know?

6:20

Yeah. It's, it's got that odd energy.

6:24

Okay. So David sends us that text about the boss baby last night, and then this morning, Ben texts us.

6:33

Do you, do you want to read your text button?

6:37

Oh yeah, sure. I texted one of the best movies I've watched for this show.

6:45

Well, you said, well, I get it cause sweetie, for, Because

6:49

as we've said, David's daughter, the boss baby was transfixed by the movie.

6:55

And I said, I got it because sweetie fucks.

6:57

And that is the boss Benny.

6:59

It was kind of the boss, Benny having a moment and yeah, I just, this is what I'll say.

7:05

And we'll obviously get into it more.

7:07

I like weird abnormal characters, just like when shit's different.

7:13

And

7:13

so

7:16

refreshing. I just recently had watched back to back the new Marvel movies and then also kind of have regionally watched dune.

7:25

And I was just like, so Samy.

7:26

And then I put this on last night and I was like, man, I don't know.

7:30

This is just exciting and refreshing.

7:34

Yeah. You know, it's another thing. This movie has a, in comparison to the movies.

7:38

You just mentioned colors.

7:39

Oh, right.

7:42

That's true. Yeah.

7:44

That's all, all anyone can talk about in this movie is the colors, But

7:48

it is wild. Like you watch this and you're just like, man, everything looks so fucking boring.

7:52

Now I

7:56

also, so I saw this when I was a kid and then, and it stuck with me.

8:01

And then I believe that it was on the NYU list of movies to watch.

8:07

Like before you get there, you know, like a very long list of movies that are like, these are, these are important films to them.

8:14

Yes.

8:14

And

8:14

I

8:14

was

8:14

like,

8:14

looking

8:14

it

8:18

up. And I was like, oh my God, that movie that's Jane Campion.

8:22

Like, you know, I was just a child, you know, at the time didn't have any reference for the filmmakers and whatever.

8:29

So yeah. It just had to, it was like a, I've had a journey with the film, I think.

8:36

So it's like a movie that transfixed you when you were nine.

8:39

Yeah. Watching it over your mother's shoulder, it kind of sticks in your craw.

8:42

And then like decades later, you see it on a list recontextualize as important film.

8:50

Yes. And you realize that it's not like, oh, that's some odd movie that gave me a nightmare as a child.

8:54

That is actually a thing by a director I now know is taken seriously.

8:59

I mean, I think I mentioned this in the last episode, but my first time watching this movie, like my awareness that this movie was I, David, I want to imagine it was maybe a similar thing for you, but being like a criterion dork teenager.

9:14

Right? Sure.

9:14

And this an angel at my table, I think we're both fairly early releases and you're like charting what each month, you know, the new announcements are.

9:25

And a lot of times like that, that was the first I'd heard of some movie, especially if it was a more obscure or an earlier film in a major director's career.

9:34

So it's like, oh, I know what the cover of that movie is.

9:37

But sometimes criteria and has artistic interpretation does not necessarily convey the tone of a thing.

9:41

And then whatever the like short description is on the website.

9:46

Right. I just always assumed this movie like, oh, chaotic sister takes over house in life was more similar in tone to later Jane Campion movies.

9:56

Like

9:56

I

9:56

thought

9:56

it

9:56

was

9:56

in

9:56

that

9:56

vein,

9:56

a

9:56

friend

9:56

of

9:56

the

9:56

podcast

9:56

past

9:56

and

9:56

future

9:56

guests,

9:56

Alex

9:56

Ross

10:04

Perry. And I went to see some movie at Lincoln center and this was playing right afterwards.

10:08

And we were like, do I just stay for sweetie?

10:10

It was like, yeah, this Jane camp she's important.

10:12

We should see this. Right. And then like five minutes into it, turn to each other and said, I had no idea.

10:17

This was the tone of this thing.

10:18

Like even just the opening with the, the fucking a psychic reading, the tea leaves.

10:26

Yeah. It was just like this, this is what this movie is.

10:29

And, and just being pretty like phlegm expired in a, in a good way.

10:36

Yes. But It

10:38

is bizarre to watch this now, if with like the rest of her career in the back of your mind, I think versus like when this is her first major statement as a filmmaker.

10:51

Yeah. No, I, I, I know what you're saying because she becomes more of a whatever lush and sort of prestige director, although she's always weird.

11:01

I don't actually know how to totally click Claire.

11:04

It is unlike anything else she's made.

11:06

I suppose. Although I do think it's, it's sort of, of a piece with an angel at my table.

11:12

That's, that's, that's a much, very different movie, but they're both about being a young woman in some way, I guess, but it's this sort of shared thing.

11:22

It's like her only movie that could be fairly categorized as a comedy.

11:28

Yes. Well, It's an odd, I

11:32

think holy smoke is the other one.

11:33

Holy smoke is the one that's sort of very heightened.

11:36

That's the only reason I'm, I'm like holy smoke might have like a lot of sweetie energy in a weird way.

11:44

So we'll get to holy smoke. I don't know, SV, like, are you a Campion fan in general?

11:49

Like, do you, how do you feel about the whole After

11:53

I

11:53

like,

11:53

cause

11:53

I

11:53

was

11:53

like,

11:53

how

11:53

does

11:53

this

11:53

compare

11:53

to

11:53

her

11:53

other

11:58

movies? And I I've seen the, you know, the piano, the piano lesson, whatever, and the Piano

12:06

lesson.

12:10

And, but like, it's pretty vague in my head.

12:14

And then I was like, wait a minute. I haven't seen any of her other movies other than these two.

12:17

So I, and I like, again, knowing that Jane Campion is, is supposed to be important.

12:25

I have yet not seen her movies except for this one that is stuck with me.

12:30

And then when I think about the P the, the piano lesson, I it's like the thing that really sticks with me from that is the weird sex scenes and that kind of resonates in this.

12:44

Right. Absolutely.

12:44

And,

12:44

and

12:44

the

12:44

non-sex

12:44

scenes

12:44

as

12:49

well. I like this sort of weird, weird non-sex in this movie Griff for me, look, Jane Campion came into my life because when I was seven or eight years old, the piano came out.

13:00

Right. I probably just, I was seven. Right.

13:01

And that was the movie where I was like, vaguely aware of a grown-up movies.

13:05

At that point, I'm watching the Oscars, there's this movie called the piano.

13:09

Right. And I'm like, oh, okay. This is that like, it's like a music movie about someone who plays the piano.

13:13

And that was a movie that all adults had to see.

13:16

Right. Like, which is so funny to think about considering that this was a New Zealand director of little, you know, like very RD note, right.

13:25

Like, you know, suddenly made this big movie with American stars in it.

13:28

And it's like, yeah, well, we're all going to go see the piano.

13:31

And I just remember my mom being like, yeah, yeah.

13:34

You know, there's the piano on the beach.

13:36

And I, you know what, I can't explain the movie to you.

13:38

I can't even begin.

13:40

Yeah. Like, and that's how I feel like Jane can't be and goes for a lot of her movies.

13:45

And as much as she is a major filmmaker and has been for decades, she also has a filmography that's widely under seen because a lot of her movies come out and are greeted with skepticism, apart from the piano, like maybe bright star, like those are the, and now the power of the dog, I Guess

14:05

Brightstar got a little bit, Yeah.

14:08

It was not major, major as it should have been.

14:11

It was critically Beloved, but it did not break through

14:16

right. Not a lot of money, right.

14:18

Years younger than you. And my distinct memory was like, I think the English patient year was the first Oscars that I watched live, where it was the same thing where I'm like, okay, this is the grownup movie.

14:27

This is the one that every time they play a clip, everyone goes like, oh, oh my God.

14:33

And that's like, the year that the Weinsteins finally pull off the thing they had been working towards with the piano and other movies where it's like, now it's a blockbuster and it wins every category, right?

14:44

Versus like piano gets these three big wins.

14:48

It gets screenplay. And the two actress wins, but that movie more than anything, it's like a, it becomes one of the sort of totemic like art house, Oscar breakouts of the nineties and B it has these weird Oscar stats to it, which is like, she's only the second woman nominated for best director ever.

15:06

And a pack, the second youngest person to ever win best supporting actress.

15:10

That's that will these kind of reputation more than anything.

15:14

But I also saw, you know, Criterion's now finally releasing movies on a 4k.

15:19

And I saw someone online defending it, being like, well, the thing that's great about criterion is they're putting 4k releases out of movies that otherwise are really obscure and would have been forgotten, like the piano.

15:30

And I was like, you don't understand how large the shadow was of the piano throughout the entire nineties, the shadow.

15:37

But it was unlike her other movies couldn't come out from it, you know?

15:42

But like, it was, it was a huge fucking deal.

15:46

As you said, David felt like a movie that was like mandatory viewing for all intellectual parents.

15:53

Right. Had to see the piano. So that's why it's funny to come back around yes.

15:58

To this early work. And you're like, oh, this is like, like having, like, what if your big sister was this like horny, Poltergeist like that you couldn't get rid of.

16:08

Like, and it's so audacious in a plot way as well, where like the movie is called sweetie.

16:16

It's extensively. Like the, as you, you might, maybe you read the back right.

16:20

The DVD box. And it says like, oh, it's about her sister bothering her.

16:23

And you watch it for like 25 minutes. And you're like, where's her sister.

16:26

I don't get this. This is about like a mousy girl.

16:29

Who's like steals away a sort of a dumb guy.

16:32

Like, I don't even know what you're, you know, like, there's nothing about this movie that really obeys how movies are supposed to work.

16:39

And it's all the better for it.

16:42

I think The point David, the first 25 minutes, I'm sitting there going, do I misremember what this movie's about?

16:48

I thought it's about a sister now has the sister not entered?

16:51

But so much has happened in the first 25 minutes.

16:53

She has her fortune told she realizes her coworker who just got engaged.

16:58

It's actually the man she's destined to love.

17:00

She steals him, makes out with him under a car and the relationship goes cold.

17:04

They're treated They're

17:06

already in trouble. Right, right.

17:07

Time by the time sweetie shows So

17:10

react story of their relationship before sweetie enters.

17:15

It's a lot of pressure to plant a tree.

17:17

Like your like, relationship I've relate to that, especially because it was founded upon omens.

17:25

And sure. It's like the first sign of the Trina being healthy.

17:29

It's like, how are they not going to get in their heads about it?

17:32

It's just, It is wild how fast this movie moves and how much it goes through.

17:38

Yeah. I, I watched, I watched this movie twice in the last 24 hours cause I watched it with commentary once.

17:45

Cool. I was just very curious to hear how she talks about This

17:49

music. Just her, or is it like her and Jared Gerard Lee or something And

17:54

the DP and then draw, it really shows up 30 minutes in like sweetie crashing the commentary and changes the whole flow of, I

18:03

did like minimal minimal research, but she and Gerard Lee had been in a relationship before they wrote the movie, which is, you know, pretty, pretty weird.

18:12

They hadn't been in a relationship and the movie is based on his family, but she kind of muddles that by debt, dedicating it to her sister, which makes, which makes you think it's about her.

18:25

But she was like, no, my sister had just been going through a lot of shit.

18:28

So I was kind of dedicated to The

18:30

thing she says in the commentary is a Campion's mother has like a horrible depression.

18:36

Yes. At the end of shooting this movie in the last couple weeks, her mother has a suicide attempt and her sister like packs up her life and goes to tend to her mother.

18:48

So the Campion can finish making the movie.

18:50

So that's the main reason the sister gets the dedication.

18:53

But it Also makes the context of the movie.

18:56

Of Course, of course.

18:58

When you hear that, you also wonder is the movie perhaps a little bit more about her relationship with her mother than it is about her relationship with her sister?

19:06

Because she's like, my sister is more gregarious than I am, but both of us are pretty grounded, pragmatic people, But

19:13

she does admit, and there's, this is in our dossier, Griff.

19:17

Like she knows she's being a little cheeky with the dedication because she knows how people are going to take that.

19:22

She knows how it's going to come off.

19:24

But I do think like this is obviously a heightened thing, but it is something that happened to Gerard.

19:32

That's his name? Right.

19:34

Gerard

19:34

Lee,

19:34

but

19:34

it's

19:34

his

19:34

brother

19:34

and

19:34

they

19:34

changed

19:34

the

19:34

sex

19:34

of

19:34

the

19:34

sibling

19:34

or

19:34

whatever,

19:34

like

19:34

which

19:34

something,

19:34

which

19:34

is

19:34

something

19:34

can't

19:34

be,

19:34

and

19:34

didn't

19:34

want

19:34

to

19:34

do

19:34

all,

19:34

everything

19:34

you

19:34

read

19:34

about

19:34

the

19:50

development. This movie does not conform with what you think, watching a movie Like

19:54

at all. Did she want it to be two Brothers?

19:56

I guess so I think she, she was worried that it would come off odd to have it be about women, but now she's like, yeah, that movie's great.

20:03

So whatever. Yeah.

20:05

I mean, and, and like she becomes a fan of Gerard Lee through his writing.

20:10

He had already had some published work.

20:13

Then they meet when she's in film school, they link up, they start dating pretty quickly.

20:20

They make the short film together, her second short, which, why am I forgetting the passionless moments?

20:27

Which is very much his sense of humor and his, the one other thing in her body of work that I think is pretty similar to this.

20:33

But it's like black and white, very voiceover heavy.

20:36

It's a series of sort of vignettes of odd moments in people's lives, interactions and stuff.

20:42

So they make that together.

20:43

They live together. She said the relationship progressed very quickly.

20:47

They moved in together almost immediately.

20:48

And then it sort of like organically came to an end.

20:52

Okay, Sure. He seems like an intense dude, like you're saying Incredibly

20:57

good terms.

20:59

Right? So that's her second short.

21:01

Then she makes the third short, a girl's own story.

21:04

Then those three shorts and two friends.

21:07

They're her TV movie debut go to, can she sort of anointed as like, this is the next great director.

21:14

There's the quote.

21:15

I'm sure you want to read David.

21:18

said to Philip Adams, head of the Australian film commission, you must give her lots of money.

21:23

So she'll be in competition with the feature film.

21:25

In two years, he basically went to the head of Australian movies and said, like fund this woman's next movie.

21:31

And I can come back.

21:33

I really like the con film festival was like, she is important if she does not come back here is, is a societal failing.

21:40

The wildest fucking thing is that her initial intent was for the piano to be her first movie, which at the time SV was supposed to be called the panel lessons.

21:51

So You were right.

21:52

You were right. So You were right.

21:57

You were right. You were right. You were right.

21:58

All I, you know, it's it's it's that?

22:00

I was like, okay, there's the piano.

22:03

And then there's the, I was like a piano teacher.

22:05

And then there's the pianist.

22:07

So many that I was like, ah, the piano, The

22:12

trilogy, it's the, it's the piano trilogy Keys

22:16

trilogy. It's it's wild.

22:18

That it's like, that was her first day.

22:20

She has this incredibly Like,

22:22

they're all very important film. Sorry.

22:24

Yeah. Yeah. It's an odd, like important for an art house trilogy.

22:29

Yeah, no, it's just wild that she, like out of the gate had that idea in her head and it was more that she was like, there's that?

22:42

And then there's sort of like doing the earliest stages of what would become Angela, my terrible, right.

22:47

Doing some sort of Janet frame adaptation And

22:53

those things were on the table. Right, right.

22:55

But she starts writing piano. First piano lesson she's Been

22:59

working on She's noodling on Janet frame.

23:02

She has this heat from con and her logic to it is to some degree, like, I don't know if they'll, let me make a movie like this later in my career.

23:12

I mean, in different interviews, she said different things that make it sound like there were a lot of different factors that went to decision, but she was like, this might be the one moment in my career where I can make a very strange, low budget, totally off putting comedy.

23:26

If I do the prestige movie, now, AI might not be ready for it.

23:30

And B it will be harder for me to come back around and make this odd thing.

23:34

Well, also it's like, people want a Jane Campion movie.

23:37

They want to see a Jane Campion movie right now later.

23:40

She can be like, okay, you didn't like sweetie, while I got a movie about you, Janet frame is that interesting?

23:46

And they'd be like, oh, well sure. I know who that, you know, like later you can hook them with a different hook, but right now she's just like, yeah, I'm going to make you a Jane Campion moving.

23:56

But Two other people on the, on the commentary are just like, I cannot believe the foresight.

24:01

You had to like, organize that in your brain and understand that many steps ahead, how to build your career.

24:07

And Campion says this thing about how, when she was a kid, other kids would call her up and they'd be like, Jane, can I, I could use your help.

24:15

I want to go to the pool today.

24:16

I have some homework to do. I want to go to the movies and she'd be like, okay, this is the order in which you do things that they would literally ask her for advice on how to organize their lives.

24:26

Well, she's, she's a smart lady, but yeah, she's with John hardly.

24:33

It's about being in a couple and the problem of being in love and not making Abel, you know, not having a relationship work, that's how she puts it.

24:43

Right? Like it's clear, they're clearly mining their own lives in this sort of weird love story.

24:48

And the tree is right from their relationship.

24:52

They had a tree growing in their backyard and he was obsessed over how they kept dying.

24:58

And she was like, I don't care about that.

25:00

I'm like working on my movies and my stuff, but I don't, I don't give a shit about the tree.

25:04

And that's why she like hits on the metaphor of like the strength of a tree, like this sort of, you know, and like the sort of frightening sight of a withering tree.

25:15

The other thing that's really interesting, the commentary is she is so fucking goofy, Like

25:21

when she's chatting yeah. The whole time.

25:23

And it doesn't feel like it's just because of this movie, but they keep on talking about how funny she is in general.

25:29

What's Sally bonkers. Like that's the director of photography who is kind of mysterious, only really shot this and disappeared Was

25:38

a film school. Compatriot of hers had a similar background, went to art school.

25:42

Yeah. This is a gorgeously photographed movie.

25:44

It's sort of odd that she didn't really pursue that career.

25:47

And she does apparently shoot Jane Campion's publicity photos to this day.

25:53

Yeah. That's where you see her name. But I just wonder what happened to her.

25:57

I mean, they don't say she does talk about like, she's a trivia fact as the first woman to shoot in Australian film.

26:05

Oh, wow. Oh, there you go. Right.

26:07

And that it, camping came to her and asked her to do it.

26:11

Like it was a very natural thing. And she was like, I felt acutely aware of the fact that none of my male film school classmates ever would have even considered me for that and that I wasn't thinking of myself that way either.

26:26

But with camping, it was like a very obvious natural thing.

26:29

There's a really interesting thing about the, this sort of development of her visual style here, where they're talking about how both of them really liked having lockdown shots without movement and loading as much into the frame as possible.

26:43

And having the frame change over, you know, as long static time where through motion, the composition of the frame can change dramatically.

26:51

And they're talking about all the philosophical reasons.

26:53

They like that and whatever. But the other thing they said was that there was only like so much equipment and all the guys at their film school were very competitive about trying to like sign up for who can rent out the cranes or the dollies or any of the other things to do these like incredibly complex moving shots.

27:11

And they were like, I don't want to fucking play that game.

27:14

We're never going to beat them at that.

27:17

We're never going to get our hands on the equipment.

27:18

Let's figure out how to make the most out of doing the opposite of what everyone else is doing.

27:23

And so I do think a lot of her being brought on to be the DP in this and everything is like sort of the two of them bonding in the foxhole, you know, to a certain extent.

27:36

And it also sounds like they were both similarly frustrated by how didactics so much a film school was and how much they were constantly being told.

27:44

Like, you have to do this. You can never do this both in terms of the visual language, in terms of screenwriting and everything.

27:50

And this movie is in many ways like them saying to all movie, right?

27:56

It's a rebellion to all movies, but it's also a movie about someone who refuses to conform to society and its rules, which is the thing that Campion says, like in her mind, all of her movies are about that.

28:07

She's fascinated by the idea of society and how we're told we're supposed to behave within it and how a natural that is when people push up against that in any way.

28:15

And this is the movie that is that both in, in like sort of text and in actual form.

28:22

It's, it's a, it's a very rich metaphor.

28:24

The whole idea of sweetie like is, is odd.

28:32

I, I don't, I don't know how else to put it, like the idea of your, your sister or your sibling or whoever, like someone who you are like, this person has a problem.

28:42

This person is messing with me and no one else being aware of it.

28:46

Like, I just love how outsize she is compared to everyone's reactions to her through most of them, you know what I mean?

28:52

Like, like she's, she's, she's so wild and only one person seems to really be bothered by that until, until the end, then, then more people get bothered by it, I guess.

29:05

But, So I think it's like, this movie is somewhat about the pains of, of trying to live in a society as a quote unquote logical person.

29:14

Right, right. She's Trying

29:16

to live by rules.

29:18

Right. She's trying to live by rules, but also the first act of this movie is her throwing herself out of her comfort zone and being like, what if I go to a psychic, what if I follow signs from the universe?

29:27

And that's not totally working for her either.

29:30

You know, Something

29:32

I loved is her relationship to the people, her coworkers, like obviously she steals the boyfriend away or a fiance.

29:40

But even like in the beginning, when they're like, do you want to look at the ring?

29:44

She's like, I'm not interested in that.

29:47

Like the way she says it is so abnormal and against societal rules.

29:52

I fucking Mike immediately in on this character.

29:55

Really my thing.

29:57

Yeah. I'm not really, that's not really my thing.

29:59

Like that is such a funny answer to that question.

30:03

She's as strangest, sweetie, just in a completely different way.

30:07

Yeah. Karen Colston is the actress playing.

30:10

Kay. She's so good. She's in multiple campaign movies as is Genevieve lemon.

30:15

Genevieve lemon.

30:18

Sorry, Jen. No, no Genevieve. Yeah.

30:20

I don't know. Genevieve lemon who is great.

30:21

And who, I think a lot of people in Australia know from other things as well, she was like on neighbors, which are the famous soap opera for, That

30:29

was her sort of breakout. And she'd done a lot of guests starting parts on Australians to coast.

30:35

be good friends.

30:39

That's the theme song to neighbors.

30:41

You know, the neighbors, neighbors is a huge deal in Britain.

30:47

That's really, you know, that I grew up on nation only.

30:54

And beyond that, I wasn't a member of the neighbors society, which was a university society that I belong to.

31:01

You paid five pounds to enter.

31:03

Our only platform was that neighbors should be played in the student union any time that neighbors is on the air, which was like twice a day, like 12 and five or something like that.

31:13

And we success, which we succeeded in that.

31:16

And then we had thousands of pounds because everyone decided to join the neighbor society.

31:21

And we, we threw a huge party on the beach.

31:24

Wow. I mean, I was barely involved in any of this, but it did all happen.

31:29

That's nice. You didn't, You didn't pocket it.

31:32

You, you spread the love, Right?

31:35

Yeah. Well, good neighbors become good friends.

31:38

Neighbors much like home in a way is the other big Australian.

31:41

So, but neighbors is one of those soaps that it's like, it's like porn with the sex cutout.

31:47

Like it's just sort of this very strange heightened world.

31:50

The dialogue is very bizarre.

31:52

You know, like it's just sort of a cult fascination in Britain neighbors.

31:55

Anyway, when else am I going to sing the neighbors song on this podcast?

32:02

The

32:02

phone's

32:06

ringing. I'm going to pick it up. Click.

32:08

Hello.

32:08

Sort

32:08

of

32:08

a

32:08

funky

32:08

baseline

32:08

is

32:08

playing

32:08

a

32:18

slab. Whoa, who's this?

32:19

Oh

32:19

my

32:24

God. Is it famed? Nineties comedian, Jerry Seinfeld.

32:26

Well,

32:26

no,

32:26

you

32:26

know

32:32

what? I did see you had a special on Netflix.

32:34

Not that long ago. Right?

32:39

I only on Netflix.

32:41

There's a Lenny girls. Love B-movie Was

32:44

called 23 hours to kill.

32:46

Wow. I really had to search for that.

32:48

They

32:52

do. They do. They're always going crazy for being movie.

32:54

Well, anyway, it's nice to hear from you, Jerry.

32:56

W what are you talking about? Gimmicks here.

32:58

Yeah. Yeah. You hear about these gimmicks and mattress companies.

33:02

Oh, mattress gimmicks.

33:04

You're

33:04

talking

33:04

about

33:04

these

33:04

mattress

33:04

companies

33:04

that

33:04

put

33:04

any

33:04

kind

33:04

of

33:04

topper

33:04

on

33:04

them

33:04

or

33:04

give

33:04

you

33:04

a

33:04

heavy

33:04

blanket

33:04

or

33:12

something. It's all lipstick on a pig.

33:14

If

33:14

you're

33:14

sleeping

33:14

on

33:14

a

33:14

terrible

33:14

mattress,

33:14

your

33:14

sleep

33:14

will

33:14

be

33:18

terrible. And I know it's funny. And that's why you, one of the world's most famous comedians is here to talk about it.

33:24

That's why I showed up because this premise is so funny.

33:27

It could only be presented by an incredible observational comedian.

33:30

No mere copy ad writer could come up with a premise of this funny, Jerry,

33:35

I have somebody to tell you, I have a recommendation.

33:37

I

33:37

recommend

33:37

sleeping

33:37

on

33:37

a

33:37

purple

33:37

mattress

33:37

because

33:37

only

33:37

purple

33:37

mattresses

33:37

have

33:37

the

33:37

gel

33:37

flex

33:43

grid. That's a super stretchy ultra squishy material that adapts and flexes around pressure points and doesn't retain heat, David.

33:52

Yeah. That is the least funny thing I've ever heard.

33:54

There's no joke here.

33:56

The gel flex grid is amazingly supportive for your back and legs while cushioning your shoulders, neck and hips, no matter how you sleep.

34:02

Okay. Nothing funny about that.

34:04

And unlike memory foam, which hilariously remembers everything, Right?

34:09

Pretty Funny, pretty funny.

34:11

The gel flex grid means that purple mattresses bounce back as he move in shift.

34:15

You never have that. I'm stuck feeling people get with memory foam.

34:18

Sometimes

34:18

I

34:18

see

34:18

a

34:18

mattress

34:18

that

34:18

go,

34:18

it's

34:18

a

34:22

Stoker. It's a staggered.

34:25

Yeah. These bouncy purple mattresses. They've got this crazy grid.

34:27

You got, you got one coming to you.

34:30

Griff. I think I have a mattress coming to me.

34:33

I look, I'll be honest.

34:35

I've had a hard time sleeping recently because the mattress I have right now is, is too funny.

34:41

These gimmicks are too funny that I do not get a good night's sleep.

34:45

And I want to just be soothed and relaxed.

34:47

I'm sorry to interrupt, but I'm getting pretty worried here.

34:50

Why are you worried? Well, I can't make any observations about this.

34:53

Purple mattress. Usually have good to find a comedic angle into anything, but there's nothing funny about the purple.

34:59

There's nothing funny.

35:00

You can try it. Risk-free with free shipping and returns, there's financing available to look it's it's, it's straight down the middle of serious stuff.

35:08

Neighborhood, a movie about Pop-Tarts.

35:10

I can't find a single angle on the purple mattress.

35:14

Okay. Look, Jerry, getting a great night's sleep starts with having a great mattress.

35:17

So get a purple mattress. Go to purple.com/check 10 and use code check 10.

35:22

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35:31

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35:39

Yeah. Can I plug something quickly?

35:41

Yeah, go ahead.

35:46

It's not new. It's mid two thousands.

35:49

They

35:52

do. They're always doing beams At

35:56

SV. Yes. You saw this movie as a child.

35:59

Yes. You rewatch this movie when you're going to NYU or did you just note it on the list?

36:04

I'm pretty, I, I re I'm like, did I have your watch or did I just watch the trailer to be like what there were?

36:11

So I think, I think this is what happened that I watched the trailer because I was like, I can't, I can't watch all these movies.

36:17

And so let me see which ones, like whatever.

36:20

And then I watched a trailer and I was like, oh, what's that movie?

36:22

And I think I was also like, I don't want to watch it again.

36:26

And then I also think that it scenes were brought up in classes at one point.

36:31

Like, I know that I've revisited it a couple of times, but not like fully until watching it for again for this and really had to, like, That

36:41

was my big question. Right? Like, how does this movie compare to your memory of it as a child, as a thing that's kind of haunted you.

36:49

Yeah. That's, you know what it's so the movie's so primal that there are still things about it that affected me in the same way that it's like, it just gets in you in this kind of way that as a child, I didn't understand what was making me so uncomfortable.

37:07

And then as, you know, adult, it was like, oh, okay.

37:11

It's these family dynamics that are like impossible to break and, you know, everyone's sort of falling apart and that really touch on like the shadow of, of, of what families can become and be, and feeling, feeling like just an icky penis again, like, I, I both times feeling icky this time, I would say it was like, I'm not, I don't think I'm actually enjoying watching this, but I'm feeling like I know that it's really good.

37:54

It's like, I don't feel like I want to necessarily recommend this to people, but, but I, but you have to like, it's, it's definitely good.

38:09

And like moving in a way that has stuck with me both times, or however many times I've watched it.

38:17

It is an odd watch. Like it does make you feel physically strange watching this movie.

38:25

I like, I found myself being like, how much more of this, you know, you'd be like checking the timeline, even though like, I was fully appreciating it the whole time being like, ah, And

38:37

the end is so particularly upsetting.

38:39

If you've seen it before, you're kind of watching it spread, knowing where you're going to end up.

38:44

Yeah. Even watching it the first, first time as a kid, I remember feeling like that, that scene really stuck in me.

38:50

I was like, and I was like, oh my God. It's like, when I, when I like rewatched the trailer or whatever it was for film school, I was like, oh, it's that movie where she's jumping up and down in the tree house naked and covered in crap.

39:03

You know? Like, it's just like, yeah.

39:05

And like, you know, I picked up on like the weird sexual dynamics too, between like, you know, how it's, you know, something that really disturbs me in any movie is like adults who are children.

39:20

Or like, like boys really disturbs me, like anything that I like, the adult is actually a child inside or like the child is an adult.

39:30

And like, you know, the, like the reveal is that the person you thought was a child is actually an adult or a Benjamin button or whatever, that stuff really, really disturbs me.

39:40

I'm kind of now just as I'm talking about it, I'm like, I wonder if this was the origin of that, but she, but like when she's like, you know, bathing her father and you're like, what, what is this?

39:51

Now you're throwing this at me.

39:53

You know, I want to put a pin in the bathtub thing and circle back to that at some point, because of campaign setting, the commentary is really interesting about it.

40:00

But I do think, yes, this movie has the vibe of movies that like upset me as a child, but that I can possibly rewatch things that were in like cable rotation.

40:07

And I do think you're right, that a lot of them have to do with like, why is this adult acting like a child?

40:12

Whether that's like part of the premise of the movie, or it's just sort of a miss calibration where you're like, th th this is broken.

40:20

Like the tone of this is off.

40:22

This should be for me. And it's upsetting me.

40:24

And sweetie is the only one of the movies in that sort of zone with that feeling that actually isn't meant for children, but yet it like fucking captivates.

40:33

You and David's infant boss, baby.

40:36

Like, there's, there's something there.

40:40

I mean, what's her name?

40:42

Genevieve lemon on top of doing neighbors and the sitcoms and whatever had done a play in which he played a child.

40:49

And like, that was the thing that sort of brought her to them, their attention and said like, oh, this is if she could do that for the whole movie, that's what we need.

40:59

And there's the story of like the first day she's working with the actor, the little boy, he goes up to her, asked her, so are you a grownup or a kid?

41:08

Oh, wow.

41:09

And not as like, what are you playing?

41:12

But as a, like, I don't understand you.

41:16

Yeah. You are the size of a grownup.

41:19

Yeah. But you, so thoroughly seem to be a kid it's like unnerving, which is the whole central, like conflict of the movie really.

41:27

But like I, a movie, I talk about way too much that I'm obsessed with as sitting in the Mets, the Le the Wiz, which I had a very similar relationship to where I like watch that when I was a child, that was a, why does this make me so uncomfortable?

41:40

And I felt very haunted by it.

41:43

And then like 12 years later or whatever, I start watching all the New York, seventies, Sidney Lumet movies.

41:49

And I'm like, this guy is the fucking best. What else did he make in the seventies?

41:52

He made the whiz, what the fuck are you talking about?

41:56

So then I rewatched the Wiz to see how it fits into like my nightmare memories of it.

42:02

And then it's more confusing to try to go, like, how is it possible that this is the same person, but also how did I not put together the weird connections between these things, the way in which they do overlap.

42:15

It's just, this thing is so visually and totally different than, than everything else this person's ever made.

42:21

She

42:21

talks

42:21

about

42:21

in

42:21

the

42:21

commentary,

42:21

this

42:21

thing

42:21

about

42:21

how,

42:21

like

42:21

so

42:21

much

42:21

of

42:21

her

42:21

visual

42:21

style

42:21

and

42:21

this

42:21

movie

42:21

was

42:21

not

42:21

a

42:21

deliberate

42:21

thing,

42:21

that

42:21

it

42:21

was

42:21

sort

42:21

of

42:21

an

42:21

organic

42:21

process

42:21

with

42:33

her. And she keeps on saying like, I have no idea why I did that that way.

42:37

And then she goes like, I guess I probably, if I'm looking at it now, I would say, but you keep on talking about how there was no sort of like intentionality behind it.

42:45

It, she has this really interesting line to where she's talking about, like the frustrations of thinking that everything needs to fit into a clean three act structure and like film school, forcing her to read like Syd field and Robert McKee and shit like that.

43:02

And she was saying, Robert McKee apparently cites her movies often as a thing not to do.

43:09

Right. Well, that makes sense. This movie does not obey anything about story structure, like movie for a story structure.

43:16

It is, it is successful in spite of that, or it's successful because of that.

43:22

Like, that's up to you like to decide, I think it's successful either way, but like, certainly if I was like, I'm thinking like a sweetie plot structure, I don't know if I could pull that off.

43:32

Like for basically anything.

43:35

This is the thing she said that I was really fascinated by.

43:38

So like drug leads kind of like saying that like, and they talk about a lot how, like can't be, and seems very serious from her work, but is in fact a pretty light, funny, goofy person.

43:49

And Gerard Lee mostly makes comedic things and is like a very sullen kind of morose guy.

43:55

And that like, that's often the balance of how artists work sometimes, you know, is there can be an interesting inverse from their personality to their sensibilities in their work.

44:08

And that's part of why they work so altogether.

44:10

But they're talking about the fact that rod Lee's like really hard on himself about the fact that this movie does not conform to a three-act structure.

44:18

And she just w a, I don't think that's necessary.

44:20

And B I think we write that way to some extent, without thinking about it.

44:27

I think you're kind of fucked. If you sit down and you outline it and you go, it has to do this, and this has to happen by page 30 and whatever.

44:34

I think if you watch a lot of stuff and you internalize it and you know, the stories you want to tell, and you let those stories guide you, we do tend to organize things in this way.

44:42

And the analogy she comes up with is like, when we speak, we do not consciously think the next sentence I'm going to say needs to have a verb.

44:50

It needs to have a subject.

44:52

You know, I

44:54

couldn't agree more. I've had these thoughts myself.

44:56

You just kind of instinctually know how to make a story.

45:01

And literally when you're just telling retelling a story that happened to you, you don't, you self edit very quickly.

45:09

You don't grammatically process or plan out things in advance of when you're saying them, but you basically know how to speak as a person and will more often than not say a correct sentence, unless you're me who the fucking verbal diarrhea is all the time.

45:23

But she's saying that like, right, if you've watched enough stuff and you've gone to film school and you've made your own shit and whatever, it's not really helpful to sit down and force your script to fit into that box, that stuff's going to be in the back of your head to some degree.

45:39

And she was sort of arguing how the movie does fit into a three extra.

45:43

Yeah. I was going to say, it's like, it's like, it's not like you can't follow it or anything, you know, it's like, yeah, It's

45:48

three, it's like a nine X structure, but each axis right.

45:51

Is, is at least there's at least three acts if you want.

45:55

It's just, it's just the opening is, there's just two sort of sharp left turns in this movie.

46:02

Yeah. And those that's where the act breaks kind of are.

46:04

I guess, if you want to think about it that way, you know, I'm not too worried about it, but this movie just sort of transforms a couple of times and that's, that's as good a way as any, to tell a story.

46:16

I think like, and by when sweetie shows up as much as the first chunk of the film is sort of bewildering in its way like that, it moves so fast and that so much is happening.

46:27

You're also very ensconced with Kay, you're you're on her side.

46:32

Like, I think you need to be on her side when sweetie shows up, because otherwise you, it would not just seem as though it would just be like, well, this is a family of weirdos.

46:42

You know what? I also didn't like realize when I was first watching it or it like in the first, in the first part where before sweetie comes K is really childlike.

46:53

But I didn't, I didn't recognize that until sweetie comes.

46:57

I was like, oh, she's, she's also like, just has a rest and development as well.

47:02

And I didn't realize that until now that I see sweetie, When

47:07

Kay is so disturbed by the tree with the yellow leaves that they planted and can't stop talking about it.

47:13

And can't stop asking questions about like, why, you know, like, is this a problem?

47:17

And then her solution is to rip it up really out of its roots and then hide it in her room.

47:24

That is such a six-year-old decision.

47:27

Like, I feel like, you know what I mean?

47:29

Like when you're six and you're like, I broke something, how am I going to deal with this?

47:32

And it's not like, you know what, let me like, take it outside and put it in the trash.

47:34

It's like, they put it under my bed.

47:36

No, one's going to see it there for some reason, like, you know, that's just logical your, and if they ask you about it, you should just go.

47:43

I don't know. Yeah.

47:45

I don't know why it's there.

47:47

I don't know why Th

47:51

th this movie has such a specific visual style that, like I was listening to this commentary, assuming that she was going to break down like the math of everything she was doing.

48:01

Right. And she keeps on sort of like talking about how much of it was instinctual and then trying to sort of retroactively analyze what she must have been unconsciously doing at the time.

48:12

But the couple of things she keeps saying are like, Hey, right, the rebellion against film school and being taught, there's a right way to do everything and trying to test whether that's bullshit or not.

48:23

Right. But then a lot of her decisions were just very broad, general things where like, she's like, I didn't have a color palette for this movie.

48:30

There wasn't some key for what colors represented, what things I just thought there should be a lot of color in it.

48:36

Like I wanted that sort of like cartoonish energy throughout the whole thing.

48:41

And then the weird framing, like the focus of the shot is never at the center of the frame.

48:48

And if they're multiple focuses, they are at complete opposite ends of the frame.

48:52

And you have like shot, reverse shot coverage where both characters in their coverage will be in like the lower right-hand corner with all this negative space or some other weird object in the other quarter, all this sort of shit.

49:05

And she was like, Hey, I thought it was interesting.

49:07

And if I were to look at it now and try to think about what I was doing, I think it was from the very beginning, consistent throughout the entire movie, trying to create a sense of unease.

49:16

So you have the color and the sort of energy and the poppiness making this movie feel like it's a comedy, but I'm never going to let you get comfortable because every single frame is kind of unbalanced and quote unquote incorrect from how we're taught movies should look, which is just such a simple, but like obvious way to approach it.

49:37

You know, Honestly, it's kind of like, it's like a relief as a director being like, oh, you don't have to like overthink.

49:43

It was like, she was just like, I don't know. I just chose it this way.

49:46

And this is only guessed my subconscious was doing the work for me to make it feel uneasy or whatever, you know, and like how, as I was watching it, when you're talking about like a character being in one side of the frame or whatever, I like my film school.

50:00

I was like, are they crossing the line here?

50:03

Or is he just in the other frame?

50:05

Like, I can't cross the line, But

50:09

it's like, I don't even think they're crossing the line.

50:10

It's opposite of the language.

50:13

We're sort of used to of how these things look and feel and whatever, but it fucking doesn't matter.

50:19

It achieves the effect. She wants to putting you in the right Headspace to watch this movie.

50:23

And I do think so often, like she says this thing too, about how, and this was part of her sort of philosophy of having the camera locked down and having as much happen in one or two shots as possible within a scene or whatever.

50:40

But that like, she'd watch other film school.

50:42

People who would have like two really important shots in a sequence and then would want to shoot like three or four other setups of coverage just for insurance.

50:54

Right. And she was like, well, then you're just you're you don't have enough time for anything.

50:58

The two shots that actually matter, you're rushing, you're not getting them right.

51:02

Or the performances aren't right. And then you're getting a bunch of other shots that you don't need.

51:06

And I was like, what if I only spend my time on the shots that I actually do need?

51:11

And I take the time to make sure that they're as good as they possibly could be in every sense.

51:15

And she said, they do the dailies every day.

51:17

And she had a lot of like female crew members on this.

51:20

But it was still probably when you say a lot of female crew members would probably 15 to 20% female.

51:26

Right. And they would do these screens of the dailies at night and the crew and the men would like laugh really hard.

51:33

They'd be like, this is great. Oh my God, this is so good.

51:35

Should have shot more coverage though.

51:37

Like even when it was working, they still acted like she was doing something wrong by not giving herself the out to cut away from the weird thing she had chosen.

51:46

She was like, but it's working like you it's, you like it.

51:50

Like it, it fucking served its intent, But

51:55

some, and some of these shots, like there's the, the, with all the women are curling their hair at the same time.

52:02

I love that shot. There's the two Cowboys doing the weird dance together.

52:07

Yeah. Oh, that that scene is also so confused.

52:09

I'm like, wait, what? This is the, where did they go?

52:12

Like, I don't know.

52:13

You said, This is a thing that she likes a lot, but she did a Lot

52:18

in dancing Not

52:20

to go to see the mountains.

52:23

Oh sure.

52:23

It's

52:23

a

52:23

lot

52:23

of

52:23

weird

52:23

shit

52:23

going

52:23

on

52:23

in

52:23

New

52:29

Zealand. Especially I keep thinking about like, pre-internet New Zealand, you know, there's only so much you can fucking do Well,

52:36

it made it sound like it was a semi widespread thing that she liked a lot that she would do very often.

52:43

And then I think so That's

52:47

what they do there.

52:49

They're like, we're going on a vacation without sweetie.

52:51

And that's what they do. Right. That's, that's what that is.

52:54

It's like, you can't come to this weird thing.

52:59

Like The D dirt mound, hoedown.

53:01

I

53:01

mean,

53:01

the

53:01

mother

53:01

in

53:01

this

53:01

movie

53:01

is

53:01

a

53:01

country

53:01

Western

53:01

singer

53:01

who

53:01

had

53:01

never

53:01

acted

53:08

before.

53:08

And

53:08

she's

53:11

The dad too, that had never acted, right.

53:14

Like a background actor. I've never done like dialogue before She

53:19

just loved his eyebrows. He's got those nice dad brows.

53:23

But she also said that he showed up on set and he had like memorized all the dialogue.

53:27

And he was like, so am I supposed to say it like a poem?

53:30

A what?

53:33

Like a poem.

53:35

Right? He was like, how am I supposed to say this? And it wasn't like he was looking for line readings.

53:38

He was like, I don't know how people talk on Canberra fair.

53:41

I wouldn't know.

53:43

And then the kid, she said, like, he, his parents worked so hard to get him memorized that he showed up on set and he knew every line backwards and forwards, but only as one continuous trunk, like he only learned his rinds.

53:58

And

53:58

she

53:58

said

53:58

like,

53:58

do

53:58

you

53:58

know

53:58

your

54:02

lines? And he did the whole thing.

54:03

And she had to like work to break it into pieces because he couldn't separate the lines in his mind while she did a fantastic 'cause.

54:12

I love this kid.

54:13

He

54:13

was

54:16

great. He's this best? He's like by a truck.

54:18

He's just so rambunctious.

54:21

There's a really nice thing on the Blu-ray too with the, the two lead actresses who like have remained best friends to this day, like metal on this movie and love each other.

54:32

Jennifer

54:32

lemon

54:32

was

54:32

saying

54:32

that

54:32

like,

54:32

she

54:32

loved

54:32

to

54:32

sing

54:32

on

54:32

set

54:32

and

54:32

she

54:32

would

54:32

like

54:32

do

54:32

it

54:32

and

54:32

all

54:32

the

54:41

downtime. And then Campion started saying like, while they were setting shots, can you do another song for me?

54:47

Can you do that one? I'm just like stressed out.

54:50

Can you do the song and would make her perform or perform for the entire crew, like multiple times a day.

54:55

And the two of them would do these songs together.

54:57

And it was like, oh, she's like, humoring me.

55:00

And how much of a ham I am that I like to do this.

55:03

And then like, whatever it is, four or five years later, they're doing the piano.

55:08

Right. Both of them are working on that movie as well.

55:11

And she noticed that like with Anna Paquin, who's what nine at the time, while they're setting up shots, she keeps on saying like, Anna Paquin, can you like do a song?

55:21

Can you like, do a routine for everyone?

55:23

Can you do like a handstand or something?

55:26

And then she was like, oh, I thought she was humoring me as a performer.

55:30

She was treating me the way she was later.

55:33

We're going to treat this child, which is, it is helpful to have them do a thing, to get a lot of their energy out of their system and then make them focus right before the take takes.

55:43

That's a good trick, David.

55:45

Yeah, what's up.

55:47

I want to do an exercise with you quickly.

55:50

Okay. I love to exercise. Put down this hand weights.

55:53

I'm not talking that kind of exercise. I'm talking about a mental exercise.

55:58

Okay. All right. I'll, I'll pick up my, my brainwaves.

56:02

We'll just close your eyes and put your fingers to your temples, like professor X.

56:07

Okay. And I want you to run your, your little noggin through this scenario or run it through your noggin rather.

56:13

Okay. I want you to imagine that you're a filmmaker shooting a comedy about the end of the world, the twist.

56:23

It's a hahaha movie about a cry, cry subject.

56:27

Okay.

56:29

Aye. Aye. Aye. Look, this is this too big, a total mashup to, for me to handle.

56:34

I'm not done. There's another wrinkle here at the time that this is Happening.

56:37

You're making the movie.

56:40

Sure. Right. Ha ha movie about a cry, cry subject.

56:42

It feels like the world is really ending.

56:45

What are you doing?

56:47

Oh my God. I, I would love to hear all about that crazy situation.

56:52

Cause it's, it's just too much for me to handle.

56:55

The only way you could cope in a situation like that is commissioning a official podcast about the behind the scenes making of that process, right?

57:05

Yeah. Well, you know me, I like to process everything through your podcast.

57:07

So yes, Of course. Right.

57:09

We exclusively live on microphone and that's the story of the last movie ever made.

57:13

It's an official podcast about the making of don't look up, which is a little movie that's on Netflix that I feel like I'm glad we're promoting it because no, one's talking about this thing online.

57:23

I Believe it's their most watched movie ever.

57:26

I'm throwing sticks, I'm throwing sticks and I'm going someone give me any opinion on don't look up and everyone's just kind of going like, what is this?

57:32

I've never heard of this. Look,

57:34

this podcast documents.

57:36

What happened with Anna McKay brought hundreds of cast and crew to Boston to make a movie in the middle of the pandemic.

57:41

Not just any cast. It's not just any Cast.

57:43

No we're talking. Leonardo DiCaprio, Jennifer Lawrence, Meryl street, Tyler Perry, Jonah hill, Timothy Shalla Mae Kate Blanchett, Rob Morgan, kid Cuddy, Ariana Grande day by day.

57:56

They're making a satire about social collapse by night.

57:58

They're isolated in hotel rooms, watching society collapsed on the nightly news, recording their reactions in real time.

58:05

Ha ha cry, cry. I do want to just quickly say that in the ad copy.

58:08

They sent us, there is a hyperlink after Timothy shall amaze name that says pronunciation and brackets and it links to a clip of him and Daya playing quote duner or later on Cole bear show.

58:21

So I appreciate that helpful hint and also just a fun excuse to watch duner or late.

58:28

I'm going to watch it. Yeah, I'm going to watch it later.

58:30

Look. That's the last movie ever made.

58:32

Okay. And the first two episodes came out on January 7th.

58:35

They're out now on apple, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts.

58:41

Yes. It's the last movie ever made.

58:44

Yeah. Out now, cracker go check it out.

58:47

Should we talk the plot of sweetie?

58:52

You know, not, not as, as you're saying, not entirely conventional, but this first chunk I do find If

59:00

not, yeah. There's a lot of story.

59:02

Yeah. Or waiting is maybe not, but like it's very engrossing watching this odd person.

59:07

K yeah. Navigate being a grown-up kind of badly, but sort of you're still with her.

59:15

Oh

59:18

wow. I'm looking at I'm DB, Griffin.

59:20

The story that, you know, how MTV has those, like those, those little key words that they put for every movie.

59:28

Yes. Yes. So here are the top five for sweetie male, full frontal nudity.

59:31

Tree-planting mouth to mouth.

59:34

Death of sister riding, man like a horse.

59:39

Hell yeah.

59:41

That's a great tag.

59:41

Wait, I want to follow that.

59:44

I want to see where that leads me under that tag.

59:50

Two things can't be and says very casually in the commentary one.

59:54

She likes to have characters, take their clothes off and every movie a possible cause she, she wants like vulnerability and she wants like people in their most awkward sort of open states with each other and to, she likes if possible to fit in at least one moment of a main character going to the toilet and every movie for some reason, Keep

1:00:16

it real. She just keeps it real.

1:00:18

That's what it is. Right.

1:00:20

But her DP, excuse me, I keep forgetting her name.

1:00:23

She's got a great name. And her name is Sally bonkers.

1:00:27

Sally bonkers was saying how radical radicalized, like all the male crew members felt when this guy just casually takes his Dick out on set.

1:00:35

And that all the female crew members were like, do you understand how many times we see female nudity in movies?

1:00:41

That this is like, not a thing that, that it wasn't any sort of statement for her.

1:00:49

But I think after seeing how effected people were by then she was like, I'm going to fucking do this.

1:00:54

And every time yeah. Is going to be, it's going to be in all the camps.

1:00:56

I mean that cause like that sequence that like Sweeney hasn't even shown up yet at that point, that's about 20 minutes into the movie.

1:01:04

She's their relationship Has gone cold.

1:01:07

Right. She steals this guy away because he's got a question mark on his forehead sorta, Which

1:01:12

also by the way, for some reason the question mark on it.

1:01:15

Yeah. The sort of question mark on his forehead also for some reason really stuck with me when I was a kid and being like, oh, that's creepy.

1:01:22

I don't know.

1:01:23

Like it, it's just a really like weird thing that I'm like one of these, the things in this movie that I'm like, I don't know why, but that's making me uncomfortable.

1:01:36

Right. He's got a Superman curl on his forehead and then a mole right underneath.

1:01:43

Right. And so that's the reason enough.

1:01:45

And they have this kind of hot encounter under Deepa car in a parking lot.

1:01:50

But, and then they move in together I guess.

1:01:54

But then by the time sweet, before sweet he's shown up, their relationship is, has gone cold.

1:01:59

Like you sit Griffin and they're like, okay, well what if we just like, you know, let's have sex tonight.

1:02:03

We'll like put it in the books and they plan It.

1:02:06

We have to organize ourselves.

1:02:09

Even though they're like, God knows. They're just like young people doing menial jobs basically.

1:02:13

But, and so they're right.

1:02:15

That scene is them lying next to each other naked.

1:02:17

And she she's like, you feel like my brother, like, you know, it's just, it's gone.

1:02:21

Like whatever tension here is is just, And

1:02:25

he was like, yeah. And he's like, maybe it's more spiritual this way.

1:02:30

Right. I, I love it.

1:02:33

It's just so it's funny that we're already there.

1:02:36

That's all that's I guess that's what's happening.

1:02:38

Right. And that's also the state of her relationship with the guy.

1:02:42

She is co-writing this movie with at the time they're, co-writing it where it's like, well, this was all the stuff leading up to us now working on this project, I moved in with you very quickly.

1:02:51

I thought we were madly in love. I realized it's maybe more of a friend collaborator thing than a sexual thing.

1:02:56

And now let's figure out where we go from here.

1:02:59

And then like, sweetie, you know, gropes him on the beach and they start making out.

1:03:03

And there's no consequences to that While

1:03:06

she's doing, she's doing a demonstration of how good she is at licking.

1:03:13

Yeah. And it just within 35 seconds heightened to like full on Frenching on the beach.

1:03:20

And then everything, everything happens very quickly.

1:03:22

It's like, no, don't like, don't marry her.

1:03:26

We're destined to be and flip these goings on.

1:03:30

Then he was like, oh, okay.

1:03:33

I mean, it's funny. Cause it's like the K character is trying to live like a reasonable logical life.

1:03:39

But I think his conscious self-conscious about the fact that she is too beholden to the rules.

1:03:46

Right. So she's like trying to find alternative rules to follow.

1:03:49

Whereas sweetie just does not play by any rules whatsoever and gets to sort of kind of float through life largely unencumbered.

1:04:01

Yes she does.

1:04:03

She, she is self-destructive in her life, in her, in her wanting to hurt other people because whatever it is that she doesn't like about it, like when she chews on the horses, which again, I was like, why, what as a kid, When

1:04:21

she spits them out and there's blood on the planet, it's just like, but she doesn't.

1:04:26

I mean, that's the problem. It's like, sweetie, that's the problem.

1:04:29

As if there's one problem she has is that many of the rules she does not follow are the ones that keep her safe and alive.

1:04:36

It's true Though, because you're not really sure why she's doing it.

1:04:41

I mean, she just loves, it's like she gets off on the chaos and I've known people kind of like sweetie before where they're just, I don't know, they just have this like wild, chaotic, fucked up energy.

1:04:56

You've definitely known some people. Like, I

1:04:59

feel like I've known people like sweetie, I can't think of who they are honestly, but I'm like, but I know, I know that energy and I don't know, like, and it's so frightening to me and like oppressive to me that I'm like, I've rejected it in my, in my psyche of like, I can't be around that kind of person.

1:05:19

I don't even remember the person that I'm thinking of, you know, but I have that feeling of like, get this, this energy out of my orbit.

1:05:30

So the, the thing, the bathtub scene that you mentioned earlier, SV where she's like bathing her father and you see it only from behind, but there's like a lot of time spent with her arms in front of his crotch.

1:05:41

Right? Yeah. And that when they screened it, people read it as like an incest thing and that it was a sign that like they had some inappropriate sexual relationship when she was a child.

1:05:53

And that is why she's quote unquote fucked up.

1:05:56

Sure. And Campion was like that. Wasn't my intent at all.

1:05:58

My intent was she doesn't have any boundaries.

1:06:01

She does not understand what she should or shouldn't be doing at any moment.

1:06:05

And the fact that he just kind of sits there, passively is showing that the problem is less, that he crossed lines with her as a child.

1:06:13

It is more that he at no point ever established any boundaries for her.

1:06:17

Yeah. That makes sense to me. Like I w when I watch it too, I was like, oh, it was, is it going in this way?

1:06:22

The direction? And then it never. And I was like, no, it was like, I didn't articulate it the way you just said that Jane did, but like, it, it w it didn't have, it didn't have a, like, oh, she was sexually assaulted, abused energy at the end of the day with it, it was just like, what is that?

1:06:38

You know? Right. I mean, I think you have to think about camping growing up with like, you know, clinically depressed mother and having to contend with behavior that it perhaps is not exactly like, this is stuff that is sort of like, irrational cannot be explained, but Campion talks about her mother with a great amount of empathy where it's just like, it's this horrible fucking disease.

1:07:02

She has, you have no idea how awful it is to watch someone suffer from that up close.

1:07:07

You know, there's no easy answer.

1:07:10

There's not like a reason.

1:07:11

There's not an inciting incident.

1:07:14

You

1:07:17

know? I mean, she's talked about in a lot of ways, how it's, and this was her recording, this commentary, what like fucking 15 years ago or whatever.

1:07:24

So it was, you know, even worse than, than it is now marginally, but that, like, these things are just not treated like diseases, which they are.

1:07:34

If you grew up as a child of someone in a household like that, you understand this as a disease, not just like, well, she's a little kooky, or like she has to get over it or whatever.

1:07:44

Yeah. We want there to be an explanation of Columbia as there as I feel like we always feel the way that way, whenever we know someone who's sick or who's depressed, or who behaves strangely or what, right.

1:07:55

You're like, wow, there's gotta be a reason. Like, I want to know why, like, you know, because it makes it feel like it will be easier to fix it.

1:08:00

That's, that's part of why this movie is uncomfortable.

1:08:02

You want There to be not like, Well,

1:08:04

here's the deal with sweetie? Well, I think it's because she's really good at that chair trick.

1:08:09

I think that's the problem. I think that's really where it all.

1:08:15

Yeah. That's also like, like the end of the movie is that flashback of her singing Not

1:08:20

well, you know, like, so it's like, I know it's a glimpse of her child.

1:08:26

Right. But Glenn's from her as a child and like getting the attention of her father for that.

1:08:31

Like, it's, it's this like, oh, she's they, they enabled this in each other in some way.

1:08:38

It's like that.

1:08:39

I don't know. Yeah. And then doing the chair trick and then like the father starts to try to do the chair trick.

1:08:48

Ben, Ben, do you like her buddy? I feel like you must like her sweeties Guy,

1:08:54

Bob.

1:08:56

Yeah. Well, and that kind of like, I don't think we have to spend too much time on it, but the nineties, I

1:09:01

think we have to spend 45 minutes on the Nineties

1:09:04

of this movie to me, Bob feels so just like, kind of pulled out of that time where he's like, got this weird rockabilly kind of like punk kind of vibe to how he's dressing.

1:09:16

Definitely

1:09:16

obviously

1:09:16

a

1:09:16

heroin

1:09:16

user,

1:09:16

but

1:09:16

again,

1:09:16

they

1:09:16

are

1:09:16

bringing

1:09:16

out

1:09:16

the

1:09:16

worst,

1:09:16

but

1:09:16

kind

1:09:16

of,

1:09:16

you

1:09:16

know,

1:09:16

it's

1:09:16

so

1:09:16

entertaining

1:09:16

to

1:09:16

me

1:09:16

the

1:09:16

way

1:09:16

they

1:09:16

are

1:09:16

around

1:09:16

each

1:09:16

other,

1:09:16

just

1:09:16

drunken

1:09:16

fucking

1:09:16

animals,

1:09:16

like

1:09:32

Mean the scene where Bob, the dad takes Bob out for lunch and he fully nods off and drills on himself is Still

1:09:40

asking him questions while he's drilling.

1:09:42

So it's like, it's like, oh, is she going to make it It's

1:09:47

clean at the size of like a fairly brothers movie yet it's still work.

1:09:51

I mean, that's that whole thing is so fascinating too.

1:09:53

We're like the dad keeps on sort of justifying to Kay that like you don't understand, sweetie is not like us.

1:10:02

Like she's creative. She's capable of doing all these things.

1:10:04

There's this sort of like rationalization of like, we cannot fix her because she's operating a different level than I

1:10:14

need some shoes this way.

1:10:15

And they can't let go of the sweetie.

1:10:18

You see, at the end of the film that the trail that they remember is this cute little, It

1:10:23

was so weird or whatever, but like this scene where he takes Bob out for lunch and you just assume this is gonna be a class of like, over-protective dad thing where it's like, who the fuck is this guy?

1:10:32

You've got her believing in some show business streams.

1:10:35

We've been down this path before, like I'm going to lay down the law.

1:10:39

And then his end point he gets to is like, so you really think she can make it, like, he's doing the windup of like, you have to understand, right.

1:10:48

You we've gone through this a lot.

1:10:50

You know, she's been burned before, but you think she's really got it.

1:10:53

And the guy's fucking drooling on himself Also.

1:10:56

He's clearly like I'm hooked up with the waitress and she hates his guts and the dad is just kind of like, it's not registering with him at all.

1:11:05

That seems amazing.

1:11:08

I love how much he loved this movie, Ben. Yeah.

1:11:10

I never, I didn't think about it. I didn't think that this would be the Ben movie, but I should have, of course My

1:11:15

energy, like biotic just weirdo people.

1:11:19

Like my, one of my favorite movies is gumbo.

1:11:21

So it's like, you know what I mean?

1:11:24

Like, this is just, it's got that.

1:11:26

Like, I don't know, buzzy energy.

1:11:30

It's funny to think about like this movie premiere, like she's the Belle of the ball.

1:11:36

Right. And she takes this movie to can, and like, some people blew it, which like is obvious.

1:11:41

And some people are like disgusted by it.

1:11:43

And I'm like, you know, I read that.

1:11:46

And I'm like, well, yeah, it's sweet. And he's a little polarizing.

1:11:47

I'm not stunned to hear that.

1:11:49

It didn't like go over like gangbusters.

1:11:51

But I think for her, it was kind of like, what the fuck is this?

1:11:54

Why are people mad? Like she naively said, like she said, like we cried and cried.

1:12:00

Like, you know, like that they were just going to be like hailed as heroes.

1:12:03

And

1:12:03

maybe

1:12:03

that's

1:12:03

another

1:12:03

reason

1:12:03

she

1:12:03

sort

1:12:03

of

1:12:03

ends

1:12:03

up

1:12:03

now,

1:12:03

like

1:12:03

after

1:12:03

this

1:12:03

dusting

1:12:03

off

1:12:03

the

1:12:03

slightly

1:12:03

more

1:12:03

prestigious

1:12:03

stuff,

1:12:03

even

1:12:03

though

1:12:03

angel

1:12:03

at

1:12:03

my

1:12:03

table

1:12:03

and

1:12:03

the

1:12:03

piano

1:12:03

were

1:12:03

still,

1:12:03

you

1:12:03

know,

1:12:03

very

1:12:03

idiosyncratic,

1:12:03

like

1:12:19

She does three more conventionally prestigious period films in a row.

1:12:24

And then her next two films after that are her only two out there To

1:12:29

American sex movies, that rule and Her

1:12:32

only like present day films, which are very poorly perceived.

1:12:35

Both of them. True.

1:12:37

That is true. And now she's back of court.

1:12:40

Her last two movies have been a period film.

1:12:43

So the top of the lake is that's, that's Contemporary,

1:12:47

that's TV. Sure. But It

1:12:49

is TV, but it's highly acclaimed to CBC TV, the play at the Cannes film festival.

1:12:53

But

1:12:53

yeah,

1:12:53

no,

1:12:53

it's

1:12:53

just,

1:12:53

I

1:12:53

find

1:12:53

this

1:12:53

movie

1:12:53

so

1:12:53

transfixing,

1:12:53

but

1:12:53

I,

1:12:53

it,

1:12:53

it,

1:12:53

it

1:12:53

makes

1:12:53

me

1:13:03

sad. Like, and that's not a complaint.

1:13:05

It put, it definitely bumps me out.

1:13:07

And I watched it last night and my wife was very unsettled, but she was like, again, it just seems to be just sort of against the rules, like what it's like, you know, it would be almost, I think, more easy to take if it was like about a person with a problem and you're dealing with the problem.

1:13:23

Right, right. Like, you know, here's sweetie and here's, what's wrong with her and here's what she's dealing with, but it's, it never pins that down.

1:13:30

So instead you're just sort of constantly feeling like you're shifting uncomfortably in your seat.

1:13:35

I also like when she dies, no, one's really sad.

1:13:39

And then I also, as the viewer was like relieved, I was like, yeah, there's something he needs out of my life.

1:13:47

Especially since sweeties final act is so chaotic that you're like, I don't know how this is supposed to end.

1:13:54

Th the, her jumping up and down in the tree house goes on for so fucking long.

1:14:01

And you think the kid might get her, you know, obviously a little worried about the kid.

1:14:04

Like there's, there's that sort of creepiness to what's happening, but they Keep

1:14:09

on doing that shot for underneath.

1:14:10

You see sort of like the floorboards, like creaking it, they just string up for so long that yes, I do think there's a relief when it finally happens, you know, they like immediately cut to the kids safely grabbing onto the trunk of the tree.

1:14:23

Like he caught himself and he doesn't have a scratch.

1:14:26

And then she's there dead.

1:14:28

She will not stop like coughing up strawberry syrup.

1:14:33

Right. It just like keeps on coming out of her mouth, but there's the relieve.

1:14:37

And there's also, I think the sense of like sad inevitability from her family, where they were just like, wow, it was a matter of time.

1:14:44

Yeah. And also it's like call the police or call someone and they're just standing there and like, yeah.

1:14:49

Like just let it be, let this moment.

1:14:55

She feels, it feels like an animal a little bit.

1:14:58

Yeah. You know, like, they're like, she's so animalistic, but almost kind of the way that she's treated.

1:15:04

Yeah. In that moment, it feels like the passing of an animal, like the stakes are lower.

1:15:09

Yeah.

1:15:11

That, that was the, the other thing that lemon said and that the making of thing is that she had done another play right before this, where she had to be naked on stage the entire time.

1:15:21

So it was like two things.

1:15:23

I could be like, I'm into it, but it's like, I've desensitized myself to this.

1:15:27

I could be naked for four days of filming.

1:15:29

I can play a trial the entire time.

1:15:31

I know how to do that.

1:15:33

Jane, please. Can I tell you one thing, I have no problems being in the nude.

1:15:36

That's what she says when Jane, because Jane was like, Campion was like, look, if you don't want, if you want to wear clothes for the CNI, I won't make a fuss.

1:15:43

And lemon was like, nah, that's fine.

1:15:46

I get it. Even when she is wearing clothes though, like those clothes are like dress up clothes.

1:15:51

She's like, still like naked.

1:15:54

And like how many scenes in this movie does she just like suddenly take off her shirt?

1:15:58

You know?

1:16:00

Like, she's usually she's in underwear for a good percentage of this movie.

1:16:04

I mean, there's the thing in this SP like when She

1:16:08

doesn't know how to dress herself or whatever she gets halfway done.

1:16:11

And then she's sort of like, this is it right. I, I don't have to like button my shirt or put on.

1:16:17

She also has like Madonna gloves on, you know?

1:16:22

Right.

1:16:25

Th there's the thing in this SB, which like, when I hear people talk about search party, right?

1:16:30

Like, so often they go, like, I like, I have to like space episodes out because it makes me so uncomfortable.

1:16:38

But there's the thing I think you and Charles do incredibly well in like on an episode by episode basis, but especially on season by season basis where it's like, you, you, as opposed to, I think so much prestige, TV, and streaming TV and whatever, where it's like, things are sort of drawn out for as long as possible.

1:16:55

You know, you're like prolonging the inevitable.

1:16:58

I feel like the two of you and everyone else who works on the show with you, we'll like write yourselves into corners of just going, like, what's the most extreme, fascinating thing that could happen now.

1:17:08

And then we will solve what you do after that, rather than being worried about how do you go further from that point?

1:17:15

And this movie has a lot of that energy.

1:17:19

And I think similarly, that thing of like watching people with incredibly complicated, somewhat toxic codependent relationships put themselves in increasingly uncomfortable situations, but it does not feel like the movie is getting joy from that, or that's mocking it.

1:17:35

Like, there's a weird balance of like genuine love for the characters while also recognizing their failings and being fascinated with watching them, having to contend with more and more complicated situations of their own doing.

1:17:50

Yeah. It's funny because I forget that like often my work is hard to watch and that people don't are like, oh, and the, and how, how much I felt that when watching this, Right.

1:18:01

That's why I bring it up because you were talking about watching this movie.

1:18:05

I do hear it from people who will end up finishing all of search party and going, I'm glad I did that.

1:18:10

That was great. But it took me a while.

1:18:12

Yeah.

1:18:14

Yeah. No, I it's. It's funny.

1:18:15

Like that does tend to be my favorite stuff too, even though I wouldn't say that this is like my favorite movie, but I, I appreciate it so much for tapping into that.

1:18:28

Cause

1:18:28

this

1:18:28

is

1:18:28

just

1:18:28

more

1:18:28

unfamiliar

1:18:28

to

1:18:28

me

1:18:28

than

1:18:28

what,

1:18:28

what,

1:18:28

like

1:18:28

the

1:18:28

dynamics

1:18:28

between

1:18:28

this,

1:18:28

in

1:18:28

this

1:18:28

family

1:18:28

and

1:18:28

the

1:18:28

husband,

1:18:28

or

1:18:28

it's

1:18:28

like

1:18:28

a

1:18:28

little

1:18:28

bit,

1:18:28

it's

1:18:28

not

1:18:28

actually

1:18:28

my

1:18:28

territory,

1:18:28

but

1:18:28

it

1:18:28

is,

1:18:28

it

1:18:28

is

1:18:28

like

1:18:28

the,

1:18:28

the,

1:18:28

the

1:18:28

uncomfortableness

1:18:28

that

1:18:28

I

1:18:28

am

1:18:28

always

1:18:28

like

1:18:51

exploring. So it's, it's, it's interesting that I'm like, oh yeah, I didn't even think about how that's, how my, how my work tends to come across.

1:19:03

Especially for something you watched at such a young age where most other movies, you see that look like this and have this kind of comedic energy are not punishing you in the same way.

1:19:14

There's

1:19:14

an

1:19:14

interesting

1:19:18

thing. Like Chris Noonan is in the special thanks of this movie, right?

1:19:22

Christian and a babe fame, the director of babe who weirdly only ever directs two feature films in his entire career.

1:19:32

This is Chris Noonan, right?

1:19:35

He does babe and Ms.

1:19:37

Potter and gets like a best director nomination.

1:19:39

His first film out doesn't make another movie for over 10 years.

1:19:43

And then as once again, proceeded, but it gets a lot of weird, special thanks credits on things or consultant credit on things.

1:19:50

And he started in Australian cinema in like the seventies.

1:19:54

I mean, he made like a student film when he was like 16, that one festival awards on TV was deeply entrenched in the industry.

1:20:02

And, and like, babe is the movie coming years after this that I think has the closest vibe to this movie, weirdly of anything else I've ever seen.

1:20:12

But there is some sort of shared like continuum between like this babe, obviously the other George Miller films, but especially his earlier films, the early Peter Jackson movies, like there is some odd overcranked cartoon Nash, but like quietly dark New Zealand, Australian comedy vibe that I never really see in American films.

1:20:39

And most of those filmmakers end up like, as they get older, evolving that style a little bit and going out of it.

1:20:45

But like, there's a very specific feel to these movies.

1:20:49

And also, I guess most of those films I mentioned are all happening around the same time.

1:20:53

I mean, those careers are all starting in the late 1770s through the mid eighties.

1:21:00

That's when like Australian cinema is revived and you'd right.

1:21:04

Like that's when it's, there's serious investment again, I guess that's where the, you know, all, all this is coming from then maybe, maybe they were film school contemporaries.

1:21:13

I don't know.

1:21:16

I just wonder what's culturally going on there.

1:21:20

There's this like very light, these, these dark loony tune movies, you know?

1:21:26

Yeah. It's weird down there. That's weird.

1:21:28

I don't know. I don't want to be stereotypical about Australians, but Australians are all crazy.

1:21:32

It's the craziest country in the world.

1:21:37

I have no concept of what day-to-day life is like in Australia.

1:21:40

Every time I see a movie that takes place in Australia, I feel so like the environment feels so foreign to me.

1:21:49

And you know, literally like winter is summer in summer is winter there, like Christmas, Christmas, and summer.

1:21:57

What? Yeah. And like, it just feels, so there is something about a lot of Australian movies that I just like have a sense of unease with with them.

1:22:10

And I like Muriel's wedding, which I love.

1:22:12

Oh yeah.

1:22:14

It just, there is also that same sort of like discomfort.

1:22:20

And

1:22:20

I'm

1:22:20

very

1:22:20

curious

1:22:20

what

1:22:20

the,

1:22:20

I

1:22:20

don't

1:22:20

know,

1:22:20

literally

1:22:20

just

1:22:20

what

1:22:20

it's

1:22:20

like

1:22:20

to

1:22:20

live

1:22:20

in

1:22:27

Australia. Yeah. It's weird. I don't know.

1:22:29

I I've never been and I'm super, I grew up in a country that is super biased and stereotypical about Australian people, which is the country, America, America

1:22:40

outbox. Now I think Americans, I

1:22:43

think the American take on Australian right. Is, is the crocodile Dundee take right?

1:22:47

Where it's like, oh yeah, those guys are like a good time.

1:22:49

They drink beer.

1:22:50

They pour shrimps on Barbies.

1:22:52

They wrestle crocodiles.

1:22:55

Right? Like that's what it's like down there.

1:22:56

Whereas I think Brits are like, those they're savages.

1:22:59

They're crazy. Like, you know, like th like there's the, they drink even more than we do.

1:23:04

And they, you know, I don't know. There's, there's this sort of like harsher edge because Brits are so prejudiced about certain countries.

1:23:11

It's very funny.

1:23:13

I mean, this is also classic dumb Griff, dumb brain shit.

1:23:16

But like, I remember being a little kid in like elementary school and a teacher telling me that she was from Oregon.

1:23:23

And I was like, with like covered wagons and shit, because my frame of my mind, I was like, this game represents what Oregon is like right now.

1:23:34

Right. I was just like, this is what Oregon has always been and will always be.

1:23:38

And it's like, I've been to Sydney twice.

1:23:40

I still, whenever I hear Australia think of the Outback, like it's hard for me to contend with the fact there are like cities where people are wearing clothes and shoes.

1:23:50

I started this, but like, I really have to apologize to our Australian listeners.

1:23:53

It's a very cosmopolitan country in so many ways.

1:23:57

Excuse

1:23:57

me,

1:23:57

I'm

1:23:57

apologizing

1:23:57

for

1:24:01

myself. No, no Josie for myself here, I'm acknowledging that I'm of course the city and I've seen it for myself.

1:24:07

But What

1:24:08

I'm saying is Rolling in New Zealand is now just thought of as the Shire, I feel like in most American lines where it's like this idyllic fucking fantasy land, but I just, I don't understand culturally what's going on.

1:24:23

And I, I hope it fucking listeners at me and give me good links to read, or someone explains her.

1:24:31

We find something later in the other episodes here, but culturally what's going on where it's like, cause he had Myrtle's wedding is another one, like the Joslin Morehead, PJ Hogan thing as well.

1:24:40

It's like, there's some odd vibe to New Zealand and Australia and a comedy that is very unique, especially from like 1983 to 92 or something.

1:24:55

So like, just thinking about these do movies, like their haircuts are like kind of off in a weird way.

1:25:00

You know, here, their style is, is, is, is I don't even know if it's out of touch or if it's just doing it's like, I don't, I don't have a context of it other than watching these movies.

1:25:14

So I'm like, what is it like living there?

1:25:16

Because it also feels very quiet all the time.

1:25:18

It's like an in the houses, like you don't hear anyone else outside, it kind of feels maybe a little bit like deserty Tucson or something.

1:25:26

Like, I don't know why I've always been kind of fascinated with what, what is it like to live in Australia?

1:25:33

I guess this is an Australian film. I should take the bag, obviously.

1:25:35

She's This

1:25:37

is fully an Australian film. Yes.

1:25:39

After going to Australian film school, working with Australian people.

1:25:42

But, but there's like that weird sort of like manic, scary quality to Australian comedy at this point in time.

1:25:49

And then I feel like when I see Australian comedy shit from like the mid nineties on that's gone, it becomes gentler again.

1:25:57

Sure. I mean, I do think there was also more crossover hits that were more gentle crowd pleasers coming out of Australia and the nineties and 2000 castle and the castle, the dish, you know, the sorts of movies that are more family friendly, babe, obviously.

1:26:12

But

1:26:12

you

1:26:12

know,

1:26:14

yeah. There's obviously there's a weird sort of, you know, there's weird humor and sort of Evan Gardy stuff always bubbling out over there to see, you know, so, and it's at the ends of the earth and the sun is, you know, two inches from your face and you know, there's scorpions, sorry, I'm slipping into stereotype again.

1:26:33

Yeah. There's like this doesn't weirdly like the movies almost feel Todd salons easy in a way like in that era Australia.

1:26:44

Yeah. It's like, yeah. It's, it's, it's interesting.

1:26:49

Todd salons is a good comparison for this movie.

1:26:53

Like welcome to the dollhouse is a decent comparison for this movie.

1:26:56

Welcome to all houses, more straightforward plot wise.

1:26:59

Right? Like, you know, it's a right, But,

1:27:03

but it's like if Danny DeVito directed a Todd Cylons script, Right.

1:27:08

It's, it's more whimsical.

1:27:10

Is that like, it's a little less leak sweety.

1:27:13

Isn't bleak. Exactly.

1:27:14

There's this Weird

1:27:16

like fable like quality to this movie, I

1:27:21

guess. Cause it's so heightened. That's that's their protection you have with sweetness.

1:27:24

You're like this isn't real like th like, you know, cause again, I, I do think it's sort of like a haunting movie.

1:27:31

All right. Like you could describe it that way.

1:27:34

Like she really is kind of like a Poltergeist.

1:27:36

Everything he does is so weird and she's this sort of problem they have to confront and weather and destroy and then they are free of her, but they're still kind of haunted by it, you know?

1:27:51

Cause the last shot of the movie is like haunting.

1:27:54

Like, you know, the, the ghostly glimpse of her as a baby, as a kid.

1:27:58

But she, this is where I keep, I just keep it like when you're, when you, if you like, I, this is not my situation.

1:28:06

But if like I had an older sibling or a younger sibling and we were all grownups, but my parents were kind of still, you know, letting them off for being a fuck up or being a weirdo or whatever.

1:28:17

And I was trying to be normal.

1:28:18

And like maybe, you know, that, that sibling just kind of grows in your brain into this sort of like super chaotic person, like beyond like they're taking maybe this story from Gerald Lee's life.

1:28:31

And they're just like, what if we just inflate the personality to these like, you know, ridiculous proportions of, of your, your wild sibling, who everyone is indulging in a weird way.

1:28:43

I look, it, it reminded me, unfortunately it was a very dark period in my life a couple of years ago when I started obsessive flea watching Dr.

1:28:49

Phil, because I could not get over.

1:28:53

Yes. I could not get over The juice of those episodes where someone is like a maniac and the rest of the family is on the panel and they're like, yeah, we don't know what to do.

1:29:00

And Dr. Phil's like, come on.

1:29:05

I mean, that's the worst thing that can happen to you is having someone like that be in your immediate family, because you can't, you can't like to an extent you can sort of like set boundaries that are like, I'm not going to talk to you if you're talking that way, but you can't be like, you're out of my life.

1:29:24

I mean, there are of course situations where that happens.

1:29:27

But like generally with that, especially if they are, you know, mentally, I don't know ill, then, then like you have to, you have to confront it constantly.

1:29:43

And then in doing so you're not actually confronting.

1:29:46

You're just like disassociating.

1:29:48

Like,

1:29:48

this

1:29:48

is

1:29:48

where

1:29:48

they're

1:29:48

here

1:29:48

right

1:29:53

now. But hopefully I can, they'll leave my house and then I can go back to my other life.

1:29:58

That's like, not That's

1:30:02

right. But there was this thing On your shoulder All

1:30:04

the time. This thing I could not fucking get my fill of watching Dr.

1:30:09

Phil was like, I, I don't know what to do.

1:30:14

And he'd be like, look at everything.

1:30:16

You're enabling them. This is all fucking terrible.

1:30:19

And they'd be like, oh, I don't know.

1:30:21

Like just disassociating from it, crane, this little bubble of deniability, right.

1:30:25

To like keep themselves safe from having to acknowledge the reality of everything all the time.

1:30:29

But then you also go like, how are you feeling? And you're like, terrible.

1:30:31

My life's a mess. Like nothing's working the woman.

1:30:35

Who's like son, hasn't left bed for four years.

1:30:37

And she's like, well, why, why won't he get out of bed?

1:30:40

And it's like, because his TV's right there who brought his TV.

1:30:43

And she's like, well, I moved the team, but if it was because he wouldn't get out of bed, what am I supposed to do?

1:30:48

Who

1:30:48

empties

1:30:48

his

1:30:48

urine

1:30:51

jars? I mean, I do, but who else? If I don't do it, then who's going to do it.

1:30:54

I tell them, Is this person the rock working out?

1:30:57

Yeah. Sorry, man.

1:30:59

I dunno. It's this thing where the rock piece in bottles, I just can't get over it.

1:31:05

Yeah. He pees in bottles while he's working out and people like why?

1:31:07

And he's like, well, the places I work at don't have bathrooms.

1:31:09

And I'm like, why don't you go to a place that does have a bathroom?

1:31:12

It seems like a better, better way to do it.

1:31:15

In my opinion. That's all.

1:31:17

Yeah. Let me just eat peas and bottles and then sells them as a Terra, mana tequila.

1:31:23

He's like, he's, he's working out so much that, you know, when I go to the gym, it's not like, oh, I've got to take a pee break in the middle of the day.

1:31:31

Right. You're like, oh, Every five minutes, baby.

1:31:33

I got to bust it out.

1:31:34

Get

1:31:34

me

1:31:34

that

1:31:34

Voss

1:31:38

bottle.

1:31:38

I'm

1:31:38

sure

1:31:38

the

1:31:38

boss

1:31:38

he's,

1:31:38

he's

1:31:38

he's

1:31:38

peeing

1:31:38

in

1:31:38

a

1:31:42

boss. Absolutely. Yeah. Is there anything else about sweetie?

1:31:45

I'm looking at the, any other scenes we're not thinking of what about the dream sequences?

1:31:49

Cause I feel like we touched on the last, you know, the last thing at the end there with like, you know, the dream sequence of her as a girl, but it's Throughout

1:31:59

the movie and I really love it and it's weird as hell.

1:32:03

And I can't even there's there's random images.

1:32:05

Like it's very dreamlike.

1:32:06

It's Hard to even lie in very Ben.

1:32:10

Oh totally. But like, there's like a part where there's a dream sequence where it's kind of like a more to do with the tree and it being buried or rather not buried, sorry under the bed.

1:32:21

And it's just like all these quick, weird shots.

1:32:24

And it's like, it's very emotional, but like again, there's hard to put your finger on what really it's trying to say.

1:32:32

I actually was like, did she rip up the tree in her sleep or did work?

1:32:36

Or was there that not part of the tree, you know, like it's, it's kind of edited in a strange way.

1:32:43

I really, I can't get over her putting the tree in the closet Also.

1:32:47

It was, I was just like, okay, so what's the, the emotional relevance of this tree.

1:32:53

What is like roots.

1:32:55

Okay. Re like family roots, you know, the whole time I was just like theirs, but trying to try to decode what exactly they were getting at with the tree.

1:33:06

And I wonder what Jane had to say about it in, in her commentary.

1:33:11

Just like, I don't know. The tree was interesting Because

1:33:14

then there's also like a root in her gray in her grave.

1:33:17

It has to be cut, you know?

1:33:19

Oh yeah. But that's the thing, like she's rarely one to one where she's like, and if you think about it, the tree is act.

1:33:24

She's more like what you're saying. If she's like, yeah.

1:33:27

That image really stirred something up in me.

1:33:29

And so I knew I had to get it into the movie.

1:33:31

Yeah. Pardon me. And then I thought that would be good for the movie.

1:33:37

And I love this quote about a sweetie coming out in America where she says, I love comfy sofas, not hard back chair.

1:33:46

So I feel guilty when people say I felt uncomfortable watching her.

1:33:51

Like she, she, she wants to make you a comfy sofa.

1:33:55

She just can't do it. I guess she's just sorta like, well, it's another hard back chair.

1:34:00

I'm sorry. I hope you like it.

1:34:03

I mean, another thing that adds to just the weird vibe of this movie is that the score is all like gospel choir Oh,

1:34:12

yeah. Which is just not what you're expecting the goal along with these images or vice versa, you know, everything that this movie is like at a 10, but each 10 is in a completely different direction.

1:34:26

She got a lot of Lynch comparisons in this movie came out, which makes sense.

1:34:29

It's funny that that's where people started with her because I don't think it's where she goes.

1:34:35

But I do obviously, because this movie is sort of quasi kitsch and has a lot of like very stark, you know, images, visual, you know, like I get why people made the Lynch comparison, like, and she sort of rolls her eyes at it, but she's like, yeah, we both like our art school people.

1:34:52

So like, I sort of get it, but, but like, you know, there's nothing else she makes that I would, I would say really lines up closely to David Lynch at all the goofiness of his, his like interest in meditation feels lynchings.

1:35:11

He loves meditation. Right. Well sure.

1:35:14

And it, the way it's portrayed though, even where the dad is, like, what is he doing?

1:35:17

I love that scene.

1:35:21

And then she tries to meditate. Yeah. That class.

1:35:23

And she's like, well, I'm not going to enjoy.

1:35:26

I related to that so much.

1:35:28

Like when you're like, I can't do it, I can't do this.

1:35:30

And then she has a profound experience.

1:35:33

Yeah. A scary experience.

1:35:35

I don't think it works.

1:35:37

I

1:35:37

just

1:35:37

love

1:35:37

how

1:35:37

that

1:35:37

guy

1:35:37

just

1:35:37

says,

1:35:37

like,

1:35:37

that's

1:35:41

fine. Like he just, he only has the one answer for it.

1:35:45

Just fucking close your Eyes.

1:35:47

You're doing it.

1:35:50

Any, you guys meditate, anyone Ever

1:35:52

meditated. Everyone tells me to do it all the time.

1:35:55

It's one of those things that any time you do.

1:35:58

Yeah. But, but I do guided meditations that are also sort of like hypnosis.

1:36:02

So That

1:36:05

might help. That might be better. Like I just, I, I

1:36:09

much preferred guided meditation.

1:36:12

Yeah. I'm not, I'm not very good at guiding myself in any way towards anything.

1:36:16

I can't say It's still, I can't like not think so.

1:36:21

Exactly.

1:36:23

I need a guide with like the little flag at the stick saying like over here over, But

1:36:29

like, I also very much appreciate the like torture of meditation now.

1:36:36

It's like, wait, this is good for me.

1:36:38

How, Yeah.

1:36:40

The exercise, same deal.

1:36:42

I'm just like, yeah, I know.

1:36:44

I know.

1:36:46

I, I, I would, I would say that I've never had like some people who meditate regularly or like, it changed my life.

1:36:52

And I'm like, I don't know if it changed my life really.

1:36:55

Like, it's like, it kind of, I don't know.

1:36:58

I guess that's my dubiousness. It's like people tell me about it.

1:37:02

And they're like, I think it would really do a lot for you.

1:37:05

And I'm like, I agree. You're probably right.

1:37:07

And then they're like, it fucking changed my life.

1:37:09

I, I I'm, I'm eight times more powerful than I was before.

1:37:13

And I'm like, now you're making me not want it.

1:37:15

I don't know if I believe that.

1:37:18

And they're like, I'm looking at your life. And I don't know.

1:37:20

It doesn't seem that much different, But

1:37:23

I'm like, I believe that it helps.

1:37:25

Yeah. Well, cause I also feel like that's the kind of thing where people get into it and they're like, I teach it now and I'm like, I teach it now.

1:37:31

What do you mean? They're like, yeah, I'm a guru.

1:37:34

I'm like, okay, cool, man.

1:37:37

I mean, you're really into it.

1:37:39

Phones

1:37:42

ringing. I think you got to pick that up. David click.

1:37:45

Hello?

1:37:48

Hello. Am I talking to a cash register?

1:37:51

No, David, I think this is the Kuching sound effect.

1:37:55

Okay. What's up. Kuching sound effect.

1:37:58

Okay. It has achieved sentence.

1:37:59

I

1:37:59

don't

1:37:59

know,

1:37:59

David,

1:37:59

how's

1:37:59

this

1:37:59

make

1:37:59

you

1:38:03

feel? Yeah, it kind of makes me smile.

1:38:05

Who doesn't love to hear the sound of money, your money Monster

1:38:10

Let's acknowledge it. It's kind of the sound of another sale on Shopify that all in one commerce platform, which starts, runs and grows your business.

1:38:17

We go, we use Shopify.

1:38:20

Of course, we use it to sell our merchant.

1:38:23

Our friends at night I'll have made a increasingly weird merchandise for us.

1:38:28

We got our, our comedy points coins.

1:38:30

We have the new chip coins, which is a chip.

1:38:33

Smith's a fungible token.

1:38:35

Absolutely very fungible.

1:38:37

Two friends. Have we have a spread master spatula coming soon, just increasingly silly things that we're selling on our Shopify page that we could not sell without a Shopify page.

1:38:48

They've been incredibly helpful for us.

1:38:50

They've been so helpful. We can really do whatever we want.

1:38:53

And it's a company that gives entrepreneurs resources that, or once only for big businesses, you know, you can sell everywhere.

1:39:00

You can synchronize online and in-person sales.

1:39:02

You can stay informed on everything.

1:39:04

You can scale your business.

1:39:06

Yeah. All of it, just hearing more register rings.

1:39:10

Every time you mentioned another feature, it's, it's an all in one commerce platform to start, run and grow your business Powers.

1:39:18

Millions of businesses like our own.

1:39:20

From first sale to full scale, you can reach customers online, across social networks.

1:39:25

They've got all kinds of channel integrations, Facebook, Instagram, Tik, TOK, Pinterest, and more, all that stuff.

1:39:30

You can synchronize your sales, like I said, and you can gain insights as you grow with detailed reporting, a conversion rates and profit margins and beyond it's all possible because of Shopify.

1:39:41

Yeah. And you know, you can go to shop blank, check pod.my shopify.com to get your chip coin, your comedy points coin priced to move heavily, discounted talking the walk 20, 20, and fifth anniversary shirts that are now coming up on two years out of date, two friends, enamel pin set.

1:40:01

We got, we got lots of good things here and it's nice to be able to get them to the people without us, you and I having to pack things ourselves, you know, they like cut out the middleman.

1:40:10

They take care of so much for us.

1:40:12

Absolutely. So if you go to shopify.com/check all lower case, you'll get a free 14 day trial and get full access to Shopify.

1:40:21

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1:40:32

And I want to remind people it's not a bit, there is a spread master blink cheque, branded purple spatula coming soon.

1:40:39

Did

1:40:39

this

1:40:39

move

1:40:39

and

1:40:39

get

1:40:39

a

1:40:39

proper

1:40:39

American

1:40:39

released

1:40:44

driven. It did. This movie was released in New York in 1990, January of 1990 after playing the New York festival.

1:40:53

And it, it was out in Australia the year before September 89.

1:40:57

I don't know if it had like a much wider release than like, you know, big cities in America or whatever, but it did get a little release and it was a festival favorite, you know, festival, sweetie.

1:41:11

It was a bit of a festival, sweetie.

1:41:13

It was a can, it was a TIFF.

1:41:15

It was in New York. And then it, you know, went to some other places and it made like 400 grand in Australia.

1:41:22

Which I have to imagine is, is, is about as much as anyone hope for.

1:41:28

Right? Like I, I mean, I don't think anyone was, That's

1:41:30

a low cost way, less than a million dollars.

1:41:34

And then an angel at my table is basically, you know, in the works like that was that that's that comes out just a year later in Australia.

1:41:43

So she's working for now.

1:41:46

She's already getting to work on what she thinks people want out of a Jane Campion movie.

1:41:52

She's like, okay, I got, I did that one.

1:41:54

Thank you for giving me the Mulligan.

1:41:58

So, sweetie, do you want me to do the box office for January 19th, 1990.

1:42:02

Cause that's what I was going to do.

1:42:04

I think it's time. Yeah. All right. Okay.

1:42:06

Look, this movie came out early 1990.

1:42:08

So number one is a hold over from Oscar season of 1989.

1:42:14

It's been out for six weeks, no driving.

1:42:19

Miss Stacy is in the top 10. It's the number eight.

1:42:22

Okay. But this is, I, you know what?

1:42:24

This was probably driving. Miss Daisy is biggest challenger.

1:42:27

Cause this movie wins best director at the Oscars

1:42:31

born on the 4th of July. It's born on the 4th

1:42:34

of July. Okay. Tom cruise as Covich.

1:42:38

Yeah. And all of a sudden film, have you seen born on the 4th of July as V?

1:42:43

No. I was going to say it's, isn't do the right thing that same Time

1:42:46

or something. It is, but obviously that was not

1:42:50

wasn't

1:42:52

Nominated at all. Yeah. Yeah.

1:42:54

When it got screenplay and supporting actor for the white guy.

1:42:58

Yeah. Right. Yep.

1:42:59

I

1:42:59

have

1:42:59

never

1:42:59

seen

1:42:59

born

1:42:59

on

1:42:59

the

1:42:59

4th

1:42:59

of

1:42:59

July

1:43:05

either. It is funny when I watch obsessively the Siskel and Ebert Oscar specials for me to hear when I can't fall asleep that year, they're talking about how they had been like very dismissive of Tom cruise up until that point.

1:43:19

And they were like, okay, fair enough.

1:43:21

We're ready. CRO here's the movie. He finally proved that he's actually an actor and not just a movie star.

1:43:27

He's like 29 in that film.

1:43:31

Like when he made it, he's like third.

1:43:33

Yeah, yeah. Right.

1:43:35

Yeah. 29, whatever. While

1:43:37

that his career was so dominant.

1:43:39

So early on that by 29, he was having to prove to people like, yes, I know I've made six mega hits in a row, but now I'm going to slow down and do a serious searing drama with the man who just won best to prove that I can really act.

1:43:53

I love Tom cruise mean We've

1:43:56

all got a soft spot for Tom cruise on this podcast.

1:43:58

He loses, he should've won.

1:44:01

Not in terms of, I think it's the best performance of the year.

1:44:04

It's actually not my favorite Tom cruise, although he's good.

1:44:07

It's a very committed performance.

1:44:09

So he's very in it.

1:44:10

But he was viewed as being unbeatable.

1:44:12

He Was certainly the favorite, but he loses to Daniel Day-Lewis for my left foot who not only is that performance, obviously also insanely showy, but that movie became the kind of field.

1:44:23

That's the original Miramax feel good out of nowhere thing.

1:44:29

I'm kind of wondering if maybe when I saw sweetie, it was like, my mom was on some like kick cause I'm like, oh, I also remember my left seeing my left foot really young and also being disturbed also disturbing she went, it must have been, been on a kick of like, what are all the important films this year that I'm going to watch The

1:44:52

serious movies? No, my leg, my left foot is like, I feel like the first successful execution of like the Weinstein attack on the Oscars.

1:45:02

And then by like the piano things are really up and running by English patient.

1:45:06

They've perfected it and they can like sweep the whole board.

1:45:09

Yeah. It's like, you know, little, do they know?

1:45:11

I guess, but like, they're going to have so many other chances to give Daniel Day Lewis and Oscar.

1:45:15

Right, right. And like, it probably would've been good to just get the Cruz win done, but whatever he wins, Cruz loses.

1:45:22

Chris doesn't have an Oscar. Danny Lewis, Denny Day-Lewis Dan Lewis.

1:45:25

Sorry. Ben has no, please let's show some Respect.

1:45:28

Chris hasn't has no Oscars.

1:45:30

No Oscar three, zero nations.

1:45:34

My left foot has that incredible Miramax poster.

1:45:36

Cause like the Painted

1:45:38

post, it looks like a stigma Posters

1:45:40

or like the stain glass painted poster.

1:45:42

And then there's the Miramax one they put out later where it's just a fucking Daniel Day.

1:45:49

Lewis is headshot.

1:45:50

It's him with like long hair looking, super handsome, smiling.

1:45:54

And then Brenda Fricker in the background, like standing with her arms up like victory and it's in no way representative of how he looks in that movie or what the plan for that movie.

1:46:05

I look, it was a big deal. I don't know.

1:46:07

I mean, it's not a movie I love Fricker is incredible in it though.

1:46:11

She is such a deserving winner anyway, born in the foot utilized number, number one of the box office.

1:46:17

Number two is a buddy comedy buddy cop movie, kind of a classic of the genre.

1:46:24

I would say 89.

1:46:27

It's kind of a classic of the genre, Snow

1:46:32

lethal weapon in terms of success or whatever.

1:46:35

But like it's a pretty big hit.

1:46:36

That gets pretty good reviews with two big stars.

1:46:40

And I just feel like it's one of those, you know, it's a good buddy cop movie.

1:46:44

It's it's very, very energetic.

1:46:47

So their cops did it get a No

1:46:51

interesting. Should have It's

1:46:54

not tango and cash. It is tango, Tango

1:46:57

and cash. It sure is.

1:47:00

Yeah. Yeah. I've I think a very troubled production, but a pretty watchable movie.

1:47:05

Yeah. A Great, I've never heard Of

1:47:07

Sylvester Stallone and Kurt Russell SV.

1:47:10

They're rival detectives, but they got to work together because Jack Palance frames.

1:47:15

One of them for murder. I can't remember which one or both of them.

1:47:19

Maybe they're both waiting for murder. And Stallone's

1:47:21

like the button down when he's got glasses in the Stallone

1:47:23

is the nerd. He's tango and Kurt is the cowboy and he is cash and Teri Hatcher is in it and it's pretty good.

1:47:36

And it's directed by that Russian guy who like made all these, you know, big Russian movies and then Hollywood stuff.

1:47:43

It's

1:47:47

also just, I mean, it's the perfect name for a buddy cop movie cash.

1:47:51

Yeah. These two guys it's I believe it's the last film of the eighties.

1:47:55

Like if it gets the less film released in the eighties, really, it Makes

1:48:00

sense. These 1999, Like

1:48:04

that was it. Goodbye. Eighties, tango and cash is your sleep.

1:48:07

And the number three at the box office is another cop drama, but assist a serious cop drama.

1:48:15

It's a serious cop trauma from 1989.

1:48:18

Underrated in my opinion, directed by kind of an RD director.

1:48:23

Hm. A big star, Big

1:48:27

star crooked, crooked cop drama based on a real story.

1:48:34

It's one of those big stars though that everyone forgets is a big star, but he really was eighties and nineties.

1:48:38

He was a big star. You struggle with him?

1:48:41

I feel like, I feel like you haven't seen a lot of his movies.

1:48:44

Oh, okay.

1:48:45

Struggled

1:48:45

with

1:48:45

other

1:48:45

of

1:48:45

his

1:48:45

others

1:48:45

of

1:48:45

his

1:48:45

movies

1:48:45

and

1:48:45

Bob

1:48:45

in

1:48:45

the

1:48:45

box

1:48:50

office. Yeah.

1:48:52

But you don't know my opinion on the man.

1:48:55

Yeah. I don't know. Maybe you love him. I can't remember.

1:48:57

I think you'll like him.

1:48:58

He's

1:48:58

a

1:48:58

bit

1:48:58

of

1:48:58

a

1:48:58

silver

1:49:02

Fox.

1:49:05

If it was pointing at his head.

1:49:07

Yeah. He's you know, he's a silver Fox Fox.

1:49:09

He was a big star of the eighties and nineties.

1:49:12

I struggled to remember.

1:49:13

It's not a, it's not a Clint.

1:49:17

No, not Clint. No, no. Right. I'm Trying to think of who else.

1:49:19

There's silver Fox in the eighties and nineties really struggled.

1:49:22

David keeps pulling at his hair. I always, Is

1:49:26

it, I mean, I don't know the movie, but are you talking about of now?

1:49:31

I can't remember. Pretty woman Guy.

1:49:36

Yes I am. I am talking to Richard Gere.

1:49:39

What's your opinion on Richard Gere. Griffin.

1:49:42

Okay.

1:49:45

The good gears. No, I

1:49:48

haven't shifted into the right gear. I mean, I love days of having days of heavens, maybe one of my 10 favorite movies ever.

1:49:52

I

1:49:52

generally

1:49:52

struggle

1:49:52

with

1:49:52

gear

1:49:52

a

1:49:52

little

1:49:58

bit. Okay. This is a crooked cop drama with Richard Gere.

1:50:01

And I just feel like I'm not going to pull the fucking name of this.

1:50:04

What's it called? Troll on gear. I just, I had To get that out.

1:50:06

Your great, great, great.

1:50:08

200 comedy points. Great.

1:50:10

Well done. It's got a very generic name.

1:50:13

It's a Mike Figgis film and it's called internal affairs.

1:50:16

And it also features Adam Garcia, Nancy, Travis, Laurie Metcalf, and Billy Baldwin.

1:50:25

Wow. And it's a totally solid cop movie, but it's, you know, he's just got a lot of movies where you're like, oh sure.

1:50:33

Yeah. That thinks that okay.

1:50:34

He was plugging along posts like pretty woman in officer and a gentlemen, American gigolo like that's is like, you know, booming time.

1:50:43

The thing that doesn't exist anymore, where it's like Richard Gere is an a list leading man with him at the front of your picture, you can guarantee it will open to $8 million and 32 domestic PO

1:50:55

and random viable Model.

1:50:57

You didn't have to be a fucking half a billion dollar guy.

1:51:02

Absolutely. He razzle-dazzle them later though.

1:51:05

He did. He did. In fact, her hustle dazzle them later.

1:51:07

God, you Raymond so many content movies.

1:51:09

I'm just looking at his, he's made a lot of And

1:51:12

movies and a lot of nothing. Movies.

1:51:13

Number four at the box office.

1:51:16

Griffin is a film directed by a man.

1:51:18

You just, in on this episode in folk, as a director, I Invoked

1:51:21

this director. You

1:51:23

invoke this director. He directed this film, but he's also in it.

1:51:26

It's a black comedy and he's on the poster.

1:51:29

Like he's dreaming up the movie.

1:51:34

It's worth the roses. It's the war of the roses directed by Danny DeVito.

1:51:38

It's one of my favorite poster layouts ever.

1:51:40

Cause it's Douglas and Turner in bed.

1:51:43

And then DaVita's at the bottom of the poster, like indicating up.

1:51:46

I think, I feel like he's got a cigar in one hand He's

1:51:48

he's got a cigarette or a cigar or something and it's a cigarette and there's smoke coming out of it.

1:51:53

And the, the picture is forming from the smoke.

1:51:57

It's like, he's created it out of his cigarette.

1:52:00

Well, he is the director of the picture.

1:52:01

I

1:52:01

do

1:52:01

like

1:52:01

though,

1:52:01

it's

1:52:01

one

1:52:01

of

1:52:01

the

1:52:01

only

1:52:01

posters

1:52:01

that

1:52:01

it

1:52:01

feels

1:52:01

like

1:52:01

is

1:52:01

physicalizing

1:52:01

the

1:52:01

idea

1:52:01

of

1:52:01

like

1:52:01

Danny

1:52:01

DeVito

1:52:01

presents

1:52:11

Here you are. These two fucks are mad at each other.

1:52:14

Hey, it Comes to me.

1:52:18

It's a good movie. It's a very dark comedy.

1:52:21

Have you seen the war of the roses?

1:52:22

It's

1:52:25

It's all worthwhile. Thank you would love that Movie.

1:52:27

Like it you'd like it.

1:52:30

Okay. Yeah. We've talked about this though.

1:52:32

We're like Devita was one of the only guys who was able, it has been able to make pitch black comedies into like major hits and then it dropped off for him.

1:52:42

But he had a couple in a row where it was just like, how Was

1:52:45

that a bar man? Like first, first him starring and then him directing.

1:52:49

And then he's just also in it as basically Danny DeVito.

1:52:52

It's such a funny career yeah, I love the man.

1:52:56

Now, number five is a cult movie.

1:53:00

I would say, not a huge hit, but like a huge cable hit like a huge tail on this movie.

1:53:08

This was a real fun monster movie of the nineties that just whatever I guess, played on VHS forever got a bunch of sequels Sequels

1:53:18

in the nineties, like Video

1:53:20

sequels, right?

1:53:22

It gets videos. Sequels. It's a horror movie or is it a Yeah,

1:53:26

but it's like a comic horror movie.

1:53:28

Like it's like a fun monster movie or it's a monster movie.

1:53:32

Yes. Is the monster the title?

1:53:36

No. What the monster is making is the title.

1:53:40

What the Munster is making is This

1:53:43

film also stars. My favorite actor alive.

1:53:48

W oh, is this tremors?

1:53:51

It's tremors. Oh, I love tremors.

1:53:53

Tremors

1:53:53

is

1:53:55

great. What the monster is.

1:53:58

That's very tricky.

1:54:01

Right? But the big, the bacon gave it away to me.

1:54:04

Yeah. Kevin bacon in tremors. And it's one of those classic Kevin bacon things where he's like, what the fuck?

1:54:10

I make a movie.

1:54:12

It's good.

1:54:14

Yeah. It's fun. It comes out every word ignores it.

1:54:17

And then five years later, everyone's coming up to me being like, you know, what's great is tremor.

1:54:21

Yeah. And he's like, well, I didn't hear that in 1990 that it was great.

1:54:25

Like where were you? Ben? It's like the classic Kevin bacon situation.

1:54:29

Anytime he leads the movie.

1:54:31

People later watch it on tape and are like, yeah, that was good.

1:54:36

Why didn't I see that in a theater?

1:54:38

Yeah. It's wild. It's also fucking Ron Underwood.

1:54:41

One of the wildest careers.

1:54:42

That's his first movie.

1:54:44

Then he makes city slickers, which is a huge fucking your head.

1:54:48

But you would not expect that he's the guy hired to do that off of tremors.

1:54:52

Then he does hearts and souls.

1:54:54

The weird Robert Downey Jr.

1:54:56

Go serum, calm, Serious

1:54:59

comedy. Right, Right. Speechless.

1:55:00

Which is that new?

1:55:05

Yeah. Oh no, no, definitely not.

1:55:07

Speechless is what? Diane Keaton.

1:55:09

Michael Keaton, sir. Well, Keaton and G and Davis, the poster is just their lips, which is like, you're like, well, you did have the two most distinctive sets of lips of the early nineties.

1:55:17

It was, you had some good Mouth.

1:55:19

He had good lips. That's true.

1:55:21

That's a good point. It's like, fair enough.

1:55:23

But that's, I think they're both speech writers for rival political campaigns.

1:55:26

Then he makes mighty show young.

1:55:29

Yes. Right. He makes money a monster, sorry, gorilla.

1:55:32

You know The

1:55:35

fucking king Kong rip rip off.

1:55:36

He does Pluto Nash.

1:55:39

Oh God sure. Notorious

1:55:41

disaster. And then his final film is in the mix, which we all remember as the usher, Chazz Palminteri, crime comedy of 2005.

1:55:52

Absolutely. I Thanksgiving smash.

1:55:53

I forget Griffin that now he's working in the TV movie realm.

1:55:59

He made a movie called Santa baby, starring Jenna McCarthy in which she plays Santa and Mrs.

1:56:06

Claus, this daughter. And then there was a sequel called Santa baby to colon Christmas.

1:56:11

Maybe He's he's made like six Paul

1:56:15

Sorvino plays Santa in these movies, Cuffs

1:56:18

deck, the halls. He does a lot of Christmas TV movies.

1:56:21

It's also wild that like a bacon does tremors.

1:56:25

People are like, is this low rent for Kevin bacon to be doing this movie?

1:56:29

It does not hit.

1:56:30

It grows in popularity.

1:56:31

Years later, they do fucking eight sequels, right?

1:56:35

Direct to video and cable.

1:56:37

And then they're like, we're ready to properly reboot tremors.

1:56:40

We're doing a proper tremors TV series.

1:56:43

Kevin bacon is coming back and people were like, fuck, they shoot a pilot.

1:56:48

Doesn't get picked up.

1:56:50

Now I'm about to change my background to Paul Servino is Santa Claus.

1:56:53

Santa, maybe to Christmas, maybe, please enjoy.

1:56:58

Wow.

1:56:58

That's

1:56:58

not

1:56:58

my

1:56:58

vision

1:56:58

of

1:57:03

Santa. That's not your sadness. It looks a little rough.

1:57:05

He

1:57:05

looks

1:57:09

hacker.

1:57:11

He looks, he looks like Francis Ford Coppola.

1:57:13

Like he just looks like I'm not getting Santa's.

1:57:18

I'm sorry. There's another picture. I have to do this again.

1:57:20

It's that good? This one's even worse.

1:57:23

I'm sorry, Paul.

1:57:24

I truly respect you as an actor.

1:57:26

I think you're so great. But why did you play Santa when you just were going to look so tired all the time?

1:57:32

Grumpy

1:57:35

Is who's Mrs. Claus.

1:57:37

It's a good question.

1:57:39

There's only one way for me to find out Santa baby, two Christmas maybe's Mrs.

1:57:46

Claus is played by Lynn Griffin.

1:57:48

Hey, from black Christmas.

1:57:51

Wow. Okay. Fair enough.

1:57:53

Yeah. Anyway, so that's the box office game.

1:57:56

Griffin. You've also got all ways.

1:57:58

Steven. Spielberg's always, you have steel Magnolias, still chugging along, along with driving, miss Daisy, a lot of sort of, you know, weepy type movies.

1:58:08

Sue McNellie's is way better about the little mermaid at the end.

1:58:15

Yeah. And back to the future. Part two, still sticking around.

1:58:19

Well, I check a film's a past hanging on the outskirts of that 10.

1:58:23

Yeah. The only new movie this week is tremors.

1:58:24

And of course, sweetie, if you live in whatever the airport side or wherever this is And

1:58:28

tremors, tremors, wasn't even succeeding with a January release.

1:58:33

It's not even succeeding against fucking the third week of internal affairs or whatever.

1:58:37

That's why it's like eat a toilet bacon.

1:58:40

I'm still here, right?

1:58:43

Yeah. SV, thank you so much for coming back on the show.

1:58:46

Thank you. Thanks For having me.

1:58:48

You're you're one of a group of people who have recently told me how much you appreciate the show being long because it helped you kill time while doing long things where you listen to it on a road trip.

1:59:02

Yes. And I probably will do it. I think honestly, maybe we listened to it on the way to our wedding, but I think we'll also listen to it on the way to Thanksgiving, which is a long road trip.

1:59:13

You were like, it helps. Cause we can like get the whole road trip done and only three blank check episodes.

1:59:17

That was like a full day, 24 hours.

1:59:25

No, it, it is. It's it's it's like, okay, we won't even be done with this episode by the time we're there.

1:59:30

So that's Good. Right? I mean, if it's, if it's a bowl, which Do

1:59:33

you want, it's a, it's a great Joshua tree Palm Springs drive.

1:59:37

Right?

1:59:37

Final

1:59:37

season

1:59:37

of

1:59:37

search

1:59:42

party. We're recording this a little advanced. I don't know if it's about to premiere or if it's just premiered, This

1:59:46

episode is coming out January 16th.

1:59:48

So I think it will have just, just premiere.

1:59:50

Okay. So check it out on HBO.

1:59:52

Is it week to week or is it all dropping at once?

1:59:54

It's all Dropping at once, right?

1:59:57

I will say like, as I was talking about earlier, the thing I love that you and Charles do where you write yourselves into corners that you have to write past rather than like going for the obvious a to B sort of plotting.

2:00:09

Yeah. It makes it difficult. I would imagine when you're ending a show to figure out how to actually end it, because you've set up this standard where anything that feels like it should be the end of another show you can get past that had been said, I know how the season ends and it's insane.

2:00:23

And you actually have come up with the thing that you cannot write past.

2:00:25

So

2:00:25

I'm

2:00:25

very

2:00:25

impressed,

2:00:30

You know? Oh God, someone, someone said to me once, like when you, when you enter the sh show, you have to be like, I can't believe they went there.

2:00:39

And that really stuck.

2:00:40

I was like, okay, I hope that was worked out.

2:00:45

Yeah. I, I am.

2:00:46

I'm deeply impressed and I can't wait to watch the whole thing.

2:00:49

Oh, Sam. So excited.

2:00:51

Super excited. And everyone watched.

2:00:56

Yeah. Everyone watched everyone, everyone watch Every

2:00:59

single one of you.

2:01:01

And I want to thank everyone for listening and tell them to please remember to rate, review and subscribe.

2:01:08

Thank you to Marie Bardi for our social media, Joe blow and pat rounds for artwork, agent McKeon and Alex Barron for editing Nick Lauriano and JJ Birch for our research, Les Montgomery and the great American novel for a theme signed can listen to their new album extremely loud, incredibly online, wherever albums are found these days go to blankets out red.com for some real nerdy shit.

2:01:33

And you can go to patrion.com/blank, check for blank, check special features where we cover franchises.

2:01:39

And right now we are ghost busting.

2:01:42

We are, in fact, we are now the family that busts together.

2:01:48

Hey, if you haven't signed up for the Patrion, we're actually every release a day.

2:01:55

We'll also be offering from our archive, the Marvel commentary series.

2:01:59

So you can check out past episodes if you, This

2:02:03

is now our fourth year of the Patrion and going forward, we're going to start taking things out from behind the paywall after three years.

2:02:11

So on the first 11th and 21st of every month, if you're already a patron subscriber, you're going to get new episodes.

2:02:18

If you're not, you can go to our Patrion page.

2:02:20

And those episodes from three years earlier, there'll be a new one dropped every 10 days that will unlock from behind the wall.

2:02:29

Yeah. So Check it out. There's some fun stuff.

2:02:30

Marvel movies Guys.

2:02:33

Yeah. You can listen to three-year-old Marvel commentaries, including the one where on Spiderman from home.

2:02:41

I say, wouldn't it just be cool if Marvel, like didn't release a movie for 18 months and then the world ended and they couldn't, I'm sure didn't tune in next week for an angel at my table.

2:02:51

Who's the guest or is that the movie Fan?

2:02:56

And,

2:02:56

and

2:02:56

as

2:02:56

always

2:02:56

completely

2:02:56

blanking

2:02:56

on

2:02:56

the

2:02:56

boss,

2:02:56

baby,

2:02:56

like

2:02:56

sweetie,

2:02:56

I

2:02:56

don't

2:03:08

know. Yeah, she does. This movie has no quotes page and no tagline. A new film by Jane new film by Jane Campions. That's the tagline I'm seeing here on the -- Yeah. -- on the on the poster. And then there's a poll quote that says spectacular. It's a movie quite unlike any other you're likely to Sweetietypes original. It's from Vincent Vincent Campbell. The legend, he was right. Could I have taken an extra two minutes to look for other places where there's maybe a quote not on I to b. Yeah. Maybe I could've. I don't I don't know. I don't know. That's where it should be though. Yeah. I'm not seeing any tags. I mean, this is the first time we've had a movie that has neither. We've had movies before with no quotes page, but very few. Like like two or three in total. I remember Weve Build out the quotes page. This one's got lines. This one's got lines. Yeah. Official selection can nineteen eighty nine. That's a tagline on one of these posters. Okay. I got one. This is from cinema dash fanatic dot com, and they do a movie quote of the day. Mhmm. And here was their movie quote of the day at some point. What if it does, Doy. What? The podcast. Well, we'll get another one. Yeah. But this is our podcast. That's not gonna work the street. The street. Yeah. don't know. Yeah. I had to act accent was bad. I did a bad job. I wasn't crap. I don't know. I don't have to tell you. Great start to a great app, Griff. Look it's gonna keep on going. It's killer movie, But an absolute failing of the IMDP community, an absolute failing of the IMDB community. A website that's never done anything wrong. No. And look, this podcast is not gonna die. The roots grow really strong. They can split concrete. There you go. Hello everybody. This is blank. Check with Griffin and David I'm with Griffin and David. I'm Griffin. I'm David. I'm realizing now that you know this thing where people are logging pie cast on IMDB? I hate really? Like like What is that? Your movies? Yeah. Okay? Yeah. Like a podcast is like a TV show, and then every episode is like an episode and they add them to people's IMDB credits. There's a blank check IMDB page now. And someone should start building out that quotes page. Oh Oh God, here it is on my MDB god. But Weve it is on my MDB page. Right. You got the credit. But I think they're the only singular episode listed -- Fanger. -- playing with Inger White awake than no other episodes filled out. Well, someone get on that. Not me though. Not me. Not me. No. Thank you. This is podcast about thermographies. Directors who have massive success early on in their careers and they're given a series of blank checks, make it ever crazy passion products they want. Sometimes those checks clear and sometimes they bounce Sweetietypes good. That was a little that was a little joke. It's a mini series on the films of Jane Campions. It is called The podcast piano. The podcast DNO The podcast piano. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Oh, okay. And I only got it. Reaction. I only couldn't hear it when David said it. So I think I think visually I think visually it's going to track think visually it's gonna track. Today, we're talking about her second feature film. Her first one that was intended purely theatrical. Which is called Sweetietypes to the show. I got a cocreator of a search party. SIRPalpha Plus. Hi. Hi Sarah Brown. I'm making I feel feel shy. You should All of a sudden, you feel shy? Yeah. Th this happened last This this happened last time, I think, too. I recently, like, when you introduced me, I was, like, oh, no. Then you clam up. Right? The pressure's on. It's on, like, the wild west of the first couple minutes Weve you haven't been introduced yet. You can say anything, but it doesn't grow. A little giggle here In the little giggle, scattered giggles right off the the Little giggle. Scattered giggles. Right off the bat, I just wanna say there were there were two big text that happened in the blank check text thread last night. One is David sent us a video of No. I think just a picture. Was it not was it not like a live photo or something? Or was it just a live photo? It might be a live It might be a live photo. It might have been a life photo. I don't want to tell tails out of school. It was a life photo of his daughter, the boss baby. Oh. Watching Sweetietypes I just had it on, and she was transfixed by it. I think because it's so colorful. She doesn't always pay attention if the TV is on, but I think because it's just such a, you know, vibrant stark looking movie. She was But you said she could not stop looking at it. Transfix by Sweetietypes she's fully, like, locked Yeah. You just said her name there, which whatever. Oh, bleep it out. Bleep it out. Bleep it out. BOSS baby. BOSS baby. I saw this when I was a kid too, clearly older than her baby, but my mom was watching it. And I too was transfixed in a way that that really got under my skin. So Yeah. Yeah. It's gurbing. Yeah. Very, especially. Yeah. Super bleak and disturbing. And I you know. But, yeah, it's just funny to hear about your baby also having the same reaction I did as child. How old were old were you? I think that I was, I think I want to say I was think that I was I I wanna say I was nine. Like -- Okay. -- you know -- Yeah. -- something like that. Th this movie has like the aesthetics of a children's film This movie has, like, the aesthetics of a children's film, though. Like, it feels like a walled doll adaptation or something. You know? Yeah. It's weird. Got that energy. Okay. So David sends us that text about the boss baby last night. And then this morning, Ben text us. Do you do you wanna read your text, Ben? Oh yeah, yes, sure. I texted one of the best movies I've watched for this show. Well, you said, well, I get a kaswitty fart. Right. Right. Right. Because as we've said, David Stodder, the boss was transfixed by the movie, and I said I got it because And that is So it was the boss, Benny. It was kind of the boss, Benny, having a moment. And, yeah, I just this is what I'll say. Weve, look, obviously, get into it more. I like weird abnormal characters. And I just like when shit's different. And this is fucking hell and so refreshing. I just recently had watched back to back the new Marvel movies and then also kind of have regionally watched just recently had watched back to back the new Marvel movies Mhmm. -- and then also kind of had recently watched June. And I was just like so samey then I put this on last night, and I was like, man, I don't know. This is just exciting and and refreshing. Yeah. You know, it's another thing this movie has in comparison to the movies you just mentioned, colors. Oh, right. Colors. That's true. Yeah. It's all all anyone can talk about in this movie is the colors. But it is wild. Like, you watch this and you're just like, man, everything looks so fucking boring now. I also, so I saw this when I was a kid and then, and it stuck with also so I saw this when I was a kid and then and it stuck with me. And then I believe that it was on the NYU list of movies to watch, like, before you get there, you know, like a very long list of movies that are, like, these are these are important for the kingdom. Yes. And I was, like, looking it up and I was, like, oh my god. That movie. That's Jane Campion. Like, you know, this was just a child, you know, at the time, didn't have any reference for the filmmakers. And whatever. So, yeah, I just had a it it was like a I've had journey with the film, I think. So So it's like a movie that transfixed you when you were like a movie that transfix you when you were nine -- Yeah. -- watching it over your mother's shoulder. And it kinda sticks in your craw. And then, like, decades later, you see it on a list, recontextualize that as important film. Yes. And you realize that it's not like, oh, that's some odd movie that gave me a nightmare as a child. Right. That is actually a thing. Like a director I now know is taken seriously. mean, I think I mentioned this in the last episode. But my first time watching this movie, like, my awareness of this movie was, I I David, I wanna imagine was maybe a similar thing for you. But being, like, AAA criterion dork teenager. Right? Sure. And this is an angel at my table. I think we're both fairly early releases. And you're like charting what each month, you know, the new announcements are, And a lot of times, like, that that was the first I'd heard of some movie, especially if it was a more obscure, an earlier film in a major director's career. So it's like, oh, I know what the cover of that movie is. But sometimes criteria and has artistic interpretation does not necessarily convey the tone of a but sometimes criterion has artistic interpretation, does not necessarily convey the tone of a thing. And then whatever the, like, short description is on the website. Right? I just always assumed this movie, like, oh, chaotic Sister takes over house and life was more similar in tone to later Jane Campion movies. Like I thought it was in that vein, a friend of the podcast a passing future guest, Alex Charles Perry, and I went to see some movie at Lincoln Center, and this was playing right afterwards. And we were like, do I just stay for Sweetietypes yeah. This is Jane She's important. We should see this. Right? And then, like, five minutes into a turn to each other and said, I had no idea this was the tone of this thing. Like, even just the opening with the the fucking psychic reading the tea leaves -- Yeah. -- it was just a teaser. This is what this movie And and just being pretty, like, flummoxbite in a in a good way. Yes. But It is bizarre to watch this now, if with like the rest of her career in the back of your mind, I think versus like when this is her first major statement as a is bizarre to watch this now. Even with, like, the rest of her career in the back of your mind, I think versus, like, when this is her first major statement as a filmmaker. That's yeah. No. III know what you're saying because she becomes more of a whatever, lush and sort of prestige director, although she's always weird. I yeah. I don't actually know if I how how to totally click clear. It is unlike anything else she's made, I suppose. Although I do think it's it's sort of of a piece with an angel at my table. That's that's that's much very different movie, but they're both about being a young woman in some way, I guess. What is this? This sort of shared thing. Is this like her only movie that could be fairly categorized as a comedy? Yes. Well -- Right. -- It's an odd, an odd. It's an odd. I think holy smoke is the other one. Holy smoke is the one that's sort of very heightened. That's the only reason I'm I'm, like, holy smoke might have like, a lot of sweetie energy in a weird way. Yeah. get to holy smokes. I don't know. So SV like, are you a Campions fan in general? Like, do you I realized the whole I realized after like, because I was like, how does this compare to her other movies? And I I've seen the, you know, the piano the piano lesson. Whatever. And The piano lesson. Yes. And And, but like, it's pretty vague in my but, like, it's pretty vague in my head. And then I was, like, wait a minute. I haven't seen any of her other movies other than these two. Mhmm. So and I like, again, knowing that Jane Campion is is supposed to be important. I have yet not seen her movies except for this one that is stuck with me. And then when I think about the p the the piano lesson, I it's like the thing that really sticks with me from that is the weird sex scenes and that kind of resonates in this. Right? Absolutely. And and the non sex scenes is kinda like the sort of weird weird non sex in this movie. Yeah. Good. For me, look, Jane Campions came into my life because when I was Weve or eight years old, the piano came out. Right? I probably just I was seven. Right? And that was a movie where I was, like, vaguely aware of grown up movies at that point. I'm watching the scores. There's this movie called The piano. Right. And I'm like, oh, I'm like, oh, okay. This is that like this is like a music movie about someone who plays piano. And that was a movie that all adults had to see. Right? Like Yeah. -- like -- Yeah. -- which is so funny to think about considering that this was a New Zealand director of little you know, of, like, very arty note. Right? Like, you know, it suddenly made this big movie with American stars in it. And it's like, yeah. Well, we're all gonna go see the piano. And I just remember my mom being like, yeah. Yeah. You know, there's the piano on a beach and I I you know what? I can't explain the movie to you. III can't even begin. Yeah. Like, and that's how I feel like Jane can't be and goes for a lot of her and that that's how I feel like Jane Camping goes for a while of her movie was Yeah. And as much as she is a major filmmaker and has been for decades. She also has a filmography that's widely underseen because a lot of her movies come out and are greeted with, like, skepticism apart from the piano. Like and maybe bright star. Like, those are the and now the power of the dog, I guess. But even but a bright star got a little bit Yeah. It was not major. Like, it was it was it should Weve been. It was critically beloved, but it did not break through in the past or not. Right. Right? Not a lot of money. Right. I'm a couple Years younger than younger than you, and my distinct memory was, like, I think the English patient year was the first skers that I watch live where it was the same thing I'm like, okay, this is the grown up movie. This is the one that every time they play a clip, everyone goes like, oh, Oh my god. And that's like the year that the Weinstein's finally pull off the thing they had been working towards with the piano and other movies where it's like, Now it's a blockbuster and it wins every category. Right? Mhmm. Versus, like, piano gets these three big wins. It gets screen play and the two actress wins. But that movie more than anything, it's like, a, it becomes one of the sort of totemic like art house Oscar breakouts of the nineties. And b, it has these weird Oscar stats to it, which is like she's only the second woman nominated for best director Weve. And apocalypse the second youngest person to ever win best supporting actress. That's that will be this kind of reputation more than anything. But I also saw, you know, criterias now finally releasing movies on four k. And I saw someone online defending it being like, the thing that's great about period is they're putting four k releases out of movies that otherwise are really obscure and would have been forgotten like the piano. And I was like, You don't understand how large the shadow was of piano throughout the entire nineties. The shadow of But but it was and, like, her other movies couldn't come out from it. You know, but, like, it was it was a huge fucking deal. As you said, David, felt like a movie that was, like, mandatory viewing for all intellectual parents -- Right. -- had to see the panda. So that's why it's funny. To come back around yes. To this early -- to this early work. And you're like, oh, this is like having, like, what if your big sister was this, like, horny Poltergeist? Like that you couldn't get rid of. Right. Right. And it's so audacious in a plot way as well where, like, the movie is called Weve. It's ostensibly like the as you you might maybe you read the back -- right. The DVD Right. -- the DVD box, and it says, like, oh, it's about her sister bothering her. And you watch like, twenty five minutes and you're, like, where's her sister? I don't get it. Yes. Right? She's about, like, a mousy girl who's, like, steals away sort of a dumb guy. Like, well, I don't even know what you're you know, like, there's nothing about this movie that really obeys how movies are supposed to work. And it's all but better for it, I think. To your point, David, the first twenty five minutes, I'm sitting there going, do I misremember what this movie is about? I thought it's about a sister not only has the sister not entered, but so much has happened in the first twenty five minutes. She has her fortune told she realizes her coworker who just got engaged as actually the man she's destined to She steals him, makes that with him under a car, and the relationship goes cold. They're treated. They're already in trouble. Right. Right. Type of Weve shows up. They're sort of like a three act story of their relationship before sweetie enters. It's a lot of pressure to plant a tree, like, for your, like, relationship. I relate to that. Especially because it was founded upon almonds. Sure. It's like the first sign of the tree nut being healthy. It's like how are they not gonna get in their heads about it? It's just it is wild how fast this movie moves and how much it goes through. Yeah. I watched I watched this movie twice in the last twenty four hours because I watched it with commentary once. Oh, sure. Cool. I was just very curious to hear how she talks about this movie. Is it just her or is it like her and Jared Jared Weve or something? Her and the deep key and then Gerard. Oh, really? Shows up thirty minutes in like sweetie crashing the commentary and changes the whole flow of things. I did, like, minimal minimal research, but she and Gerard Weve had bitten in a relationship before they wrote the movie, which is -- Yeah. -- you know, pretty pretty weird. They hadn't been in a relationship and the movie is based on his family, but she kind of muddles that by debt, dedicating it to her sister, which makes, which makes you think it's about had been in a relationship and the movie is based on his family, but she kind of muddles that by dead dedicating it to her sister -- Yeah. -- which makes which makes you think it's about her, but she was like, no. My sister just been going through a lot of shit. I was kind of dedicated to her. The thing she says in the commentary is a a Campions mother has, like, a horrible depression. Yes. At the end of shooting this movie in the last couple weeks, her mother has a suicide attempt and her sister like packs up her life and goes to tend to her the end of shooting this movie in the last couple weeks, her mother has a suicide attempt. And her sister like packs up her life and goes to ten to her mother so that Campion can finish making the movie. So that's the main reason the sister gets the dedication. But it Also makes the context of the But even the context of the movie. Of course. Of course. But then you hear that, you also wonder is the movie perhaps a little bit more about her relationship with her mother than it is about her relationship with her sister. Because she's like, my sister is more gregarious than I am. But both of us are pretty grounded pragmatic people. But she does admit and there's this is in our dossier graph. Like, she knows she's being a little cheeky with the dedication because she knows how people are gonna take that. Like, she knows how it's gonna come off, but I do think like, this is obviously a heightened thing, but it is something that happened to Jared Gerard. That's his that's the same. Right? Yeah. Gerard Lee. Gerard But it's his brother, and they changed the sex of the sibling or or whatever, like, which something which is something Campion didn't want to do. All everything you read about the development of this movie does not conform with what you'd think watching the movie and take it off. Did she want it to be two brothers? I guess so. think she she was worried that it would come off odd to have it be about women, but now she's like, yeah, the movie's great. So whatever. Yeah. I mean and and, like, she becomes a a fan of Gerardly through his writing. Weve, you had already had some published work. Then they meet when she's in film school. They link up. They start dating pretty quickly. They make the short film together, her second short, which why am I forgetting they have passionless moments, which is very much his sense of humor and is the one other thing in her body of work that think is pretty similar to this. But it's like black and white, very voiceover But it's like black and white, very voice over heavy. It's a series of sort of vignettes of odd moments in people's lives, interactions, and stuff. So they make that together. They live together. She said the relationship progressed very She said the relationship progress like very quickly. They moved in together almost immediately. And then it sort of like organically came to an end. Sure. He seems like a intense dude, like you're saying. But they seem to be incredibly good, sir. Yes. They're buds. Right. So that's her second short, then she makes the third short. Girl's own story, then those three shorts and two friends at her TV movie debut, go to can she's sort of anointed as, like, this is the next great director. There's the quote I'm sure you wanna read David. Jill Jacob said to Philip Adams, head of the Australian film commission, you must give her lots of money, so she'll be in competition with the feature film in two years. He basically went to the head of Australian movies and said, like, fund this woman's next movie. And so I can come back. It's it's literally like the confound festival was like, she is important. If she does not tell her, come back after it is is a cyudal failing. The wildest fucking thing is that her initial intent was for piano to be her first which at the times SV was supposed to be called the piano lessons. Okay. Now you are right. You are right. So You were you are right. That is You were were right. You were right all along. You were right all along. You know, it's it's it's that I was like, okay, there's the the piano and then there's the I was like, piano teacher, and then there's the pianist. There's so many different that I was like, the piano lesson. The trilogy. It's the it's the piano trilogy. Yeah. McClain keys trilogy. It's it's wild that it's like that was her first idea. She has this in credibly like Sure. All very important film. Sorry. Yeah. Yeah. It's it's an odd like, important foreign art house trilogy. Yeah. No. It it's just wild that she, like, out of the gate, had that idea in her head. And it was more that she was like, there's that and then they're sort of like doing the early stages of what would become Angel at my Terrible. Right? Doing some sort of AAA janet frame adaptation, then those things on the table. Right? Right. But she starts writing piano first cannabis The movie she's been working on. Absolutely. She's noodling on Janet Frame. She has this heat from Khan. And her, like, logic to it is to some degree, like, I don't know if they'll let me make a movie like this later in my career. I mean, in different interviews, she said different things that make it sound like there were a lot of different factors that went to decision. But she was like, this might be the one moment in my career where I can make a very strange low budget -- Yeah. -- tonally off putting comedy. If I do the prestige movie now, a, I might not be ready for and b, it'll be harder for me to come back around and make this odd thing. Well, also, it's like people want a Jane Campion movie. They wanna see a Jane Campion movie right now. Later, she can be like, okay. You didn't like Sweetietypes I got a movie about, you know, Janet Frame. Is that interesting? And they'd be like, oh, well, sure. I know who that. You know, like later, you can hook them with a different hook. But right now, she's just like, yeah, I'm gonna make you a Jane Campion moving. But But but the two other people on the on the commentary are just like, I cannot believe the foresight you had to, like, organize that in your brain and understand that many steps ahead, how to build your career. And says this thing about when she was a kid, other kids would call her up and they'd be like, Jane, can III could use your help I wanna go to the pool today. I have some homework to I have some homework to do, I wanna go to the movies, and she'd be like, okay, this is the order in which you do things. That they would literally ask her for advice on how to organize their lives. Well, she's she's smart lady. But Yes. She's with Jared Lee. It's about being in a couple and the problem of being in love and not making able, you know, not having your relationship work. That's how she puts it. Right? Like, it's clearly, clearly, mining their own lives in this sort of weird love story. And the tree is right from their relationship. They had a tree growing in their backyard and he was obsessed over how they kept dying. And she was like, I don't care about that. I'm like working on my movies and my stuff. I I don't I don't give a shit about the tree. And that's why she, like, hits on the metaphor of like, the strength of a tree, like, the sort of, you know, and, like, the sort of frightening sight of a withering tree. The other thing that's really interesting in the commentary is she is so fucking goofy? In the like, when she's chatting? Yeah. The whole whole time. Yeah. And it doesn't feel like it's just because of this movie, but they keep on talking about how funny she is in general. What's Sally Bongers like? That's the director of photography who is kind of mysterious. Only really shot this. And disappeared. Was was a film school compatriot of hers? Right. Had a similar background Weve to art school. Yeah. This is a gorgeously photographed movie. It's sort of odd that she didn't really pursue that career, and she does apparently shoot Jane Campion's publicity photos to this day. Yeah. That's where you see her name. But I just wonder what happened to her. I mean, they don't say she does talk about, like, she's a trivia fact as the first woman to shoot an Australian film. Oh, wow. Oh, there you go. Right. And that it it can't be came to her and asked her to do it. Like it was a very natural like it was a very natural thing. And she was like, I felt acutely of the of the fact that none of my male film school classmates ever would have even considered me for that. And that I wasn't thinking of myself that way either. But with Camping, it was like a very obvious natural thing. There's a really interesting thing about the the sort of development of her visual style here where they're talking about how both of them really liked having lockdown shots without movement and loading as much into the frame as possible. And having the frame change over you know, a a long static time where through motion, the the composition of the frame can change dramatically. And they're taught all the philosophical reasons they like that and whatever. But the other thing they said was that there was only like so much equipment and all the guys at their film school were very competitive about trying to, like, sign up for who can rent out the cranes or the dollies or any of the other things to do these like incredibly complex moving shots. And they were like, I don't wanna fucking play that game. We're never gonna beat them at that. We're never gonna get our hands on the equipment. Let's figure out how to make the most out of doing the opposite of what everyone else is doing. And so I do think a lot of her being brought on to be the DP in this and everything is like, Sort of the two of them bonding in the foxhole, you know, to a certain extent. Definitely. And and it also sounds like they were both similarly frustrated by how didactic so much a film school was and how much they were constantly being told, like, you have to do this, you can never do this. Both in terms of the visual language, in terms of screenwriting and everything. And this movie is in many ways like them to all movies. Right. It's a rebellion to all movies, but it's also a movie about someone who refuses to conform to society. Yes. And its rules, which is the thing that Campions like, in her mind, all of her movies are about, that. She's fascinated by the idea of society and how we're told we're supposed to behave within it and how a natural that is when people push up against that in any that she's fascinated by the idea of society and how we're told we're supposed to behave within it. And how unnatural that is and when people push up against that in any way. And this is the movie that is that both in in, like, sort of text and in actual form. But it's it's a it's a very rich metaphor. The whole idea of is is odd. But III don't I don't know how I'll support it. Like, the idea of your your sister or your sibling or whoever, like someone who you are like, this person is a problem, this person is messing with me and no one else being aware of it. Like, I just love how outsized she is compared to everyone's reactions to her through most of them. But you know what I mean? Like -- Yeah. -- like that she's she's she's so wild and only one person seems to really be bothered by that until until the end. Then more people get bothered by it, guess. But it's also I think it's like this movie is somewhat about the pains of of trying to live in a society as a quote unquote logical person. Right? Right. She's trying to live by rules. Right. She's trying to live by rules, but also the first act of this movie is her throwing herself out of her comfort zone and being like, What if I go to a psychic? What if I follow signs from the universe? And that's not totally working for her either. You know? Something I loved is her relationship to the people her coworkers. Like, obviously, she steals the boyfriend away, her fiance. Yeah. But like, in the beginning, when they're like, do you wanna look at the ring? She's like, I'm not interested in that. Like, the way she says it, it is so abnormal. And against societal rules, I fucking I'm, like, immediately in on this character. Not really my same. Yeah. I'm not really that's not really my thing. Like, that is such a funny answer to that question. She's as strange as sweetie just in a completely different way. Yeah. Karen Colston is the actress, playing k. She's so good. She's in multiple Campions movies. As is Genevieve Lemon Jean Vievre Lemons. Sorry. No. No. Genevieve. Yeah. I don't know. Genevieve lemon who is Genevieve Lemons, who is great and who I think a lot of people in Australia know from other things as well. She was like, on neighbors, which is the famous soap opera for That was her sort of breakout. And she'd done a lot of guest starring parts on -- That's Australian sitcom. -- neighbors. Become good friends. That's the theme song to neighbors. You know the neighbors then? Neighbors is a huge deal in Britain. But how much do you know that? That I Explanation only What? And beyond that, I was a member of the Neighbor's Society, which was a university society that I belong to. You paid five pounds to enter. Our only platform was that neighbors should be played at the student union anytime that neighbors is on the air. Which was, like, twice a day, like, twelve and five or something like that. And Weve which we succeeded in that, and then we had thousands of pounds because everyone decided to join the Neighbor's Society. we threw a huge party on the beach. Wow. Mhmm. I mean, I was barely involved in any of this, but did all happen. That's nice. You didn't you didn't pocket it. You you spread the love. You said we were like, well, right. Yeah. We got a yeah. Weve, good neighbors become good friends. Neighbors much like home and away is the other big Australian. So but Neighbors is one of those soaps that it's like it's like porn with the sex cutout. Like, it's just a sort of this very strange heightened world. The dialogue is very bizarre. You know, like, It's just sort of a cult fascination in British -- Yeah. -- neighbors. Anyway, when else am I gonna sing the neighbor's song on this podcast? Bring to bring. The phone's ringing. I'm gonna pick it up. Click hello. I'm perfect config. Free sort of a funky baseline is playing. Sort of a slap Whoa. Whoa. Who's this? What about these gimmicks? You guys hear about these gimmicks? Oh my god. Is it famed nineties comedian Jerry Seinfeld? There's no nineties. There's no work today. You should a b movie? Weve, no. You know what I did Weve? You had a special on Netflix. Not that long ago. Right? Yeah. It was a movie. B movies. B movies ago. I only on B movies on Netflix. Does the millennials love B movies? It was called twenty three hours to kill. Wow. I really had to search for that. There's so much about B movie with the bitch. They do. They do. They're always going crazy for B movie. Weve, anyway, it's nice to hear from you, Jerry. And what what are you talking about gimmicks here? Yeah. Can you hear about these again? It's mattress companies. Oh, mattress gimmicks. I promise again. You're talking about these mattress companies that put any kind of topper on them or give you heavy blanket or something. It's all lipstick on pig. It's funny. If you're sleeping on a terrible mattress, your sleep will be terrible. And I know it's funny and that's why you, one of the world's most famous comedians, is here to talk about it. That's why I showed up. Because this entire premise is so funny, it could only be presented by an incredible observational Campions. No mere copy ad writer can come up with premises funny. Jerry, I have somebody to tell you, I have a I have something to tell you. I have a recommendation. Please. I recommend sleeping on a purple mattress because only purple mattresses have the gel flex grid. That's a super stretchy ultra squishy material that adapts and flexes around pressure points and doesn't retain heat, That's a super stretchy, ultra squishy material that adapts and flexes around pressure points and doesn't retain heat. David. Yeah. That is the least funny thing I've ever is the least funny thing I've ever heard. There's no joke here. The gel flex grid is amazingly supportive for your back and legs while cushioning your shoulders, neck and hips, no matter how you The gelflex grid is amazingly supportive for your back and legs while cushioning your shoulders, neck, and hips no matter how you sleep. Okay. Nothing funny about Nothing funny about that. And unlike memory foam, which hilariously remembers everything, An unlike memory foam, which hilariously remembers everything. Yeah. Right. Pretty funny. Pretty funny. The gel flex grid means that purple mattresses bounce back as he move in The gelflex grid means that purple mattresses bounce back as you move in shift. You never have You never have that. I'm stuck feeling people get with memory that I'm stuck feeling. I don't know. People get with memory foam. Sometimes I see a mattress that go, it's a to see a mattress that go. It's Stoker. It's a It's a stalker of George. Yeah. These bouncy purple These bouncy purple mattresses. They've got this crazy they got this crazy grid. You got, you got one coming to got you got one coming to you. you, Griff. I think I have a mattress coming to I think. I I do. I have mattress coming to me. I look, I'll I'll be honest. I've had a hard time sleeping recently because the mattress I have right now is, is too had a hard time sleeping recently because the mattress I have right now is is too funny. These gimmicks are too funny that I do not get a good night's sleep and I wanna just be sued and relaxed. I'm sure it interrupted, but I'm I'm getting pretty worried here. Why are you worried? Well, I can't make any funny observations about this this. Purple purple mattress. Usually have good to find a comedic angle into anything, but there's nothing funny about the Usually, I'm gonna find a comedic angle at anything, but there's nothing funny about purple. There's nothing the There's nothing funny can try it. Risk-free with free shipping and returns, there's financing available to look it's it's, it's straight down the middle of serious risk free with free shipping being returns. There's financing available too. Look, it's it's it's straight down the middle, serious stuff. I'm doing a nice middle movie Pop-Tarts. I can't find a single angle on the purple can't find a single angle on the purple mattress. Okay. Look, Jerry, getting a great night's sleep starts with having a great Look, Jerry, getting a great night's sleep starts with having a great mattress. So get a purple So get a purple mattress. Go to purple.com/check 10 and use code check Go to purple dot com slash check ten and use code check 10. For a limited time, you can get 10% off, any order of $200 or more that's purple.com/check 10 code check 10 for 10% For a limited time, you can get ten percent off any order of two hundred dollars or more. That's purple dot com slash check ten. Code check ten. For ten percent off any order of two hundred dollars or more. Purple dot com slash check ten promo code check ten terms apply. Take care. Yeah. Can I plug something I plug something quickly? Yeah. Go ahead. got a new movie out on Netflix. It's called B movies. It's a new movie. It's not new. It's strictly mid two thousand. They do. They are always doing memes. At SV. Yes. You saw this movie as a child? Yes. You rewatch this movie when you're going to NYU or did you just note it on the list? I'm pretty, I, I re I'm like, did I have your watch or did I just watch the trailer to be like what there I pretty I I re mhmm. I'm like, did I rewatch it or did I just watch the trailer to be like, what there was so I think I think this has happened that I watched the trailer because I was like, I can't I I can't watch all these movies. And so let me see which ones, like, whatever. And then I watched trailer, and I was like, oh, it's that movie. And think I was also, like, I don't wanna watch it again. And then I also think that if scenes were brought up in classes at one point. Like, I know that I've revisited it Okay. A couple of times, but not, like, fully until watching it for again, for this. And so, like, what was the like? Preparing my big question. Right. Like, how does this movie compare to your memory of it as a child as a thing that's kind of on to you? Yeah. That's you know, what it's so the movie is so primal that there are still things about it that affected me in the same way that it's like it just gets in you in this kind of way that as a child, I didn't understand what was making me so uncomfortable. And then as you know adults, it was like, Oh, okay. It's these family dynamics that are, like, impossible to break and, you know, everyone's sort of falling apart that really touch on, like, the shadow of of of what families can become and be, and feeling feeling like just an ickiness. Again, like, I I both times feeling icky. This time, I would say it was, like, I'm not I don't think I'm actually enjoying watching this, but I'm feeling like, I know that it's really good. You know, it's like -- Mhmm. -- I I don't feel, like, I want to necessarily recommend this to people. But but I but you have to like, it's it's definitely good. And, like, moving in a way that has stuck with me both times or however many times I've watched it. It it is an odd watch. Like, it does make you feel physically strange watching this movie. Yes. Something comparable movie. I, like, I found myself being, like, much more of this. Yeah. Would you be, like, checking the timeline though, like, I was fully appreciating it the whole time just being, like, And the end is so particularly upsetting if you've seen it before. You're kind of watching it in red knowing where you're gonna end up. Yeah. Even watching it the first first time as a kid, I feeling direct. Like, that that scene really stuck in me. I was like and I was like, oh my god. It's the like, when I when I, like, rewatch the trailer or whatever it was for film school, I was like, oh, it's the that movie where she's jumping up and down in treehouse naked and covered in crap. You know? Like, it's just like oil. Yeah. Like, and, like, you know, I picked up on, like, the weird sexual dynamics too between like, you know, how it's, you know, something that really disturbs me in any movie is, like, adults who are children or, like, like, a noise really disturbs me. Like, anything that are, like, the adult is actually a child inside or, like, the child is an adult inside like, you know, the, like, the reveal is that the person you thought was a child is actually an adult or a Benjamin button or whatever. That stuff really really disturbs me. I'm kind of now just as I'm talking about it, I'm like, I wonder if this was the origin of that, but she, but like when she's like, you know, bathing her father and you're like, what, what is I'm kind of now just as I'm talking about, I'm like, I wonder if this was the origin of that. But she but, like, when she's like, you know, bathing her father and you're like, what what is this? Wait. Now you're throwing this at me, you know? Wanna pin in the bathtub thing and circle back to that at some point because the campaign said in the commentary is really interesting about it. But I do think, yes, this movie has the vibe of movies that like, upset me as a child, but that I compulsively rewatch, things that were in, like, cable rotation. And I do think you're right that a lot of them have to do with, like, why is this adult acting like a child? Whether that's, like, part of the premise of the movie or it's just sort of a miscalibration. Mhmm. Weve you're, like, the this is broken. Like, the tone of this is off. This should be for me and it's upsetting me. And Weve is the only one of the movies in that sort of zone with that feeling that actually isn't meant for children. But yet, it like, fuck it captivates you and David's infant boss baby. Like, there's there's something there. I mean, what's her name? Genevieve Lemon on top of doing neighbors and sitcoms and whatever, had done a play in which she played a child. And, like, that was the thing that sort of brought her to them at their attention and said, like, oh, this is if she could do that for the whole movie, that's what we need. And there's the story of, like, the first day she's working with the actor, the little boy. He goes up to her and asked her. So are you a grown up or a kid? Oh, wow. And not as like what are you playing, but as a like -- Right. -- I don't understand you. Yeah. You are the size of a grown up. Yeah. But you so thoroughly seem to be a kid. It's like unnerving, which is the whole central like conflict of the movie, really. Yeah. But, like, a movie I talk about way too much that I'm obsessed with a sitting the mets with the wiz, which I had a very similar relationship to where I, like, watch that when I was a child and I was like, why does this make me so uncomfortable? And I felt very haunted by it. And then, like, twelve years later or whatever, I start watching all the New York seventies, Sydney Matt movies. And I'm like, this guy's the fucking best. What else did he make in the seventies? He made the wiz. What the fuck are you talking about? So then I rewatch the wiz to see how it fits into like my nightmare memories of it. And then it's more confusing to try to go like How is it possible that this is the same person, but also how did I not put together the weird connections between these things? The way in which they do overlap, it's just this thing is so visually and totally different than than everything else this person's ever made. She talks about in the commentary this thing about how, like, so much of her visual style this movie was not a deliberate thing that it was sort of an organic process with her. And she keeps on saying, like, I have no idea why I did that that way. And then she goes, like, I guess, I probably if I'm looking at it now, I would say. But you keep talking about how there was no sort of, like, intentionality behind it. She has this really interesting line to where she's talking about. Like, the frustrations of thinking that everything needs to fit into a clean three act structure and like film school forcing her to read, like, Sidfield and Robert McKee and shit like that. And she was saying, Robert McKee, he apparently cites her movies often as a thing not to do. Right. Well, that makes that makes sense. This movie does not obey anything about story structure, movies, story structure. It is it is successful in spite of that or it's successful because of that. Like, that's up to you. Like, to decide. I think it's successful either way. But, like, it's certainly if I was, like, I'm thinking, like, a sweetie plot structure sure. Right. I I don't know if I could pull that off. Like, for for basically anything. Well, this is the thing she said that I was really fascinated by it. So, like, Gerard Lee is kind of like saying that, like and they talk about a lot how, like, can't be in seems very serious from her work, but is in fact a pretty light, funny, goofy person. And Gerard Weve mostly makes comedic things and is like a very swollen kind of gross guy. And that, like, that's often the balance of how artists work sometimes, you know, is there can be an interesting inverse from their personality to their sensibilities in their work. And that's part of why they work so altogether. But they're talking about the fact that Broadway like, really hard on himself about the fact that this movie does not conform to its React structure. And she said, a, I don't think that's necessary. And b, I think we write that way to some extent without thinking about it. I think you're kind of fucked if you sit down and you outline it and you go, it has to do this and this has happened by page thirty. And whatever. I think if you watch a lot of stuff and you internalize it and you know the stories you wanna tell and you let those stories guide you, we do tend to organize things in this way and the analogy she comes up with is, like, when we speak, we do not consciously think the next sentence I'm going to say needs to have a verb, it needs to have a subject. You know? I agree more. I've had these thoughts myself. But you don't if you just kind of instantially know how to make a story and you literally, when you're just telling retelling a story that happened to you, you don't you self edit very quickly. You don't grammatically process or plan out things in advance of when you're saying them, but you basically know how to speak as a person and will more often than not say a correct sentence, unless you're me who the fucking verbal diarrhea is all the don't grammatically process or plan out things in advance of when you're saying them, but you basically know how to speak as a person. And more often than not say a correct sentence. Unless you're me who the fucking verbal diarrhea is all time. But she's saying that, like, pray, if you watch enough stuff and you've gone to phone and you've made your own shit and whatever, it's not really helpful to sit down and force your script to fit into that box. That stuff's gonna be in the back of your head to some degree. And she was sort of arguing how the movie does fit into a thorax structure. I was going to say, it's like, it's like, it's not like you can't follow it or anything, you know, it's like, yeah, gonna say it's like it's like it's not like you can't follow it or anything. You know, it's Right. Right. It's three it's like a 9X structure, but each That's what this Right. Is is at least there's at least three acts if you want. It's just it's just the the opening is there's just two sort of sharp left turns in this movie. Yeah. And those that's where the act breaks kind of are, I guess, if you wanna think about it that way. You know you know, I'm not too worried about it. But this movie just sort of transforms a couple times. And that's that's as good a way as I need to tell story, I think. Like, And by when sweetie shows up, as much as the first chunk of the film is sort of bewildering in its way, like, did it move so fast and that so much is happening. You're also very ensconced with k. You're you're on her side. Like, I think you need to be on her side when sweetie shows up. Because otherwise, you it would not just seem it would just be like, well, this is family of weirdos. You You know what I also didn't like, realized when I was first watching it or is like, in the first in the first part before sweetie comes, Kaye is really child like, but I didn't I didn't recognize that until sweetie comes. So I was like, oh, she's she's also like just has a rest of development as Weve. And I didn't realize that until now that I see sweetie. When k is so disturbed by the tree with the yellow leaves, that they planted. And can't stop talking about it, and can't stop asking questions about, like, why? You know, like, is this a problem? And then her solution is to rip it up, rip it out of its roots, and then hide it in her room. That is such a six year old decision. Like -- Yeah. -- I feel like know what I mean? Like, when you're sixteen, you're like, I broke something. How am I gonna deal with this? And it's not like, you know what? Let me, like, take it outside and put it in the trash. It's like I put it under my bed. Yeah. No one's gonna see it there for some re like, you know, that's just logical what you're in. And if they ask you about it, you should just go. I don't know. Yeah. I don't know why it's I don't know why it's there. I don't know what I have now. Th th this movie has such a specific visual style that, like I was listening to this commentary, assuming that she was going to break down like the math of everything she was This movie has such a specific visual style that, like, III was listening this commentary assuming that she was gonna break down, like, the math of everything she was doing. Right? And she keeps on sort of, like, talking about how much of it was instinctual and then trying to sort of retroactively analyze what she must Weve been unconsciously doing at the time. But the couple of things she keep saying or like, a, write the rebellion against film school and being taught. There's a right way to do everything and trying to test whether that's bullshit or not. Right? But then a lot of her decisions were just very broad general things Weve, like, She's like, I didn't have a color palette for this movie. There wasn't some key for what colors represented, what things. I just thought there should be a lot of color in it. Like, I wanted that sort of, like, cartoonish energy throughout the whole thing. And then the weird framing, like, the focus of the shot is never at the center of the frame. And if there are multiple focuses, they are at complete opposite ends of the frame. And you Weve, like, shot, reverse shot coverage Weve both characters in their coverage will be in, like, the lower right hand corner with all this negative space or some other weird object in the other quarter, all this sort of shit. And she was like, hey, I thought it was interesting. And if I were to look at it now and try to think about what I was doing. I think it was from the very beginning consistent throughout the entire movie trying to create sense of unease. So you have the color and the sort of energy and the poppiness making this movie feel like it's comedy, but I'm never gonna let you get comfortable because every single frame is kind of unbalanced and quote unquote incorrect from how we're taught movies should look, which is just such a simple but, like, obvious way to approach it, you know? Yeah. It's honestly, it's kind of like it's like relief as a director being like, oh, you don't have to, like, over things. Like, she's just like, I don't know. I just chose it this way and this is and guess that my subconscious was doing the work for me to make it feel uneasy or whatever, you know. And, like, how as I was watching it when you're talking about, like, a character being in one side of the frame or whatever, I like, my film school. I was like, are they crossing the line Weve, or is he just another frame, like, I can't There they cross the line? Yeah. There they. But it's like I don't even think they're crossing the line. It's I don't think they're crossing the line. Opposite of the language we're sort of used to of how these things look and feel and whatever. But it like, fucking doesn't matter. It achieves the effect she wants of putting you in the right head space to watch this movie. And I I do think so often, like, She says this thing too about how and this is part of her sort of philosophy of having the camera lock down and having as much happen in one or two shots as possible within a scene or whatever. But that, like, she'd watch other film school people who would like, two really important shots in a sequence. And then would wanna shoot like three or four other setups of coverage just for insurance. Right. And she was like, Weve, then you're just you're you don't have enough time for anything. The two shots that actually matter, you're rushing, you're not getting them right. Or the performances aren't the performances aren't right. And then you're getting a bunch of other shots that you don't need. And I was like, what if I only spend my time on the shots that I actually do need? And I take the time to make sure there's good as they possibly could be in every sense. And she said, they do the dailies every day. And she had a lot of, like, female crew members on this, but it was still probably when you say a lot of female crew members, it's probably fifteen to twenty percent female. Right. Yeah. And they would do these screens of the dailies at night and the crew and the men would like laugh really hard. They'd be like, this is great. Oh my god. This is so good. Should've shot more coverage though. Like even when it was working, they still acted like she was doing something wrong by not giving herself out to cut away from the weird thing she had chosen. She was like, but it's working. Like, you yes. You'd like it. Like it, it fucking served its intent, Like, it it fucking served its intent. But some and some of these shots, like, the the there's the the way that all the women are curling their hair at the same time. I love that shot. There's the the two cowboys doing the weird dance together. Yeah. Oh, that that scene is also so that that scene is also so confusing. I'm like, wait. What this is the Weve did they go? Like I don't I don't know. He said this is a thing that she likes a lot, that she did a lot in financing. Nope. To go to see the mounds. Oh, sure. Sure. Which are the thing about New Zealand's. Right? You know, it's not a weird shit going on in New Zealand. Essentially, I keep thinking about, like, pre internet New Zealand. You know? Yeah. There's only so much you could fucking do, like, probably. Made it sound like it was a semi widespread thing that she liked a lot, that she wouldn't do it very often. And I think so. Go to big dirt mound. That's what they do they're they're like, we're going on a vacation without Weve, and that's what they do. Right? That's -- Right. -- what that is. It's like, you can't come to this weird such a Like, you can't come to this weird thing. Like, the The D dirt mound, dirt mount hold down. I mean, the mother in this movie is a country western singer who had never acted before. Mhmm. And she's very The dad too, that had never acted, dad too. Dad had never acted. Right? Dad was like a background actor. Well, I had never done, like, dialogue before. Yeah. He just she just loved his eyebrows. He's got those nice dad browse. But she also said that he showed up on set, and he had, like, memorized all the dialogue and he was, like, so. And my mine was supposed to say it like a poem, What? Like a poem? Right. Right? He was like, how am I supposed to say was like, how am I supposed to say this? And it wasn't like he was looking for line reading because, like, I don't know how people talk on camera. It's fair. As I wouldn't know. And then the kid, she said, like, he his parents worked so hard to get him memorized that he showed up on set and he knew every line back and forwards, but only as one continuous chunk. Like, he only learned his lines. And she said, like, do you know your lines and he did the whole thing? And she had to, like, work to break it into pieces because he couldn't separate the lines in his mind. Well, she did a fantastic job because I love this kid. This dude is He was great. He is best. He's like, buy a truck. He's just so rambunctious. There's a a really nice thing on the Blu ray too with the the two lead actresses who, like, have remained best friends to this day, like, met on this movie and love each other. Jennifer Lemon was saying that, like, she loved to sing on set. And she would, like, do it in all the downtime. And then Campion started saying, like, while they were setting up shots, like, can you do another song for me? Can you do that one? I'm just, like, stressed out. Can you do the song and would make her perform or perform for the entire crew, like multiple times a Can you do the song and would make perform or perform for the entire crew, like, multiple times a day and the two of them would do these songs together. And it was like, oh, she's like humoring me and how much of a ham I am that I like to do this. And then, like, whatever it is, four or five years later, they're doing the piano. Right? Both of them are working on that movie as well. And she noticed that, like, with Anapakon who's, what, nine at the time, while they're setting up shot keeps on saying, like, Anna Park, can you, like, do a song? Can you, like, do a routine for everyone? Can you do, like, a handstand or something? And then she was like, oh, I thought she was humoring me as a performer. She was treating me the way she was later gonna treat this child, which is It is helpful to have them do a thing to get a lot of their energy out of their system and then make them focus right before it takes turns. That's a good trick. David? Yeah. What's up? I wanna do an exercise with you quickly. Okay. I love exercise. Now put down those hand weights. I'm not talking that kind of exercise. I'm talking about a mental exercise. Okay. Alright. I'll I'll pick up my my brain weight. Weve just close your eyes and put your fingers to your temples like Professor X. Okay? And I want you to run your your little noggin through this scenario or run it through your noggin rather. Okay? Mhmm. I want you to imagine that you're a filmmaker shooting a comedy about the end of the world. That's the twist. It's a movie about a cry cry subject. Okay? III Look, this is this is too big a total mash up to for me to handle. David, I'm not done. There's another wrinkle here. At the time that this is happening, you're making the movie sure. Right. Ha ha movie about a cry, cry Movie about a cried cry subject. It feels like the world is really ending. What do you do? Oh my god. I I would love to hear all about that crazy situation because it's it's just too much for me to handle. I think the only way you could cope in a situation like that is commissioning a official podcast about the behind the scenes making of that process. Right? Yeah. Well, you know me, I like to process everything through your you know me, I like to process everything through podcast. So yes. Of course. Right. We exclusively live on microphone. And and that's the story of the last movie ever made. It's an official podcast about the making of Don't Look Up, which is a little movie that's on Netflix that I like, I'm glad we're promoting it because no one's talking about this thing online. Mhmm. I believe it's their most watched movie ever. I'm throwing sticks. I'm throwing sticks and I'm going somewhere give me any opinion on don't look up. And everyone's just kinda going like, I what is this? I've never heard of this. Look. This podcast documents happened when Anna McCabe brought hundreds of crew to Boston to make a movie in the middle of the pandemic? Not just any cast. It's not just any cast. No, we're talking. Leonard and Capri agenda for Lawrence, Merrill Street, Tyler Perry, Jonah Hill, Timothy Chalamey, Cape Blanchett, Rob Morgan, Kid Cuddy, Ariana Grande. By day, they're making a satire about social collapse by night, they're isolated in hotel rooms watching society collapse on the night News. Recording their reactions in real time. Uh-huh.cry Ha ha cry, cry cry. I do wanna just quickly say that in the ad copy they sent us, there is a hyperlink after Timothy Shalomay's name that says pronunciation and brackets, and it links to a clip of Himans and Daya playing, quote, dooner or later on Kulbert Show. So I appreciate that helpful hint and also just a fun excuse to watch Duner or later. I'm gonna watch Yeah. I'm gonna watch it later. Look, this That's the last movie ever the last movie ever made. Okay? And the first two episodes came out on January 7th. They're out now on apple, Spotify or wherever you get your They're out now on Apple. Not now. Autify or wherever you get your podcast. Yes. It's the last movie ever made. Yeah. Out now. Uh-huh. Kregari. Go check it out. Should we talk the plot of Yeah. sweetie? You know, not, not as, as you're saying, not entirely conventional, but this first chunk I do find you know, not not as as you're saying, not entirely conventional, but this first chunk. I do feel very story. If not, not, yeah. It's a lot of story. Yeah. Or winning is maybe not but, like, it's very engrossing watching this odd person k -- Yeah. -- navigate being a grown up kind of badly, but sort of you're still wither. Oh, wow. I'm looking at IMDB -- Mhmm. -- Griffin, the the story you know how IMDB has those, like, those those little keywords that they put for every movie. Yes. Yes. So here are the top five for Sweetietypes full frontal nudity, replanting, mouth to mouth, death of sister, riding man like a horse. Hell yeah. Okay. That's a great tag, man. Wait, I'm gonna follow that. I wanna see where that leads me. I wanna see what else is under under that tag. Yeah. Two things can't be and says very casually in the commentary things Campions says very casually in the commentary. One, she likes to have characters take their clothes off in every movie possible. Because she she wants, like, vulnerability and she wants, like, people in their most awkward sort of open states with each other. And two, she likes, if possible, to fit in at least one moment of a main character going to the toilet in every movie. First, she just likes to keep it real. She just keeps it real. That's what it is. Right? But her DP, excuse me, I keep forgetting her name. She's got a great name, and her name is Sally Bongers. Sally Bongers was saying how radical radicalized, like, all the male crew members felt when this guy just casually takes his dick out on set, and that all the female crew members Weve, like, do you understand how many times we see female nudity in movies -- Sure. -- that this is, like, not a a thing that that it wasn't any sort of statement for her. But I think after seeing how affected people were by it, then she was like, I'm gonna fucking do this in every day. It's gonna be it's gonna be in all the Campions mean every movie. That because, like, that sequence that like, sweetie hasn't even shown up yet at that point. No. It's, like, that's what I mean. It's into the movie. She's the relationship Has gone gone cold. Right. She steals this guy away because he's got a question mark on his forehead sort of. Which also, by the way, for some reason, the question mark yeah, the sort of question mark on his forehead. Also, for some reason, really stuck with me when I was a kid and being like, oh, yeah. It's creepy. I don't know. So I didn't like it. It's just a really, like, weird thing that that I'm, like, one of these the things in this movie that I'm like, I don't know why, but that's making me uncomfortable. Right. He's got a a Superman curl on his forehead. And then a moles -- Right. Understood. -- question mark. Right. And so that's the reason enough and they have this kind of hot encounter underneath a car in a parking lot. But And then they move in together, I guess. But that by the time Weve before suite is shown up, their relationship is has gone cold like you said Griffin and they're like, okay. Well, what if we just, like you know, let's have sex tonight. We'll, like, put it in the books. And we have to plan it. We have to organize ourselves. Right. Even though they're like, God though they're like like God knows, they're just like young people doing menial jobs basically. But and so they're right. That scene is them lying next to each other That scene is them lying next to each other and she she's like, you feel like my brother. Like, you know, it's just it's gone. whatever tension here is is just completely gone. And he's like yeah. And he's like, maybe it's more spiritual this way. Right. I I love it. It's just so it's funny that we're already there. That's all. That's guess that's what you're saying. Right. And that's also the state of her relationship with the And that's also this state of her relationship with the guy she's co writing this movie with at the time they're co writing it. it's like, well, this was all the stuff leading up to us now working on this project. I moved in with you very quickly. I thought Weve madly in love. I realized it's maybe more of a friend collaborator thing than a sexual thing. And now let's figure out where we go from here. And then, like, sweetie, you know, grosses him on the beach and they start making out and there's no consequences to that whatsoever than it's wild. Right. She's doing she's doing a demonstration of how good she is at licking. Yeah. And it's just within thirty five seconds heightened to, like, full on Frenching on the beach. And Well, everything everything happens very quickly. It's it's like, no. Don't like, don't marry her Weve destined to be and flip these coins and then he's like, okay. I'm like Right. I mean, it's funny because it's like the the cake character is trying to live like a reasonable logical life, but I think is conscious self conscious about the fact that she is to beholden to the rules. Right? So she's, like, trying to find alternative rules to follow. Whereas, sweetie just does not play by any rules whatsoever and gets the sort of kind of float through life largely unencumbered. Yes. She does. But She, she is self-destructive in her life, in her, in her wanting to hurt other people because whatever it is that she doesn't like about it, like when she chews on the horses, which again, I was like, why, what as a kid, she is self destructive in her Like, in in her in her wanting to her other people because it's whatever it is that she doesn't like about. Like, when she she was on the horses, which, again, I was like, why? It went as a kid. You know, it was what's happening. When she spits them out and there's blood on the planet. Yeah. It's just, like, But she doesn't I mean, that's the problem. It's like sweetie, that's the problem as if there's one. A problem she has is that many of the rules she does not follow are the ones that keep her. Safe and alive. It's tragic though because you're not really sure why she's doing it. I mean, she just loves, it's like she gets off on the chaos and I've known people kind of like sweetie before where they're just, I don't know, they just have this like wild, chaotic, fucked up I mean, she just loves it's like she gets off on the chaos. And I've known people kind of like sweetie before where they're just I don't know. They just have this, like, wild, chaotic, fucked up energy. You've definitely known some people like that. I feel like I've known people like Weve. I can't think of who they are honestly, but I'm like, but I know I know that energy and I don't know like and it it's so frightening to me and and, like, oppressive to me that I'm, like, I've rejected it in my in my it's like you're, like, I can't be around that kind of person. I don't even remember the person that I'm thinking of, you know, but I have that feeling of, like, get this this energy out of my orbit. So the the thing the bathtub scene that you mentioned early SV, where she's, like, bathing her father and you see it only from behind. But there's, like, a lot of times spent with her arms in front of his crotch. Right? Yeah. And that when they screened that people read it as, like, an incest thing and that it was a sign that, like, they had some inappropriate sexual relationship when she was a child and that is why she's quote unquote fucked up. Sure. And Camping was like, that wasn't my intent at all. My intent was she doesn't have any boundaries. She does not understand what she should or shouldn't be doing at any moment. And the fact that he just kind of sits there passively is showing that the problem is less that he cross lines with her as a child. It is more that he at no point ever established any boundaries for her whatsoever. Yeah. That makes sense to me. Like, I when I watch it too, I was like, I was is it going in this way? It's the direction and then it never and I was like, no. It was like, I didn't articulate it the way you just said that Jane did. But, like, it it didn't have it didn't have a, like, oh, she was sexually abused energy at the end of the day with it. It was just like, what is that? You know? Right. I mean, I think you have to think about Campions up with like, you know, clinically depressed mother and having to contend with behavior that it perhaps is not exactly like this, is stuff that is sort of, like, irrational, cannot be explained but can't be in talks about her mother with like a great amount of empathy, where it's just like it's this horrible fucking dizzy she has. You have no idea how awful it is. To watch someone suffer from that up close. You know? There's no easy answer. There's not like a reason there's not an inciting incident. You know, she I mean, she's talked about in lot of ways how it's and this was her recording this commentary, what? Like, fucking fifteen years ago or whatever. So it was, you know, even worse than than it is now marginally. But that, like, these things are just not treated like diseases, which they are. If you grow up as a child of someone in a household like that, you understand this as a disease, not just like, well, she's a little cocky or like she has to get over it or whatever. Yeah. We want there to be an explanation. Of course. As as there are as I feel like we always feel the way that way, whenever we know someone who's sick or who's depressed, who behaves strangely or what right. You're like, wow, there's gotta be a You're like, wow, there's gotta be a reason. Like, I wanna know why. Like, you know, because it makes it feel like it'll be easier to fix it. That's that's part of why this movie is uncomfortable. You want her to be a flat, like Right. Well, here's the deal with Sweden. Well, I think it's because she's really good at that chair trick. I think that's the problem. I think that's really where it all rules. Yeah. That's also, like, like, the end of the movie is that flashback of her singing not Weve, you know, like Mhmm. And so it's it's like Right now, it's a glimpse of her as a child. Right? Yeah. The glimpse of her as a child in, like, getting the attention of her father for that, like, it's it's this like, oh, she's they they enabled this in each other in some way. It's like that that I don't know. Yeah. And then doing the the chair trick. And then, like, the father starts to try to do the chair trick. Ben, Ben, do you like her Ben, do you like her buddy? I feel like you must like her sweeties. Oh, you know. Her guy. Yeah. Bob. Bob. Bob. Bob. Bob. I'm sorry Bob. Yes. Bob. Yeah. Well and that kind of like, I don't think we have to spend too much time on it, but the nineties I think we to spend forty five minutes on file. Sure. I mean, the nineties of this movie to me, Bob feels so just like kind of pulled out of that time Weve he's like, got this weird rock ability kind of like, punk kind of vibe to how he's dressing. Definitely obviously a heroin user. But again, they are bringing out the worst but kind of, you know, it's so entertaining to me the way they are around each other just drunk in fucking animals. Like mean, the scene where Bob the dad takes Bob out for lunch, and he fully nods off and rolls on himself. He's like he's like still asking him questions while he's What is drooling? It's it's like it's like so are you gonna make it? What what do you like here? It's clean at the size of like a fairly brothers movie yet it's still clean at the size. Of, like, a fairly brother's movie -- Yeah. -- it still work. That's that that whole thing is so fascinating too. We're, like, the dad keeps on sort of justifying to Kay that, like, you don't understand not like us. Like, she's creative. She's capable of doing all these things. There's this sort of, like, rationalization of, like, Weve cannot fix her because she's operating a different level than There there's a reason she's this way. Right also and they can't let go of the the sweetie you see at the end of the film, the the trail that they remember as this cute little performance. Win or whatever. But, like Yeah. -- this seem where he takes Bob out for lunch and you just assume this is gonna be a class of, like, overprotective dad thing it's, like, who the fuck is this guy? You've got her believing in some show business, dreams. We've been down this path before. Like, I'm gonna lay down the law. And then his end point he gets to is, like, So you really think she can make it. Yeah. Like, he's doing all of the wind up of, like, you have to understand. Right? You we've gone through this lot you know, she's been burned before, but you think she's really got it. And the guy's fucking drooling on himself. Also, he's clearly, like, hooked up with the waitress and she hates his guts. Yeah. And the dad is just kind of like it's not registering with him at all. Oh my god. That seems amazing. I love how much you love this movie, Ben. I Weve I didn't think about it. I didn't think that this would be the Ben movie, but I should've. Of course, it's so my energy. Like, chaotic, just weirdo people, like, my one of my favorite movies is Gumbo. So it's like, you know what I mean? Like, this is just It's got that, like, I don't know, buzzy energy. It's funny to think about, like, this movie premiere like, she's the bell of the ball. Right? And she takes this movie to can and, like, some people do it, which, like, is obvious, and some people are, like, disgusted by it. And I'm, like, you know, I read that. And I'm, like, well, yeah, the Sweetietypes little polarizing. I'm not stun to hear that it didn't, like, go over with, like, gangbusters. But I think for her, it was kinda, like, what the fuck is this? Why are people mad? Like, she naively said, like, she she said, like, we cried and cried. Like, you know, like, that they were just gonna be, like, hailed as heroes. And maybe that's another reason. She sort of ends up now, like, after this dusting off the slightly more prestige y stuff though I think my table in the piano are still, you know, very idiosyncratic. Like, they're very serious. She does three more conventionally prestige y period films in a row. Yeah. And then her next two films after that are her only two Hollywood American sex movies that rule AND HER ONLY PRESIDENT DAY FILMS WHICH ARE VERY PORTUNELY RECEIVED BOTH OF THEM. Reporter: TRUE. THAT IS TRUE. AND NOW SHE'S BACK of course, her last two movies have been a period film. So, though, you know, what's top of the lake is that's that's computer. That's TV. Sure. But yeah. It is TV. But it's highly acclaimed TV. TV to play at the Can Film Festival. Yes. But yeah. No. It's just I I find this movie so transfixing, but I it it it makes me sad. I mean, like and that's not a complaint. But it definitely bumps me out. And I watched it last night, and my wife was very unsettled, but she was like, again, it just seems to be just sort of against the rules. Like, what it's like, you know, it would be almost, I think, more easy to take if it was, like, about a person with a problem and you're dealing with the problem. Right? Right. Like, you know, here's Weve, and here's what's wrong with her, and here's what she's dealing with. But it's it it never pins that down. So instead, you're just sort of constantly feeling like you're shifting uncomfortably in your seat. Gotcha. So, like, when she dies, no one's really sad. And then And I also as the viewer was, like, relieved, I was, like, think Yeah. There's some relief. Sweetietypes out of my life, you know. Especially since sweetie's final act is so chaotic that you're like, I don't know how this is supposed to end. Like, the the herd jumping up and down in the treehouse goes on for so fucking Way long. And you think the kid might get you know, like, obviously, Weve worried about the kid. Like, there's there's that sort of creepiness to what's happening. But they keep on doing that shot for underneath where you see sort of like the floorboards, like creaking. It they just string out for so long that, yes, I do think there's a relief when it finally happens. You know, they, like, immediately cut to the kids safely grabbing onto the trunk of the tree. Like, he caught himself and he doesn't have a scratch. And then she's there dead. She will not stop, like, coughing up strawberries syrup. Right? It just, like, keeps on coming out of her mouth. But there's the relieve. And there's also, I think the sense of like sad inevitability from her family, where they were just like, wow, it was a matter of there's also, I think, the sense of, like, sad and inevitability from her family where they were just like, well, it's a matter of time. Yeah. I it also it's just it's like call the police or call someone and they're just standing there and, like, No. Like, just let it be, like, let this moment happen. She feel it feels like an animal a little bit. Yeah. You know, like, they're like, she's so animalistic, but almost kind of the way that she's treated -- Yeah. -- in that moment. It feels like the passing of an animal like the stakes are lower. Yeah. That that was the the other thing. That Lemons said and the the making of thing is that she had done another play right before this Weve she had to be naked on stage the entire time. So it was like -- Right. -- she I mean, she was like, she was like, I mean, she was like, I've desensitized myself to this. I could be naked for four days of filming. I can play a child the entire time. I know how to do this. Jane, please, can I tell you one thing? I have no problems being in the nude. That's what she says. When Jake because Jane was, like, look Campion was, like, look, if you don't want if you wanna wear clothes for the scene, I I will make a fuss. And, actually, lemon was, like, no. No. That's that's fine. I I get get it. Even when she is wearing clothes though, like, those clothes are, like, dress up. She's going out. She's, like, still like me. Right. And, like, how many scenes in this movie does she just, like, suddenly take off her shirt. Yeah. You know, like, she's usually she's an underwear for a good percentage of this. Movie. I mean, there's the thing in this as we like, when It's right. She doesn't know how to dress herself. Like or when I she gets halfway done and then she's sort of, like, this is it. Right? I don't have to, like, button my shirt or put on Yeah. also has, like, madonna gloves on, you know, Right. Turned with this so wild. Th there's the thing in this SB, which like, when I hear people talk about search party, There's the thing in this SV, which, like, when I hear people talk about search party, right, like, so often they go, like, I like I have to, like, space episodes out because it makes me so uncomfortable. But there's the thing I think you and Charles do incredibly Weve. In, like, on an episode by episode basis, but especially on season by season basis it's like, you you As opposed to think so much prestige TV and streaming TV and whatever, where it's like things are sort of drawn out for as long as possible. You know, you're like prolonging the inevitable. I feel like the two of you and everyone else who works on the show with you Weve, like, write yourselves into corners of just going like, what's the most extreme fascinating thing that could happen now? And then we will solve what you do after that. Rather than being worried about how do you go further from that point. And and this movie has a lot of that energy and think similarly that thing of, like, washing people with incredibly complicated, somewhat toxic codependent relationships, put themselves in increasingly uncomfortable situations, but it does not feel like the movie is getting joy from that or that it's mocking it like there's a weird balance of genuine love for the characters while also recognizing their failings and being fascinated with watching them having to contend with more and more complicated situations of their own doing. Yeah. It's funny because I forget that, like, often my work is hard to watch. And if people don't are like, oh, and and how how much I felt that when watching this. Right. That's why I bring it up because the day you were talking about watching this movie. I do hear it from people who will end up finishing all of Search Party and going, I'm glad I did that. That was great, but it took me a while. Yeah. Yeah. No. I it's it's funny. Like, that does tend to be my favorite stuff Weve, even though I wouldn't say that this is like my favorite movie, but I I appreciate it so much for tapping into that because this is just more unfamiliar to me than what what, like, the the dynamics between this in this family and the husband or it's, like, a little bit it's not actually my territory, but it is Sure. -- it is, like, the the the uncomfortableness that I am always, like, exploring. So it's it's a it's interesting that it's like, oh, yeah. I didn't even think about how that's how my how my work tends to come across. Especially for something you watched at such a young age most other movies you see that look like this and have this kind of comedic energy are not punishing you in the same way. There there's an interesting thing, like, Chris Noonan is in the special thanks of this movie. Right? Christiane of babe fame. The director of babe -- No. -- weirdly only ever directs two feature films in his entire career. Miss Potter's Chris Noonan. Right. Be just babe and Ms. Potter and gets like a best director Potter and gets like a best director nomination as first film out doesn't make another movie for over ten years. And then, as once again, receded, he gets a lot of weird special thanks, credits on things or consultant credit on things. And he started in Australian Cinema in, like, the seventies. I mean, he made, like, a student film when he was, like, six sixteen that won festival awards -- Worked on TV -- Yeah. -- was deeply entrenched in the industry. And and, like, Babe is the movie coming years after this that I think has the closest vibe to this movie, weirdly. If anything else I've ever seen, But there is some sort of shared, like, continuum between, like, this, babe, obviously, the other George Miller films, but especially his earlier films, the early Peter Jackson movies. Like, there is some odd over cranked cartoonish but like quietly dark New Zealand Australian comedy vibe. That I never really see in American films. No. And and most of those filmmakers end up, like, as they get older, evolving that style a little bit and going out of it. But, like, there's a very specific feel to these movies. And also, I guess, most of those phones I mentioned are all happening around the same time. I mean, those careers are all starting in the late seventies through the mid eighties. when, like, Australian cinema is revived. And you're right. Like, that's when it's there's serious investment again, I guess. Right. That's you know, all of this is coming from. And maybe maybe they were film school contemporaries. I don't know. I just wonder what's culturally going on just wonder what's culturally going on there. There's this, like, very light down there. These these dark looney tune movies, you know? Yeah. It's weird down there. It's weird. I don't know. I don't wanna be stereotypical about Australians, but Australians are all crazy. It's the craziest people in the world. I like, no concept of what day to day life is like in Australia. Every time I see a movie that takes place in Australia, I feel so like the environment feels so foreign to Every time I see a movie that takes place in Australia, III feel so like, the environment feels so foreign to me and, you know, literally, like, winter is summer and summer is winter there, you know. Exactly. Christmas is summer. Suburbia what? Yeah. And, like, it just feels so There is something about a lot of Australian movies that I just, like, have a sense of unease with with them. And I like, muriel's wedding which love. Mhmm. Oh, yeah. It just there is also that same sort of, like, discomfort, and I'm very curious what the, I don't know, literally just what it's like to live in Australia. Yeah. It's weird. I don't know. I I've never been and I'm super I grew up in country that is super biased and stereotypical about Australian people, which is a country America. I don't America we judge Australia, you know, Outbox, somehow. I think America and Crockett, I'll die. I I think the American take on Australian the America takeout Australia, right, is is the crocodile Dundee take. Right? Where it's like, oh, yeah. Those guys are like a good time. They drink beer. They throw shrimps on barbies. They wrestle Crocs. Grials. Right? Like that's what it's like down Right? Like, that's what it's like down there. Whereas, I think Brits are like those. They're savages. They're crazy. Like, you know, like, good. Like, there's the they drink even more than we do, and they, you know, I don't know. There's, there's this sort of like harsher edge because Brits are so prejudiced about certain there's there's this sort of, like, harsher edge because Brits are so prejudiced about certain countries. It's very funny. I mean, this is also classic dumb grip, dumb brain shit. But, like, I remember being a a little kid in elementary school, and a teacher telling me that she was from Oregon. And I was, like, with, like, covered wagons and shit, because my favorite movie was still real. That's a in my mind, I was like, this game represents what Oregon is like right now. Right. I was just like, this is what Oregon again, has always been and will always be. And it's like, I've been to Sydney twice. I still, whenever I hear Australia, think of, the Outback. Like, it's hard for me to contend with that. There are like cities where people are wearing clothes and shoes. I started this, but like, I really have to apologize to our Australian started this, but, like, I really have to apologize for Australian listeners. It's a very cosmopolitan country in so many way. IIII apologize for myself. I apologize for myself. No. No. No. I apologize for myself here. I'm I'm acknowledging that I'm, of course, the idiot. I do apologize for my obviously. But what I'm saying is More offensive. Right. New Zealand has now just thought of as the shire. I feel like in most American lines Weve it's like this idyllic fucking fantasy land. But I I just I don't understand culturally what's going on. And I I hope it fucking listeners at me and give me good links to read or someone explain to refine something later in the other episodes here. But culturally, what's going on where it's like because even Muriel's wedding is another one. Like, the Jocelyn Moore hit PJ Hogan thing as Weve. It's like, there's some odd vibe to New Zealand and Australia comedy that is very unique especially from, like, nineteen eighty three to ninety two or something. There's also, like, just thinking about these two movies, like, their haircuts are, like, kind of off in a weird way, you know. Yeah. Their their style is is is I don't even know if it's out of touch or if it's just doing its like, I I don't I don't have a context of it other than watching these movies. So I'm like, What is it like living there? Because it also feels very quiet all the time. It's like in in the houses, like, you don't hear anyone else outside. It kind of feels maybe a little bit, like, deserty, Tucson or something, like, I don't know. I am I've always been kind of fascinated with what what is it like to live in Australia. I guess this is an Australian film. I should take them back. Obviously, she's a She's a she's a This is fully an Australian is fully an Australian film. Right? Yes. After going to Australian film school, working with Australian people. But but there's like that weird sort of like manic scary quality to Australian comedy at this point in time. And then I feel like when I see Australian comedy shit from like the mid nineties on, that's gone. It becomes gentler again. Howard Bauchner: Sure. I mean, I do think there was also more crossover hits that were more gentle crowd pleasers coming out of Australia in the nineties and two thousand. The castle and shit. The castle, the dish -- Right. -- you know, the sorts of movies that are from family babe, obviously. But, you know, yeah, there's, obviously, there's a weird sort of, you know, there's weird humor and sort of avant garde y stuff always bubbling out over there. So, you know, so and it's the end of the earth. And the sun is, you know, two inches from your face. And, you know, there's a warping and peace up. No. Sorry. I was slipping into stereotype again. Yeah. There's, like, this doesn't weirdly, like, the movies almost feel Todd salanzi in a way, like, in that mirror. Sure. This one, especially, I know. Yeah. It's like Yeah. And so it's it's interesting. Maybe. Consolesale is a good comparison for this movie. Like, welcome to the Doll House's in comparison for this movie. Welcome to the whole house is more straightforward, plot wise. Right? Like, you know, it's a Yeah. Right. Right. But still But, but it's like if Danny DeVito directed a Todd Cylons script, but it's like if Danny DeVito directed a Todd's follow on script. Right. It's it's more whimsical. Is that, like, it's a little Lake. Sweetietypes bleak exactly. There's this weird, like, fable, like, quality to this movie. I guess because it's so heightened. That's that's their protection you have with Weve. Right. You're like, this isn't real. Like, that, like, you know, it's because again, III do think it's sort of like a haunting movie. I'll like, you could describe it that way. Like, she really is kinda like poltergeist. Everything she does is so weird. Yeah. And she's this sort of problem they have to confront and weather and destroy. And then they're free of her, but they're still kinda haunted by it with yeah. Because the last shot of the movie is, like, haunting. Like, you know, the the ghostly glimpse of her as a baby, as kid. But she this is right. I just keep it, like, when you're when you if you like, this is not my situation. But if, like, I had an older sibling or a younger sibling, and we were all grown ups, but my parents were kinda still you know, letting them off for being a fuck up or being a weirdo or whatever, and I was trying to be normal. And, like, maybe, you know, that that sibling just kinda grows in your brain into this sort of, like, super chaotic person. Like, beyond like, they're taking maybe this story from Gerald Lee's life and they're just like, what if we just inflate the personality to these, like, you know, ridiculous proportions of of your your wild sibling who who everyone is indulging in a weird way. Well, look, it reminded me unfortunately of the very dark period in my life, a couple of years ago when I started obsessively watching doctor Phil because I could not get over the article phase. Yes. I could not get over the juice of those episodes where someone is like a maniac and the rest of the families on the panel, they're like, yeah, we don't know what to do. And Dr. Phil's like, come Phil's like, come on. I mean, that's the worst thing that can happen to you is having someone like that be in your immediate family, because you can't, you can't like to an extent you can sort of like set boundaries that are like, I'm not going to talk to you if you're talking that way, but you can't be like, you're out of my I mean, that's the the worst thing that can happen to you is having someone like that be in your immediate family because you can't -- Right. -- you can't, like, to an extent you can sort of, like, set boundaries that are, like, I'm not gonna talk to you if you're talking that way, but you can't be, like, you're out of my life. I mean, there are, of course, situations where that But, like, generally with that, especially if they are, you know, mentally, I don't know, ill, then then, like, you have to you have to confront it constantly. And then in doing so, you're not actually confront it. You're just, like, disassociating. This is this is where they're here right now, but hopefully I can they'll leave my house and then I can go back to my other life that's, like, not That that's right. That was the thing On your shoulder your shoulder all the time. The thing I could not fucking get my fill of watching doctor fill was, like, I I don't know what to do. And it'd be like, look at everything. You're you're enabling them. This is all fucking terrible, and they'd be like, I I don't know. Like, it's disassociating from it. Crain this little bubble of deniability, right, to, like, keep themselves safe from having to acknowledge the reality of everything all the time. But then you also go like, how are you But then you also go, like, how are you feeling? And you're, like, terrible. My life's a mess. Like, nothing's working. The woman who's like son hasn't left bed for four years. And she's like, why why won't he get out of bed? It's like, because his TV is right there, who brought his Weve, and she's like, well, I moved the team. But I but it was because he wouldn't get out of bed. What am I supposed to do? Who empties his urine jars? I mean, I do it. But if else? If I don't do it, then who's going to do if I don't do it, then who's gonna do it? I tell you this person, the rock, working out, Yeah. Sound like good. No. No. No. This this thing with a rock piece and bottles. I just can't get some more Yeah. But he he pees in bottles while he's working on people why? And he's like, well, the places I work at don't Weve And I'm like, why don't you go to a place that does have a bathroom? Seems like a better better way to do it in my opinion. That's all. Yeah. Let me just eat peas and bottles and then sells them as a Terramana tequila. Oh, so he's like he's he's working out so much that you know, I when I go to the gym, it's not like, oh, I've gotta take a pee break in the middle of gym. Right? You're like, every five minutes I gotta bust it out. Yeah. Get me that boss bottle. Troy Les. I'm sure Troy Les. He's he's he's peeing in a vase. Absolutely. Yeah. Is there anything else about sweetie. I'm looking at the any other scenes we're not thinking of. What about the dream sequences? Because I feel like we we touched on the last, you know, the last thing at at the end there with, like, you know, the dream sequence of her as a girl, but it's throughout the movie. And I really love it. And it's weird as hell and I can't even There's there's random images. Like, it's very dreamlike. It's hard to even It's very ban. Oh, totally. But, like, there's, like, a part where there's a dream sequence where it's kind of, like, a more to do with the tree and it being buried or rather not buried, sorry, under bed. And it's just like all these quick weird shots And it's, like, it's very emotional, but, like, again, it's hard to put your finger on what really it's trying to yeah. I I actually was, like, did she rip up the tree in her sleep? Or work? Or was there that not part of the tree, you know, like it's, it's kind of edited in a strange or was there that not part of the tree? You know, like, it's it's kind of edited in a strange way. Right. The tree is very hot. The tree I really, I can't get over her putting the tree in the closet really I can't get over her putting the tree in the closet. Also, which I was just like, okay. So what's the the emotional relevance of this tree, like, was, like, roots. Okay. Root is, like, family roots. You know? Like, the whole time, I was just like, there's trying to decode what exactly they were getting at with the tree. And I wonder what Jane had to say about it in in her commentary. Just like, I don't know. The tree was interesting. Yeah. Because then there's also, like, a good root in her great in her grave, it has to be cut, you know. Oh yeah. But that's the thing. Like, she's rarely one to one where she's like and if you think about it, the tree is actually she's more like what you're saying, girl. She's like, Yeah. That image really stirred something up in me. And so I knew I had to get it into the Right. So, yeah, I knew I had to get it into the movie. It happened with Gerard and me, and then I thought that would that would be good for movie. Yeah. And I love this quote about sweetie coming out in America Weve she says, I love comfy sofa is not hard back chairs. So I feel guilty when people say I felt uncomfortable watching your baby. Like, She she she wants to make you a comfy sofa. She just can't do it, I guess. She's just sort of like, well, it's another hard back chair. I'm sorry. I hope you like it. I mean, another thing that adds to just the weird vibe of this movie is that the score is all like gospel choir. Mhmm. Oh, yeah. Which is just not what you're expecting to go along with these images. Or vice versa. You know? Everything that this movie is, like, out of ten, but each ten is in a completely different direction. She got a lot of Lynch comparisons in this movie came out, which makes got a lot linch comparisons when this movie came out, which makes sense. Mhmm. It's funny that that's where people started with her because I don't think it's where she goes. Now, but I do obviously because this movie is sort of quasi kitsch and has a lot of, like, very stark, you know, imagery visual you know, like, I get why people made the lynch comparison, like, and she sort of rolls her eyes at it, but she's like, yeah. We both, like, are art school people. So, like, I I sort of get it. Yeah. But but, like, you know, obviously That's it. There's nothing else she makes that I would I would say really lines up closely David Lynch. At all. The goofiness of his his, like, interest in meditation -- Mhmm. -- feels lynchings. He loves He loves meditation. Right? Weve, Sure. And it's the way it's portrayed, though, even where the dad is, like, what is he doing? I love that scene. The the class. And then she tries to meditate, Yeah. That that class, and she's like, Well, I'm not gonna enjoy it. Oh. I related to that so much. Like, Weve you're like, I can't do She can't do this. Sounds good. She has a profound experience. Yeah. Yeah. Sort of a scary experience. I I don't think it worked. I just love how that guy just says, like, that's fine. Like, that's Yeah. Like, he just only has the one answer for it. Just fucking close your Just fucking close your eye. You're doing it. And do you guys meditate? Anyone ever meditated? Everyone tells me to do it all the time. It's one of those things that any time you do? Yeah. But but I do guided meditations that are also sort of, like, hypnosis. So No. That's a challenge. That might be better. Like, I just I've That sounds so good to know. I'm much I much prefer guided meditations. Yeah. I'm not I'm not very good at guiding myself in any way. Towards anything. I can't sit still. I can't like, not think. So I think it's pretty hard. Sure. I need a guide with, like, the little flag at the stick. Saying, like, over Weve, over here. But like, I also very much appreciate the like torture of meditation like, I also very much appreciate. But, like, torture of meditation. And I was like, wait, this is good for me. How? Yeah. The exercise same deal. Just like, yeah. I know. I know. I, I, I would, I would say that I've never had like some people who meditate regularly or like, it changed my I've I would I would say that I've never had, like, some people who meditate regularly or, like, it changed my life. And I'm, like, I don't know if it changed my really. Like, it's, like, it kind of I don't know. Sure. I I guess that's my guess that's my dubious sense. It's like people tell me about it and they're like, I think it would really do a lot for you. And I'm like, I agree. You're probably right. Then they're like, it fucking changed my life. I I'm I'm I'm eight times more powerful than I was before, and I'm like, now you're making me not one. I don't know if I believe that. And they're like, I'm looking at your life, and I don't know. It doesn't -- Right. -- let's see that much different. Right. I'm like, I I Weve that it helped. Yeah. Well, because I also feel like that's the kind of thing where people get into it and they're like, I teach it now. And I'm like, well, I teach it now. What do you mean? Like, yeah. I'm a guru. I'm like, okay. Cool, man. I mean, you're really into it. Pone's ringing? I think you gotta pick that up, David. Click. Hello? Good. Hello. Am I talking to a cash register? No, David. I think this is the Kuching sound effect. Okay. What's up Kuching sound effect? Kuching. Okay. It has achieved sentence. Uh-huh. I don't know, David, how does this make you feel? Yeah. It kind of makes me smile. Who doesn't love to hear the sound of money? Yeah. My monster. Let's acknowledge acknowledge it. It's kind of the sound of another sale on Shopify that all in one commerce platform, which starts, runs and grows your it. It's kind of the sound of another sale on Shopify, that all in one commerce platform, which starts, runs, and grows your business. We go, we use We go Weve use Shopify. Of course, we use it to sell our of course. We do. We use it to sell our merchant. Our friends at night I'll have made a increasingly weird merchandise for our friends at night, all have made increasingly weird merchandise for us. We got our, our comedy points We got our our Comedy Points coins. We have the new chip coins, which is a We have the new chip coins, which is chip. Smith's a fungible Smith's fungible token. Absolutely very Absolutely very fungible. Two Two friends have. We have a spreadmaster, spatula coming soon. Just increasingly silly things that we're selling on our Shopify page. 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And you know, you can go to shop blank, check pod.my shopify.com to get your chip coin, your comedy points coin priced to move heavily, discounted talking the walk 20, 20, and fifth anniversary shirts that are now coming up on two years out of date, two friends, enamel pin And, you know, you can go to shop blankcheckpod dot my Shopify dot com to get your trip coin Your comedy points, Quine, price to move heavily discounted talking the walk twenty twenty, and fifth anniversary shirts that are now coming up on two years out of date. Ten friends and animal pin set. We got, we got lots of good things here and it's nice to be able to get them to the people without us, you and I having to pack things ourselves, you know, they like cut out the We got we got lots of good things Weve, and it's nice to be able to get them to the people. Without us, you and I having to pack things ourselves, you know. They, like, cut out the middleman. They take care of so much for They take care of so much for us. Absolutely. So if you go to shopify dot com slash check, all lower case, you'll get a free fourteen day trial and get full access to Shopify's entire suite of features. Grow your business with Shopify today. Go to shopify dot com slash check right now. Shopify dot com slash check. And I want remind people it's not a bit. There is a Spreadmaster Blankcheckpod purple spatula coming soon. Did this movie get a proper American release, David? It did. This movie was released in New York in nineteen ninety January nineteen ninety after playing the New York film festival. festival. And it, it was out in Australia the year before September And it it was out in Australia the year before. September eighty nine. I don't know if it had, like, a much wider release than, like, you know, big cities in America Weve everybody did get a little release. And it was a festival favorite, you know? A festival Weve. It was a bit of a festival sweeter. It was a can. It was a if it was in New York, and then it, you know, went to some other places. And it made, like, four hundred grand in Australia, which I have to imagine is is is as much as anyone hoped for. Right? Like, I I mean, I don't think anything was That's a robust thing. Like, cost way less than a million dollars. And then an angel at my table is basically, you know, in the works. Like, that was that that that comes out just a year later in Australia. So she's working fresh. She's already getting to work on what she thinks people want out of the Dream Campion movie. She's like, okay, I got I did that one. Thank you for giving me the Mulligan. So Weve, do you want me to do the box office for January nineteenth nineteen ninety? Because that's what I was gonna do. think it's time. Yeah. Alright. Okay. Look, this movie came out early nineteen ninety. So number one is a a holdover from Oscar season. Of nineteen eighty nine. It's been out for six Driving Miss Stacey? No. Driving Miss Stacey is in the top ten. It's a number eight. Okay. But this is I you know what? This was probably driving miss Daisy's biggest challenger because this movie wins best director. At the the Oscars. Born on the fourth of July? It's born on the fourth of July. Okay. Tom Cruise is Ronovich. Yeah. And all of a sudden film, have you seen born on the 4th of July as Oliver Stone film. Have you seen Brian on the fourth of July, SV? No. I I was gonna say, is isn't do the right thing that same time or something? It is. Yep. But, obviously, that was not nominated for a prestigious prestigious. Oh, it wasn't nominated at all. Okay. Yeah. But it just didn't win. It got screen play and supporting actor for the white guy. Yeah. Right. Yeah. I I have never seen born on the fourth of July either. either. It is funny when I watch obsessively the Siskel and Ebert Oscar specials for me to hear when I can't fall asleep that year, they're talking about how they had been like very dismissive of Tom cruise up until that It is funny when I watch obsessively the Cisco and Napa Oscar specials from each ear when I can't fall asleep. That year, they're talking about how they had been, like, very dismiss of Tom Cruise up until that point and they were like, okay, fair enough. We're Brady Crow. Here's the movie. He finally proved that he's actually an actor and not just a movie star. He's like twenty nine in that film? Like, when he made it. He's, like, third yeah. Yeah. Right. Yeah. Twenty nine It is just wild that his career was so dominant so early on that by twenty nine he was having to prove to people like, yes, I know I'd made six mega hits in a row. But now I'm gonna slow down into a serious searing drama with the man who just won best director to prove that I can really act. I love Tom cruise mean I love Tom Cruise. I'm not Weve. think Weve all got a a soft spot for tonkers on this podcast. He loses he should won. Not in terms of I think it's the best performance of the year. It's actually not my favorite time cruise, although he's good. It's a very committed performer. Yeah. He's very in it. But he was viewed as being he was viewed as being unbeatable. He was certainly the favorite, but he loses to Daniel Day Lewis for my left foot who not only is that performance obviously also insanely showy, but that movie became the kind of feel. That's the original Miramax feel good. That was a shared thing. I'm kind of wondering if maybe when I saw sweetie, it was like, my mom was on some like kick cause I'm like, oh, I also remember my left seeing my left foot really young and also being disturbed also disturbing she went, it must have been, been on a kick of like, what are all the important films this year that I'm going to watch I'm kind of wondering if maybe when I saw Weve, it was, like, my mom was on some, like, kick because I'm, like, oh, I also remember my left seeing my left foot really young and also being disturbed. Also disturbing. She she must Weve been been on a kick of, like, what what are all the important films this year that I'm gonna watch. The serious movies. Yeah. No. My left my left foot is, like, I feel like the first successful execution of, like, the Weinstein attack on the Oscars. And then by, like, the piano, things are really up and running it by English patient. They've perfected it, and they can, like, split it the board. Yeah. It's, like, you know, little do they know, I guess, but, like, they're gonna have so many other chances to stick with Daniel's Day Lewis and Oscar. Right? Right. And, like, it probably would Weve been good to just get the cruise win done. But whatever he wins, cruise loses. Cruise doesn't an Oscar, Danny Lewis. Danny day Lewis. Dan Lewis. Sorry, has no idea. No, please. Let's show some respect. Thomas has has no Oscars. No Oscars. Three zero nations. My left foot has that incredible Mira Max poster because, like, the The the the painted post, it looks like a stained glass. The UK posters are like the stained glass painted poster. And then there's the Miramax one they put out later Weve it's just fucking Daniel Day Lewis's headshot. It's him with, like, long hair, looking super handsome smiling, and then Brenda Offkilter in the background, like, standing with her arms up, like victory, and it's in no way representative of how he looks in that movie or what the plan for that movie is. I look, it was a big Look, it was a big deal. I don't know. I mean, It's not a movie I love. Fricker is incredible in it though. She is such a deserving winner. Anyway, born in the fortifies number one of the box office. Number two, is a buddy, comedy, buddy cop movie. Mhmm. Kind of a classic of the genre, I would say. Eighty nine. It's kind of a classic of the genre. You know, it's no lethal weapon in terms of -- Right. Success or whatever, but like it's a pretty big hit that gets pretty good reviews with two big stars. And I just feel like it's one of those you know, it's a good buddy cop movie. It's it's very, very energetic. So their cops did it get a their cops, did it get a single? No. Interesting. Should have. It's not tango and It's not tango in cash. It is tango, is tango in cash. Oh, okay. It is tango in cash. It sure sure is. Yeah. Yeah. I I think a very troubled production but a pretty watchable movie. Yeah. Great. I've never heard Of Sylvester Stallone and Kurt Russell Sylvester Stallone and Kurt Russell SV. Okay. They're rival detectives, but they gotta work together because Jack Palens frames one of them for murder. I can't remember which one or maybe both of them. Maybe they're both playing for murder. And salones like the button down one. He's got glasses in the Stallone is the nerd. He's tango. And Kurt is the cowboy, and he is cash. Terry Hatcher is in it, and it's pretty good. And it's directed by that Russian guy. Who, like, made all these, you know, big Russian movies and then -- Andrei -- Hollywood stuff. -- Kunchalovsky. Yes. It's also just I mean, it's the perfect name for a buddy company. Tango and Dash. Yeah. These two guys. It's I believe it's the last film of the eighties. Like, it it gets the last film released in the eighties. Oh, really? It's December twenty second nineteen ninety nine. Right. Nineteen ninety nine started. Like, it's, like, that was it. Goodbye, ladies. Tangoed cash as you're still there. And then number three at the box office square is another cop drama, but it's it's just a serious cop drama. Okay. It's a serious cop drama from nineteen eighty nine. Underrated, in my opinion, directed by kind of an Arty director Hm. A big star, Big star. Big star -- Big star. -- crooked cop. Drama based on a real story or just not. It's one of those big stars, though, that everyone forgets as a big star. But he really was, eighties and nineties. He's a big star. You struggle with him. I feel like. I feel like he haven't seen a lot of his movies. Oh, okay. Struggled with other of his others of his movies in the box office. Of guessing them. Yeah. Mhmm. But you don't know my opinion on man is I don't know. Maybe you love him. I I can't remember. think you like him. He's a bit of a silver fox. Tifa was pointing at his head. Yes. You know, he's a superstar. Fox, he was a big star of the eighties and nineties. I struggled to I struggled remember It's not a it's not a clint. No. Not clint. No. No. Right. I'm trying to think of this as Silver Fox in the eighties. And nine You really struggled. David keeps pulling at his hair. I always struggle. Good hair. Is it I mean, I don't know the movie, but are you talking about Can't now? I can't I can't remember pretty woman guy. It's Richard. Richard himself. Yes. I am. I am talking about Richard Gear. What's your opinion on Richard Gear Griffin? Okay. I feel like you seen the good years. No. I haven't shifted into the right gear. I mean, I Weve days of hav days of heavens, maybe one of my ten favorite movies ever. Yeah. And he's a nice 1II generally struggle with gear a little bit. Okay. This is a crooked cop drama with Richard Gear, and I just feel like I'm not gonna pull the fucking name of this Weve. What's a control on gear? I just I had to get out. Your great, great, new Yeah. It's been great. Great. Great. Two hundred comedy points. Great. Well done. Alright. It's got a very generic name. It's a Mike FIGUS film, and it's Right. -- in colonial affairs. Right. Right. Right. Okay. And it also features Adam Garcia, Nancy Travis, Lori McKaff, and Billy Baldwin. Wow. And it's a totally solid cop movie. Yep. But it's you know, he's just got a lot of movies where you're like, oh, Sure. Yeah. That's it. Okay. Yeah. He was Weve was plugging along. Post, like, pretty woman and officer and gentleman American jiggle. Like, that's his, like, you know, booming time. It's a thing that doesn't exist anymore where it's like Richard Gear is an a list leading man. With him at the front of your picture, you can guarantee it will open to eight million dollars and numbers. Thirty two domestic. Right. Like, they launched fifty on HBO and random A viable model. You didn't have to be a fucking half a billion dollar guy. Absolutely. He razzled dazzled them, believed earth, though. He did. He did, in fact, razzled dazzled them later. You're making made so many goddamn movies. I'm just looking at his He's made a lot of good movies and a lot of nothing movies. Number four, the box office Griffin is a film directed by a man. You just in on this episode, invoked as a director. I invoked this director. You invoke this this director. He directed this film, but he's also in it. It's a black comedy, and he's on the poster like he's dreaming of the moon. It's it's worth the roses. It's the war of the roses, directed by Danny Dorito. It's one of my favorite post your layouts ever because it's Douglas and Turner in bed. And then DaVita's at the bottom of the poster, like, indicating up. I think, I feel like he's got a cigar in one hand I feel like he's got a cigar in one hand? He's he's got a cigarette or a cigar or something. And there's smoke. It's a cigarette. And there's smoke coming out of it. And the the picture is forming from the smoke. Right. It's like he's created it out of his cigarette. Well, he is the director of the picture. Yes. I understand. Also in it. I do like though. It's one of the the only posters that it feels like is physicalizing the idea of, like, Danny DaViro presents. Weve you are. These two fucks are mad at each These two fucks are mad at each other. Here comes my fucking trophy. It's a good a good movie. It's a very dark Comedy. Have you seen the War Roses? Oh, yeah. It's it's old fourth one. I think you would love that movie. You'd like it. You'd like it. Okay. Yeah. We've we've talked about this though. We're like Devita was one of the only guys who was able, it has been able to make pitch black comedies into like major hits and then it dropped off for Weve, like, DaVita was one of the only guys who was able it has been able to make pitch black comedies into, like, major hits. And then it dropped off from him, but he had a couple in a row where it was just like, How Was that a bar that about your man? Like, first first him starring and then him directing, and then he's just also in it as basically Danny DeVito. Yeah. It's such a funny career. Yeah. I love the man. Now number five is a cult movie, I would say. Okay. Not a huge hit. Mhmm. But like one a huge cable hit. Like AAAA huge tail on this movie. This was a real fun monster movie of the nineties. That just whatever, I guess, played on VHS forever. A bunch of -- Eighties. -- sequels. Okay. Get sequels in the nineties. Like, video sequels. Right. It's it's video Sequels. It's a horror movie or is it a It's a horror movie or is it a a Yeah. But it's like a comic horror movie. Like it's like a fun monster movie or it's a monster Like, it's like a fun Is it an actual monster movie? Or It's a monster movie. Yes. Is is the monster the title? No. What the monster is making is the title. What the monster is making is the title. This film also stars, my favorite actor alive. W oh, is this Oh, is this tremors? It's tremors. Oh, I love tremors so good. Tremors is great. What's that what the monster is making? I guess That's very tricky. They're making sure. But Right. But the the bacon gave it away to me. Yeah. Kevin Bacon and tremors, and it's one of those classic Kevin Bacon things Weve he's like, What the fuck? I make a movie. It's good. Yeah. It's fun. Yeah. It comes out. Everyone ignores it. And then five years later, everyone's coming up to me being like, you know, what's great is And then five years later, everyone's coming up to me being like, you know what greatest tremor. Yeah. He's like, well, I didn't hear that in nineteen ninety that it was great. Like, where were you been? It's like the the classic Kevin Bank of the situation. Anytime he leads the movie, people later watch it on tape and are like, yeah, that was good. Why didn't I see that in the theater? Yeah. It's wild. It's also fucking run under one of the wildest careers that's his first movie. Then he makes city slickers, which is a huge fucking hit. But, you know, you would not expect that he's the guy hired to do that off of tremors. Then he does Hearts and Souls, the weird Robert Downey junior -- Go series. -- com. Right. Sirius comedy. Right. Right. Speechless, which is Is that too well? That's new. No. No. Or two souls? Yeah. No. No. Definitely not. Speechless is what? Diane Keaton. No. Michael Keaton, sir. It's Michael Keaton and Jean Davis. The poster is just their lips, which is like You're like you did have the two most distinctive sets of lips of the early nineties. It was you had some good mouths there. Yeah. Good lips. That's true. That's a good point. It's a it's like fair enough, but that's I think they're both SPEECHRIATORS FOR RIVAL POLITICAL THEN HE MAKES MIGHTY TO SHOW YOUNG? YES. RIGHT? HE MAKES MIGHTY TO monster. I was, like, gorilla, you know -- Right. -- the the fucking king kong rip rip off. He does Pluto Nash. Oh God God. Sure. Notorious disaster. And then his final film ever is in the mix, which we all remember as theusher Chaz Pulmonary Crime Comedy of two thousand and five. Absolutely. Thanksgiving smash. Kitchen Forget Griffin that now he's working in the TV movie realm. He made a movie called Santa baby starring Jenna McCarthy. In which she plays Santa and missus Claus's daughter. Mhmm. And then there was a sequel called Santa maybe two, colon Christmas maybe. He's he's made, like, six plus El Dorvino plays Santa in these movies. Holiday in handcuffs deck the halls. He does a lot of Christmas TV movies. It's also wild that like Bacon does tremors. People are like, is this a low rent for Kevin Bacon to be doing this movie? It does not hit it grows in popularity years later. They do fucking eight sequels -- Right. -- direct to video and cable. And then they're like, we're ready to properly reboot tremors. We're doing a proper tremor's TV series. Kevin Bacon is coming back and people are like fuck. They shoot a pilot doesn't get picked up. Now I'm about to change my background to Paul Servino is Santa I'm about to change my background to Paul Sorvino as Santa Claus and Santa maybe two Christmas maybe please. Okay. Enjoy. Wow. What do I think? That's not that's not my vision of Santa Fe. That's not your sir. I said it looks a little rough. He looks he looks haggard. He just got smoothie. He looks He looks like Francis Ford Coppola. Like, he just looks like I'm not getting Santa. I'm sorry. It was another picture. I have to do this again. It's that good. This one's even worse. I'm sorry, Paul. I truly respect you as an actor. I think you're so great. But why did you play Santa when you just Weve gonna look so tired all the time. Okay. And look how grumpy he is. Who's mister Claus? It's a good question. There's only one way for me to find out. Santa baby two Christmas maybe missus Claus is played by Lynn Griffin -- Hey. -- from Black Christmas. Wow. Okay. Fair Fair enough. Yeah. Anyway. So that's the box office game Griffin. You've also got Always. Steven. Spielberg's always, you have steel Magnolias, still chugging along, along with driving, miss Daisy, a lot of sort of, you know, weepy type Spielberg's Always. You have Steele Magnolia's still chugging along. Mhmm. Along with driving miss Daisy, a lot of sort of, you know, Weve type Mhmm. Seamagnales is way better, though. The little mermaid? At the end. Yeah. And back to the future part too, still sticking around. Well, I check a film's a past hanging on the outskirts of that films have passed. Hanging on the outskirts of that tent. Yeah. The only new movie this week is tremors. And of course, Weve, if you live in whatever, the opposite side or wherever this is. And tremors. Tremors wasn't even six seating with a January release. Yeah. It's not even succeeding against fucking the third week of internal affairs or whatever. Yeah. That's why. There's, like, eat a toilet bacon. I'm still here. Right. Yeah. SV, thank you so much for calling back on the show. Thank you. Yes. Thanks For having having me. You're you're one of a group of people who have recently told me how much you appreciate the show being long because it helped you kill time while doing long things. But where do you listen to it on a road trip? Yes. Yeah. I probably will do it. I think honestly, maybe we listen to it to it on the way to our wedding, but I think we'll also listen to it on the way to Thanksgiving, which is a long road trip. Right. You were like, it helps because we can, like, get the whole road trip done in only three blank track episodes. Yes. Exactly. That was like a full day, twenty four on the phone. Jesus. No. It it is. It's it's it's like, okay. Weve we won't even be done with this up by the time we're there. So that that's Right. I mean, if it's if it's a Bullwidge. Do Do you want, it's a, it's a great Joshua tree Palm Springs you want It's a it's a great Joshua Tree, Palm Springs stretch. Right. Final season of search party, we're recording this in low advance. I don't know if it's about to premiere or if it's just premiere. This at episode is coming out January sixteenth. So I think it will have just premier. Just premier. Yes. So check it out on HBO. Is it week to or is it all dropping at once? It's all Dropping at once, at once. Wow. I will say, like, as I was talking about earlier, the the thing I I love that you and Charles do you write yourselves in the corners that you have to write past rather than like going for the obvious a to b sort of plotting. Yeah. It makes it difficult. I would imagine when you're ending a show to figure out how to actually end it because you've set up this standard where anything that feels like it should be the end of another show, you can get past. That have been said, I know how the season ends, end date. It's insane. And you actually have come up with the thing that you cannot write past. I know. Because I'm very impressed. You know, oh god. Someone someone said to me once, like, when you when you end this show, you have to be, like, can't believe they went there. And that really stuck in my mind. I think you'll do it. Yeah. Okay. I hope I hope it'll work to that. Yeah. III am I am deeply impressed, and I can't wait to to watch the whole thing. Oh, man. Same. So excited. Super excited. Oh, yeah. And everyone watch. Yeah. Everyone watched. Everyone. Everyone watched. Everyone watched. Every single one of you. And I want to thank everyone for listening and tell them to please remember to rate review and subscribe. Thank you to Marie Bardi for our social. Media Joe Bone pat rounds for our artwork, agent McKeehan, and Alex Barron for editing Nikola Ariano. And JJ Bush, four hour research lay Montgomery and the great American novel for a theme sign can listen their new album extremely loud and incredibly online wherever albums are found these days. Go to red dot com for some real nerdy shit and you can go to patreon dot com slash blank check For blank check special features Weve we cover franchises, and right now, we are ghost busting. We are, in fact We are We're bouncing ghost. The family that bust together. Hey. If you haven't signed up for the Patreon, we're actually every release day. We'll also be offering from our archive, the Marvel Commentary series. So you can check out past episodes. If you So this is now yeah. Our fourth year of the Patreon and going forward, we're gonna start taking things out from behind the paywall after three years. So on the first, eleventh, and 21st of every month, if you're already a paid transfer scriber, you're gonna get new episodes. If you're not, you can go to our Patreon's page and those episodes from three years earlier, there'll be a new one drop every ten days that will unlock from behind the wall. Yeah. So check it out. There's some fun stuff. Marvel movies, guys. Yeah. You could listen to three year old Marvel commentaries, including the one where on Spider Man Everyone loves those. I say, wouldn't it just be cool if Marvel, like, didn't release a movie for eighteen months? And then the world ended, they couldn't. That sure didn't. Tune in next week for an angel at my table. Who's the guest? Or is that the movie? Oh, god. Ben. And and as always. I complete be blanking them. I'm really good. The boss likes don't know. Yeah. She does. does. She

2:03:10

does. She likes the shoe agri. Okay.