0:00

What's up? I'm John Wall and I'm CJ

0:02

Toledano and we're starting a new podcast presented

0:04

by DraftKings called Point Game Hey,

0:06

you know like at camps and stuff like this you take the ball out

0:08

you ain't getting the ball back Like you the

0:11

last one up the court They already and did they think so

0:13

I stopped it and I just got into a rhythm and start

0:15

hooping The Lakers should sign Trey

0:17

Young this summer They got to kind of start preparing

0:19

for like the LeBron's last year's this year and next

0:21

year whenever it is and I feel like A pick

0:23

and roll with AD and a guy like Trey Young

0:25

will be dead Check out point

0:28

game with John Wall and CJ Toledano on the I

0:30

heart radio app DraftKings YouTube or wherever

0:32

you get your podcasts You

0:35

know that feeling when you walk into your home Take

0:39

a deep breath and

0:41

feel new Well, that's

0:43

what it's like to use Clorox and

0:45

Tiva because Clorox and Tiva smells like

0:47

coconut cleans like Clorox and feels like

0:50

energy It'll elevate any

0:52

cleaning routine to not just clean

0:54

but also make every room smell

0:56

like a tropical coconut getaway Discover

0:59

how Clorox and Tiva's powerful clean

1:01

and refreshing scents can transform your

1:03

space Get yours and

1:05

coconut or other fabulous scents at a nearby

1:07

retail store Take

1:12

your business further with the smart and

1:14

flexible American Express Business Gold Card. It's

1:17

packed with benefits to help unlock more

1:19

value from your business purchases. That's

1:21

the powerful backing of American

1:23

Express. Learn more at americanexpress.com

1:25

slash businessgoldcard. AT&T

1:27

connects an ode to podcasts

1:29

connect the alarm change the

1:31

podcast you stream Connect the

1:33

snooze ten more minutes to

1:35

dream connect the shower lather

1:37

up with the news sports talk comedians

1:40

or movie reviews Connect

1:42

with that three-hour philosophy show changes

1:44

the drive into work in traffic so

1:47

slow Connect the dishes

1:49

to voices that glow. Thank

1:51

you to the geniuses of

1:53

spoken audio Connect the

1:55

stories change your perspective connecting changes

1:57

everything AT&T At

2:02

Bet365 we don't do ordinary. We believe

2:04

that every sport should be epic. Every

2:06

home run, every hit, every inning, every

2:08

play. From the moments that are legendary

2:10

to the ones that fly under the

2:12

radar. Whether it's a walk off grand

2:14

slam or a base hit to center

2:16

field. Whatever the sport, whatever

2:19

the moment. It's never ordinary. At Bet365,

2:21

21 plus only, must be President Ohio.

2:25

If you or someone you know has a

2:27

gambling problem and wants help, call 1-800-GAMBLER. Welcome

2:58

back to Unplug, our weekly look around. And

3:00

there was a lot to look around at, Jack. A

3:02

lot of fun stuff happened over these past

3:05

week. Denver recap, we had

3:07

a good time. Went out there and messed with our

3:09

coach Prime and Shador and then I see you rocking.

3:11

You came back loaded, huh bro? I hit up the

3:13

school shop but Prime say you got some packages on

3:15

the way for us so we got more coming. Also,

3:17

man caught up with Jake, the snake plumber and his

3:20

mushroom farm. I got a chance to meet Dale and

3:22

his whole team. We had a blast up there, can't

3:24

wait for you guys to see that. I'm

3:26

fresh off my lines, man. You

3:29

been psilocybin' duck? No, lines, man. I got

3:31

no psilocybin'. Oh, lines, man. I thought you said fresh

3:33

off your lines. I didn't know we were having this. I

3:35

didn't know what was going on over here. I just want

3:37

to know. This thing is crazy, man. Reminder, we're going on

3:39

tour. First two ladies of our tour, Detroit, June 3rd and

3:41

Chicago, June 4th, man. So

3:49

be there or be square. Go

3:54

to our page for tickets. It's

3:56

definitely going down, man. We'd love to see you guys there

3:58

again. Chicago or Detroit? the one we said, who

4:00

do you who what city should we come to? They

4:03

represented the most man. So again, this is the first

4:05

two stops. I think we got like six more. So

4:08

keep throwing your cities in there, man. We want to come see

4:10

you guys. Please come to the show.

4:13

You sound like Bob from Martin. Thank

4:15

you. Cowboy Bob Ryan

4:18

Garcia shocked the world, man. Dominated

4:23

Haney. Obviously,

4:25

you're the expert in the boxing field. Actually,

4:29

we were all enjoying what Jake

4:31

gave us on a FaceTime and also a little

4:33

bit of cannabis because that was 420 as well.

4:36

So we all kind of watched the fight together from different

4:38

parts of the country. But man, what did you

4:40

see in that Haney Garcia

4:42

fight? I had peeped where Ryan his mindset

4:45

was when he came into the weigh in

4:48

three pounds over. You know, Ryan had

4:50

no plans of even making weight. He

4:53

knew the last experience he had in the big fight like

4:55

that with Tankway. He had to make weight and he didn't

4:57

come in the way he didn't come in to fight strong

4:59

as he felt as he normally feels. So he

5:01

felt like, you know what, I paid at one point

5:03

five. I probably make thirty forty million off the

5:06

fight. That one point five ain't nothing. And

5:08

fuck them belts. I don't want the belts. I just want

5:10

to get the money and beat you and get

5:12

the win. And and he went in there and did

5:14

it. He was a bigger fighter. He was a stronger

5:16

fighter. Devin Punches didn't affect him at

5:19

all. Ryan went in there and

5:21

did what he told everybody he was going to do. People

5:23

thought he was crazy, but he went in there and fought

5:25

the fight. Now I will say this, Matt, three

5:27

pounds means a lot, especially

5:30

in those lighter divisions and

5:32

weight draining all that matters.

5:34

So I would I

5:36

would like to see the fight with

5:38

the way. Yeah. And then

5:40

no, we did with Ryan

5:42

making weight. But I'm saying it would probably be at a catch

5:44

like one forty five then he wouldn't he already

5:47

said he's not going back to one forty no matter what.

5:49

So maybe a catch weight. He said he wants to fight

5:51

one forty seven. Maybe a catch at one forty five. Yeah,

5:53

but I don't think it's going to happen. I think I

5:55

think he's moving on. I think he didn't beat Devin. He

5:57

just and he beat Devin in great fashion. No, I

5:59

think I had to run that. that back. I

6:01

mean, I mean a lot. I mean, a lot.

6:03

We we're saying it but I don't think Ryan

6:05

will. You know, Ryan and Ryan and call our

6:07

boots was was not a great move. He's calling

6:09

the other fighters. I honestly think that I honestly

6:11

think they're gonna move on because Ryan is not

6:13

fighting for belts. The only way he fight um

6:16

uh uh Devon Haney again for belts at a catchweight

6:18

is for the belts and Ryan is not fighting for

6:20

belts. He's fighting for money and he's fighting just cuz

6:22

he loves the sport. Oh

6:24

no. I think they definitely go. I think they got it.

6:26

They gotta run it back. The one I mean, I mean,

6:28

what I saw is I mean just explosive hands. You

6:30

know, obviously, Haney Haney Haney got one of the

6:32

best jazz but like you said, his punches weren't

6:34

really doing nothing to Ryan. I wanna say I

6:36

think it was the seventh round. That ref was

6:39

on some **** man. That ref was

6:41

on some **** the extra long counts getting in

6:43

the way letting the holding go like I really

6:45

thought that Ryan had a chance to

6:47

uh to finish Haney but Jack, you and I discussed

6:49

it before. I thought I mean, I like Haney a

6:51

lot. I thought Lomachenko beat him. Yeah, he did. Yeah.

6:53

You know, I mean, I thought Lomachenko beat him but

6:55

it was only a matter of time. You know, he

6:57

ran into Garcia Pops. You

7:00

know, uh what's the Bill Haney, right? That's the

7:03

name. Yeah, Bill Haney. I just didn't. I mean,

7:05

and we're we're we're fathers. So, we get it

7:08

but he was just talking real,

7:10

real, real greasy out there and

7:12

uh it was you

7:14

know, at some point, I'm just like, damn like, you

7:17

know what I mean? This is between them but at

7:19

the end of the day, you know, it it it

7:21

made a fight. Everyone thought Ryan was crazy. You know, every

7:23

thought everyone thought Ryan went off the deep end and he

7:25

was doing all this and I and and it was funny

7:27

because I made a comment like three or four days ago

7:29

and I forgot what what page it was on. It's just like,

7:33

hey, this this dude's doing a hell of a job of

7:35

selling the fight. I hope he's there mentally and and to

7:37

find out this whole **** was a plan, man. So, he

7:39

did a great job because uh he did

7:41

everything he do to sell the fight and then went out

7:43

there and perform and and and and shocked everybody and and

7:45

I and I don't I don't know if this is but

7:48

I read this morning too that he bet 2 million on

7:50

himself in that fight in 112 off the

7:53

betting side too. So, if that if that is true,

7:55

that's super dope man. Happy for him. You know, definitely

7:57

happy for because there's kind of been uh He's

8:00

a social media rapper or a boxer and he can't

8:02

do this and he's not doing that and he's not

8:05

focused and this dude went out here and did it

8:07

his way and won. So

8:10

it'll be interesting to see who is next opponent,

8:12

if it's a rematch with Tank, if

8:16

there's other people in the mix. I mean, what do you

8:18

see? It won't be Tank, Tank, that part of them already.

8:21

Ryan is not going to do a rehab division cause again, so

8:23

that's not going to fight and it makes no sense. I mean,

8:25

Tank didn't already beat him. Ryan getting better. So a lot of

8:27

guys are going to start duck and Ryan, trust me, because

8:30

of that speed, his size at that

8:32

weight class is just dangerous. And he

8:34

got so much power. So

8:36

I would like to see him

8:39

fight either Pitbull or Cruz or Shakur or Stevenson

8:42

to see where he really at. You know what

8:44

I'm saying? And then I think if he fought

8:46

Shakur or Stevenson, I think that'd

8:48

be a great tune up for

8:50

Shakur or Stevenson to Tank. Tank just announced

8:53

he's going to fight Frank Martin. And

8:55

Ben Vides will be the co-main June

8:57

15th in Vegas. Fight

9:00

Town. Hold on, is Fight Town coming

9:02

back, Jack? You got something to share with us?

9:04

I'll let you introduce her since she was already

9:06

introducing it. It sounds good here, you say it.

9:08

No, I mean, I want to know. I mean,

9:10

obviously Fight Town is back, something you started over

9:12

at Showbox and now that we're doing our own

9:15

thing, we've been able to talk to some people,

9:17

to know some people, to know some people, get

9:19

it back, get the lines back working,

9:21

but tell us about it and who you're working with. Fight

9:23

Town's we're back, shout out to Draft Kings, shout

9:26

out to BD, my guy who always making shit happen.

9:29

Fight Town's back, man, the show,

9:31

the boxing show, we started at Showtime, we've been

9:33

brought it over here, now we're going to get

9:35

it back. We're going to Miami, we're going to

9:37

link up with David Ben Vides, Roy Jones and

9:39

Tank and talk

9:41

to them right before the big fight. But

9:44

having Roy Jones on, we're possibly even

9:46

bringing on the great Andre Ward. So

9:50

just to have those two great minds, a

9:53

part of this company and this new venture we

9:55

started with Fight Town and our new boxing company,

9:57

I'm excited, man, because I'm a big fan of

9:59

boxing. I

10:02

love going to these guys hometowns,

10:04

learning more about these boxes because

10:06

I admire the way they stay in

10:08

shape. The

10:11

things they go through, the ups and downs

10:13

in the box of rain, the punching, the

10:15

bullet nose, all this stuff I admire because

10:17

I'm a warrior in my damn self, but

10:19

I ain't a warrior to that damn extent.

10:21

Not to anything. So, yeah,

10:24

I admire those guys. So I'm glad we

10:26

back. Shout out BD again. Definitely shout out

10:28

BD. As you said, we're in

10:31

close conversations with Andre Ward, the

10:33

great Andre Ward and Roy Jones.

10:35

Jack, we've been working, man. People don't know, man. We're

10:38

in the boxing space now. We got

10:40

some MMA stuff cooking. We got some

10:42

football stuff cooking. We cooking. We over

10:45

here cooking, man. Dream team. Yeah,

10:47

man. It's been fun to be able to... I

10:50

mean, we're creating great content, getting

10:52

paid like we're still athletes, but then also opening up

10:54

doors for other people and bringing more people on the

10:56

roster. I already shout out everyone who's on the roster

10:58

right now. More big names

11:00

coming, but more important, man. Great content. It's coming

11:03

from a good place and we're

11:05

blessed to be able to continue to build our company

11:07

and do what we love. Jack, now we want to

11:09

welcome to the show one of our brothers, Brandon

11:12

Jennings, one of your Oak Hill

11:14

comrades, BJ. Bye. BJ,

11:17

what up, bro? What up? What up?

11:19

What up, y'all? What's up? How's

11:22

life? How's everything going right now? Good morning. Got

11:25

the podcast in a couple of hours, so I just

11:27

wanted to chat with my boys. We appreciate

11:29

you spending a little time with us. Jack, I'm

11:31

going to let you kind of run it because

11:33

you guys just had your Oak Hill reunion

11:37

of sorts. Your jersey was retired and you guys

11:39

got a little project coming, so let's talk to

11:41

us. What's going on? Yeah, a shout

11:43

out to my little bro, man, one of the realest man I've met,

11:45

man. We played together in the

11:47

league and been walking together as somebody

11:49

who I consider a real brother, bro. Thank you for

11:52

coming on today, man. We

11:54

went to Oak Hill together, got put

11:56

in the Oak Hill Hall of Fame. It's such an honor

11:59

that me and you both. appreciated

12:01

and wanted because so many great players

12:03

come up out of there. We

12:06

went down there, we got the O'Kill doc is out

12:08

now, you can catch it. I'll smoke production YouTube. We

12:10

had a great time man, I think the experience, all

12:12

the players were never a nice group of players that

12:14

we were inducted with. And then to be back to

12:17

O'Kill was a great feeling. Talk about your experience being

12:19

there. Man, O'Kill man, I remember getting

12:21

there at 16. Man,

12:24

definitely a culture shock coming from LA, coming

12:27

from Dominguez, actually in Compton. And

12:30

then, I think

12:32

I got to give the credit to my

12:34

mom, man, because being 16 and her even

12:37

just having the confidence in me just to

12:39

go away, all the way from California to

12:41

Virginia and play basketball was a huge step

12:44

in my life for me and also a

12:46

challenge. So I got to give all

12:48

of that to my mom for that. But

12:50

the experience was great, man, I was able to

12:53

work on my game every day. Steve

12:55

Smith, the schedule that we

12:57

played, we was always playing against eight, against

12:59

five, the

13:02

challenges, everybody

13:04

on the team was going G1. And

13:06

just the experience, man, just being able to focus

13:08

on basketball was something that I needed at 16.

13:13

Yeah, I agree, bro. Mine

13:15

was kind of similar, my mom, she believed in

13:17

Steve Smith too. I know if I

13:19

didn't leave, I was gonna either be dead in jail,

13:21

but I knew I could play basketball. And

13:24

to be there away from everything, focusing on

13:26

basketball and still being traveling there for all

13:28

these tournaments, being able to be seen is

13:31

everything I needed. Because not only did

13:33

it show me that the dream of me making it

13:35

to the next level could really happen, but

13:37

it also made me appreciate the

13:39

game. It made me appreciate Steve Smith and

13:41

being at Oak Hill in a position it

13:43

put me in. So it did

13:45

the same for me. I mean, the structure, man, let's talk about the

13:47

structure of the school. We

13:50

had Saturday schools, we had to go to church. We

13:53

had to wear uniforms a certain way. We

13:56

had to wear uniforms, and we only had like six

13:58

or seven people to a class. So, So we

14:00

got that attention, far as like

14:02

education wise, and then you know you just play

14:04

basketball every day. So it was kind of like,

14:07

I don't know, it was like, I don't know, it was

14:10

like the first Europe experience, I guess, just playing basketball. I

14:13

don't know if this younger generation appreciates just

14:15

the history because you know, this

14:17

younger generation is not so much on

14:20

history, but just to have you know

14:22

45 NBA players

14:24

come through there at one point from Carmelo KD,

14:27

Rondo, Stackhouse, Rod Strickland, Josh Smith,

14:29

Michael Beasley, to name a

14:31

few. I know you guys have a list of

14:33

guys, but just the history of that program and

14:35

Steve Smith and not only how it

14:38

was a positive influence on your basketball life

14:40

and career and journey, but like you said

14:42

be off the court and you know, taught

14:44

you discipline and structure and you know, had

14:46

to do the above and beyond,

14:49

which is really dope. Why

14:52

do you guys feel this kind of a joint

14:54

question, that kind of structure on

14:57

and off the court is so important to

14:59

continue? Why is it important for that story

15:01

to continue to be told? I mean, I

15:03

think the way social media is today, I

15:06

think it's probably needed way more for kids just

15:08

to focus because they're seeing a lot of things

15:11

and you know, the internet is like, it's

15:13

a fake place. So you know,

15:15

kids get these highlight tapes and they think they're,

15:17

you know, it's on and it's like, you know,

15:19

you got to get back to the grid and

15:22

grind of it. And

15:24

just being away, man, like just being away,

15:26

like you're not really missing much. I mean,

15:28

you know, if you can dedicate your life

15:30

to basketball for, you know, from 16

15:32

to 18 and just focus

15:34

on strictly that, I

15:36

mean, I think the outcome is going to be insane

15:39

for you. I

15:41

think to be, for me, Oak

15:44

Hill still gives you that old school,

15:46

high school feel. You in a small

15:48

town, the whole town comes out to every

15:50

home game and it's just about

15:53

basketball there. You know, it's

15:55

not about nothing else. It's not about no

15:57

politics. It's about basketball and you're work

16:00

on your game and become a better man. I think,

16:02

like you said, social media and some money being

16:04

involved, there's so much going on with kids bouncing around,

16:06

playing even in high school, not just for the part

16:09

of kids doing that at high school and the AAU

16:11

circuit too, bouncing around, playing from team to team and

16:13

getting paid. So I think

16:16

places like Oak Hill is

16:19

very important if kids want to just be a high

16:21

school kid, grow up in high school, play basketball the

16:23

right way, but also be seen the way you need

16:25

to. And also, a piggyback

16:27

on that is like you also play with other great

16:29

players. Right? So you're learning how to

16:31

play with great players. So when you play at the

16:33

night... I was going to ask not to cut you

16:35

off, like what are those practices like? I mean, you

16:38

guys had, you know, D1 NBA players in high school.

16:40

So what were those practice? I'm sure those practice sometimes

16:42

is really in the games a lot of the time.

16:44

Yeah, I mean, for me crazy. I mean, I played

16:46

at a long fight, Nolan Smith, Alex Legion, Julian

16:49

Vaughn, Trey Thompson, and

16:52

you know, every day it was a battle. But

16:54

like I said, my team was so good. So

16:56

being able to play with good players was always

16:58

easy for me. That's why AAU, me

17:00

and Kevin Love, you know what I'm saying?

17:02

We went 38-0 because just playing with Oak

17:04

Hill every day, like, you know, you learn

17:06

how to play with great players and the

17:08

NBA, you know, that's how it's going to

17:10

be anyway. And Steve Smith was good at

17:12

teaching, man. He'll probably... Our practice is started.

17:14

He'll go through some stuff, teach for about

17:16

a good 10, 15 minutes. The

17:19

rest of the practice is all scrimmaging. He wanted to live.

17:21

He wanted to practice what he teaches live. So he didn't

17:23

do too much talking. We did a lot of playing in

17:26

practice. Fellas, we're going to play a

17:28

quick game right here with the start of

17:30

the NBA playoffs. And there's, you know, always

17:32

a lot of overreactions in this space. So

17:34

you guys tell me if it's

17:36

going to breathe in or breathe out. Are

17:38

you fucking with it or you're not? Adidas

17:42

is stomping Nike in the signature

17:44

shoe game right now. Ant-Man

17:46

just released his debut low tops. Harden

17:48

came through with his heat. Dane came

17:50

through with his. Firing game

17:53

one on the flip side right

17:55

now. Obviously, Giannis didn't play. I

17:57

think bronze shoes have gotten a lot better now that they're

17:59

more... more sleek and kind

18:02

of up to the newer

18:04

kids with the kids like fashion, obviously KD, D

18:08

Book, Jaws on the Side Lines. And

18:11

I'm seeing a lot of guys and kids

18:13

now too wearing the Sabrina's.

18:15

So with all I just

18:18

said, is Adidas the

18:21

top signature line for basketball right now? No

18:24

and they never will be. But

18:27

they got some fresh shit coming out there. I

18:29

think the Ant-Man's are super dope. I would rock them

18:32

if I could, you know,

18:34

shout out to Jordan Brand.

18:36

But they definitely doing their

18:38

thing, bro. I

18:41

think Nike, the reason Nike lost their steam

18:43

is ever since they lost Kyrie. If you

18:45

went to every AAU tournament, because I got

18:47

sons, I got my daughter, man, you got

18:49

sons, yeah, I got your kids playing basketball,

18:51

BJ and everybody, you go to these

18:54

tournaments, it ain't nothing but PG's and Kyrie's. And

18:57

Kobe's. They got the broads now.

18:59

You know, with my daughter, I'm going, I'm

19:01

going, I'm going, I'm saying the Kyrie's, the

19:03

Sabrina's and the and broads. So like, but

19:06

since they lost Kyrie, it ain't been the same for them. And

19:08

I think too, you know, Adidas

19:11

got the young players, you know, some of

19:13

the young players and guys that's really making noise right

19:15

now too, man, along with their shoes coming out. So

19:18

if you put enough numbers, your team

19:20

winning, when you're dropping shoes, it all

19:22

makes sense. Absolutely. For me, I'm

19:24

gonna say Adidas is running it right now. You

19:28

know, I love, I love the layout

19:30

that they did, you know, the hardens,

19:33

the Ant-Man's, you know, especially Ant

19:35

becoming one of the faces of the league. I

19:38

think with Nike, you know, when you said

19:40

when they lost Kyrie, that was huge. But

19:43

I think them missing Jaff, you know,

19:45

Jaff right now. He was supposed to be, he was supposed

19:47

not to cut you off, but he was supposed to kind

19:49

of that, and I was going to soften the hit that

19:51

Kyrie left. I agree with you 1000%. Yeah.

19:54

Yeah. I mean, not losing Jaff, but Jaff

19:57

being hurt right now and not being on the floor hurts

19:59

him a lot. So I'm gonna go

20:01

with Adidas Right now

20:03

but then you know, you know, you got curry

20:05

brand coming up. They just signed. Oh, hey, you

20:07

know these Fox And

20:09

then, you know, I'm working on some stuff in that Dharma. So we'll

20:11

see, you know, we'll see Yeah, get your

20:13

creative hats on and tell us about it. But

20:15

also kind of stuff as far as it so,

20:18

you know He just started over there like yeah,

20:20

the new light is fired. They gonna start by.

20:22

Yeah, it's new life. All right The

20:25

way I judge all this is What

20:28

am I seeing at AU tournaments? And

20:31

although I definitely think Adidas is making waves in

20:33

the league right now Does that

20:35

transition into dollars with the

20:38

public and you see you guys know you see

20:40

the Kobe's you see You

20:42

I see a lot of Sabrina's now you

20:45

know you you still see a

20:47

majority of Nike

20:50

So they finished up buying the Caitlin's and the wind

20:53

is said the Caitlin's the wind be and then you

20:55

know and then juju I mean, you know, I mean

20:57

watch guys Definitely gonna be a

20:59

lot of girls. You definitely gonna be there You

21:02

know interesting you said that you know, we with

21:04

the conversation of late is you know About

21:07

Caitlin Clark getting her signature shoe and how

21:09

come Asia Wilson doesn't have her signature

21:11

shoe And I wanted to kind of toss that around

21:14

real quick with both you guys and hear your thoughts

21:16

Well, I mean, you know, you know my thoughts. I

21:18

mean, it just is no reason for her not to

21:21

have one I mean, she's one back-to-back. She's

21:23

won MVP. She's won all the war. She's

21:25

been the best player. Yeah, well MVP Yeah

21:28

player and the three players that got

21:30

sitting shoes are all white, you

21:33

know saying like that That's crazy. It ain't being

21:35

racist. These are just the facts, you know, I'm

21:37

saying I mean, but look even to go further

21:40

You have four black women that

21:43

went number one They

21:45

never got paid with Kayla's I

21:48

wasn't aware of those numbers. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

21:51

Yeah. Yeah. She's she getting 78 a

21:53

little a little Boston that went to Indiana

21:58

last year number one pick she She got, she's the

22:00

second closest to her. She got 76. One

22:03

of them. So, I mean, it's supposed to scale up

22:05

every year. But still, you know what

22:07

I'm saying? I'm just saying, these are the facts. You

22:09

know what I'm saying? But no question, Asia deserves to

22:11

shoot no doubt. I agree. Everything you said, her accomplishment,

22:14

but is she moving the needle like

22:16

that? Like, like, like these young girls are coming

22:18

in from college, like, you

22:20

know, I mean, their numbers are just crazy. Like,

22:23

I mean, the game, like, you know, can

22:25

she move the needle like that, I think, you

22:27

know? Asia

22:29

is definitely moving the needle in our culture. No,

22:31

but I mean, I mean, Jack, not to say she's

22:34

not, but again, to

22:36

me, no, no, he said more than Angel

22:38

Rees. You know what I mean? To me,

22:40

I'm thinking she's already had all these accomplishments.

22:42

Why hasn't it happened already? It should have

22:44

already happened. We all agree that she should

22:46

have her own shoe. If we're

22:48

looking at Nike, maybe Nike's not the move.

22:50

Maybe it's Steph, maybe it's, you know, Steph

22:52

and his brand, maybe it's Adidas. You know

22:54

what I mean? So, I'm thinking, but at

22:56

the same time, and I saw an

22:58

interesting fact, and I want to say, I don't know if Candace Parker, she

23:00

had her own signature shoe with Adidas, so

23:03

I'm not mistaken. I don't know if she still does, but the

23:05

way I was looking at it is you can't hold, you

23:08

know, obviously seeing three white women that have their signature

23:10

shoe, you can't hold that against those women, though. Nah,

23:12

nah, not at all. People's issues with Nike, and

23:14

I don't like that people are trying to discredit

23:17

Kaitlyn Clark because she has a shoe before she's

23:19

even stepped in the WNBA because for the reason

23:21

that Brandon just said, she moves the needle. She

23:23

is a movement in herself. So, all these people

23:25

that kind of feel a certain way about Kaitlyn

23:27

coming in the league, or she hasn't done nothing,

23:30

or players kind of saying they're a little slick

23:32

shit that we've been seeing them say, they

23:34

should all be happy because she's bringing eyeballs with

23:37

her. She's bringing in a whole ecosystem with her.

23:39

Like they said, Jack, she sold one, Merged Rizzi's

23:41

in one day, then your team sold in

23:43

a whole entire year. The Cowboys, yeah. The

23:46

Cowboys. The Cowboys. You know what I mean?

23:48

We were just talking about Nike falling

23:50

off, right? Yeah. Oh,

23:53

I don't know falling off, but yeah. I mean, I

23:55

mean, I mean, I mean, yeah, but yeah,

23:57

but by not, by not. by

24:00

not having the signature shoes, right? Because

24:02

they're seeing the shoes are not popping, right? So

24:04

you're saying, how many players with Nike that have

24:06

signature shoes right now that's not moving the needle?

24:10

I don't know, you'd have to look. I wouldn't want to say. It's a couple.

24:13

We just talked about it. We just talked about

24:15

it. Who? Who you talking about? A

24:18

lot of those players that got signature shoes, we talking about

24:20

Adidas has passed them and people are not wearing those shoes,

24:23

right? They're not moving the needle. But

24:25

they still got signature shoes. You're saying,

24:27

where Asia Woodson moved the needle. She

24:29

is moving the needle because she's winning the championship,

24:31

but you got guys in the NBA that ain't

24:33

moving the needle that got signature shoes. But it's

24:35

still different, Jack. I mean, the WNBA championship is

24:38

not, with all due respect, it's not celebrated like

24:40

an NBA championship. I'm not saying that. I'm not

24:42

comparing it like that. No, her accolades, obviously her.

24:45

In her league, she is that. She's

24:47

the one. She's her in

24:49

her league. I mean, if I'm Nike, if

24:51

I'm Nike, honestly, I'm giving Juju a signature

24:53

shoe right now in college. Off

24:56

the wrist. Fact, no question. You know what I'm saying?

24:58

But that's why you got to go with a Clayton

25:00

Kark right now because she's moving the needle.

25:02

And now it's going to move the needle

25:05

even more. Nobody's denying that. Nobody's denying that.

25:07

Nobody's denying it. But Asia deserves that, too.

25:09

Yeah. But you also got to think, I

25:11

think Asia kind of missed. Obviously, Jack, we

25:13

had her on the show. She missed that

25:15

NIL shit. She said she would have been

25:17

showing up with minks like Frank Lucas. So

25:20

with this NIL stuff, these girls are

25:23

coming into the WNBA bigger

25:25

than the WNBA. With

25:27

their following and their brands and their visibility

25:30

and their market. You mean the way they

25:32

can market themselves now. So all

25:34

these women that are in the WNBA, you

25:36

could say, we're all hoopers. We can kind

25:38

of sense the slick shit that's being said.

25:40

But they should all appreciate it because they're

25:42

all these. The top seven picks are all

25:45

coming in. Top 10 picks are all coming

25:47

in with built-in. So my

25:49

whole question, fellas, was would that

25:51

excitement in the storylines from college

25:53

basketball translate to the W? Because

25:55

if it does, it's going to change the game. It's

25:57

definitely going to change the game. And obviously, they're going

26:00

to go back. after this year and go back to

26:02

the tables and redo their negotiations and there's some new

26:04

TV stuff in the works for them and there's a

26:06

big sponsor coming in. So contracts and salaries are definitely

26:08

going to be up, but I just love the fact

26:10

that we're having these type of conversations because that means

26:12

the game is growing, whether people like it or not.

26:15

I mean, and it's exciting right now. It's exciting. It's

26:17

going to get better and better. So

26:19

I mean, but the WNBA is going to have to

26:21

do their job though. And they do bigger. Like

26:23

you know what I'm saying? Regardless of what

26:26

somebody else do, regardless of what you do,

26:28

if you beat B, if you go score a 30 and

26:30

you come into my league and you, and you big, regardless

26:32

of what you do, what you do, what you do, I

26:35

know what I've done in this league. So yeah, you

26:37

deserve what you, what you've done and what you coming

26:39

into, but I deserve it too. No

26:42

one's arguing with that. No one's arguing with that. But like

26:44

I said, I just think these younger women, I

26:47

think I feel like Caitlin is taking heat, you

26:50

know, similar to where Agile was taking heat

26:52

a while back for different reasons, but you

26:55

can't be mad at Caitlin because she has a big ass deal. Not

26:57

at all. You know what I mean? That's what I'm trying to tell

26:59

these people. Like you can't be, it's not her fault. Right.

27:02

It's her fault that she hooped and did because

27:04

it's not like she's just, you know, some great

27:06

white, like she's a hooper. I think she benefited

27:08

off the Steph Curry effect. You know what I

27:10

mean? People love the way Steph kind of changed

27:12

the game as a whole along with Clay and

27:14

some other guys, but that she shoots the shit

27:16

from half court without effort. And she's carrying a

27:18

ball to respect, not a, you know, not a

27:20

super talented team to the, you know, to the

27:22

final four and to the championship. So her game

27:25

speaks for itself. So I just, I just don't like the

27:27

negative attention that any of these women are getting because at

27:29

the end of the day, all these women are going to

27:31

help build this game more and take it to the

27:33

next level. Okay. Okay. Well, can

27:35

I be negative again? How do you feel

27:37

about, how do you feel about Caitlin Clark

27:40

and her team that did win the national

27:42

championship, get invited to Saturday night live, her

27:44

whole team, but the national championship actually didn't.

27:46

Cause I'm moving the needle. Yeah.

27:49

Don stay there. Now I'm moving the needle. Not

27:52

like playing the needle. Definitely moving the needle. Don

27:55

Staley is definitely moving the needle. I ain't trying

27:58

to make this racial. I'm

28:00

just speaking the facts, bro. I'm not

28:02

making it racial. People try to twist

28:04

my words. Actually, I

28:06

question. I'm not mad at the question, but I think

28:08

what B. Jennings said, bro, and

28:11

Don Staley is definitely moving the needle. But

28:13

nobody, I would argue that nobody right now

28:15

in this little last month is moving the

28:17

needle like Kaitlyn Clark, period. Not

28:19

LeBron, not nobody. Kaitlyn

28:21

Clark has fascinated and captured the

28:23

entire world. So no one is moving

28:26

the needle like her. So I get the Saturn there last year.

28:28

I get the Nike deal. I get it. Now she going to

28:30

have to come improve that shit, though. You know what I mean?

28:33

So moving on. James Worthy, the

28:35

great Hall of Famer friend of the All

28:38

the Smoke Prager, and Ritzy said, Yoakich is

28:40

a combination of magic and Kareem. He

28:42

said, to me, Yoakich is magic and

28:45

Kareem on the floor at the same time. He's

28:47

a guard who makes great decisions and is a

28:49

hell of a passer. But when he wants to

28:51

be Kareem, he goes down in the post and

28:53

dominates. Question to you

28:55

guys. If Yoakich wins a chip in an

28:58

MVP this year, where do you

29:00

have him on your all-time list? Not all-time centers.

29:03

We'll talk about that, too. Where do you have

29:05

him in the all-time? Is he cracking the top 10, 15, 20?

29:08

Brandon, I'm going to start with you. He's cracking the top

29:10

30. OK. I

29:13

give him top 30 still. It's still early. Accolades

29:17

are heavy. Game is heavy. But

29:19

you're a top 30. Yeah, top 30 right now. Where

29:22

do you have him on your top centers

29:25

of all time? Is he top 10 there?

29:28

He's top 10 for sure. He's top 10. So

29:32

he's creeping off the bench right now. OK.

29:36

So round six, seven. Yeah,

29:38

he's off the bench six. I might

29:40

put him higher. What's

29:43

up? I'm John Wall. And I'm CJ Toledona.

29:45

And we're starting a new podcast presented by

29:47

Draft Kings called Point Game. Everyone,

29:50

please welcome Coach John Calipari. We're

29:52

getting beat by 18, my first

29:54

game in Kentucky. They're saying, Cal's

29:56

a plus kick, Coach. This is

29:58

crazy. John Wall. That runs down the

30:00

floor and makes a buzzer beater. You

30:02

remember that, Joe? That's my first game winner ever made. Remember you

30:04

said you never see me do that. Ladies

30:07

and gentlemen, DeMarcus Boogie-Cousins. I called Boogie. I'm like,

30:09

yo, bro, I'm about to commit to Duke. And

30:11

I hung up on him. Bro,

30:14

I'm talking about, do you want to tell me how

30:16

many times he called me all type of names? Bro,

30:18

you really selling me out? You doing this? Yeah.

30:22

Bro, I was sick. I remember that

30:24

like yesterday, man. Love you,

30:26

Joe Wall. Thanks, Coach. Love you, too. You

30:29

made me everything I am today. Nah, you

30:31

made me. You made me. Love it. Check

30:33

out Point Game with John Wall and CJ

30:35

Toledano on the iHeartRadio app, DraftKings YouTube, or

30:37

wherever you get your podcasts. It wasn't even

30:39

supposed to be my game. That's my job.

30:45

Are you tired of your scented cleaning product

30:47

smelling and cleaning like, meh,

30:50

then it's time for an upgrade with

30:52

the power of Clorox Cintiva. With

30:54

an uplifting scent that smells like

30:56

coconut, Clorox Cintiva gives you powerful

30:59

clean like Clorox, but a feeling

31:01

like, ah, being transported

31:03

to a tropical island retreat. Imagine

31:05

putting your phone on Do Not Disturb, tuning

31:08

out all the constants, just

31:12

a feeling of warm sand in between

31:14

your toes, and a fruity drink in

31:16

your hand. The ones with

31:18

the little umbrella. We're a fresher home

31:20

to feel like an all-inclusive vacation by

31:23

getting Clorox Cintiva, also available in grapefruit

31:25

and lavender scents at a nearby retail store.

31:31

Take your business further with the smart

31:33

and flexible American Express Business Gold Card.

31:35

It's packed with benefits to help unlock

31:37

more value from your business purchases. That's

31:40

the powerful backing of American

31:42

Express. Learn more at americanexpress.com

31:44

slash businessgoldcard. Connect

31:49

the alarm. Change the podcast you

31:51

stream. Connect the snooze. 10

31:54

more minutes to dream. Connect the

31:56

shower. Lather up with the news.

31:58

Sports Talk Comedians. or movie

32:00

reviews. Connect with that three-hour philosophy

32:03

show. Change the drive

32:05

into work and traffic so slow.

32:07

Connect the dishes to voices that

32:09

glow. Thank you to the geniuses

32:12

of spoken audio. Connect the stories,

32:14

change your perspective. Connecting changes everything.

32:16

AT&T. At

32:21

bed 365 we don't do ordinary.

32:23

We believe that every sport should be

32:25

epic. Every home run, every hit, every

32:28

inning, every play. From the moments that

32:30

are legendary to the ones that fly

32:32

under the radar. Whether it's a walk-off

32:34

grand slam or a base hit to

32:36

center field. Whatever the sport, whatever the

32:39

moment, it's never ordinary. At bed 365,

32:42

21 plus only must be President Ohio. If

32:44

you or someone you know has a gambling

32:46

problem and wants help, call 1-800-GAMBLER. Jack,

32:51

where's Yokich at for you? Well,

32:53

one, you can't never go against what

32:56

Jane Worthy is saying because he played

32:58

with Magic and Kareem. He knows

33:00

him better than anybody and that's a great comparison because

33:02

you can see a lot of both of them in

33:04

him. I think for me, I got

33:06

him on the all-time list. I

33:09

got Yokich top 10. No,

33:11

excuse me, top 15, top 20, top 15, so

33:14

somewhere in that, yeah. And all-time centerless, I

33:17

got him top five. Ooh.

33:19

Okay, I think I'm gonna agree. I definitely,

33:21

I don't know where he's at. I don't have time to knock

33:24

a list down right now, but I feel like he's in

33:26

my top 20 players of all time

33:28

and he's still got, you know, more time and they

33:30

got something really good going over there right now. And

33:32

then as far as centers, yeah,

33:35

I put him up there, man. I mean, to

33:37

me, Shaq is the greatest center of all time

33:39

and then you look at Kareem

33:41

and then, you know, people say Wilt and

33:43

Russell, but I'm throwing Yokich right

33:45

up in that mix. Yokich is tough. Yokich

33:48

is tough, so we

33:50

shall see. Are

33:53

we seeing a passing of

33:55

the torch in front of

33:57

our eyes as far as the new wave? of

34:00

the NBA. Steph didn't make

34:03

it. KD and his

34:05

boys are up against the next face

34:07

of the league, Anthony

34:09

Edwards. LeBron is

34:11

going to be uphill sledding to see if they even get out of

34:13

the first round this year. But if

34:15

you look at Ant-Man, Luca, I don't know if they're going to

34:17

get out of the first round, but we all know what Luca

34:19

is about and then Jokic. Are we

34:21

seeing a passing of the torch, fellas? I

34:24

think so. I think so. For the

34:26

simple fact that you know, when

34:29

you start to see the guys that was carrying the

34:31

torch starting to be in the play-in every year, that's

34:34

a big sign. And you see guys like

34:36

Chi, the youngest team in the NBA, be

34:39

number one in the Western Conference, when Western Conference

34:41

is normally the toughest conference, that's starting to say

34:43

a lot. So yeah, the passing of the torch

34:45

is definitely here. Yeah, the passing of the torch

34:47

is here and the league is going to be

34:49

in good hands, man. I mean, you got Ant-Man,

34:51

Luca, Jokic, you got Tatum, you got Chi. You

34:54

know, you got a bunch of young guys, man, that

34:57

can hold their own. And, you know, they're not

34:59

playing together. They're all like, you know, this thing,

35:01

like they want to... And Ant-Man, you know, he

35:03

definitely want to go against everybody. So

35:05

just his demeanor, you know,

35:07

his aura and what he brings to the game, man, I think, you

35:09

know, the league is going to be in

35:12

good hands. These young boys are not really trying to team up.

35:16

Are they going to bring that wave back? I'm not

35:18

really trying to, because it was a big three-air for

35:20

a minute that we all were a

35:22

part of and played in. And

35:25

it doesn't necessarily... But obviously, all these guys are young and

35:27

they haven't got their, you know, some of them are still

35:29

coming off their first deals. But

35:31

do you think this next wave is going to kind of

35:34

take it back to what it used to be? Well, we're

35:36

not teaming up. We may get one guy, but that's about

35:38

it. And we're going to try to... We're going to each

35:40

other's next. I can see it. I mean, the money too.

35:42

I mean, you know, super-matched, you know, the way the money

35:44

is going and everything. You know, the way

35:46

first team, second team, third team is, it's kind of

35:48

like, you know, it's kind of like you stay over

35:51

there. You know, at

35:53

this time. And I mean,

35:55

and the way guys are just putting up numbers too,

35:58

you know, it's just crazy. Like, they're so young. And,

36:01

and, you know, the way Minnesota has already built their

36:03

team is kind of like, you know, they have their,

36:05

they have their guys, they have him in, in cat.

36:07

And, you know, they have a vet in Mike Conley.

36:09

So, you know, some of these teams are well put

36:11

together. They just got to add just like one, one

36:13

or two, you know, pieces. I just want to see

36:16

it from OKC in Minnesota. I love it. I love

36:18

that they got there. We all know the regular season

36:20

is a little bit different than the playoffs, but right

36:22

as of now, although man, OKC went down to the

36:24

wire last night. Well, that was a really good game

36:26

with New Orleans, you know, obviously minus Zion,

36:29

but I just want to see it from these young teams. You know,

36:31

obviously Jack, we spoke, it's kind of a changing of

36:33

the guard from, you know, OKC is number one in

36:35

the West now and it's unfinished third, but I got

36:37

to see it in the playoffs. One

36:40

thing that also drew my attention was the

36:43

shit that Anthony Edwards was talking to

36:45

KD and KD loved it. KD

36:47

loved it. Obviously KD, you know, being a

36:50

favorite player and as you know, is when

36:52

your idols become your rivals, so to speak.

36:54

And, and, and out of

36:56

all these young players, and there's a lot of

36:59

young players, I just love Anthony Edwards energy and

37:01

his game back to that. What was

37:03

going through you guys mind when you seen him talking shit

37:06

to KD like that? I loved it,

37:08

bro, but put us up with the fact that

37:10

he already, he already didn't came out millions of

37:12

times saying, KD is his favorite player, dog. So

37:14

when you get a chance in the

37:16

playoffs to go up and get your favorite player,

37:18

one of the best players of all time to

37:20

prove yourself, it's no better feeling than that, man.

37:22

There's no better feeling than that. When even though

37:25

we the same age, when I got a chance

37:27

to play against Kobe in the playoffs after they

37:29

had three peated and beat

37:31

them to go win the championship, dog, that was the best

37:34

feeling in the world. So when you, you know, I looked,

37:36

even I looked up to Kobe, even though it was the

37:38

same age, just cause I good, he was, but I get

37:40

it. That's the best feeling in the world is getting and

37:42

KD embracing it. You know what I'm saying? He's not taking

37:44

it the wrong way. He led a competition as well, but

37:46

it's good to see that you got players coming back that's

37:48

ready to compete like that and give the game what we

37:51

want to see. Yeah. I mean, it just talks about this

37:53

just shows his passion and this is why he's about to

37:55

be the face of the league. This is what the league

37:57

wants. Like this is what the NBA is about.

38:00

This is what the dogs, this is when the dogs

38:02

come out and this

38:05

is when you take your game to the next level. This is

38:07

something that everybody dreams of. Everybody

38:09

dreamers to play against their favorite player, go on

38:11

the court, give them 30 or be in that

38:13

big game, hit that big shot against them. So

38:15

I mean, that just shows his passion and

38:17

the love for the game. So I'm rooting for the young

38:19

guy. The great Detroit Mercy

38:22

point guard who knocked UCLA

38:24

out in the tournament, I think it was

38:26

my freshman year, Rashad Phillips on

38:28

Twitter said, Katie smiles at like a proud

38:30

father as he watches a

38:32

generation he helped build, have

38:34

their moment in the midst of the battle. This

38:36

is beautiful. As you get older, you will understand

38:39

what I mean. Katie is one of the greatest

38:41

of all time. So I thought that was a

38:43

beautiful, beautifully said by Rashad Phillips. Cause like I

38:45

said, I mean, we're seeing it. And

38:48

I hope now people are appreciating

38:50

what Katie has been able to do for this game, what

38:53

Steph has been able to do for this game, what LeBron

38:55

has been able to do for this game, because

38:58

these guys, you know, two,

39:00

three years, they might

39:02

not be here after that. So, you know, I

39:04

love when, in an era where everyone loves to

39:06

talk shit and be disrespectful and critique everything. I

39:08

hope that these people just appreciate what they've been

39:10

able to see the last 20 years from

39:14

LeBron and 17 from KD. And I think Steph's at

39:16

15 or 16. I just

39:18

hope these people appreciate him. Yeah.

39:20

One last thing before we get out of

39:22

this, Ant-Man said he's the best two guard

39:24

in the league over Booker. We're

39:27

gonna leave that out there. We're gonna

39:29

leave that out there. I'm

39:31

going to. Clippers. I'm rolling. You're

39:33

right. I'm not. I ain't even gonna

39:35

argue. I'm just gonna throw it out there. I know Booker has something

39:37

to say and that's the best part about it is, they're

39:39

playing each other in the playoffs right now. Right. Clippers,

39:42

veteran savvy. Can it win? Obviously

39:45

you guys think he can get them out of the West.

39:48

I mean, minus Kawhi, they went, took

39:51

game one, versus Dallas. Westbrook,

39:55

integral part. Off

39:57

the bench, smart. Doing it on both ends.

40:00

defensively and offensively. James

40:02

Harden in his bag 28 and 8,

40:04

6 for 11 from deep. This

40:10

supporting cast, I haven't even mentioned PG and

40:12

what he brings to the game. Do

40:14

you guys think that this team has a chance to

40:17

get out of the West? Man, I mean, the West is tough, man.

40:21

Especially without Kawhi Leonard, it's definitely gonna be

40:23

tough. But they

40:25

are definitely gonna have to use Westbrook a lot and

40:29

do his thing and be him. But

40:33

yeah, man, I mean, the West

40:36

is so stacked, man. I mean,

40:38

it's, I don't know. And

40:40

we're not even saying they go get out the

40:42

first round. I mean, they just won nothing on

40:44

Dallas. I mean, the series is just getting started.

40:46

But Jack, do you feel like if

40:49

Kawhi is able to come back, can

40:51

this team come out of the West? That's

40:54

my thing, man. I love the Clippers. I love

40:56

the coach. I love the way they

40:58

put James and Russ and Kawhi and Paul

41:00

together. I love that whole little thing. But

41:02

I know Jason Kidd, I know Kawhi, I

41:05

know Luca Doncic, the leading scorer

41:07

in the NBA this year. They're gonna come back real-

41:10

This is far from over. This is far from over.

41:12

Yeah, because you know how Luca has

41:14

some amazing games there in the playoffs. So

41:16

my thing is, they can tie the

41:18

series up. Now they have home court advantage. So

41:22

we've seen James do this, and I love

41:24

him James playing well, because the game is

41:26

just more exciting when he's getting his threes

41:28

and doing his ISO. The game is way

41:30

more exciting, but he hasn't sustained that on

41:32

no team he's been on to get them,

41:34

you know what I'm saying, to the championship

41:36

out of the West of Carver. So with

41:40

Kawhi coming back, that's less shots for a lot of

41:42

these guys too. So how this gonna look when he

41:44

come back? I don't know if the Clippers can do

41:46

it, but I know they will see a different Dallas

41:48

team come game too. I mean, I

41:50

kind of feel like, I mean, Clippers have been my pick

41:53

from the beginning. And I agree

41:55

with you know, James has been great, you know,

41:57

in flashes of the playoffs, but hasn't made it.

42:00

and consistent, but I think this team is

42:02

different from a standpoint if he doesn't have to

42:04

be him every single night, you know what I

42:06

mean? You know PG could be him. You know

42:08

Russ can come off the bench and still be

42:10

him if they're able to get Kawhi. We already

42:12

know Kawhi's resume when it comes to playoffs in

42:14

the finals. So I don't feel like there's as

42:16

much pressure and I don't know if pressure was

42:18

the reason why he wasn't playing well at times,

42:20

but those have always been kind of the James

42:22

Harden shows with the Rockets obviously

42:24

and then him and Embiid and that didn't really mix

42:26

too well, but I just don't feel like there's a

42:29

lot that as much pressure on him

42:31

and I feel like he's definitely gonna do his

42:33

thing, but I do agree. There's no

42:35

telling if they're gonna get out of this series if

42:37

they don't have Kawhi and I don't know if they

42:39

can make it through the West without

42:42

Kawhi, but they're still my pick. I can't go back on my

42:44

pick and I hope that Kawhi is able

42:46

to come back. BJ

42:48

before we get you out of here, man, we wanted

42:50

to, you know, obviously your game speaks for itself. We

42:53

definitely looking forward to having you come on all the

42:55

smoke soon, but we wanted to

42:57

touch on just tough crowd and what you've

42:59

been able to build and your brand and

43:01

your partnerships and what's kind of been the

43:03

future for you there. If you don't

43:06

mind breaking it down for us as I

43:08

mentioned it, but I know our fans are sitting here. Yeah,

43:10

tough crowd is a brand. I started when I

43:12

took a trip to China. I think it's my

43:14

last year playing basketball and I was

43:16

just looking at how big our culture was

43:19

over there. So you know,

43:21

far as hip hop and fashion and when

43:23

I came back, I was just like, man, I want to start a

43:25

brand. So started

43:28

a brand set on

43:30

the name tough crowd for a while

43:33

and tough crowd is just for anybody that's

43:35

like an entrepreneur or anybody that's, you

43:38

know, far as hip hop and fashion. And

43:40

when I came back, I was just like, man, I want to start a

43:42

brand. So started

43:45

a brand set on

43:47

the name tough crowd for a while

43:50

and tough crowd is just for anybody

43:52

that's like an entrepreneur or anybody that's

43:54

wanting more in life. And

43:57

at the end of the day, you know, life is just a tough crowd

43:59

because we always got Prove ourselves and you

44:01

know, it's always haters and downers. So that's

44:03

like the meaning behind it a tough crowd

44:05

and The reason

44:07

why I put a tough crowd on the collar Was

44:10

because back in the day, you know that the selfie error, right?

44:13

So so, you know, everybody was taking selfies So

44:15

I was doing that to use to

44:17

get the brand out there and use marketing So

44:20

it was like a cool little marketing way to

44:22

to get everybody to see the brand first So

44:26

I know you if I'm not mistaken I follow you on

44:28

IG I know you have a gym Who

44:30

Jim this brand you've also did a partnership with

44:33

your brother Steph Curry And

44:35

and you were one of the early under armor guys weren't yeah.

44:37

Yeah, I was the first one to sign the under armor Then

44:40

here he came over and so me and curry we

44:42

have a Lot of

44:45

relationships with people from under armor So it

44:47

was just dope the fact to be able to do

44:49

that collab go back to my home gym at Raleigh

44:51

Park Where I grew up at actually

44:53

where I first started playing basketball at three So

44:57

doing that for the community dropping the collab

44:59

was dope man And

45:01

it was actually one of our biggest moments so

45:03

far He ate

45:05

man. He also made our Hall of

45:08

Fame Jackers for old kids ceremony to

45:10

oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah That's

45:16

really good and again we gonna dig a little you know

45:18

get you get into more of your story once we have

45:20

you on The show we just want to give you all

45:22

a taste Yeah of what our guys giving you right now,

45:24

but before we get you out of here gills arena. Yes

45:28

In one year you guys have done amazing things you guys just

45:30

had a live show shout out to the whole game man I

45:32

think it's a beautiful thing the way you guys have been come

45:34

together I feel like there's just that

45:36

we all know there's a huge shift in media right

45:38

now And when I was on Paul George's podcast here,

45:40

they was like I don't look at any of my

45:42

brothers as competition I feel like that all move in

45:44

the needle. We're all pushing. We're all changing the game

45:46

and there's enough money for all There's

45:49

definitely some good money out here But tell us you

45:51

know how that you know how you guys kind of

45:53

came about and what that experience has been like for

45:55

you guys But experience been great first. I want to

45:57

show Gil man for giving me the opportunity and give

46:00

Even Rashad, Ken, Lexi

46:02

Brown, Josiah, K-Mart, Noah's

46:06

Co, everybody, Tim, Steve, everybody over there,

46:08

Apollo, being from LA, LA, I gotta

46:11

be real, a

46:14

lot of us, we don't do business together. Unfortunately.

46:19

The fact that Gil, as an OG, gave

46:22

me the opportunity to be on the show, definitely

46:24

has opened up a lot of doors for me outside of

46:26

it, them speaking engagements

46:30

for the NBA, getting back with

46:32

the Bucks has been tremendous. So

46:35

just the whole experience and just being able to talk

46:37

about the game and my life, it's

46:40

been great, man. It's been great, it's been awesome. No,

46:43

I think that shit is dope because it's different. You

46:46

bring your energy, Gil brings his

46:48

energy, Rashad is burnt over there. He brings

46:50

to the energy K-Mart and all the people

46:52

you guys have rotating as well, our brother

46:54

Josiah, Joe is our dog. I

46:57

went to college with Joey playing on the same hoop team, but

46:59

I just really love, but quick story, Jack, I've

47:03

never told this story. So a podcast

47:05

was pitched to me before I came up

47:07

with this idea for

47:09

me and K-Mart and this dude from Vice Sports

47:11

pitched it to me. I don't even know if K-Mart knows this

47:13

story or not. I'm gonna ask him one day. But

47:16

the dude that was doing it died. The dude

47:18

that had the idea and was taking the device,

47:21

it died and then like, yeah. And

47:24

then maybe like six months later is

47:26

when I hit you up like, yo, let's

47:28

do this thing. But it was pitched to

47:30

me originally to do something with K-Mart. That's

47:33

my boy. Yes, our dog. Yeah, Vice

47:35

Sports. Shout out K-Mart, K-Mart, and Rashad,

47:37

I'm a cancer, that's my brothers, man.

47:40

I love the energy in the mix. Yeah,

47:42

the mix, yeah. Of burntness, of fat, of humor. Yeah,

47:47

how was your, we're gonna start doing a live, we've

47:49

done a few live shows. We're going on a live

47:51

tour this summer, but how was it you guys sold out

47:53

to El Rey, right, 1200 people at the El Rey?

47:55

What was that experience like? El Rey was great, man.

47:57

And the thing about the live show, like your fans

47:59

come so they. They just be in the rowdy, they

48:01

just ask the questions, they just be shouting out

48:03

stuff. You know, you be going

48:05

back and forth. The questions are kind of intense, but

48:09

I mean, just overall, man, just to be

48:11

out of the element of planning in

48:13

the arena and

48:16

having life after basketball and doing something different

48:18

is just like, hey, we still stars, we

48:20

still got it. I

48:23

love it, I love it. Well, congratulations,

48:25

man. And again, thank you for coming on our

48:27

show today and we look forward to you coming

48:29

and sitting down with us and really chopping it

48:31

up. Oh, for sure, man. Thank you, Stack. Thank

48:34

you, Matt. Love, five, you know that, always.

48:36

Always, five. I said I

48:38

love to the bros over there too. Sure, I will. Yeah,

48:41

tell everybody we said whatever. All right, love y'all. Jack, right

48:43

now we want to welcome to the show. When

48:46

this idea was pitched to me, I loved it

48:48

instantly. Once I looked up who he

48:50

was and what he had going on and then obviously

48:52

who his sister was like, oh, this dude is dope,

48:54

but he also has his own story, not to mention

48:58

what he's doing with Coach Cal.

49:00

So right now, welcome to Unplugged

49:02

Craig Robinson. Craig, how you doing,

49:04

man? I'm

49:06

doing fine. So happy to be here with

49:09

you brothers, man. Thanks for having me. Man,

49:11

we appreciate you making some time for us.

49:13

Former Division I coach, two time. Had

49:16

some game of his own, Jack, two time Ivy

49:18

League player of the year over

49:20

at Princeton. Worked in the front office

49:22

with the Bucks and the Knicks. Recently

49:26

launched a new podcast

49:28

with Coach Cal, which

49:31

I'm definitely looking forward to catching up on. Craig,

49:35

what's going on, man? I just do

49:37

a lot at you, but what's going

49:39

on with you right now currently? Listen, so

49:41

I'm currently the executive

49:43

director of the NABC, which is

49:46

the National Association of Basketball Coaches.

49:49

Two years ago, we launched our

49:51

own media content creating company called

49:54

Coaches Plus. And part

49:56

of that, we've done three documentaries.

50:00

And we've launched this podcast called ways to

50:02

win with Coach Cal. And

50:04

I can't tell you how thrilled I am to be

50:07

doing that. And

50:09

then to be on here with you guys.

50:11

I am a huge fan of your show

50:13

was a fan of you guys while you

50:16

were playing, even though I'm older than you.

50:18

I know all about that. I coached in

50:20

the Pac-12. So

50:22

Matt, I came to Oregon State

50:25

right after you left a little bit after

50:27

you left. So I

50:30

coached again, Drew

50:32

and Drew Holliday and Wes

50:34

Brooke and that team that

50:36

just, you know, we're meeting

50:38

the pants off folks. So

50:41

Steven, I'm a big fan of yours

50:43

because I like both of you all

50:45

because you're like me. You're

50:48

like big guys who can play

50:51

guard, but you also can guard

50:53

people. Yeah, both sides.

50:56

That's how I was. Both sides of the

50:58

ball. Tell us how this pod with Coach

51:00

Cal came about. What should we

51:02

be expecting? And then obviously the whirlwind, you

51:04

know, your good friend is leaving Kentucky where

51:07

he, you know, set down, you know,

51:09

set the precedents for the one and done

51:11

and all the pros he's turned out and

51:14

he's off to Arkansas. So tell me how the pod

51:16

came about, you know, a little bit about your guys'

51:18

friendship and what we should expect from the podcast. Yeah,

51:22

well, I've known Cal for a long time

51:24

and he was always really nice to me

51:26

when I got into coaching and

51:29

we sort of stayed connected. And

51:31

then once I got this job, he was on the

51:33

board and I pitched the board

51:35

on using our coaches to

51:37

start a content creation company where we

51:40

use our coaches and we tell stories

51:42

about coaches, about coaching, about ball. And

51:46

then we had this idea to do

51:49

a podcast about lessons learned

51:51

on the court, on the

51:53

field that can translate

51:56

into regular life, the

51:58

business world. of

52:00

teaching, leadership,

52:04

that kind of thing. And we were trying to figure

52:06

out who would be good to be on. And

52:08

so I talked to a couple of coaches and I

52:11

talked to Cal and Cal, of course, you guys know

52:13

how Cal is. He raised his hand, he was like,

52:15

podcast? Yeah, I'm in. And that's how we

52:17

got it. And

52:19

obviously we launched it right before the

52:21

start of the NCAA tournament. So we're

52:23

doing shows and then he

52:27

plays in the tournament and then

52:29

leaves Kentucky. Crazy.

52:32

And that's what we are, but

52:34

it's been chaotic for him, I'm

52:37

sure, but as you

52:39

guys know in this business, chaos makes

52:41

for good story. Right, right.

52:44

And it don't last long.

52:46

And one thing about Cal, I know

52:49

from watching from afar, he

52:52

adjusts quickly. You know what I'm

52:54

saying? Yeah. He adjusts real quickly. Right,

52:56

right. And I listened to your

52:59

last episode, it might not have been

53:01

your last one, but a recent one where you had

53:03

Boogie on talking about Cal and

53:05

talking about how the

53:08

effect on him is like when you have

53:10

two parents who get divorced, right?

53:13

For his players, they're riding with them

53:15

100%, but they're

53:18

still loyal to Kentucky. So

53:20

I find that as a

53:22

really interesting dynamic with

53:24

all this going on. But

53:26

this is the business that we're in. You

53:28

get hired, you get fired. And

53:31

my question was to Kentucky, who

53:33

you gonna get? Right.

53:37

That's a hard act to follow. That's

53:39

a hard act to follow. And I

53:42

represent all the coaches in our

53:44

organization, so I'm happy for Mark

53:46

Pope, but that's a hard

53:48

job, hard fans, hard shoes to fill.

53:50

I mean, come on. Yeah,

53:52

it's gonna be a hard job. You

53:55

were a four-year star there at Princeton under

53:57

the great Peter Carroll. For real. career,

54:00

excuse me, P.K.A. He was also a

54:02

long time of King's assistant. Did,

54:05

can you say that the offense at Princeton

54:07

taught you about life? Oh,

54:10

absolutely, Steven. I

54:12

will tell you, it not only taught me about life,

54:14

but it taught me how to play, too. Right?

54:17

Because, you know, I'll start with that

54:19

part first. You know, now all the

54:21

stuff you see run in the NBA,

54:23

that's all former Princeton

54:25

offense stuff. Pistol, you

54:29

know, back cuts off a chin, you know.

54:32

All that stuff got started. I was doing that when

54:35

I was in college. And

54:37

so I learned how to

54:39

play from Coach Correll. But, you

54:41

know, there were a couple of things when I

54:43

think about some of the life lessons I learned

54:45

from him, because there were many. But

54:48

the ones that stick out were, first

54:51

and foremost, everything

54:53

is important. He preached that all the

54:55

time, because we were, you know,

54:58

we were Princeton, right? We weren't McDonald's

55:00

All-Americans. And when we had to play

55:03

folks like you in order

55:06

to win those games, which we won our

55:08

share of, you

55:10

had to do everything perfectly. And

55:12

so what that taught me

55:14

was that everything

55:16

you do, whether people are looking at

55:19

you or not, is important. How

55:21

you come to work every day, how do

55:23

you be a professional, how

55:25

you hit the weight room, how you hit

55:27

the books in school, all of that contributes

55:30

to being good enough to beat

55:32

the Stephen Jacksons of the

55:35

world, right? You can't beat

55:37

the Stephen Jacksons of the world. You just come show

55:39

up for a game. The

55:41

second thing I would say is, you

55:45

know, in the Princeton offense

55:47

and in basketball generally,

55:49

you know, if

55:52

you give yourself over to the team

55:54

and the process and the game, so

55:57

being unselfish, you get further

55:59

ahead. head than if you are selfish.

56:01

Thanks. So when you make a cut

56:04

and you know you're not going to get a pass,

56:06

but you know that cut's going to open up the

56:08

guy behind you, a

56:10

lot of guys don't learn that these

56:12

days playing basketball with

56:14

their one on O working. Yeah, they don't know

56:16

how to play off the ball at all. They

56:18

don't know how to play off the ball. And off

56:21

the ball is teaching you how to sacrifice for

56:24

the good of the team. Those

56:27

are a couple of things, man, that I took with me.

56:30

Before I got into coaching, I spent 14 years

56:33

in corporate America in investment banking. And

56:36

those were the lessons that got me

56:38

to move up the corporate ladder. Mm-hmm.

56:42

What's up? I'm John Wall. And I'm CJ

56:44

Toledona, and we're starting a new podcast presented

56:46

by DraftKings called Point Game. Everyone,

56:49

please welcome Coach John Calipari. We're

56:51

getting beat by 18, my first

56:53

game in Kentucky. They're saying, Tows

56:55

are busting, can't coach. This is

56:57

crazy. John Wall runs down the

56:59

floor and makes a buzzer beater. You

57:01

remember that, John? That's my first game winner ever made. Remember

57:03

you said you never see me do that. Ladies

57:06

and gentlemen, DeMarcus Boogie Cousin. I called Boogie. I'm like,

57:08

Yo, bro, I'm about to commit to Duke. And I

57:10

hung up on him. Bro,

57:13

I'm talking about, do you want to tell me how many

57:15

times he called me all type of names? Bro, you really

57:17

selling me out. You doing this. Bro,

57:21

I was sick. I remember that like

57:23

yesterday, man. Love you, John

57:26

Wall. Thanks, Coach. Love you, too. You made

57:28

me everything I am today. Nah, you made

57:30

me. You made me. I love it. Check

57:32

out Point Game with John Wall and CJ

57:34

Toledano on the iHeartRadio app, DraftKings YouTube, or

57:36

wherever you get your podcasts. It wasn't supposed

57:39

to be my game. That's my job. Are

57:44

you tired of your scented cleaning products

57:46

smelling and cleaning like, meh,

57:49

then it's time for an upgrade with

57:51

the power of Clorox Cintiva. With

57:53

an uplifting scent that smells like

57:55

coconut, Clorox Cintiva gives you powerful

57:58

clean like Clorox. like

58:01

being transported to a tropical island

58:03

retreat. Imagine putting your phone

58:05

on Do Not Disturb, tuning

58:07

out all the constants, just

58:11

a feeling of warm sand in between your

58:13

toes and a fruity drink in your hands.

58:15

The ones with the little umbrella. We're

58:18

a fresher home to feel like an

58:20

all-inclusive vacation by getting Clorox Antiva, also

58:22

available in grapefruit and lavender scents at

58:25

a nearby retail store. Take

58:30

your business further with the smart and

58:32

flexible American Express Business Gold Card. It's

58:34

packed with benefits to help unlock more

58:37

value from your business purchases. That's

58:39

the powerful backing of American

58:41

Express. Learn more at americanexpress.com

58:43

slash businessgoldcard. That's

58:46

the powerful backing of American Express.

58:50

Four times points and up to $150,000 in purchases per year. Terms

58:54

apply. Learn more at

58:57

americanexpress.com/business gold card. AT&T

59:00

connects and O to podcasts. Connect

59:03

the alarm. Change the podcast you

59:05

stream. Connect the snooze. 10

59:08

more minutes to dream. Connect the

59:10

shower. Lather up with the

59:12

news, sports talk, comedians, or movie

59:14

reviews. Connect with that

59:16

three-hour philosophy show. Change the

59:19

drive into work, in traffic, so slow.

59:21

Connect the dishes to voices that glow.

59:24

Thank you to the geniuses of Spoken

59:26

Audio. Connect the stories. Change

59:28

your perspective. Everything changes

59:30

everything. AT&T. At

59:35

Bet365, we don't do ordinary. We believe

59:37

that every sport should be epic. Every

59:39

home run, every hit, every inning, every

59:41

play. From the moments that are legendary

59:43

to the ones that fly under the

59:45

radar, whether it's a walk-off grand slam

59:48

or a base hit to center field.

59:50

Whatever the sport, whatever the moment,

59:52

it's never ordinary. At Bet365,

59:54

21 plus only, must be President Ohio.

59:57

If you or someone you know has

59:59

a game. gambling problem and wants

1:00:01

help. Call 1-800-GAMBLER. What

1:00:05

kind of person was Coach off

1:00:07

the court? Coachy. Coachy?

1:00:11

Well, you guys got the good Coachy in

1:00:13

the NBA. I always used to laugh when

1:00:15

I used to go visit him in Sacramento.

1:00:19

I was like, Coach, you're way nicer to

1:00:21

these guys than you were to us. I

1:00:24

used to tell people he

1:00:26

was hard on us and

1:00:28

he coached by

1:00:30

character assassination. He

1:00:32

had a sharp tongue. He

1:00:35

would talk big shit. He

1:00:37

had a sharp tongue. I

1:00:40

tried to do this with my coaching only without

1:00:42

the acidity. Every

1:00:45

day. We

1:00:48

called it going down the line. Every

1:00:50

day after practice, you know where you

1:00:52

stood because he would go down

1:00:54

the line and tell you what you did

1:00:57

well and didn't do well at practice every

1:00:59

day. So if

1:01:01

you were the 15th guy on

1:01:03

the roster, you knew what it'd take to get to

1:01:05

be number one. It was

1:01:08

all accountability. You knew why

1:01:10

the number one guy was number one and you knew why you

1:01:12

were 15. And if

1:01:14

you were the number one guy, you knew why you were

1:01:16

number one and you knew what the

1:01:18

other guys had to do to come take you from being

1:01:20

number one. That

1:01:23

daily accountability, most

1:01:25

people can't take it and most athletes

1:01:27

can't take it. Especially

1:01:29

this day and age. In

1:01:31

this day and age, oh, forget about it, man. You

1:01:36

have to handle these kids with kid gloves. And

1:01:39

like you, I'm coaching my two

1:01:41

youngest in AAU and I barely even

1:01:43

open my mouth these days because I'm

1:01:45

scared I'm going to shatter somebody's dreams.

1:01:49

I dealt with it coming in with Greg Popovich,

1:01:51

but it was the best thing for me. You

1:01:53

know, Greg was hard on me, but when I seen

1:01:55

him treat Tim Duncan the same way he was treating

1:01:57

me and was hard on the best player, it was

1:01:59

easy. The easy for me to take as he

1:02:01

targeted best player like vessel. I needed that and

1:02:03

that was Everly Benefits for me. What?

1:02:06

Was that you know in in and it's

1:02:08

It's really interesting cause I was late to

1:02:10

the and be a game when i when

1:02:12

i started working in the front office. And

1:02:15

it amazes me how many. Times.

1:02:18

That that didn't happen right? Like I'm with you

1:02:20

are you know I've visited with top a lot

1:02:22

before I went to the and be a to

1:02:24

see if it was something I wanted do and.

1:02:28

He was he was. He reminded me

1:02:30

a cause grill only just them, a

1:02:32

mild and a milder version but the

1:02:34

ability to hold your best players accountable.

1:02:36

Inability of your best players to allow

1:02:39

the coach know old you account right?

1:02:41

Is. A big. In In

1:02:43

in winning and and to meet it's

1:02:45

a good. It's a good example of

1:02:48

why it's so hard for the team

1:02:50

to win on a consistent basis. Because

1:02:53

they change and out the coaches sobering.

1:02:55

You're. Afraid the whole guys accountable cause you

1:02:57

trying to hang onto your john. I'm from

1:02:59

movie your sister. The former First Lady Michelle

1:03:01

Obama of Ah obviously wanted to to to

1:03:04

shout that out real quick. where was you

1:03:06

like have a sister but then I want

1:03:08

to get to those those pick up games

1:03:10

in in here. Have you any good pickup

1:03:12

games of Brock. Assessed.

1:03:15

What have you know? My sister and

1:03:17

I are close continue to be closed

1:03:19

today and. You. Don't see was

1:03:21

the see people don't realize she's

1:03:23

like a really good athlete, but

1:03:25

she came along right at the

1:03:27

time. right? Before

1:03:29

folks started. Pushing.

1:03:32

Girls into sports. And

1:03:36

it even if she was see her

1:03:38

her personality sees see didn't see was

1:03:40

Morrow Why? Why do we have to

1:03:42

keep score? Had a hard worker aca

1:03:44

lot of the a half of the

1:03:47

a winner and I was like well

1:03:49

that's the whole point of compete life

1:03:51

or death Sundance. Data.

1:03:54

Bases she was suicide as soon as a

1:03:56

good. says. That a half as will

1:03:58

like twenty months apart. So what else? The about

1:04:00

the Boss used by about moment. I'll play

1:04:02

as awful as you play softball and I'll

1:04:04

play football See a play for Bomb! I

1:04:07

played ice hockey at at our part she

1:04:09

played ice hockey at the park so she

1:04:11

was. She was my first competitor and my

1:04:13

dad was my first coach so of. So.

1:04:16

With we've been close ever since then continue

1:04:19

to be so I appreciate asking about her

1:04:21

and then. The. The the pick

1:04:23

up your were you guys have her out on of

1:04:25

you've heard the store app told it so many times.

1:04:28

About my sister asking me to

1:04:30

take barack to play pick up

1:04:32

basketball? Haven't heard whispers Dayton. You.

1:04:35

Guys haven't heard every I let me share

1:04:37

with he felt. My. Sister.

1:04:40

Who. You know she had a shared data.

1:04:42

She was a prince into soap. The.

1:04:44

Don't see cheap. she. She.

1:04:46

Was. Popular. Campus and had

1:04:48

boyfriend but they never lasted too

1:04:50

long. So we we get outta

1:04:52

college and am I added went

1:04:54

overseas play came back, started work

1:04:56

and. She. Meets this

1:04:58

guy is he says. He.

1:05:01

Fashions himself, a basketball player.

1:05:03

heck, economic. Swear.

1:05:06

We want me Dubai and see

1:05:08

I want. I know how you

1:05:10

and Dad always talk about. You

1:05:13

can tell a guy's personality, sustain

1:05:15

and character. I. Play and pick

1:05:17

up basketball of my dad used every

1:05:19

and you guys know you had modi

1:05:21

due to be call a foul by

1:05:23

the secretary gonna be the circuit ago

1:05:26

he declared the a real life as

1:05:28

money and sell player you know Michael

1:05:30

Jordan plays in our family Tim Hardaway

1:05:32

mean I'm I'm like of I'm A

1:05:34

I'm a. Bona. Fide play

1:05:36

around with unity. So yeah, I'm a

1:05:39

real Hooper. Issues

1:05:41

that come on, please and just kept

1:05:43

begged me out like finally, okay, I'll

1:05:45

do it. And and as like but

1:05:47

I'm not a be a bad guy you it is.

1:05:49

This do turned out to be a jerk you got

1:05:51

a am on that then you have to fit. So.

1:05:55

I put together a group of my friends.

1:05:57

A couple of my friends. aren't he Duncan?

1:05:59

who? you guys? probably have heard of

1:06:01

was former Secretary of Education and

1:06:03

John Rogers who runs a mutual fund

1:06:05

in Chicago and Marty Nesbitt and some

1:06:08

other guys who are friends of mine.

1:06:10

And we put together this game and we're playing and

1:06:13

Barack comes and you know we're playing and

1:06:16

to my surprise he wasn't that bad

1:06:18

but you know not like us not

1:06:20

like the three of us and I'm

1:06:23

taking some liberties

1:06:25

including myself.

1:06:27

But he could

1:06:30

hold his own in a pickup game right. So and

1:06:33

so I had to report back to my sister and she

1:06:35

said what'd you think and I said well it

1:06:37

was actually pretty good like he passed the ball when

1:06:40

he should have passed. He

1:06:42

took shots when he should have taken it and

1:06:44

I said most importantly he didn't try and suck

1:06:47

up to me like passing the ball to me

1:06:49

and just because I'm your sister it was like

1:06:51

it was like you know he was not noticeable

1:06:53

it was a good game and

1:06:56

that was how that he

1:06:58

passed that test and the rest is

1:07:00

history. We had no idea the guy

1:07:02

was going to be present so because

1:07:04

I had no idea. So pretty much

1:07:07

so because of you is how the

1:07:09

union formed is what you're saying. It's

1:07:11

absolutely because absolutely because I could have

1:07:13

just been like how to do can't

1:07:15

play I don't know why you do

1:07:17

this little skinny guy. Loving basketball is

1:07:20

a beautiful thing. I love it. I

1:07:22

love it. The state of college sports

1:07:24

right now the transfer portal in

1:07:27

IEL the emergence of women's

1:07:29

basketball. Let's start with the transfer

1:07:32

portal seeing that you're first and foremost a father.

1:07:34

So I know you're teaching your kids you know

1:07:36

when tough when adversity hits you got to stand

1:07:38

it and get through it. But then

1:07:40

you've also been a coach and I know a lot

1:07:42

of coaches like getting those experienced players in the portal.

1:07:45

So talk to us about the portal. Well

1:07:48

I would say that the

1:07:51

way the portals

1:07:54

currently constructed along

1:07:56

with the fact that to do an NIL and it

1:07:58

started at the same time. It's not

1:08:00

working the way they thought it was going

1:08:02

to work. It turned it turned into pay

1:08:05

for play. Right. And to your point about

1:08:07

folks sticking it out when they have a

1:08:09

tough time, it's too easy to just chase

1:08:11

the money. Right. So, and, and

1:08:13

the second thing and most importantly,

1:08:15

and folks are not talking about

1:08:18

this enough is that

1:08:21

when you go into the portal, it's

1:08:23

not like Steven Jackson,

1:08:25

Matt Barnes going to the portal. Y'all going to get

1:08:27

picked up. Mm hmm. It's

1:08:31

Joe Blow. I'm not even going to

1:08:33

say Craig Robbins is Joe Blow from

1:08:35

X university with no prospect and he's

1:08:37

hoping somebody's going to pick him up.

1:08:40

And so he loses what he, he

1:08:43

loses his bird in the

1:08:45

hand, go for two in the bush, and then

1:08:47

he's out. And most of these pissy,

1:08:49

what they're not reporting on are the people who

1:08:51

get stuck in the portal and don't have a

1:08:53

home to go to. Well, they also said, I mean,

1:08:56

not to cut you off. There's over 1500 kids

1:08:59

in the transfer portal and a little

1:09:01

bit over 350 division

1:09:03

one program. Opening. You know what

1:09:06

I mean? So it's like, what are we doing?

1:09:09

What are we doing? It's a numbers

1:09:11

game. And so, so here, you

1:09:13

didn't cut me off because you're, you're going right where

1:09:15

I'm going with this. In

1:09:18

addition to that, when

1:09:20

you transfer and you guys know

1:09:22

this with your own kids and

1:09:25

just reading the papers, these

1:09:27

schools have different admissions policies.

1:09:29

So not all your credits

1:09:32

transfer. So, so

1:09:34

what I liked about having to sit out a

1:09:36

year, you all, all

1:09:38

the athletes got ahead because you

1:09:40

got caught up on the, on

1:09:43

the work and you had some time to get it

1:09:45

and then you got ahead. So you could, you go

1:09:48

to school in the summer and next thing you know,

1:09:50

you're working on your graduate degree, but all

1:09:52

that's going to go out the window and they're

1:09:54

not talking about that because it's too soon to

1:09:56

have any data on it. And I'm so sick

1:09:58

of this whole data thing. And I shouldn't

1:10:00

say that but you also that that would you

1:10:02

also got a thing I mean on on the

1:10:05

basketball side. They're. Not going for that anyway.

1:10:07

you know what it is. it's just a whole different.

1:10:09

I remember Jack went straight to the pros but I

1:10:11

remember you know I was kind of the end of

1:10:13

an era. You know Ninety six guys are to go

1:10:15

on pro and eighty five says gossipers sort of on

1:10:18

prom Ninety eight so we went from the reasons you

1:10:20

said obviously we will. You know you couldn't tell who

1:10:22

are going to the pros but we also went to

1:10:24

get a degree but those days are long gone. If

1:10:26

you stay in the In in in college best of

1:10:28

you say past two year there's a problem with you

1:10:31

in. I mean so as a whole different mentality and

1:10:33

thinking what you can't off the kids for taking this

1:10:35

way because that's. What was at what's going

1:10:37

on So they are with that mess you

1:10:39

up to your to your point. There.

1:10:42

Are four hundred and fifty job in Mbs.

1:10:44

It. And

1:10:46

really I always sell people after I've worked in

1:10:48

there because I like the were all the good

1:10:50

players. dell in a bit. Of

1:10:53

an end and you you you cut

1:10:55

off. Let the top eight guys are

1:10:57

the ones who play so that each

1:11:00

tab that two hundred and forty guys.

1:11:02

The. Rest of the guys are

1:11:04

expendable. G League. Might

1:11:06

get an might not. So we're

1:11:09

talking about a small. Sansa.

1:11:11

Make him it and all these guys are

1:11:13

putting putting all their eggs in one basket.

1:11:15

I just don't like the way. It

1:11:18

is and work and we have been A B C

1:11:20

or are trying to help. With.

1:11:22

The coaches are trying to help the unsuitable

1:11:24

a come up with a better. I

1:11:27

wait for it but over I liked

1:11:29

the idea of folks the enable have

1:11:31

to have some freedom. But. The

1:11:33

way this is currently constructed. I'm

1:11:36

not doing. Is. It's

1:11:38

doing a disservice to the suit athletes. And

1:11:40

then there's one other point here. I

1:11:43

don't think these exists. Student athletes? That's an

1:11:46

item I'm a raise my hand ago. And

1:11:48

the portal. You. know these that

1:11:50

these their agents and handlers who would

1:11:52

sell and god or i think gets

1:11:54

yeah this amount of money and they

1:11:57

really don't have an off origin point

1:11:59

guys georgia Yeah, I just

1:12:01

want to give you two examples of the points

1:12:03

you're making. You talked about credits

1:12:06

and credits not transferring

1:12:08

over to certain colleges.

1:12:10

Don Staley had to

1:12:12

create, she had to

1:12:14

create, not, she had to create, what's

1:12:16

the word I'm looking for Matt? A

1:12:18

major? She had to create a major just to

1:12:20

get this player and have the school create a

1:12:22

major just so they can get this player to

1:12:25

your other point. And the prime,

1:12:27

Dion Sanders even said, his daughter jumped in

1:12:29

the transfer portal and he called it dumb

1:12:31

because to your point, why jump in the

1:12:33

transfer portal when you don't have a school to go to? It

1:12:35

makes no sense. You know what I'm saying? So that, I just

1:12:37

want to make points, two great points of what you said because

1:12:39

Dion just said that to us when we had him on the

1:12:41

show. The emergence of

1:12:44

women's basketball. You

1:12:47

know, I was someone who played D1 and

1:12:49

played the tournament and I still feel like

1:12:51

there's nothing like March Madness, but I feel

1:12:54

like in the last two years, the women's

1:12:56

March Madness has been bigger and

1:12:59

had more stars than the

1:13:01

men's. Talk to us about that

1:13:03

as a former division one. Yeah. Yeah.

1:13:06

Yeah. I will. And as

1:13:09

a parent of a, a dog, my,

1:13:11

so my, my second oldest played at

1:13:13

Princeton, got drafted, you

1:13:15

know, went to the NCAA tournament,

1:13:17

got drafted, got, she got

1:13:19

cut, went overseas, played a couple of years

1:13:21

now. She's working in finance,

1:13:23

right? I

1:13:25

think just, it's, it's, it's just a matter

1:13:28

of time. The women, the

1:13:30

women's game has, it's

1:13:33

not the men's game, right? But it's

1:13:35

caught up from a media, it's catching

1:13:37

up from a media standpoint. Like it's

1:13:39

getting enough attention

1:13:42

from folks like you,

1:13:45

folks like ESPN. And

1:13:49

that's all they needed is a little bit of

1:13:51

that. And then I always said they needed those

1:13:53

storytellers to tell the drama of what's

1:13:55

going on in the women's game, because

1:13:58

as a. sports

1:14:00

fans like you know I watched football

1:14:02

I was a baseball fan growing up

1:14:05

you don't just root for your team

1:14:07

you root against the

1:14:10

teams you don't your teams unlike like

1:14:12

the 49ers and yeah and and

1:14:16

and I'm from Chicago I rooted against the Packers

1:14:19

I like and now I live in Wisconsin and I'm like

1:14:21

oh my god I must have done something wrong. If they

1:14:24

only know. But

1:14:28

I think that the attention that

1:14:30

the game is getting is helping

1:14:32

people it's awakening

1:14:34

people to another form

1:14:37

of competition that they weren't paying attention to

1:14:39

because it just wasn't being seen and

1:14:41

I'm really excited for what's going

1:14:43

on because it's basketball for me like

1:14:46

you know I was

1:14:48

made privy to a stat

1:14:52

that I did not know the

1:14:55

bulk the number one demographic

1:14:58

of the fans who

1:15:00

go to see the WNBA

1:15:03

are black males. Really?

1:15:06

Yes. I didn't know that. Matt your reaction with my reaction

1:15:09

when I heard that. I definitely didn't expect that but

1:15:11

interesting. I didn't expect it either. I didn't expect it

1:15:13

either you know I was thinking they would say something

1:15:16

like LGBT something or other but

1:15:18

it is straight black male and when you think

1:15:20

about it when I

1:15:22

want to take my kids to a

1:15:24

game that that's affordable and I want

1:15:27

to sit down and try to get

1:15:29

keywords. Keyword affordable. Go to a WNBA

1:15:31

game. Right. And then my my two

1:15:33

younger sons who are in eighth grade

1:15:35

and sixth grade they grew up watching

1:15:38

their sister who

1:15:40

and and and I have an older

1:15:42

son who played division three college but

1:15:44

they all watch my their sister play

1:15:47

and she's their role model. It's like it's

1:15:49

just a different time for women and it's

1:15:51

it's happening. I'm really excited. I love it.

1:15:53

I love it. I love the growth. I

1:15:56

love where it's going. The fact that it's

1:15:58

the top of the conversation. that

1:16:00

people are getting big time shoe deals now and

1:16:03

I definitely think it's good overall for the

1:16:05

growth of the sport. Last question before we get you

1:16:07

out of here, your thought on being

1:16:09

again a former player and coach on

1:16:12

the college landscape the former professional NBA

1:16:14

and particularly NFL guys that are coming back

1:16:16

and starting to coach college?

1:16:21

Yeah I love

1:16:23

it. I love it for

1:16:25

a couple of reasons. One is

1:16:29

so many times like when I when I

1:16:31

was growing up I never thought I

1:16:34

could coach for a living right? Like

1:16:36

that wasn't that wasn't on my list

1:16:38

of things right? It was like be

1:16:40

a teacher you know my family is

1:16:42

a full of teachers and cops and

1:16:45

firemen and you know city workers

1:16:47

and laborers and things like that.

1:16:50

So just having the opportunity

1:16:53

for young

1:16:55

particularly African Americans

1:16:58

as a way

1:17:01

to to get in the game

1:17:03

is fantastic. And then

1:17:05

secondly you know

1:17:07

what I what I learned in the NBA and

1:17:09

I'd love to get you guys take on this

1:17:11

but what I learned is the

1:17:14

most important person in

1:17:16

a pro franchise is

1:17:19

the person who has the ability

1:17:21

to connect with the players. Absolutely.

1:17:25

And and and then sometimes

1:17:27

that becomes threatening but that's another that's for

1:17:30

another show. Because most of the time those

1:17:32

the assistant coaches. And

1:17:35

those are the guys

1:17:38

who can get through to the players

1:17:40

and help your team win.

1:17:43

And and and so the

1:17:45

more guys who have pro experience who

1:17:47

can get in on the game and learn

1:17:49

the coaching profession because a lot of

1:17:51

people don't realize you can't just like come

1:17:53

out and blow a whistle and it

1:17:57

just say okay let's have two lines for layups

1:17:59

and then scrimmage, right? Like

1:18:01

it's a real profession. The

1:18:04

more who can learn that profession, the

1:18:06

better it is for our game and

1:18:08

the better it is for the players,

1:18:11

our student athletes, especially the players, because

1:18:13

most of our players are not going

1:18:15

to the NBA. They're not going pro.

1:18:18

So hearing from the guys who know

1:18:20

how hard it is to do

1:18:22

it, if you want

1:18:24

to sign up for that, that's great. And

1:18:26

if you don't, you understand what other stuff

1:18:29

you can do. Yeah, absolutely.

1:18:31

One thing I mean, people don't understand, and as

1:18:33

we were talking earlier, the transfer portal and the

1:18:35

lifeliness of going pro, 99%

1:18:38

of student athletes don't go pro in

1:18:40

sports. They may go pro in another

1:18:42

profession, but not in sports. So it's

1:18:45

a crazy number if you really think about the end of the

1:18:47

day. But Craig, we want to thank you, man, for your time.

1:18:49

Best of luck with the pod and everything else you have going

1:18:52

on. Give Coach Cal our best man

1:18:54

and come back. We want to catch up

1:18:56

with you again. Absolutely. Absolutely. And

1:18:58

we want to have you guys on

1:19:00

so you can share some of your

1:19:02

life lessons you guys learned. I'd love

1:19:04

to have you on. Thanks, guys. Really

1:19:07

appreciate you. Thanks for coming, Craig. We

1:19:09

want to thank our guests today, Craig

1:19:11

Robinson and our brother, Brandon Jennings. Yes,

1:19:13

sir. Jack, it was a good one

1:19:15

today, man. Covered a lot of stuff.

1:19:19

Good luck. What's next for you? Well, next I got

1:19:21

Coach of the Allen Officer game and shout out to

1:19:23

my son, Steve Junior. He made the Allen Officer get

1:19:26

out of the classic. It's going to be dope for

1:19:28

him. A lot of club players, Cooper

1:19:30

Flag and Mercy, Masterpiece, a lot

1:19:32

of those guys supposed to be there. And

1:19:35

shout out to AI and Bobby and all

1:19:37

them. But I'll see you in Miami.

1:19:39

I'll be in Atlanta before that, though. I'll be

1:19:41

in Atlanta the weekend before with the twins at

1:19:43

AU. Oh, I'll be there pulling up. Straight up,

1:19:45

man. You can catch this unplugged on the DraftKings

1:19:47

Network and all the Smoke Productions

1:19:49

YouTube. We'll see you guys next week. You

1:20:02

know that feeling when you walk into your home,

1:20:05

take a deep breath, and

1:20:08

feel new? Well, that's

1:20:10

what it's like to use Clorox Ventiva. Because

1:20:13

Clorox Ventiva smells like coconut,

1:20:15

cleans like Clorox, and feels

1:20:17

like energy. It'll elevate any

1:20:19

cleaning routine to not just clean, but

1:20:21

also make every room smell like

1:20:24

a tropical coconut getaway. Discover

1:20:26

how Clorox Ventiva's powerful, clean,

1:20:28

and refreshing scents can transform

1:20:30

your space. Get yours

1:20:32

in coconut or other fabulous scents at a

1:20:34

nearby retail store. At

1:20:39

Bet365, we don't do ordinary. We believe that

1:20:41

every sport should be epic. Every home run,

1:20:43

every hit, every inning, every play. From the

1:20:45

moments that are legendary to the ones that

1:20:47

fly under the radar. See for yourself when

1:20:49

you sign up today and get $150 in

1:20:51

bonus bets when you bet just $5. Whatever

1:20:56

the sport, whatever the moment, it's never

1:20:58

ordinary at Bet365. 21

1:21:01

plus only must be present in Ohio. If you

1:21:03

or someone you know has a gambling problem and

1:21:06

wants help, call 1-800-GAMBLER. Terms

1:21:08

and conditions apply. Hello there, I'm

1:21:10

Ann Thompson, editor-at-large for IndieWire. And

1:21:12

I'm IndieWire's deputy film editor, Ryan LaTonsio.

1:21:15

And we're the co-hosts of IndieWire's

1:21:17

weekly Screen Talk podcast. Join

1:21:19

us each week for an in-depth discussion

1:21:21

of the latest in film and TV

1:21:23

industry news. With special guests along the

1:21:26

way, including filmmakers and executives. Hear from

1:21:28

us every Friday morning on iHeart platforms

1:21:30

or wherever you get your podcasts. As

1:21:32

IndieWire shares what we've learned from the

1:21:34

movie week that was... There's

1:21:40

a lot of pros to drinking health-aid

1:21:42

kombucha. No cons that I can think

1:21:44

of. Pro, amazing taste. Pro, pairs

1:21:47

well with anything. Pro, probiotic.

1:21:50

That's a literal pro. And it's

1:21:52

deliciously refreshing. It's the

1:21:54

perfect pairing to your meal or great on

1:21:56

its own. Whether you're having pink lady apple,

1:21:59

berry lemonade. or one of

1:22:01

the other great flavors. It's a

1:22:05

great idea to make a part of your daily routine.

1:22:07

Look for the brown bottle with an anchor on it

1:22:09

and try a healthy kombucha today. AT&T

1:22:11

connects an ode to podcast.

1:22:13

Connect the alarm. Change the

1:22:15

podcast you stream. Connect the snooze.

1:22:17

10 more minutes to drink.